Yeah, rufflet is really strong. I still like to assert that staravia is better for a choice scarf set due to being faster, having similar damage output, and most importantly: being much more reliable. When something is your scarfer, ko'ing that sweeper that's set up can mean the difference between winning and losing, and having an 80% accurate move is not the smartest idea in that situation.
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350 Cup
- Thread starter Halliday
- Start date
Reshiram @ Leftovers
Ability: Turboblaze
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Blue Flare
- Extrasensory/Toxic
- Roost
Ferroseed and Shroomish dominate the meta and are difficult to to break through without a powerful Fire STAB. Hence Reshiram. Reshiram's 90 base speed is much to slow to bother running speed investment. Even with choice scarf Abra and Gastly can outspeed. Reshiram's roost bulk set from Ubers matches up well against the games top walls. It also outclasses Litwick.
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I'd say rufflet with a lum and HC would outclass staravia as a wallbreaker.
8-BIT Luster
Completely Unviable
Corrected.
Pikachuun
the entire waruda machine
Smeargle: I have no experience with this, so I cannot comment on it.
Spritzee: Can sponge virtually anything, especially on the special side where it becomes a wall. Can make dents to things that are weak to it as well. I'm leaning towards ban, but I'll abstain until I have more proof.
Cranidos: Ban. I can express this in one simple comment. Nothing can counter Cranidos except for the bulkier ground types. Your move.
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Illusio
Bold and Brash
Smeargle: It's speedy, for sure, but it's not a big enough deal for me to ban.
Spritzee: Ban. It's bulkier than Chansey in this meta, as shown in the 2 calcs below.
Cranidos: I honestly have no opinion on this one.
Spritzee: Ban. It's bulkier than Chansey in this meta, as shown in the 2 calcs below.
252 Atk Mega Mewtwo X Zen Headbutt vs. 4 HP / 252 Def Spritzee: 121-144 (26.6 - 31.7%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252 Atk Mega Mewtwo X Zen Headbutt vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 231-273 (35.9 - 42.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Mega Mewtwo X Zen Headbutt vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 231-273 (35.9 - 42.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Cranidos: I honestly have no opinion on this one.
xJownage
Even pendulums swing both ways
smeargle: this thing is a mediocre gimmick imo, its not all that defining and is easy to beat flat out. smashpass can be stopped with offesive presence but smashpass is not an issue relevant to smeargle (if smashpass is broken ban that). smeargle has no offensive presence and pitiful bulk, there is no reason to deem it broken because all it does is provide quick support or bp boosts which can be banned independenty of smeargle to begin with.
spritzee: its needed the boot for a long time. ridiculously walls half of the tier, can provide amazing wish support, and cant be taunted,encored, etc.
cranidos: its mediocre to me, it lacks the power withot head smash, needs the scarf, and automatically dies after two smashes due to the recoil. lo+sheer force sucks since anything wth relevant speed outright obliterates it to begin with. also its pitiful bulk means it has to ohko stuff, which it often cant.
spritzee: its needed the boot for a long time. ridiculously walls half of the tier, can provide amazing wish support, and cant be taunted,encored, etc.
cranidos: its mediocre to me, it lacks the power withot head smash, needs the scarf, and automatically dies after two smashes due to the recoil. lo+sheer force sucks since anything wth relevant speed outright obliterates it to begin with. also its pitiful bulk means it has to ohko stuff, which it often cant.
