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Attempt at UU Stall

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by a412, Jul 11, 2013.

  1. a412

    a412

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2012
    Messages:
    4
    Hey! This is my attempt at a UU stall team. I've done fairly well with stall teams in OU / Ubers, so I tried it in UU :)

    First Glance
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    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
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    The Team (Changes in green)

    [​IMG]
    Snorlax @ Leftovers
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 SDef / 8 Spd
    Careful Nature
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk
    - Whirlwind
    - Body Slam

    Max SpDef Snorlax to wall special attackers to no end. 8 speed EVs to speed creep other 30 speed stuff. Using the RestTalk set because I love instant recovery. Spreads paralysis and phazes to rack up hazard damage.

    Sure, it can't do anything to Chandelure, but it walls it all day while resting and phazing it for free damage. Specs HP Fighting is a switch to Cofagrigus. Scarf / LO Chandelure stands no chance at all of killing it.

    Relevant calcs (I accidentally used 252 HP / 248+ SpD instead of 248 HP / 252+ SpD, but it doesn't really make a difference):

    252+ SpA Choice Specs Chandelure Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 248+ SpD Thick Fat Snorlax: 118-141 (22.51 - 26.9%) -- possible 5HKO
    252+ SpA Choice Specs Chandelure Hidden Power Fighting vs. 252 HP / 248+ SpD Snorlax: 184-218 (35.11 - 41.6%) -- 82.23% chance to 3HKO
    252 SpA Chandelure Hidden Power Fighting vs. 252 HP / 248+ SpD Snorlax: 112-134 (21.37 - 25.57%) -- possible 5HKO
    252+ SpA Life Orb Chandelure Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 248+ SpD Thick Fat Snorlax: 103-122 (19.65 - 23.28%) -- possible 6HKO

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    [​IMG]
    Umbreon @ Leftovers
    Trait: Synchronize
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 SDef / 8 Spd
    Bold Nature
    - Heal Bell
    - Wish
    - Foul Play
    - Protect

    I added Umbreon because a bunch of things hated status / lacked recovery. Wish + Protect for Wish passing and semi-reliable recovery. Heal Bell because having a cleric can't be a bad thing, also because Slowbro hates being hit by Toxic. Foul Play because it was suggested that I add an attacking move to Umbreon. Changed to SpD Umbreon because it wasn't walling physical attacks that well anyways. Now synergizes even better with Cofagrigus.

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    [​IMG]
    Cofagrigus @ Leftovers
    Trait: Mummy
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spd
    Bold Nature
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Shadow Ball

    I needed a Fighting resist = physically defensive Ghost-type = Cofagrigus. WoW + Max Def = good luck killing it. 8 speed EVs to speed creep other 30 speed stuff. RestTalk because I found that it was taking way too much damage to wall anything if using Pain Split. Good defensive synergy with both Snorlax (Cofagrigus takes Fighting and Snorlax takes Ghost) and Umbreon (Cofagrigus takes Bug / Fighting and Umbreon takes Ghost / Dark).

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    [​IMG]
    Qwilfish @ Black Sludge
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 248 HP / 208 Def / 52 Spd
    Impish Nature
    - Taunt
    - Spikes
    - Pain Split
    - Waterfall

    Hazards! Qwilfish is (IMO) the best Spikes user in UU. On-site spread with 4 EVs moved from HP to Def for SR. Between Intimidate and high investment in Def, Qwilfish can switch into physical attacks and get free hazards up. Thunder Wave doesn't really synergise that well with Toxic / WoW all over this team, so I don't use it. This used to have Toxic Spikes, which was changed to Taunt after I realized that Toxic Spikes are kind of bad in UU.

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    [​IMG]
    Swampert @ Leftovers
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spd
    Impish Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Stealth Rock
    - Toxic
    - Roar
    Defensive Swampert set, added because I had Electric-type problems. Stealth Rock to round out my hazards. Roar, to have a physically defensive phazer. Toxic for status, obviously.

