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2014 April Friendly

Discussion in 'Battle Spot' started by TheMantyke, Mar 25, 2014.

  1. TheMantyke

    TheMantyke DISRESPECT YOUR SUPERIORS
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    [​IMG]

    Official Announcement

    Pokemon is hosting a tournament over the battlespot with the entire Kalos dex available, even Yveltal and Xerneus! Registration runs through April 17th to April 24th with the competition hosted from April 25th to April 28th. Results are to be posted on May 1st. There are two age divisions with Seniors and Juniors lumped into one group of being born before 1999 and Masters born 1998 or earlier. Interestingly, Nature Power is Earthquake throughout this competition.

    On Site Tournament Regulations
  2. Professor Birch

    Professor Birch

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    I'll get to put my Greninja and Mega Scizor to good use!
  3. starlightfeline

    starlightfeline

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    As far as legendaries go, I'm more concerned about Mega Mewtwo than Xerneas/Yveltal. I'm thinking about trying, but the fact that those things are allowed are really turning me off from entering.
    ethan06 likes this.
  4. BerzerkFury365

    BerzerkFury365

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    What with the legendaries being available, this makes for an interesting single battle.
    Though I'm sure I'd bring along a Scarf Imposter Ditto to bring down Mega Mewtwo's
  5. ethan06

    ethan06

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    I don't think Mewtwo-Y will be uncounterable - max HP Crumbler Aegislash deals with it just fine, as does Sucker Punch Yveltal. I wouldn't discount the other three, as they're all very good in their own rights.

    EDIT:
    Yveltal @ Assault Vest
    Quiet
    Dark Aura
    252 HP/252 Sp. Atk/4 Def
    -Sucker Punch
    -Dark Pulse
    -Oblivion Wing
    -Focus Blast/U-Turn

    0 Atk Dark Aura Yveltal Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Mewtwo Y: 390-462 (110.4 - 130.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
    252+ SpA Dark Aura Yveltal Dark Pulse vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Mewtwo Y: 330-390 (93.4 - 110.4%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
    252 SpA Mega Mewtwo Y Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Yveltal: 180-214 (39.4 - 46.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

    Probably the best Mewtwo check I've seen so far. Can tank any of it's attacking moves like a champ and KO with Sucker Punch or Dark Pulse (the latter assuming prior damage). It's easily set up on though.

    ----
    Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
    Quiet
    Stance Change
    252 HP/252 Sp. Atk/4 Atk
    -Shadow Ball
    -Shadow Sneak/Iron Head
    -Sacred Sword
    -King's Shield

    252 SpA Mega Mewtwo Y Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Aegislash-Shield: 168-198 (51.8 - 61.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    252 SpA Mega Mewtwo Y Psystrike vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Aegislash-Shield: 78-92 (24 - 28.3%) -- 96% chance to 4HKO

    61 + 28 = 89% - Aegislash can come in on any of Mewtwo's moves, tank a follow-up Shadow Ball and OHKO with it's own +2 Shadow Ball. It's pretty useless afterward though.
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2014
  6. EsurioXY

    EsurioXY

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    Battlespot Singles rules with no pokemon bans.

    I want a Xerneas now... Counter all those Chomps/Yvetals
    I wonder if there is any symmetry with a Yvetal/Xerneas/Mega-Mewtwo team...
  7. Theorymon

    Theorymon ☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄
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    Ah, this is pretty similar to pre Pokébank battle spot free battles! If I remember correctly, Mega Kangaskahn and Mega Mawile where VERY common in that metagame. They where so common, that those two plus Yveltal made Jibaku run Will-O-Wisp on his Mega Mewtwo Y. I wonder if that still has merit in this metagame...

    Also, while Power Herb Xerneas may be dangerous, I expect it to be EXTREMELY prepared for in this metagame, so I'm tempted to run something like LO Aromatherepy Xerneas. Too bad HP Fire is super hard to get though...
  8. Onicon

    Onicon

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    We are currently doing some tests with DD-Tyranitar. Thanks to its Mega it is now able to break the magical 200 benchmark that is Mewtwo. Its type is ideal for a sweeper because of the resistance to Brave Bird. One concern would be probably that it is a bit weak at +1, although its bulk allows it to stomach at least another it like Xerneas' Moonblast or Mewtwo's Aura Sphere, at least when without LO.

    We have the feeling that Aegislash will be our MVP, for being a great Xerneas counter and Mewtwo check. If you use the CRUMBLER without LO, be sure to pack in Shadow Sneak so that the 252 Iron Head can be followed up for a clean 2HKO (almost clean, there is a tiny chance it survives with 1 or 2 HP). Otherwise, LO Iron Head is a OHKO against 4/0 Xerneas. The set with HP even has a high chance of surviving two +2 Moon Blasts. Power Herb Xerneas is not going to bother us a lot. However ...

