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A Legend, Mr. Wayne, a Legend

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Avatar Korra, Aug 20, 2012.

  1. Avatar Korra

    Avatar Korra

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2012
    Messages:
    213
    A Legend, Mr. Wayne, a Legend
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Introduction

    Hey guys, Avatar Korra here. I’m not an avid OU player in 5th gen, as I heard talk that it’s waaaaay to centralized on weather. During most of Black and White 1, I focused primarily on UU, and heck even sometimes went back to my Platinum for some fun 4th gen battling. With the release of BW2, however, I decided to get back into OU, as some Pokemon just seemed too awesome for me not to use. (Tornadus-T anyone?) After messing around with this team for a bit, I decided a Rain team was the best course of action. I’ve literally seen so many Rain teams; I had to try them out to see what the big deal was. I have to say, it was surprisingly fun! Rain is definitely the safest weather choice I think, as there are the most abusers for the Rain boost, and Politoed can handle other weather inducers. I gotta say, blasting powerful STAB Hurricanes have been a blast, and I feel like OU isn’t quite the stale, unchanging metagame everyone told me it was!

    Rain is fun and all, however one Pokemon I HAD to use was my second favorite of this generation: Terrakion! (Darmanitan still has a very special place in my heart as number 1…I’ll make an OU team centered around you someday!) Terrakion just reeks of awesomeness. His awesome base Speed of 108 allows him to outspeed a lot of common threats. His earth-shattering base 129 Attack hits the opponent hard. The best part of this rock…horse thing though, in my opinion, is his awesome ability to wreck stall teams. I don’t know if this is just me with my bad luck, but on Pokemon Showdown I have faced countless teams that use the dreaded SkarmBliss combo, with Ferrothorn thrown in for good measure. With the proper set up and support, Terrakion can set up on a ridiculous number of Pokemon and just plow through these teams.

    As for this team’s success, it’s been quite good. I usually stuck around the low 30’s high 20’s on the Showdown leaderboard, with my peak being something like number 21 on the leaderboard, at 1900. I don’t really take leaderboards seriously though and I’ve dropped down heavily to like the 60’s lol, mostly for just trying a bunch of things out, messing around, and trying to use fun sets. Having fun should be the most important thing after all :)

    You may be wondering about the weird title. I just got back from seeing the Dark Knight Rises again and Batman is just running through my mind right now haha. The full quote was “If you devote yourself to an ideal. Then you become something else entirely, a legend Mr. Wayne, A legend.” I devoted my team around Terrakion and Tornadus, trying to do my best for them to sweep, so I suppose it somewhat fits. Plus, considering I have a whopping 5 legendary Pokemon on my team, I suppose this team has some legendary characteristics ;p


    Team Building Process

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    I wanted to base my team around two of my favorite Pokemon: Terrakion and Tornadus-T. I knew from the start I wanted to use a Specs Tornadus for its raw power, and Sub Terrakion for its versatility and ability to set up much easier.

    [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    Well, how can you have Tornadus without his best friend Politoed? His rain would prove invaluable in being able to unleash perfect accuracy Hurricanes. With Politoed on my team, I knew I had to make sure the rest of my team would be okay with rain.

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    I needed a strong Pokemon that could benefit the rest of my team, and provide a check towards Dragon type Pokemon. Jirachi fit the bill perfectly, with his ability to paralyze the opponent, and pass wishes to rest of my team so they can recover their health. He could also switch into powerful threats that would take advantage of my rain, like other Tornadus-T’s.

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    I wanted to have a spinner to prevent Tornadus-T from losing health from Stealth Rock, so I just kinda threw a defensive Forretress onto the team.

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    I realized I needed a strong revenge killer for my team, so I added a Scarf Latios to my team. His strong powerful Dragon attacks were valuable in that I could weaken the opposing team, allowing my Terrakion and Tornadus-T to sweep better. Being able to revenge all dragon types was a huge plus as well.
    Now, at this point, my team worked very well, however I felt something was missing. Forretress was the weak link, and Rapid Spin wasn’t necessary with Tornadus-T’s Regenerator ability and Jirachi’s wishes. Having a pure defensive Pokemon on my offensive team didn’t work well.

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    Replacing Forretress with Heatran was the best thing I’ve done. Despite the rain, Heatran could handle all troublesome steel Pokemon easily, and provided another Dragon check. His powerful offense was a breath of fresh air after Forretress, who mostly did nothing on my team besides spin. Right now my team was working very well, and is my final version of the team!



