Alternative Items

[TheMaskedNitpicker]

Also I'd like to suggest a Superluck Absol @ Scope Lens with Night Slash, Stone Edge, SD and Focus Energy (It's a shame it doesn't get Cross Chop for excellent coverage instead of SD). This one is really just for a laugh and I've never actually used it and it's probably rubbish.

I actually used this before. I passed it a agility, and it crited every single one of my opponents pokemon. I didn't have focus energy on it though.

That's probably because Absol CAN'T LEARN FOCUS ENERGY. Also, the combination of Super Luck, High-crit move, Scope Lens and Focus Energy would get you up to 5 levels of crit-boost and the maximum is 4. What you can do is give it Lansat Berry instead of Scope Lens.

 

[PhredLevi]

Is Natural Gift viable as a surprise attack? With the right berry, that's an 80 power attack of any type.
Seems like a fun way to use some of those berries you don't usually see.

 

[teamsleep]

Sometimes if I want to help one of my Pokémon set up, usually in lower tier environments, I will use Trick with an item like Iron Ball because it makes it much easier on some occasions to set up on a Pokémon hindered by an item like Iron Ball, while if you Trick a Choice item, your opponent will almost always switch out unless they are benefitted from the Choice item, which could be the downfall of your setup.

Lopunny works well with that, because it pretty much switcherooing iron ball means Armaldo, Absol, and Aggron will be running free or summat

unless they switch, then you can just baton pass agility onto one of them.

 

[Dragonknight!]

I use Sharp beak on my staraptor, which completely destroys everything with Brave Bird. On my subroost Staraptor, If I have stealth rock and spikes support, sharp beak bb staraptor ohkos so many things.

 

[Colonel Darren]

I'm hoping that White Herb and Power Herb can be written into Shoddy 2. Who wouldn't like a free Overheat/etc at full power, or an instant Skull Bash or instant Solarbeam without sunlight?

 

[Airfoil]

I'm hoping that White Herb and Power Herb can be written into Shoddy 2. Who wouldn't like a free Overheat/etc at full power, or an instant Skull Bash or instant Solarbeam without sunlight?

Don't forget Sky Attack.....Especial Great on Staraptor (something else would usually be a better option, especially seeing it's one of those lucky ducks w/ 120 base STAB attack) and Aerodactyl (could really work to make up for the OK base attack and the fact he isn't made to be on the field long enough to desire a second use).

I think a few Pokemon would benifit more from Muscle Band and Wise Glasses for more power than from Leftovers, and can be a better replacement for LO if Item clause is on/Leftovers isn't needed/recoil is annoying. I have used them multiple times w/ great success.

 

[PhredLevi]

Big Root seems fun to try. I thought about using Drain Punch and Hitmonchan, but he's not really built for the long run, is he?
I guess Giga Drain also works?

 

[Airfoil]

The main problem there, though, is Giga Drain's/Drain Punch's low power. But if it raises the amount of HP recovered from Leech Seed (I'm not sure)....But that's about it.....

 

[PhredLevi]

The main problem there, though, is Giga Drain's/Drain Punch's low power. But if it raises the amount of HP recovered from Leech Seed (I'm not sure)....But that's about it.....

Well it does work with Leech Seed, too.
Giga Drain, Leech Seed, Synthesis, Toxic @ Big Root.
Ultimate stalling. It could work, I tell ya.

 

[Little Battler]

@ bigroot discussion

technitop + drain punch + bigroot sounds nice to me by the way.

 

[TheMaskedNitpicker]

I have a Venusaur with Giga Drain/Sludge Bomb/Sleep Poweder/Leech Seed and Big Root. It's got EVs in Def, SpAtk, and SpDef, if I recall correctly. It works pretty well on PBR singles random WiFi, where it's 3 vs 3. It can take an Ice Beam from most Water types and gain pretty much all the HP back with a Giga Drain and Leech Seed thanks to Big Root.

I don't think it'd be nearly as effective in OU 6v6 play on Shoddy, though.

 

[Instinctive]

I have a Venusaur with Giga Drain/Sludge Bomb/Sleep Poweder/Leech Seed and Big Root. It's got EVs in Def, SpAtk, and SpDef, if I recall correctly. It works pretty well on PBR singles random WiFi, where it's 3 vs 3. It can take an Ice Beam from most Water types and gain pretty much all the HP back with a Giga Drain and Leech Seed thanks to Big Root.

I don't think it'd be nearly as effective in OU 6v6 play on Shoddy, though.

Might be interesting to try that with a solid Sub, although idk what to get rid of for it...

