1. Welcome to Smogon! Check out the Smogon Starters Hangout for everything you need to know about starting out in the community. Don't forget to introduce yourself in the Introduction and Hangout Thread, too!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

BW OU Art of Ruin - Peaked #1

Discussion in 'RMT Archive' started by kill yourself, Feb 8, 2012.

  1. kill yourself

    kill yourself .|~Fashionista~|.
    is a Tutor Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Castle Valetis a Past WCoP Winneris the Smogon Tour Season 16 Champion

    Joined:
    May 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,767
    [​IMG]
    Introduction

    This is my offensive Drizzle squad that has been my go-to team for the past three months, which is the longest I've ever stuck with a single team in BW. I usually use balanced or defensive teams, so this made a nice change from that routine, and helped me discover that offensive teams are also enjoyable to use. I've used it in a few tournaments, and it's been effective; it also peaked #1 on the ladder with a 1602 rating under the name "Art of Ruin". I'm posting this because it's got some flaws that I could use help with, and I am also trying to raise offensive rain awareness so people will try another playstyle outside of those stupid Sandstorm Volt-Turn teams. If that happens, I will be happy because this metagame has alot of viable options and should not be as stale as it is. When building this team, I wanted to try something different other than the disgustingly overused Tyranitar + Landorus + Scizor + Rotom-W + 2 fillers team that was extremely popular at the time; I also wanted something that could easily defeat these teams, as they were absolutely everywhere. So I looked for something that was uncommon yet effective, and stumbled upon Tornadus. This team is built to abuse the incredible power of its Specs Hurricane, one of the most powerful attacks in the metagame. Drizzle support is mandatory so that the move's mediocre accuracy doesn't let it down; Politoed is necessary for this role, and seeing as this was shaping up to be an offensive team, I chose a Choice Specs set for its sheer destructive power.
    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Tornadus may be strong, but his Stealth Rock weakness cuts down the amount of times he can switch in, and makes him more vulnerable to priority attacks. Drizzle teams usually run Tentacruel as their Rapid Spinner, but I felt that he was too defensive for this team, so I chose to run Starmie, who in addition to spinning could function as a potent offensive threat.
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Speaking of hazards, I could use some of my own. Ferrothorn was a perfect choice, since it has access to Stealth Rock + Spikes, and gets a ton of opportunities to set up hazards with its excellent typing.
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    I wasn't sure what to do here, since I had no prior experience with offensive rain. I was watching some Battle Royale matches, and in Smith vs. Iconic, the latter was using an offensive rain team of his own, with an interesting choice in Azumarill. I decided to add it to my team to see how it did.
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Finally, I added a Choice Band Dragonite simply because I felt like using one.
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    This version of the team did well, peaking in the high 1400s under the alt "Bodom Beach Terror", but I felt it could be improved. I tried finding a problem with it from my team rater point of view, and CB Azumarill + CB Dragonite was just screaming redundancy. Azumarill was definitely the MVP of the whole team, so I wasn't going to change anything about him, but that didn't mean I had to drop Dragonite; I began exploring some other options for it. I settled on the offensive mixed rain abuse set [Hurricane | Thunder | Aqua Tail | ExtremeSpeed]. While it wasn't the biggest difference, I gradually got more and more comfortable with the team, and I got my alt "Death-less" to a 1505 rating, good for #10 on the leaderboard. While Dragonite's new set wasn't bad by any means, it was too hit-or-miss; either it completely thrashed the opponent or it did nothing, and the latter happened too much for my liking. I also found that the team struggled with Calm Mind Latias. So, I did what 30% of OU players do with their teams nowadays: I added a Scizor, the standard Choice Band set. Not only did it fix my CM Latias weakness, but it naturally fit in with the rest of the team - it appreciated the reduction of its fire weakness, and Starmie's Rapid Spin support let it U-turn in and out of battle as much as it pleased.
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    I stuck with this version of the team the most, as it finally felt comfortable in nearly every aspect, and this allowed me to place three accounts in the top 20 at the same time [Art of Ruin @ #8 - 1500 | No Commands @ #16 - 1464 | p fly 4 a white guy @ #18 - 1460]. However, I recently made two changes that, although subtle, were extremely helpful. After noticing how annoying Gastrodon could be to this team if it managed to land a Scald burn on Ferrothorn, I changed Politoed's item to Leftovers, so I could change moves on Gastro after it switched in and HP Grass it to oblivion, lessening the need for prediction. Lefties were also a bit more helpful in winning weather wars and preventing me from becoming set-up fodder in general, although I do miss the sheer power of Specs. The second change I made to the team was changing Scizor to a Scarf variant. While it lacks the power and bulk of the CB set, its extra speed had amazing utility in checking fast special attackers. And with these final changes, I got to #1. Ladies and gentlemen, I present:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    The knowledge that seeking the favor of another means the murder of self.
    Politoed | Modest Nature
    Ability: Drizzle | Item: Leftovers
    EVs: 136 HP | 56 Def | 252 SpA | 64 Spe
    Moveset: Scald | Ice Beam | Hidden Power Grass | Perish Song


    Who would've thought a formerly NU Pokemon would become one of the most important pieces of the BW OU metagame? Politoed's zero-to-hero story is really inspiring and all, but I'll just tell you what he does for my team. With Drizzle active, every member of the team benefits in some way - Ferrothorn and Scizor's fire weaknesses are halved; Starmie and Azumarill's Water-type attacks become frighteningly powerful; and Tornadus's Hurricane never misses. Toed does quite well on his own, though; when he was a Choice Specs set, I used him to break down Sandstorm teams' water resists, doing over 50% to Celebi and Rotom-W with Hydro Pump, so that Azumarill could clean up late-game. However, I needed the ability to switch attacks because Gastrodon is a bitch, so I sadly traded in my stylish glasses for some Leftovers. Fortunately, even with 50% less power, I still nab the 2HKO on that stupid slug with HP Grass. Lefties are also pretty good in helping me go the distance in weather wars. With this set, Toed can't exactly beat the crap out of everything, but he still hits pretty hard with his respectable 305 SpA stat. Hydro Pump was changed to Scald because with the item change, I wasn't in a kill-everything-in-sight mentality anymore, so I figured I could sacrifice some power for accuracy and burning stuff. Last but not least, Toed's Perish Song will put an end to any Baton Pass shenanigans, whether it's a dedicated team or just some Screens + SmashPass bullshit.

