With heavy regenerator usage...Lefties Blissey might be bulkier. Not sure.
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
-
Congrats to the winners of the 2023 Smog Awards!
Ability Unity!
- Thread starter MegaGallade
- Start date
How does regen affect bulk in any way?
A few interesting niche pokemon I don't think I've seen mentioned.
Octillery (Swift Swim):
Kabutops (Regenerator):
Audino (Slow Start):
Octillery (Swift Swim):
Can keldeo do this?
252+ SpA Choice Specs Octillery Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Rain: 267-315 (41.5 - 49%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
Secret sword is beside the point, you aren't going to get much more raw power right from the word go than this.
Ain't no one wanna switch in. And most things get cleanly one shotted. Just watch out for that one joker running ferrothorn.
Pros/cons:
++++Hits like a truck
+Pretty fast. Just over an effective base 122 (378 speed) modest and just under 140 (414 speed) timid.
+Ass loads of coverage. Energy ball, Ice beam, Sludge wave. Heck even flamethrower, but that would be silly.
+105 attack sitting pretty there could be used for a surprise, certainly not lacking moves on that side either. (Waterfall, Seed bomb, Rock Blast, Bullet Seed, Gunk Shot)
+Did I mention it hits like a truck because god damn.
+75/75/75 bulk isn't awful
-----Deadweight with no rain.
--Life orb and water spout don't gel. Specs mandatory.
--Must not be hit.
-Needs a good hazard clearing friend to stop chip damage from ruining your wall breaking power.
-75/75/75 bulk isn't good.
-Water immunities exist.
-Status prone.
-Does not into priority.
And yes this is the thing with the highest spa that gets spout (that isn't a mega or kyogre). Blastoise can also do this combo (swsw+spout) but it can't two shot chansey after rocks. Tough choices.
252+ SpA Choice Specs Octillery Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Rain: 267-315 (41.5 - 49%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
Secret sword is beside the point, you aren't going to get much more raw power right from the word go than this.
Ain't no one wanna switch in. And most things get cleanly one shotted. Just watch out for that one joker running ferrothorn.
Pros/cons:
++++Hits like a truck
+Pretty fast. Just over an effective base 122 (378 speed) modest and just under 140 (414 speed) timid.
+Ass loads of coverage. Energy ball, Ice beam, Sludge wave. Heck even flamethrower, but that would be silly.
+105 attack sitting pretty there could be used for a surprise, certainly not lacking moves on that side either. (Waterfall, Seed bomb, Rock Blast, Bullet Seed, Gunk Shot)
+Did I mention it hits like a truck because god damn.
+75/75/75 bulk isn't awful
-----Deadweight with no rain.
--Life orb and water spout don't gel. Specs mandatory.
--Must not be hit.
-Needs a good hazard clearing friend to stop chip damage from ruining your wall breaking power.
-75/75/75 bulk isn't good.
-Water immunities exist.
-Status prone.
-Does not into priority.
And yes this is the thing with the highest spa that gets spout (that isn't a mega or kyogre). Blastoise can also do this combo (swsw+spout) but it can't two shot chansey after rocks. Tough choices.
Kabutops (Regenerator):
A spinner that resists flying and can have regen.
Wow. This is all I really wanted to point out.
Pros/Cons:
++Spins AND resists flying? Wow!
++Regenerator means more spinning for longer.
+Can set rocks.
+Knock off is good support.
+Rock is a good offensive type, especially for the things it will be switching in on.
+Attacks off of this don't tickle. 115 attack is nice.
---Not the most bulky thing in the world at 60/105/70.
---Not the fastest thing in the world at base 80.
-Coverage leaves much to be desired.
-Really doesn't do much outside spinning and rock laying.
Wow. This is all I really wanted to point out.
Pros/Cons:
++Spins AND resists flying? Wow!
++Regenerator means more spinning for longer.
+Can set rocks.
+Knock off is good support.
+Rock is a good offensive type, especially for the things it will be switching in on.
+Attacks off of this don't tickle. 115 attack is nice.
