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Back In Orange (Rebirth of UU Stall)

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by Mazz, Dec 9, 2012.

  1. Mazz

    Mazz UU's Workhorse
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    [​IMG]
    The Rebirth of UU Stall
    An Underused RMT by Ace_Emerald (orange) and Pokemazter (black)

    Introduction

    With Hail making a passive return to the tier, the death of standard-ass stall teams in UU is official. The tier has become too offensive, with the likes of Raikou, Heracross, and Kingdra buzzing around the the tier non-stop, and any other stall to emerge will most likely take the form of Hail Stall, taking advantage of Snover's induction to the tier. However, this team is not about to let Standard Stall just roll over and die.

    Putting our heads together, Ace_Emerald and I have had immediate and lasting success with this team under the alts of Emerald Deuce and Mazter Deuce. Using an outside-the-box perspective, Back in Orange takes the concept of using standard elements of stall and adding a twist to help cover the new threats brought about by the previous tier shifts and inclusion of hail. The team focuses on Roserade and Camerupt's ability to set up hazards and quickly neuter any possible threats via Cofagrigus' Will-O-Wisp or Snorlax's Body Slam, allowing the slow, residual damage brought about by hazards damage, status, and the sporadic attack to break down a team.​

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    In-Depth Look

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    Snorlax @ Leftovers
    Thick Fat
    208 HP / 124 Def / 176 SpD
    Careful Nature
    - Body Slam
    - Whirlwind
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk


    Snorlax is a give-me on any stall team. It single handedly counters almost every special attacker in the tier and is even difficult to KO physically. Not using something that handles so much of the metagame would be stupid.

    Much like Ace_Emerald made aware of above, Snorlax is way too valuable to pass over on a stall team, as it beats all Special Attackers. Body Slam brings a lot to the team, slowing many Choice Scarf switch-ins with it's chance for paralysis. With access to Whirlwind, Snorlax also doubles as a phazer, racking up hazards damage for the opposing team. Snorlax also functions as an effective status absorber, being able to Rest off the status and abuse Sleep Talk.​

    [​IMG]
    Cofagrigus @ Leftovers
    Mummy
    252 HP / 136 Def / 120 SpD
    Bold Nature
    - Shadow Ball
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Haze
    - Rest


    Another give-me. It has ridiculous physical bulk, the ability to take on almost any physical attacker with Haze and Will-O-Wisp, and pairs perfectly with the mighty Snorlax. Those two can stall a good portion of the metagame by themselves.

    Adding onto Ace_Emerald's point, Cofagrigus also functions as the team's Spinblocker, allowing the team to maintain the passive damage brought by its entry hazards. Cofagrigus also puts major physical threats, such as Heracross and Mienshao, on lockdown, preventing them from completely bowling over the team. Shadow Ball prevents Cofagrigus from being Taunt-bait while providing the team with a solid hit against Psychic- and Ghost-types. Haze and Will-O-Wisp are vital components of Cofagrigus that this team cannot afford to give up, the one completely neutering set up sweepers, and the other devastating the physical sweepers Cofagrigus tends to switch-in on. Rest is used over Pain split to guarantee full HP recovery and protect Cofagrigus from status. Roserade carries Aromatherapy regardless, so the 2-turn Sleep is negligible.​

    [​IMG]
    Roserade @ Black Sludge
    Natural Cure
    252 HP / 240 SpD / 16 Spe
    Calm Nature
    - Spikes
    - Giga Drain
    - Sludge Bomb
    - Aromatherapy


    A great team supporter. She's a fantastic Spiker that allows this team to break through bulky Water-types easier, and clears possibly crippling status conditions with Aromatherapy. Very useful, and a pretty standard choice.

    That, in a nutshell. Initially, Qwilfish was supposed to take this slot, but Rotom-F would be incapable of taking on all the bulky Water-types, so dual Spikes were dropped for Spikes + Cleric. Giga Drain and Leftovers are being used in place of Rest or Synthesis in order to make room for Aromatherapy. So far, the trade has been a benefit, as many things Roserade is either setting up against or subduing carry a weakness to Giga Drain. Sludge Bomb is there to mostly just damage other Roserade, but the chance for Poison helps the team out loads.​

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    Rotom-Frost @ Choice Specs
    Levitate
    252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Thunderbolt
    - Blizzard
    - Volt Switch
    - Trick


    This was my bright idea for the team. Specs Rotom checks many wallbreakers that would otherwise run through this team, Togekiss being the most important. Trick allows it to check set up sweepers like Scrafty that give this team problems, or cripple an annoying wall on the opponent's team. I originally suggested Rotom-H, but Pokematzer pointed out the nicer coverage of this form, so we stuck with it.

