1. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.
  2. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!

Amoonguss (BW2 Revamp) [QC 3/3] [GP 2/2]

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by col49, Feb 18, 2013.

  1. col49

    col49 unpolished
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    Hiya, so the old analysis for this I actually think was pretty solid (albeit a little unfair to it at points), I'd just like to reaffirm this and that, go into some more detail on some stuff, etc. Also I'm just gonna keep the Offensive set as is since its already pretty up-to-date, and the writer is a pretty chill guy ^_^

    Code:
    [I]To-Do List:[/I]
    [LIST]
    [*]Confirm slashes / optimize EVs? (idk what 56 SpA EVs are doing, and since it is still 
    losing to +2 'Tops I really never found full-on physically defensive to be optimal, 
    especially with immediate competition from Tangrowth :/) [✓]
    [*]Beef up Overview+C&C, split C&C into pre- and post-Spore (since they differ quite a bit 
    and I feel it's the best way to go about it [✓]
    [*]Control my Quality [✓]
    [*]All about words words words [✓]
    [*]GPs [✓]
    [/LIST]

    [​IMG]
    Best partnered with Cheetos

    [Overview]

    <p>Amoonguss is one of the best pivots in the RU tier, sporting impressive bulk and a handful of useful resistances as well as an excellent ability in Regenerator, which together allow it to switch in and out repeatedly without much support. Its movepool, while fairly shallow, is tailored to this role perfectly, and in particular contains the coveted Spore. Between these attributes, Amoonguss is capable of taking on a variety of Pokemon, including Sceptile, Feraligatr, and Galvantula, throughout the course of a battle without much fuss.</p>

    <p>However, even with all the positive attributes Amoonguss sports, it does get held down by several notable negatives. Amoonguss's low Speed and mediocre Special Attack make it extremely exploitable by a variety of offensive threats after Spore has put something to sleep. Even with Spore available, sleep is a status that is highly prepared for in RU, with nearly every team utilizing any of a Sap Sipper or Vital Spirit user, a Choice user carrying Sleep Talk, Lum Berry sweepers that can take out Amoonguss after a boost, Heal Bell support, or some combination of these to prevent Amoonguss from simply using Spore and incapacitating a Pokemon for the rest of the match. What's more, Amoonguss faces direct competition from its Grass-type cousin Tangrowth, which likewise has access to Regenerator and its own sleep move, while sporting better physical bulk, higher offensive stats, and coverage moves that can better deter common sleep absorbers from switching in for free. While Amoonguss can be a very effective multi-purpose pivot, it must be used with caution in order to avoid being exploited by a metagame well prepared for what it aims to accomplish.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Pivot
    move 1: Spore
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Clear Smog / Sludge Bomb
    move 4: Stun Spore / Synthesis / Hidden Power Fire
    item: Black Sludge
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Calm
    evs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 52 SpA / 116 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Due to Amoonguss's respectable overall bulk, good defensive typing, and access to Regenerator, it can take on a variety of offensive Pokemon, both physical and special. Spore is a huge draw for Amoonguss, allowing it to cripple any Pokemon unless the opponent carries a Vital Spirit or Sap Sipper user. Giga Drain provides Amoonguss with a moderately powerful STAB attack that also recovers HP, letting it comfortably take on Water-types such as Feraligatr and Lanturn. With Clear Smog, Amoonguss can neutralize stat boosts and hit Grass-types for reasonable damage, allowing it to effectively check an assortment of boosting Grass-, Fighting-, and Water-type Pokemon. On the other hand, Sludge Bomb, while no longer letting Amoonguss indefinitely combat certain boosting sweepers, provides a more powerful secondary STAB. This allows Amoonguss to not only better take on Pokemon such as Substitute + Bulk Up Gallade, but also better threaten incoming Fire-types such as Moltres and Entei, especially with Sludge Bomb's high poison rate. The final move is largely influenced by individual needs. Stun Spore gives Amoonguss a secondary status move to cripple faster Pokemon after Spore has been used, as well as Pokemon unfazed by Spore. Synthesis eases the strain on Regenerator for recovery, allowing Amoonguss to better take on powerful off-the-bat attackers such as Galvantula. Lastly, Hidden Power Fire is an option to hit incoming Steel-types fairly hard, most notably 2HKOing Escavalier and OHKOing Durant, two common switch-ins to Amoonguss.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>With the given EV spread, Amoonguss capably takes on physically and specially attacking Pokemon alike, ensuring it is never 2HKOed by Lilligant's Hidden Power Fire or OHKOed by Sceptile's Flying Gem-boosted Acrobatics among other things, and letting it effectively take on most Water- and Grass-types in the tier. The Special Attack investment allows Amoonguss to consistently 3HKO Qwilfish and 2HKO Ferroseed after Stealth Rock damage with the appropriate attack, limiting the amount of entry hazards they can set up. However, Amoonguss's EVs are incredibly flexible, so don't hesitate to alter the EVs to tailor them to your team's individual needs. Between Regenerator, Giga Drain, and perhaps even Synthesis, Amoonguss isn't exactly hard-pressed for recovery, so Rocky Helmet can be utilized to punish zealous physical attackers, wearing down Pokemon such as Feraligatr and Hitmonlee.</p>

    <p>Though Amoonguss is rather self-sufficient, certain Pokemon can help ease its duties. Water-types offer good synergy with Amoonguss, both defensively and offensively. Offensive Water-types such as Crawdaunt and Kabutops appreciate Amoonguss's ability to check Grass-types that prevent their sweep, and Slowking and Alomomola can both form an effective Regenerator core with it to take on a variety of threats. Rock-types such as Rhydon and Regirock help combat Fire- and Flying-type Pokemon for Amoonguss and provide Stealth Rock support to wear down Pokemon such as Entei.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive
    move 1: Spore
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Sludge Bomb
    move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ground
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Modest
    evs: 240 HP / 16 Def / 252 SpA