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    [​IMG]
    Crobat @ Black Sludge
    Trait: Inner Focus
    EVs: 176 HP / 192 Atk / 4 SDef / 136 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Brave Bird
    - Taunt
    - Roost
    - Toxic

    Crobat, added to deal with Scrafty, which this team had problems with. EV spread is the onsite spread (outspeeds base 115s, OHKOs 0/0 Scrafty after SR). Fast Taunt shuts down setup / hazards.

    Importable:
  2. PTJon7

    PTJon7

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    553
    Sub-Bulk Up Scrafty would sweep your entire team, the only thing that actually stops it is Snorlax's Whirlwind. Nothing on this team can break Scrafty's sub and once the Sub is up thats pretty much game. The best thing you've got to stop Scrafty is Qwilfish, replace Pain Split or Toxic Spikes with Taunt.

    Umbreon needs Foul Play, you should always have an attack on something, or else Taunt will screw you over completely. Replace Toxic as Qwilfish already can lay Toxic Spikes.

    Hypnosis' 60% accuracy is pretty abysmal, Bronzong could really do with running Earthquake instead.

    Running just Psychic on Slowbro leaves it incredibly open to the powerful Dark types of the tier. They won't care if they get Toxic'd or not when they can just nail you with their super-effective STABs. I think Scald and Psyshock would be much better moves over Psychic and Toxic.
  3. Tyler Nagase

    Tyler Nagase

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2013
    Messages:
    10
    i love umbreon. he such a great pokemon, i would recomend a different moveset though. i always use: Toxic, Confuse Ray, Moonlight, Payback. he pretty much becomes a staller. toxic will take them over, confuse ray just for a couple more hits from themselves, i use payback because he is slower than most pokemon so he is dealing some damage and then moonlight. he will survive most hits even a fighting type hit so you can always survive a little bit longer
  4. TheEeveeAnimations

    TheEeveeAnimations

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2013
    Messages:
    5
    First thing:
    From what I see, a popular offensive core CM Raikou + Choice Scarf Darmanitan can wreck through your team badly, as after +3 Raikou can 2HKO your whole team and Darmanitan can blast through Umbreon and Snorlax so Raikou can clean up.
    +3 252 SpA Raikou Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Snorlax: 240-283 (45.88 - 54.11%) -- 3.91% chance to 2HKO

    Also, two bulky Waters on one team seems redundant to me, but that's just personal preference.
  5. Tyler Nagase

    Tyler Nagase

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2013
    Messages:
    10
    Also an alakazam with focus blast and shadow ball and energy ball would wreck every Pokemon on your team.
  6. Purple Grind

    Purple Grind

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2012
    Messages:
    28
    ^alakazam is ou
  7. Kitten Milk

    Kitten Milk relevant
    is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2013
    Messages:
    634
    You're kind of weak to volt-turn/basically any team that implements a lot of strong electric attacks. I'd advise you replace slowbro (which doesn't really fit in) with swampert to help you deal with this more. Keep in mind that you still have to watch out for HP Grass, but it should at least help against Volt Turn. Given that you already have an SR user, you could either make Swampert a bulky Band set (I like giving my stall teams a bit of wallbreaking for not only surprise but also to help win against other stall), or just a defensive set with Scald, EQ, Toxic, and Roar (or something like that, not the most efficient with toxic spikes but whatever). Also, I'd suggest that you shift Umbreon's EVs to 252 HP/252 SpD/4 Def. For starters, this gives you three special and three physical walls.

