B&W Research Thread

[Naxte]

Originally Posted by Fat OmegaDonut

I don't really think it's necessary to test all these items. It's already been proven that Encourage still allows King's Rock to flinch, so it's not as if it blocks all item side effects.

These will be tested on a "if someone happens to encounter it in battle" basis.

Of course--that's something I'd expect, considering this new information, and is why King's Rock wasn't an item I asked about. The only effect of King's Rock is adding a chance of flinching the opponent to attacks, after all, unlike Life Orb, which has two: (1.) a primary effect of effectively increasing the Pokemon's Attack and Special Attack by 1.3x (2.) a secondary effect of making the holder take 10% of its Max HP in recoil damage if it manages to inflict damage to the opponent's HP.

As a result, stuff like King's Rock, Toxic Orb, Flame Orb, Yache Berry, Expert Belt, Flame Plate, etc, which only do one thing, should act normally even on Pokemon with Encourage. It's items that have multiple effects, like Life Orb (and potentially the Choice Items), just like the moves Encourage boosts, that it's curious as to how they might interact, considering this information.

Iron Ball's probably a stretch, but I definitely think it's worth testing how the Choice Items interact with Encourage, considering this information (Encourage stopped only one effect of an item with multiple when it activated, and one that it usually has no effect on (recoil) at that).

[DDRMaster]

Originally Posted by Fat mien

I have tested this with a 175 Spatt Encourage Nidoking hold Life orb using Flamethrower against a Blissey with 306 SpD

Damage = 66 - 79 damage (both min and max confirmed in-game)
Nidoking got no Life Orb damage

As such i confirm that the Encourage and Life Orb boosts stack without any recoil when using a move with a secondary effect.

By stacks, do you mean that it's addative or multiplicative (a 1.6x boost or a 1.69x boost, respectively)? I just think some clarification would be good to avoid any confusion.

[CPU]

Multiplicative. Very rarely in Pokémon are stackings additive.

[ΩDonut]

Originally Posted by Fat CPU

Multiplicative. Very rarely in Pokémon are stackings additive.

I can't think of a single stacking that is additive. When a Pokemon gets boosts from different sources, they are always multiplicative.

[Zharizard]

Does the move Dragon Tail Phaze Shedinja?

[breh]

I would assume no because Dragon tail (and overhead throw for that matter) are entirely blocked by Wonderguard; thus their effect cannot occur

But I don't know, good thing to test.

[CPU]

Originally Posted by Fat OmegaDonut

I can't think of a single stacking that is additive. When a Pokemon gets boosts from different sources, they are always multiplicative.

It's only within multipliers, such as Assist Power's boost per stat increase.

[breh]

I have an interesting question: does shell bell work when endeavor is used?

If so, Aron can use Endeavor in the sandstorm against anything without multiple hit moves or status moves and get back to full health.

[ΩDonut]

Originally Posted by Fat Breludicolo

I have an interesting question: does shell bell work when endeavor is used?

If so, Aron can use Endeavor in the sandstorm against anything without multiple hit moves or status moves and get back to full health.

Just tested it. Yes it does!

[Badal]

Feint: Does it bypass Fast Guard?

Unless I got the move wrong ._.
Feint doesn't bypass Fast Guard, Feint has higher priority than Fast Guard

[ΩDonut]

Originally Posted by Fat badalcristiano

Unless I got the move wrong ._.
Feint doesn't bypass Fast Guard, Feint has higher priority than Fast Guard

Feint has lower priority than Fast Guard.

Did you test it, or what?

[Zebstrika]

Originally Posted by Fat Naxte

Of course--that's something I'd expect, considering this new information, and is why King's Rock wasn't an item I asked about. The only effect of King's Rock is adding a chance of flinching the opponent to attacks, after all, unlike Life Orb, which has two: (1.) a primary effect of effectively increasing the Pokemon's Attack and Special Attack by 1.3x (2.) a secondary effect of making the holder take 10% of its Max HP in recoil damage if it manages to inflict damage to the opponent's HP.

As a result, stuff like King's Rock, Toxic Orb, Flame Orb, Yache Berry, Expert Belt, Flame Plate, etc, which only do one thing, should act normally even on Pokemon with Encourage. It's items that have multiple effects, like Life Orb (and potentially the Choice Items), just like the moves Encourage boosts, that it's curious as to how they might interact, considering this information.

Iron Ball's probably a stretch, but I definitely think it's worth testing how the Choice Items interact with Encourage, considering this information (Encourage stopped only one effect of an item with multiple when it activated, and one that it usually has no effect on (recoil) at that).

Now I get it, I thought it was a glitch or something. Crash damage is not boosted be Encourage, right? And so far, no other negative effects have been removed? Sticky Barb may have an effect removed, and a really long stretch would be Black Sludge.

