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Ubers Arceus-Ground

Discussion in 'Preliminary Pokedex' started by PISTOLERO, May 15, 2014.

?

What is your favourite Swords Dance Arceus type? [hint: the lower you go the better they are]

  1. Arceus-Normal (ew no, how boring)

    45.5%
  2. Arceus-Ghost (is cool, but still mainstream)

    15.2%
  3. Arceus-Ground (yay that's what this analysis is about)

    27.3%
  4. Arceus-Dragon (.... I hate Fairy-Types so much)

    9.1%
  5. Arceus-Water (yay this one is cool too)

    15.2%
  6. Arceus-Rock (this one isn't actually bad, Stone Edge hurts like a bitch)

    12.1%
  7. Arceus-Grass (Sweep agrees with me that this is cool, go read his comments on Arceus-Grass)

    15.2%
  8. Arceus-Flying (Nayrz will tell you himself that this one is good, STAB Aerial Ace or Fly is cool af)

    12.1%
  9. Arceus-Psychic (it learns Zen Headbutt, and is awesome anyway, and it's pink)

    18.2%
  10. Arceus-Ice (Avalanche + Earthquake + Stone Edge is fun)

    33.3%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. PISTOLERO

    PISTOLERO formerly LustrousPalkia

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2014
    Messages:
    290
    Arceus-Ground


    [​IMG]

    Extremekiller is a little bitch, try [my] Earthquakes on for size - Sweep

    QC Checks: Sweep, Shrang, Hack He Must
    GP Checks: GatoDelFuego , Ender


    Overview
    ########

    Arceus-Ground gained new niches during the generation shift, filling a useful role on many offensive team archetypes. With excellent bulk and typical Arceus base 120 stats, Arceus-Ground can fit into many teams easily. The most important defensive role for Arceus-Ground is to absorb Bolt Strikes from Zekrom, a very threatening Pokemon this generation, but Arceus-Ground can also be a very powerful sweeper that uses Swords Dance to fire off powerful STAB Earthquakes. It can also act as a very useful Thunder Wave sponge and severely threatens Klefki, the most common user of Prankster Thunder Wave, which can ruin offensive teams otherwise.

    However, Arceus-Ground does have quite a few flaws. Common support Arceus formes such as Arceus-Water and Arceus-Grass have a type advantage against it. Choice Scarf Kyogre in particular can outspeed and OHKO Ground Arceus with ease with either Water Spout or Surf, meaning that Arceus-Ground must have significant team support to deal with it. There is also a certain opportunity cost when using Arceus-Ground: as it takes up your Arceus slot, you can no longer use support Arceus variants with Defog and/or Will-O-Wisp, or Calm Mind Arceus formes such as Electric and Poison. Lastly, other variants of Swords Dance Arceus such as Extreme Killer can often fit into teams far more easily than Arceus-Ground can.

    Swords Dance
    ########
    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Earthquake
    move 3: Stone Edge
    move 4: Recover / Extreme Speed / Ice Beam
    item: Earth Plate
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

    Moves
    ========
    Earthquake is an incredibly powerful move. With a Swords Dance boost, Earthquake OHKOes virtually all non-Levitating Pokemon in the tier barring immunities and certain support Arceus formes. Stone Edge nails those immune to Earthquake, such as Ho-Oh, Yveltal, and Lugia, for super effective damage, and completes the famous EdgeQuake combination. Recover can be used for longevity throughout a match and helps Arceus-Ground take hits from Zekrom as well as letting it set up more easily. However, Extreme Speed is useful to finish off weakened Choice Scarf users that attempt to revenge kill Arceus-Ground. Ice Beam is an interesting option—it works best on Sticky Web teams, but it is also extremely useful to hit Landorus-T, Gliscor, and Shaymin-S super effectively, although it can only hit the latter on the switch. Gliscor and Landorus-T in particular can irritate Arceus-Ground with Toxic whilst not taking too much from Stone Edge, and they are often problematic for Sticky Web teams to face otherwise. Lastly, Shadow Force specifically targets Giratina, Giratina-O, and Lugia (although Lugia can Roost back to Multiscale due to the charge turn), dealing heavy damage to all of them after a Swords Dance. It also allows Arceus to avoid status and phazing moves, and works quite nicely if the opponent's Pokemon are burned or poisoned.

    Set Details
    ========
    Full investment in Attack and Speed allows Arceus-Ground to outpace most of the tier, letting it Speed tie with other max Speed Arceus formes, and allows its moves to hit for maximum damage, with four special defense EVs giving Genesect an Attack boost so it cannot attack with a boosted Ice Beam. As Arceus-Ground has an excellent typing and bulk, HP investment is unnecessary most of the time. Another interesting spread is Adamant with full Speed, Attack, and four Special Defense. This allows Arceus-Ground to hit much harder and still reaches 339 Speed, allowing it to Speed tie with max Speed base 105s, which admittedly are rare, and also outspeed Palkia and everything below it. Most importantly of all, it allows it to oustpeed support Arceus formes that run standard 96+ Speed spreads. It also outruns Arceus formes around this range that Speed creep each other and gives Arceus-Ground a chance to OHKO those neutral to Earthquake at +2 after Stealth Rock. Thus, Arceus-Ground can escape a burn, whereas Jolly Arceus cannot OHKO after Stealth Rock at all. However, this does mean that non-Mega Gengar can outspeed and Destiny Bond Arceus away, which it cannot do against Jolly variants. If using Arceus-Ground on a Sticky Web team, an alternative spread with Adamant nature, 40 HP, 252 Attack, 4 Special Defense and 212 Speed can be used. 212 Speed allows it to outspeed base 100s such as Mega Charizard Y, which is immune to Sticky Web and hits hard with Fire Blast or Solarbeam. However, tailoring EV Spreads to suit your team is perfectly fine; investing in HP and Defense is perfectly reasonable if you prefer to be able to take on Zekrom better, as well as having better all around bulk. An important benchmark to hit is running enough Speed to beat Palkia. An example of such a spread is 80 Attack and 112 Speed with a Jolly nature, which allows Arceus-Ground to outspeed Garchomp and OHKO Palkia, Mewtwo, and Mega Mewtwo Y from full health at +2;the rest can then be invested in bulk to comfortably take attacks from things such as Zekrom.

    Usage Tips
    ========
    Swords Dance Arceus-Ground functions as a late-game sweeper if not running Recover, when Choice Scarf users and other faster Pokemon are either gone or weakened enough to fall to Extreme Speed. Burn is extremely threatening to Arceus-Ground, so be mindful about setting up on anything that even has a chance of burning it. Despite its weaknesses, it has an excellent Electric-type immunity. Therefore, Arceus-Ground can liberally switch into Zekrom's Bolt Strike or Volt Switch, which is often Choice-locked, and regain momentum from there.

