Metagame Analysis: Underused (And only Underused) - Page 2

Siphai · May 28th, 2006, 11:23:24 AM

As was said in another topic, though, Aggron needs 200 Sp. Atk evs to ohko Gligar. It would just be wasting ev's and an attack slot to use Ice Beam for Gligar. Plus you would need to predict him on the switch, since you can't use it once he's in.

Pax Deorum · May 28th, 2006, 11:32:35 AM

People usually use Substitute when a pokemon is switching out, so not much prediction is needed. You won't sacrifice that much in other stats. You'll still have ultra high Defence and good Attack. Focus Punch isn't that needed on Aggron seeing he's all about Paraflinching.

Siphai · May 28th, 2006, 12:07:18 PM

It's not like you KNOW when they are switching out, so it isn't like you'll know that well when to use Sub. If they have something in that can keep breaking the sub anyway, then you're fucked. Putting 200 Evs in Sp Atk just to counter something that will fuck it over anyway isn't smart.

Pax Deorum · May 28th, 2006, 12:23:19 PM

I think it's pretty obvious a CBer switches out when Aggron comes in on a NVE Attack. Plus if you read my post carefully I never said I used Ice Beam on him because Gligar fucked it up. I said I used Ice Beam Aggron because Gligar fucks up Bellywrath and nothing makes Gligar come in more than Aggron.

**Pocket** · May 28th, 2006, 12:57:03 PM

You don't need 200 Sp Attk to OHKO Gligar with Ice Beam, btw. 183 is a definite OHKO (not a guarantee OHKO, but 100% OHKO).

So a spread like 252 HP / 148 Atk / 108 Sp Atk, Brave Nature would be pretty good.

Siphai · May 28th, 2006, 1:05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Pocket

You don't need 200 Sp Attk to OHKO Gligar with Ice Beam, btw. 183 is a definite OHKO (not a guarantee OHKO, but 100% OHKO).

So a spread like 252 HP / 148 Atk / 108 Sp Atk, Adamant Nature would be pretty good.

Are you sure it's 108 evs for an Adamant nature? That makes it's Sp Atk only 164, and it doesn't ohko a Defensive Gligar (With lots of HP Evs)

**Pocket** · May 28th, 2006, 1:16:09 PM

Sorry, I meant Brave, and I really doubt Gligar's HP exceeds 305.

Pax Deorum · May 28th, 2006, 2:30:58 PM

It can reach 334 ._.

Most Gligars I see have 300 HP which means Aggron only needs 96 Sp. Attack EVs with a neutral nature on Sp. Attack to guarantee a OHKO on him.

Kataphraktoi · Jun 2nd, 2006, 8:40:12 PM

I have a Q. Typlosion, Lapras, and Slowbro are all in the borderline section, but ive seen other people using them on UU teams. Whats the deal? Can i use borderlines or not? Because if i dont, these(all the bls i mean) will be continuing to walk over my pure-UU teams, and if i do use bls, i will get(and have gotten) flak from people.

I dont get why other people can use borderlines and i cant. Seriously. And if you clause them, its like ''rofl stfu'' and there goes my team down the drain.

Tazzler · Jun 2nd, 2006, 9:45:16 PM

By adding Bls's in a regular UU team with no special privilage, the UU metagame becomes a 'mixed' metagme or UU/BL. A BL metagame if you will. Just state in your info "No Bl's" or something like that.

Siphai · Jun 3rd, 2006, 5:11:15 AM

It's probably teams from the Summer Freedom tournament, where 1 BL is allowed.

cook · Jun 22nd, 2006, 11:06:46 PM

can somebody just write a damn uu teambuilding article

ToP · Jun 23rd, 2006, 12:19:37 AM

1. Pick 6 Pokemon with a high attack stat and decent speed.
2. Put a Choice Band on said pokemon.
3. Have a normal and a rock resist.

