Metagame Anything Goes

Chloe

;w;
is a Forum Moderator
Moderator
Heya everyone!

We've updated sample teams to reflect the current metagame a lot better. We've removed all but two of the previous samples and picked an additional seven teams to represent the rest of the metagame. Thimo and I were hard at work ensuring all these teams had no major groundbreaking flaws, and we're quite happy with these nine. That being said, we're still open to any future submissions and encourage you to post teams if you feel as if they could be a potential sample team. Thanks for all your submissions, and I'm sorry we couldn't choose all of them.

Next on the agenda is making sure the resources thread is up to date and correct. The role compendium, speed tiers and other resources are quite outdated and should see an update within the next week or so.
 

DoW

formally Death on Wings
is a Pre-Contributor
Sorry for the one liner but what exactly does Barbaracle do that makes it viable? Is it some sort of Z-Move Tough Claws combo or...
The idea is that after a shell smash it beats pokemon like pdon and ekiller 1v1 thanks to air balloon:
252+ Atk Arceus Extreme Speed vs. -1 0 HP / 4 Def Barbaracle: 90-106 (31.5 - 37.1%) -- 84.4% chance to 3HKO
+2 252+ Atk Tough Claws Barbaracle Razor Shell vs. 240 HP / 0 Def Arceus: 259-306 (58.7 - 69.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

That said, I'd consider it still very much a meme because you can say the same of many mons, like geoxern or dd mray, and the ability to beat stuff after setup isn't exactly impressive given the support you need to get that setup. Overall you should make sure your team doesn't outright lose to barbaracle, but further than that you can just ignore it.

Disclaimer: I've never used the mon myself, but if I'm missing something then it's something I haven't seen in battles where people used it.
 

Pigeons

formerly Yuga42
Frankly, Barbspam is underrated. I will get replays soon, but barbsapm should definitely be added to the sample teams.
Don't submit complicated Flygon & Breloom Webs or some niche Thimo innovation unless it's simple enough for a new player to use.
No.

So this isn't purely a shitpost, I'd like to ask what people think are underrated Pokemon or playstyles at the moment. I'd personally like to draw more attention to MSab balance in the current meta as I feel like it matches up well against a lot of the offense teams in the meta thanks to its ability to block most suicide leads and good matchup against Marshadow and EKiller. It's also nice against balance teams, Celesteela and Ferrothorn for example are a real headache a lot of the time but MSab shuts them down pretty handily.
 

DoW

formally Death on Wings
is a Pre-Contributor
While balance is certainly a strong playstyle at the moment, I honestly think offense isn't being given the credit it deserves right now. Too often when people try to use offense, they use either a meme like barbaracle or something matchup-dependent and extremely prepared-for like psychic terrain deo-a spam. A well-built offense team, with pivots, wallbreakers / stallbreakers, and multiple angles of attack, coupled with overwhelming offensive pressure, can often make it hard for a balance team to win after only a few good plays, and though stall is necessary to consider during teambuilding it's often easy enough to beat when you know what you're doing and have a competent team.


Barb is viable with, yes. Some tough claws z-move combo. What makes barb good is the good movepool combined with shell smash. With screens in place on your side, a barb can easily sweep a team after one shell smash.
"easily"
It's good, in the same way that eeveepass is good - it wins loads low-ladder and you have to have a team that can deal with it. Outside of having one or two checks to the strategy though, it's pretty easy to ignore.
 
Barb is viable with, yes. Some tough claws z-move combo. What makes barb good is the good movepool combined with shell smash. With screens in place on your side, a barb can easily sweep a team after one shell smash.
Its frail in current meta and even with screens you can't KO fairyceus-+2 252+ Atk Barbaracle Stone Edge vs. 120 HP / 250+ Def Arceus-Fairy: 196-232 (47.6 - 56.4%) -- 85.5% chance to 2HKO (evs are my own fairyceus evs).Even with screens you can't give it that much support as fairyceus carries defog and it can defog screens and rocks and then it get killed by pogre or pdon idk pdon evs at the moment so idk whether EQ at +2 OHKO or not,and its not that good against many common mons in meta too like pogre,steelceus and marshadow.
 
