[Anything Goes] Ho-Oh [QC: 2/3][GP: 0/2][Writing]

Chloe

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NUPL Champion

so majestic~
QC: Megazard / Catalystic /
GP: /​
[OVERVIEW]

- Fairly high attack stat paired with extremely powerful STAB attacks make Ho-Oh a dominant offensive force.
- Sacred Fire's 50% burn chance allows less pressure from physical attackers, while providing extra residual damage for destroying Lugia's Multiscale and Deoxys's Focus Sash.
- In addition to this, its high defenses allow it to switch in on many offensive Pokémon with ease.
- It can act as a check for Geomancy Xerneas, as well as almost any Calm Mind Arceus forme.
- Its colossal ability Regenerator allows easy health regain as well as allowing Ho-Oh to take virtually no damage from Klefki and Darkrai, therefore providing a decent answer to both.
- However, its crippling weakness to Stealth Rock prevents it from being a god-like Pokemon.
- Due to this, it relies on hazard removal excessively, which can prevent it from functioning to its full potential.
- It is also pressured by common physical attackers like Arceus, Mega Rayquaza and Ground Arceus; only further adding to its problems.

[SET]
name: Tank
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Sacred Fire
move 3: Earthquake / Thunder Wave
move 4: Recover
item: Life Orb
ability: Regenerator
nature: Adamant
evs: 248 HP / 196 Atk / 52 SpD / 12 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

- Brave Bird is Ho-Oh's hardest hitting option, boasting 180 Base Power after STAB and an excellent offensive typing in Flying.
- Sacred Fire is another excellent move for Ho-Oh, still dealing large amounts of damage while having a 50% chance to burn the opponent. It also helps wear down defensive walls as for example, Brave Bird's damage may often not be enough to out-damage a Support Arceus using Recover excessively.
- Earthquake is a nice coverage option for Ho-Oh allowing more damage to Primal Groudon without having to worry about the recoil of Brave Bird. Earthquake also hits Zekrom and Rock-types on switch-in if staying in is the optimal play.
- Recover allows Ho-Oh to recover its health without switching, and is the superior option to Roost due to the prevalence of Earthquake within the metagame.
- Thunder Wave allows Ho-Oh to cripple offensive wallbreakers such as Geomancy Xerneas, while providing extra defensive support for Ho-Oh.

Set Details
========

- 248 HP and 52 Special Defense enable Ho-Oh to always live a +2 Xerneas Thunder.
- 12 Speed ensures Ho-Oh outspeeds Mega Diancie as it mega evolves so it can OHKO with Earthquake or possibly burn it before it can utilise its Diamond Storm.
- The remaining 196 EVs are slotted into Attack and an Adamant Nature is given to make Ho-Oh's attacks do as much damage as possible while still achieving the aforementioned goals.
- Life Orb powers up Ho-Oh's attacks even more, as the extra damage is extremely beneficial.
- An ability in Regenerator ensures Ho-Oh can gain its health back when unable to utilise Recover and has the ability to increase the longevity of this Pokemon within the match.
- Maximum Attack and Speed can be ran if Geomancy Xerneas is already taken care of by other team members.

Usage Tips
========

- Ensure Stealth Rock is not present before Ho-Oh switches in, as depleting Ho-Oh's health to half is extremely detrimental to its attacking ability especially with the heavy recoil Brave Bird and Life Orb provide.
- Account for Brave Bird and Life Orb recoil when attacking, as the damage may be enough to make Ho-Oh faint.
- Abuse Ho-Oh's ability Regenerator to its maximum potential by switching it out when low on health, or requiring usage later on. Even at low health, Ho-Oh isn't necessarily useless later on in the match.
- When one of Ho-Oh's checks is in need of being badly poisoned, paralyzed or put to sleep, ensure that Sacred Fire is used carefully and doesn't result in a burn on the opponent.
- Using Sacred Fire when anticipating a physical attacker to switch in can be extremely beneficial in the progression of the match.
- Keep Ho-Oh healthy if the opposing team has a Xerneas or Calm Mind Arceus forme still alive.

Team Options
========

- Defog users such as Giratina and Support Arceus formes such as Water Arceus, Ground Arceus and Rock Arceus all provide Ho-Oh with the hazard removal it requires.
- Ground Arceus especially, as it provides a decent answer to Rock-type moves, as well as providing optimal support through Defog.
- Pokemon with access to Magic Bounce can prevent Stealth Rock setup, allowing Ho-Oh to be ran much more freely. These include Mega Diancie and Mega Sableye.
- Primal Groudon is immune to two of Ho-Oh's weaknesses Water and Electric, while Ho-Oh is immune to Primal Groudon's only weakness in Ground. It also checks Xerneas quite well, if Ho-Oh is unable to due to Stealth Rock.
- Checks for physical attackers such as Extreme Killer Arceus and physical variants of Ground Arceus benefit Ho-Oh immensely. These include Lugia, Skarmory and Giratina.
- Primal Kyogre checks such as Ferrothorn and Primal Groudon.
- Regenerator Pokemon like Amoonguss and Alomomola can provide a core that disable SwagPlay Klefki completely, while also disabling more passive Darkrai sets.