:\

***Mekkah***** · Jun 23rd, 2006, 1:31:08 AM

Basically just cover the top20 or so of most used Pokemon while having relatively good offense.

meddle · Jun 23rd, 2006, 9:32:36 AM

here are the top 20 underuseds in my opinion (in no particular order):

1 gligar
2 solrock
3 fearow
4 quagsire
5 grumpig
6 hypno
7 vileplume
8 kangaskhan
9 mr. mime
10 tentacruel
11 lanturn
12 clefable
13 electabuzz
14 pinsir
15 blastoise
16 nidoking
17 meganium
18 electrode
19 hitmonlee
20 persian

honorable mentions:
muk
manectric
shiftry
slowking
omastar
linoone

***Mekkah***** · Jun 23rd, 2006, 10:18:43 AM

And also Aggron obviously.

Siphai · Jun 23rd, 2006, 11:23:26 AM

Yeah, but countering Aggron is easy. Just put Mud Slap on something.

I'd say something that makes a good UU team is a combination of

· Gligar Counter
· Minimal Ground weakeness (2 Pokemon maximum)
· Physical Tank (Make sure it has a Normal/Flying resist.)
· Special Tank (Optional)
· Choice Bander
· Special Sweeper (Optional)

Also, I just want to say that a Gligar + Grumpig combo is awesome.

***Mekkah***** · Jun 23rd, 2006, 12:15:17 PM

Once again I don't see why "Gligar counter" is a seperate thing. God damnit that thing is so overrated. You'll usually have a Water or Solrock or both on your team anyway.

MNL · Jun 23rd, 2006, 12:18:45 PM

nidoking @ leftovers
earthquake
megahorn
ice beam
thunderbolt/thunder/fire blast

^ this can really destroy teams in uu when you can easily switch into common pokemon like aggron and muk.

**gene** · Jun 23rd, 2006, 12:34:35 PM

choice banders are overrated, you don't need a choice bander on a good uu team.

fighting/bug/rock resist is needed though

cook · Jun 23rd, 2006, 2:29:58 PM

well personally i had a different idea for an uu team building guide, because a beginner to the uu environment who reads this article would have no clue on what 6 pokemon to pick that would work well together. in my ,math class today i outlined an uu teambuilding guide which would complement this thread as well as bluelightstars. ill write it this weekend, and before i post it ill show it to mekkah or someone to see if it is worth posting

~~TheYêllowWizzãrd~~ · Jun 23rd, 2006, 6:51:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat meddle

here are the top 20 underuseds in my opinion (in no particular order):

1 gligar
2 solrock
3 fearow
4 quagsire
5 grumpig
6 hypno
7 vileplume
8 kangaskhan
9 mr. mime
10 tentacruel
11 lanturn
12 clefable
13 electabuzz
14 pinsir
15 blastoise
16 nidoking
17 meganium
18 electrode
19 hitmonlee
20 persian

honorable mentions:
muk
manectric
shiftry
slowking
omastar
linoone

No slowbro? He's arguably the best tank in the UU metagame.

Raikou21 · Jun 23rd, 2006, 6:52:05 PM

Well this is for UU only, and Slowbro's BL.

meddle · Jun 23rd, 2006, 9:30:08 PM

Yeah, I forgot Aggron.

Also, Aggron should NOT pack ice beam ffs. "lol it beats gligar," just switch!

Siphai · Jun 24th, 2006, 2:41:47 AM

Yes, exactly. "lol aggron is gligar bait" is not a good enough excuse. While a lot of teams DO run gligar, if you run into a team that doesn't, well you are fucked aren't you?

In the case that they DO have gligar, it's not neccessarily given that they'll switch to it. And if you accidentally Ice Beam a Solrock, or something, well your whole plan is fucked since you gave yourself away.