    I've been considering Expert Belt, so that I could bluff a choice item and put a little extra oomph behind my super effective attacks - I imagine this would be helpful against CB / Scarf Tyranitar who switch in on my "choiced" Ice Beam, try to Pursuit me, and end up eating a Hydro Pump [which I would probably go back to, to further the choice bluff].

    [​IMG]
    This is the resolution, the end of all progress; the death of evolution, it bleeds all life away.
    Ferrothorn | Sassy Nature
    Ability: Iron Barbs | Item: Leftovers
    EVs: 224 HP | 32 Def | 252 SpD
    Moveset: Stealth Rock | Spikes | Gyro Ball | Power Whip


    I wish Game Freak hadn't felt the need to give this mon an English name...Nattorei is cool! But anyways, Ferrothorn sets up hazards, which make my hard hitters really hard to switch into, since none of their counters are immune to Spikes. I don't pack a spin-blocker, because the focus of the team is on hitting my opponent's Pokemon with repeated powerfulattacks, and extra hazards make scoring KOs much easier - but they're a bonus, not a necessity. Ferro is also my sponge for Rotom-W's Volt Switch; I don't mind switching in and out of the Volt-Turn chain because the more Rotom itself switches in and out, the weaker it becomes, thanks to Stealth Rock, and the easier it becomes to pick off with Azumarill late-game. The bog standard Sandstorm Volt-Turn teams I despise so much will always lead with this washing machine on the first turn once they see I've got a Politoed in team preview, so I get some quick hazards at the beginning of the match. I've experimented with Bulldoze, and hitting Magnezone was really cool, but losing Gyro Ball means that I can't touch DD Dragonite, and losing Power Whip means I'm walled by Rotom-W / Gyarados. So, I'll generally double switch and surprise the Zone with Scarf Scizor's Superpower [HP Fire won't KO under rain], leaving my opponent without their Ferro killer and leaving me with a happy face.

    I'm considering Bulldoze over one of my two attacking moves because Magnezone is that much of a bitch. I'd probably drop Gyro Ball since I have Dragonite / Haxorus / Salamence checked in different ways, and Bulldoze screws with Haxorus anyway.

    [​IMG]
    Silence speeds the path to the streams of solace that run so few and narrow.
    Scizor | Jolly Nature
    Ability: Technician | Item: Choice Scarf
    EVs: 8 HP | 252 Atk | 248 Spe
    Moveset: U-turn | Bullet Punch | Superpower | Pursuit


    Mister super fantastic fun time here is absurdly popular and it is disgusting. However, I needed a second steel, and more importantly, a CM Latias counter, so I threw him on. The standard Choice Band set was here for awhile; it did alright, but I tried Scarf on a whim when I recalled how it had performed well on a previous team, and I have been quite pleased with the results. It can check Lati@s and Celebi regardless of its own health, which the CB set cannot do. The extra speed is also helpful in surprise killing Magnezone who try to trap my Ferrothorn. Bullet Punch is still a great attack, even with a Jolly nature and no CB, although I suppose Iron Head is worth testing since it has more power with an additional flinch rate at the cost of priority. As for the retarded red bug's EV spread, I ran 224 Spe on my previous ScarfZor teams so I could outpace ScarfTar, but beating Alakazam is crucial now that it's OU, so I threw on 248 EVs since that's all I need and if I face another Scarf Scizor, they'll be faster, so I can get the second U-turn off, which will give me switch advantage. 8 HP EVs totally make a difference in how this guy takes hits.

    I am considering Scarf Metagross in this slot, since it retains Scizor's roles of 1). a second steel-type, 2). trapper, and 3). CM Latias counter, but Meta comes with the bonus of fixing my nasty Toxicroak weakness. Gaining Earthquake would make it much easier to deal with Jirachi. I would also be able to Trick and cripple opposing Ferrothorn. Losing U-turn is a relatively small price to pay for these benefits. Input on this idea in particular would be awesome.

    [​IMG]
    Brooks that babble the sounds of torture.
    Starmie | Timid Nature
    Ability: Natural Cure | Item: Life Orb
    EVs: 252 SpA | 4 Def | 252 Spe
    Moveset: Hydro Pump | Ice Beam | Thunder | Rapid Spin


    This thing is absolutely ridiculous with Drizzle active. Hydro Pump beats the living shit out of any non-grass/water-type, and if I've enough hazards up, even the resistance is not enough to save these unfortunate pocket monsters from a watery doom. Surf is for pussies. Rapid Spin is the main reason Starmie is on the team, as it allows the deadly Tornadus to switch in and out of battle as he pleases, unhindered by his crippling Stealth Rock weakness. Spinning also lets Scizor U-turn as much as he wants. BoltBeam is awesome not only because it hits everything, but also because no one expects Starmie to have both, since most sets run Recover / Psyshock and can only choose one coverage move. Life Orb as the item because I wanna kill stuff, although I guess Leftovers is a decent alternative because it would help to have longevity on my spinner, even if it is kind of limited.

    [​IMG]
    You will one day rise to flood the banks of the chosen.
    Tornadus | Timid Nature
    Ability: Prankster | Item: Choice Specs
    EVs: 252 SpA | 4 SpD | 252 Spe
    Moveset: U-turn | Hurricane | Focus Blast | Tailwind


    Tornadus excels at luring in Tyranitar and U-turning out into Politoed for an immediate weather advantage. Focus Blast's use is kind of limited but it's killed a few Tyranitars when Politoed was too weak to come in so it's pretty cool. Tailwind temporarily gives my team +2 Speed, which can be really helpful in revenging an out-of-hand Outraging Dragonite, and the Prankster ability means that Tornadobro will never fail in pulling it off.