[Badal]

Yes, unless I got my move wrong

[Syberia]

I assume Roar/Whirlwind are still affected by evasion modifiers, but we might want to be 100% certain of that.

[Badal]

Nevermind, turns out it wasn't fast guard, it was protect, didn't check it properly. Sorry for the hassle, I'll check feint + fast guard now and get back to you

[Sixonesix]

Feint mechanics:
- 30 base power (down from 50 in gen 4)
- Priority = +2
- Penetrates and breaks Protect/Detect
- Now hits even if the target does not use Protect/Detect
- Blocked by Fast Guard
- Does not interact with Wide Guard

[Badal]

Yeah, sixonesix is right
as long as fast guard is the one listed here (spelling)
Feint gets blocked.

[El_Sargento]

Something weird.

Battle Subway.
Raichu survives with Focus Sash.
He uses Thief and pick my Life Orb up.
He dies.

???

Is this something new?

[ΩDonut]

Originally Posted by Fat El_Sargento

Something weird.

Battle Surway.
Raichu survives with Focus Sash.
He uses Thief and pick my Life Orb up.
He dies.

???

Is this something new?

It's probable that it worked this way in 4th gen and we just never thought of this situation.

[mien]

Power\Guard Share: Does it actually split stats, instead of just sharing boosts? What happens to the averaged stats if either one of the Pokemon switch out?

To test this i used a 614 Defense Shuckle using Guard Share on a 130 Defense Blissey.
Then i switched out Shuckle to a 369 Attack Machamp using Dynamicpunch on the same Blissey.

Results: 217-248 damage (tested about 10 times)

As such i confirm that these moves split stats and the effect remains after one of the pokemon switches out.

[Bug Maniac Marc]

Originally Posted by Fat OmegaDonut

It's probable that it worked this way in 4th gen and we just never thought of this situation.

Yes, this is how it worked in gen 4 as well.

[Missingno. Master]

An interesting point was brought up on Bulbagarden forums. There was a thread asking why we don't have the english names for Generation V Pokemon yet, and the guy went on to explain that since Generation IV, the english names for the newest Pokemon were programmed into the Japanese carts so that if a Pokemon with its English name was evolved on a Japanese cart, it would change to the evolved form's Japanese name, as opposed to keeping the previous form's English name as a nickname. I'm not entirely sure how we could do it, but if this is true, then the Generation V Pokemon english names are in the programming!

And no, before anyone says anything, I am NOT suggesting any... legally questionable means of discovering said names. That being said, I was hoping that the people in the B/W research thread here would have an idea.

[ΩDonut]

The dude is wrong. The game doesn't need to know the English\German\etc. names for the Pokemon in order to determine if its name should change when it evolves. All the Pokemon needs to have is the nickname flag unchecked.

You can nickname a Pokemon "fluffers" and uncheck the nickname flag with Pokesav, and it'll lose the nickname when it evolves.

Also, my trade thread partner RockinX Pal Parked his English Chansey to a Japanese game, and it decided to give them a nickname flag upon Pal Parking (because it didn't recognize the names). So when it evolved into a Blissey - on an English game - it's nickname was stuck as "CHANSEY".

[SupremeDirt]

Originally Posted by Fat OmegaDonut

The dude is wrong. The game doesn't need to know the English\German\etc. names for the Pokemon in order to determine if its name should change when it evolves. All the Pokemon needs to have is the nickname flag unchecked.

You can nickname a Pokemon "fluffers" and uncheck the nickname flag with Pokesav, and it'll lose the nickname when it evolves.

Also, my trade thread partner RockinX Pal Parked his English Chansey to a Japanese game, and it decided to give them a nickname flag upon Pal Parking (because it didn't recognize the names). So when it evolved into a Blissey - on an English game - it's nickname was stuck as "CHANSEY".

I think the guy was referring to the "international pokedex" option, how after D/P it was expanded to all Pokemon in the game, not just the 20 or so it was in D/P. In theory, they could have left in this feature. However, as the people translating haven't found this text yet, we should assume it doesn't exist for the moment.

*EDIT* Actually, there's an easy way to test this. Set something's region to North America and trade it to someone. Then, check that Pokemon's pokedex entry.

[Smasher89]

I read a bit about the new thing with pickup, does it mean you can pick up any berry and keep it after the battle with an ingame trainer?

Same thing with thief, even though my pokemon fainted(I won the battle) it didn´t keep the rivals waterstarters leftovers, is it prevented to use thief for getting trainers pokemons items now? Or was it due to my pokemon fainted?

In the case it works, the pinchberries is accessable in the games =)