    Finally, I'm not sure if Cofag really benefits much from RestTalk. I personally would rather see Pain Split/Knock Off/Shadow Ball/Will-o-Wisp, but I guess that's just personal preference. Best of luck with the stall team =)
  8. Tyler Nagase

    Tyler Nagase

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2013
    Messages:
    10
    Oh yah my bad, I forgot this was a UU team.
  9. rampage0529

    rampage0529

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2013
    Messages:
    2
    If I had to battle this team I would probably click the forfeit button so fast to save me the trouble of a long and boring battle but nonetheless your team looks solid and seems to have all the components of a stall team. Though these are the suggestions I have. I would take hypnosis off of bronzong and replace it with EQ since you are running toxic on it already and toxic spikes on qwilfish. Plus the accuracy isn't good and you won't get frustrated when you miss. Also you could add a rapid spinner although on a team like this its not really necessary but if the opposing team sets up spikes or has a Xatu then you're kinda in a pickle. Also mixed work up Virizion seems to be a threat to your team so watch out for that
  10. Patrick1088

    Patrick1088

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2013
    Messages:
    557
    Hey there i agree with rampage itd be a very boring battle to say the least...

    Anyhoo i dont really see the need for 6 walls tbh. Even stall teams have some poke to come in and cleanup late game. For example an ou sand stall can use landorus or terrakion which love hazards to get the key kos. I would highly recommend considering actual offensive pressure or stall breakers otherwise pokes will be able to setup on you.

    Personally i feel that cof, lax and umbreon are a great core that stop most offensive pokes easily. Zong is reallu there for hazards and status. Qwilfish is good but you have a great wall on cof that counters mienshao and heracross. Plus i wouldnt recommend t spikes since nidoz and roserade are everywhere.

    I recommend leaving cof, lax, and umbreon (switch to sp def spread you have no hope of taking fighting attacks so you might as well inveat in sp def). Try a core with roserade, swampert and crobat
    You get hazards, status, another phazer, and a great stall breaker in crobat. Plus all three of these pokes can hit hard and be great utility pokes. I dont mean to change your team but try some of those pokes ans youll notice theboffenaivebpressure will force switches racking up entry hazard dmg : )
  11. a412

    a412

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2012
    Messages:
    4
    Thanks for all the comments!

    Changes:

    Slowbro -> Swampert

    Swampert @ Leftovers
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spd
    Impish Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Stealth Rock
    - Toxic
    - Roar

    Per the advice / comments of TheEeveeAnimations, Kitten Milk, and Patrick1088, I've changed Slowbro to Swampert to deal with Electric-types better. SR because I removed Bronzong, Toxic because Qwilfish no longer carries Toxic Spikes.

    Question: Should I use Waterfall or Scald on this set instead of a status move?

    Bronzong -> Crobat

    Crobat @ Black Sludge
    Trait: Inner Focus
    EVs: 176 HP / 192 Atk / 4 SDef / 136 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Brave Bird
    - Taunt
    - Roost
    - Toxic
    Crobat to deal with Sub BU Scrafty. Toxic because Qwilfish no longer carries Toxic Spikes. On site spread.

    Umbreon:
    Toxic -> Foul Play
    248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spd -> 248 HP / 252 SDef / 8 Spd
    Per the advice of PTJon7 and Kitten Milk.

    Qwilfish:
    Toxic Spikes -> Taunt
    I realized that Toxic Spikes were really bad in UU with Nidoking / Nidoqueen / Roserade running around. I'm thinking about replacing Qwilfish now, but with what?

    Is my team weak to anything new after I changed all that?
  12. SOMALIA

    SOMALIA The King
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2009
    Messages:
    1,706
    1) Pain Split on Qwilfish is an interesting idea however there are moves that would be of greater use. Try using Haze instead of Pain Split; substitute set-up mons as well as last-opposing-Pokemon standing can be in someways nulified via the use of Haze. Go with this is you are NOT going to follow my suggestionsin points 3 & 4.

    2) Change the nature of your Umbreon to Careful, 252 evs in SpD calls for a Careful nature to make the most of it.

    3) Your team lacks a Spinner which can put you in a bad situation vs opposing stall teams.

    To help remedy this issue I suggest adding a Blastoise instead of Swampert. You now have a spinner but have lost your Stealth Rock user.

    Add Roserade instead of Qwilfish as a bulky Spiker.