    If running Recover, Arceus-Ground immediately becomes a lot more durable and can be useful throughout the entire game. It becomes a lot easier and less risky to switch into Zekrom, and it is also able to Recover off weak attacks and set up. If using Arceus early-game, it is advised to switch it in at the right time. Switching it in on Zekrom's Bolt Strike works very well, as Arceus then gets a free turn. In the mid-game, it is advised to throw out Earthquakes to see what the opponent's response to Arceus is. This way, Arceus can weaken its checks and counters and not be forced out by something that threatens it and lose momentum; Arceus-Ground tends to provoke an immediate response, and it is perfectly feasible to catch Choice Scarf Kyogre with an Earthquake on the switch as it expects Swords Dance. You can also force the opponent's hand and scout out their team.


    Team Options
    ========
    It is mandatory to have a good Choice Scarf Kyogre check on a team with Arceus-Ground. Choice Scarf Zekrom, Palkia, and specially defensive Dialga are excellent for this role; however, Choice Scarf Zekrom can only switch in once and Dialga can only take two full-strength Water Spouts. Wobbuffet, Yveltal, and Xerneas are also excellent teammates for removing Giratina-O and pressuring support Arceus, with the first being able to use Encore and Shadow Tag to give Arceus-Ground an opportunity to set up and the latter two being able to force out Giratina and Giratina-O. Interestingly, Geomancy Xerneas and Swords Dance Arceus-Ground work very well together, as, with smart double switching, it is easy to set up with Arceus-Ground against Xerneas's checks such as Klefki, whereas Xerneas can either Geomancy or Moonblast against Giratina, Giratina-O and certain Support Arceus. However, one must watch out for Roar. Gothitelle, Wobbuffet, and Mega Gengar are all good trappers that can aid Arceus-Ground by removing its checks such as support Arceus and creating conditions where Arceus-Ground can freely set up. A burn absorber or Aromatherapy support is recommend to ensure that Arceus-Ground is free from burn, meaning that it can have more than one chance at setting up. Blissey and defensive Xerneas excel at this supporting role, and Blissey helps with the support Arceus weakness that Arceus-Ground has. Xerneas and Arceus-Ground also go well together as because they create a dual immunity against Zekrom. Along with Palkia and Kyogre, Zekrom is forced into nasty 50/50 situations each time it tries to revenge kill something. Lastly, Choice Specs Kyogre is a nice offensive partner, as it can lure in and wear down many of Arceu-Ground's checks, such as Giratina. In return, Arceus-Ground can absorb Bolt Strikes for Kyogre.

    Other Options
    ########
    Overheat can be used to hit Bronzong and Skarmory, which take a pittance from Arceus-Ground's moves otherwise. A Calm Mind set with Judgment, Ice Beam, and Recover can be used, but it is vastly inferior to the Swords Dance set this generation, due to the weak damage output even after a boost, the inability to boost quickly, and the hideous weakness to Toxic. A support set of Earthquake, Stone Edge, Recover, and Will-O-Wisp, Toxic, Defog, or Stealth Rock can be used to surprise checks and provide team support. This set is also the best Zekrom counter in the game. A specially defensive support set can run Roar to phaze Geomancy Xerneas. Dragon Claw can be used over Recover or Extreme Speed on Swords Dance sets to deal heavy damage to Giratina-O; Outrage could be used to OHKO it after a Swords Dance, but the lock-in effect is awful. Magic Coat can be used to anti-lead Deoxys and bounce back status aimed towards it. Gravity can be used to remove the Ground-type immunity of Ho-Oh and Skarmory, allowing Arceus-Ground to bypass some of its checks. A mono-attacking set of Earthquake, Swords Dance, Gravity, and Recover is hilarious and is actually only resisted by Grass- and Bug-Types, of which there are few in Ubers.

    Checks & Counters
    ########
    **Water-types**: Choice Scarf Kyogre can easily revenge kill Arceus-Ground with powerful Water-type attacks. Defensive Kyogre can phaze Arceus-Ground or hit it with Scald, but does not take a boosted Earthquake very well at all. Arceus-Water can burn Arceus-Ground or hit it with Judgment. Palkia can take an unboosted Earthquake (albeit not very nicely) and KO Arceus-Ground with either Surf or Hydro Pump.

    **Grass-types**: Shaymin-S is always guaranteed to be faster than Arceus-Ground thanks to its base 127 Speed and immunity to Sticky Web. It can then easily dispose of Arceus-Ground with Seed Flare or Leaf Storm. It can also switch in on Earthquake, but gets worked over by Stone Edge and Ice Beam and can fall to a boosted Extreme Speed if it has taken prior damage, with it being a guaranteed OHKO after two Stealth Rock switch-ins.

    **Ground / Flying Types**: Landorus-T and Gliscor can Toxic stall Arceus-Ground forever. Gliscor takes +2 Stone Edge with ease and can Roost off any damage, not fearing Earthquake due to its Roosts being slower. However, Landorus-T does not appreciate repeated boosted Stone Edges, and they both have to watch out for Ice Beam.

    **Giratina-O and Giratina**: Both formes of Giratina laugh at whatever Arceus-Ground tries to do and threaten with Will-O-Wisp. They can also phaze Arceus-Ground out if it tries to boost through burn.

    **Bronzong & Skarmory**: Bronzong is virtually untouched by any of Arceus-Ground's attacks and threatens with Toxic whilst setting up Stealth Rock. Skarmory can do the same as Bronzong while also being able to phaze Arceus-Ground away with Whirlwind.

    **Multiscale Lugia**: Lugia can stall out Stone Edge PP with Roost if it is faster and then phaze or Toxic stall Arceus. However, with Stealth Rock up, Lugia can lose to faster Stone Edges, as it will take them before being able to Roost.

    **Support Arceus**: Support Arceus formes sometimes run maximum Speed, and can use Will-O-Wisp and then simply stall with Recover until Arceus-Ground faints. However, they need to win both Speed ties, otherwise they will be KOed by Earthquake. Arceus-Grass and Arceus-Water deserve special mention for being able to hit Arceus-Ground for super effective damage, with Arceus-Grass also resisting Earthquake.
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2014
  2. PISTOLERO

    PISTOLERO formerly LustrousPalkia

    Joined:
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    I took Orch's 2/3 Skeleton, CPed it and rewrote it in part, added in what Melee Mewtwo said as well, I think this is just fine for 3 quick restamps :)
  3. Sweep

    Sweep
    is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderator

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    QC 1/3

    This isn't a pussy like EKiller, it hits really hard at +2 and eq+se grant it near perfect coverage. What a beautiful mon.

    Edit: I'll add comments later

    Reviver's spread is fine, mention zardY as it's viable, base 105 speed mons do not really exist in ubers so shoot for Chompy and below.
    Last edited: May 17, 2014
    user php and PISTOLERO like this.
  4. PISTOLERO

    PISTOLERO formerly LustrousPalkia

    Joined:
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    Sweep there's shittons of stuff in red, it's stuff that I'd like to hear opinions on as some of it is pretty specific. Adamant max Speed is a spread i came up with and it actually works very nicely, as most supportceus creep Palkia then leave it at that, meaning you can beat the shit out of them ez. Not sure if this qualifies as speed creep though....?