[SET]
name: Choice Band
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Sacred Fire
move 3: Earthquake
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Choice Band
ability: Regenerator
nature: Adamant
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

- Brave Bird is Ho-Oh's main way of dealing damage, harnessing a massive Base Power of 180 after STAB as well as a great offensive typing in Flying.
- Sacred Fire offers another excellent offensive typing in Fire that allows the easy countering of Skarmory and Ferrothorn, as well as the high chance to burn the opponent. This can potentially ruin a Physical attacker's utility; however, this is exempt to Fire-type attackers, Primal Groudon and opposing Ho-Oh. Sacred Fire can also be useful in crippling defensive walls such as defensive sets of Fairy Arceus and Ground Arceus.
- Earthquake allows Ho-Oh to cripple Primal Groudon and Rock Arceus ensuring they are not able to utilize their Rock-type attacks.
- Sleep Talk allows Ho-Oh to be a great Pokemon against Darkrai without Taunt and Smeargle. However this does rely on predicting Darkrai's Dark Void and can be outstalled by spamming Substitute.

Set Details
========

- An Adamant nature paired with maximum Attack and Speed allow Ho-Oh to rip through many defensive walls such as Support Arceus and offensive tanks such as Primal Kyogre.
- This power is only amplified by the use of a Choice Band, allowing Ho-Oh to break through the majority of the metagame.
- An ability in Regenerator ensures Ho-Oh can gain its health back due to the lack of Recovery and the ability to increase the longevity of this Pokemon within the match.
- An alternate set with 248 HP / 196 Atk / 52 SpD / 12 Spe and an Adamant Nature can be run if the team is opting for a bulkier set that can take Geomancy Xerneas on.

Usage Tips
========

- Make sure Stealth Rock isn't present before switching Ho-Oh in, as losing half its health before accomplishing anything is extremely detrimental.
- Account for Brave Bird recoil when attacking, as the damage may be enough to make Ho-Oh faint.
- Abuse Ho-Oh's ability Regenerator to its maximum potential by switching it out when low on health or requiring usage later on. Even at low health, Ho-Oh isn't necessarily useless later on in the match.
- When facing Darkrai, ensure you aren't locked into Sleep Talk while not asleep, as this can allow free turns for Darkrai to set up with Nasty Plot.
- Feel free to switch into a teammate and then back into Ho-Oh on a Dark Void, when predicting wake up to prevent Ho-Oh from being locked into a move it cannot use.
- Keep Ho-Oh at a good health range when Calm Mind Arceus formes are still alive to prevent these Pokemon from becoming problematic.
- Be careful when using Choice Band Ho-Oh, as Primal Kyogre, Skarmory and Steel Arceus can abuse the inability to change moves.

Team Options
========

- Defog users such as Support Arceus formes, Latias, Latios and Giratina all provide Ho-Oh with the hazard removal it requires.
- Pokemon with access to Magic Bounce can prevent Stealth Rock setup, allowing Ho-Oh to be ran much more freely. These include Mega Diancie and Mega Sableye.
- Primal Groudon and Ho-Oh have nice defensive synergy as Primal Groudon is immune to two of Ho-Oh's weaknesses Water and Electric, while Ho-Oh is immune to Primal Groudon's only weakness in Ground.
- Checks for physical attackers such as Extreme Killer Arceus and physical variants of Ground Arceus benefit Ho-Oh immensely. These include Lugia, Skarmory and Giratina.
- Primal Kyogre checks such as Ferrothorn and Primal Groudon.
- Regenerator Pokemon like Amoonguss and Alomomola can provide a core that disable SwagPlay Klefki completely, while also disabling more passive Darkrai sets.
- Alternative Darkrai checks can be used alongside Ho-Oh to ensure safer options for when one is against Darkrai. These include Xerneas and Mega Diancie.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

- Substitute can be considered on sets with Recover, and can be used when an opponent is forced out for maximum efficiency. This allows Ho-Oh an extra line of defense when unsure of an opponent bearing Rock-type coverage, or just a safety net against common Status moves.
- Toxic can provide stalling capabilities for Ho-Oh due to its high natural bulk and Toxic's exponential residual damage.
- Whirlwind is a potential stop to Calm Mind Arceus formes that Ho-Oh can't necessarily deal with normally. Whirlwind also allows a simple stop for Geomancy Xerneas in most scenarios.
- Flame Charge allows Ho-Oh to boost its Speed above common threats such as Darkrai and Mewtwo, which can provide less reliance on predicting whether Darkrai will be using Substitute or not.
- Tailwind provides a Speed boost as well, however Tailwind is less permanent than Flame Charge and the team support is often limited.
- A physically defensive set with Toxic and Leftovers enables Ho-Oh to have a better chance against offensive foes in Mega Rayquaza, and non-Stone Edge Extreme Killer Arceus. This is used with an Impish nature and an EV spread of 248 HP / 208 Def / 52 SpD.
- Lum Berry is an option for Ho-Oh if a team struggles against Taunt Darkrai and Klefki, however Regenerator recovery allows Ho-Oh to outstall Klefki regardless.
- Sleep Talk should not be limited to the Choice Band set, as it can be used efficiently without being choice locked. However, this limits power and is usually unnecessary if running a better Darkrai check.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Stealth Rock**: Ho-Oh's unfortunate weakness to Stealth Rock takes away most of the defensive utility it provides. Ho-Oh cannot use Regenerator effectively and is therefore severely impaired.

**Rock-types**: Ho-Oh suffers immensely from its rock type weakness, particularly Rock Arceus as it is only threatened by Choice Banded Earthquake. Mega Diancie is also a threat, however is eliminated by Earthquake on its evolution if it decides not to utilize Protect. Tyranitar can also cripple Ho-Oh easily; however, it suffers immensely from Sacred Fire burns and is 2HKOed by Choice Band boosted Earthquake. Tyranitar, unlike these other Pokemon, can hold an item such as Shuca Berry to prevent a powerful Earthquake.

