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5th Gen OU Analysis Index - 89 BW2 Revamps On Site!

Discussion in 'BW OU Analyses' started by alexwolf, Nov 30, 2010.

  1. Spirit

    Spirit
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    Ohhh, I'll take sharpedo.
  2. vyomov

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    I don't know whether it needs a full revamp, but Landorus-T's smogon analysis shows Sheer Force as an ability despite the fact that it can't actually get it: when the Reflect Glass is used Landorus-T becomes Landorus which gets Sheer Force.
  3. Rohail

    Rohail Vaporeon <3
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    I'll take Crawdaunt over for Vertex, all I really have to do is write it up :P
  4. Worldtour

    Worldtour left: Hitmonchan right: rest of RU
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    Just as an FYI, Gliscor should probably be reassigned because it has been in the WIP stage ever since April
  5. Rohail

    Rohail Vaporeon <3
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    Crawdaunt has been written up and is awaiting its last QC check.
  6. Halcyon.

    Halcyon. Mad, mad love
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    I'd like to start working with C&C, so if I'd be willing to work on Gliscor if no one else wants to.
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  7. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
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    Ok go ahead Halcyon!
  8. ginganinja

    ginganinja Dating Haunter
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    someone needs to writeup Meleotta.

    I pushed it through QC so it really just needs writing up. Ill lend advice to anyone who writes it up considering im one of the few Meloetta players out there xD.

    Help my bb out <3
  9. 100%

    100%

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    Eh, I'm kind of shaky with the format, but I've played with Melloetta a lot, so I'd like to do it bro.
  10. Halcyon.

    Halcyon. Mad, mad love
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    Took a look at the Sawsbuck analysis on site and it really needs to be updated. It mentions things like Dusclops and Cofagrigus being trouble for it (which they are, I guess, but they're very irrelevant). It's EVs are outdated and don't let it out-speed Scarf Latios or Timid Venusaur. If possible, I'd like to work on updating it. Sawsbuck is a really underrated sun sweeper and makes a great partner to Volcarona/Sun teams in general since it can wreck Heatran with Nature Power or Jump Kick. Plus, the things that can wall it (Skarmory, Forretress, Ferrothorn, Breloom) aren't exactly hard for sun teams to beat. I think it's worth updating.
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  11. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    I think a few Chlorophyll sweepers are currently outdated. Shiftry was outdated before I decided to update it, Sawsbuck is outdated as you mentioned, and Lilligant is now a bit outdated because it mentions the sheer importance of outpacing +2 Modest Landorus (who is banned), so there's no reason not to run Modest. I'd probably hold off on updating any of them now though, because a lot of them mention Keldeo, who will probably be banned in the next coming month.
  12. Jukain

    Jukain fuck redew
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    think i'll do dd latios, it needs an analysis

    it's been rejected in the past, but i say with confidence that it's good. i can get some logs and the word of a few people if needed.

    i'll scms patch up lilligant also (like gary said), since i wrote the current analysis.
  13. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    Are we ever going to update Jirachi's analysis to include Meteor Mash on some of its sets (Scarf in particular). I know it may seem a bit unappealing because of its lowered accuracy and it misses out on that awesome 60% flinch hax, but on the flip side, the 40% Attack boost is nice for late game cleaning and on top of that it can achieve a few important KOs that Iron Head can't.

    Show Hide
    252 Atk Jirachi Meteor Mash vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mamoswine: 326-386 (90.3 - 106.92%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
    252 Atk Jirachi Iron Head vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mamoswine: 260-308 (72.02 - 85.31%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 Atk Jirachi Meteor Mash vs. 56 HP / 0- Def Kyurem-B: 306-360 (75.55 - 88.88%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
    252 Atk Jirachi Iron Head vs. 56 HP / 0- Def Kyurem-B: 242-288 (59.75 - 71.11%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252 Atk Jirachi Meteor Mash vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 300-354 (92.59 - 109.25%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
    252 Atk Jirachi Iron Head vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 240-284 (74.07 - 87.65%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock


    These are three key Pokemon that Meteor Mash can OHKO after SR that Iron Head can't, and all three of them can do massive damage to Jirachi next turn if they don't get flinched by Iron Head. I don't feel that it should be slashed before Iron Head or anything, but I think that it should at least get an honorable mention, because it is indeed useful on the Scarf set, and there are reasons to use it over Iron Head.
  14. Jukain