    Yveltal is going to be another level of beastly. The only thing we can imagine beating it is Xerneas but it is a check at best. Too bad we don't have access to Togekiss, it's service is pretty much needed for this one. In bad cases we have to fall back to Chople-TTar. CM-Mewtwo-X anyone? Oblivion Wing.
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2014
    ethan06 likes this.
  9. NixHex

    NixHex No excuses
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    TI put up a practice ladder on PS! "2014 April Friendly"

    edit: don't play yet. the ban list was implemented incorrectly. talking to TI about it, i'll post again when it's fixed.
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2014
    ethan06 likes this.
  10. samuraigrifter

    samuraigrifter

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    What would be some good Mega Evos to start building a team with for this format? It's safe to bring 2 since it's 3v3, but I can't decide which ones to start building a team around.

    Also, do you think Mega MewtwoX will be neutered a bit in this format since he can't have access to good physical transfer only moves with STAB?
  11. Theorymon

    Theorymon ☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄☄
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    I actually sort of want to try Mega Mewtwo X. Prebank, I remember there being a shit ton of Sucker Punch abuse, from the likes of Yveltal, Mega Kangaskhan, and Mega Mawile. Mega Mewtwo Y is probably better, but Sucker Punch was such a huge issue that I know Jibaku started using Will-O-Wisp Mega Mewtwo Y!

    I imagine that if Mega Mewtwo X has any use, maybe a specially based set could make sense? Even with the base 190 Atk, I think Psystrike out damages Psycho Cut. It's going to be weaker than LO Mewtwo and Mega Mewto Y, but maybe avoiding the dark weakness could be worth it, but the Fairy weakness will hurt vs Mega Mawile and Xerneas.

    I'll maybe do some calcs for a Bulk Up set too, maybe setting up on something like Scizor + having more resistance to priority could make up for the weaker attacking output!
    samuraigrifter likes this.
  12. ethan06

    ethan06

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    Well, besides the obvious Mega Mewtwo, which Theorymon covered, the other Mega Evolutions that will probably see the most use are Kangaskhan, Lucario and Mawile. In terms of the ones you should use, they're all viable in singles (besides a couple of the more niche ones like Banette and Abomasnow) but it really depends on the kind of team you're planning to make. If you're going for the anti-meta approach (which I recommend), then Pokémon that can tear down the top threats are essential; Gengar works great for playing around Xerneas, Kangaskhan and Lucario (and Mawile to a lesser extent), but gets demolished by Mewtwo and Yveltal. Manectric hard counters Talonflame, checks Yveltal and can spread Intimidate to annoy Kangaskhan and beats physical Lucario with it's fire coverage but hates Sucker Punch - and once again, Mewtwo outspeeds and runs through it. It can almost OHKO standard Garchomp with Hidden Power [Ice] but fails with about 5% HP left. An interesting option to consider is Absol; with access to a crazy-powerful Sucker Punch and immunity to Will-o-Wisp through Magic Bounce, it may do well as a check to Mega Mewtwo if you're good at Sucker Punch mindgames. This set may be fun to try out:

    Absol @ Absolite
    Naive
    Justified -> Magic Bounce
    252 Spd/196 Sp. Atk/60 Atk
    -Substitute
    -Sucker Punch
    -Play Rough
    -Fire Blast

    Beats most of the above Mega Evolutions when it has a Substitute up. Mega Absol is very good at forcing things out, however, don't lead with it as lead matchups can very easily go wrong in 3v3. Fire Blast puts a hole in Lucario and Mawile as well as cracking Scizor, Aegislash and Ferrothorn reliably should they appear; Play Rough hits Garchomp super-effectively and removes it and Sucker Punch kills Gengar and Mewtwo Y, as well as denting Manectric. It's extremely frail though, so it'd have to be played carefully but it's just a little idea I had :)
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2014
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  13. MythTrainerInfinity

    MythTrainerInfinity

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    Mega Mawile can pretty much OHKO any Mewtwo, right? It also does really well against Yvetal and Xerneas too... Hmmm.
    ethan06 likes this.
  14. ethan06

    ethan06

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    The Will-o-Wisp Mewtwo would completely screw Mawile though, so if that gets popular...
  15. samuraigrifter

    samuraigrifter

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    These are the two I'm thinking of building around.

    The Mewtwo I caught in X is Jolly. Right now it has 4HP/252Atk/252/Spe.
    The moves I have so far are Recover/Earthquake/Aura Sphere/Psychic

    I was thinking of putting in Poison Jab to take care of the fairies and changing Psychic with PsyShock or Psycho Cut. That'll leave me without a decent Physical fighting move.