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Though commonly regarded as a defensive pivot, Amoonguss has a respectable base 85 Special Attack and access to Regenerator, which allow it to serve as a surprisingly versatile tank. While initially appearing outclassed by the very similar Tangrowth, which has higher physical bulk, Special Attack, and Speed than Amoonguss, the latter has certain traits that allow it to remain useful. Spore is the first of these traits and a natural choice for any Amoonguss set, as being able to incapacitate a single Pokemon with perfect accuracy is a great improvement over Tangrowth's sometimes-shaky Sleep Powder. In addition, its Poison typing and superior special bulk make Amoonguss preferred over Tangrowth against dangerous Grass- and Electric-types, such as Sceptile, Lilligant, and Rotom, while also better handling Bug-types, such as Accelgor, in a pinch. Giga Drain provides Amoonguss with a moderately powerful STAB attack with the added benefit of recovering lost HP, mitigating damage from Life Orb recoil and attacks aimed at it. STAB Sludge Bomb provides respectable neutral coverage alongside Giga Drain, hitting Grass-, Dragon-, Flying-, Fire-, and Bug-types that might otherwise switch in fearlessly. Moreover, Sludge Bomb is capable of hitting common Sap Sipper users, such as Bouffalant and Sawsbuck, that try to switch into Spore or Giga Drain, severely hurting the former and OHKOing the latter. Hidden Power Fire rounds out Amoonguss's coverage, hitting Steel-types hard, preventing Pokemon such as Escavalier and Klinklang from switching in for free after a Pokemon has been put to sleep, and letting Amoonguss switch into Ferroseed and beat it. Hidden Power Ground, while leaving Amoonguss vulnerable to Escavalier and to an extent Durant and Ferroseed, allows Amoonguss to hit Poison-types, most notably Drapion, hard.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>With the given EV spread, Amoonguss seeks to maximize its offensive presence and ability to sponge hits while minimizing damage taken from Life Orb. While a Life Orb is preferred to supplement Amoonguss's moderate Special Attack and Regenerator generally keeps it healthy anyway, Black Sludge can be used to enhance Amoonguss's survivability. Stun Spore can ease prediction, crippling incoming Pokemon and reducing their Speed and even allowing Amoonguss to outpace them in the proceeding turn. Though access to Regenerator and generally solid overall bulk make Amoonguss a fairly self-sufficient Pokemon, certain teammates can be used to improve its overall performance. Hard-hitting Water-types such as Slowking and Kabutops are very capable of switching into Fire-type attacks aimed at Amoonguss which in turn switches into Electric- and Grass-types aimed at them, with Slowking forming a potent Regenerator core. Bulky Rock-types such as Rhydon are also very useful partners, being able to support Amoonguss with Stealth Rock, checking physically oriented Fire- and Flying-types such as Entei and Braviary, and luring in Water-, Grass-, and Fighting-type attacks for Amoonguss to switch into.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Amoonguss makes for a respectable Rain Dance user, as its solid bulk and good synergy with Water-type Swift Swim users, as well as its ability to use Damp Rock to good effect thanks to Regenerator passively healing it, give it quite a few opportunities to set up rain. Body Slam can be utilized over Stun Spore in order to possibly paralyze Bouffalant and other Sap Sipper users, though its usefulness doesn't extend beyond this. Similarly, Toxic offers Amoonguss the ability to put defensive switch-ins such as Cryogonal on a timer, which can prove more useful than Stun Spore against more defensive teams. Lastly, Substitute allows Amoonguss to use Spore more conservatively while also preventing it from being scared out by strong attacks as quickly.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>The task of taking on Amoonguss is largely determined by whether or not it has put something to sleep yet. Magmortar can switch in with near impunity thanks to Vital Spirit and threaten Amoonguss with powerful attacks. Sap Sipper Pokemon, most notably Bouffalant, can capitalize on Amoonguss's Grass-type attacks to net an Attack boost and, in Bouffalant's case, threaten it with a powerful Head Charge. Sleep Talk users such as Entei, Escavalier, and Emboar can absorb sleep well and proceed to threaten Amoonguss with their powerful STAB attacks. Lum Berry sweepers such as Swords Dance Gallade and Absol, while not immediately threatening Amoonguss, are capable of setting up on it as it attempts to inflict them with status in vain and KO it in the proceeding turn. However, these Pokemon should remain wary of offensive variants of Amoonguss, which can pressure most Lum Berry carriers with Life Orb-boosted Sludge Bombs. Roselia is capable of switching into Amoonguss with near impunity due to Natural Cure and set up Spikes on it.</p>

    <p>After Spore has put an opposing Pokemon to sleep, a lot more Pokemon can check or counter Amoonguss. Steel-types such as Aggron and Klinklang can switch in and potentially set up on Amoonguss thanks to an immunity to Clear Smog, though they must be wary of Stun Spore in doing so. Fire-types such as Moltres and Typhlosion have little trouble switching in on anything in Amoonguss's arsenal barring Stun Spore and Life Orb-boosted Sludge Bombs and can proceed to OHKO with their powerful STAB attacks. Moreover, Pokemon with good special bulk and Substitute such as Substitute + Bulk Up Gallade and Substitute + Calm Mind Uxie can safely set up all over Amoonguss, avoiding both Clear Smog and Stun Spore.</p>
  2. col49

    col49 unpolished
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    Okie, I guess I already had a pretty solid grasp on Amoonguss, so I didn't really have to do much testing '~' Anywho, QC can feel free to give this a go-over if they want.
  3. tehy

    tehy

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2010
    Messages:
    1,399
    The second set has no ability listed, might want to take care of that real quick
  4. col49

    col49 unpolished
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    oh derp, thanks for the catch :x
  5. Oglemi

    Oglemi it's me heysup's gay friend, the legendary gaysup
    is a Tournament Directoris a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
    C&C Leader

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2009
    Messages:
    8,257
    OK, I played around for about 20 battles with Amoonguss today and I think I have a better EV spread

    252 HP / 88 Def / 52 SpA / 116 SpD with a Calm nature gives you a really nice spread that does a couple things. It lets you avoid the 2HKO from +0 Lilligant's HP Fire after Stealth Rock, which should be a major goal Amoonguss does for the team. It also avoids the OHKO from +0 Flying Gem Acrobatics from Sceptile and Spore it out or finish it off with Clear Smog/Sludge Bomb. Amoonguss's main niche is that it is one of the best Grass-type counters in the tier and this spread lets it accomplish that along with being a great counter to most Water-types. There's no point in investing in either defense anymore since you don't avoid any other KOs either way from stuff like Feraligatr. Not getting OHKOed by stuff like CB Esca or Durant isn't that big of an accomplishment since Amoonguss should be trying to counter stuff, not just barely survive and then get outspeed or Taunted or switched out on or what have you. You can't really "pivot" if you can't switch into stuff with confidence.

    You can either invest the rest of the EVs into Special Attack or Speed. I never found myself wishing I had Speed since Slowking is going to beat you in most cases anyway (high Fire Blast and Psyshock) and you beat Spiritomb most of the time anyway unless it's CroTomb. The SpA also ensure the 3HKO on Qwilfish and Steelix with Giga Drain iirc, as well as the 2HKO on Ferroseed with HP Fire, both after Stealth Rock.

    I would give a mention to offensive Water-types as teammates more so than defensive ones since any defensive core centered around that is just annihilated by Nidoqueen and requires Uxie as a teammate then. Crawdaunt in particular I found is a fantastic teammate since Amoonguss just shits all over Tangrowth, Lilligant, and Ferroseed (with HP Fire for the latter), and can switch into a large variety of stuff should come down to it.

    btw the team I was using was Amoonguss / DD Daunt / Scarf Emboar / CB Tomb / 252 SpA Uxie / Mixed Druddi. Amoonguss just fit right in and is overall a great asset as a pivot.

    Make my change to the EV spread and consider this

    [qc]1/3[/qc]
  6. col49

    col49 unpolished
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    Alrighty, done and done, thanks Oglemi n_n
  7. Molk

    Molk tfw zoroark
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Smogon IRC AOPis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    RU Leader

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2011
    Messages:
    3,305
    I'd slash Sludge Bomb with Clear Smog, of course having a pseudo hazing move is nice but from my experience Amoonguss needs all the power it can get, in particular it makes it much easier for Amoonguss to eliminate tangrowth from the match, something Clear Smog just isnt powerful enough to accomplish.

