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BW OU Apocalypse (Peaked #1)

Discussion in 'RMT Archive' started by LUST, Oct 29, 2011.

  1. LUST

    LUST
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    I really appreciate your rate SJCrew, and I also believe that I beat your own sun with this team on the ladder. If you really want me to post the replay on here, I'd be more than happy to do so. I'll definitely test Choice Scarf Terrakion out. Best thing to do on Scarfty is to switch to Rotom-W as it DDs up and trick it. It will either go for HJK, Drain Punch, Crunch or perhaps an another DD? After that it's really easy to handle. I know it can cause further problems but meh. I know this team is weak to sun sweepers but nothing is perfect and if you play each poke right you have a chance for sure. Losing a couple battles won't drop you as much and I've beaten Sun teams many times too, again i'll test your suggestions out and see how it goes.

    You're Welcome and Thanks man. I also have an updated version for this team which I'll be posting soon.
  2. SJCrew

    SJCrew Believer, going on a journey...
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    Likewise, I recognize this team from having played it just yesterday, and I believe I won 3-0 in a not-so-close game. But the point is moot, as you and I are both aware that I am not exaggerating this team's Sun weakness. I wouldn't mind seeing that replay either. People who are interested in using this team should get an idea of how to react against a Sun team.
  3. LUST

    LUST
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    As I said the better version of this team should be up shortly. In meantime here's a battle vs you under my alt. while I was testing: http://pokemon.aesoft.org/replay-fuckabro-vs-SJCrew--2011-10-23 . Plus I haven't laddered for awhile due to midterms and shit, you must had played someone else.
  4. SJCrew

    SJCrew Believer, going on a journey...
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    Ooh, that team. Shame it's so blatantly Terrakion weak and has no Chloro sweepers. I'll still whip that one out every now and then for fun. <3 Regardless, I think a battle against a traditional Sun team would have been a better way to exemplify your point, where you'll actually see some of the dangerous stuff I was talking about, like setup sweepers. I'm more interested in seeing how you handle those.
  5. shrang

    shrang Go to your room
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    Man, this team has just become too abusable. Every third team I see is this one or some variant, and it's getting me annoyed already. It goes without saying that this is a brilliant team.

    Just one thing of note that I've picked up while playing this team like 50 times in the last few weeks, and one that I have really taken advantage of. Should Stealth Rock be up (not hard), and it switches in on a something that it resists (again, not hard, I've been coming in X-Scissor a lot of the time), Swords Dance Lucario with both ExtremeSpeed AND Bullet Punch (Yes, it's my MVP now, for obvious reasons, it is actually really legit) x-0's you pretty much immediately. Not much you can do about this without wrecking your synergy, but just something to think about.
  6. Rewer

    Rewer
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    Hi Mostwanted

    Every pepole are using versions of this team on the ladder, eh, you, squirrel and lamppost made a dirty job there :( Pepole talk about your Sun weakness, i'd rather talk about your Bulky SD Scizor weakness. To Remedy this, you should give your Rotom a Choice Specs and give your Terrakion a Choice Scarf. Terrakion revenges much more stuff here than Rotom-W, much more stuff. Rotom-W packs a incredible power against rain, being able to even 2HKO some Ferrothorn with Hydro Pump. Rain does not want to mess with him, and for other styles he can came in and give you a free switch for your sweepers. Also give Hidden Power Grass instead of Ice so you can blow that slug off.

    Now, about your Gengar, I think he's like of a free spot there as you think "Oh, i'm using spikes, lets add a spinblocker". Deal with Gengar is all spinners can break his sub and once they saw leftovers they gonna switch to a faster mon on the obvious disable, not to mention disable gar is incredible weak and stopping deo-s from setting up many layers is not hard. So I suggest you change your Gengar to a Starmie. Your team dosent apreciate hazards itself, even though you have the deo lead to stop hazards early game, like i said its not hard to stop him laying many hazard, especially without sash, you have two scout members and dragonite, so a spinner will help alot on this department. I'd use something like Leftovers - Hydro Pump, Ice Beam, HP grass, Rapid Spin, like in Stone_Cold's team.