---Not the most bulky thing in the world at 60/105/70.
---Not the fastest thing in the world at base 80.
-Coverage leaves much to be desired.
-Really doesn't do much outside spinning and rock laying.
Audino (Slow Start):
Use entrainment doofus.
Pros/Cons:
+++Ridiculously disruptive in a meta where people rely on abilities.
++Bulky as all fuck when it gets something with this. Effective fur coat if you will.
+Doesn't really care about the stats it loses.
+Wish passer. Pretty nice one too.
+T wave and Tox are good status to spread.
+Support movepool is pretty nice. It's audino, we all know what it can do.
---Actually needs to hit something with entrainment
---Special offence unaffected.
--Keldeo lmao.
--Extreme 4MSS. Wants to run entrainment, wish, protect, tox, twave, knock off, heal bell and encore.
-Magic bounce ruins this.
+But it gets magic bounce when that happens. Not all bad. Bounce vs Bounce is always a laugh.
-Really passive.
-Slow start wears off eventually.
-Relies on wish for recovery.
-Real gimmicky.
Note: Skill swap also there. But just use a chansey for that.
Pros/Cons:
+++Ridiculously disruptive in a meta where people rely on abilities.
++Bulky as all fuck when it gets something with this. Effective fur coat if you will.
+Doesn't really care about the stats it loses.
+Wish passer. Pretty nice one too.
+T wave and Tox are good status to spread.
+Support movepool is pretty nice. It's audino, we all know what it can do.
---Actually needs to hit something with entrainment
---Special offence unaffected.
--Keldeo lmao.
--Extreme 4MSS. Wants to run entrainment, wish, protect, tox, twave, knock off, heal bell and encore.
-Magic bounce ruins this.
+But it gets magic bounce when that happens. Not all bad. Bounce vs Bounce is always a laugh.
-Really passive.
-Slow start wears off eventually.
-Relies on wish for recovery.
-Real gimmicky.
Note: Skill swap also there. But just use a chansey for that.
I have created this team. It seems to work fine for me.
[replay]abilityunity-353226147[/replay]
Fuck Electric (Zapdos) @ Leftovers
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Discharge
- Heat Wave
- Roost
- Defog
Chesnaught @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Spiky Shield
- Leech Seed
- Drain Punch
- Wood Hammer
HeHe (Chansey) @ Eviolite
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 160 Def / 100 SpD
Bold Nature
- Heal Bell
- Toxic
- Seismic Toss
- Soft-Boiled
Ka-Boom (Hoopa-Unbound) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Hyperspace Fury
- Gunk Shot
- Zen Headbutt
- Drain Punch
RIP (Lopunny) @ Lopunnite
Ability: Download
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Return
- Substitute /baton pass
- Fake Out
Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Fire Blast
- Scald
- Slack Off
- Toxic
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Discharge
- Heat Wave
- Roost
- Defog
Chesnaught @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Spiky Shield
- Leech Seed
- Drain Punch
- Wood Hammer
HeHe (Chansey) @ Eviolite
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 160 Def / 100 SpD
Bold Nature
- Heal Bell
- Toxic
- Seismic Toss
- Soft-Boiled
Ka-Boom (Hoopa-Unbound) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Hyperspace Fury
- Gunk Shot
- Zen Headbutt
- Drain Punch
RIP (Lopunny) @ Lopunnite
Ability: Download
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Return
- Substitute /baton pass
- Fake Out
Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Fire Blast
- Scald
- Slack Off
- Toxic
Zapdos: Acts as a perfect switch-in for electric types and discharge is basically scald but with 30% paral chance instead to burn
Chesnaught: it's basically a Mega-Scizor and scarfed Hoopa-counter. It's high defense lets it wall any defensive monster. Poison Heal/Leech Seed/Drain Punch combo means it's unbeatable
Chansey: Unaware chansey with eviolite basically means no SpA can win against you.