**Water-types**: Primal Kyogre and Water Arceus don't appreciate switching in on Brave Bird, however if given the chance to attack, these Pokemon can easily 2HKO Ho-Oh without much concern.

**Rock-type Coverage**: Stone Edge users Arceus and Primal Groudon pose a problem for Ho-Oh as they can ensure a guaranteed OHKO on Ho-Oh with only a miss chance to be fearful of. Other Physical attacking Arceus formes such Ground Arceus and Ghost Arceus, may boast this deadly coverage.

**Zekrom**: Zekrom's Bolt Strike OHKOes even the most defensive Ho-Oh sets and isn't able to be hit effectively by Ho-Oh's attacks, bar Earthquake. Ho-Oh can rely on a Sacred Fire burn; however, even while burned, Zekrom can deal major damage to Ho-Oh with its powerful Electric-type STAB.
 
Last edited:

MZ

And now for something completely different
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Overview
Put darkrai in the things it checks, that's p relevant
needs something about being pressured by strong physical attackers like ray, arc, groundceus, etc, ik u love this but SR isn't its only flaw :v

Moves
The sub point doesn't really explain what it actually does

Set Details
If you want a max speed set, run band. In set details I'd say that if u handle xern the 52 spdef can go back into attack, rather than just go all out offensive
Lefties is good enough for here imo, especially if ur running sub. it's nice to not get chipped so much if u really want hooh in more of a defensive capacity

UT
I don't think using hooh's team to keep SR off should be in UT really, especially in a meta where rocks are stupidly easy to set by slapping onto any arc form
keeping hooh healthy if they've got xern or CM arc something in the back
In general u want to get this in a lot to break teams fast, hooh isn't exactly #1 for staying power

TO
no latis, specific arc formes though and maybe both gira ones
examples of magic bouncers
hooh wants checks to faster physical things in general, not just ekiller but also groundceus etc
physical attackers which appreciate it donking walls
rockceus checks I guess
not only are these pretty niche but I don't see how they make klefki totally useless if it can do a ton to hooh with foul play. in general regen cores just arent as effective when u can click megaray and things die
idk just beef this up a bit

Moves
In both of the Brave bird bullets you just say the power and don't rly give a description, even just something like main STAB that u click unless going for burn or something
Sleep talks helps w/smeargle too I guess, also thunder darkrai is rly uncommon and not on analysis so just mentioning taunt here is sufficient

UT
DONT JUST COPY THE SAME EXACT SHIT BIG NONO EVEN IF U HAVE TO REWRITE THE EXACT SAME POINTS YOU SHOULDN'T LOOK AT 2 DIFFERENT UT AND SEE THE EXACT SAME THING VERY IMPORTANT
Again the using ho-oh's team thing doesn't belong at all
Pretty bare, the thing about facing darkrai is really vague and could be expanded on or something so it makes sense. something about bringing this in a lot and spamming strong attacks to break quickly, something about staying around to check CM arc forms, etc. just too short here for such a good mon

TO
again never copy the same exact bullet. in addition to rewriting some, see above comments like not mentioning the latis
give examples of alternative darkrai checks and make it more clear what this means (i think it means something like having both hooh and xern is good because it either has taunt or sludge bomb but not both so ur ensured a check)
Again this needs teammates to check ray and groundceus in addition to ekiller. I'm just saying the same mons here bc lazy and that's your job to get examples
sweepers which like the wallbreaking
again a bit short, if you can think of anything else that'd be nice but you do seem to cover it

OO
I'd prefer lefties go in set details of set 1, remove from here if ur good w/that and put lefties up there

C&C
Maybe give a couple examples of mons which xern cant pivot into with rocks up, like suddenly you cant switch into scarf xern's moon blast or something
Rock arceus does take a lot from CB EQ, I think the thing with it is that it can pivot into hooh really easily, you might not realize it's typed rock at the start, and can check. also ttar is good enough to mention here imo, something something checks, can have shuca berry as well, etc
groundceus edge user
zekrom+stone edge users --> faster physical attackers, mention those mons plus a couple of things like megaray, fast don, groundceus. I think this compression makes more sense because they all fit under the same general category. this is definitely longer than other sections and zekrom should still get a separate mention but yeah I feel like not mentioning faster physical attackers ignores something kinda significant in how to beat hooh

p good, most of this stuff was just small nitpicks or expand a bit more pls
zDganmZ.gif
1/3
 
AM QC coming through!
[OVERVIEW]

- Fairly high attack stat paired with extremely powerful STAB attacks make Ho-Oh a dominant offensive force.
- Sacred Fire's 50% burn chance allows less pressure from physical attackers, while providing extra residual damage for destroying Lugia's Multiscale and Deoxys's Focus Sash.
- In addition to this, its high defenses allow it to switch in on many offensive Pokémon with ease.
- It can act as a check for Geomancy Xerneas, as well as almost any Calm Mind Arceus forme.
- Its colossal ability Regenerator allows easy health regain as well as allowing Ho-Oh to take virtually no damage from Klefki and Darkrai, therefore providing a decent answer to both.
- However, its crippling weakness to Stealth Rock prevents it from being a god-like Pokemon.
- Due to this, it relies on hazard removal excessively, which can prevent it from functioning to its full potential.
- It is also pressured by common physical attackers like Arceus, Mega Rayquaza and Ground Arceus; only further adding to its problems.
Ho-oh is very good vs xern, but it isn't even a check with the sets you offer.
CB: +2 252+ SpA Xerneas Thunder vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Ho-Oh: 362-428 (102.5 - 121.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Ho-Oh Sacred Fire vs. 184 HP / 28 Def Xerneas: 273-322 (62.1 - 73.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after burn damage (Brave Bird doesn't ko either)
Tank: +2 252+ SpA Xerneas Thunder vs. 248 HP / 52 SpD Ho-Oh: 350-414 (84.3 - 99.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Obv does less back. Doesn't KO, but KOs after LO recoil more than 1/2 the time.
Since none of your sets run whirlwind, it loses straight out if Xern Geomancies.
[SET]
name: Tank
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Sacred Fire
move 3: Earthquake / Substitute
move 4: Recover
item: Life Orb
ability: Regenerator
nature: Adamant
evs: 248 HP / 196 Atk / 52 SpD / 12 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

