1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Alternation

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by Kierany9, Jul 10, 2013.

  1. Kierany9

    Kierany9

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2012
    Messages:
    53
    Well, this is my first team I've ever made for UU. I'm brand new to the tier and have had moderate sucess with a team I glued together in five minutes and have been refining it until I can refine no-more. Which is a lot more than 5 minutes.
    Also, I don't give a shit about the title.

    The team:________________________________
    At a glance:
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    How it wins:
    This team uses a combination of incredible defenses, recovery and powerful attacks to destroy the opponent while avoiding heavy damange and inflicting status, allowing for a flow between Stall and Offence. Stall teams are picked apart with the teams powerhouses whereas offensive teams are walled to hell and back, before being disposed of easily.​
    In detail:
    [​IMG]
    The Duck (Porygon2) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Trace
    EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 SAtk
    Calm Nature
    - Tri Attack
    - Thunder Wave
    - Recover
    - Shadow Ball Thunderbolt
    The Duck is the glue that holds this team together. The Duck has an insane defensive power and decent offence too. With Eviolite, The Duck can switch into almost any attack and then cripple the opponent with Thunder Wave or spam Tri Attack, which can hinder the opponent by freezing, burning or paralyzing them. Recover is a no-brainer, allowing The Duck to heal from a random critical or the like. Trace is the only usefull ability on The Duck, allowing it to copy enemy's abilites. This can help The Duck unexpectedly. It's immune to Earthquake because it traced Levitate or it healed itself of toxic because it traced Natural Cure. All in all, The Duck is a solid Pokemon and earns a solid slot on this team.​
    [​IMG]
    Batman (Gligar) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Immunity
    EVs: 252 Def / 252 HP / 4 Atk
    Impish Nature
    - Protect Stealth Rock
    - Toxic
    - Earthquake
    - Roost
    If you beat The Duck then chances are you won't beat Batman. Batman abuses Eviolite just like The Duck, pushing his physical defence to insane limits. Batman will take any attacks The Duck may find nasty while spreading toxic onto anything that isn't paralyzed yet. Protect allows him to toxistall more efficiently and avoid any attacks that may cause him trouble. Toxic and Roost are obvious choices, with the latter temporarily turning his x4 ice weakness into an x2 weakness, which does help a lot when it comes to survival. Earthquake prevents Batman from being complete Taunt Bait. Batman, other than his x4 Ice weakness, is solid and protects the team from powerful physical attacks.​
    [​IMG]
    Dark Knight (Umbreon) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Synchronize
    EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 Def
    Careful Nature
    - Heal Bell
    - Wish
    - Toxic Protect
    - Foul Play
    Dark Knight is one of the few Pokemon with Heal Bell in the whole UU tier. Which is a very good thing because The Duck and Batman will be absorbing a lot of Status effects. Dark Knight also has 95/110/130 defences, turning it into an unbreakable wall just like The Duck. Unfortunately, its weakness to Bug and Fighting prevent it from being as effective as The Duck. Wish can be used for self-healing or healing others without self recovery. Toxic is there for the sake of being there, as it is one of the best status moves in the tier. Foul Play is Umbreon's best bet at dealing damage since it has miserable 65/60 offences. Foul Play tears physical sweepers to shreds, especially those that rely on setting up since it uses their own stat modifiers against them. Dark Knight is the teams much-needed cleric and general support and helps the team get by.​
    [​IMG]
    Gotta Go Fast (Ambipom) @ Normal Gem Silk Scarf
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
    Jolly Nature
    - Return
    - Shadow Claw
    - U-turn
    - Fake Out
    Gotta Go Fast is your average Ambipom, a Jolly Natured FakeTurn set. However, anybody predicting the Fake Out and switching into a ghost type can take a Shadow Claw coming off Ambipoms fully invested 100 base attack. Return is a STAB move that can finish off almost anything that took more than 45% damage from STAB Tecnician Normal Gem Fake Out. When Ambipom can switch in, it can deal huge amounts of damage and switch out safely to one of the teams tanks.​
    [​IMG]
    Your average lead (Azelf) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef
    Timid Nature
    - Grass Knot
    - Fire Blast
    - Stealth Rock Psychic
    - Shadow Ball
    One of the reasons why I lost a lot of matches while the team was in development was because those bloody Frosslass and Swampert and Roserade kept on getting Spikes and SR up. In this slot I previously had Chandelure and Darmatian just so my team had something to deal with Bronzong. However, this set takes the icing on the cake just because it functions as a perfect anti-lead. It's inconsipuous and looks like your average lead, yet murders everything and sets up SR if it gets a chance. If I see a Frosslass or a Swampert or a Rhyperior or some other SR lead, Azelf is out on the field. Grass Knot deals with Water and Ground types, Fire Blast deals with Bronzong and Roserade and Shadow Ball is for Frosslass(I can't usually aford to miss Fire Blast and this OHKOs anyway) and opposing Azelf.​
    252 SpA Life Orb Azelf Grass Knot (80 BP) vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Swampert: 484-572 (120.69 - 142.64%) -- guaranteed OHKO
    252 SpA Life Orb Azelf Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Bronzong: 291-343 (86.09 - 101.47%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO, 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
    252 SpA Life Orb Azelf Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Azelf: 294-348 (101.03 - 119.58%) -- guaranteed OHKO
    252 SpA Life Orb Azelf Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Froslass: 294-348 (104.62 - 123.84%) -- guaranteed OHKO
    252 SpA Life Orb Azelf Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 240+ SpD Roserade: 234-276 (72.22 - 85.18%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    As you can see this set storms through common leads and deals with a wall that none oth my other pokemon can deal with. And if I get a spare moment, then I can set up rocks. If no common hazard setters are in the team preview or I have to deal with Empoleon then I can use Azelf as a late game sweeper with its unresisted coverage.​
    [​IMG]
    Thundercat (Raikou) @ Air Balloon Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
    Timid Nature
    - Thunderbolt
    - Substitute
    - Calm Mind
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    Thundercat is a sweeper. It appretiates being able to set up but even without a CM boost, it can still hit hard. Thunderbolt is a no-brainer and Substitute lets it dodge status and set up easily. Hidden Power Ice takes care of ground types that think they can switch into a Thunderbolt and OHKOs the omnipresent Flygon. Basically Smogon's SubCM set with an Air Balloon. I didn't even read the Smogon article before putting this set together...​
  2. Godsend