    But screw all that. When this powerhouse comes in, something is going to get fucking nuked. I win games by sending out this nig and clicking Hurricane. With Choice Specs attached, it's not only one of the most powerful attacks in the metagame, but it also has excellent coverage, and under Drizzle, it has perfect accuracy. A few half-assed examples of its strength: it 2HKOs Rotom-W and Ferrothorn, while OHKOing Latios and Scizor after SR. This monster is one of the most underrated mons in the metagame and should be getting way more usage.

    [​IMG]
    This is the art of ruin.
    Azumarill | Adamant Nature
    Ability: Huge Power | Item: Choice Band
    EVs: 252 HP | 252 Atk | 4 Def
    Moveset: Aqua Jet | Waterfall | Ice Punch | Superpower


    Even though it was Tornadus who the team was focused on, Azumarill has consistently proved he is the MVP. He absolutely smashes the common Volt-Turn team once the water resists have been brought down to 30% or so [not a hard task, considering my multiple hazards and other hard hitters - also, keep in mind that said water resists cannot switch into Azu without taking massive damage from a rain-boosted Waterfall], simply by clicking Aqua Jet. Azu revenges a ton of threats, including but not limited to Volcarona, Landorus, Terrakion, Shell Smash recipient Nidoking, and generally most Pokemon that don't resist water. Ice Punch and Superpower are generally filler since I'll generally be spamming rain-boosted Aqua Jets or Waterfalls while laughing at my fool of an opponent who thought it was safe to switch in because his Pokemon "resisted" the attack.

    Conclusion
    So that's my team. I am hoping that it will make rain offense a bit more popular, if only for the sake of having people try something other than typical Volt-Turn garbage. I've got a few weaknesses - namely, Swords Dance / Bulk Up Toxicroak and Calm Mind Jirachi - that I hope you guys can help me with. As I mentioned in Scizor's description, I'm considering Scarf Metagross in its place as it fixes both these issues while doing the same thing that Scizor did, so some feedback on that in particular would be great. Thanks for reading, threat list and importable below. Btw the shitty banner thing was made by me. Yes I know it's terrible.​
  2. kill yourself

    kill yourself .|~Fashionista~|.
    is a Tutor Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Castle Valetis a Past WCoP Winneris the Smogon Tour Season 16 Champion