    But yeah, I love this thing, simple to use, gets results, and seriously fuck you Klefki.

    I'll lace in a mention of how good this thing is on offensive teams to eat up Thunder Wave, I'm just not sure where.

    Finally, Groundceus fits on offensive teams but not really on defensive ones, so what's the standard in terms of teammates? do we mention defensive teammates such as SpDef Palkia?
  5. shrang

    shrang I AM CHAMPION CHRISTMAS!!
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

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    Maybe add Overheat to moves/OO? It lets you deal decent damage to Bronzong as well as having a shot to OHKO Skarmory after Stealth Rock. Also mention Shadow Claw/Force in OO as it's your best shot against Bronzong.

    EDIT:
    SD Fireceus is obviously the best
    Last edited: May 16, 2014
    Piexplode and Nayrz like this.
  6. Nayrz

    Nayrz
    is a Pre-Contributor

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    Seconding the use of Shadow Force, destroys Giratina-O as well as Bronzong and can even avoid status / phasing. Groundceus can do whatever it likes with that last moveslot.

    Edit: It can also screw Lugia if rocks are up: +2 252 Atk Arceus-Ground Shadow Force vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lugia: 296-350 (71.1 - 84.1%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
  7. orch

    orch

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  8. PISTOLERO

    PISTOLERO formerly LustrousPalkia

    Joined:
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    Sweep, whilst I agree that there is a dearth of 105s in the tier, I'd rather keep Adamant max Speed, as 6 or 7 or whatever extra HP is not going to prove useful most of the time, whilst with max Speed you can basically outrun all supportceus lingering around the Palkia/Garchomp range - they all speedcreep each other, but noone goes up to 339 or 340 - I'm also not really a fan of fancy EV spreads like 24 HP / 252+ Atk / 232 Speed which is what outspeeding Garchomp works out as. If you still want a fancy EV spread I'll change it, although i really REALLY think that it's simpler and safer to go with Max Speed - you'd be really pissed to tie with a Garchomp-creeping Arceus and have it burn you for example.

    Shadow Force, after testing, is actually not bad, especially with Toxic on the opponent. Nayrz it doesn't really work against Lugia as Lugia is going to Roost back up to multiscale, and it gets a chance to do this before getting hit by Shadow Force, whereas it can't do it with Stone Edge. It's still really good for nailing Giratina-O (OHKOes at +2) and doing a shitton to Gira-A. It's gone as a 3rd slash, although i can remove this if QC wants
    Sweep likes this.
  9. PISTOLERO

    PISTOLERO formerly LustrousPalkia

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    I realise this is a double post, but I am going to be gone until Jun 6th. Soon as I've failed my last exam I'll be back to finish this, so I'll put it in hibernation until then.

    Malefic, Canman98, Minority Suspect, NO ANALYSIS SNATCHING THANK YOU

    (love you all, cya on the 6th)
  10. PISTOLERO

    PISTOLERO formerly LustrousPalkia

    Joined:
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    Okay let's get this show back on the road.

    All suggestions, errors and changes have been made, this is out of hibernation and ready to get stamped.
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2014
  11. shrang

    shrang I AM CHAMPION CHRISTMAS!!
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

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    Small nitpicks:

    - Put SD in slot 1 if you're going to call it Swords Dance lol
    - Formatting of EVs should be 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

    Otherwise qc 2/3
    PISTOLERO likes this.
  12. PISTOLERO

    PISTOLERO formerly LustrousPalkia

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    ta-da! :)
  13. Hack

    Hack formerly Hack He Must
    is a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon

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    I'd rather have Ice Beam as the third slash in the 4th slot, Lando-T is way more common than Zong. Giratinas are rare and Lugia is still hit by Stone Edge (SE is also better against Lugia as Lugia can roost on the charge turn to regain multiscale). S force can still go in moves but slashing it is just incorrect

    Make this swap and qc 3/3
  14. PISTOLERO

    PISTOLERO formerly LustrousPalkia

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    Done - simple straightforward analysis for a simple straightforward Arceus, into GP it goes
  15. RotomPoison

    RotomPoison

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    Amcheck is here

    the better extremekiller (open)
    Overview
    ########

    Ground Arceus gained new niches during the generation shift, (AC) which gave it . Ground types suddenly found themselves with a premier typing in the metagame. This gives Ground Arceus a useful role on many offensive team archetypes. With excellent bulk, attack, and support options, Ground Arceus can be fit into many teams. The most important role for Ground Arceus is to absorb Bolt Strikes from Zekrom, a very threatening Pokemon Choice Scarf user (it can always do this, even when it's not ScarfKrom, so this just makes more sense) this generation. Ground Arceus is also doubles up as a very powerful sweeper that uses with Swords Dance sweeper with a to fire off powerful +2 STAB Earthquakes from 120 speed base Attack. It can also act as a very useful Thunder Wave sponge and that severely threatens Klefki, the most common user of Prankster Thunder Wave, which can ruin offensive teams otherwise.

    However, Arceus-Ground Ground Arceus (keep this consistent) does have quite a few flaws. Common support Arceus formes such as Arceus-Water and Arceus-Grass have a type advantage against it. Scarf Kyogre in particular can also outspeed and OHKO Ground Arceus with ease with either Water Spout or Surf, meaning that Arceus-Ground must have significant team support to deal with the blue whale. There is also a certain opportunity cost when using Arceus-Ground Ground Arceus; as it takes up your Arceus slot, meaning you can no longer use support Arceus variants which can with Defog, (RC) use or Will-O-Wisp, (AC) or and check a myriad of different tier members; you cannot use Calm Mind Arceus Formes such as Electric and Poison; lastly, other variants of Swords Dance Arceus such as Extremekiller can often fit into teams far more easily than Arceus-Ground Ground Arceus can. However, as previously mentioned, Arceus-Ground it has unique traits which allow it to fulfill very important roles for any offensive team.