    Jukain fuck redew
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    i'll scms it into ac, no reason not to
  15. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    Shiftry is ready to be uploaded.
  16. Agent Gibbs

    Agent Gibbs Rule 51
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    I don't imagine it's a high priority, but could I do a revamp for Terrakion? The old analysis was started over 2 years ago, so needless to say, it's quite old. I do think the set order could be changed. For example, the SR Lead set just might be one of Terrakion's best sets right now, perhaps second to the Choice Band set (and maybe Scarf too, depending on who you ask). Also, I feel the Double Dance set needs to be removed or changed. Few people use Rock Polish on Terrakion anymore (much less Rock Polish + Swords Dance), and Air Balloon is virtually non-existent. There are a few other quirks that I'd like to address; for instance, I feel the overview needs to make it clear that Terrakion does have weaknesses that make it less than perfect, and the Calm Mind joke in the Other Options section has gotten old. There's also no mention of Breloom anywhere in C&C, and Toxicroak is mentioned nowhere at all (Bulk Up Toxicraok under Rain tanks hits from even the Band set fairly well bar Earthquake, which incidentally I think needs more credit as a move option).

    Just thought I'd make a case for a revamp before reserving the analysis. I know Terrakion itself hasn't changed all that much since the old analysis was written, and so some people might be hesitant about allowing a revamp.

    EDIT @ Below: Alright, I'll PM somebody about it. I might just do a revision instead and try to keep Jabba's original wording as much as possible, if that turns out to be an issue.
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2013
  17. Jukain

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    I think the main thing is that the original writing is absolutely amazing, and that no one wants to mess with that (it's by JabbaTheGriffin). I'm not on QC and therefore what I say has no real value, but if that's the case I think it's best to take the original analysis and post a thread with your edits. Alternatively you can just submit them to someone like @PK Gaming. Here's the raw text for your convenience:

    analysis (open)

    [Overview]

    <p>Terrakion's unique typing is formidable offensively, allowing it to break through many defensive walls. STAB Close Combat and Stone Edge are always very threatening, as they provide near-perfect coverage, hit monstrously hard, and can be used continuously without any loss of power. Terrakion can also hold its own defensively, and its resistance to Stealth Rock further adds to its practicality. Terrakion has many viable sets in the Dream World metagame, making it a versatile sweeper, even though it isn't used as much in Dream World as it is in BW OU, due to the legality of Shadow Tag Chandelure. Because of this threat, the Choice sets lose some viability, despite their ability to take out Chandelure with Stone Edge.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Scarf
    move 1: Close Combat
    move 2: Stone Edge
    move 3: X-Scissor
    move 4: Earthquake / Sacred Sword
    item: Choice Scarf
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Terrakion's excellent coverage makes it one of the best Choice Scarf users in the Dream World metagame. Its amazing Speed, coupled with its access to powerful moves, allows it to revenge kill several boosted threats in the Dream World, such as the popular Choice Scarf Chandelure, +2 Dragonite, +1 Volcarona, as well as +1 Salamence. Close Combat is Terrakion's main STAB move, while Stone Edge is used to hit Flying-types such as Tornadus super effectively. X-Scissor allows Terrakion to hit the Psychic-types that resist Close Combat, Terrakion's main move, hard. Terrakion's last move is based on preference; Earthquake is the preferred option, as it can hit Jirachi, Tentacruel and Toxicroak for super effective damage; however, Sacred Sword is useful in situations where one does not want Terrakion's defenses lowered by Close Combat, such as if Terrakion's trying to land a 2HKO on a Pokemon that could hit it hard after first taking a hit. The drop in defenses could cause Terrakion to faint, so Sacred Sword would be the preferred option in similar situations.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EV spread lets Terrakion hit as hard and fast as possible, which is mandatory for a set whose purpose is to revenge kill at high speed. A Jolly nature is necessary, as it lets Terrakion outspeed Choice Scarf Landorus. An Adamant nature isn't recommended, as this Terrakion's main purpose is to revenge kill, not to sweep; moreover, Adamant Choice Scarf Terrakion will also be outsped by Choice Scarf Landorus. Quick Attack can also be used, but without an item boost, it won't be damaging much at all.</p>