    Eh I see you have an priority Lucario major weakness too, so you might try ev en Infernape, Conkeldurr or NP Lucario here, the problem is where, maybe over dragonite, but you dont want to fuck your own sweeper. Maybe infernape > scizor (also fixes your jirachi weakness!) with Life Orb, U-Turn (seems suicide, but you have a spinner now!) Fire Blast, Mach Punch and Close Combat will help here, I think pepole are overrating your sun weakness. Dragonite can tear sun teams apart and can handle well if multiscale is up (again, you have a spinner now!) Terrakion does a great job there, and if you choose infernape, you can lure a mon and keep momentum with volt switch rotom and go ape on the likes of venusaur, they either need to sack venu (wich will be awesome) or something else while you can just u-turn out or hitting, whatever gives you more advantage and whatever you guess.

    Good luck, this is an amazing team
  7. Chaos Storm

    Chaos Storm

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    Good team, but it's not fucking Heavy Offense. And what the hell is "Volt Switch + U-turn combo which is pretty effective in HO"? No it fucking isn't. It ruins your stat boosts.

    Deoxys-S: If this "IS" Heavy Offense, Deoxys-S should have a moveset of Reflect, Light Screen, Stealth Rock, Taunt and be holding Light Clay. The EVs are good. His nature should be Jolly/Timid. He wont outspeed any other Deoxys-S, Sableye with that moveset. You pretty much just gave Deoxys a chance to set up both of it's screens or switch into something that can OHKO it by making it slower than the before mentioned. Tyranitar with no boosts using Crunch has an 88.82% - 104.61% chance of OHKOing it, which leaves you either dead, switching, or setting up another layer of spikes/layer of rocks. Another common pokemon seen in HO is SD Scizor. Bug Bite will OHKO the bitch. Leaving you again, either dead, switching, or setting up another layer of spikes/layer of rocks.

    Gengar: Take him completely out of there and replace it with something like Double Dance Haxorus. Since SD Scizor could be a problem, this is why you should use it. It can 2HKO Scizor after 1 Dragon Dance and 1 Swords Dance, it can also 2HKO Skarmory (54.79% - 64.37%) after the same boosts, and boosting to that is easy. An EV spread of 32 HP/252 Atk/220 Spe will let you outrun things and still survive many attacks.

    Rotom-W: Take him the fuck out of the ballgame. Replace the fucker with Dragon Dance Tyranitar. That guy is a fucking beast. Getting to +3 might be a bit hard but once he gets there, he out speeds Timid max speed Latios, Latias, Gengar, etc, and OHKOs them.

    Double Booster Terrakion also deserves a mention in here. At +2, almost nothing out speeds this guy. It out speeds Shell Smash Cloyster and OHKOs it with Close Combat. Almost nothing can stop this guy after +2 of Atk and Spe.

    Scizor: Scizor is a great pokemon for Heavy Offense. This set is shit for it though. Don't put U-Turn on a fucking SD Scizor. It's too slow to get out of situations and U-Turn will just cancel out his boosts. Take off Roost because his main goal is to sweep as much as he can in 1 hit and have good move coverage, not roost shit off. It makes him a pussy on HO if he does that.

    Terrakion: Do you NOT know that Heavy Offense does NOT use choiced items? It is completely pointless because you can't set up. You're stuck in you fucking move.

    Since i've already suggested him, I will suggest something like Infernape if you're using Tyranitar. He can wreck shit if you use him right.

    Dragonite: Finally, the end to my rant. He can be good with Haxorus under screens. I mean amazing. This is the only one you haven't fucked up on. Just don't use him if you use Tyranitar.

    I honestly thought all of you would recognize this as not Heavy Offense. If you want to see a real updated 5th gen HO guide, click this. THAT is HO, not this HO posing shit. Who gives a shit if it's on Serebii? Some people on there are highly respected members on here like Zeph, SkyNet, AB2, Lizardman, etc. I know Lizardman has contributed to that HO guide. I seriously think all of you are retarded now.
  8. kill yourself

    kill yourself .|~Fashionista~|.
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    I don't think you're in any position to make comments like this on such a successful team, especially when you're not even correct. The method of HO you're referring to, Screens Deoxys + 5 setup sweepers, is hyper offense. That playstyle relies on 5 combined sweepers to break down a shared counter. This team is heavy offense, relying on synergy to force switches and cause damage from hazards (which Gengar prevents from being spun away, so he can't be replaced). Scizor is running SD + U-turn to bluff a Choice Band early game and then surprise the opponent by boosting lategame and cleaning with Bullet Punch. Learn your shit before trying talking trash and trying to replace half the members of a #1 ranked team.