    Stealth Rock weakness aside, Rotom-F is a massive threat to the metagame. It's excellent coverage is only stopped by a few Pokemon that are rarely seen in the tier, making it hard for the opposition to switch-in. Rotom-F is here to typically handle most Stallbreakers or finish off weakened threats, typically ending matches. Volt Switch provides the team with momentum, while ThunderBolt and Blizzard just bash things in left,right, and center.​

    [​IMG]
    Blastoise @ Leftovers
    Torrent
    252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
    Bold Nature
    - Scald
    - Foresight
    - Roar
    - Rapid Spin


    Using Blastiose over better bulky Water-types is a necessary evil. A stall team needs to clear hazards, and it's simply the best at this job. It still manages to serve as a general backup physical wall for Cofagrigus, and between it and Camerupt we can check offensive Fire-types like Victini, Darmanitan, and Arcanine.

    Scald is dead useful, as the triple-crit burns help wear down offensive teams and neuter physical threats. Blastoise also provides the team with another phazer, keeping most set-up sweepers at bay. Foresight allows us to guarantee the Rapid Spin against Ghost-type switch-ins. However, we have considered using Toxic in this slot, as it holds equal merit on a stall team.​

    [​IMG]
    Camerupt @ Leftovers
    Solid Rock
    252 HP / 156 Def / 100 SpD
    Sassy Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Fire Blast
    - Stealth Rock
    - Will-O-Wisp


    Camerupt UU 2013 let's get it. Seriously though. Pokemazter suggested this thing on a whim, and it has performed beyond all our expectations. It's typing is perfect for our team, and with investment, it's defenses allow it to take pretty substantial damage. It not only gives us Stealth Rock, but also cripples the opposing team with Will-O-Wisp. It serves as a back of check to many Pokemon, and ensures our walls aren't defeated by stacked damage. Use it.

    Simply put, we've found the next Cofagrigus. Not bulk wise, but usability in the tier, as it fills quite a few niches that would typically require 2 Pokemon. Physically, it's very difficult to break through, as Will-O-Wisp destroys all physical sweepers that aren't immune to it. Its coverage moves plough many other tanks out of its way, nuking the opposition with its base 100 /105 offensive stats.​

    Conclusion

    In short, this "stall" (I only say this because it plays somewhat like Semi-Stall, but with a bigger punch) team is one of the most effective we've used. Camerupt and Rotom-F, two Pokemon rarely seen in the tier have lived beyond initial expectations and pull a lot of weight on the team. We appreciate any rates we get, as this team has a few rough edges that need smoothing out. Thanks for the read, and thanks for the rate!​

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  2. Ace Emerald

    Ace Emerald Horsing around
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    Threatlist

    [​IMG]

    Shed Skin Scrafty can give this team major problems. It dodges burns that the team uses to wear and cripple other physical attacks, and hits our main physical wall, Cofagrigus, for super effective damage with its STAB. Blastoise can Roar it out, but due to Scrafty's bulk and ability to shed burns, it can't do much else. If Scrafty is the Bulk Up variant (the variant that uses Shed Skin the most), Rotom-F can cripple it with Trick. Dragon Dance variants are also scary, but as they use Moxie more often, burns become an effective way to handle it. Either way, Scrafty is the biggest threat to this team, and battles against him have to be carefully planned.​

    [​IMG]

    Choice Band Flygon causes big problems because we have no Steel-type. We've got nothing to resist that powerful Outrage, and just have to do our best playing around it and crippling it with burns. To make matters worse, it is super resistant to entry hazards, and hard to wear down. It can have problems switching in, as many team members can cripple it with status, but once in it can wreck havoc.​

    [​IMG]

    Normal Scarf Krookodile isn't really a problem. Blastiose handles it just fine as long as it doesn't get a Moxie boost, and Rotom-F can check it as well. A Bulk Up Krookodile can get the jump on this team through sheer surprise, and start sweeping if we aren't careful. Not exactly the threat Scrafty is, but possibly dangerous.​

    1k, in such a beautiful thread.