    Joined:
    May 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,767
    threat list (open)
    Code:
    Offensive Threats
     [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/0f/248MS.png[/IMG] Tyranitar:
    [LIST]
    [*]Choice Band - It usually comes in on Starmie as I Spin, so I'll make it eat a Hydro Pump for massive damage before I go down and then I can bring in Politoed to change the weather. Scizor can come in on Crunch and threaten with U-turn.
    [*]Choice Scarf - Same as CB but it checks Starmie / Tornadus with greater ease thanks to the speed. Thankfully it doesn't hit that hard so Politoed and Ferrothorn switch in alot easier. Scizor outspeeds and threatens with U-turn.
    [*]Dragon Dance - Scizor revenges, Azumarill revenges.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/d/d6/Ani479WMS.png[/IMG] Rotom-W: 
    [LIST]
    [*]Choice Scarf / Specs - Tornadus lures the Scarf set it and deals upwards of 50% to it; I'll force it in and out of the battle from that point, using Ferrothorn to absorb Volt Switch, making it take SR damage, and putting it in range for Azumarill to pick off late-game. Specs hits hard but can't check Tornadus / Starmie reliably.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/f2/212MS.png[/IMG] Scizor:
    [LIST]
    [*]Choice Band - Its constant switching leads to its own demise thanks to hazards. I also like to switch Ferrothorn into U-turns / Bullet Punches to rack up even more residual damage with Iron Barbs. Sciz also tries to revenge Tornadus with BP but fails unless SR is up and gets smashed by a Hurricane in return.
    [*]Swords Dance - Politoed, Starmie and Azumarill check it.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/8a/Ani149MS.png[/IMG] Dragonite:
    [LIST]
    [*]Choice Band - Hits hard, thankfully doesn't get many free switch-ins. Starmie or Tornadus can revenge Outrage-locked ones.
    [*]Dragon Dance - Ferrothorn, Scizor, and Azumarill make sure the offensive variants don't sweep me. Bulky DD or SubDD is forced out by Toed's Perish Song and from there it's up to me to grab momentum and not give it another chance at setup. Azumarill does pretty well against them on its own though which is cool.
    [*]Mixed - Usually leads with Draco Meteor which I'm fine with since Ferro is my initial switch.
    [*]Parashuffler - Thankfully rare, Ferrothorn sets up all over it, Starmie removes the hazards that makes its phazing deadly, Toed can Perish Song, and Azumarill pounds away with Ice Punch.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/e4/Ani186MS.png[/IMG] Politoed:
    [LIST]
    [*]Choice Specs / Scarf - Ferrothorn, unless it Focus Blasts on the switch [doesn't KO], in which case I have a free Starmie / Tornadus switch.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/03/Ani485MS.png[/IMG] Heatran:
    [LIST]
    [*]Standard - Politoed, Starmie, Azumarill.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/7/77/Ani385MS.png[/IMG] Jirachi:
    [LIST]
    [*]Substitute + Calm Mind / Wish + Calm Mind - This thing is a royal pain in the ass and is another reason why I want to use Bulldoze on Ferrothorn / use Scarf Metagross over Scizor. I have to just pound away with Starmie / Scizor and then pick it off with Azumarill's Aqua Jet.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/6/65/Ani381MS.png[/IMG] Latios:
    [LIST]
    [*]Life Orb - Ferrothorn, Scizor.
    [*]Choice Scarf / Specs - Ferrothorn, Scizor.
    [*]Calm Mind - Ferrothorn, Scizor.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/3/3b/Ani579MS.png[/IMG] Reuniclus:
    [LIST]
    [*]Calm Mind - Pound away at it. Azumarill's Waterfall deals upwards of 80% in the rain and Scizor can revenge after.
    [*]Offensive Trick Room - Scizor, Azumarill.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/ef/Ani612MS.png[/IMG] Haxorus:
    [LIST]
    [*]Choice Scarf / Choice Band - Ferrothorn.
    [*]Dragon Dance - Ferrothorn, Scizor / Azumarill revenge.
    [*]Double Dance - Ferrothorn, Scizor / Azumarill revenge.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/50/Ani038MS.png[/IMG] Ninetales:
    [LIST]
    [*]Nasty Plot - I've never seen this used but I imagine changing the weather would be pretty good because then Tornadus comes in on Energy Ball and wrecks it.
    [*]Choice Specs - lol
    [*]Special Attacker - Same as NP.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/b8/Ani534MS.png[/IMG] Conkeldurr:
    [LIST]
    [*]Bulk Up - [B]TORNADUS[/B]
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/4/4b/Ani251MS.png[/IMG] Celebi:
    [LIST]
    [*]Nasty Plot Sweeper - [B]TORNADUS[/B] and scizor
    [*]Tinkerbell - [B]TORNADUS[/B] and scizor
    [*]Choice Specs / Choice Scarf - Ferrothorn, Scizor.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/9/90/Ani639MS.png[/IMG] Terrakion:
    [LIST]
    [*]Double Dance - Azumarill and Scizor revenge, as can Starmie / Tornadus if the boost of choice is Swords Dance.
    [*]Choice Scarf / Choice Band - Nothing can really switch in safely but the same checks as to the boosting sets work fine here.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/d/d1/Ani130MS.png[/IMG] Gyarados:
    [LIST]
    [*]Offensive / Bulky Dragon Dance - Ferrothorn.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/18/Ani094MS.png[/IMG] Gengar:
    [LIST]
    [*]Substitute + Disable / Pain Split - Scizor, Azumarill, Starmie, Tornadus.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/19/Ani121MS.png[/IMG] Starmie:
    [LIST]
    [*]Life Orb - Scizor, Ferrothorn.
    [*]Rapid Spin - Scizor, Ferrothorn.
    [*]Choice Specs - Scizor, Ferrothorn.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/6/66/Ani645MS.png[/IMG] Landorus:
    [LIST]
    [*]Rock Polish / Swords Dance - Azumarill.
    [*]Choice Scarf - Azumarill.
    [*]Substitute + 3 Attacks - Azumarill, Starmie, Ferrothorn and Tornadus.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/7/74/Ani392MS.png[/IMG] Infernape:
    [LIST]
    [*]Mixed Attacker - Starmie, Azumarill, Tornadus.
    [*]Nasty Plot / Swords Dance Booster - Starmie, Azumarill, Tornadus.
    [*]Choice Band - It surprises Starmie with U-turn which sucks but Azumarill and Tornadus.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/08/Ani637MS.png[/IMG] Volcarona:
    [LIST]
    [*]Offensive Quiver Dance - [B]AZUMARILL[/B]
    [*]Bulky Quiver Dance - [B]AZUMARILL[/B]
    [*]Chesto Rest - [B]AZUMARILL[/B]
    [*]Substitute - [B]AZUMARILL [/B]
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/d/d8/Ani462MS.png[/IMG] Magnezone:
    [LIST]
    [*]Substitute - THE reason I want Bulldoze on my Ferrothorn. I usually have to sac Ferrothorn and then another mon just to break its sub and kill it / force it out.
    [*]Choice Scarf - Not as big a deal since it doesn't have the protection of Sub, so after Ferro dies, Starmie outspeeds and Hydro Pumps its face in.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/88/Ani196MS.png[/IMG] Espeon:
    [LIST]
    [*]Calm Mind - Scizor, Azumarill.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/e5/Ani373MS.png[/IMG] Salamence:
    [LIST]
    [*]Dragon Dance - Ferrothorn, Scizor, Azumarill.
    [*]Mixed - Hits hard but is revenged handily by Scizor, Starmie, or Tornadus.
    [*]Defensive - Set-up fodder for Ferrothorn and a free switch for Starmie.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/6/60/Ani635MS.png[/IMG] Hydreigon:
    [LIST]
    [*]Offensive - Has like no room to come in and half my team can outright OHKO it.
    [*]Choice Specs / Choice Scarf - Abuse the move it's locked into, late-game Azu or Sciz will pick it off with priority.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/7/7e/Ani286MS.png[/IMG] Breloom:
    [LIST]
    [*]Sub Seed - let something sleep and [B]TORNADUS[/B]
    [*]Sub Punch - let something sleep and [B]TORNADUS[/B]
    [*]Bulk Up - let something sleep and [B]TORNADUS[/B]
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/bb/Ani380MS.png[/IMG] Latias:
    [LIST]
    [*]Calm Mind - Scizor mainly, Azumarill and Tornadus also hit it hard.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/2/20/Ani454MS.png[/IMG] Toxicroak:
    [LIST]
    [*]Swords Dance - What a bitch. The only mon it doesn't come in for free on is Tornadus and it'll usually kick my ass. The main reason I'm considering Metagross > Scizor. 
    [*]Bulk Up - Same as SD.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/b0/Ani448MS.png[/IMG] Lucario:
    [LIST]
    [*]Swords Dance - A bitch to switch into, but Scizor checks it and a high-health Azumarill does the same.
    [*]Nasty Plot - Tornadus and Starmie.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/bf/Ani640MS.png[/IMG] Virizion:
    [LIST]
    [*]Calm Mind - [B]TORNADUS[/B]
    [*]Swords Dance - [B]TORNADUS[/B]
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/4/44/Ani560MS.png[/IMG] Scrafty:
    [LIST]
    [*]Dragon Dance - Starmie, Sciz and Azu check it. Tornadus checks Adamant versions.
    [*]Bulk Up - [B]TORNADUS[/B]
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/8e/Ani003MS.png[/IMG] Venusaur:
    [LIST]
    [*]Special Growth - win the weather war and TORNADUS
    [*]Mixed Growth - win the weather war and TORNADUS
    [*]SubSeed - win the weather war and TORNADUS
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/4/49/Ani376MS.png[/IMG] Metagross:
    [LIST]
    [*]Stealth Rock - Ferro sets up all over it, Starmie spins away the rocks and Hydro Pumps it to death. Politoed does pretty well against it too.
    [*]Choice Scarf / Choice Band - Ferro, Toed, Azumarill. 
    [*]Agility - Azumarill. Tornadus's Tailwind can let Starmie revenge.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/ff/Ani620MS.png[/IMG] Mienshao:
    [LIST]
    [*]All-Out Attacker - [B]TORNADUS[/B]
    [*]Choice Scarf / Choice Band - Azumarill for the former, Starmie / Tornadus for the latter.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/50/Ani091MS.png[/IMG] Cloyster:
    [LIST]
    [*]Shell Smash - Ferro, Sciz, Azu, Tailwind + Starmie.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/6/67/Ani473MS.png[/IMG] Mamoswine:
    [LIST]
    [*]Physical Attacker - Starmie, Sciz, Ferro and Azu check it.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/15/Ani555MS.png[/IMG] Darmanitan:
    [LIST]
    [*]Choice Scarf - Azu, Tailwind + Starmie.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/0c/Ani641MS.png[/IMG] Tornadus:
    [LIST]
    [*]Rain Abuser - Starmie, Sciz, Azu.
    [/LIST]
    