    Add Gligar instead of Crobat. Crobat provided with some nice quick Taunting as well as wrecking fighting types however you now got Gligar for Heracross as well as Cofagrigus.

    Snorlax / Gligar / Umbreon / Roserade / Blastoise / Cofagrigus

    4) Use the standard bulky spiker Roserade onsite. Use the standard spinner Blastoise onsite. Use the standard Gligar set onsite.

    If you still have trouble with stall try a NP Cofagrigus set.

    Hope this helps

    @Patrick, Stall needs a spinner. Simple as. Sure my suggestions aren't the best but the purpose of Gligar was for setting up rocks and having a good defensive wall. He can use Roost / SR / Aerial Ace / EQ if he really has trouble with cross however I doubt that...
    Blastoise gives some good syngergy with the remainder of the team. Raikou gets fucked by umbreon and Snorlax....Play stall and then come back talking bro.
  13. Patrick1088

    Patrick1088

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2013
    Messages:
    557
    He doeant need gligar AND cof to counter hera. Crobat is a great check to moxie cross locked into its STAB moves. I find that swampert and crobat stop hera easily. Crobat can take the cc megahorn and eq while swamp handles the stone edges. If you put gligar over crobat youll find sd hera to rip through the team. What can gligar do to hera? Hit it with a weak resisted earthquake? Dont use blastoise youll open yourself again to cm raikou.
  14. BlazeTemplar

    BlazeTemplar

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2012
    Messages:
    40
    On Moxie sets Gligar can take anything from Heracross, smash with a toxic, and then roost stall it to death. It's known as the best heracross Counter in UU for a reason. Crobat gets demolished by stone edge, and Swampert doesn't appreciate anything from Moxiecross.

    Anyways, onto the team.
    I've never been a big user of stall teams but they're a fun type to run. Still, like many stall cores Taunt completely severely cripplies this team so that's something you'll need to keep on the watch for. Prankster Sableye in particular completely disrupts and cripples your entire team for example. It can take just about anything crobat can dish out too (Even taking a max crit brave bird though not well), taunt it and heal up with priority recovers. Then to add insult to injury it can burn crobat if it's not afraid of the Umbreon switch (not that burn overly bothers Sableye anyways.) Worse yet, sableye can taunt Snorlax so it can't get rid of it to rack up hazard damage. Sableye really wrecks your team right now. Tornadus can taunt, and then begin applying offensive pressure and Whimsicott can taunt stall most of your team to death too though it needs a sub to pester Crobat. (It can't outright kill it though without paraturns or prior residual damage.)
    If you want to keep crobat maybe try Banded Crobat
    An example Banded Set:
    252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Brave Bird
    U-Turn
    Cross Poison
    Roost
    This will let you deal with Sableye a bit easier as it deals a minimum of 65% with Brave bird (As Jolly) and a OHKO if a critical.
    In short, Crobat may not appreciate the burn but the damage output is high enough that Sableye cannot switch into Crobat at all. Plus, you can deal good chip damage with U-Turn, wearing down walls or sacrifices that go in to deal with Crobat.

    Another good choice is a powerful guts user that doesn't mind the burn and can deal with Sableye.

    For example Choice Luxray can do a good job thanks to it's hefty 120 base attack, guts, and access to powerful STAB wild charge.
    Luxray @ Choice Scarf
    252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
    Adamant / Jolly Nature (I'd suggest Adamant with the scarf set)
    Wild Charge
    Facade
    Crunch / Ice Fang
    Superpower
    This set gives you excellent coverage, good power, and a potential boost if Sableye is stupid enough to burn it. Plus, it'll consistantly do hefty damage to the rest of the team. Furthermore, it can give you a scarf user to break down threats that would typically outspeed you and cripple your walls. (Tornadus with taunt comes to mind) Ice Fang can deal SE Damage on Whimsicott while Crunch does good neutral damage to a lot of things. Wild Charge deals with tornadus and can hammer Sableye hard too.

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