- Brave Bird is Ho-Oh's hardest hitting option, boasting 180 Attack after STAB and an excellent offensive typing in Flying.
- Sacred Fire is another excellent move for Ho-Oh, still dealing large amounts of damage while having a 50% chance to burn the opponent. It also helps wear down defensive walls as for example, Brave Bird's damage may often not be enough to out-damage a Support Arceus using Recover excessively.
- Earthquake is a nice coverage option for Ho-Oh allowing more damage to Primal Groudon without having to worry about the recoil of Brave Bird. Earthquake also hits Zekrom and Rock-types on switch-in if staying in is the optimal play.
- Recover allows Ho-Oh to recover its health without switching, and is the superior option to Roost due to the prevalence of Earthquake within the metagame.
- Substitute can be considered over Earthquake, and can be used when an opponent is forced out for maximum efficiency. This allows Ho-Oh an extra line of defense when unsure of an opponent bearing Rock-type coverage, or just a safety net against common Status moves.
180 BP, not attack.

Set Details
========

- 248 HP and 52 Special Defense enable Ho-Oh to always live a +2 Xerneas Thunder.
- 12 Speed ensures Ho-Oh outspeeds Mega Diancie as it mega evolves so it can OHKO with Earthquake or possibly burn it before it can utilise its Diamond Storm.
- The remaining 196 EVs are slotted into Attack and an Adamant Nature is given to make Ho-Oh's attacks do as much damage as possible while still achieving the aforementioned goals.
- Life Orb powers up Ho-Oh's attacks even more, as the extra damage is extremely beneficial.
- An ability in Regenerator ensures Ho-Oh can gain its health back due to the lack of Recovery and the ability to increase the longevity of this Pokemon within the match.
- Maximum Attack and Speed can be ran if Geomancy Xerneas is already taken care of by other team members.
The living xern thunder is misleading when combined with LO- It can hit back, but its a mutual kill unless thunder misses.
You have recovery in this set- it doesn't have a lack of it
If its max attack and speed, why is it a tank set/why is this in set details instead of OO; What else handles Geoxern as well as Ho-Oh? IG Klefki...


Usage Tips
========

- Ensure Stealth Rock is not present before Ho-Oh switches in, as depleting Ho-Oh's health to half is extremely detrimental to its attacking ability especially with the heavy recoil Brave Bird and Life Orb provide.
- Account for Brave Bird and Life Orb recoil when attacking, as the damage may be enough to make Ho-Oh faint.
- Abuse Ho-Oh's ability Regenerator to its maximum potential by switching it out when low on health, or requiring usage later on. Even at low health, Ho-Oh isn't necessarily useless later on in the match.
- When one of Ho-Oh's checks is in need of being badly poisoned, paralyzed or put to sleep, ensure that Sacred Fire is used carefully and doesn't result in a burn on the opponent.
- Using Sacred Fire when anticipating a physical attacker to switch in can be extremely beneficial in the progression of the match.
- Keep Ho-Oh healthy if the opposing team has a Xerneas or Calm Mind Arceus forme still alive.
- Get Ho-Oh in early to break teams fast, however still ensure that it is kept at high health.

Team Options
========

- Defog users such as Giratina and Support Arceus formes such as Water Arceus, Ground Arceus and Rock Arceus all provide Ho-Oh with the hazard removal it requires.
- Rock Arceus especially, as it provides a decent answer to Rock-type moves, as well as providing optimal support through Defog.
- Pokemon with access to Magic Bounce can prevent Stealth Rock setup, allowing Ho-Oh to be ran much more freely. These include Mega Diancie and Mega Sableye.
- Primal Groudon is immune to two of Ho-Oh's weaknesses Water and Electric, while Ho-Oh is immune to Primal Groudon's only weakness in Ground.
- Checks for physical attackers such as Extreme Killer Arceus and physical variants of Ground Arceus benefit Ho-Oh immensely. These include Skarmory and Quagsire.
- Regenerator Pokemon like Amoonguss and Alomomola can provide a core that disable SwagPlay Klefki completely, while also disabling more passive Darkrai sets.
Sacred fire isn't the best click for PDon/Opposing physical Ho-Oh, otherwise that's fine
What do you mean by "break teams fast"? Does Ho-Oh have some kind of timer on its use? Do you just want to avoid long matches?