    Code:
    Defensive threats
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/0f/248MS.png[/IMG] Tyranitar:
    [LIST]
    [*]Specially Defensive - terrible set, Politoed shits on it. 
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/d/d6/Ani479WMS.png[/IMG] Rotom-W: 
    [LIST]
    [*]Standard - Break it down with Tornadus / Starmie / Ferrothorn so that Azu can clean up late-game.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/d/d3/Ani598MS.png[/IMG] Ferrothorn:
    [LIST]
    [*]Standard - Set up my own hazards, threaten with Scizor, spin theirs later. Tornad 2HKOs with Hurricane.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/e/e4/Ani186MS.png[/IMG] Politoed:
    [LIST]
    [*]Defensive - Ferrothorn, Starmie.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/3/3f/Ani472MS.png[/IMG] Gliscor:
    [LIST]
    [*]Swords Dance - Politoed, Starmie, Azumarill, Tornadus. 
    [*]Substitute + Protect - Politoed, Starmie, Azumarill, Tornadus. 
    [*]AcroBat - Politoed, Starmie, Azumarill, Tornadus. 
    [*]Defensive - Politoed, Starmie, Azumarill, Tornadus. 
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/03/Ani485MS.png[/IMG] Heatran:
    [LIST]
    [*]Specially Defensive - Politoed, Starmie, Azumarill.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/7/77/Ani385MS.png[/IMG] Jirachi:
    [LIST]
    [*]Specially Defensive - Ferro sets up on it, if it has Thunder it's kind of a pain but Toed / Azu / Starmie can check it.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/3/31/Ani227MS.png[/IMG] Skarmory:
    [LIST]
    [*]Physically Defensive Spiker - Starmie. Tornadus 2HKOs with Hurricane, even with the resist. Azumarill's Waterfall 2HKOs.
    [*]Specially Defensive Spiker - Starmie, Azumarill. 
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/5/50/Ani038MS.png[/IMG] Ninetales:
    [LIST]
    [*]Specially Defensive - Weather wars :(
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/4/4b/Ani251MS.png[/IMG] Celebi:
    [LIST]
    [*]Physically Defensive - [B]TORNADUS[/B] and scizor
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/81/Ani205MS.png[/IMG] Forretress:
    [LIST]
    [*]Physically Defensive Spiker - Starmie, Tornadus.
    [*]Specially Defensive Spiker - Starmie, Tornadus.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/d/d1/Ani130MS.png[/IMG] Gyarados: 
    [LIST]
    [*]RestTalk - Ferrothorn, Starmie.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/f8/Ani593MS.png[/IMG] Jellicent:
    [LIST]
    [*]Utility Counter - Kind of annoying but Starmie and Tornadus can 2HKO it.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/88/Ani073MS.png[/IMG] Tentacruel:
    [LIST]
    [*]Toxic Spikes - scald burns on ferro >:( starmie and tornad 2hko
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/1/1e/Ani423MS.png[/IMG] Gastrodon:
    [LIST]
    [*]Tank - an all-around bitch, ferro beats it barring a scald burn, toed 2hkos with hp grass, tornadus 2hkos.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/8/88/Ani196MS.png[/IMG] Espeon:
    [LIST]
    [*]Dual Screens - Scizor, Starmie, Azumarill, Tornadus.
    [*]Baton Pass - Toed breaks up BP chains with Perish Song :D
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/b5/Ani242MS.png[/IMG] Blissey:
    [LIST]
    [*]Support - Ferro, Scizor, Azumarill.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/4/47/Ani134MS.png[/IMG] Vaporeon:
    [LIST]
    [*]Wish Support - Ferro, Starmie. 
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/bb/Ani380MS.png[/IMG] Latias:
    [LIST]
    [*]Support - Ferro, Scizor, Starmie, Azumarill, Tornadus.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/0/0d/Ani437MS.png[/IMG] Bronzong:
    [LIST]
    [*]Tank - Ferro, Starmie.
    [*]Dual Screens - Ferro, Starmie.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/7/78/Ani260MS.png[/IMG] Swampert:
    [LIST]
    [*]Defensive - Ferro, Starmie. 
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/c/cd/Ani151MS.png[/IMG] Mew:
    [LIST]
    [*]Stallbreaker - Toed goes for burns, ScarfZor, Starmie, Tornad.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/9/9d/Ani080MS.png[/IMG] Slowbro:
    [LIST]
    [*]Tank - Ferro, Scizor, Starmie, Tornadus.
    [/LIST]
    [IMG]http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/b/bd/Ani195MS.png[/IMG] Quagsire:
    [LIST]
    [*]Curse - Ferro, Starmie, Tornadus, Politoed.
    [*]Specially Defensive - Ferro, Starmie, Tornadus, Politoed.
    [*]Physically Defensive - Ferro, Starmie, Tornadus, Politoed.
    [/LIST]
     

