1. Welcome to Smogon! Check out the Smogon Starters Hangout for everything you need to know about starting out in the community. Don't forget to introduce yourself in the Introduction and Hangout Thread, too!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

B&W Research Thread

Discussion in 'BW Competitive Discussion' started by ΩDonut, Sep 21, 2010.

  1. Zebstrika

    Zebstrika

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    942
    I thought, like Thunder, it had 50% accuracy in the sun. Bulbapedia says that, and it otherwise seems exactly like Thunder except for typing and effect.
    What about Ancientpower and its variants and Charge Beam?
  2. MeroMero

    MeroMero

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2010
    Messages:
    79
    Assist Power's increase in power will only acknowledge stat boost when said stats are at level +1 or above.

    Stats drops are factored in, Assist Power's base power decrease by 20 for each stage of stat drop but will ignore stats that have dropped at level -1 or below.

    The highest base power Assist Power can achieve is 860, to test this I used a Smeargle (103 SpAtk) and a Bronzong (364 SpDef).

    Smeargle's moveset:
    _Acupressure
    _Tail Glow
    _Spore
    _Assist Power

    Tail Glow first to immediately put Smeargle at +6 SpAtk in two turns, then Acupressure until Smeargle can't boost its stats anymore.

    Then I used Assist Power against Bronzong and here are the damages:
    194 - 180 - 200 - 176 - 200 - 178 - 184 - 202

    Since there are 7 stats (including accuracy and evasion), max power is 20 + 20 * 42, which is equal to 860.



    Stats drops are factored in, Assist Power's base power decrease by 20 for each stage of stat drop but will ignore stats that have dropped at level -1 or below.
    Smeargle (103 SpAtk) vs Gardevoir (265 HP / 228 SpDef)
    Code:
    Smeargle: +6 SpAtk
    Damage: 96 HP
    Power: 140
    After Gardevoir's Captivate
    Code:
    Smeargle: +4 SpAtk
    Damage: 51 HP
    Power: 100
    Smeargle (103 SpAtk) vs lv 59 Magnezone (159 HP / 123 SpDef)
    Code:
    Smeargle: +6 Def
    Damage: 45 HP
    Power: 140
    After Magnezone's Mirror Shot
    Code:
    Smeargle: +6 Def
              -1 Acc
    Damage: 47 HP
    Power: 140
    After Magnezone's Screech
    Code:
    Smeargle: +4 Def
              -1 Acc
    Damage: 34 HP
    Power: 100
    After Smeargle's Cotton Guard and Magnezone's Mirror Shot
    Code:
    Smeargle: +6 Def
              -2 Acc
    Damage: 44 HP
    Power: 140


    Assist Power's increase in power will only acknowledge stat boost when said stats are at level +1 or above.
    Smeargle (103 SpAtk) vs lv 59 Magnezone (159 HP / 123 SpDef) second test
    Code:
    Smeargle: +3 SpAtk
    Damage: 64 HP
    Power: 80
    After Magnezone's Screech
    Code:
    Smeargle: +3 SpAtk
              -2 Def
    Damage: 60 HP
    Power: 80
    After Smeargle's Cotton Guard and Magnezone's Screech
    Code:
    Smeargle: +3 SpAtk
              -1 Def
    Damage: 70 HP
    Power: 80
    After Smeargle's Cotton Guard
    Code:
    Smeargle: +3 SpAtk
              +2 Def
    Damage: 93 HP
    Power: 120




    EDIT:

    http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3071599&postcount=1225
    It seems this was overlooked ^^'


    Pumice Stone
    Concerning the item Pumice Stone:
    _it cuts in half its holder's weight;
    _combined with the ability Light Metal, it effectively divides by 4 the Pokémon's original weight.

    Pokémon used:
    _Machamp
    _Entei (198 kg / 436.5 lb)
    _Rayquaza (206.5 kg / 455.2 lb)
    _Metagross (550 kg / 1215.5 lb)

    First test: Machamp (394 Atk) using Low Kick vs Entei (434 HP / 295 Def)
    w/o Pumice Stone: 168 HP dealt (100 bp)
    with Pumice Stone: 123 HP dealt (80 bp)

    Second test (to see if Pumice Stone has a modifier /2 or /3): Machamp (394 Atk) using Low Kick vs Rayquaza (321 HP / 192 Def)
    w/o Pumice Stone: 149 HP dealt (120 bp)
    with Pumice Stone: 122 HP dealt (100 bp)

    At this point we know the the Pumice Stone divide by 2 the weight of its holder, but what about Light Metal ?