    <p>Breloom is a big threat to this set, as its Technician-boosted Mach Punch takes Terrakion down in one hit. As Chandelure can trap and take out Breloom due its immunity to Mach Punch and resistance to Bullet Seed, it is a good teammate. Scizor threatens this set in a similar fashion, making Magnezone a good partner, as it can come in easily on a Choice Band Scizor locked into Bullet Punch, and Substitute + Charge Beam variants can often KO another opponent after it dispatches Scizor. Opposing Chandelure are deadly to this Terrakion as well. As Terrakion cannot hurt Chandelure if it is locked into Close Combat, and cannot switch out on top of that, Substitute + Calm Mind Chandelure can freely set up to +6 and rip your team apart. Tyranitar is a great teammate, as it can use Pursuit to trap and take out Chandelure as well as bulky Psychic-types such as Slowbro, who would otherwise stand in Terrakion's way. In addition, Tyranitar summons a sandstorm that boosts Terrakion's Special Defense, and can provide Stealth Rock support, which helps Terrakion take down Multiscale Dragonite in particular.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Substitute + Swords Dance
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Swords Dance
    move 3: Close Combat
    move 4: Stone Edge
    item: Rock Gem / Leftovers
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Terrakion is a Pokemon that will always be prone to being revenge killed by Breloom's Mach Punch and Scizor's Bullet Punch; it is also vulnerable to and crippled by all forms of status. For these reasons, it makes an effective Substitute user. As it poses a massive offensive threat, Terrakion can often easily switch into and scare out foes such as Tyranitar, and safely put up a Substitute. Substitute not only allows Terrakion to dodge status effects, but also grants Terrakion a free turn to either get a Swords Dance boost or take down an opponent. Furthermore, as previously mentioned, the Substitute lets Terrakion take a hit from faster opponents and then take them out. For example, Starmie, Alakazam, Breloom, and Scizor can break Terrakion's Substitutes, but they would then be forced to take a strong, often fatal, hit in return.</p>

    <p>The moveset is fairly straightforward; Substitute and Swords Dance both help Terrakion sweep with its two best STAB moves, Close Combat and Stone Edge. The combination of Rock and Fighting provides near-perfect coverage in the Dream World metagame, meaning that Terrakion doesn't even need any other moves. Close Combat enables it to muscle through defensive walls such as Ferrothorn, while Stone Edge lets it beat Chandelure, Dragonite, Salamence, and Volcarona. The boost provided by Swords Dance elevates Terrakion's Attack stat to an impressive 714, which lets it threaten even the standard Gliscor with an OHKO.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Terrakion's Attack and Speed are maximized as they are the only stats worth investing in. Once again, a Jolly nature is used so that Terrakion outspeeds Landorus, and at worst speed ties with Keldeo, Infernape, and Virizion. Besides, Swords Dance already skyrockets Terrakion's Attack stat to ridiculous heights, so the extra Attack is generally unneeded. Rock Gem lets +2 Terrakion OHKO standard Gliscor after Stealth Rock. The lack of Life Orb recoil can also let Terrakion bluff a Choice Band or Choice Scarf, which can possibly allow it to lure in and take out Chandelure. Alternatively, Leftovers provides recovery to mitigate the HP loss from Substitute. Life Orb is a final option to let Terrakion consistently hit harder, instead of doing massive damage just once with a Rock Gem.</p>

    <p>Wish support is very helpful, as Terrakion will be taking damage from Substitute and possibly Life Orb recoil very frequently. Chansey and Blissey should be the main candidates for this role, as they can also sponge specially based Psychic-type attacks directed towards Terrakion. Chandelure can trap and eliminate Breloom, while Magnezone can do the same to Scizor. The sandstorm Tyranitar summons gives Terrakion a Special Defense boost, letting its Substitute withstand Jellicent's Scald. However, note that the latter two Pokemon compound Terrakion's Fighting weakness. On that note, Latias is a good partner for its amazing synergy with Terrakion.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Double Dance
    move 1: Rock Polish
    move 2: Swords Dance
    move 3: Close Combat
    move 4: Stone Edge
    item: Air Balloon / Life Orb
    nature: Jolly / Adamant
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>A great offensive typing and decent bulk allow Terrakion to pull off a double boosting set. Access to both Swords Dance and Rock Polish gives Terrakion the option to double either its Attack or Speed, letting it flourish in a wide variety of situations. For example, Rock Polish lets Terrakion sweep a team of fast, frail Pokemon, while Swords Dance ramps up its power considerably and allows it to leave many dents in even teams of relatively slower and bulkier Pokemon. In fact, if Terrakion manages to nab both boosts and opposing priority users are KOed, it's pretty much game over. All in all, if used correctly, Double Dance Terrakion is easily one of the deadliest sweepers in the metagame.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>This Terrakion can utilize a variety of items. Air Balloon grants it a temporary immunity to Ground-type moves, possibly letting it set up against Pokemon such as Choice Scarf Landorus; it is also incredibly useful against the likes of Gliscor, as the additional Swords Dance boost will let Terrakion take it down. Furthermore, the Air Balloon allows Terrakion to beat Excadrill in a one-on-one situation under sandstorm. While it breaks Terrakion's Balloon and fails to OHKO, Terrakion can use Rock Polish to boost its Speed, then take Excadrill out with Close Combat. Life Orb isn't a bad choice either, as it allows Terrakion an extra boost in power, which can come in handy if it doesn't manage to nab an Attack boost.</p>