I haven't seen or used smeargle or cranidos so I'm not going to say anything about them
Spritzee: has better bulk than Giratina as well as a better typing (both offensively and defensively) Gastly, Cranidos, Grimer, Bellsprout, Stunky, Croagunk, Skrelp, Ekans, Spinarak, Nidoran-M, Venonat, Toxicroak, Muk, Victreebel, Seviper, Trubbish, Skorupi, Nidoran-F, Garbodor, Qwilfish, Skuntank, Beedrill, Crobat, Drapion, Weezing, Ariados, Weepinbell, Zubat, Gulpin, Arbok, a bunch of physical steel types, and Magnemite can take it out offensively assuming 252 HP, 4 Def, 252 SpD Bold. However, among those only Gastly, Cranidos, Stunky, Croagunk(?), Bisharp, Meggron, Magnemite, and Bellsprout are actually viable for other offensive things and Cranidos is being suspected. Ontop of this no competent player will ever leave a spritzee in on a steel or poison type (immune to toxic)
It's better than Gira at support because of being able to wishpash and use aromatherapy to help the team while also being immune to taunt.
Against stall it has toxic for non-steel/poison types and aromatherapy(and refresh) to heal itself of toxic or burn
tl;dr: Spritzee is too bulky for any non-offensive non-steel/poison type(which it wouldn't stay in on anyway) and can consistently wall even most of those with the right EV spread. It also fairs fairly well against stall. Ban.
Spritzee: has better bulk than Giratina as well as a better typing (both offensively and defensively) Gastly, Cranidos, Grimer, Bellsprout, Stunky, Croagunk, Skrelp, Ekans, Spinarak, Nidoran-M, Venonat, Toxicroak, Muk, Victreebel, Seviper, Trubbish, Skorupi, Nidoran-F, Garbodor, Qwilfish, Skuntank, Beedrill, Crobat, Drapion, Weezing, Ariados, Weepinbell, Zubat, Gulpin, Arbok, a bunch of physical steel types, and Magnemite can take it out offensively assuming 252 HP, 4 Def, 252 SpD Bold. However, among those only Gastly, Cranidos, Stunky, Croagunk(?), Bisharp, Meggron, Magnemite, and Bellsprout are actually viable for other offensive things and Cranidos is being suspected. Ontop of this no competent player will ever leave a spritzee in on a steel or poison type (immune to toxic)
It's better than Gira at support because of being able to wishpash and use aromatherapy to help the team while also being immune to taunt.
Against stall it has toxic for non-steel/poison types and aromatherapy(and refresh) to heal itself of toxic or burn
tl;dr: Spritzee is too bulky for any non-offensive non-steel/poison type(which it wouldn't stay in on anyway) and can consistently wall even most of those with the right EV spread. It also fairs fairly well against stall. Ban.
80 / 100 / 80 / 80 / 80 / 180
Poliwag @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Belly Drum
- Encore / Thief
- Waterfall
- Return
Also, will talk about the based CACNEA and also DELIBIRD <3 soon
unfixable omg how do you know I like Delibird and Cacnea? *o*
Smeargle: Sure, it's very fast and can get away with Rocks, Spikes or a Spore to nullify offensive mons quickly, but it isn't necessarily "overpowered" which is why anything is suspected. Neither is it "broken" or disturbs with the state of the meta. In fact, I've only faced 1 Smeargle ever, and it was really easy to handle and not much of a dent-maker. No ban, not broken.
Spritzee: This thing is incredible! *_* On a more defining note, though, it can bulk lots and lots attacks. Which makes it a really good wall. However (*cough* 252+ Atk Choice Band Hustle Rufflet Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 4+ Def Spritzee: 451-532 (87.4 - 103.1%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock *cough*), it can still be annihilated by switching into powerful attacks such as ones by Banded Staravia (252 Atk Choice Band Reckless Staravia Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 4+ Def Spritzee: 304-358 (58.9 - 69.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery) and Life Orb Trapinch (252+ Atk Life Orb Trapinch Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4+ Def Spritzee: 253-298 (49 - 57.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery). Still, though, I'll probably ask people to use this more and get more experience against this, and for that reasons so I'll abstain by decision on this one.