    The Team

    [​IMG]
    Politoed @ Leftovers
    Ability: Drizzle
    Modest Nature
    248 HP / 252 SpAtk / 8 Spe
    -Hydro Pump
    -Ice Beam
    -Hidden Power Grass
    -Perish Song

    [​IMG]
    Latios @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Levitate
    Timid Nature
    4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    -Draco Meteor
    -Surf
    -Thunder
    -Trick


    [​IMG]
    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    Ability: Serene Grace
    Careful Nature
    252 HP/ 32 Def / 224 SpDef
    -Body Slam
    -Iron Head
    -Wish
    -U-Turn


    [​IMG]
    Heatran @ Air Balloon
    Ability: Flash Fire
    Timid Nature
    4 HP / 252 SpAtk / 252 Spe
    -Fire Blast
    -Earth Power
    -Hidden Power Ice
    -Stealth Rock



    [​IMG]
    Tornadus-T @ Choice Specs
    Ability: Regenerator
    Timid Nature
    4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    -Hurricane
    -Focus Blast
    -U-Turn
    -Sleep Talk


    [​IMG]
    Terrakion @ Life Orb
    Ability: Justified
    Jolly Nature
    4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    -Close Combat
    -Stone Edge
    -Swords Dance
    -Substitute



    Conclusion

    Well, that's my team everyone! It definitely isn't original, it's as overused as one can be lol. I've had a blast using it though, and it's been pretty successful so far. It's definitely not perfect by any means, I eagerly await you guys improvements!

    Anyone looking over my team, please rate, comment, luvdisk, and suggest anything you think will improve this team's success. Thanks for reading my RMT!! :)

    Importable (open)


    Politoed @ Leftovers
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpAtk / 8 Spe
    Modest Nature
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power Grass
    - Perish Song

    Latios @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Draco Meteor
    - Surf
    - Thunder
    - Trick

    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP/ 32 Def / 224 SpDef
    Careful Nature
    - Body Slam
    - Iron Head
    - Wish
    - U-Turn

    Heatran @ Air Balloon
    Trait: Flash Fire
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpAtk / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Fire Blast
    - Earth Power
    - Hidden Power Ice
    - Stealth Rock

    Tornadus-T @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Hurricane
    - Focus Blast
    - U-Turn
    - Sleep Talk

    Terrakion @ Life Orb
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge
    - Swords Dance
    - Substitute

  2. Avatar Korra

    Avatar Korra

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2012
    Messages:
    213
    Remember guys, because I have an offensive team, I won't have a reliable counter to everything. I just try my best to do good damage and weaken whatever I'm facing for my next guy to deal with easier.