    After playing this team about five million times in the past two weeks, I think running Scarf on Terrakion would really help with the team's problems against Chlorophyll sweepers like Venusaur. Multiple hazards make up for the loss of CB's power. I also think Occa Berry is worth trying on Scizor to help against mons that rely on HP Fire to beat it (most notably against Celebi but it also lets you escape from Magnezone if it catches you on a double switch).
  9. KnivesNPistols

    KnivesNPistols

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    That Chaos Storm guy obviously doesn't know what's he talking about. Take a successful offensive team and ruin it completly, just so you can call it a true Hyper Offense team. Great thinking there man.:evan:


    About the team, I see Gengar as the weakest link. Its set is just too predictable and it even has to rely on that stupid Focus Blast. Have you at least tried out the LO variant or maybe Pain Split? Gengar is not the best spinblocker (probably the main reason why you use him) either, way too frail and has problems switching into Starmie, the most common spinner. I would recommend changing that spot to someone that could help against sun but it's hard to find the right candidate that would not open other weakness, for example Heatran (great sun counter obviously) would increase the one to Starmie, rain and fighters too much.

    If you decide to scarf Terrakion, putting specs on Rotom could balance out the loss of power. However you could lose the ability to revenge crucial threats, so be careful. Occa berry on Scizor is not a bad idea, but weaker priority could hurt the team. That change would require some testing to see if it pays off.

    Good luck and congrats on this great team.
  10. By Myself

    By Myself

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    Ok, this made me laugh for a long time seeing as you don't really know what you're saying. Like BKC said what you're talking about is Hyper Offense. You should really think about what you say before you say it next time especially on such a popular post. Also that post being your first on Smogon forums, i really have nothing much else to say.

    Great team Supr, really is annoying seeing randoms using it on ladder but you know what can you do?
  11. Xephyr

    Xephyr

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    Yep, this guy's an idiot. Move along people.

    I have to agree with what Shrang said. As someone who has used that Lucario (Espeed AND Bullet Punch), I can safely say that it mostly decimates this team. Rotom can survive an Espeed if it hasn't taken any damage IIRC but with rocks up your team still won't really stand a chance. But there's not much that can be done to fix it, AND it's an obscure threat. So it's not too much to worry about, but it's definitely a problem.
  12. Chaos Storm

    Chaos Storm

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    It's the same fucking thing dumbass.This team is not Heavy Offense or Hyper Offense at all. Heavy and Hyper Offense are the same things with 2 different names, but it is still the same concept.

    The Heavy Offense thread on here is 4th gen. The one on there is 5th. I know what I'm fucking talking about. This is a regular OU team, not Heavy/Hyper Offense.

    Hyper Offense and Heavy Offense are the same thing. Who gives a fuck if it's my first post?

    Who gives a fuck. It doesn't matter what the post count is, just how much you know. The guide here is 4th gen, not 5th. Take a fucking look at it and see my point dumbass.

    Oh no! Shoot me for posting somewhere about something I know about for having a post count of 1!
  13. Dragone

    Dragone

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    Chaos Storm, if I was Rainbow Dash I would tell you that you need to be about 20% cooler to even figure out what Heavy Offense is, but since I'm not I will just tell you to respect the teams and players that have the talent and work ethic to make it to number one.

    Have a nice day
  14. Chaos Storm

    Chaos Storm

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    That was the worst comeback I have ever seen.

    I'm not sure if this is good or bad towards me, although, I do agree it was a bit messy. I can't stand to see this many people think that this is Heavy/Hyper Offense.
  15. Moo

    Moo Professor
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    Why does anyone's team have to be pinned down by labels like Stall, Heavy Offense, Hyper offense etc? Imo if you build / rate a team with that mindset then you're just restricting your options....
  16. Pocket

    Pocket Apo, the astronaut's best friend >:3
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    Who gives a fuck if this team doesn't fit your definition of "heavy offense?" Don't change up the team just to make it "heavy offense" - change it to make the team better. Yes, Dual Screen Deoxys-S is the bread-and-butter heavy offense for you, good job. Doesn't mean it fits this team. This team abuses SR + Spikes with Volt Switch and U-turns, while CBTerrakion provides the wall-breaking power to allow Dragonite to sweep. Gengar is necessary to keep these SR + Spikes on the field to wear the opponent down.