[SET]
name: Choice Band
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Sacred Fire
move 3: Earthquake
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Choice Band
ability: Regenerator
nature: Adamant
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

- Brave Bird is Ho-Oh's main way of dealing damage, harnessing a massive Base Power of 180 after STAB as well as a great offensive typing in Flying.
- Sacred Fire offers another excellent offensive typing in Fire that allows the easy countering of Skarmory and Ferrothorn, as well as the high chance to burn the opponent. This can potentially ruin a Physical attacker's utility as well as crippling defensive walls such as Support Fairy Arceus.
- Earthquake allows Ho-Oh to cripple Primal Groudon and Rock Arceus ensuring they are not able to utilize their Rock-type attacks.
- Sleep Talk allows Ho-Oh to be a great Pokemon against Darkrai without Taunt and Smeargle. However this does rely on predictions and can be outstalled by spamming Substitute.

Set Details
========

- An Adamant nature paired with maximum Attack and Speed allow Ho-Oh to rip through many defensive walls such as Support Arceus and offensive tanks such as Primal Kyogre.
- This power is only amplified by the use of a Choice Band, allowing Ho-Oh to break through the majority of the metagame.
- An ability in Regenerator ensures Ho-Oh can gain its health back due to the lack of Recovery and the ability to increase the longevity of this Pokemon within the match.
- An alternate set with 248 HP / 196 Atk / 52 SpD / 12 Spe and an Adamant Nature can be run if the team is opting for a bulkier set that can take Geomancy Xerneas on.

Usage Tips
========

- Make sure Stealth Rock isn't present before switching Ho-Oh in, as losing half its health before accomplishing anything is extremely detrimental.
- Account for Brave Bird recoil when attacking, as the damage may be enough to make Ho-Oh faint.
- Abuse Ho-Oh's ability Regenerator to its maximum potential by switching it out when low on health or requiring usage later on. Even at low health, Ho-Oh isn't necessarily useless later on in the match.
- Ensure not to be locked into Sleep Talk against a Darkrai as they can then potentially Nasty Plot against you and sweep your team.
First point looks like it was taken from the previous, only done correctly this time
Sleep talk band outright loses to a well played sub darkrai, not just nasty plot. Sub doesn't even require prediction (except like Whirlwind/Flame Charge, but w/e), ant taunt can make it struggle.

Team Options
========

- Defog users such as Support Arceus formes, Latias, Latios and Giratina all provide Ho-Oh with the hazard removal it requires.
- Pokemon with access to Magic Bounce can prevent Stealth Rock setup, allowing Ho-Oh to be ran much more freely. These include Mega Diancie and Mega Sableye.
- Primal Groudon and Ho-Oh have nice defensive synergy as Primal Groudon is immune to two of Ho-Oh's weaknesses Water and Electric, while Ho-Oh is immune to Primal Groudon's only weakness in Ground.
- Extreme Killer Arceus checks benefit Ho-Oh immensely. These include Skarmory and Quagsire.
- Regenerator Pokemon like Amoonguss and Alomomola can provide a core that disable SwagPlay Klefki completely, while also disabling more passive Darkrai sets.
- Alternative Darkrai checks can be used alongside Ho-Oh to ensure safer options for when one is against Darkrai.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

- Thunder Wave allows Ho-Oh to cripple offensive wallbreakers, providing extra defensive support for Ho-Oh. This can be utilised on most bulkier spreads, including the aforementioned tank set.
- Toxic can provide stalling capabilities for Ho-Oh due to its high natural bulk and Toxic's exponential residual damage.
- Whirlwind is a potential stop to Calm Mind Arceus formes that Ho-Oh can't necessarily deal with normally. Whirlwind also allows a simple stop for Geomancy Xerneas in many scenarios.
- Flame Charge allows Ho-Oh to boost its Speed above common threats such as Darkrai and Mewtwo, which can provide less reliance on predicting whether Darkrai will be using Substitute or not.
- Tailwind provides a Speed boost as well, however Tailwind is less permanent than Flame Charge and the team support is often limited.
- A physically defensive set enables Ho-Oh to have a better chance against offensive foes in Mega Rayquaza, and non-Stone Edge Extreme Killer Arceus. This is used with an Impish nature and an EV spread of 248 HP / 208 Def / 52 SpD.
- Leftovers can be utilised on bulky sets to provide passive recovery against Offensive foes and disabling many important 2HKOs.
- Lum Berry is an option for Ho-Oh if a team struggles against Taunt Darkrai and Klefki, however Regenerator recovery allows Ho-Oh to outstall Klefki regardless.
Possibly add pokemon weak to xern/rai, as Ho-oh can support them? IE Darkrai/Mray/YGod for the former, YGod/Ghost Arc/Giratina/the metagame for the latter?
Also whirlwind for OO, also STalk for the tank set OO.
 
Last edited:

Chloe

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NUPL Champion
Implemented, thanks Zard. As for the difference where the points looked copied, they will definitely be differentiated in writeup.

AM QC coming through!

Ho-oh is very good vs xern, but it isn't even a check with the sets you offer.
CB: +2 252+ SpA Xerneas Thunder vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Ho-Oh: 362-428 (102.5 - 121.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Ho-Oh Sacred Fire vs. 184 HP / 28 Def Xerneas: 273-322 (62.1 - 73.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after burn damage (Brave Bird doesn't ko either)
Tank: +2 252+ SpA Xerneas Thunder vs. 248 HP / 52 SpD Ho-Oh: 350-414 (84.3 - 99.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Obv does less back. Doesn't KO, but KOs after LO recoil more than 1/2 the time.
Since none of your sets run whirlwind, it loses straight out if Xern Geomancies.
- I feel like you're missing the point of Banded Ho-Oh. Banded Ho-Oh is meant for breaking things not absorbing Xerneas's attacks. This is specified in set details.
- As for tank, I can't tell if you're serious or not. Are you expecting a Xerneas to Geomancy against a Ho-Oh? I don't see what advantage Ho-Oh sees in living an extra turn, when it's going to die to the faster attack regardless, or risk sacking a team member alive. This is the same with any Ho-Oh set.