Its frail in current meta and even with screens you can't KO fairyceus-+2 252+ Atk Barbaracle Stone Edge vs. 120 HP / 250+ Def Arceus-Fairy: 196-232 (47.6 - 56.4%) -- 85.5% chance to 2HKO (evs are my own fairyceus evs).Even with screens you can't give it that much support as fairyceus carries defog and it can defog screens and rocks and then it get killed by pogre or pdon idk pdon evs at the moment so idk whether EQ at +2 OHKO or not,and its not that good against many common mons in meta too like pogre,steelceus and marshadow.
It gets low kick, and can brutally counter normal, steel, and rock arcs. +2 252+ Atk Tough Claws Barbaracle Low Kick (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Arceus: 448-528 (100.9 - 118.9%) -- guaranteeed OHKO. Ik it cannot beat fairy arc, but that is why other pokemon exist. However, with a continental crush set, you can hit fairyceus for a guaranteed 2hko, while 252 SpA Pixie Plate Arceus-Fairy Judgment vs. -1 0 HP / 0 SpD Barbaracle through Light Screen: 158-186 (55.4 - 65.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO and barb outspeeds, so it beats fairyceus (with a setup deo-s installing lightscreen).
 
Well, I have a pretty decent team to share that I feel is worthy of going in samples. However, knowing the people running the thread I'm assuming I'll just be ignored. Regardless, this team peaked #1 and hit a 94.9 GXE, coupled with an above 2000 rating, and doesn't really have any major weaknesses (except maybe goth?) . Not really going to go into the details of how the team works because it's fairly self explanatory. It's pretty much a revamped version of the previous team that I posted on here. If it doesn't go in samples I'll just make an rmt of it. Anyway, here is the team:

Rayquaza-Mega @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Delta Stream
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Ascent
- Outrage
- V-create
- Extreme Speed

Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb
Ability: Desolate Land
EVs: 252 HP / 248 SpD / 8 Spe
Careful Nature
- Precipice Blades
- Lava Plume
- Dragon Tail
- Stealth Rock

Marshadow @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Close Combat
- Shadow Sneak
- Spectral Thief

Arceus-Ground @ Earth Plate
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 236 HP / 252 SpA / 20 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Recover
- Judgment
- Ice Beam

Arceus-Steel @ Steelium Z
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- Stone Edge
- Swords Dance
- Magic Coat

Arceus-Fairy @ Pixie Plate
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 252 HP / 236 Def / 20 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Judgment
- Flamethrower
- Toxic
- Recover
 
I have been a little hype about shuckle webs and was wondering if we are ever going to get any of those on the sample teams or at lest if someone knows about somewhere I can get 1. Shuckle just has been my favorite for webs because of its bulk and the fact that even if it can be ohko by some super effective attack or taunted it has mental herb and sturdy.
 

avocado

queen vados
is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
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Assuming you're quoting Quantum Tesseract 's post from the first page about solgaleo, the part you quoted means that solgaleo can live a xerneas that boosted it's special attack by two stages (+2, meaning double the special attack) and used focus blast, after solgaleo takes stealth rock damage (which would be 6%; so that would mean solgaleo lives a +2 focus blast from 94%)
 
Gothitelle Checks

Gothitelle has been wreaking havoc on strong AG teams for quite a while. It uses a brutal combination of Shadow Tag, Charm, and Confide. It can defeat virtually any support Arceus, and clears the field of obstacles to setup sweepers. Gothitelle is a serious problem in the current AG metagame, so we are taking a look at potential counters and checks to it.

