Miracle Shooter Discussion

Destiny Warrior · Feb 11th, 2011, 10:22:50 AM

Miracle Shooter is one of the interesting new additions to the metagame. To recap what items you can access via Miracle Shooter: http://www.serebii.net/blackwhite/battle.shtml#miracle

On first glance, the Pokemon I think this will help the most are Pokemon who can only be checked once in a game, since they can soak up a status, and can come back in later for a sweep. As a side note, it also helps to remove instances of "bs hax" by giving access to awakening etc. within 3 turns(1 point on turn of status, and 3 more points on subsequent turns), meaning a sleeping mon is significantly less deadweight as it can be used for sleep clause purproses, and can be awakened later.

Another interesting group of items are the X items. X items look like they could aid the likes of Zuruggu by adding on bulk every few turns. Full Heals also seem pretty useless, because you can get your intended effect with just 3 points instead of wasting 5.

Revives are probably going to be uncommon, because getting 11 points is not a joke whn your opponent is busy tanking up his Pokemon on those 11 turns with his own MS items.

Finally, Potions look like a dominating force. They get 75% to 100% of a Pokemon's health usually, meaning a near-dead sweeper can use this as a clutch to get back into the match.

Discuss Miracle Shooter's effect on Little Cup.

P.S.: Back your statements with proper evidence. I don't want people just whining "MS is gonna be broken" or "so and so Pokemon is gonna be broken" here without backing up their statement with calcs or arguments.

Moo · Feb 11th, 2011, 12:28:50 PM

Well Potion will be incredibly broken, because it's like a Berry Juice, (which is banned) and it only costs 2 points. The only reason it would be a problem in LC is because it requires such little points compared to standard play. I think Miracle Shooter could add some cool variety to the game, but will definitely require suspect testing.

Ice-eyes · Feb 11th, 2011, 1:20:51 PM

DW, you do realise this is not going to be allowed in normal LC?

But yeah, Potion is incredibly good, X items are pretty awesome as well. Stall becomes less potent because the longer the match lasts, the more likely it is that I will get the chance to give my Gligar +6 and win.

TorchicBlaziken · Feb 11th, 2011, 1:43:00 PM

Wonder Launcher

Destiny Warrior · Feb 11th, 2011, 8:08:18 PM

@Ice-eyes: This is just a discussion thread, since I think we *should* test MS if it gets implemented on PO for the sake of completeness.

You do bring up an interesting point about stall. Maybe Miracle Shooter could help counteract Evo Stone a little?

LeviLamprey · Feb 11th, 2011, 8:09:43 PM

Well, if there's a battle mode for LC allowing Miracle SHooter set up, it'd be incredibly broken.

NeoSeth · Feb 11th, 2011, 8:26:11 PM

The thing that interests me the most is the potential this has for stall in LC. Every two turns you gain an item to restore one of your Pokemon back to almost full health. That's amazing, and could make stall a lot more accessible in LC (I say accessible because I think stall is actually very viable in LC, you just have to play it differently).

SkyNet · Feb 11th, 2011, 8:52:10 PM

Well first off I really don't see the point in discussing a game mechanic that is never going to see the light of day in any metagame, do we even know that MS is going to be implemented on PO?

just seems like a waste of time discussing MS atm.

KratosAurion · Feb 12th, 2011, 11:43:35 AM

I agree. However, MS does open up several posibilities for breaking the meta, firstly, Poition, just when we declared Berry Juice to be 'broken' thanks to Dual Screen supported DD Bagon back in Gen IV.

That aside, this bends over the rules of the game more than anything before, since Stall Teams could become pretty much unbreakable while tanking turns with Protect / Substitute / Slack Off and other assorted moves, and once 11 turns pass, a member comes back, and Stall becomes even harder to defeat. Or say the KO was picked up by means of a good prediction, then Revive would make prediction a lot easier, since you could just Revive the lost member, and play cautiously depending on how it was last KO'ed.

Miracle Shooter itself is not so bad, but the items that are allowed could be the ones to break the meta. Still, let's hope this never sees the light of day.

Nails · Feb 12th, 2011, 3:04:51 PM

From the one battle I've seen with MS, no matter how flawed it might be, MS makes setup far easier than it should be.