 

[Zystral]

Perishable items would be interesting sometimes. Sadly, their one time use means you have to be sure that it'll guarantee you the win at that point.

Mainly things like Pinch Berries. Any sort of Sub/StatUpMove/PowerAttack/CoverageAttack @ Pinch Berry set only work once, especially since you're stacking the boosts from both your CM/SD/Agility/Claw Sharpen/Whatever and your Pinch Berry. But then, some go for raw power over coverage.

However, something that's really been making me think is Power Herb or White Herb.
Power Herb lets you skip the charge turn for Solarbeam and Sky Attack. I forget any other charge-up moves, but you know what I mean. Generally, things that benefit from it; Exeggutor's Solarbeam, Honchkrow's Sky Attack, Salamence's Fly. Then again, Life Orbed secondary STAB options do more damage...

White Herb on the other hand makes Leaf Storm and Overheat more viable on the likes of Defensive Celebi/Heatran respectively. But why drop Lefties? Lucario or Heracross can keep spamming Close Combat. But they'll die fast anyway...

I think the reason certain items aren't used are because they're just not as good or consistent as the top items; Choice, Life Orb, Leftovers.
It's hard to find a good alternative item for a Defensive Pokemon. Alternative Items for sweepers, Life Orb vs Expert Belt. Defensive Mons on the other hand, have to jump between Leftovers, Lum Berry, or even Shed Shell in the case of Steel-typed ones like Skarm or Forretress. But they're not that much better than Leftovers.
Pokemon is a game you play to win, and to do that, you need to have some of the best items on some of the best pokemon. Unfortunately, it just happens that the best items are very difficult to change, and there are only so many of them.

 

[TheValkyries]

Half Power Berries are some of my favorite items ever.

<3 free set up turns.

 

[Airfoil]

I think the reason certain items aren't used are because they're just not as good or consistent as the top items; Choice, Life Orb, Leftovers.

Some Pokemon on Smogon's articles have Leftovers as a filler, with no point other than to give it something.Many Pokemon really don't need Leftovers and would benefit more from some of the items listed.



The Plates can come in handy on occasion. Giving a large boost to certain STAB attacks.

 

[Staraptor Call]

I use Sharp beak on my staraptor, which completely destroys everything with Brave Bird. On my subroost Staraptor, If I have stealth rock and spikes support, sharp beak bb staraptor ohkos so many things.

Why not just use Life Orb? Life Orb boosts all of Staraptor's attacks more than Sharp Beak boosts Brave Bird, and it isn't like Staraptor is going to be sticking around for very long anyway.

 

[PhredLevi]

Half Power Berries are some of my favorite items ever.

<3 free set up turns.

I do think of trying those from time to time.
I always like it when my teams are readily usable in PBR Colosseums to earn a few coupons, so when everyone's got all the good items, berries tend to get spread around to the rest.
It's fun to watch them try to put me to sleep with hypnosis, but I had a Lum Berry all the time.
I almost gave my Porygon2 Recycle for lots of lum, but I kind of needed the 4 moves he has now more.

 

[Ace Emerald]

I used a gallade with max sp def, max hp, bulk up, bigroot, and drain punch for alright success. Berries + natural gift seems like an awesome choice for one time coverage, but if you use it right with a poke with good stats, I bet you can ko. I'll have to look in to it.

 

[Zystral]

The Plates can come in handy on occasion. Giving a large boost to certain STAB attacks.

the thing about plates is that they provide the exact same boost as Sharp Beak or something else. They do a bit more damage with Fling, but come on. You could use plates on hard hitters with bad coverage, such as Scizor to feign choice band.

Fling itself is interesting actually, since Recycle+Fling actually works, although to get any sort of real interesting power you need to carry a useless item such as Iron Ball, a Fossol, a Plate or an evolution item. Life Orb musters 30 damage compared to Choice Scarf's 10 as well, so unless you also have Trick on top of that, it's going to be hard to use it viably.
And guess what - the only users of that combo are Azelf, Clefable, Deoxys, Gallade, Gardevoir, Grumpig, Hypno, Jynx, Kecleon, Medicham, Mew, Mr. Mime, Slowbro/King and Uxie. Out of that list, Azelf, Medicham and Gallade are the only usable ones for having enough base power to actually hurt something with Fling. Iron Ball screws Azelf over, Medicham has better coverage options and Gallade has stronger attacks to use. Sad.