    Standard OU Offensive Threats

    [​IMG] Tyranitar: Jirachi is usually a solid option, flinching it to death with Iron Head. Latios will outspeed everything, and can take out a weakened one with a rain boosted surf.
    [​IMG] Rotom-W: Jirachi and Latios are pretty solid options, Latios doesn’t fear burns, while Jirachi can try and paralyze it.
    [​IMG] Scizor: Heatran is my best bet, taking it out even in rain. Jirachi can paralyze it making it easier to handle, Terrakion can do severe damage while behind a sub.
    [​IMG] Dragonite: Quite tricky due to its versatility, but between Jirachi and Heatran, I should be good. Latios will always outspeed and revenge kill.
    [​IMG] Politoed: Latios can handle most versions, my own Politoed 3 hit KO’s defensive ones with HP Grass. Not a threat.
    [​IMG] Heatran: Between my own Heatran, Latios, Politoed, and Terrakion, Heatran is not a threat at all.
    [​IMG] Jirachi: Quite annoying, but Heatran is usually a safe choice. Latios can do lots of damage with Surf, and Politoed can harass Jirachi as well.
    [​IMG] Latios: Jirachi can take its hits all day long, my own Latios can revenge kill any non-scarfed versions.
    [​IMG] Reuniclus: The key is to kill it before too many boosts. Thankfully, all my guys can cause massive damage to it, Tornadus even being able to take it out in one hit. Never been an issue
    [​IMG] Haxorus: Quite a beast, but Jirachi and Heatran can handle it. Latios always revenge kills if needed.
    [​IMG] Ninetales: Politoed, Terrakion, Latios, and Heatran deal with him easily, allowing me to usually win the weather war.
    [​IMG] Conkeldurr: Quite a beast, but with all my guys doing massive damage it’s never a threat. Tornadus can take Mach Punches and take it out in one hit.
    [​IMG] Celebi: Between Heatran, Jirachi, Tornadus, and Latios, it’s never been an issue.
    [​IMG] Terrakion: Always a big threat, but Jirachi and Latios help against it. Tornadus makes a solid revenge killer as well.
    [​IMG] Gyarados: Latios can take pretty much anything he throws and can take him out easily.
    [​IMG] Gengar: Annoying, especially disable sets, but Jirachi and Heatran together can beat this down. Latios can always revenge kill. Very annoying
    [​IMG] Latios and Politoed make him a non-issue. Tornadus outspeeds and can cause massive damage.
    [​IMG] Landorus: Can’t safely come in on anyone, but my own Latios alwasys outspeeds it, Heatran always takes it out with HP Ice.
    [​IMG] Infernape: Between Latios, Tornadus, and Politoed, I can usually handle him.
    [​IMG] Volcarona:All variants of Volcarona are a huge threat, I gotta pray Tornadus takes it out before it sets up or I at least have SR up, so Latios can outspeed and kill. Terrakion can live a hit and take it out.
    [​IMG] Magnezone: Thanks to U-Turn, Jirachi won’t be trapped and I can go to Latios or Heatran to take this out.
    [​IMG] Espeon: Jirachi can handle this all day, paralyzing it, Latios does okay as well.
    [​IMG] Salamence: Jirachi can Paralyze it, Latios will always outspeed it, Heatran can take it out with HP Ice with Air Balloon.
    [​IMG] Hydreigon: Quite unpredictable, but usually Jirachi can come on top. Latios always outspeeds this too.
    [​IMG] Breloom: Tornadus can take the sleep, and proceed to wreck it. Latios does fine as well.

    [​IMG]Latias: Always tricky to play around, but if Jirachi can paralyze it becomes much easier. Latios’ Draco Meteor should always dent, if not outright kill it. Quite a threat, thankfully I’ve managed to always beat them through smart play.
    [​IMG] Toxicroak: Latios, Tornadus, and Jirachi can handle him easily.
    [​IMG] Lucario: Jirachi can paralyze it, allowing Heatran to kill. Terrakion can revenge kill if they lack Bullet Punch. Could be a problem but I rarely see them.
    [​IMG] Virizion: Between Tornadus and Jirachi, I can always handle this. Latios works as well.
    [​IMG] Cloyster: Latios still outspeeds after a shell smash, and Jirachi does decent against this also.
    [​IMG] Mamoswine: Politoed can handle this, Heatran with an Air Balloon can handle this as well. Latios can live one Ice shard if needed.
    [​IMG] Tornadus: Jirachi is pretty much perfect against this, Latios outspeeds them as well for the revenge kill.
    [​IMG] Abomasnow: Between Terrakion, Jirachi, and Heatran, I can take it out and win the weather war.
    [​IMG] Alakazam: Jirachi is fantastic against this, Latios does good as well.
    [​IMG] Deoxys-D: Hm, just bombard it with powerful hits until it’s dead. It’s quite annoying, especially with my team having no spinner anymore.
    [​IMG] Dugtrio: Can’t really hurt anyone but Jirachi, as I always Sub with Terrakion and hopefully Heatran has his Air Balloon intact. So weak, it’s easy to deal with.
    [​IMG] Kyurem: A very underrated threat, Terrakion can outspeed normal versions and kill it, and Latios can always revenge kill it too.
    [​IMG] Victini: Heatran and Latios can deal with this fine.
    [​IMG] Stoutland: Jirachi is my best bet against this, I rarely see them though.
    [​IMG] Smeargle: Tornadus can handle sleep, Politoed can Perish Song to ruin chains.