Sub Ekiller:
Arceus @ Leftovers / Life Orb
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Extreme Speed
- Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Claw

Charm does not bypass substitute, so this is a great poke with which to crush goth. You can switch in to a confide, then sub against charm, and get one swords dance in before taunt. You can then crush Goth with shadow claw. This also will hit hard against many other pokes that could be switched in to replace Gothitelle.
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Arceus Shadow Claw vs. 252 HP / 80 Def Gothitelle: 395-465 (114.8 - 135.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Arceus Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 80 Def Gothitelle: 339-399 (98.5 - 115.9%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Arceus Shadow Claw vs. 252 HP / 80 Def Gothitelle: 304-358 (88.3 - 104%) -- 25% chance to OHKO


Dhelmise:
Dhelmise @ Leftovers
Ability: Steelworker
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Anchor Shot
- Shadow Claw
- Swords Dance

Dhelmise is an amazing goth check, though not good for anything else. It switches in on Goth, uses Anchor Shot, then substitutes. It can then use swords dance until Goth catches up and uses taunt. A bonus of Dhelmise is that if something goes pear shaped in taking down Gothitelle, it can easily switch out.


Support Arceus:
Gothitelle's main purpose in life is switching in on support Arceus. However, in order to defeat Gothitelle, your support Arceus can be fitted with roar. This does, however use up a moveslot. One of the best ways to beat Goth using support Arceus is to bait it with supportceus and then switch out to Choice Band Mega Rayquaza.

Choice Band M-Ray:
What is there to say? This thing is an absolute beast, and can be extremely effective switching in to a Goth that was drawn out by a support Arceus.

252 Atk Choice Band Rayquaza-Mega Dragon Ascent vs. 252 HP / 80 Def Gothitelle: 360-424 (104.6 - 123.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Rayquaza-Mega Dragon Ascent vs. 252 HP / 80 Def Gothitelle: 396-466 (115.1 - 135.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO


I have provided a couple of strong checks here, in order to get a discussion started. Obviously, I have not covered every single Gothitelle check, and am very interested as to what other people come up with to solve their own Gothitelle problems.

Special thanks to zxcvbnmqa for helping me to discover the Gothitelle checks featured above!
 
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Gothitelle is the most vile answer to support Arceus formes and support 'mons such as Ferrothorn in the tier. The centralization of the metagame around a great number of threats such as Primal Groudon, Mega Rayquaza, Ho-Oh, Xerneas, and mostly, Marshadow, has made role compression unavoidable, resulting in teams almost always relying on Pokemon such as Arceus-Fairy and other passive utility Pokemon to glue builds together. It is the pokemon that traps and removes defensive backbones in most balance team to open a way for the likes of Mega Rayquaza / Marshadow / Xerneas to run rampant, and I agree it is one of the most annoying Pokemon to deal with at this point.

Unfortunately Anything Goes, after all, is cartridge based and I don't think Gothitelle ban will happen under any circumstances unless the authorities make exceptionally off-rule decision.
 
Gothitelle Checks Discussion

Gothitelle has been wreaking havoc on strong AG teams for quite a while. It uses a brutal combination of Shadow Tag, Charm, and Confide. It can defeat virtually any support Arceus, and clears the field of obstacles to setup sweepers. Gothitelle is a serious problem in the current AG metagame, so we are taking a look at potential counters and checks to it in this thread.

Sub Ekiller:
Arceus @ Leftovers / Life Orb
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Extreme Speed
- Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Claw

Charm does not bypass substitute, so this is a great poke with which to crush goth. You can switch in to a confide, then sub against charm, and get one swords dance in before taunt. You can then crush Goth with shadow claw. This also will hit hard against many other pokes that could be switched in to replace Gothitelle.
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Arceus Shadow Claw vs. 252 HP / 80 Def Gothitelle: 395-465 (114.8 - 135.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Arceus Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 80 Def Gothitelle: 339-399 (98.5 - 115.9%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Arceus Shadow Claw vs. 252 HP / 80 Def Gothitelle: 304-358 (88.3 - 104%) -- 25% chance to OHKO


Dhelmise:
Dhelmise @ Leftovers
Ability: Steelworker
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Anchor Shot
- Shadow Claw
- Swords Dance

Dhelmise is an amazing goth check, though not good for anything else. It switches in on Goth, uses Anchor Shot, then substitutes. It can then use swords dance until Goth catches up and uses taunt. A bonus of Dhelmise is that if something goes pear shaped in taking down Gothitelle, it can easily switch out.