Venser · Feb 16th, 2011, 8:12:03 AM

Also, coyo isn't planning on programming in miracle shooter anyways. :/

Feb 11th, 2011, 10:22:50 AM	#1
Destiny Warrior also known as Darkwing_Duck Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 3,044 Location: Andromeda Galaxy	Miracle Shooter Discussion Miracle Shooter is one of the interesting new additions to the metagame. To recap what items you can access via Miracle Shooter: http://www.serebii.net/blackwhite/battle.shtml#miracle On first glance, the Pokemon I think this will help the most are Pokemon who can only be checked once in a game, since they can soak up a status, and can come back in later for a sweep. As a side note, it also helps to remove instances of "bs hax" by giving access to awakening etc. within 3 turns(1 point on turn of status, and 3 more points on subsequent turns), meaning a sleeping mon is significantly less deadweight as it can be used for sleep clause purproses, and can be awakened later. Another interesting group of items are the X items. X items look like they could aid the likes of Zuruggu by adding on bulk every few turns. Full Heals also seem pretty useless, because you can get your intended effect with just 3 points instead of wasting 5. Revives are probably going to be uncommon, because getting 11 points is not a joke whn your opponent is busy tanking up his Pokemon on those 11 turns with his own MS items. Finally, Potions look like a dominating force. They get 75% to 100% of a Pokemon's health usually, meaning a near-dead sweeper can use this as a clutch to get back into the match. Discuss Miracle Shooter's effect on Little Cup. P.S.: Back your statements with proper evidence. I don't want people just whining "MS is gonna be broken" or "so and so Pokemon is gonna be broken" here without backing up their statement with calcs or arguments. __________________ 17:47 Zarator cc for cap shit? 17:47 Zarator why? 17:48 Destiny_Warrior he contributed to the CAP community with his posts duh 17:48 Zarator oh wait 17:48 Objection maybe CAP's becoming more influential on smogon? 17:48 Zarator you don't mean currency counters right? CAP ASB and Battle Arcade Last edited by Destiny Warrior; Feb 11th, 2011 at 10:37:59 AM.

Feb 11th, 2011, 12:28:50 PM	#2
Moo Professor Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 1,447	Well Potion will be incredibly broken, because it's like a Berry Juice, (which is banned) and it only costs 2 points. The only reason it would be a problem in LC is because it requires such little points compared to standard play. I think Miracle Shooter could add some cool variety to the game, but will definitely require suspect testing. __________________ GP / UU QC, VM for check VM for a UU rate

Feb 11th, 2011, 1:20:51 PM	#3
Ice-eyes Simper Fi Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 1,658	DW, you do realise this is not going to be allowed in normal LC? But yeah, Potion is incredibly good, X items are pretty awesome as well. Stall becomes less potent because the longer the match lasts, the more likely it is that I will get the chance to give my Gligar +6 and win. __________________ 22:36 <MMF> cunt is my favorite

Feb 11th, 2011, 8:08:18 PM	#5
Destiny Warrior also known as Darkwing_Duck Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 3,044 Location: Andromeda Galaxy	@Ice-eyes: This is just a discussion thread, since I think we should test MS if it gets implemented on PO for the sake of completeness. You do bring up an interesting point about stall. Maybe Miracle Shooter could help counteract Evo Stone a little? __________________ 17:47 Zarator cc for cap shit? 17:47 Zarator why? 17:48 Destiny_Warrior he contributed to the CAP community with his posts duh 17:48 Zarator oh wait 17:48 Objection maybe CAP's becoming more influential on smogon? 17:48 Zarator you don't mean currency counters right? CAP ASB and Battle Arcade

Feb 11th, 2011, 8:09:43 PM	#6
LeviLamprey Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 1,205	Well, if there's a battle mode for LC allowing Miracle SHooter set up, it'd be incredibly broken. __________________ CAP ASB Shenanigans Pikurei Forums (12:01:01) EmeraldOx: we can be clumsybuddies ;w;

Feb 11th, 2011, 1:43:00 PM	#4
TorchicBlaziken Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 1,225 Use sunscreen!	Wonder Launcher

Feb 11th, 2011, 8:26:11 PM	#7
NeoSeth Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 267 It's simple. We kill the Batman.	The thing that interests me the most is the potential this has for stall in LC. Every two turns you gain an item to restore one of your Pokemon back to almost full health. That's amazing, and could make stall a lot more accessible in LC (I say accessible because I think stall is actually very viable in LC, you just have to play it differently). __________________ My RMT: Wobbuffet is Broken Rate, Don't Hate, Appreciate

Feb 11th, 2011, 8:52:10 PM	#8
SkyNet MediEvil! Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 293 Gallowmere	Well first off I really don't see the point in discussing a game mechanic that is never going to see the light of day in any metagame, do we even know that MS is going to be implemented on PO? just seems like a waste of time discussing MS atm.

Feb 12th, 2011, 11:43:35 AM	#9
KratosAurion Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 67 Imil, Weyard.	I agree. However, MS does open up several posibilities for breaking the meta, firstly, Poition, just when we declared Berry Juice to be 'broken' thanks to Dual Screen supported DD Bagon back in Gen IV. That aside, this bends over the rules of the game more than anything before, since Stall Teams could become pretty much unbreakable while tanking turns with Protect / Substitute / Slack Off and other assorted moves, and once 11 turns pass, a member comes back, and Stall becomes even harder to defeat. Or say the KO was picked up by means of a good prediction, then Revive would make prediction a lot easier, since you could just Revive the lost member, and play cautiously depending on how it was last KO'ed. Miracle Shooter itself is not so bad, but the items that are allowed could be the ones to break the meta. Still, let's hope this never sees the light of day. __________________ ...

Feb 12th, 2011, 3:04:51 PM	#10
Nails I wanna be a red panda when I grow up Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,257	From the one battle I've seen with MS, no matter how flawed it might be, MS makes setup far easier than it should be. __________________ reyscarface: nails unluckiest man alive Eternal: no ghosting Das

Feb 16th, 2011, 8:12:03 AM	#11
Venser Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 1,606 #doubles if anywhere	Also, coyo isn't planning on programming in miracle shooter anyways. :/