    Standard OU Defensive Threats
    [​IMG] Tyranitar: Jirachi and Terrakion can handle this, it also doesn’t like Hydro Pumps.
    [​IMG] Rotom-W: Latios and Jirachi do pretty fantastic against it.
    [​IMG] Ferrothorn: Heatran, Tornadus, Terrakion all demolish this thing.
    [​IMG] Politoed: Latios does great against this, my own Politoed outspeeds defensive ones and can 3 Hit KO.
    [​IMG] Gliscor: Heatran always manages to take this out with HP Ice, Latios does fine, as does Politoed.
    [​IMG] Skarmory: Politoed, Latios, and Heatran can handle this annoying bird.
    [​IMG] Celebi: Between Heatran, Tornadus, and Jirachi, I can deal with Celebi’s with ease.
    [​IMG] Forretress: Heatran, Tornadus even 2 hit KO’s. Terrakion can kill it behind a sub.
    [​IMG] Gyarados: Latios can handle this all day.
    [​IMG] Jellicent: Latios helps, Tornadus does massive damage, it can get quite annoying though.
    [​IMG] Tentacruel: Latios demolishes it, Tornadus does massive damage too if needed. Not a threat.
    [​IMG] Gastrodon: Can get very annoying, it’s why I have HP Grass on Politoed. Latios does massive damage too.
    [​IMG] Espeon: Jirachi can handle this so easily, as can Latios.
    [​IMG] Blissey: If Terrakion can safely come in on this, bye bye Blissey. If Terrakion is gone it can be a problem, but hey, just got to play carefully right?
    [​IMG] Vaporeon: Latios is my best bet, Tornadus deals massive massive damage.
    [​IMG] Latias: You already know.
    [​IMG] Bronzong: Between Terrakion, Heatran, and Politoed I can handle this.
    [​IMG] Swampert: Latios and Politoed’s HP Grass.
    [​IMG] Mew: Latios can do massive damage, but it’s very annoying due to its unpredictability.
    [​IMG] Slowbro: Latios can take it out, Tornadus does massive damage to it. It can be very annoying though.
    [​IMG] Cresselia: Never seen one before lol. I assume it will just die after multiple hits, rain nerfs its healing too.
    [​IMG] Hippowdon: Can’t handle Latios, Politoed, or Tornadus.
    [​IMG] Xatu: Um, idk, I assume anyone?
    [​IMG] Wobbuffet: Can’t really counter it, but I deal massive with all my guys, or Jirachi can U-Turn out. It’s a pain if it comes in on Latios after a Draco Meteor or Heatran, however.
    [​IMG] Whimsicott: Tornadus, and Latios. Heatran does well as well.
    [​IMG] Tangrowth: Heatran is my best bet, Tornadus just takes it out in one hit.
    [​IMG] Sableye: Heatran is a very solid check against this.
    [​IMG] Porygon2: Can get annoying, but if I get Terrakion in safely it’s a goner.
    [​IMG] Chansey: Same as Blissey.
  3. Jirachee

    Jirachee Nightfall
    is a Tutoris an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor Alumnus
    RMT Co-Leader

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2010
    Messages:
    1,515
    Hi

    This is actually quite a solid team, good job on that. However, like a lot of Rain teams, you'll have a lot of problems when it comes to deal with Rain Calm Mind Jirachi. With its great coverage in Thunder and Water Pulse, it can hit pretty much everything very hard on this team after only one easily acquired boost on Tornadus-T, and then proceed to really do a lot of damage to your team. Latios might resist both of its common moves but, it really doesn't enjoy Thunder's 60% paralysis chance and if Jirachi has a sub when it switches in, it's pretty screwed. That means that it will be able to get multiple boosts leaving you unable to check it and it will probably end up sweeping your team (if played well). Quite honestly, Heatran is cool and all but, it's not that great on a rain team, as Drizzle really stops it from hitting a lot of stuff kinda hard etc. I think that Hydreigon would be a great fit over Heatran. First of all, Hydreigon is able to hit Jirachi with an Earthquake, which is very nice, while it can't damage it that much without a lot of boosts and Hydreigon can actually still check it when paralyzed. It will also be able to heal itself with Roost if it takes a lot of damage. Hydreigon still keeps that amazing Fire Blast that you need in order to beat Steel types that you put Heatran on your team to check, and definetly lure them in quite well with the mighty Draco Meteor. Hydreigon may look weird on the same team as Latios but, they fill in different roles. If you're worried about opposing Dragon types, Latios can revenge kill most of them quite easily especially if they're locked into Outrage and Jirachi is amazing at check Special Dragons (except mixed Hydreigon hehehe.)