Support Arceus:
Gothitelle's main purpose in life is switching in on support Arceus. However, in order to defeat Gothitelle, your support Arceus can be fitted with roar. This does, however use up a moveslot. One of the best ways to beat Goth using support Arceus is to bait it with supportceus and then switch out to Choice Band Mega Rayquaza.

Choice Band M-Ray:
What is there to say? This thing is an absolute beast, and can be extremely effective switching in to a Goth that was drawn out by a support Arceus.

252 Atk Choice Band Rayquaza-Mega Dragon Ascent vs. 252 HP / 80 Def Gothitelle: 360-424 (104.6 - 123.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Rayquaza-Mega Dragon Ascent vs. 252 HP / 80 Def Gothitelle: 396-466 (115.1 - 135.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO


I have provided a couple of strong checks here, in order to get a discussion started. Obviously, I have not covered every single Gothitelle check, and am very interested as to what other people come up with to solve their own Gothitelle problems.

Special thanks to zxcvbnmqa for helping me to discover the Gothitelle checks featured above!
Dhelmise is, unfortuantely, not viable. Furthermore, for many of these pokemon, all they do is force out goth, which is handy, but not what they need. Fort a defensive team, heres some of the counterplay you can run without greatly disadvantaging your team, but it will have side effects ofc.

Lugia @ Leftovers
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Toxic
- Substitute
- Roost
- Dragon Tail
While Normal sets can win if they toxic ont he switch, this exchanges being a xerneas check beyond toxic for not dying to goth. Dragon Tail makes ice beam much less needed, but you can of course still run it over sub.

Yveltal @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Dark Aura
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Roost
- Foul Play
- Toxic
- Taunt
While sucker punch is great, Yveltal can run taunt+toxic to beat all gothitelle sets while still taking on the likes of ekiller.

Giratina @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Toxic
- Defog
- Roar
- Rest
Any giratina set will do, it can't be trapped.

Sableye-Mega @ Sablenite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Foul Play
- Toxic
- Protect
- Recover
Again, ghost, any set will win, plus it has bounce to not get taunted to force it to stay at low hp and is psy immune for a free switch.

Arceus-Dark @ Dread Plate
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 16 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Judgment
- Recover
- Defog
- Toxic / Will-O-Wisp
Not nearly as good as it used to be, but it still serves its role well as a physical wall and deffogger. Arceus ghost does something similar.


Ho-Oh @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 204 Def / 52 SpD
Impish Nature
- Sacred Fire
- Brave Bird
- Toxic
- Recover
Charm sets can win, but they cant switch in and ho-oh has plenty of chances to fish for crits. Defog support is harder with gothitelle, but by no means impossible, and you still have stuff like bounce.

Muk-Alola @ Assault Vest
Ability: Poison Touch
EVs: 252 HP / 80 Atk / 176 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Pursuit
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
- Shadow Sneak
Can lose to charm goth, but will at the very least koff it, burn a ton off pp, and leave it much more difficult for goth to switch into supportcues; vs standard cm taunt, it just wins, and can also trap other threats such as mewtwo and lunala.

Blissey @ Shed Shell
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Def / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
Calm Nature
- Soft-Boiled
- Toxic
- Heal Bell
- Confide
Cannot be trapped by goth or gar


Gothitelle is the most vile answer to support Arceus formes and support 'mons such as Ferrothorn in the tier. The centralization of the metagame around a great number of threats such as Primal Groudon, Mega Rayquaza, Ho-Oh, Xerneas, and mostly, Marshadow, has made role compression unavoidable, resulting in teams almost always relying on Pokemon such as Arceus-Fairy and other passive utility Pokemon to glue builds together. It is the pokemon that traps and removes defensive backbones in most balance team to open a way for the likes of Mega Rayquaza / Marshadow / Xerneas to run rampant, and I agree it is one of the most annoying Pokemon to deal with at this point.