Hoopa-Unbound: Scarfed hoopa with contrary means you can spam hyperspace fury and it will raise you defense in turn. Plus it's high attack can 2 shot (if not OHKO) any mon
Mega-Lopunny: Download to get that attack/SpA boost before mega-evolving. If you're lucky enough to get that Attack boost, Lop will literally destroy any mon it faces
Slowbro: Acts as a counter against mega-lop.
Chesnaught: it's basically a Mega-Scizor and scarfed Hoopa-counter. It's high defense lets it wall any defensive monster. Poison Heal/Leech Seed/Drain Punch combo means it's unbeatable
Chansey: Unaware chansey with eviolite basically means no SpA can win against you.
Hoopa-Unbound: Scarfed hoopa with contrary means you can spam hyperspace fury and it will raise you defense in turn. Plus it's high attack can 2 shot (if not OHKO) any mon
Mega-Lopunny: Download to get that attack/SpA boost before mega-evolving. If you're lucky enough to get that Attack boost, Lop will literally destroy any mon it faces
Slowbro: Acts as a counter against mega-lop.
[replay]abilityunity-353226147[/replay]
Last edited:
Like to add another combo I think is fairly viable:
Mew @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 (Def/SpD) / 4 Spe
(Calm/Bold) Nature
- Transform
- Will-o-Wisp
- Heal Bell/Roost
- Trick
OR without the scarf:
Mew @ (Leftovers/Red Card/Lum Berry/Rocky Helmet/Life Orb)
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 (Def/SpD) / 4 Spe
(Calm/Bold) Nature
- Transform
- Will-o-Wisp
- Heal Bell
- Roost
[Item Choice depends on purpose (what it's transforming into).]
[Higher Speed could allow outspeeding other Pranksters or Gale Wings users; the latter isn't important because gale wings users, can't really tank each other.]
Mew @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 (Def/SpD) / 4 Spe
(Calm/Bold) Nature
- Transform
- Will-o-Wisp
- Heal Bell/Roost
- Trick
OR without the scarf:
Mew @ (Leftovers/Red Card/Lum Berry/Rocky Helmet/Life Orb)
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 (Def/SpD) / 4 Spe
(Calm/Bold) Nature
- Transform
- Will-o-Wisp
- Heal Bell
- Roost
[Item Choice depends on purpose (what it's transforming into).]
[Higher Speed could allow outspeeding other Pranksters or Gale Wings users; the latter isn't important because gale wings users, can't really tank each other.]
Last edited:
Sorry to double post; but on a different topic.
As much as I enjoy Chatot, the fact it can go THIS HAXXY:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/abilityunity-357121007
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/abilityunity-357134448
Is probably evidence is should be banned in AU.
As much as I enjoy Chatot, the fact it can go THIS HAXXY:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/abilityunity-357121007
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/abilityunity-357134448
Is probably evidence is should be banned in AU.
Last edited:
To be honest, I can't understand how Chatot wasn't banned yet. Gale wings is, by itself, very threatening, but combining this with a 100% chance of confusion? And Nasty Plot? Chatter is not healthy for any metagame, especially when it is a priority move. Pokémon is already a very luck-based game and Chatter just makes this even worst. I feel like AU is not receiving any support regarding to bans/suspects, I remember when Mix and Mega was the OMotM, there was a lot of discussion and support but AU just seems... dead.
Last edited:
So in normal play poison heal Gliscor and defog is an illegal combination. Shouldn't defog Gliscor from gen 4 be able to get poison heal from itself in this meta? I'm unable to use it on the simulator, and I was wondering if this was intentional.
Aside of that, the only Ground/Flying Pokemon who gets Poison Heal is Gliscor itself, so it would be illegal either way.
Regenerator Manaphy has been really awesome for me in this meta, taking on a lot of physical attackers and poses a real bother to stall. Toxic+koff is big game vs stall, and toxic in particular lets you avoid being set up on by opposing pokemon. Uturn allows you to get good switches along with recovery and avoids manaphy being a passive momentum sink. Scald is there for obvious additional utility and some damage. Overall this set is just a huge amount of utility and regenerator (especially when paired with a second regenerator mon) allows manaphy some pretty absurd longevity.