180 BP, not attack.
- I agree with you, thanks!

The living xern thunder is misleading when combined with LO- It can hit back, but its a mutual kill unless thunder misses.
You have recovery in this set- it doesn't have a lack of it
If its max attack and speed, why is it a tank set/why is this in set details instead of OO; What else handles Geoxern as well as Ho-Oh? IG Klefki...
- You misinterpreted; however, no one else had a problem with understanding this.
- Fair, I had that written from before when Recover was optional.
- Aegislash, Bronzong, Jirachi, Klefki, Primal Groudon, Clefable, Amoonguss all handle Xerneas better than Ho-Oh, it isn't anywhere near the best check in the metagame.

Sacred fire isn't the best click for PDon/Opposing physical Ho-Oh, otherwise that's fine
What do you mean by "break teams fast"? Does Ho-Oh have some kind of timer on its use? Do you just want to avoid long matches?
- ✓
- Zard's point, usually you want to rip into opposing teams early, but seeing it's a Ho-Oh and it isn't intended for offensive teams, I may disregard this point due to its ambiguity.

First point looks like it was taken from the previous, only done correctly this time
Sleep talk band outright loses to a well played sub darkrai, not just nasty plot. Sub doesn't even require prediction (except like Whirlwind/Flame Charge, but w/e), ant taunt can make it struggle.
- Thanks, let me implement the first QC first before you copy Zard's QC word for word.
- I've adjusted the point to explain how to play around these mons. I suggest you read the analysis when it's complete.

Possibly add pokemon weak to xern/rai, as Ho-oh can support them? IE Darkrai/Mray/YGod for the former, YGod/Ghost Arc/Giratina/the metagame for the latter?
Also whirlwind for OO, also STalk for the tank set OO.
- "Create weaknesses on your team so Ho-Oh sees more use"
- I have Whirlwind matey, and yea sure Tank STalk deserves a mention.

Thanks for taking the time to QC regardless :)
 

Chloe

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After discussion with a few of the QC members, we have decided that Thunder Wave is much more important than Substitute on the Tank set. Changes have been made accordingly.
 
Just an Amateur Check:

[OVERVIEW]
Chloe said:
- Fairly high attack stat paired with extremely powerful STAB attacks make Ho-Oh a dominant offensive force.
- Sacred Fire's 50% burn chance allows less pressure from physical attackers, while providing extra residual damage for destroying Lugia's Multiscale and Deoxys's Focus Sash.
- In addition to this, its high defenses allow it to switch in on many offensive Pokémon with ease.
- It can act as a check for Geomancy Xerneas, as well as almost any Calm Mind Arceus forme.
- Its colossal ability Regenerator allows easy health regain as well as allowing Ho-Oh to take virtually no damage from Klefki and Darkrai, therefore providing a decent answer to both.
- However, its crippling weakness to Stealth Rock prevents it from being a god-like Pokemon.
- Due to this, it relies on hazard removal excessively, which can prevent it from functioning to its full potential.
- It is also pressured by common physical attackers like Arceus, Mega Rayquaza and Ground Arceus; only further adding to its problems.
  • Ho-oh actually loses to Darkrai without sleep talk, so perhaps mentioning sleep talk could be good
Chloe said:
[SET]
name: Tank
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Sacred Fire
move 3: Earthquake / Thunder Wave
move 4: Recover
item: Life Orb
ability: Regenerator
nature: Adamant
evs: 248 HP / 196 Atk / 52 SpD / 12 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

- Brave Bird is Ho-Oh's hardest hitting option, boasting 180 Base Power after STAB and an excellent offensive typing in Flying.
- Sacred Fire is another excellent move for Ho-Oh, still dealing large amounts of damage while having a 50% chance to burn the opponent. It also helps wear down defensive walls as for example, Brave Bird's damage may often not be enough to out-damage a Support Arceus using Recover excessively.
- Earthquake is a nice coverage option for Ho-Oh allowing more damage to Primal Groudon without having to worry about the recoil of Brave Bird. Earthquake also hits Zekrom and Rock-types on switch-in if staying in is the optimal play.
- Recover allows Ho-Oh to recover its health without switching, and is the superior option to Roost due to the prevalence of Earthquake within the metagame.
- Thunder Wave allows Ho-Oh to cripple offensive wallbreakers such as Geomancy Xerneas, while providing extra defensive support for Ho-Oh.
  • While Zekrom is a very true counter, Perhaps mention explicitly M-Diancie and Rockceus? EQ mainly hits those (along with Pdon)
Chloe said:
Usage Tips
========

- Ensure Stealth Rock is not present before Ho-Oh switches in, as depleting Ho-Oh's health to half is extremely detrimental to its attacking ability especially with the heavy recoil Brave Bird and Life Orb provide.
- Account for Brave Bird and Life Orb recoil when attacking, as the damage may be enough to make Ho-Oh faint.
- Abuse Ho-Oh's ability Regenerator to its maximum potential by switching it out when low on health, or requiring usage later on. Even at low health, Ho-Oh isn't necessarily useless later on in the match.
- When one of Ho-Oh's checks is in need of being badly poisoned, paralyzed or put to sleep, ensure that Sacred Fire is used carefully and doesn't result in a burn on the opponent.
- Using Sacred Fire when anticipating a physical attacker to switch in can be extremely beneficial in the progression of the match.
- Keep Ho-Oh healthy if the opposing team has a Xerneas or Calm Mind Arceus forme still alive.
  • Mention wall breaking, status spreading, and pivoting roles that Ho-oh provides that make it such a god
Chloe said:
Team Options
========