    <p>The nature choice is also a difficult one to make. The power boost from an Adamant nature is helpful after Terrakion's boosted its own Speed with Rock Polish. A Jolly nature, though, gives it a more usable Speed stat if it can't find the time to boost up, especially as an Adamant one leaves it outrun by the likes of Keldeo, Infernape, and Virizion. Again, it's based on preference and suiting your team's needs. If your team can deal with the above threats, feel free to run an Adamant nature without any problems.</p>

    <p>With regards to partners, Tyranitar stands out as Terrakion appreciates the 50% Special Defense boost sandstorm grants it. Tyranitar can also bring Stealth Rock support to the table, allowing Terrakion to deal with Volcarona and Dragonite more easily. The latter's Multiscale gets broken by sandstorm as well, which can prove very helpful. Landorus is also a great fellow sandstorm sweeper thanks to Sheer Force. Furthermore, Hidden Power Ice variants can lure in and take out Gliscor, opening Terrakion up for an easier sweep. Bulky variants of Gyarados help against Scizor, Metagross, and Breloom, as Intimidate lowers their Attack, leaving them unable to do much in return; Gyarados can also tank Fighting-type hits.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: Close Combat
    move 2: Stone Edge
    move 3: X-Scissor
    move 4: Sacred Sword / Quick Attack
    item: Choice Band
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>A great base 108 Speed stat combined with an outstanding base 129 Attack makes Terrakion a solid Choice Band user. Choice Band boosts Terrakion's power to incredible heights, allowing it to muscle through anything that does not resist it. Even Skarmory, the standard for physical walling, will hate switching into a STAB Close Combat. Stone Edge, Terrakion's secondary STAB move, takes care of Dragonite and Volcarona, two huge threats in the Dream World metagame. X-Scissor eliminates pesky Psychic-types such as Latias, Latios, Reuniclus, and Slowbro, all of whom might switch in hoping to sponge a Close Combat. Sacred Sword is an inferior Close Combat because the power difference is considerable. Quick Attack is interesting: although it is weak, it does decent damage with a Choice Band, and it lets Terrakion eliminate weakened Choice Scarf revenge killers and boosted sweepers.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Earthquake can be used over either move slashed in the last slot, as it hits Jirachi, Toxicroak, and Tentacruel super effectively. However, Close Combat provides more than enough coverage, and as such isn't really necessary. The EV spread is straightforward, as its main purpose is to sweep. While a Jolly nature is recommended as it lets Terrakion outspeed Jolly Landorus, an Adamant nature isn't completely worthless, as it enables Terrakion to 2HKO walls such as Gliscor with Stone Edge.</p>