    However that leaves you without Stealth Rock support which is kinda bad, so I would suggest you run Stealth Rock over U-turn on Jirachi. Obviously U-turn is nice but Stealth Rock will just be much more valuable in most battles, while you actually have to predict a Dugtrio switch in to beat it with U-turn, which doesn't mean you're going to be able to escape it as it could use a nifty double switch or a revenge kill or U-turn support and whatnot. Another thing you could consider is Thunder over Body Slam as, it helps you dealing with SubDisable Gengar quite a lot considering it's very annoying for your team and you have to switch around a lot to beat it, and since you have no spinner, you better have a one pokemon solution to it. It does mean you can't really check Thundurus-T with Jirachi though.

    Lastly, you could really use an item change on Terrakion. Substitute+Swords Dance is very good at surprising a lot of its common checks, however, you might find it very annoying that Terrakion's lifespan is put on such a short timer. It will lose health to entry hazards, which could be Spikes, Substitute AND Life Orb, which means it will often not find the time to sweep, especially if you come in on a random attack. Rock Gem can fit very well over Life Orb as it gives Stone Edge the power it needs to bypass stuff like Gliscor and Slowbro after a Swords Dance and one boosted hit from it is really all you need to sweep considering Terrakion is just ridiculously powerful after a Swords Dance. It won't really need to boost Close Combat either since most of its checks tend to resist its Fighting STAB and are neutral to the weaker Stone Edge.

    Overall that seems like a really cool team. Here's the set you should use:
    Hydreigon (open)

    [​IMG]
    Hydreigon @ Life Orb
    Levitate
    Mild
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ~Draco Meteor
    ~Earthquake
    ~Fire Blast
    ~Roost


    Good luck!
  4. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn the hidden heart of the ocean
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2012
    Messages:
    2,826
    Hey there,

    First of all, nice team! I like the combination of Tornadus-T and Terrakion in this metagame; it really puts a ton of pressure on the opponent to respond, which is the kind of playstyle I like. This team is really solid; I went through standard threats and couldn't really come up with much. The only change I think you should consider is Scarf Keldeo > Latios. With Tyranitar and Scizor still high up on the usage statistics, a Scarf Latios is easy Pursuit bait. Once you get trapped, Latios isn't coming back, and there goes your response to virtually any boosting sweeper, most notably Gyarados, who is seeing more usage these days with Rain's rising popularity. Keldeo is a better Scarf user for this team in general - it still has enough Speed to outspeed common +1 threats, gets a huge power boost for its main STAB with Drizzle in play, can still scare out the pink blobs with Secret Sword, and has enough movepool diversity to check all the sweepers your team needs to worry about. Plus, Keldeo isn't cursed with the unfortunate Psychic typing that leaves such Pokemon as Latios open to Pursuit trapping; in fact, it scares out both Tyranitar and Scizor, instead of being scared by them. The set is below.

    Keldeo (open)
    Keldeo @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump / Surf
    - Secret Sword
    - Icy Wind
    - Hidden Power [Electric]


    The choice between Hydro Pump and Surf is yours. I generally prefer Hydro Pump, but your preference may be Surf. It's up to you. Secret Sword for secondary STAB, Icy Wind covers Dragons and HP Electric beats Gyarados. Keldeo truly is the perfect fit for this team.

    I hope you'll consider the changes I suggested. Best of luck with this team in the future, it has great potential!
  5. Electrolyte

    Electrolyte For every king that died, oh, they would crown another
    is an official Team Rateris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderator
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2012
    Messages:
    1,880
    Hi,

    This is a really solid team- very nice job! Jirachi pretty much covered a lot, but I'm just pointing out that Sun and Volcorona will be a bit more porblematic without Heatran, so you'll have to play extra conservitavely with Latios. Other than that, there are just a few nitpicks I'd recommend:

    This is really really picky, but a spread of 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe Naive is probably better on Tornadus; it doesn't weaken your U-Turn, and even gives it a little tiny boost in power. Trying Heat Wave instead of Sleep Talk might also be a good idea; the rest of your teammates don't actually give Breloom/Amoonguss many chances to set up; as almost every member in your team can OHKO or is immune to Spore. Heat Wave hits hard in and out of Rain, which means that you'll have a powerful move to unleash even in the Sun.

    Terrakion needs a Salac Berry instead of Life Orb. Not only does it make you a whole lot faster; you can control HP loss through Substitute and can Dance away, leaving your opponent with a +1 Spe +2 Terrakion to deal with. Plus, you can switch moves.