    I'd also mention Alomomola as a potential teammate, that core was pretty common while Amoonguss was still in NU, they form a nice regenerator core together, beating most of what the other cant handle for the most part, and wish is always useful even though Amoonguss doesnt need it as much as say Druddigon or Roselia due to regenerator.

    make these changes and consider this

    QC approved 2/3
  8. col49

    col49 unpolished
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    Ok, gotcha, thanks Molk :>

    I'll get stuff written up soon (i'd like to say wednesday)
  9. col49

    col49 unpolished
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    Ok, so I was a little off on that estimate, whoops '~' Anywho, this is finally written up and ready for a final look-over by QC. Also, to confirm this, I did decide to slash HP Fire over Ground on the offensive set, since Durant and Escavalier are much more metagame-relevant than Drapion anyway :P
  10. SilentVerse

    SilentVerse Into the New World
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Past SPL Winner
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2009
    Messages:
    923
    [qc]3/3[/qc]
  11. col49

    col49 unpolished
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    Cool beans, thanks SV =)
    GP me!
  12. tehy

    tehy

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2010
    Messages:
    1,399
    Not really much to say here, nice job

    add blue remove red comments below
    Show Hide

    [Overview]

    <p>Amoonguss is one of the best pivots in the RU tier, sporting impressive bulk and a handful of useful resistances as well as an excellent ability in Regenerator, all of which allow him to switch in and out numerous times without much support. Its movepool, while fairly shallow, is tailorsed to this role perfectly, including the coveted Spore. Between these attributes, Amoonguss is capable of taking on a variety of Pokemon, including Sceptile, Feraligatr, and Galvantula, for extended periods of time without much fuss.</p>

    <p>However, even with all the positive attributes Amoonguss sports, it does get held down by several notable negatives. Amoonguss's low Speed and only mediocre special attack lead it to become extremely exploitable by a variety of offensive threats after Spore has been successful usedput something to sleep. Even with Spore available, sleep is a status that is highly prepared for in RU, with nearly every team utilizing either a Sap Sipper or Vital Spirit user or a Choice user carrying Sleep Talk, Lum Berry sweepers that can take out Amoonguss after a boost, Heal Bell support, or some combination of the threse to prevent Amoonguss from simply using Spore and incapacitating a pokemon for the match. What's more, Amoonguss faces direct competition from its Grass-type cousin Tangrowth, who sports better physical bulk and higher offensive stats, as well as coverage moves that can better deter common sleep absorbers from switching in for free. While Amoonguss can be a very effective multi-purpose pivot, it must be used with caution in order to avoid being exploited by a metagame well-prepared for what it aims to accomplish.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Pivot
    move 1: Spore
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Clear Smog / Sludge Bomb
    move 4: Stun Spore / Synthesis / Hidden Power Fire
    item: Black Sludge
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Calm
    evs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 52 SpA / 116 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Due to Amoonguss' respectable overall bulk, good defensive typing, and access to Regenerator, it is capable of taking on a variety of offensive pokemon, both physical and special. Spore is a huge draw offor Amoonguss's, allowing it to cripple any Pokemon for an extensive period of time unless the opponent carries a Vital Spirit or Sap Sipper userPokemon. Giga Drain provides Amoonguss with a moderately powerful STAB attack that allows it to recover HP, allowing it to comfortably take on Water-types such as Feraligatr and Lanturn. Clear Smog allows Amoonguss to neutralize stat boosts and hit Grass-types for reasonable damage, allowing it to effetictively check an assortment of boosting Grass-, Fighting-, and Water-type Pokemon. On the other hand, Sludge Bomb, while no longer allowing Amoonguss to indefinitely combat certain boosting sweepers, provides a more powerful secondary STAB that allows it to not only better take on Pokemon such as Substitute+Bulk Up Gallade, but also better threaten incoming Fire-types such as Moltres and Entei, especially thanks to the high poison rate. The final move is largely influenced by individual needs. Stun Spore allows Amoonguss a secondary status move to cripple faster Pokemon after Spore ihas been used, or even beforeif Spore's use in wouldn't cripple the case of Sleep Talk users such as Entei and EmboarPokemon in question. Synthesis eases the strain on Regenerator for recovery, allowing Amoonguss to better take on powerful immedioff-the-bate attackers such as Galvantula. Lastly, Hidden Power Fire allows Amoonguss to hit incoming Steel-types fairly hard, most notably being able to 2HKOing Escavalier and OHKOing Durant, two common switch-ins to Amoonguss.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The given EV spread allows Amoonguss to take on physically and specially based Pokemon alike fairly well, ensuring it is never 2HKOed by Lilligant's HP Fire or OHKOed by Sceptile's Flying Gem-boosted Acrobatics, among other things, allowing it to effectively take on most of the Water- and Grass-types in the tier well. The additional Special Attack allows Amoonguss to more comfortably 3HKO Steelix and Qwilfish with Giga Drain and 2HKO Ferroseed with Hidden Power Fire with Stealth Rock damage, limiting the amount of Spikes the latter two can set up and preventing the former from simply Roaring Amoonguss out at minimal risk. However, as Amoonguss is incredibly flexible in terms of EVs, don't hesitate to alter the EVs in order to tailor them to your team's individual needs! Considering that between Regenerator, Giga Drain, and even Synthesis, Amoonguss isn't exactly hard-pressed for recovery, Rocky Helmet can be utilized to punish zealous physical attackers, wearing down Pokemon such as Feraligatr and Hitmonlee passively.</p>

    <p>Though Amoonguss is rather self-sufficient, certain Pokemon can help ease its duties. Water-types offer good synergy with Amoonguss, both defensively and offensively. Offensive Water-types such as Crawdaunt and Kabutops both appreciate Amoonguss's ability to check Grass-types that prevent their sweep, and Slowking and Alomomola can both form an effective Regenerator core with it to take on a variety of threats, though it does remain susceptible to powerful wallbreakers such as Nidoqueen. Rock-types such as Rhydon and Regirock help combat Fire- and Flying-type Pokemon for Amoonguss, while also providing Stealth Rock support to help wear down Pokemon such as Entei for Amoonguss.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive
    move 1: Spore
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Sludge Bomb
    move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ground
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Modest
    evs: 240 HP / 16 Def / 252 SpA

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Though commonly regarded as a defensive pivot, Amoonguss has a respectable base 85 Special Attack and access to Regenerator, which allow it to serve as a surprisingly versatile tank. While initially appearing outclassed by the very similar Tangrowth, which holds higher physical bulk, Special Attack, and Speed over it, Amoonguss holds certain traits that allow it to remain useful. Spore is the first of these traits and a natural choice for any Amoonguss set because being able to remove one prospective check or counter from the equation is a godsend for any Pokemon. In addition, its Poison typing, as well as superior special bulk, allows Amoonguss to better take on dangerous Grass- and Electric-types, such as Sceptile, Lilligant, and Rotom, while also being able to take on Bug-types, such as Accelgor, in a pinch. Giga Drain provides Amoonguss with a moderately powerful STAB attack with the added benefit of recovering lost HP, mitigating damage from Life Orb recoil and various attacks aimed at it. STAB Sludge Bomb provides respectable neutral coverage alongside Giga Drain, hitting Grass-, Dragon-, Flying-, Fire-, and Bug-types that might otherwise switch in easily. Moreover, Sludge Bomb is also capable of hitting common Sap Sipper users, such as Bouffalant and Sawsbuck, that try to switch into Spore or Giga Drain hard, severely hurting the former and achieving an OHKOing the latter. Hidden Power Fire rounds off Amoonguss's coverage, allowing it to hit Steel-types hard, preventing Pokemon such as Escavalier and Klinklang from switching in for free after a Pokemon has been put to sleep, while cementing Amoonguss's ability to switch into and beat Ferroseed. Hidden Power Ground, while leaving Amoonguss vulnerable to Escavalier and to an extent Durant, allows it to hit Poison-types, most notably Drapion, hard.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Amoonguss's EV spread seeks to maximize its offensive presence and ability to sponge hits, while minimizing damage taken from Life Orb. While a Life Orb is preferred for supplementing Amoonguss's moderate Special Attack, and Regenerator generally keeps it healthy, Black Sludge can be used to enhance its survivability in a game. Stun Spore is a feasible option over Hidden Power, allowing Amoonguss to cripple switch-ins even after Spore has been used. Though access to Regenerator and generally solid overall bulk make Amoonguss a fairly self-sufficient Pokemon, certain teammates can be used to improve its overall performance. Hard-hitting Water-types such as Slowking and Kabutops are very capable of switching into Fire-type attacks aimed at Amoonguss, with Slowking forming a potent Regenerator core with it. Bulky Rock-types such as Rhydon are also very useful partners, being able to support Amoonguss with Stealth Rock, checking physically oriented Fire- and Flying-types such as Entei and Braviary, and luring in Water-, Grass-, and Fighting-type attacks for Amoonguss to switch into.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Amoonguss makes for a respectable Rain Dance user, as its solid bulk and good synergy with Water-type Swift Swim users, as well as its ability to use Damp Rock to good effect thanks to Regenerator passively healing it, gives it quite a few opportunities to set it up. Body Slam can be utilized over Stun Spore in order to possibly paralysis Bouffalant and other Sap Sipper users, though its usefulness doesn't extend beyond this. Similarly, Toxic offers Amoonguss the ability to put defensive switch-ins such as Cryogonal on a timer, which can prove more useful than Stun Spore against more defensive teams. Lastly, Substitute allows Amoonguss to use its Spore more conservatively, while also preventing it from being scared out by strong attacks as immediatequickly.</p>