Manaphy @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Knock Off
- Toxic
- U-turn
Manaphy @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Knock Off
- Toxic
- U-turn
bp scrub
rub a dub dub one scrub in a tub
I really like Regen Mana too, been using this set lately
Manaphy @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Scald
- Knock Off
- U-turn
- Ice Beam
This thing is just insanely specially bulky, being 4hkoed by Modest LO Moltres' Hurricane, taking 40% from specs Raikou, and taking around 45-50% from Sceptile, meaning that you can U-Turn out, deal around 45% while only taking around 15 net % in damage, and get a free switch in to anything, like a Gale Wings mon.
This however probably my favorite mon in this meta. Basically every time it comes in, something dies.
Typhlosion @ Choice Specs
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Eruption
- Focus Blast
- Fire Blast
- Solar Beam
Timid may be better, but Modest is nice for the power boost, notably being able to 2hko Chansey with rocks.
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Harsh Sunshine: 274-324 (42.6 - 50.4%) -- 95.7% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Suicune in Harsh Sunshine: 175-207 (43.3 - 51.2%) -- 58.6% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery (No one runs max spdef Suicune)
Although many offensive mons can outspeed and KO, the vast majority cannot both tank a hit and outspeed, and can only revenge kill (Drizzle/Primo Sea beats this though)
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Charizard X in Harsh Sunshine: 153-180 (51.5 - 60.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock (4x resist, Charizard is down with prior damage or if it didn't mega evolve before switching in.)
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Omastar in Harsh Sunshine: 178-210 (63.3 - 74.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Keldeo in Harsh Sunshine: 292-344 (90.4 - 106.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Moltres in Harsh Sunshine: 306-360 (79.6 - 93.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (If Moltres isn't max HP, has a little prior damage, or SR are up, it's down (75% chance of OHKOing 0/0 Moltres)
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Starmie in Harsh Sunshine: 304-358 (117.3 - 138.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Garchomp in Harsh Sunshine: 306-360 (85.7 - 100.8%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock (Offensive Chomp, Tankchomp is outspeed and 2hkoed)
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Entei in Harsh Sunshine: 339-399 (91.3 - 107.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Manaphy in Harsh Sunshine: 267-315 (78.2 - 92.3%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
Those are all of the resist that are A tier on the VR, mons that dont resist are obviously destroyed by Eruption like
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Hoopa Unbound in Harsh Sunshine: 427-504 (141.8 - 167.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Manaphy @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Scald
- Knock Off
- U-turn
- Ice Beam
This thing is just insanely specially bulky, being 4hkoed by Modest LO Moltres' Hurricane, taking 40% from specs Raikou, and taking around 45-50% from Sceptile, meaning that you can U-Turn out, deal around 45% while only taking around 15 net % in damage, and get a free switch in to anything, like a Gale Wings mon.
This however probably my favorite mon in this meta. Basically every time it comes in, something dies.
Typhlosion @ Choice Specs
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Eruption
- Focus Blast
- Fire Blast
- Solar Beam
Timid may be better, but Modest is nice for the power boost, notably being able to 2hko Chansey with rocks.
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Harsh Sunshine: 274-324 (42.6 - 50.4%) -- 95.7% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Suicune in Harsh Sunshine: 175-207 (43.3 - 51.2%) -- 58.6% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery (No one runs max spdef Suicune)
Although many offensive mons can outspeed and KO, the vast majority cannot both tank a hit and outspeed, and can only revenge kill (Drizzle/Primo Sea beats this though)
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Charizard X in Harsh Sunshine: 153-180 (51.5 - 60.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock (4x resist, Charizard is down with prior damage or if it didn't mega evolve before switching in.)