    Godsend

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2009
    Messages:
    369
    Hey, let my offer some general advice.

    First, Porygon2 would really appreciate Ice Beam/Discharge>Shadow Ball. They will provide much better coverage overall, and allow it to hit the things that it wants to switch into much harder.

    Gligar could benefit from a couple choices instead of Protect, like Stealth Rock. Protect is a decent move, but freeing up a slot on Azelf seems much more beneficial.

    On to Azelf, I think a set of Psyshock/Fire Blast/Thunderbolt/ Nasty Plot would be the best. It allows max offensiveness and destruction now that Gligar has Stealth Rock.

    Umbreon is a Pokémon that would enjoy Protect a lot more than Toxic. Gligar and Pory both have status moves already and ensuring that Umby gets the Wish off to heal itself is really useful. I have won many games against players that use Wish without Protect.

    If you like Ambipom keep using it, I do feel that there are other Pokémon that would benefit the team either offensively or defensively. One I can suggest is a Scarfmienshao the standard set is fine.

    Last Raikou I think would be better off with lefties since it has sub.

    good luck
  3. Kierany9

    Kierany9

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2012
    Messages:
    53
    Thunderbolt is my move of choice on The Duck just so that it can actually hit steel types like Empoleon and Bronzong.
    SR on Gilgar seems like a good idea. Only used Protect once to scout an offensive Porygon(with ice beam...)
    If I set up with Azelf, I don't OHKO the hazard leads and they set up, thus defeating the purpose of Azelf. I also switched SR for Psychic just to hit Roserade harder.
    Agreed about Protect on Umbreon. Also, it had some useless attack EVs so I put them on defense.
    Raikou does need Lefties.
    Thanks for the advice.
  4. Purple Grind

    Purple Grind

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2012
    Messages:
    28
    If you're gonna use abmipom I don't think I'd put a normal gem on it since the first move you'd use would usually be fake out. Life orb would be best or you could use silk scarf if you don't like recoil. Life orb/silk scarf fake out followed by life orb/silk scarf return is better than normal gem fakout return or just plain normal gem return. On ambipom I prefer beat up over shadow claw because it gets a technician boost and it can ohko past suicide frosslass's sash, which is a common lead you'll run into. It also 2hko's cofagrigus and ohko's chandelure assuming most of your team is still alive.
  5. CoolStoryBrobat

    CoolStoryBrobat The hero Smogon needs, but not the one it deserves
    is a Community Contributoris a Battle Server Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2012
    Messages:
    889
    Ayy, mon. Nice team you got here for just starting out in UU, but I got a few things in the way of advice you should consider, at least:

    Gligar + Umbreon is probably the defensive core I've loved for so long and rolled into so many games with on so many teams, to the point I realized I was brutally at fault because I fit them into crap near every team I made. While your team is good, you gotta realize the few things that demolish that core can actually pose a threat to the majority of your team because they're generally hard to switch into if they're able to ruin your bulky Pokemon:

    Virizion (ALL sets; CM, SD, and the rare Work Up variants)
    Mixed/Special Cobalion with HP Ice
    LO Mienshao with HP Ice (Or scarf with HP Ice for that matter)
    SubCM Raikou (If it gets to +3, Umbreon is 2HKO'd)
    Swords Dance Heracross (Especially since it runs Guts, it'll drink that Toxic from Gligar and basically render you almost fully unable to try switching in on it after it's set up.)
    Choice Specs Chandelure (You got it kind of covered with Porygon2, but the Specs Variant at times runs Flame Body just to get past it...and Trick cripples Umbreon or Porygon2 if they switch into it)
    Life Orb Nidoking/Queen(?) with Focus Blast
    Life Orb Shaymin w/HP Ice
    Choice Band Azumarill
    Swords Dance Weavile (Funny thing is Weavile also outspeeds your entire team. The only hope you have of taking it on is Ambipom's Fake Out. If it were to get up an SD you'd be in trouble)
    Dragon Dance Scrafty
    Dragon Dance Kingdra
    Choice Band Victini
    Heck, even a Golurk with Ice Punch and Dynamicpunch is actually a scary check to deal with if it shows up at the right time, believe it or not. Add that to the fact it checks Raikou and Ambipom to some extent!

    While it's kind of a short list of huge threats, bear in mind they are HUGE threats and all carry something in common: That is having access to a powerful physical and/or fighting move to beat out Porygon2 and Umbreon (or in Chandy and Shaymin's case, having overwhelmingly powerful STAB moves, especially in Shaymin's case with Seed Flare's -2 SpDef drop) on top of an ice-type (Or water if you're Azumarill or DD Kingdra) move or a generally hard-hitting special move to keep Gligar at bay.

    The next thing I noticed, your team doesn't have a Choice Scarf user. While this is plausible in itself for some teams, and you have made up for it by carrying three Pokemon in the base 115 Speed tier at max speed (Ambipom, Azelf, and Raikou), none of them are going to be able to beat out the most common scarfers one-on-one. Ambipom can pull out a nice Fake Out and hopefully finish off a weakened scarfer, but say it's something like Heracross or Mienshao, or heck even Flygon. And let's also say the guy you're battling is smart enough to know he needs Ambipom dead to avoid being revenge killed and that he just has to remove Gligar from play while keeping Heracross/Mienshao/Flygon healthy. He could easily play around Fake Out, whittle down (if not outright kill at some point) Ambipom and then propose a threatening lategame sweep that you're going to have to play around that fact by constantly relying on Umbreon, Gligar, and occasionally Porygon2 as your defensive pivots until it's safe to bring one of your attackers back in, meanwhile the opponent can wear them down with his wallbreakers or setup sweepers, while still keeping the pressure up on you. Kinda scary in itself, ain't it?

    Last big flaw I see is that you have no major check to Fighting-types outside of Gligar, and he's not really helping beat out the ones I mentioned above. I mean, you have Azelf to take maybe one hit to the face, but given his frailty, if you so much as mispredict (switch in Azelf on a predicted Fighting move, end up eating a U-Turn) then you're short one of your main attackers. Add that to the fact that if it can beat Gligar, you can't afford to switch much else on your team in against it, thus meaning in order to check it you may have to sacrifice one of your own Pokemon, which can hurt you tremendously in a battle.

    Anyway, those are all the flaws I noticed with the team, but I at least have a couple of solutions/suggestions to pitch at you to hopefully mitigate this a little.