    [Checks & Counters]

    <p>The task of taking on Amoonguss is largely affecdetermined by whether or not it has put something to sleep yet. If it has yet to put a pokemon to sleep, Vital Spirit pVital Spirit Pokemon such as Magmortar can switch in with near impunity and threaten it with its powerful Fire STAB. Sap Sipper usersPokemon, most notably Bouffalant, can capitalize on Amoonguss's Grass-type attacks to net an Attack boost and threaten it with a powerful Head Charge. Sleep Talk users such as Entei, Escavalier, and Emboar can "absorb" sleep well and proceed to threaten Amoonguss with their power STAB attacks. Lum Berry sweepers such as Swords Dance Gallade and Absol, while not immediately threatening Amoonguss, are capable of setting up on it as it attempts to inflict them with status in vain and proceed to KO it in the proceeding turn. However, these Pokemon due to to remain wary of offensive variants of Amoonguss, who can pressure most of them with Life Orb-boosted Sludge Bombs. Roselia is capable of switching into nearly any Amoonguss with near impunity due to Natural Cure, and is capable of using Amoonguss to set up Spikes.</p>

    <p>Pri After Spore has been used, a lot more Pokemon can check Spore, counter Amoonguss. Steel-types such as Aggron and Klinklang can switch in and potentially set up on Amoonguss thanks to an immunity to Clear Smog, though they must be wary of Stun Spore in doing so. Fire-types such as Moltres and Typhlosion have very little trouble switching in on anything in Amoonguss' arsenal barring Stun Spore and Life Orb-boosted Sludge Bombs and can proceed to threaten to OHKO with their powerful STAB attacks. Moreover, Pokemon with good special bulk and Substitute such as Substitute+Bulk Up Gallade and Substitute+Calm Mind Uxie can set up all over Amoonguss fairly safely, avoiding both the hazing effects of Clear Smog and Stun Spore.</p>

    Comments: You say water-types have good synergy with Amoonguss, at least mention they take fire-type attacks and Amoonguss takes electric- and grass-type attacks please?
    For the second Checks and Counters, don't you mean after Spore??
  13. col49

    col49 unpolished
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    Geez, totally missed your check tehy, sorry :x Implemented all(?) of it haha, thanks =)
  14. GatoDelFuego

    GatoDelFuego The little hand says it's time to rock and roll
    is a Smogon Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    May 29, 2011
    Messages:
    2,827
    REMOVE CHANGE COMMENTS

    Show Hide
    [Overview]

    <p>Amoonguss is one of the best pivots in the RU tier, sporting impressive bulk and a handful of useful resistances as well as an excellent ability in Regenerator, all of which allow him it to switch in and out numerous times without much support. Its movepool, while fairly shallow, is tailored to this role perfectly, including sporting the coveted Spore. Between these attributes, Amoonguss is capable of taking on a variety of Pokemon, including Sceptile, Feraligatr, and Galvantula, for extended periods of time without much fuss.</p>

    <p>However, even with all the positive attributes Amoonguss sports, it does get held down by several notable negatives. Amoonguss's low Speed and mediocre Special Attack lead it to become extremely exploitable by a variety of offensive threats after Spore has put something to sleep. Even with Spore available, sleep is a status that is highly prepared for in RU, with nearly every team utilizing either a Sap Sipper or Vital Spirit user or a Choice user carrying Sleep Talk, Lum Berry sweepers that can take out Amoonguss after a boost, Heal Bell support, or some combination of these to prevent Amoonguss from simply using Spore and incapacitating a Pokemon for the match. What's more, Amoonguss faces direct competition from its Grass-type cousin Tangrowth, which sports better physical bulk and higher offensive stats, (RC) as well as coverage moves that can better deter common sleep absorbers from switching in for free. While Amoonguss can be a very effective multi-purpose pivot, it must be used with caution in order to avoid being exploited by a metagame well prepared for what it aims to accomplish.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Pivot
    move 1: Spore
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Clear Smog / Sludge Bomb
    move 4: Stun Spore / Synthesis / Hidden Power Fire
    item: Black Sludge
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Calm
    evs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 52 SpA / 116 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Due to Amoonguss's respectable overall bulk, good defensive typing, and access to Regenerator, (AC) it is capable of taking on a variety of offensive pokemon, both physical and special. Spore is a huge draw for Amoonguss, allowing it to cripple any Pokemon for an extensive period of time unless the opponent carries a Vital Spirit or Sap Sipper user. Giga Drain provides Amoonguss with a moderately powerful STAB attack that allows it to recover HP, allowing letting it to comfortably take on Water-types such as Feraligatr and Lanturn. Clear Smog allows Amoonguss to neutralize stat boosts and hit Grass-types for reasonable damage, allowing it to effectively check an assortment of boosting Grass-, Fighting-, and Water-type Pokemon. On the other hand, Sludge Bomb, while no longer allowing Amoonguss to indefinitely combat certain boosting sweepers, provides a more powerful secondary STAB. This that allows it Amoonguss to not only better take on Pokemon such as Substitute+Bulk Up Gallade, but also better threaten incoming Fire-types such as Moltres and Entei, especially thanks to the high poison rate. The final move is largely influenced by individual needs. Stun Spore allows Amoonguss a secondary status move to cripple faster Pokemon after Spore has been used, or if Spore wouldn't cripple the Pokemon in question. Synthesis eases the strain on Regenerator for recovery, allowing Amoonguss to better take on powerful off-the-bat attackers such as Galvantula. Lastly, Hidden Power Fire allows Amoonguss to hit incoming Steel-types fairly hard, most notably 2HKOing Escavalier and OHKOing Durant, two common switch-ins to Amoonguss.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The given EV spread allows Amoonguss to take on physically and specially based Pokemon alike fairly well, ensuring it is never 2HKOed by Lilligant's HP Fire or OHKOed by Sceptile's Flying Gem-boosted Acrobatics, (RC) among other things, allowing it to effectively take on most of the Water- and Grass-types in the tier well. The additional Special Attack allows Amoonguss to more comfortably 3HKO Steelix and Qwilfish with Giga Drain and 2HKO Ferroseed with Hidden Power Fire with Stealth Rock damage, limiting the amount of Spikes the latter two can set up and preventing the former from simply Roaring phazing Amoonguss out at minimal risk. However, as Amoonguss is incredibly flexible in terms of EVs, don't hesitate to alter the EVs to tailor them to your team's individual needs. This is a pretty personal change, but I don't really view that sentence as something to get really excited about Considering that between Regenerator, Giga Drain, and even Synthesis, (AC) Amoonguss isn't exactly hard-pressed for recovery, so Rocky Helmet can be utilized to punish zealous physical attackers, wearing down Pokemon such as Feraligatr and Hitmonlee.</p>