    An importable:
    Show Hide

    Snorlax @ Leftovers
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 208 HP / 176 SDef / 124 Def
    Careful Nature
    - Body Slam
    - Sleep Talk
    - Rest
    - Whirlwind

    Cofagrigus @ Leftovers
    Trait: Mummy
    EVs: 252 HP / 130 Def / 126 SDef
    Bold Nature
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Shadow Ball
    - Haze
    - Rest

    Roserade @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 252 HP / 120 Def / 136 SDef
    Calm Nature
    - Giga Drain
    - Sludge Bomb
    - Spikes
    - Aromatherapy

    Blastoise @ Leftovers
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 252 Def / 252 HP / 4 SAtk
    Bold Nature
    - Scald
    - Rapid Spin
    - Foresight
    - Roar

    Rotom-Frost @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 SDef
    Timid Nature
    - Thunderbolt
    - Blizzard
    - Trick
    - Volt Switch

    Camerupt @ Leftovers
    Trait: Solid Rock
    EVs: 252 HP / 156 Def / 100 SDef
    Sassy Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Earthquake
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Fire Blast
  3. hilarious

    hilarious

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    Ace emeralds 1000th post is about camerupt stall??

    Imma go out on a limb and say you are MEW (especially np) and MELOETTA (especially psyshock) and AZELF (only np psyshock really) weak because if say Mew manages to get a +2 boost it can do like 70-100% to all your team members while only your cofag can really hurt it (and rotom but thats outsped and ohko'd after rocks). of course mew is broken but whatever.

    Funnily enough I don't have a real suggestion for you to fix that haha. I mean you could use Swampert over Camerupt (which incidentally has lucarioesque defensive stats) for a REAL tank that can still check fire mons and raikou. it also can phaze away Mew Meloetta and Azelf but thats just delaying the problem really and Mew can giga and Azelf can gknot.

    Or you could use toxic spikes over something on your roserade but that opens you up to other guys and leaves you dead in the water against xatu i suppose if you get rid of sludge bomb. And toxic spikes isn't a great answer to azelf lololol while if your opp just sets up fast/uses a poison mon even mew meloetta won't care.
    Not particularly sure but I'm just throwing ideas around. if you use golurk over Camerupt you kind of combine your sr user with cofagrigus so you could use another pokemon like maybe umbreon which can usually beat mew Azelf and Meleotta.your team has more utility as a whole but i wonder how you would do against blastoise hmmmm.

    And as to how this would concern your problems you still have? golurk can be a random check to scrafty if you use dpunch and ev yourself so +1 bu scarfty cant ohko (idk if thats even possible though) and add ice punch as well so flygon that think they can start sweeping only gets through like 80% of your health and then just dies.

    and i just LOVEdisc stall
  4. Ernesto

    Ernesto is a motionless pedophile
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    Hey! This is a great stall-esque team!
    I can't suggest much to deal with the threats you mentioned since SS Scrafty and CB Flygon will almost always be a problem to stall in UU, though I feel CM Slowbro could fit in somewhere :P What I do think you should consider is, putting Toxic or Rest over Foresight on Blastoise, and trading Fire Blast on Camerupt for Flamethrower / Lava Plume to get a secondary answer to SubRoost Zapdos in case Snorlax, for whatever reason, is in no condition to fight. I also don't know what the 156 EV in Defense achieve, but I guess they're there for a reason, otherwise you could opt for max/max Sassy on it.
    Kudos on the awesome team and use of underrated Pokemon in Rotom-F (outside of Hail at least) and Camerupt!!!

    EDIT: Oh, Luvdisc'd :D
  5. DestinyUnknown

    DestinyUnknown in other words...
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    This team is cool, and while I understand the logic behind using Camerupt I just idk, don't see it really fitting on this team. I mean, I think you already have Electrics covered well enough and using such a niche pokemon as Camerupt seems kind of overkill. Though it may be just me, but I think that Rhyperior or Swampert would fit better on the team as they actually check more stuff (Rhyperior would give you some kind of Togekiss secondary check for example, even if it's not very reliable because Togekiss will more often than not flinch it to death).