    1. Drop Ambipom. Not that I'm trying to simply rally the massive bandwagon that many UU players have ridden on for their hate of the Purple Ape, but for this team I think you may want to consider replacing Ambipom for a decent Choice Scarfer, preferably one who can take on some of the threats I mentioned above. A good example would be:

    [​IMG]

    Mienshao @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Regenerator/Reckless
    Jolly/Naive Nature
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 SpD
    - Hi Jump Kick
    - Stone Edge
    - U-Turn
    - Aerial Ace/Hidden Power Ice

    Scarf Mienshao, as easy as it is to fit on any offensive team, could find a nice home here. Being able to demolish Cobalion, Virizion, Scrafty, Weavile, any Raikou not behind a Sub already, and opposing Mienshao, I think it's a worthy option to consider. It's one of the best scarfers in the tier and for good reason. Regenerator mitigates passive damage you may receive from prior switch-ins to hazards (or even missing an HJK), but Reckless can step it up to having enough power to OHKO even the likes of Flygon (Scarf Flygon also kills Raikou, while Raikou can only outspeed the Choice Band set). Add this all to the amount of pressure it puts on the opponent as well as the capability of a lategame cleanup job (Just don't miss Hi-Jump Kick!) I honestly think it's your best bet. There's other options and it's best to tailor that to what your team needs, but this may be as solid an option as any out there.

    2. Either run Ice Beam + Thunderbolt + Thunder Wave on Porygon2, or run Discharge + Ice Beam + Toxic. Somewhat more of a minor nitpick, but I really don't like the idea of Tri Attack on a fully defensive Porygon2 set, especially for what you're using it for. With either of the options I mentioned you retain that infamous "BoltBeam" (It's 2013, we say Tundrabolt now) coverage while still having a move to cripple foes with. Thunder Wave is there in case you want to use this guy as a pivot to cripple fast attackers with (Which may matter for your team at times, especially against scarfers) but you could use the second option of Discharge (Which still has the 30% paralysis chance) and Toxic, since you mentioned you like using your pivots to semistall with to weaken foes to be killed off later.

    3. OPTION: A) Replace Gligar with either Golurk or Nidoqueen, or B) Replace Toxic for U-Turn on Gligar. This seems like a funky option for me to propose but there's some sound reasoning behind it, actually. The only, and I mean only beef with Gligar that I have on this team is he's among the few Ground-types unable to soundly check SubCM Raikou. For any UU Team in this day and age, that is a necessity. You may dismiss this suggestion immediately as you have Umbreon, and that's actually understandable. Gligar's physical defense surpasses that of either of the two, and there's no useful resistances they both have that Gligar can't take itself. However like I mentioned above, if Raikou manages to get to +3, Umbreon is 2HKO'd, and your options against it are severely limited. Some smart players who see an Umbreon in your team will know this and won't go for a Substitute, but will just repeatedly spam Calm Mind while you try and tank it out. (Also beware of the super rare CM + 3 Attacks Raikou. If it happens to you, you'll flip your beans like I did once.)

    Golurk and Nidoqueen take pretty pitiful damage from Hidden Power Ice, and even if Raikou is behind a sub and uses calm mind as they break the sub, they can still take a +1 HP Ice and hammer it with the Ground STABs. They also maintain the ability to setup Stealth Rock for your team while checking Fighting types, something Rhyperior can't do as effectively, and the only reason I didn't mention it as an option here. They ALSO can take on Heracross much better than Gligar can (Watch for Night Slash and Earthquake, though) as Golurk's got Shadow Punch (Or Ice Punch, which still does more than what Gligar's Earthquake could) and Nidoqueen has Fire Blast to quickly dispatch it.

    The other choice, U-Turn over Toxic on Gligar. I know you want to use Gligar to help spread status while performing duties as a pivot, but I feel U-Turn would accomplish so much more in the long run. Say the opponent brings in one of those threats I mentioned above; some of them are outsped by your other Pokemon and promptly dealt with. You use U-Turn as they switch, and you maintain the upper hand while still keeping pressure up with your offensive Pokemon. In my opinion U-Turn is probably the best move a Gligar can have to keep it from being setup bait, and a lot of other players for some reason still would bash this guy. Either option would do your team a bit more justice than what you currently have in your favor. Not only that but Toxic is Gligar's only option for damaging a non-choiced Heracross, and that activates Guts. Really hard to switch in on a Guts-boosted Heracross, even moreso for this team alone. Non-Scarf Heracross is at least outsped by Azelf and promptly KO'd. Speaking of...

    4. Psyshock > Psychic on Azelf. Even more of a minor nitpick it seems, but what you overlooked was the fact that Psyshock hits Roserade even harder than Psychic does. It also does a respectable amount to Snorlax compared to Psychic (~47%-~56% to standard offensive Lax, insane for any special attacker) and is usually going to be more useful against the stuff you'd be using it on; even Hitmontop, who runs physical Defense, is taking no less than 80%.

    Anyway, them's the breaks. All these suggestions hopefully improve your team to make it become even more successful than it currently is and I wish you the best in UU!

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)