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Omastar in Harsh Sunshine: 178-210 (63.3 - 74.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Keldeo in Harsh Sunshine: 292-344 (90.4 - 106.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Moltres in Harsh Sunshine: 306-360 (79.6 - 93.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (If Moltres isn't max HP, has a little prior damage, or SR are up, it's down (75% chance of OHKOing 0/0 Moltres)
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Starmie in Harsh Sunshine: 304-358 (117.3 - 138.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Garchomp in Harsh Sunshine: 306-360 (85.7 - 100.8%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock (Offensive Chomp, Tankchomp is outspeed and 2hkoed)
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Entei in Harsh Sunshine: 339-399 (91.3 - 107.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Manaphy in Harsh Sunshine: 267-315 (78.2 - 92.3%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
Those are all of the resist that are A tier on the VR, mons that dont resist are obviously destroyed by Eruption like
252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Hoopa Unbound in Harsh Sunshine: 427-504 (141.8 - 167.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Last edited:
Idle theorymonning... I noticed there's Solid Rock Eviolite Rhydon doing the rounds as a birdkiller, and I wondered if a Rest tank might be a viable set:-
Theraphosa Blondi (Rhydon) @ Eviolite
Ability: Shed Skin (courtesy of Pupitar)
252 HP / 16 DEF / 240 SPD
Adamant Nature
- Rest
- Rock Blast/Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Megahorn
This set is a version that... might work. Maybe. Rest+Shed Skin is a pretty good combination (there's a defensive Scrafty set I've seen that utilizes it quite well), and Rhydon's base 105 HP and exceptional Defence makes it an excellent user of it. I think Rock Blast over Stone Edge would be preferable, but there's something to be said for more consistent damage output (though this implies that Stone Miss is ever consistent =] ). Earthquake is there purely for STAB, since I like being able to hit things that aren't birds, and Megahorn is there for the Psychic-types running around. Hopefully this is a bit more of a success than the previous attempts (thanks to motherlove for the feedback, btw, I appreciate it).
Theraphosa Blondi (Rhydon) @ Eviolite
Ability: Shed Skin (courtesy of Pupitar)
252 HP / 16 DEF / 240 SPD
Adamant Nature
- Rest
- Rock Blast/Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Megahorn
This set is a version that... might work. Maybe. Rest+Shed Skin is a pretty good combination (there's a defensive Scrafty set I've seen that utilizes it quite well), and Rhydon's base 105 HP and exceptional Defence makes it an excellent user of it. I think Rock Blast over Stone Edge would be preferable, but there's something to be said for more consistent damage output (though this implies that Stone Miss is ever consistent =] ). Earthquake is there purely for STAB, since I like being able to hit things that aren't birds, and Megahorn is there for the Psychic-types running around. Hopefully this is a bit more of a success than the previous attempts (thanks to motherlove for the feedback, btw, I appreciate it).
I have been using venomoth to set up on m-bounce mews and stuff. If you get ride of gale wings users you can sweep.
Venomoth @ Black Sludge
Ability: Adaptability (thanks mega beedrill)
252 Sp. Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Sp. Def
Modest Nature
- Substitute
- Quiver Dance
- Sludge Bomb
- Bug Buzz
Venomoth @ Black Sludge
Ability: Adaptability (thanks mega beedrill)
252 Sp. Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Sp. Def
Modest Nature
- Substitute
- Quiver Dance
- Sludge Bomb
- Bug Buzz
OLD GREGG (im back baby)
old gregg for life
Been playing this a bit and want to share a couple of sets that you may or may not have seen on the ladder.
Goodra @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 160 HP / 128 Def / 220 SpD
Careful Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Curse
- Rest
- Dragon Tail
- Sleep Talk
First off is an overlooked wincon that I have been utilizing. It requires a little support in that fairies must be dealt with before trying to set-up, steels can be a nuisance but are a lot less of a headache, it also needs 2-3 turns to be really tanky in the physical department so setting up on special attackers and passive mons is a must. Once it gets to +2 in def most birdspam cant break it outright, most special attackers can't even hope to break it. The evs ensure that Goodra is not OHKO by Adamant LO Braviary BB. This set is magic with hazards.