    <p>Though Amoonguss is rather self-sufficient, certain Pokemon can help ease its duties. Water-types offer good synergy with Amoonguss, both defensively and offensively. Offensive Water-types such as Crawdaunt and Kabutops appreciate Amoonguss's ability to check Grass-types that prevent their sweep, and Slowking and Alomomola can both form an effective Regenerator core with it to take on a variety of threats. Rock-types such as Rhydon and Regirock help combat Fire- and Flying-type Pokemon for Amoonguss, while also providing Stealth Rock support to help wear down Pokemon such as Entei.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive
    move 1: Spore
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Sludge Bomb
    move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ground
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Modest
    evs: 240 HP / 16 Def / 252 SpA

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Though commonly regarded as a defensive pivot, Amoonguss has a respectable base 85 Special Attack and access to Regenerator, which allow it to serve as a surprisingly versatile tank. While initially appearing outclassed by the very similar Tangrowth, which holds higher physical bulk, Special Attack, and Speed over it, Amoonguss holds has certain traits that allow it to remain useful. Spore is the first of these traits and a natural choice for any Amoonguss set, (AC) because being able to remove one prospective check or counter from the equation is a godsend for any Pokemon. In addition, its Poison typing, as well as superior special bulk, allows Amoonguss to better take on dangerous Grass- and Electric-types, such as Sceptile, Lilligant, and Rotom, while also being able to take on Bug-types, such as Accelgor, in a pinch. Giga Drain provides Amoonguss with a moderately powerful STAB attack with the added benefit of recovering lost HP, mitigating damage from Life Orb recoil and various attacks aimed at it. STAB Sludge Bomb provides respectable neutral coverage alongside Giga Drain, hitting Grass-, Dragon-, Flying-, Fire-, and Bug-types that might otherwise switch in easily. Moreover, Sludge Bomb is also capable of hitting common Sap Sipper users, such as Bouffalant and Sawsbuck, that try to switch into Spore or Giga Drain, severely hurting the former and OHKOing the latter. Hidden Power Fire rounds off Amoonguss's coverage, allowing it to hit Steel-types hard, preventing Pokemon such as Escavalier and Klinklang from switching in for free after a Pokemon has been put to sleep, while cementing Amoonguss's ability to switch into and beat Ferroseed. Hidden Power Ground, while leaving Amoonguss vulnerable to Escavalier and to an extent Durant, allows it Amoonguss to hit Poison-types, most notably Drapion, hard.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Amoonguss's EV spread seeks to maximize its offensive presence and ability to sponge hits, (RC) while minimizing damage taken from Life Orb. While a Life Orb is preferred for supplementing Amoonguss's moderate Special Attack and Regenerator generally keeps it healthy, Black Sludge can be used to enhance its Amoonguss's survivability. Stun Spore is a feasible option over Hidden Power, allowing Amoonguss to cripple switch-ins even after Spore has been used. Though access to Regenerator and generally solid overall bulk make Amoonguss a fairly self-sufficient Pokemon, certain teammates can be used to improve its overall performance. Hard-hitting Water-types such as Slowking and Kabutops are very capable of switching into Fire-type attacks aimed at Amoonguss who which in turn switches into Electric- and Grass-types aimed at them, with Slowking forming a potent Regenerator core with it. Bulky Rock-types such as Rhydon are also very useful partners, being able to support Amoonguss with Stealth Rock, checking physically oriented Fire- and Flying-types such as Entei and Braviary, and luring in Water-, Grass-, and Fighting-type attacks for Amoonguss to switch into.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Amoonguss makes for a respectable Rain Dance user, as its solid bulk and good synergy with Water-type Swift Swim users, as well as its ability to use Damp Rock to good effect thanks to Regenerator passively healing it, gives it quite a few opportunities to set it up. Body Slam can be utilized over Stun Spore in order to possibly paralyze Bouffalant and other Sap Sipper users, though its usefulness doesn't extend beyond this. Similarly, Toxic offers Amoonguss the ability to put defensive switch-ins such as Cryogonal on a timer, which can prove more useful than Stun Spore against more defensive teams. Lastly, Substitute allows Amoonguss to use its Spore more conservatively, (RC) while also preventing it from being scared out by strong attacks as quickly.</p>

    [Checks & Counters]

    <p>The task of taking on Amoonguss is largely determined by whether or not it has put something to sleep yet. Vital Spirit Pokemon such as Magmortar can switch in with near impunity and threaten it Amoonguss with its powerful Fire STAB. Sap Sipper Pokemon, most notably Bouffalant, can capitalize on Amoonguss's Grass-type attacks to net an Attack boost and, in Boffulant's case, threaten it with a powerful Head Charge. Sleep Talk users such as Entei, Escavalier, and Emboar can "absorb" sleep well and proceed to threaten Amoonguss with their powerful STAB attacks. Lum Berry sweepers such as Swords Dance Gallade and Absol, while not immediately threatening Amoonguss, are capable of setting up on it as it attempts to inflict them with status in vain and proceed to KO it in the proceeding turn. However, these Pokemon due to to should remain wary of offensive variants of Amoonguss, who which can pressure most of them with Life Orb-boosted Sludge Bombs. Roselia is capable of switching into nearly any Amoonguss with near impunity due to Natural Cure, (RC) and is capable of using Amoonguss to set up Spikes.</p>

    <p>After Spore has been used, a lot more Pokemon can check or counter Amoonguss. Steel-types such as Aggron and Klinklang can switch in and potentially set up on Amoonguss thanks to an immunity to Clear Smog, though they must be wary of Stun Spore in doing so. Fire-types such as Moltres and Typhlosion have very little trouble switching in on anything in Amoonguss's arsenal barring Stun Spore and Life Orb-boosted Sludge Bombs and can proceed to threaten to OHKO with their powerful STAB attacks. Moreover, Pokemon with good special bulk and Substitute such as Substitute+Bulk Up Gallade and Substitute+Calm Mind Uxie can set up all over Amoonguss fairly safely, avoiding both Clear Smog and Stun Spore.</p>


    [gp]1/2[/gp]
  15. col49

    col49 unpolished
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    Implemented, thanks GatoDelFuego =)
  16. relaunched

    relaunched

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2012
    Messages:
    299
    additions deletions comments

    There was a whole lot to change, so I will wait to see the changes and then comment once more before stamping the check.