    Swords Dance
    ########
    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Earthquake
    move 3: Stone Edge
    move 4: Recover / Extreme Speed / Ice Beam
    item: Earth Plate
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 252 Attack / 4 SpD / 252 Speed

    Moves
    ========
    Earthquake is the most powerful STAB Ground Arceus has, (AC) incredibly powerful move. and with a Swords Dance boost, Earthquake it OHKOs virtually all non-levitating pokemon Pokemon in the metagame except barring immunities and certain support Arceus. Stone Edge nails those immune to Earthquake, such as Ho-Oh, Yveltal, and Lugia, for super effective damage, and completes the famous EdgeQuake combination. Recover can be used for longevity throughout a match, and helps Arceus-Ground take hits from Zekrom, as well as letting it set up more easily. However, Extreme Speed is useful to finish off weakened Choice Scarf users that attempt to revenge kill Arceus-Ground Ground Arceus. Ice Beam is an interesting option - it works best on Sticky Web teams (explain this), but is also extremely useful to hit Landorus-T, Gliscor, and Shaymin-S super effectively, (AC) although it can only hit the latter on the switch. (AP) The first two in particular can irritate Arceus-Ground Ground Arceus with Toxic whilst while not taking too much negligibile damage from Stone Edge. Lastly, Shadow Force specifically targets some of Arceus-Ground's the best checks to Ground Arceus, such as Giratina, Giratina-O and Lugia (although Lugia can Roost back to Multiscale due to the charge turn) (this would be better off in usage tips), dealing heavy damage to all of them after a Swords Dance - It also allows while allowing it to avoid status moves and phazing moves, and works quite nicely if the opponent's Pokemon are statused burned or poisoned. (just because paralyzing wouldn't help)

    Set Details
    ========
    Maximum Speed and Attack Attack and Speed allows Ground Arceus to outpace most of the tier, lets letting it speed tie with other max speed Arceus, and allows its moves to hit for maximum damage. Since Ground Arceus has an excellent typing and bulk, HP investment is unnecessary most of the time. Another interesting spread is Adamant with full Speed, Attack and 4 Special Defense. This allows Arceus-Ground to hit that much harder, and still reaches 339 speed, allowing it to speed tie with max Speed base 105s, which admittedly are rare, outspeed Palkia and everything below it, and most importantly of all, allows it to oustpeed outspeed support Arceus formes that run standard 96+ Speed spreads with a Speed boosting nature, and have a chance to OHKO those neutral to Earthquake at +2 after Stealth Rock, (AC) meaning that Arceus-Ground can escape a burn, (AC) whereas Jolly Arceus cannot OHKO after Stealth Rock at all. This does mean that unevolved Mega Gengar can outspeed and Destiny Bond against Arceus, however, (AC) - it cannot do this against Jolly variants. If using Ground Arceus on a Sticky Web team, an alternative spread with an Adamant nature, 44 HP, 252 Attack, and 212 Speed EVs can be used. 212 This Speed allows it to outspeed base 100s, notably Charizard Y, which is immune to Sticky Web and hits hard with Fire Blast or Solarbeam (Zard Y is ass tho, i'm not sure it should be mentioned at all to be honest). However, tailoring EV Spreads to suit your team is perfectly fine, (AC) - and investing in HP and Defense is perfectly reasonable if you prefer to be able to take on Zekrom better, as well as having better all around bulk. (AP) - important An important benchmarks to hit are is enough speed Speed to beat Palkia, however. An example of such a spread is 80 Attack and 112 Speed with a Jolly nature, which allows Arceus-Ground Ground Arceus to outspeed Garchomp and OHKO Palkia, Mewtwo, (AC) and Mewtwo Y from full health at +2 while - the rest can then be invested in bulk to comfortably take attacks from things Pokemon such as Zekrom.

    Usage Tips
    ========
    Swords Dance Ground Arceus functions as a late game sweeper if not running Recover, when Choice Scarf users and other faster Pokemon are either dead KOd or weakened enough to fall to Extreme Speed Extremespeed. Burn is extremely threatening for to Ground Arceus, so be mindful about setting up on anything that even has a chance of being able to burning Arceus-Ground Ground Arceus. Despite its weaknesses, it has an excellent Electric immunity to Electric-type moves. Therefore, Ground Arceus can liberally switch into Zekrom’s Bolt Strike or Volt Switch, which is often Choice-locked, and reverse the momentum from there.

    If running Recover, Arceus-Ground immediately becomes a lot more durable, and can be useful throughout the entire game. It becomes a lot easier and less risky to switch into Zekrom, as well as being able to Recover off weak attacks and set up. If using Ground Arceus early-game, it is advised to switch it in at the right time. Switching it in on Zekrom's Bolt Strike works very well, as Arceus then gets a free turn. In the mid-game, it is advised to throw out Earthquakes to see what the opponent's response to Arceus is - this way, Arceus can weaken its checks and counters, and not be forced out by something that threatens it and lose momentum; Arceus-Ground Ground Arceus tends to provoke an immediate response, and it is perfectly feasible to catch Scarf Kyogre with an Earthquake on the switch as it expects Swords Dance. You can also force the opponent's hand and scout out their team.

    Team Options
    ========
    It is mandatory to have good Scarf Kyogre checks on a team with Ground Arceus. Scarf Zekrom, Palkia, and specially defensive Dialga are excellent for this role - however, Scarf Zekrom can only swith switch in once and Dialga can only take two full strength Water Spouts. Wobbuffet, Yveltal and Xerneas are also excellent teammates for removing Giratina-O and pressuring support Arceus, with the former being able to use Encore and Shadow Tag to give Arceus-Ground Ground Arceus an opportunity to set up, and the latter two being able to scare the crap force out of Giratina and Giratina-Origin. Interestingly, Geomancy Xerneas and Swords Dance Arceus-Ground work very well together, as, (RC) with smart double switching, it is easy to set up with Ground Arceus against Xerneas's checks such as Klefki, whereas Xerneas can either Geomancy or Moonblast against Giratina, Giratina-Origin and certain support Support Arceus; one must watch out for Roar though. Gothitelle, Wobbuffet, and Mega Gengar are all good trappers that can aid Ground Arceus by removing its checks such as support Arceus and creating conditions where Ground Arceus can freely set up. A burn absorber or Aromatherapy support is recommend to ensure that Ground Arceus is free from burn, and, if Arceus-Ground is running Recover, this means that it can have more than one chance at setting up. Blissey and defensive Xerneas excel at this supporting role, and Blissey helps with support Arceus weakness that Arceus Ground has. Xerneas and Ground Arceus also go well together as because they create a dual immunity against Zekrom - alongside things like Palkia and Kyogre, Zekrom is forced into nasty 50/50 situations each time it tries to revenge kill something. Lastly, (AC) Specs Kyogre is a nice offensive partner, as it can lure in and wear down many of Ground Arceus’ checks, such as Giratina-A. In return, Ground Arceus can absorb Bolt Strikes for Kyogre.

    Other Options
    ########
    Overheat can be used to hit Bronzong and Skarmory, who take a pittance from Ground ArceusArceus-Ground's moves otherwise. A Calm Mind set with Judgment, Ice Beam, and Recover (RC) and Calm Mind can be used, but it is vastly inferior to the Swords Dance set in this generation, due to the weak damage output even after a boost, the inability to boost quickly, and it is hideously susceptible to Toxic. There is no reason to use this at all ever. A support set of Earthquake, Stone Edge, Recover, and Will-o-Wisp, Toxic, Defog, or Stealth Rock can be used to surprise checks and provide team support. This set is also the best Zekrom counter in the game. A specially defensive support set can run roar Roar to phaze Geomancy Xerneas. Dragon Claw or Outrage can be used over Recover or Extreme Speed on Swords Dance sets to deal heavy damage to Giratina-O, (AC) but this has significant drawbacks; Outrage - could - be used to OHKO it after a Swords Dance, but the lock is awful. Magic Coat can be used to troll anti-lead Deoxys leads, and bounce status aimed towards it. Gravity can be used to remove the ground Ground immunity of things like Ho-Oh and Skarmory, (AC) allowing and allows Arceus-Ground to bypass some of its checks. (AP) - A mono-attacking set of Earthquake, Swords Dance, Gravity and Recover is hilarious and is actually only resisted by Grass- and Bug-types, of which there are few in the Ubers metagame.