May 28th, 2006, 11:32:35 AM	#27
Pax Deorum Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 839	People usually use Substitute when a pokemon is switching out, so not much prediction is needed. You won't sacrifice that much in other stats. You'll still have ultra high Defence and good Attack. Focus Punch isn't that needed on Aggron seeing he's all about Paraflinching. __________________ http://imagegen.last.fm/Robot3MusicV...GoldenLamb.gif

May 28th, 2006, 12:23:19 PM	#29
Pax Deorum Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 839	I think it's pretty obvious a CBer switches out when Aggron comes in on a NVE Attack. Plus if you read my post carefully I never said I used Ice Beam on him because Gligar fucked it up. I said I used Ice Beam Aggron because Gligar fucks up Bellywrath and nothing makes Gligar come in more than Aggron. __________________ http://imagegen.last.fm/Robot3MusicV...GoldenLamb.gif

May 28th, 2006, 12:57:03 PM	#30
Pocket Bakuman ;< Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 7,179 Bergenfield	You don't need 200 Sp Attk to OHKO Gligar with Ice Beam, btw. 183 is a definite OHKO (not a guarantee OHKO, but 100% OHKO). So a spread like 252 HP / 148 Atk / 108 Sp Atk, Brave Nature would be pretty good. __________________ Dark Horse Project: Conquer the Ladder! \| Word of Wisdom for Trainers \| Smogon Doubles: Let's Make It Official! Last edited by Pocket; May 28th, 2006 at 1:17:05 PM.

May 28th, 2006, 1:16:09 PM	#32
Pocket Bakuman ;< Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 7,179 Bergenfield	Sorry, I meant Brave, and I really doubt Gligar's HP exceeds 305. __________________ Dark Horse Project: Conquer the Ladder! \| Word of Wisdom for Trainers \| Smogon Doubles: Let's Make It Official!

May 28th, 2006, 2:30:58 PM	#33
Pax Deorum Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 839	It can reach 334 ._. Most Gligars I see have 300 HP which means Aggron only needs 96 Sp. Attack EVs with a neutral nature on Sp. Attack to guarantee a OHKO on him. __________________ http://imagegen.last.fm/Robot3MusicV...GoldenLamb.gif

May 28th, 2006, 11:23:24 AM	#26
Siphai Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,465	As was said in another topic, though, Aggron needs 200 Sp. Atk evs to ohko Gligar. It would just be wasting ev's and an attack slot to use Ice Beam for Gligar. Plus you would need to predict him on the switch, since you can't use it once he's in.

May 28th, 2006, 12:07:18 PM	#28
Siphai Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,465	It's not like you KNOW when they are switching out, so it isn't like you'll know that well when to use Sub. If they have something in that can keep breaking the sub anyway, then you're fucked. Putting 200 Evs in Sp Atk just to counter something that will fuck it over anyway isn't smart.

Jun 2nd, 2006, 8:40:12 PM	#34
Kataphraktoi Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 74	I have a Q. Typlosion, Lapras, and Slowbro are all in the borderline section, but ive seen other people using them on UU teams. Whats the deal? Can i use borderlines or not? Because if i dont, these(all the bls i mean) will be continuing to walk over my pure-UU teams, and if i do use bls, i will get(and have gotten) flak from people. I dont get why other people can use borderlines and i cant. Seriously. And if you clause them, its like ''rofl stfu'' and there goes my team down the drain. __________________ It is pleasant, when the sea is high and the winds are dashing the waves about, to watch from the shores the struggles of another -Lucretius They have an abundance of gold and silver, and these make war, like other things, go smoothly.-Hermocrates

Jun 2nd, 2006, 9:45:16 PM	#35
Tazzler Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 1,347 Maryland	By adding Bls's in a regular UU team with no special privilage, the UU metagame becomes a 'mixed' metagme or UU/BL. A BL metagame if you will. Just state in your info "No Bl's" or something like that. Last edited by Tazzler; Jun 22nd, 2006 at 11:13:44 PM.

Jun 3rd, 2006, 5:11:15 AM	#36
Siphai Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,465	It's probably teams from the Summer Freedom tournament, where 1 BL is allowed.