Unfortunately Anything Goes, after all, is cartridge based and I don't think Gothitelle ban will happen under any circumstances unless the authorities make exceptionally off-rule decision.
This is completely off base. He never asked for a ban and of course anything goes wont have them anyway.
 

DoW

formally Death on Wings
is a Pre-Contributor
The problem with trapping is not that the trappers can't be beaten (Mega Gengar is perfectly fine in the 1v1 metagame), but rather that having a counter isn't good enough. I've considered building stall teams this gen, and the fact that Gothitelle is so common is highly frustrating - it's almost impossible to build a stall team where every pokemon is able to phaze or escape trapping. Instead, I think it is a little more common to have one bait mon, which you expect their trapper to come in on and which can escape via shed shell or u-turn, and a pursuit trapper. The problem here is that you're then forced to use somehting like ttar, however it's still fairly viable in the current metagame, you just need to ensure you don't come in on charm.

That said, the only reason I used stall in the AG metagame to begin with was that it simply wasn't well enough prepared for - whenever I go on a ladder, one of the first things I think is "how many of these teams straight-up lose to chansey?" - and it was plenty when I started using stall. The prevalence of trappers reduces this to very few, and I now would simply state that using stall isn't realistically viable in the present metagame. Instead, it's far more productive to use a few mons that can phase or escape gothitelle as your bulky core, or simply use offense.
 

Squawkerz

Torchic is best mon
Quick note: this needs to be updated. Please delete my post as soon as the stuff is updated. Also, something with Marshadow needs to be in the sample teams. Thanks!
That was in no way official and just my opinions on it at pretty much release day of sun and moon, a lot of the other stuff in it is wrong too, like Solgaleo being a meta defining monster
 

Pigeons

formerly Yuga42
Quick note: this needs to be updated. Also, something with Marshadow needs to be in the sample teams. Thanks!

Edit: Because this post is kinda a waste of time without any usefuk information, I am gonna point out that phazing trappers is just not gonna work too well for stall teams. Due to this, stall is probably going to see significantly less use as Gothitelle grows in popularity. Also, so that stall users do not completely give up hope, here is a quick set that should be able to phaze trappers kinda effectively, and work well with stall teams.


Arceus-Steel @ Iron Plate
Ability: Multitype
Evs: whatever
-Roar
-Judgment
-Stealth Rock
-Recover

Edit 2: Thanks for the quick reply, but this is kinda misleading if it is not up to date. New players will be turned away from the tier as a whole if the resources are out of date/incorrect.
Like Squawkerz said, those initial posts were just speculation so there's no need to update. If you'd read the thread more carefully you'd see there are multiple teams with Marshadow on them so please do so before posting in the future. On an aside the set you posted does not avoid getting trapped by Gothitelle because it just Taunts anyways. If you want to improve your Arceus's matchup against Gothitelle, Magic Coat is definitely a good option for blocking both Taunt and Confide while having addition utility against suicide leads.
 
well i am going to post a short note here about gothitelle's check/counter thing.I am using gothitelle currently and only thing that i have found that gives problem to this mon is darkceus+a dtailer i have faced this and imo darkceus can be used in current balance teams another thing i find good is whirpool perish song arceus you can use either of them darkceus or perishpool Ceus.
 
well i am going to post a short note here about gothitelle's check/counter thing.I am using gothitelle currently and only thing that i have found that gives problem to this mon is darkceus+a dtailer i have faced this and imo darkceus can be used in current balance teams another thing i find good is whirpool perish song arceus you can use either of them darkceus or perishpool Ceus.
I'd say the only relevant dtailer is Zygarde / Zygarde-C and these two are not the 'mons you wanna trap. Lugia prefers Whirlwind over Dragon Tail too phaze non-Ingrain Xerneas variants so I won't really say dtailer is a relevant answer to Gothitelle. What Gothitelle aims to trap and remove are support Arceus forms that stuff like Mega Rayquaza / Marshadow do not enjoy having around, aka Arceus-Fairy or any other defensive roadblocks.