    Checks & Counters
    ########
    **Water-Types**: Choice Scarf Kyogre can easily revenge kill Ground Arceus with powerful Water-type attacks. Defensive Kyogre can phaze Ground Arceus or hit it with Scald, but does not take boosted Earthquake very well at all. Water Arceus can burn Ground Arceus with Will-O-Wisp. Palkia can take an unboosted Earthquake (albeit not very nicely) and KO Ground Arceus slaughter Arceus-Ground with either Surf or Hydro Pump.

    **Grass-Types**: Shaymin-S is guaranteed to be faster than Arceus-Ground all the time thanks to its base 127 speed and immunity to Sticky Web. It can then easily dispose of Arceus-Ground with Seed Flare or Leaf Storm. It can also switch in on Earthquake, but gets worked over KOd by Stone Edge and Ice Beam, and can fall to boosted Extremespeed if it has taken prior damage, with it being a guaranteed OHKO after two.

    **Ground/Flying Types**: Landorus-T and Gliscor can Toxic Arceus-Ground and stall Ground Arceus it to death. Gliscor takes +2 Stone Edge with ease, and can Roost off any damage, whilst not fearing Earthquake due to its Roosts being slower. However, Landorus-Therian cannot take repeated +1 Stone Edges very nicely at all, and they both have to watch out for the rare Ice Beam from Ground Arceus.

    **Giratina-O and Giratina**: Can take whatever Ground Arceus tries to do and threatens with Will-O-Wisp, and can phaze if Ground Arceus tries to boost through burn.

    **Bronzong**: Virtually untouched by any of Ground Arceus’ attacks and threatens with Toxic whilst setting up Stealth Rock.

    **Multiscale Lugia**: Lugia can stall the Stone Edge PP with roost Roost if it is faster, and then phaze or toxic Toxic stall it. However, with Stealth Rock up, Lugia can lose to faster Stone Edges as it will take them before being able to Roost.

    **Support Arceus**: They can run maximum speed and will Will-O-Wisp if they win the speed tie. Then, they can simply recover spam stall with Recover until Ground Arceus faints. However, they need to win the second speed tie to Recover before being hit with Earthquake again, which will KO.


    For 1 set this was a really long analysis ._.
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2014
    Sapphire. likes this.
  16. PISTOLERO

    PISTOLERO formerly LustrousPalkia

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2014
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    ta-da, done. implemented most of this :). what do i do now....?
  17. GatoDelFuego

    GatoDelFuego xXFaze GatoXx
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor
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    LustrousPalkia

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    Overview
    ########

    Ground Arceus gained new niches during the generation shift, it fills a useful role on many offensive team archetypes. With excellent bulk and typical Arceus base 120 base stats, Arceus-Ground can fit into many teams easily. The most important defensive role for Arceus-Ground is to absorb Bolt Strikes from Zekrom, a very threatening Pokemon this generation, but Arceus-Ground can also be a very powerful sweeper that uses Swords Dance to fire off powerful STAB Earthquakes. It can also act as a very useful Thunder Wave sponge and severely threatens Klefki, the most common user of Prankster Thunder Wave, which can ruin offensive teams otherwise.

    However, Arceus-Ground does have quite a few flaws. Common support Arceus formes such as Arceus-Water and Arceus-Grass have a type advantage against it. Choice Scarf Kyogre in particular can outspeed and OHKO Ground Arceus with ease with either Water Spout or Surf, meaning that Arceus-Ground must have significant team support to deal with it the blue whale. There is also a certain opportunity cost when using Arceus-Ground—as it takes up your Arceus slot, you can no longer use support Arceus variants with Defog and/or Will-O-Wisp; you cannot use Calm Mind Arceus formes such as Electric and Poison. Lastly, other variants of Swords Dance Arceus such as Extreme Killer can often fit into teams far more easily than Arceus-Ground can. However, as previously mentioned, Arceus-Ground has unique traits which allow it to fulfill very important roles for any offensive team.

    Swords Dance
    ########
    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Earthquake
    move 3: Stone Edge
    move 4: Recover / Extreme Speed / Ice Beam
    item: Earth Plate
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

    Moves
    ========
    Earthquake is an incredibly powerful move. With a Swords Dance boost, Earthquake OHKOes virtually all non-Levitating Pokemon in metagame barring immunities and certain support Arceus formes. Stone Edge nails those immune to Earthquake, such as Ho-Oh, Yveltal, and Lugia, for super effective damage, and completes the famous EdgeQuake combination. Recover can be used for longevity throughout a match, (RC) and helps Arceus-Ground take hits from Zekrom, as well as letting it set up more easily. However, Extreme Speed is useful to finish off weakened Choice Scarf users that attempt to revenge kill Arceus-Ground. Ice Beam is an interesting option—it works best on Sticky Web teams, but is also extremely useful to hit Landorus-T, Gliscor, and Shaymin-S super effectively, although it can only hit the latter on the switch. Gliscor and Landorus-Therian in particular can irritate Arceus-Ground with Toxic whilst not taking too much from Stone Edge, and are often problematic for Sticky Web teams to face. Lastly, Shadow Force specifically targets some Arceus-Ground's checks, Giratina, Giratina-O, (AC) and Lugia (although Lugia can Roost back to Multiscale due to the charge turn), dealing heavy damage to all of them after a Swords Dance. (period) It also allows Arceus to avoid status and phazing moves, and works quite nicely if the opponent's Pokemon are burned or poisoned.