    Show Hide
    [Overview]

    <p>Amoonguss is one of the best pivots in the RU tier, sporting impressive bulk and a handful of useful resistances as well as an excellent ability in Regenerator, all of which together allow it to switch in and out numerous times repeatedly without much support. Its movepool, while fairly shallow, is tailored to this role perfectly, sporting containing the coveted Spore. Between these attributes, Amoonguss is capable of taking on a variety of Pokemon, including Sceptile, Feraligatr, and Galvantula, for extended periods of time throughout the course of a battle without much fuss.</p>

    <p>However, even with all the positive attributes Amoonguss sports, it does get held down by several notable negatives. Amoonguss's low Speed and mediocre Special Attack lead make it to become extremely exploitable by a variety of offensive threats after Spore has put something to sleep. Even with Spore available, sleep is a status that is highly prepared for in RU, with nearly every team utilizing either a Sap Sipper or Vital Spirit user or a Choice user carrying Sleep Talk, Lum Berry sweepers that can take out Amoonguss after a boost, Heal Bell support, or some combination of these to prevent Amoonguss from simply using Spore and incapacitating a Pokemon for the rest of the match. What's more, Amoonguss faces direct competition from its Grass-type cousin Tangrowth, which likewise has access to Regenerator and its own sleep move, sports while sporting better physical bulk and (AC) higher offensive stats as well as and coverage moves that can better deter common sleep absorbers from switching in for free. While Amoonguss can be a very effective multi-purpose pivot, it must be used with caution in order to avoid being exploited by a metagame well prepared for what it aims to accomplish.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Pivot
    move 1: Spore
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Clear Smog / Sludge Bomb
    move 4: Stun Spore / Synthesis / Hidden Power Fire
    item: Black Sludge
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Calm
    evs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 52 SpA / 116 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Due to Amoonguss's respectable overall bulk, good defensive typing, and access to Regenerator, it is capable of taking can take on a variety of offensive pokemon, both physical and special. Spore is a huge draw for Amoonguss, allowing it to cripple any Pokemon for an extensive period of time unless the opponent carries a Vital Spirit or Sap Sipper user. Giga Drain provides Amoonguss with a moderately powerful STAB attack that allows it to recovers HP, letting it comfortably take on Water-types such as Feraligatr and Lanturn. With Clear Smog (AC) allows Amoonguss to can neutralize stat boosts and hit Grass-types for reasonable damage, allowing it to effectively check an assortment of boosting Grass-, Fighting-, and Water-type Pokemon. On the other hand, Sludge Bomb, while no longer allowing letting Amoonguss to indefinitely combat certain boosting sweepers, provides a more powerful secondary STAB. This allows Amoonguss to not only better take on Pokemon such as Substitute+Bulk Up Gallade, but also better threaten incoming Fire-types such as Moltres and Entei, especially thanks to the with Sludge Bomb's high poison rate. The final move is largely influenced by individual needs. Stun Spore allows gives Amoonguss a secondary status move to cripple faster Pokemon after Spore has been used, or if Spore wouldn't cripple the Pokemon in question as well as Pokemon unfazed by Spore. Synthesis eases the strain on Regenerator for recovery, allowing Amoonguss to better take on powerful off-the-bat attackers such as Galvantula. Lastly, Hidden Power Fire allows Amoonguss is an option to hit incoming Steel-types fairly hard, most notably 2HKOing Escavalier and OHKOing Durant, two common switch-ins to Amoonguss.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The With the given EV spread allows (AC) Amoonguss to capably takes on physically and specially based attacking Pokemon alike fairly well, ensuring it is never 2HKOed by Lilligant's unboosted HP Fire or OHKOed by Sceptile's Flying Gem-boosted Acrobatics among other things, allowing it to and letting it effectively take on most of the Water- and Grass-types in the tier well. The additional Special Attack investment allows Amoonguss to more comfortably 3HKO Steelix and Qwilfish with Giga Drain and 2HKO Ferroseed with Hidden Power Fire with Stealth Rock damage, limiting the amount number of Spikes the latter two can set up and preventing the former from simply phazing Amoonguss out at minimal risk. (The whole preceding sentence is too vague and inaccurate. What does "comfortably" mean? According to my calculations, standard Steelix is almost never 3HKOed by Giga Drain, even if switching in to Giga Drain and stepping on Stealth Rock, while Qwilfish is almost always 3HKOed from full health without switching in. Does "Stealth Rock damage" pertain to just Ferroseed or Steelix and Qwilfish as well? You have to make this all as clear as a bell.) However, as Amoonguss is incredibly flexible in terms of EVs Amoonguss's EVs are incredibly flexible, so don't hesitate to alter the EVs to tailor them to your team's individual needs. Considering that bBetween Regenerator, Giga Drain, and perhaps even Synthesis, Amoonguss isn't exactly hard-pressed for recovery, so Rocky Helmet can be utilized to punish zealous physical attackers, wearing down Pokemon such as Feraligatr and Hitmonlee.</p>

    <p>Though Amoonguss is rather self-sufficient, certain Pokemon can help ease its duties. Water-types offer good synergy with Amoonguss, both defensively and offensively. Offensive Water-types such as Crawdaunt and Kabutops appreciate Amoonguss's ability to check Grass-types that prevent their sweep, and Slowking and Alomomola can both form an effective Regenerator core with it to take on a variety of threats. Rock-types such as Rhydon and Regirock help combat Fire- and Flying-type Pokemon for Amoonguss, (RC) also providing and provide Stealth Rock support to help wear down Pokemon such as Entei.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive
    move 1: Spore
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Sludge Bomb
    move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ground
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Modest
    evs: 240 HP / 16 Def / 252 SpA

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Though commonly regarded as a defensive pivot, Amoonguss has a respectable base 85 Special Attack and access to Regenerator, which allow it to serve as a surprisingly versatile tank. While initially appearing outclassed by the very similar Tangrowth, which holds has higher physical bulk, Special Attack, and Speed over it Amoonguss, Amoonguss the latter has certain traits that allow it to remain useful. Spore is the first of these traits and a natural choice for any Amoonguss set, because being able to remove one prospective check or counter from the equation is a godsend for any Pokemon. (The preceding sentence doesn't work -- it suggests that Tangrowth doesn't have a sleep move. Rework this sentence to instead emphasize Spore's better accuracy than Sleep Powder as Amoonguss's advantage.) In addition, its Poison typing, as well as and superior special bulk, (RC) allows Amoonguss to better take on is preferred to Tangrowth against dangerous Grass- and Electric-types, such as Sceptile, Lilligant, and Rotom, while also being able to take on better handling Bug-types, such as Accelgor, in a pinch. Giga Drain provides Amoonguss with a moderately powerful STAB attack with the added benefit of recovering lost HP, mitigating damage from Life Orb recoil and various attacks aimed at it. STAB Sludge Bomb provides respectable neutral coverage alongside Giga Drain, hitting Grass-, Dragon-, Flying-, Fire-, and Bug-types that might otherwise switch in easily fearlessly. Moreover, Sludge Bomb is also capable of hitting common Sap Sipper users, such as Bouffalant and Sawsbuck, that try to switch into Spore or Giga Drain, severely hurting the former and OHKOing the latter. Hidden Power Fire rounds off out Amoonguss's coverage, allowing it to hit hitting Steel-types hard, preventing Pokemon such as Escavalier and Klinklang from switching in for free after a Pokemon has been put to sleep, cementing and letting Amoonguss's ability to switch into and beat Ferroseed Ferroseed and beat it. (There's no "cementing" about it, as Amoonguss otherwise can't touch Ferroseed outside of sleep.) Hidden Power Ground, while leaving Amoonguss vulnerable to Escavalier and to an extent Durant, allows Amoonguss to hit Poison-types, most notably Drapion, hard. (Isn't it inconsistent to mention Ferroseed only in the first of these sentences and Durant only in the second? If you think so, change that.)</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Amoonguss's EV spread With the given EV spread, Amoonguss seeks to maximize its offensive presence and ability to sponge hits while minimizing damage taken from Life Orb. While a Life Orb is preferred for supplementing to supplement Amoonguss's moderate Special Attack and Regenerator generally keeps it healthy anyway, Black Sludge can be used to enhance Amoonguss's survivability. Stun Spore is a feasible option over Hidden Power, allowing Amoonguss to cripple switch-ins after Spore has been used. As in the first set, Stun Spore is a feasible option over a coverage move in the last slot. (The following sentences essentially restate the partner suggestions from the first paragraph. Could you make them somehow less redundant?) Though access to Regenerator and generally solid overall bulk make Amoonguss a fairly self-sufficient Pokemon, certain teammates can be used to improve its overall performance. Hard-hitting Water-types such as Slowking and Kabutops are very capable of switching into Fire-type attacks aimed at Amoonguss which in turn switches into Electric- and Grass-types aimed at them, with Slowking forming a potent Regenerator core. Bulky Rock-types such as Rhydon are also very useful partners, being able to support Amoonguss with Stealth Rock, checking physically oriented Fire- and Flying-types such as Entei and Braviary, and luring in Water-, Grass-, and Fighting-type attacks for Amoonguss to switch into.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Amoonguss makes for a respectable Rain Dance user, as its solid bulk and good synergy with Water-type Swift Swim users, as well as its ability to use Damp Rock to good effect thanks to Regenerator passively healing it, gives it quite a few opportunities to set it up up rain. Body Slam can be utilized over Stun Spore in order to possibly paralyze Bouffalant and other Sap Sipper users, though its usefulness doesn't extend beyond this. Similarly, Toxic offers Amoonguss the ability to put defensive switch-ins such as Cryogonal on a timer, which can prove more useful than Stun Spore against more defensive teams. Lastly, Substitute allows Amoonguss to use its Spore more conservatively while also preventing it from being scared out by strong attacks as quickly.</p>