    Nice team, I hope I helped! Good luck!
  6. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn the hidden heart of the ocean
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2012
    Messages:
    2,826
    I disagree; with a Naive nature, Tornadus-T is 2HKO'd by Scald from Tentacruel and Politoed without any SAtk investment, making it extremely vulnerable on the special side. It also has no chance of surviving a Scarf Politoed Hydro Pump, which can catch a lot of Tornadus-T off guard. The boost of power on U-Turn, an increase of only 20 or so Attack points, hardly makes a difference; the point isn't how much damage U-Turn does, it's the offensive momentum U-Turn generates. An extra 5% on Latias isn't worth the Special Defense drop.
  7. Wizarus

    Wizarus

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2011
    Messages:
    230
    Lucario is a massive threat, especially if it's given a free turn to set-up(Wobbuffet, Screens, Memento). It can come in on Latios after it Draco Meteors, or if Jirachi doesn't paralyze it 40% of the time, and Sword Dance. If it has Bullet Punch, and Stealth Rock is on the field, it sweeps through your team. Even without Bullet Punch, Terrakion with Substitute + Life Orb is a shaky check to it. Not sure what you're willing to change on your team, but Intimidate Gyarados deals with Lucario, and it loves the rain that Politoed provides.
  8. Kiyo

    Kiyo

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2012
    Messages:
    230
    Nice Team, no time for a real rate right now. I'll probably edit one in later although I like the additions that Lavos and Jirachi have suggested already. Anyways Luvdisc'd :]
  9. Jimbon

    Jimbon fools and worthless liars
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2012
    Messages:
    510
    Hi there,

    Solid Rain Team, with a good use of Heatran. One thing I did notice about your team was the big Volcarona weakness. You pretty much rely on Stealth Rock being up on your opponent's side of the field to bring it into a point where you can easily revenge it. This is really not reliable, as you will not get Stealth Rock up every match, and teams that carry Volcarona will also carry a Spinner and you have no Spinblocker to keep your hazards up. From here, Volcarona finds many opportunities to set up. It can switch in on -2 Latios, or Choice locked Tornadus. Even Heatran is used as setup fodder in Rain, as offensive variants break the Balloon and remove Heatran with a follow up Hidden Power [Ground]. One way you could help to deal with Volcarona, as well as many other threats to your team, is changing your Heatran to a Specially Defensive set. Specially Defensive Heatran allows you to beat Volcarona easier, as you can Toxic it to deter it from setting up multiple Quiver Dances. Toxic also helps with many mons you identified as threats on your threat list. Jellicent, Mew, Slowbro and Latias are all checked well by this set, as Heatran can Toxic these mons to wear them down. It also helps as Heatran isn't even 2HKO'd by Jellicent's or Slowbro's Scald, so you have more opportunities to set up Stealth Rock too. With this set, you also gain the ability to Roar out opposing boosters. Calm Mind Latias in particular cannot touch Specially Defensive Heatran, whereas your previous set is used as setup fodder. Additionally, you also gain an extra answer to Sun Teams with this Heatran set. Heatran does incredibly well against a lot of members of common Sun Teams, most notably Chlorophyll abusers such as Venusaur, Victreebell and Lilligant who Heatran walls provided you have something else as Sleep fodder.

    Also looking at your Politoed, I did notice something. While Leftovers is nice for the extra recovery, it indicates you are not Choiced, which is what you want to be doing when running an Offensive Politoed. I think a Water Gem would be much better over Leftovers. Although it is only a one time use, the ability to bluff the Choice Item is incredibly helpful. Watch as Dragonite and Salamence try to set up on you, thinking you are locked into Hidden Power [Grass], or Heatran trying to set up Stealth Rock / Toxic you thinking you are locked into Ice Beam. Water Gem also provides you with some additional power, when in Rain it allows Politoed to hit incredibly hard. It pressures Quiver Dance Volcarona even at +1 / +2, making it a lot easier to deal with. It's also good for leaving a huge dent in Ninetales, even when Sun is up. This makes the weather war a lot easier for you to win, and giving your sweepers Latios and Tornadus free reign to spam Surf, Thunder and Hurricane everywhere.

    Additionally, I'm also agreeing with Jirachi about Rock Gem on Terrakion. Rock Gem's one time use is nice for being able to break through Terrakion's counters, namely Gliscor who has a chance to be OHKO'd by a Swords Dance Rock Gem Stone Edge.