    Set Details
    ========
    Full investment in Attack and Speed allows Arceus-Ground to outpace most of the tier, letting it Speed tie with other max Speed Arceus formes, and allows its moves to hit for maximum damage. Since As Ground Arceus has an excellent typing and bulk, HP investment is unnecessary most of the time. Another interesting spread is Adamant with full Speed, Attack, (AC) and 4 Special Defense. This allows Arceus-Ground to hit much harder, (RC) and still reaches 339 Speed, allowing it to Speed tie with max Speed base 105s, which admittedly are rare, outspeed Palkia and everything below it, and most importantly of all, allows it to oustpeed support Arceus that run standard 96+ Speed spreads, as well as outrunning those that Speed creep each other, and gives Arceus-Ground a chance to OHKO those neutral to Earthquake at +2 after Stealth Rock meaning that Arceus-Ground can escape a burn, whereas Jolly Arceus cannot OHKO after Stealth Rock at all. damn this sentence is literally 6 lines long pls make it shorter This does mean that unevolved non-Mega Gengar can outspeed and Destiny Bond against Arceus, however—it cannot do this against Jolly variants. If using Ground Arceus on a Sticky Web team, an alternative spread with Adamant nature, 40 HP, 252 Attack, 4 Special Defense, (AC) and 212 Speed can be used. 212 Speed allows it to outspeed base 100s, notably Mega Charizard Y, which is immune to Sticky Web and hits hard with Fire Blast or Solarbeam. However, tailoring EV spreads to suit your team is perfectly fine; (SC) investing in HP and Defense is perfectly reasonable if you prefer to be able to take on Zekrom better, as well as having better all around bulk. An important benchmarks to hit is running enough Speed to beat Palkia, however. An example of such a spread is 80 Attack and 112 Speed with a Jolly nature, which allows Arceus-Ground to outspeed Garchomp and OHKO Palkia, Mewtwo, (AC) and Mega Mewtwo Y from full health at +2—the rest can then be invested in bulk to comfortably take attacks from things such as Zekrom.

    Usage Tips
    ========
    Swords Dance Arceus-Ground functions as a late-game sweeper if not running Recover, when Choice Scarf users and other faster Pokemon are either gone or weakened enough to fall to Extreme Speed. Burn is extremely threatening to Arceus-Ground, so be mindful about setting up anything that even has a chance of burning it being able to burn Arceus-Ground. Despite its weaknesses, it has an excellent Electric immunity. Therefore, Ground Arceus can liberally switch into Zekrom's Bolt Strike or Volt Switch, which is often Choice-locked, and reverse the regain momentum from there.

    If running Recover, Arceus-Ground immediately becomes a lot more durable, and can be useful throughout the entire game. It becomes a lot easier and less risky to switch into Zekrom, as well as being able to Recover off weak attacks and set up. If using Arceus early-game, it is advised to switch it in at the right time. Switching it in on Zekrom's Bolt Strike works very well, as Arceus then gets a free turn. In the mid-game, it is advised to throw out Earthquakes to see what the opponent's response to Arceus is. This way, Arceus can weaken its checks and counters, (RC) and not be forced out by something that threatens it and lose momentum; Arceus-Ground tends to provoke an immediate response, and it is perfectly feasible to catch Choice Scarf Kyogre with an Earthquake on the switch as it expects Swords Dance. You can also force the opponent's hand and scout out their team.

    Team Options
    ========
    It is mandatory to have a good Choice Scarf Kyogre check on a team with Arceus-Ground. Choice Scarf Zekrom, Palkia, and specially defensive Dialga are excellent for this role—however, Scarf Zekrom can only switch in once and Dialga can only take two full-strength Water Spouts. Wobbuffet, Yveltal, (AC) and Xerneas are also excellent teammates for removing Giratina-O and pressuring support Arceus, with the former being able to use Encore and Shadow Tag to give Arceus-Ground an opportunity to set up, (RC) and the latter two being able to force out Giratina and Giratina-Origin. Interestingly, Geomancy Xerneas and Swords Dance Arceus-Ground work very well together, as, with smart double switching, it is easy to set up with Arceus-Ground against Xerneas's checks such as Klefki, whereas Xerneas can either Geomancy or Moonblast against Giratina, Giratina-Origin and certain Support Arceus. However, one must watch out for Roar though. Gothitelle, Wobbuffet, and Mega Gengar are all good trappers that can aid Ground Arceus by removing its checks such as support Arceus and creating conditions where Ground Arceus can freely set up. A burn absorber or Aromatherapy support is recommend to ensure that Ground Arceus is free from burn, and, if Arceus-Ground is running Recover, means that it can have more than one chance at setting up. Blissey and defensive Xerneas excel at this supporting role, and Blissey helps with the support Arceus weakness that Arceus Ground has. Xerneas and Ground Arceus also go well together as because they create a dual immunity against Zekrom. Along with alongside things like Palkia and Kyogre, Zekrom is forced into nasty 50/50 situations each time it tries to revenge kill something. Lastly, Choice Specs Kyogre is a nice offensive partner, as it can lure in and wear down many of Ground Arceus's checks, such as Giratina. In return, Arceus-Ground can absorb Bolt Strikes for Kyogre.

    Other Options
    ########
    Overheat can be used to hit Bronzong and Skarmory, who which take a pittance from Arceus-Ground's moves otherwise. A Calm Mind set with Judgment, Ice Beam, and Recover, and Calm Mind can be used, but is vastly inferior to the Swords Dance set this generation, (RC) due to the weak damage output even after a boost, the inability to boost quickly, and the hideous weakness to Toxic. A support set of Earthquake, Stone Edge, Recover, and Will-O-Wisp, Toxic, Defog, or Stealth Rock can be used to surprise checks and provide team support. This set is also the best Zekrom counter in the game. A specially defensive support set can run Roar to phaze Geomancy Xerneas. Dragon Claw can be used over Recover or Extreme Speed on Swords Dance sets to deal heavy damage to Giratina-O; Outrage could be used to OHKO it after a Swords Dance, but the lock-in effect is awful. Magic Coat can be used to anti-lead Deoxys leads, and bounce back status aimed towards it. Gravity can be used to remove the Ground immunity of things like Ho-Oh and Skarmory, allowing Arceus-Ground to bypass some of its checks. A mono-attacking set of Earthquake, Swords Dance, Gravity, (AC) and Recover is hilarious and is actually only resisted by Grass- and Bug-Types, of which there are few in Ubers.

    Checks & Counters
    ########
    **Water-Types**: Choice Scarf Kyogre can easily revenge kill Arceus-Ground with powerful Water-type attacks. Defensive Kyogre can phaze Ground Arceus or hit it with Scald, but does not take a boosted Earthquake very well at all. Water Arceus can burn Ground Arceus. Palkia can take an unboosted Earthquake (albeit not very nicely) and KO Arceus-Ground with either Surf or Hydro Pump.

    **Grass-Types**: Shaymin-S is guaranteed to be faster than Arceus-Ground all the time thanks to its base 127 Speed and immunity to Sticky Web. It can then easily dispose of Arceus-Ground with Seed Flare or Leaf Storm. It can also switch in on Earthquake, but gets worked over by Stone Edge and Ice Beam, and can fall to boosted Extreme Speed if it has taken prior damage, with it being a guaranteed OHKO after two Stealth Rock switch-ins.

    **Ground / Flying Types**: Landorus-T and Gliscor can Toxic stall Arceus-Ground forever and stall it to death. Gliscor takes +2 Stone Edges with ease, (RC) and can Roost off any damage, whilst not fearing Earthquake due to its Roosts being slower. However, Landorus-Therian does not appreciate repeated boosted Stone Edges, and they both have to watch out for the rare Ice Beam from Arceus-Ground.