    import; change Ferrothorn's speed IV to 0 for maximum Gyro Ball power (open)
    Insurrection (Politoed) (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 136 HP / 56 Def / 252 SAtk / 64 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Scald
    - Perish Song
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - Ice Beam

    The Undertow (Ferrothorn) (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 224 HP / 32 Def / 252 SDef
    Sassy Nature (+SDef, -Spd)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Spikes
    - Gyro Ball
    - Power Whip

    Cheated (Scizor) (F) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 8 HP / 252 Atk / 248 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - U-turn
    - Bullet Punch
    - Superpower
    - Pursuit

    Guilty (Starmie) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Thunder
    - Rapid Spin

    Visitation (Tornadus) (M) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Prankster
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - U-turn
    - Hurricane
    - Focus Blast
    - Tailwind

    King Me (Azumarill) (F) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Huge Power
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Aqua Jet
    - Waterfall
    - Ice Punch
    - Superpower
  3. peng

    peng

    Joined:
    May 21, 2009
    Messages:
    480
    Hi,

    Having used this team quite a lot I can definitely vouch for its effectiveness. You already know exactly what I think you should change but whatever, I'll post it here anyway.

    First off, Magnezone loves facing this team. You have 4 electric weaknesses with only one resist who can't really touch Magnezone anyway without Bulldoze or Leech Seed. Replacing Gyro Ball with Bulldoze as you mentioned is probably the easiest fix to this, so I'd definitely recommend going ahead with that. Another way of handling Magnezone (and I know I've told you to do this like 1000000 times) would be to at least try out Bulk Up Breloom somewhere on the team. It probably fits best over Ferrothorn or Scizor, but the problem with replacing Ferro is losing SR and Spikes which really make the team so threatening. For SD Croak, you could try Psychic over Hidden Power [Grass] or Perish Song on Politoed to hit it on the switch-in or as it Swords Dances, but obviously this opens you up to Gastrodon and CM Reu / Latias respectively.

    You know I prefer SD Feraligatr over Azumarill but I'm pretty sure you won't budge on that so I won't go on about it.

    Needless to say this is a great (albeit pretty standard) team, and is easily one of the best Offensive Rain builds I've ever had the pleasure of using. Toxicroak and Magnezone are particularly annoying but aside from some very small moveset changes there isn't really all that much you can do without opening the team up to other threats. Besides, you know this team like the back of your hand and know how to play from turn 1 to stop them from being too problematic. Great team, gl.
  4. Lasers

    Lasers

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2012
    Messages:
    68
    You have four electric weaknesses with only one resistance.
    Volt switch Rotom really hurts this team ALOT. Just wanted to point that out.

    I recomenend getting rid of Tornadus for CHOICE SPECS JOLTEON. This not only gives you a viable immunity, but with Specs STAB 100% accuracy thunders are really going to put the hurting on almost anything.

    Jolteon @ Specs
    Timid
    252 SPA/252 Speed
    -Thunder
    -Shadow Ball
    -Volt Switch
    -Hidden Power grass or Ice
  5. AfroThunderRule

    AfroThunderRule *yawn* ez
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    May 25, 2009
    Messages:
    1,162
    Your Ferrothorn EV seems weird. I recommend using a 252 HP / 28 Def / 228 SDef EV spread. Makes your Ferrothorn a bit bulkier on both physical and special attacks. >.>

    Example, on your old spread a Specs Tornadus Hurricane will do (53.91% - 63.48%) on your current Ferrothorn. While the one I recommend does (53.69% - 63.35%). Yea it's it does less than a half percent less, but you'll never know when that could come in handy.

    Another example, a banded U-Turn from Scizor does (42.03% - 49.86%) to your current Ferrothorn while the same Scizor does (41.19% - 48.86%). Like I said not a drastic drop but you'll never know when it come in handy.

    Oh, and congrats on the team. I remember using a similar team to this, was hella fun to play with. <3 Tornadus, especially Tailwind Tornadus.
  6. LighTz911

    LighTz911

    Joined:
    May 18, 2010
    Messages:
    233
    Really nice team! I don't really have much to say besides you using 248 HP EVs on Azumarrill. When you're not using Leftovers, you should use an odd number to reduce the damage your Pokemon take from Stealth Rocks and other passive damage.

    Also, how do you deal with Rotom-w? I could see it being a problem for you...
  7. yee

    yee
    is a Battle Server Moderator Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,110
    Great job BKC, it's refreshing to see something good in here.

    As a Scarf Metagross user, I heavily recommend you keep Scarf Scizor instead. You say it is there to counter CM Latias but has trouble with Magnezone, to revenge anything with Metagross requires getting trapped by Magnezone. Pursuit isn't nearly as strong without Technician and U-Turning out of foes is much more helpful for your team than getting locked into a Meteor Mash 4x resisted by a certain pokemon dickheads like to spam.

    Also, you may want to look into more speed for Azumarill. A Tailwind sweep late game is incredibly powerful and with Azumarill's starting speed actually turning into more than that of a Terrakion you will probably find it more useful than a little extra bulk.