    The 2nd Mega I have is Charizard Y,

    Charizard@CharizarditeY
    FireBlast
    SolarBeam
    Focus Blast
    Roost
    Modest
    4HP/252SpA/252Spe

    Any suggestions on these 2 as well as possible partners for each?
  16. Onicon

    Onicon

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    Psystrike is always better than Psychic unless your opponent is Skarmory (the coverage moves do more damage anyway).
    Firstly, use Brick Break. It is no Low Kick but still does more damage than Aura Shpere, especially against Kangaskhan (75% against 0/0).
    Secondly, Bulk Up + Stone Edge is a clean OHKO aganist 252/0 and 0/0 Yveltal. This combined with not being weak against Sucker Punch is probably THE reason to use Mewtwo X over regular and Y.
    Earthquake can stay, because it OHKOs Aegislash. At +1 it is a 75% OHKO against 252/0 Aegislash and a clean one against 0/0. Mega-Mawile still beats you, though.

    We recommend you to keep the EV spread but to change the moves to Bulk Up/Brick Break/Stone Edge/Earthquake. One thing to note is that you cannot check Xerneas. The Geomancy set has (or should have, imo) enough Def in oder to survive one +1 Poison Jab so it will eventually beat you. The cookie cutter attacker cannot always survive a +1, but the chance of him surviving is over 30%. In a clean state battle, you always lose. If you are concerned about Xerneas, just run Aegislash.

    Charizard Y is, in our opinion, not solid. Checks Attacker Xerneas, loses to Geomancy. Loses to every Yveltal with Assault Vest and still 50/50 against offensive ones. Checks Mewtwos but only when they don't CM. Speed ties with Kangaskhan, but you will lose more often than not, assuming it is Adamant and not Jolly in order to outspeed the box legendaries (she OHKOs you, you OHKO less than 100% of the times, with Fire Miss no less).
    This one relies too much on generous damage roll to make things work and has no form of priority. If it is Modest, it is possible that it will be outsped by all the big threats who don't need the extra damage and you still can't reliably KO them. If it is Timid, you will fare even worse in KOing them and it still will eat a Sucker Punch follow-up.
    samuraigrifter likes this.
  17. xfeather

    xfeather

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    I haven't been into competitive battling so far and April Friendly seems like a nice tournament to start out with.

    Two commonly used Pokemon (that I like, too :)) that seem to have a good typing against the new legendaries are Scizor and Tyranitar.
    What do you think of them and how would you build them?
    Do you think it's too risky to run Tyranitar and Yveltal in the same team?

    Is there any pre-pokebank battle spot data or something similar to look into or where do you try to get your hints on what could be strong in this meta game?

    Also, Will-o-Wisp Mewtwo sounds great. Would you still run a Timid 252SpAtk, 252Speed Mewtwo Y with that or would you try to make it tankier-ish?
    Thanks for your insights :)
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2014
  18. samuraigrifter

    samuraigrifter

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    Thanks for the tip! I'll try looking for a 2nd Mega to build around if Zard Y isn't very viable in this meta. I have a feeling that I'd rather use TTar with Assault Vest rather than as a Mega. I'll look into Scizor, Garchomp or Kangaskhan as a 2nd Mega.
  19. Onicon

    Onicon

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    After digging into the issue about Yveltal we took a look at Zygarde, see if it is any good.

    Zygarde @ Life Orb
    Ability: Aura Break
    Level: 50
    EVs (1): 148 Atk / 156 Spd / 204 SDef
    EVs (2): 236 Atk / 156 Spd / 44 HP / 12 SDef / 60 Def
    Adamant Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Earthquake
    - Outrage
    - Stone Edge

    Timid LO Oblivion Wing with do less than 50%. When you are able to come in, you can Dragon Dance once. The subsequent Stone Edge will KO it after its LO recoil. The speed enables you to outrun Mewtwo with +1 Spd and the Atk is for OHKOing 4/0 Mewtwo wit +1 Atk. The only problem we see with this set is that its setup opportunities are Yveltals only. Xerneas 2HKOs it or outspeeds it with Geomancy while Zygarde only 3HKOs most of the time.
    The second set is designed to take down Mewtwo Kangaskhan every time with a +1 Outrage while surviving Return and Sucker Punch but this is a mixed bag. Firstly, that is assuming Kangaskhan does not crit, which is unlikely because it attacks up to four times. Secondly, depending on the damage roll you might end up dying from LO recoil or surviving. When the opponent does not run Xerneas that is good, but if Xerneas comes in your Outrage and get the free Geomancy off - well, Aegislash still counters it but will not be able to check the inevitable Mewtwo follow-up anymore. Be sure to have an appropiate answer to that one (like Scarf-Xerneas who incidentally also covers Yveltal).