    **Giratina-O and Giratina**: Both formes of Giratina laughs at whatever Ground Arceus tries to do and threatens with Will-O-Wisp. They can also and can phaze if Arceus-Ground out if it tries to boost through burn.

    **Bronzong**: Bronzong is virtually untouched by any of Ground Arceus's attacks and threatens with Toxic whilst setting up Stealth Rock.

    **Multiscale Lugia**: Lugia can stall out the Stone Edge PP with Roost if it is faster, (RC) and then phaze or Toxic stall Arceus it. However, with Stealth Rock up, Lugia can lose to faster Stone Edges as it will take them before being able to Roost.

    **Support Arceus**: They Support Arceus formes can run maximum Speed and will Will-O-Wisp if they win the Speed tie. Then, they can simply stall with Recover until Ground Arceus faints. However, they need to win the second Speed tie to Recover before being hit with Earthquake again, which will KO. So they need to win two speed ties? Why not just say that they need to win both Speed ties at the end and shorten both sentences
    [​IMG]
    1/2
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2014
    PISTOLERO likes this.
  18. PISTOLERO

    PISTOLERO formerly LustrousPalkia

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2014
    Messages:
    290
    GatoDelFuego thank you for the Fuego touch :)

    only thing i'd like to ask about is the very last thing

    could you possibly do this for me because i'm stupid and can't seem to do it myself :P
  19. Ender

    Ender Comfortably Numb
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2013
    Messages:
    307
    "Support Arceus formes can use Will-O-Wisp and then simply stall with Recovery until Ground Arceus faints. However, they need to win both Speed ties, otherwise they will be KOed by Earthquake."
    PISTOLERO likes this.
  20. Ender

    Ender Comfortably Numb
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2013
    Messages:
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    GP 2/2

    Show Hide


    Overview
    ########

    Ground Arceus-Ground gained new niches during the generation shift, filling a useful role on many offensive team archetypes. With excellent bulk and typical Arceus base 120 stats, Arceus-Ground can fit into many teams easily. The most important defensive role for Arceus-Ground is to absorb Bolt Strikes from Zekrom, a very threatening Pokemon this generation, but Arceus-Ground can also be a very powerful sweeper that uses Swords Dance to fire off powerful STAB Earthquakes. It can also act as a very useful Thunder Wave sponge and severely threatens Klefki, the most common user of Prankster Thunder Wave, which can ruin offensive teams otherwise.

    However, Arceus-Ground does have quite a few flaws. Common support Arceus formes such as Arceus-Water and Arceus-Grass have a type advantage against it. Choice Scarf Kyogre in particular can outspeed and OHKO Ground Arceus with ease with either Water Spout or Surf, meaning that Arceus-Ground must have significant team support to deal with it. There is also a certain opportunity cost when using Arceus-Ground: [mdash to colon] as it takes up your Arceus slot, you can no longer use support Arceus variants with Defog and/or Will-O-Wisp, or Calm Mind Arceus formes such as Electric and Poison. Lastly, other variants of Swords Dance Arceus such as Extreme Killer can often fit into teams far more easily than Arceus-Ground can.

    Swords Dance
    ########
    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Earthquake
    move 3: Stone Edge
    move 4: Recover / Extreme Speed / Ice Beam
    item: Earth Plate
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

    Moves
    ========
    Earthquake is an incredibly powerful move. With a Swords Dance boost, Earthquake OHKOes virtually all non-Levitating Pokemon in the tier barring immunities and certain support Arceus formes. Stone Edge nails those immune to Earthquake, such as Ho-Oh, Yveltal, and Lugia, for super effective damage, and completes the famous EdgeQuake combination. Recover can be used for longevity throughout a match and helps Arceus-Ground take hits from Zekrom [removed ,] as well as letting it set up more easily. However, Extreme Speed is useful to finish off weakened Choice Scarf users that attempt to revenge kill Arceus-Ground. Ice Beam is an interesting option—it works best on Sticky Web teams, but it is also extremely useful to hit Landorus-T, Gliscor, and Shaymin-S super effectively, although it can only hit the latter on the switch. Gliscor and Landorus-T in particular can irritate Arceus-Ground with Toxic whilst not taking too much from Stone Edge, and they are often problematic for Sticky Web teams to face otherwise. Lastly, Shadow Force specifically targets Giratina, Giratina-O, [comma] and Lugia (although Lugia can Roost back to Multiscale due to the charge turn), dealing heavy damage to all of them after a Swords Dance. It also allows Arceus to avoid status and phazing moves, and works quite nicely if the opponent's Pokemon are burned or poisoned.

    Set Details
    ========
    Full investment in Attack and Speed allows Arceus-Ground to outpace most of the tier, letting it Speed tie with other max Speed Arceus formes, and allows its moves to hit for maximum damage. As Arceus-Ground has an excellent typing and bulk, HP investment is unnecessary most of the time. Another interesting spread is Adamant with full Speed, Attack, and four 4 Special Defense. This allows Arceus-Ground to hit much harder and still reaches 339 Speed, allowing it to Speed tie with max Speed base 105s, which admittedly are rare, and also [removed .] outspeed Palkia and everything below it. Most importantly of all, it allows it to oustpeed support Arceus formes that run standard 96+ Speed spreads. [, to .] It also outruns as well as outrunning those that Speed creep each other [removed ,] and gives Arceus-Ground a chance to OHKO those neutral to Earthquake at +2 after Stealth Rock. [, to .] Thus, meaning that Arceus-Ground can escape a burn, whereas Jolly Arceus cannot OHKO after Stealth Rock at all. However, this does mean that non-Mega Gengar can outspeed and Destiny Bond Arceus, which it cannot do against Jolly variants. however - it cannot do this against Jolly variants. If using Arceus-Ground on a Sticky Web team, an alternative spread with Adamant nature, 40 HP, 252 Attack, 4 Special Defense and 212 Speed can be used. 212 Speed allows it to outspeed base 100s [removed ,] such as Mega Charizard Y, which is immune to Sticky Web and hits hard with Fire Blast or Solarbeam. However, tailoring EV Spreads to suit your team is perfectly fine; investing in HP and Defense is perfectly reasonable if you prefer to be able to take on Zekrom better, as well as having better all around bulk. An important benchmark to hit is running enough Speed to beat Palkia, however. An example of such a spread is 80 Attack and 112 Speed with a Jolly nature, which allows Arceus-Ground to outspeed Garchomp and OHKO Palkia, Mewtwo, and Mega Mewtwo Y from full health at +2; [mdash to ;] mdash;the rest can then be invested in bulk to comfortably take attacks from things such as Zekrom.