    [Checks & Counters]

    <p>The task of taking on Amoonguss is largely determined by whether or not it has put something to sleep yet. Vital Spirit Pokemon such as Magmortar can switch in with near impunity and threaten Amoonguss with its powerful Fire STAB powerful attacks. (You can't mix the generality of "such as" with the specificity of Magmortar.) Sap Sipper Pokemon, most notably Bouffalant, can capitalize on Amoonguss's Grass-type attacks to net an Attack boost and, in Bouffalant's case, threaten it with a powerful Head Charge. Sleep Talk users such as Entei, Escavalier, and Emboar can "absorb" sleep well and proceed to threaten Amoonguss with their powerful STAB attacks. Lum Berry sweepers such as Swords Dance Gallade and Absol, while not immediately threatening Amoonguss, are capable of setting up on it as it attempts to inflict them with status in vain and proceed to KO it in the proceeding turn. However, these Pokemon should to remain wary of offensive variants of Amoonguss, which can pressure most of them Lum Berry carriers with Life Orb-boosted Sludge Bombs. Roselia is capable of switching into nearly any Amoonguss with near impunity due to Natural Cure and is capable of using Amoonguss to set up Spikes setting up Spikes on it. </p>

    <p>After Spore has been used put an opposing Pokemon to sleep, a lot more Pokemon can check or counter Amoonguss. Steel-types such as Aggron and Klinklang can switch in and potentially set up on Amoonguss thanks to an immunity to Clear Smog, though they must be wary of Stun Spore in doing so. Fire-types such as Moltres and Typhlosion have very little trouble switching in on anything in Amoonguss's arsenal barring Stun Spore and Life Orb-boosted Sludge Bombs and can proceed to threaten to OHKO with their powerful STAB attacks. Moreover, Pokemon with good special bulk and Substitute such as Substitute+Bulk Up Gallade and Substitute+Calm Mind Uxie can safely set up all over Amoonguss fairly safely, avoiding both Clear Smog and Stun Spore.</p>


    Edit: Double posted, so sorry!
  17. col49

    col49 unpolished
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    Ok, sorry for taking so long relaunched, implemented :x In response to the Stun Spore bit in the second set's AC, unless I'm mistaken analyses shouldn't reference set order (in the case that the set order is changed for one reason or another), so I reworded in another manner if that's ok '~'
  18. relaunched

    relaunched

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2012
    Messages:
    299
    col49, sorry for the set order edit. I had better brush up on such things. You did a great job on this analysis, and now I have just a few tiny changes.

    deletions additions

    Show Hide
    <p>Amoonguss is one of the best pivots in the RU tier, sporting impressive bulk and a handful of useful resistances as well as an excellent ability in Regenerator, which together allow it to switch in and out repeatedly without much support. Its movepool, while fairly shallow, is tailored to this role perfectly, containing the coveted Spore. Between these attributes, Amoonguss is capable of taking on a variety of Pokemon, including Sceptile, Feraligatr, and Galvantula, throughout the course of a battle without much fuss.</p>

    <p>However, even with all the positive attributes Amoonguss sports, it does get held down by several notable negatives. Amoonguss's low Speed and mediocre Special Attack make it extremely exploitable by a variety of offensive threats after Spore has put something to sleep. Even with Spore available, sleep is a status that is highly prepared for in RU, with nearly every team utilizing either a Sap Sipper or Vital Spirit user or a Choice user carrying Sleep Talk, Lum Berry sweepers that can take out Amoonguss after a boost, Heal Bell support, or some combination of these to prevent Amoonguss from simply using Spore and incapacitating a Pokemon for the rest of the match. What's more, Amoonguss faces direct competition from its Grass-type cousin Tangrowth, which likewise has access to Regenerator and its own sleep move, while sporting better physical bulk, higher offensive stats and coverage moves that can better deter common sleep absorbers from switching in for free. While Amoonguss can be a very effective multi-purpose pivot, it must be used with caution in order to avoid being exploited by a metagame well prepared for what it aims to accomplish.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Pivot
    move 1: Spore
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Clear Smog / Sludge Bomb
    move 4: Stun Spore / Synthesis / Hidden Power Fire
    item: Black Sludge
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Calm
    evs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 52 SpA / 116 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Due to Amoonguss's respectable overall bulk, good defensive typing, and access to Regenerator, it can take on a variety of offensive pokemon, both physical and special. Spore is a huge draw for Amoonguss, allowing it to cripple any Pokemon unless the opponent carries a Vital Spirit or Sap Sipper user. Giga Drain provides Amoonguss with a moderately powerful STAB attack recovers HP, letting it comfortably take on Water-types such as Feraligatr and Lanturn. With Clear Smog, Amoonguss can neutralize stat boosts and hit Grass-types for reasonable damage, allowing it to effectively check an assortment of boosting Grass-, Fighting-, and Water-type Pokemon. On the other hand, Sludge Bomb, while no longer letting Amoonguss indefinitely combat certain boosting sweepers, provides a more powerful secondary STAB. This allows Amoonguss to not only better take on Pokemon such as Substitute+Bulk Up Gallade, but also better threaten incoming Fire-types such as Moltres and Entei, especially with Sludge Bomb's high poison rate. The final move is largely influenced by individual needs. Stun Spore gives Amoonguss a secondary status move to cripple faster Pokemon after Spore has been used, as well as Pokemon unfazed by Spore. Synthesis eases the strain on Regenerator for recovery, allowing Amoonguss to better take on powerful off-the-bat attackers such as Galvantula. Lastly, Hidden Power Fire is an option to hit incoming Steel-types fairly hard, most notably 2HKOing Escavalier and OHKOing Durant, two common switch-ins to Amoonguss.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>With the given EV spread, Amoonguss capably takes on physically and specially attacking Pokemon alike, ensuring it is never 2HKOed by Lilligant's Hidden Power Fire or OHKOed by Sceptile's Flying Gem-boosted Acrobatics among other things, and letting it effectively take on most of the Water- and Grass-types in the tier. The Special Attack investment allows Amoonguss to consistently 3HKO Qwilfish and 2HKO Ferroseed after Stealth Rock damage with the appropriate attack, limiting the amount of entry hazards they can set up. However, Amoonguss's EVs are incredibly flexible, so don't hesitate to alter the EVs to tailor them to your team's individual needs. Between Regenerator, Giga Drain, and perhaps even Synthesis, Amoonguss isn't exactly hard-pressed for recovery, so Rocky Helmet can be utilized to punish zealous physical attackers, wearing down Pokemon such as Feraligatr and Hitmonlee.</p>