    Third test: Machamp (394 Atk) using Low Kick vs Metagross with the Light Metal ability (364 HP / 394 Def)
    with Pumice Stone: 112 HP dealt (100 bp)

    Now we know as well that it stacks with Light Metal as well (and presumably with Heavy Metal as well, but it's rather pointless).
  3. mien

    mien
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2008
    Messages:
    732
    Good question, to test this i made an Erufuun with +2 Accuracy(used Claw Sharpen twice) using Windstorm against a Blissey in permanent sunshine.
    If it has 70 accuracy it should hit 116.2% of the time (never miss)
    If it has 60 accuracy it should hit 99.6% of the time
    If it has 50 accuracy it should hit 83.0% of the time

    During my test Windstorm hit 44 out of 50 times or 88% hit rate.

    I suppose this confirms that Windstorm indeed has 50% accuracy in Sun
  4. Neintales

    Neintales

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    Messages:
    8
    So I was just doing some battle subway and using magic guard rankurusu. I got glared by a kurimugan or something but thought nothing of it due to already being slow as dicks and magic guard preventing me from being fully paralyzed. On the next pokemon however, I was fully paralyzed for 2 turns in a row.
    Magic guard no longer prevents a pokemon from being fully paralyzed.
    I think some testing needs to be done with magic guard to see if there are any other changes, but considering all of its other effects have to do with indirect damage, I doubt there are any.

    Thought gastro acid might have been used that battle, but after doing a wild double battle where I paralyzed my own rankurusu, I was still fully paralyzed. Still would be a good idea for someone else to confirm this however.
  5. mien

    mien
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2008
    Messages:
    732
    I confirm this, my own paralyzed Rankurusu with Magic Guard got fully paralyzed 3 times out of 10 turns.
  6. MeroMero

    MeroMero

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2010
    Messages:
    79
    Now Skill Swap actually shows the swapped abilities:

    [​IMG]
    Here it shows Rankurusu's Magic Guard and Tabunne's Regeneration being swapped.

    Btw, I second what Neintales and mien said, my Rankurusu got fully paralyzed twice despite Magic Guard.
  7. Death Phenomeno

    Death Phenomeno I'm polite so just for clarity, when I'm cross I
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2006
    Messages:
    902
    Focus Punch & switching change:

    Previously, the user would charge Focus Punch, the opponent would switch, and then Focus Punch would hit.

    Now, however, it's the other way around. The opponent switches first, and then Focus Punch will charge and hit immediately after.
  8. breh

    breh ⁰ ゝ⁰
    is a Smogon IRC AOPis a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2010
    Messages:
    3,199
    So the focus punch message has a lower priority/switch has a higher priority? Which?
  9. SupremeDirt

    SupremeDirt

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2009
    Messages:
    611
    Just a note:
    I can confirm that V-Generate has a secondary effect of lowering the user's Defense, Special Defense, and Speed one stage. Tested with an Infernape using Assist and picking it from a Smeargle, as well as the Smeargle using it itself.

    Alas, my team was fire weak and was swept. Damn you Niched.
  10. CPU

    CPU

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2007
    Messages:
    475
    I don't know if it was noted, but the Everstone trick still works for both parents.

    Tested first with a female Kuitaran holding it; 13 out of 20 Eggs had the same nature.
    Then tested with the male Sneasel holding it; 8 out of 20 Eggs had the same nature.
  11. TheGuyWhoIsSitting

    TheGuyWhoIsSitting

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2009
    Messages:
    10
    I don't know if this has been tested already. I tried using Simple Beam (a move that will make the targets ability Simple) on Slaking and it didn't work. So I can assume it doesn't work if a Pokemon with Truant is the target.

    I assume if you wanted to make Slaking not as usless you'd have to have Desukan make it Mummy and then try Simple Beam from there, but I don't know I was trying to use it with a Genosect and Bulk Up on Slaking so Slaking would be at +2 attack and defense.
  12. CanadiEntei

    CanadiEntei

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2010
    Messages:
    164
    Question: About two of the new Ice-type moves: "Freeze Bolt" & Cold Flare

    Before my question, the info if you need it (again?):
    "Freeze Bolt": Ice-type: Physical Attack: 5 PP: 140 Base Power: 90 Accuracy
    ~ may paralyze ~

    "Cold Flare": Ice-type: Special Attack: 5 PP: 140 Base Power: 90 Accuracy

    Now the question/(s): assume Kyurem's Frozen World is used after the other "signature"

    Are Freeze Bolt and Cold Flare current moves as used via the "combination attack method" when Kyurem (Dragon/Ice) paired with Reshiram/Zekrom and their "signature" moves of Lightning Strike, Blue Flame, Cross Thunder, and Cross Flame***

    ...or a Pokemon that has use of these "signatures" from Sketch, Assist, Transform, or Mimic...

    ***are used?

    I'm asking as these two Ice move's have an Accuracy-slash-BasePower difference when compared to the BW dragon legend's "signature" moves.
  13. El_Sargento

    El_Sargento

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2006
    Messages:
    627
    Somewhat important...