    Good job and good luck!
  8. Nubagator

    Nubagator

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2010
    Messages:
    168
    Awesome RMT, I love seeing good ones!
    I don't have anything that would really merit a full rate but, I agree with Bulldoze over gyro ball. Also love the Album cover. (mad good photoshop skills)
  9. Motagua

    Motagua El Ciclón Azul

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2009
    Messages:
    190
    Hey bro, sup! This is really a fantastic rain team and I would not dare to replace Tornadus & Azumarill considering both have an excellent synergy in weakening each other´s counters.

    I played with your team for a while, and definitely Bulk Up Toxicroak trolls your team. Also I feel somewhat insecure in how you deal with Rain Mixed Attacker Dragonite since Hurricane can 2HKO Ferrothorn, Bullet Punch fails to 2HKO him even after SR allowing him to Roost off the damage, and ExtremeSpeed can pick off Tornadus & Starmie if they are weakened. You should defnitely consider Scarf Metagross instead of Scizor.

    [​IMG]
    Metagross @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Clear Body
    EVs: 52 HP / 252 Atk / 204 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Trick / Pursuit
    - Ice Punch
    - Earthquake
    - Meteor Mash

    With 204 Speed EVs, Metagross reaches 373,5 Speed outspeeding Timid Alakazam and punish him first before it does something. Ice Punch will allow Metagross to defeat any variant of Dragonite and since Fire Punch´s power is halved and Aqua Tail wont OHKO Metagross, it definitely makes him an excellent check for Dragonite and most Dragons. Earthquake allows you to deal with CM Jirachi and Earthquake him for the 2HKO. Meteor Mash is for STAB and deal high damage to anything that doesnt resist it. For the last move slot, I prefer Trick considering it can cripple CM users and most Magnezone switch-ins since Metagross can survive Thunderbolt and KO back with Earthquake, and vs Scarfzones you can swap to Earthquake again; Latias & Reuniclaus get already hit strongly by Meteor Mash, but its up to you whether running Trick or Pursuit.

    Hope my rate helps :].
  10. blunder

    blunder

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2011
    Messages:
    626
    As Lasers said, Rotom-W does a lot of Damage to your team once Ferrothorn is gone, being able to Kill OHKO 4 of your guys. I think this set of Latios would benefit your team-

    Latios @ Life Orb/Leftovers
    Timid 252 SpA, 252 Spd, HP
    -Surf
    -Draco Meteor
    -Thunder
    -Hidden Power Fighting

    HP fighting does the same amount to Ferrothorn as a Rain Weakened HP Fire, and can also help against Tyranitar. For Tornadus, I think Hidden Power Ice could be an option to deal with Dragons better, and not be locked into Tailwind..

    Otherwise, I think the team is really well made
  11. Harsha

    Harsha Rest In Beats
    is a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
    RMT Co-Leader

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2011
    Messages:
    1,224
    Hey,

    Really nice team. You play your Tornadus with the right support quite nicely, so my rate will be a bit brief (teams that peak at #1 don't really need many changes). One of the few things you could try is Leftovers > Life Orb on Starmie, as it gives you survivability to ensure that Stealth Rock never goes unnoticed. This will also help immensely because you don't use Recover. It looks like you're going for coverage and reliability on Politoed, so I'd like to recommend my 3 Attacks Politoed, as it does what you need quite nicely. On Ferrothorn, try out Thunder Wave > Gyro Ball, because the things you'll be hitting (Espeon, Lati@s, and co.) aren't as common as other boosting sweepers that you could ruin with a well-timed Thunder Wave.

    Politoed (open)
    Politoed @ Leftovers | Drizzle
    Modest Nature | 248 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
    Hydro Pump | Hidden Power Grass | Ice Beam | Perish Song

    Anyhow, really cool team man. Good luck, I hope this helped!
  12. Smith

    Smith is a 90's bitch
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2009
    Messages:
    1,341
    I have been COERCED via Facebook to rate this pedestrian attempt at rain offense so I submit.

    I have no earthly idea how you stop DD Dragonite, at all. He can set up on Ferrothorn and then you have to use Tailwind on Tornadus and hit him with an Azumarill ice punch, which really sounds more like something I would do. You could try using a Scarfrachi over Scarf Scizor. Granted, the U-turn is a lot less powerful, but you now have a fantastic check to dragons (even lati@s and dnite) and can trick away your scarf against stall teams or the like (oh and that scarf jirachi or sd toxicroak that you've been bitching about (especially since toxicroak will probably sucker punch)). This also means you can run Bulldoze on "Nattorei" like Pengy wanted you to, since Gyro Ball isn't really that necessary. Good luck dickweed ;)

    EDIT: @below- Lum Berry
  13. Harsha

    Harsha Rest In Beats
    is a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
    RMT Co-Leader

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2011
    Messages:
    1,224
    Thunder Wave on Ferrothorn would stop Dragonite lol
  14. yee

    yee
    is a Battle Server Moderator Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,110
    Don't forget, Jirachi can use Zen Headbutt on a Scarf set to patch the Toxicroak weakness. U-Turn isn't worth a slot on it so you shouldn't have a hard time fitting it on.
  15. Spaniard

    Spaniard

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2006
    Messages:
    241
    When I saw tailwind I thought it was a very good idea to start a late-mid game waterfall sweep with azumarril. Why not simply pump it with speed EV's? I feel that even if waterfall destroys about everything you don't get oportunities to use it.

    And, since toxicroak is a problem to the team, you can try psychic over ice beam on politoed. I think you won't be using ice beam against dragonites and the like since very often, since your poli is not bulky and they will kill you, while poli can stand a fight against toxicroak with psychic.

    Good job in a ny case and congrats on the peak!
  16. dcae

    dcae naughty list

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2011
    Messages:
    1,169
    I like your team a lot, it is great and congratz on the 1st place. I think that if by chance you lose the weather war, it wouldnt hurt to put Rain Dance on Tornadus or Starmie to have a chance of dictating the match. I also think Iron Head should have the slot over Bullet Punch. With your EVs and Scarf, Bullet Punch fails to 2HKO Dragonite even after its Multiscale is broken (correct me if I'm wrong.) Azumarill provides excellent priority, so Scizor's is not necessarily necessary. Other than that, I do not see anything that is not covered by prior raters. Once again, congratulations.
  17. kill yourself

    kill yourself .|~Fashionista~|.
    is a Tutor Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Castle Valetis a Past WCoP Winneris the Smogon Tour Season 16 Champion

    Joined:
    May 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,767
    Thanks for the rates and compliments!