Cranidos: Okay, lets get this one straight; Cranidos has a really good offensive stat which can be easily nullified by a faster Will-O-Wisp or walls it can't answer, e.g Phanpy. Which means it isn't certainly broken as I'll say the walls part is pretty common, Phanpy can just hard-wall it whereas Shieldon can come into a predicted Rock Slide/Crunch and force out a choiced set. In other words, (again,) it isn't really "broken" and can be outsped by other scarfers or faster ones wielding SE moves. No ban.
Smeargle: Sure, it's very fast and can get away with Rocks, Spikes or a Spore to nullify offensive mons quickly, but it isn't necessarily "overpowered" which is why anything is suspected. Neither is it "broken" or disturbs with the state of the meta. In fact, I've only faced 1 Smeargle ever, and it was really easy to handle and not much of a dent-maker. No ban, not broken.
Spritzee: This thing is incredible! *_* On a more defining note, though, it can bulk lots and lots attacks. Which makes it a really good wall. However (*cough* 252+ Atk Choice Band Hustle Rufflet Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 4+ Def Spritzee: 451-532 (87.4 - 103.1%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock *cough*), it can still be annihilated by switching into powerful attacks such as ones by Banded Staravia (252 Atk Choice Band Reckless Staravia Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 4+ Def Spritzee: 304-358 (58.9 - 69.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery) and Life Orb Trapinch (252+ Atk Life Orb Trapinch Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4+ Def Spritzee: 253-298 (49 - 57.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery). Still, though, I'll probably ask people to use this more and get more experience against this, and for that reasons so I'll abstain by decision on this one.
Cranidos: Okay, lets get this one straight; Cranidos has a really good offensive stat which can be easily nullified by a faster Will-O-Wisp or walls it can't answer, e.g Phanpy. Which means it isn't certainly broken as I'll say the walls part is pretty common, Phanpy can just hard-wall it whereas Shieldon can come into a predicted Rock Slide/Crunch and force out a choiced set. In other words, (again,) it isn't really "broken" and can be outsped by other scarfers or faster ones wielding SE moves. No ban.
Smeargle: fast taunt, spore, and set up, and hazards but doesn't really do much besides that. Not really centralizing and easy to beat. No ban
Spritzee: massive wish pass heal, walls everything but the most massive switch in damages. plus strong offense with moonblast. I am leaning towards ban.
Cranidos- just will o miss it with arceus lol. Seriously its not that fast or bulky in terms of 350 cup, there are plenty of faster threats that can ohko. yes there is rock polish but priority gives him fits too. Its not like there is only one way to beat this thing. It can be walled, outsped, and priority killed. Yes its a pain to switch into cause of its massive power but is easily revenged and stall can wall it so i see no reason for a ban.
Spritzee: massive wish pass heal, walls everything but the most massive switch in damages. plus strong offense with moonblast. I am leaning towards ban.
Cranidos- just will o miss it with arceus lol. Seriously its not that fast or bulky in terms of 350 cup, there are plenty of faster threats that can ohko. yes there is rock polish but priority gives him fits too. Its not like there is only one way to beat this thing. It can be walled, outsped, and priority killed. Yes its a pain to switch into cause of its massive power but is easily revenged and stall can wall it so i see no reason for a ban.
So I did a quick scan through the thread for my bro Numel and nothing came up :(
120 / 120 / 80 / 130 / 90 / 70 with SIMPLE
This little guy has access to all sorts of boostan moves like Amnesia, Curse, Growth, Flame Charge, and Stockpile as well as an expansive movepool. Here's some example sets:
Numel @ Lum Berry
Ability: Simple
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Curse
- Flame Charge
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
(With sun support)
Numel @ Life Orb
Ability: Simple
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Growth
- Flame Charge
- Earthquake
- Fire Blast
Maybe Spritzee should be out of the OP.
Screw you littleprick brick wall...
Also for this meta, can we take out one point of Special Attack from Krokorok? Pretty Please?
Screw you little
Also for this meta, can we take out one point of Special Attack from Krokorok? Pretty Please?
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