    <p>The main problem this set faces is being locked into a single move. If it's locked into Close Combat, SubDisable Gengar can force it to switch and get a free Substitute in the process, making specially defensive Jirachi—who beats the aforementioned Gengar—a good teammate. Chandelure can also come in on Terrakion locked into Close Combat, set up a Substitute, boost up with Calm Mind, and proceed to demolish your team. It is recommended you get rid of Chandelure before sending out Terrakion for a sweep, making Pursuit users such as Tyranitar excellent partners. Dragonite is also an ideal partner as it can not only take Fighting-type attacks but also wall Chandelure and eliminate it with Earthquake. Breloom can revenge kill this Terrakion with Mach Punch, but it can be taken out by Choice Scarf Chandelure. Chandelure can also trap and get rid of both Scizor and Gengar.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Work Up can allow Terrakion to hit Gliscor with a boosted Hidden Power Ice, but the use of Work Up itself gives away the surprise. Going mixed would also necessitate that Terrakion split its offensive EVs and reduce its defenses, which is off-putting as well. Taunt enables Terrakion to set up against attempts to status it, but Substitute is far better as it also protects Terrakion from being revenge killed. Lum Berry allows it to dodge status, which is always useful, Chople Berry lets Terrakion avoid the OHKO from Infernape's Close Combat, and Babiri Berry buffers Steel-type hits, most importantly Bullet Punch, a move commonly used to revenge kill Terrakion. Double Kick gets STAB and hits twice in a row, allowing Terrakion to break Substitutes and damage the opponent, but it is very situational. Reflect could help Terrakion set up more easily, while Safeguard lets your whole team dodge status, which is handy. Roar is an option to phaze away setup sweepers such as Chandelure. ChestoRest could work for one-time instant recovery.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Gliscor and Slowbro are often pinpointed as the best counters to Terrakion. They can both come in on Close Combat, which won't damage them too much, and retaliate with a super effective STAB Earthquake and Scald respectively. However, +2 Rock Gem Stone Edge has a chance to OHKO Gliscor after Stealth Rock. Choice Scarf users such as Landorus can come in on a Close Combat or X-Scissor and take down Terrakion with Earthquake. As Terrakion outspeeds most of the Dream World metagame, priority is very useful in beating it; Scizor, Azumarill, and Breloom are the best picks here. Latios can switch into a resisted Close Combat, outspeeds unboosted Terrakion, and can take it out with a Psyshock. Bulky Psychic-types such as Reuniclus also do well, although they need to watch out for Choice Band X-Scissor. Jellicent is immune to Close Combat and can ruin Terrakion with Will-O-Wisp. SubDisable Gengar can beat Choice Band Terrakion too, but cannot switch into Stone Edge. Excadrill outspeeds unboosted Terrakion in sand, and although it can't switch into Close Combat, it can KO Terrakion with its STAB Earthquake. Terrakion also fears being trapped and revenge killed by Dugtrio, who outspeeds all variants bar Choice Scarf ones.</p>


    This is of course all irrelevant if you can do a revamp, but if not just helping~
  18. Rohail

    Rohail Vaporeon <3
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    Crawdaunt is done and ready to be uploaded!
  19. Jukain

    Jukain fuck redew
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    relevant posts (open)


    Okay, @Gary2346, I've SCMS'd Meteor Mash into Jirachi's Choice Scarf set and changed the Timid spreads to the Modest ones on Lilligant.
  20. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    No offense but is there a reason why analysis aren't being uploaded lately? There's a bunch that have been sitting there for a while.
  21. Jukain

    Jukain fuck redew
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    the scms has been down and people have been busy -- give it a few days and I'm sure everything will be good
  22. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    Minor nitpick, but would it be a problem if someone could maybe replace Shadow Ball with Signal Beam on Reuniclus' OTR set? Like Alakazam, Reuniclus appreciates the chance of OHKOing specially defensive Celebi after SR with Signal Beam, while still 2HKOing the Lati twins and KOing Alakazam. Although Reuniclus can no longer hit Jellicent for super effective damage, Psyshock handles it just fine. I've always used Signal Beam on Reuniclus, because I've never seen the reasoning in using Shadow Ball over it anyway. I always hated that Celebi can actually stall out TR if Reuniclus runs Shadow Ball instead of Signal Beam. This gives Reuniclus one less thing it has to worry about before late game sweeping.
  23. Alfalfa

    Alfalfa Banned deucer.

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    Machamp is severly outdated, and it is now mostly niche now. I am going to update it.
  24. Halcyon.

    Halcyon. Mad, mad love
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    Gliscor is ready to be uploaded.

    Now that I've finished Gliscor, I'd like to formally ask if I can revamp Sawsbuck. I actually have a lot of experience with it, and it desperately needs a new analysis. The current one doesn't play up the advantages that it has over other Chlorophyll sweepers at all, and makes it seem like a pretty poor choice for sun teams in general, when that couldn't be further from the truth. Sun teams love the ability to beat Heatran and Latias, something that most sun teams struggle against. The analysis mentions outdated threats to Sawsbuck, and the EV spread doesn't let him outrun Venusaur, which he should always be outspeeding. Also, I question the viability of the Baton Pass set that's on site. Not sure what it really provides that Mew, Smeargle, Scizor, and Gliscor can't already provide. Anyway, I would love to revamp Sawsbuck if possible.

    EDIT: Sawsbuck is up, I'm just putting the final touches on the skeleton.
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2013
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  25. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
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    Updated the Index! Also, Porygon2 and Magneton are up for grabs.

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