Moltres @ Choice Specs
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 136 HP / 252 SpA / 120 Spe
Modest Nature
- Ancient Power / Sleep Talk
- Fire Blast
- Hurricane
- U-turn
This set is a special sweeper that really appreciates weather, either sun or rain. Rain ensures that Moltres' priority Specs Hurricanes are 100% accurate which lets Moltres more reliably break through Lax, Cress, Cune, etc...especially when factoring in that confusion chance. Sun makes Moltres' Specs Fire Blast hit harder than Char Y's. These evs are just generic to give Moltres max SpA with a little speed and a little bulk.
*Edit:
I literally have never used Ancient Power and Sleep Talk could make Moltres good sleep fodder so I slashed it.
Goodra @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 160 HP / 128 Def / 220 SpD
Careful Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Curse
- Rest
- Dragon Tail
- Sleep Talk
First off is an overlooked wincon that I have been utilizing. It requires a little support in that fairies must be dealt with before trying to set-up, steels can be a nuisance but are a lot less of a headache, it also needs 2-3 turns to be really tanky in the physical department so setting up on special attackers and passive mons is a must. Once it gets to +2 in def most birdspam cant break it outright, most special attackers can't even hope to break it. The evs ensure that Goodra is not OHKO by Adamant LO Braviary BB. This set is magic with hazards.
Moltres @ Choice Specs
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 136 HP / 252 SpA / 120 Spe
Modest Nature
- Ancient Power / Sleep Talk
- Fire Blast
- Hurricane
- U-turn
This set is a special sweeper that really appreciates weather, either sun or rain. Rain ensures that Moltres' priority Specs Hurricanes are 100% accurate which lets Moltres more reliably break through Lax, Cress, Cune, etc...especially when factoring in that confusion chance. Sun makes Moltres' Specs Fire Blast hit harder than Char Y's. These evs are just generic to give Moltres max SpA with a little speed and a little bulk.
*Edit:
I literally have never used Ancient Power and Sleep Talk could make Moltres good sleep fodder so I slashed it.
Going to temporarily ban Chatot from the ladder due it it being very uncompetitive. If nobody makes a good argument for it to stay then the ban will be permanent.
i argument that not chatot is the problem, but chatter.
imho the move only should be banned (like in bh).
chatot without chatter is not so viable, but maybe somebody still wants to use it.
bp scrub
rub a dub dub one scrub in a tub
Yeah it doesn't really have too much use w/o chatter, but Tinted Lens + Boomburst could be useful, especially since Ghost types aren't very prevalent here as far as i know
It's also more simple to just ban Chatot instead of banning Chatter
sin(pi)
lucky n bad
This hasn't been done in any other metagame where this issue arises, as far as I'm aware (even PU elected to ban Chatter itself). The only real reason Chatot is banworthy is Chatter - NP Boomburst is cool but the bird is PU in standard, and without Chatter, I can't think of a notable ability that makes it broken (Tinted Lens is cool, but it still struggles with Chansey and Ghosts, and can't beat both).
The problem is Chatot itself, not Chatter. Firstly, Chatter is only available to Chatot and not any other Pokemon. If Chatter were an issue on multiple Pokemon, then it should be banned. Second, if Chatot had 10 SpA for example, or if it didn't have access to a useful ability, it's unlikely you would call for a Chatter ban. And last, it's more simple.
Instead of banning chatot, ban gale wings chatot, because I run a set like this:
Lullaby (Chatot) @ Focus Sash
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Sing
- Boomburst
- Chatter
- Nasty Plot
And it is completely not overpowered, you just get 100% sleep, and chance to nasty plot up
Lullaby (Chatot) @ Focus Sash
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Sing
- Boomburst
- Chatter
- Nasty Plot
And it is completely not overpowered, you just get 100% sleep, and chance to nasty plot up
While I agree, I'd provide the counterpoint that AAA (an official OM which this is a derivative of) set the precedent of banning Chatter and not Chatot, based on the Gale Wings set.
Not a topic for this thread but Kl4ng can consider rectifying that. I'm not going to step on his toes and do it.