I won't really say Darkceus is the best Arceus form either; I don't think it checks anything in particular except having improved matchup against Psychic-spam teams which can already be easily dealt with other ways. It isn't the Arceus form you might wanna rely on in the tier flooded with Xerneas / Magearna / Marshadow. It is not like it OHKO's -1 Mega Rayquaza with Judgment or anything. Also Gothitelle can just switch out of Arceus-Dark while Arceus can't double switch or anything because of Shadow Tag.

Perish Song Arceus with Whirlpool... I mean I don't see how is this even a productive way to check Gothitelle. You will also die in 3 turns and you can't escape because of Shadow Tag, and if you let your precious Arceus form perish together with Gothitelle... that is something what Gothi essentially wants to happen; mostly after trapping and removing its target, Gothitelle would have outlived its usefulness, so trading Arceus and Gothitelle isn't really worth in the first place imo.
 
I'd say the only relevant dtailer is Zygarde / Zygarde-C and these two are not the 'mons you wanna trap. Lugia prefers Whirlwind over Dragon Tail too phaze non-Ingrain Xerneas variants so I won't really say dtailer is a relevant answer to Gothitelle. What Gothitelle aims to trap and remove are support Arceus forms that stuff like Mega Rayquaza / Marshadow do not enjoy having around, aka Arceus-Fairy or any other defensive roadblocks.

I won't really say Darkceus is the best Arceus form either; I don't think it checks anything in particular except having improved matchup against Psychic-spam teams which can already be easily dealt with other ways. It isn't the Arceus form you might wanna rely on in the tier flooded with Xerneas / Magearna / Marshadow. It is not like it OHKO's -1 Mega Rayquaza with Judgment or anything. Also Gothitelle can just switch out of Arceus-Dark while Arceus can't double switch or anything because of Shadow Tag.

Perish Song Arceus with Whirlpool... I mean I don't see how is this even a productive way to check Gothitelle. You will also die in 3 turns and you can't escape because of Shadow Tag, and if you let your precious Arceus form perish together with Gothitelle... that is something what Gothi essentially wants to happen; mostly after trapping and removing its target, Gothitelle would have outlived its usefulness, so trading Arceus and Gothitelle isn't really worth in the first place imo.
I would agree that Arceus-Dark isn't the best in the current metagame, but its not like magearna is particularly common currently; while you have correctly identified xerneas and marshadow as threats, its not as though they remove arceus-darks utility or anything. In addition to not being readily trapped, either by gengar or gothitelle, arcues-dark acts as a solid check to the likes of lunala and yveltal, both of which pressure a lot of balance teams. It can also fill the standard supportceus roles such as defog and mixed wall; for instance, it serves as an adequate check to primal groudon in most cases, and has nothing to fear from arceus ghost, which is still a solid pokemon even with the competition given my marshadow. It has plenty of utility even aside from trappin, and is a solid choice for teams that need reliable defog (such as hooh balances).


Moving on to a different topic, I have to say that I've really been liking Zmove Marshadow + Mega Gengar. Most teams run at most two defensive arceus as marshadow checks, and nearly invariably one of those is going to be arceus-fairy for the role compression it offers. Mega Gengar can trap and remove arceus-fairy, allowing Marshadow to freely use a +1 zmove to muscle past whatever the other check is without another arceus being able to just come in and wall it further. Mega Gengar also acts as a check to xerneas, while marshadow can take out the likes of tyranitar or or chansey. While they share weaknesses to the likes of Primal groudon and Yevltal, that can be covered with your other four pokemon.