Jun 22nd, 2006, 11:06:46 PM	#37
cook Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 1,658 chicago!	can somebody just write a damn uu teambuilding article

Jun 23rd, 2006, 12:19:37 AM	#38
ToP Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 1,574 Colorado	1. Pick 6 Pokemon with a high attack stat and decent speed. 2. Put a Choice Band on said pokemon. 3. Have a normal and a rock resist. :\

Jun 23rd, 2006, 1:31:08 AM	#39
*Mekkah* pfbwowbfobwobwobfwowbf Administrator** Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 13,835 Most of them are good	Basically just cover the top20 or so of most used Pokemon while having relatively good offense.

Jun 23rd, 2006, 9:32:36 AM	#40
meddle Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 2,844 seattle	here are the top 20 underuseds in my opinion (in no particular order): 1 gligar 2 solrock 3 fearow 4 quagsire 5 grumpig 6 hypno 7 vileplume 8 kangaskhan 9 mr. mime 10 tentacruel 11 lanturn 12 clefable 13 electabuzz 14 pinsir 15 blastoise 16 nidoking 17 meganium 18 electrode 19 hitmonlee 20 persian honorable mentions: muk manectric shiftry slowking omastar linoone Last edited by meddle; Jun 23rd, 2006 at 9:34:39 AM.

Jun 23rd, 2006, 10:18:43 AM	#41
*Mekkah* pfbwowbfobwobwobfwowbf Administrator** Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 13,835 Most of them are good	And also Aggron obviously.

Jun 23rd, 2006, 11:23:26 AM	#42
Siphai Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,465	Yeah, but countering Aggron is easy. Just put Mud Slap on something. I'd say something that makes a good UU team is a combination of · Gligar Counter · Minimal Ground weakeness (2 Pokemon maximum) · Physical Tank (Make sure it has a Normal/Flying resist.) · Special Tank (Optional) · Choice Bander · Special Sweeper (Optional) Also, I just want to say that a Gligar + Grumpig combo is awesome. Last edited by Siphai; Jun 23rd, 2006 at 11:58:20 AM.

Jun 23rd, 2006, 12:15:17 PM	#43
*Mekkah* pfbwowbfobwobwobfwowbf Administrator** Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 13,835 Most of them are good	Once again I don't see why "Gligar counter" is a seperate thing. God damnit that thing is so overrated. You'll usually have a Water or Solrock or both on your team anyway.

Jun 23rd, 2006, 12:18:45 PM	#44
MNL Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 265	nidoking @ leftovers earthquake megahorn ice beam thunderbolt/thunder/fire blast ^ this can really destroy teams in uu when you can easily switch into common pokemon like aggron and muk.

Jun 23rd, 2006, 12:34:35 PM	#45
gene GENE Moderator Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 2,715 Buffalo, NY	choice banders are overrated, you don't need a choice bander on a good uu team. fighting/bug/rock resist is needed though __________________ death to evan

Jun 23rd, 2006, 2:29:58 PM	#46
cook Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 1,658 chicago!	well personally i had a different idea for an uu team building guide, because a beginner to the uu environment who reads this article would have no clue on what 6 pokemon to pick that would work well together. in my ,math class today i outlined an uu teambuilding guide which would complement this thread as well as bluelightstars. ill write it this weekend, and before i post it ill show it to mekkah or someone to see if it is worth posting

Jun 23rd, 2006, 6:52:05 PM	#48
Raikou21 Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 625 Abbotsford, BC, Canada	Well this is for UU only, and Slowbro's BL. __________________ http://scorponok.rubeus.org/archives/sesamestreet.jpg Watch out! Elmo's got a gun!

Jun 23rd, 2006, 9:30:08 PM	#49
meddle Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 2,844 seattle	Yeah, I forgot Aggron. Also, Aggron should NOT pack ice beam ffs. "lol it beats gligar," just switch!

Jun 24th, 2006, 2:41:47 AM	#50
Siphai Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,465	Yes, exactly. "lol aggron is gligar bait" is not a good enough excuse. While a lot of teams DO run gligar, if you run into a team that doesn't, well you are fucked aren't you? In the case that they DO have gligar, it's not neccessarily given that they'll switch to it. And if you accidentally Ice Beam a Solrock, or something, well your whole plan is fucked since you gave yourself away.