- Defog users such as Giratina and Support Arceus formes such as Water Arceus, Ground Arceus and Rock Arceus all provide Ho-Oh with the hazard removal it requires.
- Rock Arceus especially, as it provides a decent answer to Rock-type moves, as well as providing optimal support through Defog.
- Pokemon with access to Magic Bounce can prevent Stealth Rock setup, allowing Ho-Oh to be ran much more freely. These include Mega Diancie and Mega Sableye.
- Primal Groudon is immune to two of Ho-Oh's weaknesses Water and Electric, while Ho-Oh is immune to Primal Groudon's only weakness in Ground.
- Checks for physical attackers such as Extreme Killer Arceus and physical variants of Ground Arceus benefit Ho-Oh immensely. These include Skarmory and Quagsire.
- Regenerator Pokemon like Amoonguss and Alomomola can provide a core that disable SwagPlay Klefki completely, while also disabling more passive Darkrai sets.
  • Defog users should just simplify all the Support Arceus into a single term, as Ghost, Fairy, Dragon are too much to list alongside
  • Rock Arceus especially, as it provides a decent answer to Rock-type moves, as well as providing optimal support through Defog. - Did you mean Steelceus/Groundceus?
  • Primal Groudon can provide a second check to xerneas in case rocks are up
  • Physical attacker checks - Should include more viable threats as well, including Lugia, Support Arceus, Defensive Yveltal, Giratina
  • Regenerator Pokemon like Amoonguss and Alomomola can provide a core that disable SwagPlay Klefki completely, while also disabling more passive Darkrai sets. - D Rank Pokemon in Viab, probably shouldn't be here
  • Ferrothorn, Primal Groudon help check Primal Kyogre
  • M-Ray appreciates sacred fire pressuring checks and in turn can set up much more easily
  • M-Gar can remove rock types (with focus blast), taunt to prevent stealth rock, and destiny bond to eliminate Mega Rayquaza
Chloe said:
[SET]
name: Choice Band
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Sacred Fire
move 3: Earthquake
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Choice Band
ability: Regenerator
nature: Adamant
evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

Set Details
========

- An Adamant nature paired with maximum Attack and Speed allow Ho-Oh to rip through many defensive walls such as Support Arceus and offensive tanks such as Primal Kyogre.
- This power is only amplified by the use of a Choice Band, allowing Ho-Oh to break through the majority of the metagame.
- An ability in Regenerator ensures Ho-Oh can gain its health back due to the lack of Recovery and the ability to increase the longevity of this Pokemon within the match.
- An alternate set with 248 HP / 196 Atk / 52 SpD / 12 Spe and an Adamant Nature can be run if the team is opting for a bulkier set that can take Geomancy Xerneas on.
  • Are you sure you want the max speed variant to be put? Just curious if you insist this is the more viable set

Chloe said:
Usage Tips
========

- Make sure Stealth Rock isn't present before switching Ho-Oh in, as losing half its health before accomplishing anything is extremely detrimental.
- Account for Brave Bird recoil when attacking, as the damage may be enough to make Ho-Oh faint.
- Abuse Ho-Oh's ability Regenerator to its maximum potential by switching it out when low on health or requiring usage later on. Even at low health, Ho-Oh isn't necessarily useless later on in the match.
- When facing Darkrai, ensure you aren't locked into Sleep Talk while not asleep, as this can allow free turns for Darkrai to set up with Nasty Plot.
- Feel free to switch into a teammate and then back into Ho-Oh on a Dark Void, when predicting wake up to prevent Ho-Oh from being locked into a move it cannot use.
- Keep Ho-Oh at a good health range when Calm Mind Arceus formes are still alive to prevent these Pokemon from becoming problematic.
  • Talk about choice band locking into moves being very tricky and vulnerable to Primal Kyogre, Skarmory, Steelceus after a Predict, and trappable by m-gar

Chloe said:
Team Options
========

- Defog users such as Support Arceus formes, Latias, Latios and Giratina all provide Ho-Oh with the hazard removal it requires.
- Pokemon with access to Magic Bounce can prevent Stealth Rock setup, allowing Ho-Oh to be ran much more freely. These include Mega Diancie and Mega Sableye.
- Primal Groudon and Ho-Oh have nice defensive synergy as Primal Groudon is immune to two of Ho-Oh's weaknesses Water and Electric, while Ho-Oh is immune to Primal Groudon's only weakness in Ground.
- Checks for Extreme Killer Arceus and other potent physical attackers benefit Ho-Oh immensely. These include Skarmory and Quagsire.
- Regenerator Pokemon like Amoonguss and Alomomola can provide a core that disable SwagPlay Klefki completely, while also disabling more passive Darkrai sets.
- Alternative Darkrai checks can be used alongside Ho-Oh to ensure safer options for when one is against Darkrai. These include Xerneas and Mega Diancie.
  • Same comments as tank set

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Chloe said:
Other Options
=============