    <p>Though Amoonguss is rather self-sufficient, certain Pokemon can help ease its duties. Water-types offer good synergy with Amoonguss, both defensively and offensively. Offensive Water-types such as Crawdaunt and Kabutops appreciate Amoonguss's ability to check Grass-types that prevent their sweep, and Slowking and Alomomola can both form an effective Regenerator core with it to take on a variety of threats. Rock-types such as Rhydon and Regirock help combat Fire- and Flying-type Pokemon for Amoonguss and provide Stealth Rock support to wear down Pokemon such as Entei.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive
    move 1: Spore
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Sludge Bomb
    move 4: Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ground
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Modest
    evs: 240 HP / 16 Def / 252 SpA

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Though commonly regarded as a defensive pivot, Amoonguss has a respectable base 85 Special Attack and access to Regenerator, which allow it to serve as a surprisingly versatile tank. While initially appearing outclassed by the very similar Tangrowth, which has higher physical bulk, Special Attack, and Speed over than Amoonguss, the latter has certain traits that allow it to remain useful. Spore is the first of these traits and a natural choice for any Amoonguss set, as being able to incapacitate a single Pokemon with perfect accuracy is a great improvement over Tangrowth's shaky Sleep Powder. In addition, its Poison typing and superior special bulk make Amoonguss is preferred to Tangrowth against dangerous Grass- and Electric-types, such as Sceptile, Lilligant, and Rotom, while also better handling Bug-types, such as Accelgor, in a pinch. Giga Drain provides Amoonguss with a moderately powerful STAB attack with the added benefit of recovering lost HP, mitigating damage from Life Orb recoil and attacks aimed at it. STAB Sludge Bomb provides respectable neutral coverage alongside Giga Drain, hitting Grass-, Dragon-, Flying-, Fire-, and Bug-types that might otherwise switch in fearlessly. Moreover, Sludge Bomb is capable of hitting common Sap Sipper users, such as Bouffalant and Sawsbuck, that try to switch into Spore or Giga Drain, severely hurting the former and OHKOing the latter. Hidden Power Fire rounds out Amoonguss's coverage, hitting Steel-types hard, preventing Pokemon such as Escavalier and Klinklang from switching in for free after a Pokemon has been put to sleep, and letting Amoonguss's switch into Ferroseed and beat it. Hidden Power Ground, while leaving Amoonguss vulnerable to Escavalier and to an extent Durant and Ferrosed, allows Amoonguss to hit Poison-types, most notably Drapion, hard.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>With the given EV spread, Amoonguss seeks to maximize its offensive presence and ability to sponge hits while minimizing damage taken from Life Orb. While a Life Orb is preferred to supplement Amoonguss's moderate Special Attack and Regenerator generally keeps it healthy anyway, Black Sludge can be used to enhance Amoonguss's survivability. Stun Spore can ease prediction, crippling incoming Pokemon and reducing their Speed and even allowing Amoonguss to outpace them in the proceeding turn. Though access to Regenerator and generally solid overall bulk make Amoonguss a fairly self-sufficient Pokemon, certain teammates can be used to improve its overall performance. Hard-hitting Water-types such as Slowking and Kabutops are very capable of switching into Fire-type attacks aimed at Amoonguss which in turn switches into Electric- and Grass-types aimed at them, with Slowking forming a potent Regenerator core. Bulky Rock-types such as Rhydon are also very useful partners, being able to support Amoonguss with Stealth Rock, checking physically oriented Fire- and Flying-types such as Entei and Braviary, and luring in Water-, Grass-, and Fighting-type attacks for Amoonguss to switch into.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Amoonguss makes for a respectable Rain Dance user, as its solid bulk and good synergy with Water-type Swift Swim users, as well as its ability to use Damp Rock to good effect thanks to Regenerator passively healing it, give it quite a few opportunities to set up rain. Body Slam can be utilized over Stun Spore in order to possibly paralyze Bouffalant and other Sap Sipper users, though its usefulness doesn't extend beyond this. Similarly, Toxic offers Amoonguss the ability to put defensive switch-ins such as Cryogonal on a timer, which can prove more useful than Stun Spore against more defensive teams. Lastly, Substitute allows Amoonguss to use Spore more conservatively while also preventing it from being scared out by strong attacks as quickly.</p>

    [Checks & Counters]

    <p>The task of taking on Amoonguss is largely determined by whether or not it has put something to sleep yet. Magmortar can switch in with near impunity thanks to Vital Spirit and threaten Amoonguss with powerful attacks. Sap Sipper Pokemon, most notably Bouffalant, can capitalize on Amoonguss's Grass-type attacks to net an Attack boost and, in Bouffalant's case, threaten it with a powerful Head Charge. Sleep Talk users such as Entei, Escavalier, and Emboar can absorb sleep well and proceed to threaten Amoonguss with their powerful STAB attacks. Lum Berry sweepers such as Swords Dance Gallade and Absol, while not immediately threatening Amoonguss, are capable of setting up on it as it attempts to inflict them with status in vain and KO it in the proceeding turn. However, these Pokemon should remain wary of offensive variants of Amoonguss, which can pressure most Lum Berry carriers with Life Orb-boosted Sludge Bombs. Roselia is capable of switching into Amoonguss with near impunity due to Natural Cure setting up Spikes on it.</p>

    <p>After Spore has put an opposing Pokemon to sleep, a lot more Pokemon can check or counter Amoonguss. Steel-types such as Aggron and Klinklang can switch in and potentially set up on Amoonguss thanks to an immunity to Clear Smog, though they must be wary of Stun Spore in doing so. Fire-types such as Moltres and Typhlosion have little trouble switching in on anything in Amoonguss's arsenal barring Stun Spore and Life Orb-boosted Sludge Bombs and can proceed to OHKO with their powerful STAB attacks. Moreover, Pokemon with good special bulk and Substitute such as Substitute+Bulk Up Gallade and Substitute+Calm Mind Uxie can safely set up all over Amoonguss, avoiding both Clear Smog and Stun Spore.</p>


    [gp]2/2[/gp]
  19. col49

    col49 unpolished
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    Haha, don't worry about it, its a really minor thing considering all the help you're giving me :P Thanks for the check man, this is ready for upload whenever n_n
  20. Oglemi

    Oglemi it's me heysup's gay friend, the legendary gaysup
    is a Tournament Directoris a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
    C&C Leader

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2009
    Messages:
    8,257
    uploaded

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)