    Good luck!

    Specially Defensive Heatran (open)
    Heatran @ Air Balloon
    Ability: Flash Fire
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    EVs: 248 HP / 248 SDef / 12 Spe
    - Lava Plume
    - Stealth Rock
    - Toxic
    - Roar
  10. burritosenior

    burritosenior

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2012
    Messages:
    1
    Hey Stephanie, thanks for the shoutout. This is a great team, I'm glad sleep talk on Tornadus is working for you. It's a great help against breloom and the like.

    Anyways, my recommendation is to change leftovers on polities for something that lets it fake a choice item. This can range from expert belt to water gem, like the other guy suggested. Good luck! :)
  11. Avatar Korra

    Avatar Korra

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2012
    Messages:
    213

    Thanks for your rate! Hydreigon seems very interesting, I'll definitely have to try him out. One think I'll miss is Heatran's ability to take out dragons easier, but you're right in that I have Jirachi and Latios. I'm a bit nervous to replace U-Turn with Stealth Rock on Jirachi, as it's great for getting momentum and to ensure I'll never get trapped by Magnezone. I'll definitely look into it, though. As for Rock Gem, you bring up some good points and another person said the same thing, so I'll test it and probably will implement it. Thanks for your rate!



    Hi, thanks for your rate! Scarf Keldeo seems very interesting and I'll have to look into it. His Rain boosted Hydro Pumps will be great and I'll still be an effective revenge killer, thanks to Keldeo's great speed. I'll definitely test it, thanks!



    Hey dude, thanks for your rate! You're right, Volcarona is the biggest threat on my team, I have to play very carefully against him. As for the Naive nature, I'm not so sure, Tornadus' defense isn't the best but he certainly can take a hit or two, so I'm not sure I want to lower it, considering U-Turn is meant more for momentum getting rather than damage.

    As for Heat Wave, that seems like a great idea, you're right that Breloom can't really safely come in on anyone on my team. It'll give me an advantage in the sun, so it seems awesome. I'll definitely test it.

    Salac Berry seems like a great idea to sweep better, I'll be sure to test both that and Rock Gem. Thanks for your rate!


    Thanks for your rate! Lucario is indeed a threat, and ones with Bullet Punch will wreck my team. Latios can take a +2 Extremespeed, but that's shaky at best. Gyarados seems cool, it'll help my Volcarona weakness as well. Who do you think I should replace? Thanks for your rate!


    Thanks! I look forward to your rate!

    I've never thought about Specially Defensive Heatran, it seems like a great solution for troublesome Volcarona, and can wear down bulky waters as well. I'll definitely try it out, it seems great. As for Water Gem, you're right feigning a choice item would be awesome, I'll make the switch right away. And I'll try out both the Rock Gem for Terrakion and Salac berry. Thanks for your rate!


    Ew, it's you. Lol JK dude, thanks for your recommendation on sleep talk, and thanks for your rate, I'll definitely switch from Leftovers to Water Gem.



    Thanks for all your rates guys! :)
  12. Stone RG

    Stone RG Megas are broke
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2012
    Messages:
    346
    Very nice team you have here, though no team is not perfect, so lets get into the rate.

    First of all, i think, Sand VoltTurn (is there any other playstyle with sand?) is a mayor threat to your team, considering between Scarf Rotom W and CB scizor your team gets quite worn down by hazards (which you have no way way to spin) and Volt Switch/U-Turn, considering youre using a Hyper Offense team, prediction is in most cases crucial, a way to ease you this as well as helping you dealing with scizor trying to spam U-turn is changing Substitute for Protect, remember this will always help at getting momentum against choice locked Pokes.

    Now i would also reccomend you switching Body Slam for Thunder on Jirachi, why? Beacause i say so...lol jk. But really it would really help your team dealing with Sub DD gyara, who can come in and set up Rachi all day and night, plus Poli is not what we can call a counter, i also forgot to mention it cleanly 2HKOs Slowbro, who seems to give you headaches.

    Finally, i should say Mamo could take the place of Heatran, considering its most important STAB isnt weakened in rain and it gives an ever important check for almost every dragon-type, and it can also set up rocks. Id suggest the Focus Sash+Stealth Rock set, im guessing you already know it.