- Substitute can be considered on sets with Recover, and can be used when an opponent is forced out for maximum efficiency. This allows Ho-Oh an extra line of defense when unsure of an opponent bearing Rock-type coverage, or just a safety net against common Status moves.
- Toxic can provide stalling capabilities for Ho-Oh due to its high natural bulk and Toxic's exponential residual damage.
- Whirlwind is a potential stop to Calm Mind Arceus formes that Ho-Oh can't necessarily deal with normally. Whirlwind also allows a simple stop for Geomancy Xerneas in many scenarios.
- Flame Charge allows Ho-Oh to boost its Speed above common threats such as Darkrai and Mewtwo, which can provide less reliance on predicting whether Darkrai will be using Substitute or not.
- Tailwind provides a Speed boost as well, however Tailwind is less permanent than Flame Charge and the team support is often limited.
- A physically defensive set enables Ho-Oh to have a better chance against offensive foes in Mega Rayquaza, and non-Stone Edge Extreme Killer Arceus. This is used with an Impish nature and an EV spread of 248 HP / 208 Def / 52 SpD.
- Leftovers can be utilised on bulky sets to provide passive recovery against Offensive foes and disabling many important 2HKOs.
- Lum Berry is an option for Ho-Oh if a team struggles against Taunt Darkrai and Klefki, however Regenerator recovery allows Ho-Oh to outstall Klefki regardless.
- Sleep Talk should not be limited to the Choice Band set, as it can be used efficiently without being choice locked. However, this limits power and is usually unnecessary if running a better Darkrai check.
Reordering that I propose (in term of viab):
- Substitute can be considered on sets with Recover, and can be used when an opponent is forced out for maximum efficiency. This allows Ho-Oh an extra line of defense when unsure of an opponent bearing Rock-type coverage, or just a safety net against common Status moves.
- A physically defensive set with toxic and leftovers enables Ho-Oh to have a better chance against offensive foes in Mega Rayquaza, and non-Stone Edge Extreme Killer Arceus and avoid many 2hkos. This is used with an Impish nature and an EV spread of 248 HP / 208 Def / 52 SpD.
- Flame Charge allows Ho-Oh to boost its Speed above common threats such as Darkrai and Mewtwo, which can provide less reliance on predicting whether Darkrai will be using Substitute or not.
- Lum Berry is an option for Ho-Oh if a team struggles against Taunt Darkrai and Klefki, however Regenerator recovery allows Ho-Oh to outstall Klefki regardless.
- Whirlwind is a potential stop to Calm Mind Arceus formes that Ho-Oh can't necessarily deal with normally. Whirlwind also allows a simple stop for Geomancy Xerneas in most scenarios.
- Tailwind provides a Speed boost as well, however Tailwind is less permanent than Flame Charge and the team support is often limited.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Stealth Rock**: Ho-Oh's unfortunate weakness to Stealth Rock takes away any defensive utility it provides. Ho-Oh cannot use Regenerator effectively and is therefore severely impaired.
  • not true, it can still check steelceus and fairyceus even in its weakened form, perhaps reword to most of defensive utility
**Rock-types**: Ho-Oh suffers immensely from its rock type weakness, particularly Rock Arceus as it isn't threatened by even Banded Earthquake. Mega Diancie is also a threat, however is eliminated by Earthquake on its evolution if it decides not to utilize Protect. Tyranitar can also cripple Ho-Oh easily; however, it suffers immensely from Sacred Fire burns and is 2HKOed by Choice Band boosted Earthquake. Tyranitar, unlike these other Pokemon, can hold an item such as Shuca Berry to prevent a powerful Earthquake.
  • 196+ Atk Choice Band Ho-Oh Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Arceus-Rock: 294-348 (66.3 - 78.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO - looks threatened to me
  • M-Diancie should be mentioned
  • Ttar has too much text (just an opinion)

**Water-types**: Primal Kyogre and Water Arceus don't appreciate switching in on Brave Bird, however if given the chance to attack, these Pokemon can easily damage Ho-Oh without much concern.
  • 2HKO can be used for more clarity
**Stone Edge Users**: Stone Edge users Arceus and Primal Groudon pose a problem for Ho-Oh as they can ensure a guaranteed OHKO on Ho-Oh with only a miss chance to be fearful of. Other Physical attacking Arceus formes such as Steel and Ground Arceus, may boast this deadly coverage.
  • perhaps change name to rock type coverage? Rock Tomb and the occasional rock slide (on xern and people fearing for misses) can be included under this
  • Steelceus is not a good physical attacking arceus

**Zekrom**: Zekrom's Bolt Strike OHKOes even the most defensive Ho-Oh sets and isn't able to be hit effectively by Ho-Oh's attacks, bar Earthquake. Ho-Oh can rely on a Sacred Fire burn; however, even while burned, Zekrom can deal major damage to Ho-Oh with its powerful Electric-type STAB.
Additions:
  • Powerful Physical Type Setup Sweepers - M-Ray, Swords Dance Arceus (normal, ghost, ground), easily pressure ho-oh and force it to swap
  • M-Gar, can eliminate band set with dbond, when it might be needed to check cm arc forms
  • Yveltal - Defensive sets take hits and hit back with foul play (must be wary of sacred fire halving foul play damage), offensive sets can taunt and 3HKO ho-oh with dark pulse
  • Lugia - Can switch in on any move, toxic, and slowly stall Ho-oh Out, must be wary of sacred fire burns
  • Arceus-Dragon - Toxic, resists sacred fire
Hope this helps push this toward finally becoming official!
 
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Chloe

is a Community Contributoris a Top Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Dedicated Tournament Hostis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
NUPL Champion
Since we're running out of time and Catalystic's AM QC actually helped quite extensively, I'll stamp that as 2/3 (I think I'm allowed to do that). I'll be writing this up shortly.

just do what you want yeah

not that you have any respect for my opinion. the feeling is mutual, scrub
 
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