    Any reason to use it over Dragonite (yes, we know Dragonite cannot reach 135 speed without going Jolly)?
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2014
  20. Unowninator

    Unowninator

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    Is it worth using an Avalugg w/ Own Tempo just to beat PrankSwag on Battle Spot?

    Seriously, I abosolutely hate losing to Pokemon like Klefki, Meowstic & Liepard. Would using Avalugg w/ Own Tempo be a good idea?

    Or if you have a better idea to counter them, please tell me. Preferably something foolproof if possible.
  21. Onicon

    Onicon

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    Avalugg is just horrible when box legendaries are running rampant. Your best is probably Jolly Persim/Lum Garchomp, both with max Atk and Spd. Garchomp is immune to Thunder Wave and is likely to nab a +2 when facing Klefki and Meowstic. If you are very ballsy you may set up a substitute while they use priority Swagger, making you safe for the rest of the battle.
  22. starlightfeline

    starlightfeline

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    Lum Berry mons are the way to go. If you're up for sacrificing a moveslot and extra time, there are some pokemon that can get Magic Coat in BW2 from the move tutor-possible useable ones without the pesky weakness to Dark are Togekiss, Sableye, Milotic, and Magnezone. May not be great, but whenever Swagsters see an obvious counter (like Magic Bounce), they usually lead with Substitute, so a well-timed Magic Coat can really go a long way, since they won't be expecting that.

    Relevant calcs:
    252+ SpA Magnezone Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Liepard: 280-331 (84.5 - 100%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
    252+ SpA Magnezone Flash Cannon vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Liepard: 249-294 (75.2 - 88.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
    252+ SpA Magnezone Volt Switch vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Liepard: 219-258 (66.1 - 77.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

    Foul play does 12-14% for non darks if modest, 17-21% if Liepard-not too bad a counter.

    252+ SpA Togekiss Dazzling Gleam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Klefki: 76-90 (23.8 - 28.3%) -- possible 5HKO after Leftovers recovery
    0 SpA Togekiss Dazzling Gleam vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Liepard: 350-414 (105.7 - 125%) -- guaranteed OHKO

    8 Atk Liepard Foul Play vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Togekiss: 28-33 (7.4 - 8.8%) -- possibly the worst move ever

    Sableye:

    0- Atk Sableye Foul Play vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Liepard: 80-95 (24.1 - 28.7%) -- possible 5HKO after Leftovers recovery

    8 Atk Liepard Foul Play vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Sableye: 93-109 (30.5 - 35.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
    Sableye does get recover and knock off, but that screws you over coverage-wise.

    Milotic:
    4 SpA Milotic Scald vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Liepard: 151-178 (45.6 - 53.7%) -- 2% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

    8 Atk Liepard Foul Play vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Milotic: 51-61 (12.9 - 15.4%) -- possibly the worst move ever

    The only problem is that you're taking away a moveslot for this. I'd go with Magnezone, since you can actually do things with it aside from being a Swagplay counter.
  23. Unowninator

    Unowninator

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    Sadly, Magic Coat isn't an option because a blue pentagon is required for all Pokemon here. Also, Togekiss & Milotic are forbidden in this tournament because they're not in any Kalos dex.
  24. starlightfeline

    starlightfeline

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    Oh, my bad. I'd go with the Lum route, then.
  25. NixHex

    NixHex No excuses
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    Uh, let's forget about Mewtwo (in all of its forms), Xerneas, Yveltal, and SwagPlay for a second and address the real issue here...

    Kangaskhan.

    Even the most powerful pokemon in the tier (the three I listed and aegislash and stuff) just cannot kill it. A combo of Fake Out and Sucker Punch take care of Mewtwo-Y without it doing anything back. If you're afraid it'll Calm Mind, just go straight for the Return which KOes, while Aura Sphere does a max of 80 to 4 SpD Kanga... and if they DO CM they're dead anyway. Nothing can burn it safely, not even 252/252+ Rotom-W, who suffers a massive hit from Return (on the switch) or Fake Out, and is killed in 2 hits at worst if the W-o-W actually hits afterward. As for my Kanga, I usually run Crunch over Sucker Punch for Sub Gengar (whom I've seen on the ladder). Earthquake can be used for Klefki but then you're just getting desperate lol. I don't feel like expounding further then turning this into a Kangaskhan debate. It can't be banned lol, so it's time to figure out how to beat it.

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