    Hope i helped
  13. TGMD

    TGMD +Biosci: you both gave me crabs
    is a Tutoris a Battle Server Moderatoris a Team Rater Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
    Tournament Winner

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2011
    Messages:
    960
    Hey Avatar Korra, nice team!

    First of all I recommend changing Terrakion's EV Spread to: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spe and Heatran's to: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spe. This prevents Genesect from getting a Download boost in SAtk from Terrakion or Heatran, which can be a threat if you're not careful.

    As Wizarus pointed out Lucario is a pretty big threat, and I don't really like Life Orb on Sub SD Terrakion, so a much simpler way of solving that problem would be to run a Babiri Berry over Life Orb on Terrakion. Babiri Berry reduces the damage taken from super-effective steel type moves by 50% allowing you to live a max power Bullet Punch from a +2 Lucario, which does; (56.04% - 66.25%) and then suprise kill with Close Combat as well as preventing a Bullet Punch Choice Band Scizor from ending your sweep, which does; (54.80% - 64.40%), even when Terrakion is at -1 Defense after a Close Combat, which does; (81.73% - 96.59%). Although you won't be able to break through Slowbro or Gliscor like you would if you had Rock Gem, I think it's a better solution to Lucario than slapping a Gyrados onto your team who dosen't really synergise too well and has a weakness to Stealth Rocks meaning it won't be able to switch into Lucario very often.

    Speaking of Gyrados, on your threat list you mentioned that Latios can take it out no problem, but what if a Sub DD Gyrados comes in after Latios has used Draco Meteor and it's at -2? Nothing else on your team threatens it, so your best bet is to go out to Terrakion, as it DD's on the switch and force Gyrados to kill you and then go back out to Latios after Terrakion is gone, then kill with Draco Meteor. But there's one problem, Draco Meteor from Latios only does (66.76% - 78.72%) to standard Sub DD Gyrados, meaning it can get up another DD and then clean sweep through your team (if rocks aren't up, Bounce only does (97.39% - 114.62%) to Politoed, so it has a 79.49% chance of survival, but at that point it's very likely they will have rocks considering you have nothing with taunt or a rapid spinner), unless you pull off something like bringing in Politoed, bait the Bounce, switch into Jirachi as Gyrados is in the middle of it's Bounce and then go for the Body Slam and hope they don't paralyze you and Body Slam paralyses, which is just so incredibly shaky and they could very easily go for the Sub thinking you're bulky Politoed. You could use Trick rather than Draco Meteor after Terrakion dies, but they could predict that and Waterfall, you wouldn't have any damage on Gyrados meaning you would have to try and get off a Perish Song or a Paralyse and this will only work if Gyrados dosen't flinch Politoed or with Jirachi you get lucky with Body Slam and Gyrados dosen't flinch you, all this is down to luck and even if you get off a Perish Song Gyrados would have already torn a huge chunk out of your team and then you'll porbably lose anyway. All this could be averted if you never let Latios be at -2 in the first place and don't let Gyrados set up, but sometimes you are forced to Draco Meteor to revenge kill something, otherwise another pokemon can sweep your team. To help remedy this I suggest you run Hidden Power [Electric] over Hidden Power [Grass] on Politoed, and Thunder over Body Slam on Jirachi. These two changes give you a reliable option against Gyrados and Gyrados shouldn't be a problem anymore, you'll easily be able to stop it from sweeping because both Jirachi and Politoed can live any hit from +1 Gyrados, then Jirachi can OHKO with Thunder, and Politoed does (78.81% - 93.13%) with Hidden Power [Electric], so you can then finish it off with Latios.

    Sorry for the incredibly long paragraph about Gyrados, lol. Anyway, I hope this rate helped and GL with the team :)
  14. ariq2kpokemanz

    ariq2kpokemanz

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2011
    Messages:
    25
    as lavos spawn suggested keldeo would be a good choice however if u opt to use keldeo instead of latios, ur team will be weak to electric type pokemon and u will be forced to fodder something and then revenge kill, jirachi took 51% from a thunderbolt from thundurus- t and heatran was 2hko'd. so maybe consider that. btw if the thundurus-t is a agility variant you will get wrecked, but with gd predicting u can play around it, also you may also want to try splash plate on politoed as there are times when you need to use hydro pump right off the bat and then revealing your water gem isn't too good. whereas you can use hydro pump whenever you want without revealing you aren't choiced. water gem is still a good option. luvdisc'd

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