    @ PenguinX - yea Bulldoze is probably going over Gyro Ball. I'm not sure about Psychic on Toed patching up the Toxicroak weakness since it has other opportunities to set up, but I'll try it.

    @ Lasers - Ferrothorn is usually all the electric resist I need, since the electric types can't exactly switch into my attacks very well. I wear them down with SR and late-game Azumarill will pick them off. I like the idea of Jolteon though, since it forms a Volt-Turn core with Scizor, so I'll test it out.

    @ AfroThunderRule - I'll try that spread.

    @ LighTz911 - Rotom-W isn't a problem, since it can't switch into my attacks without taking significant damage. Its own Volt Switching leads to its demise, since it racks up constant SR damage, and Ferrothorn sponges them nicely. Late-game, Azumarill picks it off.

    @ yee - ok, I'll run some calcs and add some speed to Azu.

    @ Nubagator - those aren't photoshop skills lol, I made it in microsoft paint!

    @ Motagua - Yep I'll definitely try ScarfGross.

    @ ThunderBlunder - Latios seems interesting and would definitely make fighting Rotom-W easier but I'm not sure where to fit it in. I'll try it once I figure that out.

    @ harsha2014 - adding Thunder Wave to Ferro makes me even more vulnerable to Magnezone, so I'm not sure about that. The spread I use on Politoed lets it outrun SpDef Heatran and Bulk Up Breloom, which could always come in handy, so I'm kind of reluctant to drop it for some bulk that probably won't make much of a difference in the long run. I'll try Lefties on Starmie.

    @ Smith - I really like the Scarf Rachi idea and will test it out :D

    @ spaniard - yeah I'll add some speed to Azu after I run some calcs.

    @ Dcae - I don't really need Rain Dance on anything else since the rest of the team deals with opposing weather just fine and Politoed has great longevity. Iron Head's worth a shot on Sciz, but I can remember some situations where dual priority really saved my ass (vs. a weakened Trick Room Reuniclus, for instance). I'll try it though.
  18. maxehg

    maxehg

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2012
    Messages:
    4
    Zapdos kills everything in this team with heatwave and thunder
  19. kill yourself

    kill yourself .|~Fashionista~|.
    is a Tutor Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Castle Valetis a Past WCoP Winneris the Smogon Tour Season 16 Champion

    Joined:
    May 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,767
    Starmie outspeeds and OHKOs it with a rain-boosted Hydro Pump
  20. JGSabino

    JGSabino

    Joined:
    May 19, 2010
    Messages:
    145
    Awesome team, I have a similar one. However, as I play DW OU, I don't have problems with choosing a Steel-type because there is Genesect x).

    Mine was also built around Specs Tornadus, but CB Pert quickly showed to me that it is as good as Tornados, and together they are even more awesome. It also has an immunity to Electric and CB STAB Earthquake will help you a lot against Jirachi and Toxicroak. I think you should at least try it.

    About Scizor's slot, I don't think Metagross or Jirachi are a good idea. Scarf Metagross is not that powerful as it can't use its STAB without becoming Setup bait for the next Pokémon, and putting a Scarf on Jirachi sounds like a waste of an awesome Pokémon to me.

    I love the idea of Specs Jolteon + Scizor, but Tornadus is way too awesome to be replaced :3.

    EDIT: Hm... I guess ScarfRachi still works as good as in 4th gen... Awesome! About Sun teams, I remember checking a RMT with Scarf Terakion and ScarfRachi as a Revenge Killer Core and it worked, maybe you should try it... But then you get 4 Choice-locked Pokémons o.O
  21. emirinho

    emirinho

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2010
    Messages:
    295
    Hello, congrats on the very good and successful team.
    Honestly, i don't have anything special to suggest except that you should put hp ice instead of Tailwind on Tornadus because you can counter set up dragons like that.
  22. maxehg

    maxehg

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2012
    Messages:
    4
    Starmie cant OHKO specially defensive zapdos, rain-boosted hydro pump does 250 - 295(65.3% - 77%) while thunder from the same zapdos does 356 - 422(136.4% - 161.7%) to starmie, 378 - 446(93.6% - 110.4%) to azumarril, 314 - 372(88.5% - 104.8%) to politoed. heatwave does 212 - 252(74.9% - 89%) to scizor and zapdos walls it completly with sub-roost the same happens with ferrothorn. Tornadus dies from 1 thunder and lacks any means of damaging zapdos.
  23. kill yourself

    kill yourself .|~Fashionista~|.
    is a Tutor Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Castle Valetis a Past WCoP Winneris the Smogon Tour Season 16 Champion

    Joined:
    May 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,767
    CB Pert is interesting...I might try it. Thanks for the rate.
    I can't counter setup dragons because they outspeed and OHKO me first lol. Tailwind is a life-saver. Thanks for the rate and compliment.
    Starmie has a good chance of OHKOing it after Stealth Rock, and then Azumarill / Tornadus can pick it off. Besides, it's not like SpDef Zapdos is common, and if you really think it's a 6-0 machine against me, I would appreciate it if you would tell me how I should change my team to deal with it better while still maintaining the overall strategy.
  24. emirinho

    emirinho

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2010
    Messages:
    295
    If you want something against Zapdos use CB Swampert as suggested above by someone.
    Put Ice punch instead of SE for better accuracy.
    Just wondering when do you even use tail-wind, since your tornadus is Specs.
  25. New World Order

    New World Order Licks Toads
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2009
    Messages:
    2,170
    Cool team BKC, and congrats on the success, any team with an Azumarill is win!

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)