    Life Orbed Encourage Nidoking used Earthquake --------------> 10% recoil.
    Life Orbed Encourage Nidoking used Earth Power -------------> No recoil AT ALL.

    Life Orb + Attack boosted by Encourage = No Recoil? o_O

    Nidoking is a monster now!
  14. ΩDonut

    ΩDonut don't glaze me bro
    is a Programmeris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2006
    Messages:
    3,727
    Interesting. Do you have a video of this, and did Earth Power still get the Encorage boost?
  15. El_Sargento

    El_Sargento

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2006
    Messages:
    627
    No video, sorry. But it works. I have a Life Orb Nidoking with Earth Power, Thunderbolt, Ice Beam and Flamethrower and he NEVER takes recoil... and the Life Orb and Encourage boosts stack too.

    Level 67 Nidoking Flamethrower vs Level 65 wild Clefairy = Aprox. 35% Hp left.
    Level 67 Life Orb Nidoking Flamethrower vs Level 65 wild Clefairy = Nearly OHKO... and no Life Orb recoil.

    EDIT: Pretty much confirmed.

    Recently catched Encourage Kurimugan equiped with Life Orb uses Sludge Bomb -----> NO RECOIL.
    Recently catched Encourage Kurimugan equiped with Life Orb uses Dragon Claw -----> 10% RECOIL.
  16. BurningMan

    BurningMan fueled by beer

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2009
    Messages:
    1,303
    in gen 4 it was exactly the same Magic Guard only prevents from passive damage not the side effect of status.
    if a magic guard pokemon is burnt it will still lower its attack, paralysis will still lower you speed and make you fully paralized and if your toxiced the toxic counter will still count up (so be aware of gastro acid^^).
  17. Thorhammer

    Thorhammer

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2008
    Messages:
    1,959
    False. The one thing Gen 4 Magic Guard did other than prevent passive damage was prevent full paralysis. All other secondary effects of status applied, but not full paralysis.

    http://www.smogon.com/dp/abilities/magic_guard
  18. mien

    mien
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2008
    Messages:
    732
    I have tested this with a 175 Spatt Encourage Nidoking hold Life orb using Flamethrower against a Blissey with 306 SpD

    Damage = 66 - 79 damage (both min and max confirmed in-game)
    Nidoking got no Life Orb damage

    As such i confirm that the Encourage and Life Orb boosts stack without any recoil when using a move with a secondary effect.
  19. Guyperson

    Guyperson

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2010
    Messages:
    5
    If a choice item pokemon uses mimic, does it get to choose a new move, or is it stuck with its mimicked move?
  20. Staraptor Call

    Staraptor Call

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2009
    Messages:
    1,422
    Dragon Claw and Earthquake are both Physical moves, but all the secondary effect moves tested with Life Orb and Encourage have been special. Do Encourage Pokemon holding Life Orbs take damage when using Physical secondary effect moves? What about Special moves without secondary effects?
  21. El_Sargento

    El_Sargento

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2006
    Messages:
    627
    Encourage + Rock Slide + Life Orb = No recoil.
    Encourage + Surf + Life Orb = 10% recoil.

    Again, Nidoking, Master of Encourage XD.
  22. Last Elixir

    Last Elixir

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2009
    Messages:
    3
    Was Rock Slide boosted by the Life Orb though? This sounds like it could be awesome.
  23. El_Sargento

    El_Sargento

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2006
    Messages:
    627
    Yes :)
  24. Naxte

    Naxte

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    1,320
    Interesting.. This makes me think of some other questions then. I don't believe it's very likely, but then again, I didn't expect this stuff with Life Orb at all either, so it's worth testing, especially my first question:

    -If a Pokemon with Encourage that's holding a Choice Item uses a move with a secondary effect, is it still locked into that move next turn, or can it choose another move (in other words, when using a secondary effect, does Encourage let the Pokemon ignore the locking-effects of Choice items)? If the Pokemon can make a different choice, can it just choose between other moves with secondary effects or can it choose any move it wants next turn?

    -If a Pokemon with Encourage that's holding an Iron Ball uses a secondary effect move, does it suffer from the speed-reducing effects of the item for that turn? If it's a Flying-type/has Levitate, does Iron Ball still negate the immunities those offer if the Pokemon chooses a secondary effect move for that turn?
  25. ΩDonut

    ΩDonut don't glaze me bro
    is a Programmeris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2006
    Messages:
    3,727
    I don't really think it's necessary to test all these items. It's already been proven that Encourage still allows King's Rock to flinch, so it's not as if it blocks all item side effects.

    These will be tested on a "if someone happens to encounter it in battle" basis.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)