    Usage Tips
    ========
    Swords Dance Arceus-Ground functions as a late-game sweeper if not running Recover, when Choice Scarf users and other faster Pokemon are either gone or weakened enough to fall to Extreme Speed. Burn is extremely threatening to Arceus-Ground, so be mindful about setting up on anything that even has a chance of burning it. Despite its weaknesses, it has an excellent Electric-type immunity. Therefore, Ground Arceus-Ground can liberally switch into Zekrom's Bolt Strike or Volt Switch, which is often Choice-locked, and regain momentum from there.

    If running Recover, Arceus-Ground immediately becomes a lot more durable [removed ,] and can be useful throughout the entire game. It becomes a lot easier and less risky to switch into Zekrom, and it is also as well as being able to Recover off weak attacks and set up. If using Arceus early-game, it is advised to switch it in at the right time. Switching it in on Zekrom's Bolt Strike works very well, as Arceus then gets a free turn. In the mid-game, it is advised to throw out Earthquakes to see what the opponent's response to Arceus is. This way, Arceus can weaken its checks and counters and not be forced out by something that threatens it and lose momentum; Arceus-Ground tends to provoke an immediate response, and it is perfectly feasible to catch Choice Scarf Kyogre with an Earthquake on the switch as it expects Swords Dance. You can also force the opponent's hand and scout out their team.

    Team Options
    ========
    It is mandatory to have a good Choice Scarf Kyogre check on a team with Arceus-Ground. Choice Scarf Zekrom, Palkia, and specially defensive Dialga are excellent for this role; [mdash to ;] —however, Choice Scarf Zekrom can only switch in once and Dialga can only take two full-strength Water Spouts. Wobbuffet, Yveltal, [comma] and Xerneas are also excellent teammates for removing Giratina-O and pressuring support Arceus, with the former first being able to use Encore and Shadow Tag to give Arceus-Ground an opportunity to set up and the latter two being able to force out Giratina and Giratina-O. Interestingly, Geomancy Xerneas and Swords Dance Arceus-Ground work very well together, as, with smart double switching, it is easy to set up with Arceus-Ground against Xerneas's checks such as Klefki, whereas Xerneas can either Geomancy or Moonblast against Giratina, Giratina-O, [comma] and certain Support Arceus. However, one must watch out for Roar. Gothitelle, Wobbuffet, and Mega Gengar are all good trappers that can aid Arceus-Ground by removing its checks such as support Arceus and creating conditions where Ground Arceus-Ground can freely set up. A burn absorber or Aromatherapy support is recommend to ensure that Arceus-Ground is free from burn, meaning and, if Arceus-Ground is running Recover, means that it can have more than one chance at setting up. Blissey and defensive Xerneas excel at this supporting role, and Blissey helps with the support Arceus weakness that Arceus-Ground has. Xerneas and Arceus-Ground also go well together as because they create a dual immunity against Zekrom. Along with Palkia and Kyogre, Zekrom is forced into nasty 50/50 situations each time it tries to revenge kill something. Lastly, Choice Specs Kyogre is a nice offensive partner, as it can lure in and wear down many of Arceus-Ground's checks, such as Giratina. In return, Arceus-Ground can absorb Bolt Strikes for Kyogre.

    Other Options
    ########
    Overheat can be used to hit Bronzong and Skarmory, which take a pittance from Arceus-Ground's moves otherwise. A Calm Mind set with Judgment, Ice Beam, and Recover can be used, but it is vastly inferior to the Swords Dance set this generation, due to the weak damage output even after a boost, the inability to boost quickly, and the hideous weakness to Toxic. A support set of Earthquake, Stone Edge, Recover, and Will-O-Wisp, Toxic, Defog, or Stealth Rock can be used to surprise checks and provide team support. This set is also the best Zekrom counter in the game. A specially defensive support set can run Roar to phaze Geomancy Xerneas. Dragon Claw can be used over Recover or Extreme Speed on Swords Dance sets to deal heavy damage to Giratina-O; Outrage could be used to OHKO it after a Swords Dance, but the lock-in effect is awful. Magic Coat can be used to anti-lead Deoxys [removed ,] and bounce back status aimed towards it. Gravity can be used to remove the Ground-type immunity of Ho-Oh and Skarmory, allowing Arceus-Ground to bypass some of its checks. A mono-attacking set of Earthquake, Swords Dance, Gravity, and Recover is hilarious and is actually only resisted by Grass- and Bug-Types, of which there are few in Ubers.

    Checks & Counters
    ########
    **Water-types**: Choice Scarf Kyogre can easily revenge kill Arceus-Ground with powerful Water-type attacks. Defensive Kyogre can phaze Ground Arceus-Ground or hit it with Scald, but it does not take a boosted Earthquake very well at all. Water Arceus-Water can burn Ground Arceus-Ground. Palkia can take an unboosted Earthquake (albeit not very nicely) and KO Arceus-Ground with either Surf or Hydro Pump.

    **Grass-types**: Shaymin-S is always guaranteed to be faster than Arceus-Ground thanks to its base 127 Speed and immunity to Sticky Web. It can then easily dispose of Arceus-Ground with Seed Flare or Leaf Storm. It can also switch in on Earthquake, but it gets worked over by Stone Edge and Ice Beam [removed ,] and can fall to boosted Extreme Speed if it has taken prior damage, with it being a guaranteed OHKO after two Stealth Rock switch-ins.

    **Ground / Flying Types**: Landorus-T and Gliscor can Toxic stall Arceus-Ground forever. Gliscor takes +2 Stone Edge with ease and can Roost off any damage, not fearing Earthquake due to its Roosts being slower. However, Landorus-T does not appreciate repeated boosted Stone Edges, and they both have to watch out for Ice Beam.

    **Giratina-O and Giratina**: Both formes of Giratina laugh at whatever Arceus-Ground tries to do and threaten with Will-O-Wisp. They can also phaze Arceus-Ground out if it tries to boost through burn.

    **Bronzong and Skarmory**: Bronzong is virtually untouched by any of Arceus-Ground's attacks and threatens with Toxic whilst setting up Stealth Rock. Skarmory can do the same as Bronzong while whilst also being able to phaze Arceus-Ground away with Whirlwind.

    **Multiscale Lugia**: Lugia can stall out Stone Edge PP with Roost if it is faster and then phaze or Toxic stall Arceus. However, with Stealth Rock up, Lugia can lose to faster Stone Edges, [comma] as it will take them before being able to Roost.

    **Support Arceus**: Support Arceus formes can run maximum Speed and will Will-O-Wisp if they win the Speed tie. Then, they can simply stall with Recover until Ground Arceus-Ground faints. However, they need to win the second Speed tie to Recover before being hit with Earthquake again, which will KO. Arceus-Grass and Arceus-Water deserve special mention for being able to hit Arceus-Ground for super effective damage, with Arceus-Grass also resisting Earthquake.


    Last edited: Jul 10, 2014
  21. PISTOLERO

    PISTOLERO formerly LustrousPalkia

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    This is done, sorry Ender for having taken so long

    Moderators, away to the Dex with this :)
  22. Fireburn

    Fireburn BARN ALL
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