    Here are other teams that do not rely on predictable "heavy offense" tactics to do work:
    ShakeItUp
    bcam0991
    X5Dragon

    Welcome to Smogon, and expand your mind box.
  17. Xephyr

    Xephyr

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    I say we have Chaos Storm pit one of his fancy super offense teams against mostwanted and this team to see how he fares.
  18. Chaos Storm

    Chaos Storm

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    Look, all I'm saying is that this isn't heavy offense. Everybody thinks it is, that's what's bugging me. This is just a normal DW/OU team. This is a very similar team to HO, but this is just a spike stacking offensive team.

    This isn't my definition of a HO team. It is the guy whoever deemed Heavy Offense Heavy Offense. I know what the team does, I'm not stupid. I read the OP. I even agreed that this is a very good team. This play style is this play style. Stall is stall like HO is HO. HO is not this team.

    This is the 4th gen HO thread from Smogon.

    SAMALIA'S team is HO, pure HO.

    SOMALIAs Team (open)
    Espeon (M) @ Light Clay
    Trait: Synchronize
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Light Screen
    - Reflect
    - Rain Dance
    - Psychic

    Omastar (M) @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Swift Swim
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Surf
    - Ice Beam
    - Shell Smash
    - Hidden Power [Grass]

    Scizor (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Swarm
    EVs: 200 HP / 252 Atk / 52 SDef / 4 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Bug Bite
    - Bullet Punch
    - Swords Dance
    - Brick Break

    Latios (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Recover
    - Surf
    - Thunderbolt

    Haxorus (M) @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Rivalry
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Outrage
    - Earthquake
    - Dragon Dance
    - Brick Break

    Volcarona (M) @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Flame Body
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Flamethrower
    - Bug Buzz
    - Hidden Power [Rock]
    - Quiver Dance


    Isn't BW OU a play style? Isn't Stall a play style? HO is a play style just as much as Stall and other styles.

    As for expanding my "mind box", you can not bend the rules of HO, just like you can not bend the rules of stall. It's like using ubers on an OU team. You just can't do that.

    My team is not the greatest HO team. I never said that. I never said HO was the best thing sinced sliced bread and is better than everything else. I'm sorry if it seemed that way. I would battle if I could, but I have limited PO access. If you really want to battle someone who knows HO and can utilize it well, go to Nachos or Lizardman.
  19. Bluewind

    Bluewind My appearance, ability, and awesomeness strike fea
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    Thanks for posting in this thread five times, I'm sure its creator, as well as the many readers of this thread, found it extremely important to take note that this is NOT a Heavy Offense team, but a Spiked-Balance-Heavily-Biased-Towards-Offense Team.

    Your rate was also terrible.

    Edit: Also lol a thread by Sprinkles.

    Also, so that this post isn't only a rant at stupidity, I do support the change to Scarf Terrakion.
  20. Rewer

    Rewer
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    chaos storm, you didint realized something. HO = Hyper Offense. This is a pokemon with screens and setupers playing all-auto pilot. This one is an heavy (not hyper) offensive team, this one tries to setup as many hazards it can and then keep pressuring the opponent using scout team strategy and hard hitters like terrakion, while gengar acts as a spinblocker and dnite as a cleanup. it plays different
  21. extremebeta

    extremebeta

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    lol bluewind, good post is good.

    Please don't try to alter the style of Mostwanted's play and make it fit with Hyper Offense, that is what you did in your first post.

    Great team Mostwanted, maybe try muscle band instead of Iron plate. Iron plate boosts Bullet Punch by 20% but Muscle Band boosts all Bullet punch and Uturn by 10%. I know it doesn't really matter, I only said that because I can't find any other flaws ._.
  22. Chaos Storm

    Chaos Storm

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    Don't care, had sex my input.

    This is the only HO guide on here. People here actually go to things that are on Smogon.


    Hyper Offense IS Heavy Offense. It is the same thing. This is, like I have already said, a spike stacking offensive team.

    Well I "altered" it to fit HO.
  23. dragonuser

    dragonuser The only thing I look up to is the sky
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    waits to see Mostwanteds response

    seriously chaos y mess wit such a great team(especially when u give terrible rates). Sure it isnt traditional HO, no reason to go all apeshit
  24. extremebeta

    extremebeta

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    That is fine as long as you have a good reason that his team has to fit HO.
  25. Chaos Storm

    Chaos Storm

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    You mean stuff with HO? That isn't the worst.

    None? None at all? Of course there is. It's written all over the first post with 4 pages of it and everybody here thinks that it is HO.

    I do, it says it all over the first post.

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