    The team seems pretty solid in general, though I would definitely put Rest or Synthesis over one of Roserade attacking moves, because Roserade it's extremely important for the team, as it has to act as both a cleric and a hazard settler, and it won't last long with the current moveset. Oh, and maybe you could try using Zapdos (or idk, Raikou ?) over Rotom-F to have a better answer to Togekiss, but it's just preference I guess!

    Good luck with the team :)
  6. Ace Emerald

    Ace Emerald Horsing around
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    You know, Zapdos might be just what this team needs. I've been trying Mandibuzz over Rotom as an answer to Scrafty and more importantly Mew, but Zapdos seems like it might have more of a place. Thanks for the suggestion, I'll have to try some different sets! And I haven't been clicking Sludge Bomb too often, it might be worth it to run Synthesis/Rest on Rosy. As for Camerupt, don't get me wrong, on a general team, Rhyperior or Swampert would be much better. But between Will-O-Wisp, that great Fire STAB, lack of a Grass weakness, and a few other small things, I just don't know if either of those two can do his job much better. Of course I ought to at least try, and probably will, but I want to at least stick up for the namesake of the RMT, he does some serious work. Anyways, thanks a lot for the rate!
  7. fatty

    fatty
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    i really like the look of this team as i do think niche pokes are good at times in uu, but not for stall. stall in uu is already on the brink of extinction whether you like it or not, and so if you want it to use it on the big stage against the top tier uu offenses, you're going to need to bring some big guns of your own. due to this, i'd like to suggest a couple changes to the team, while simultaneously attempting to keep the main cores of the team and synergy in tact.

    first of all, rotom-f has got to go. i may understand if it was a scarf version (ok not really), as it might have a chance to act as a decent revenge killer, but the sr weak combined with it's anti-longevity w/o recovery as well as not having very good bulk in the first place is just a recipe for disaster. uu stall is just not the place for rotom-f. in its place, i'd like to suggest a bulky zapdos with tbolt / hp fly / roar / roost. zapdos does a number of things for this team including adding a secondary check to the monster that is sd / scarf moxie heracross, bringing yet another phazer to the table, and being a great check to all kinds of scrafty sets, all on top of still beating togekiss. i would go bold - 248 hp / 252 def / 8 spe to start with, and then tweak the ev spread to your liking because a lot of stall revolves around fine tuning those ev spreads.

    secondly, you are really weak to ground mons like cb pert or cb rhyperior. the only reasonable switchins are cofag and blastoise, both of which don't resist eq and therefore will still get mauled. in order to remedy this, i would like to suggest running claydol > camperupt. yes, camerupt is cool and all but in the end he's only useful for electrics, things that lax + claydol can handle together anyways. claydol, on the other hand, can still sr and has that beautiful quakeedge resist in conjunction with being able to spin as well, alleviating the need for the otherwise useless blastoise. now, claydol doesn't necessarily alleviate all of your ground mon weak because swampert and rhyperior can both hit you with waterfall and megahorn, respectively, but this just adds to the mind games you can play with your opponent, having the option of switching in claydol, cofag, or a bulky water. the set i would run is sr / spin / eq / toxic, with an ev spread of careful - 248 hp / 84 def / 176 spd, which lets you check raikou / lo zapdos reasonably well while still playing off of claydol's resists on the physical side.

    lastly, if you make the camperupt to claydol switch, you don't need blastoise anymore, but i still think a bulky water is the best thing for this team. either milotic or suicune would fit imo, so it's up to you on what you want to add to the team. milotic gives you a great overall bulky pivot with a great movepool to basically add a utility check for a bunch of shit as well as handle kingdra really well. on the other hand, suicune is slightly bulkier and set of scald / ice beam / rest / calm mind could add a win condition to your team, and i've found that that particular cune set can prove deadly when the conditions are set and it is used wisely. for you, i would probably recommend milotic because you really don't have a great kingdra switch, but like i said it's up to you and what you think is best.

    hopefully that helped! good luck!

    damn i like rating uu teams why don't i do it more often.

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