 

[Ace Emerald]

Here's a quick set I made regarding natural gift, it might be useless but here it is.
Scizor @ occa berry
swords dance
bullet punch/bug bite
brick break
natural gift
The idea is to lure the steels that feel safe switching in on Scizor's only real offencive choices (bronzong, metagross, skamory, fortress) and catching them with a plus two base 90 (technician) fire move. Other moves and evs could be changed this is just the concept. Tell me what you think.

 

[Instinctive]

Here's a quick set I made regarding natural gift, it might be useless but here it is.
Scizor @ occa berry
swords dance
bullet punch/bug bite
brick break
natural gift
The idea is to lure the steels that feel safe switching in on Scizor's only real offencive choices (bronzong, metagross, skamory, fortress) and catching them with a plus two base 90 (technician) fire move. Other moves and evs could be changed this is just the concept. Tell me what you think.

I use close to the same set, with EVs in Atk and SDef, and occa, but with UTurn instead of Natural gift.

If one of those guys comes in, go to Magnezone. Or have a spinner and use the Forry switch-in to get up 3 SDs and sweep.

I just like the Occa because it means I can set up on stuff that things I couldn't, like Infernape or Flamethrower Bliss, and KO with BP or BB

 

[haunter]

Here's a quick set I made regarding natural gift, it might be useless but here it is.
Scizor @ occa berry
swords dance
bullet punch/bug bite
brick break
natural gift
The idea is to lure the steels that feel safe switching in on Scizor's only real offencive choices (bronzong, metagross, skamory, fortress) and catching them with a plus two base 90 (technician) fire move. Other moves and evs could be changed this is just the concept. Tell me what you think.

All of the Pkm you mentioned are already Ko'd by a +2 superpower\bug bite so occa is at best gimmick. Not to mention that things like Heatran and Infernape will ohko Scizor through the resistance berry. Life orb boosts all of your attacks and is arguably the best choice on SD Scizor.

 

[Instinctive]

All of the Pkm you mentioned are already Ko'd by a +2 superpower\bug bite so occa is at best gimmick. Not to mention that things like Heatran and Infernape will ohko Scizor through the resistance berry. Life orb boosts all of your attacks and is arguably the best choice on SD Scizor.

Being a user of SD scizor, I know the bolded simply isn't true. With investment in SDef, you still get to invest 252 in atk and can survive attacks from Infernape and the naive Heatrans and TormentTrans (I'm seeing a few more TormentTrans than usual recently).

I don't know why you would stay in on a Heatran based on the possibility of it outspeeding you the second time anyway, but staying in to get an extra SD on Nape oftentimes leads to a BP for the KO

 

[haunter]

Being a user of SD scizor, I know the bolded simply isn't true. With investment in SDef, you still get to invest 252 in atk and can survive attacks from Infernape and the naive Heatrans and TormentTrans (I'm seeing a few more TormentTrans than usual recently).

I don't know why you would stay in on a Heatran based on the possibility of it outspeeding you the second time anyway, but staying in to get an extra SD on Nape oftentimes leads to a BP for the KO

You better run some damage calcs before calling me out. For your reference, standard scarf Heatran's fire blast against standard SD Scizor carrying an occa berry: 168.1% - 197.9%. Even if the said Scizor has max SpD and HP (which basically makes it a mediocre sweeper for the lack of Atk investment): 103.5% - 122.7%.

Standard mix Ape's fire blast against standard SD Scizor: 185.8% - 219.1%. Against max HP\SpD Scizor: 115.7% - 136.6%.

So yeah, you get the point.

Mixmence's fire blast against standard SD Scizor: 141.8% - 167.4%. Against max HP\SpD: 88.4% - 104.1% (still a OHKO with SR).

 

[Instinctive]

You better run some damage calcs before calling me out. For your reference, standard scarf Heatran's fire blast against standard SD Scizor carrying an occa berry: 168.1% - 197.9%. Even if the said Scizor has max SpD and HP (which basically makes it a mediocre sweeper for the lack of Atk investment): 103.5% - 122.7%.

Standard mix Ape's fire blast against standard SD Scizor: 185.8% - 219.1%. Against max HP\SpD Scizor: 115.7% - 136.6%.

So yeah, you get the point.

Mixmence's fire blast against standard SD Scizor: 141.8% - 167.4%. Against max HP\SpD: 88.4% - 104.1% (still a OHKO with SR).

I've been assuming Flamethrower, been a while since I saw Fire Blast. And, a smentioned in my post, I haven't come up against Scarf or SpecsTran in quite some time, whereas Torment is gaining popularity with it's much weaker lava plume.

MixApe's with Fire Blast must simply not come up against me, because, again, I see Flamethrower.