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Banette (QC 3/3) (GP 2/2)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by ScraftyIsTheBest, Jul 12, 2013.

  1. ScraftyIsTheBest

    ScraftyIsTheBest Screw Water Druddigon
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    Okay, here's the weakest Ghost-type in the entire game.

    [​IMG]

    Why does Dusclops have to be so much better?


    [Overview]

    <p>Banette is a very unfortunate case. While its offensive stats are very solid, it suffers from the fact that it is simply too frail and slow to make any use of said stats the majority of the time. Its movepool doesn't help its case either, since it is fairly dry on offensive options, further limiting any offensive potential it might have had. Banette does have one small niche, however, as a suicidal Trick Room lead. It can set up Trick Room for its team while taking itself down in the process; therefore, don't expect too much out of Banette otherwise.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Suicide Trick Room
    move 1: Trick Room
    move 2: Taunt
    move 3: Shadow Claw / Curse
    move 4: Destiny Bond
    item: Focus Sash
    ability: Insomnia
    nature: Brave
    evs: 252 Atk
    ivs: 0 HP / 0 Def / 0 SpD / 0 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This is Banette's best and only way to effectively contribute to its team. This set should always take the lead position, as it should very rarely stay around for long. Its main role is to support slower team members with Trick Room, hopefully taking down an opponent in the process. Its middling defenses and Speed are also key to this set's success. Taunt is an effective tool to stop the opponent's setup opportunities, especially from the likes of Scolipede and Carracosta. Shadow Claw provides a reasonably strong STAB attack for Banette to use, and prevents it from being complete Taunt bait. Curse, on the other hand, is useful against any Pokemon that refuses to outright defeat Banette after it has done its job; aside from wearing down an opponent for your sweepers to sweep better, it will quickly guarantee Banette's demise. Finally, Destiny Bond is useful for Banette to potentially take down an opponent after it has done its job.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EV spread, IVs, and nature minimize Banette's already upsetting defenses and Speed to allow it to reach its Focus Sash more easily and outspeed plenty of opponents under Trick Room. Focus Sash is necessary in order for Banette to set up Trick Room successfully, as Banette is a frail Pokemon in general. Insomnia is the preferred ability, as it allows Banette to ignore sleep moves from the likes of Jynx's and Jumpluff and hence set up Trick Room on them. Because Banette is running Trick Room, it is necessary to pair it up with slow and powerful Pokemon, such as Marowak, Relicanth, Eelektross, and Golurk. Other Trick Room users, such as Exeggutor and Musharna, are also advisable to put less pressure on Banette for its role.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>As previously stated, Banette has quite a miserable movepool, which means there isn't much for it to put to good use. It has some useful priority attacks in Sucker Punch and Shadow Sneak, but its lack of STAB on the former makes Banette a mediocre user of it. Choice Band and Choice Specs are certainly possibilities, but it is outclassed by Golurk and Sawk as Choice Band users, with Trick being its one and only niche over them. It can also support its team with Sunny Day or Rain Dance, and has Thunder to take advantage of the latter, but this role is better left to other Pokemon such as Regirock and Ludicolo. Banette also has some support options in Will-O-Wisp, Thunder Wave, Disable, Toxic, Pain Split, Calm Mind, and Cotton Guard. Unfortunately, Banette's bulk is too disappointing put any of these moves to good use.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Kangaskhan can utilize Scrappy along with a combination of Fake Out and Double-Edge to ensure Banette accomplishes nothing. Taunt users such as Mandibuzz, Samurott, and Serperior are also useful to stop Banette from doing its job, especially if it lacks Shadow Claw in favor of Curse. Skuntank can also do this, and can also use Pursuit to break the Focus Sash. Marowak, Golem, and Piloswine can use multi-hit moves to break Banette's Focus Sash and potentially eliminate it from the match. It is noteworthy that it is usually the slow powerhouses under Trick Room that pose the legitimate threat; Banette itself is not extraordinarily threatening.</p>


    Skeleton:

    Skeleton (open)

    [Overview]

    • One of those Pokemon that get condemned to disuse even in NU
    • It's offensive stats are good, but it's too slow and frail to make use of them
    • Not a great movepool either, it's pretty dry on many options
    • Almost completely outclassed by all the other Ghosts, who have actual legit stats and movepools to work with
    • The only thing Banette is good for is a suicide Trick Room lead
    • Don't expect a lot out of this thing
    [STR]

    • The only reason Banette should ever be used, and the only way to use it to any effect
    • It aims to set up TR for slower mons like Relicanth and then take down something
    • Trick Room because that's what Banette is used for
    • Taunt stops setup from mons such as Scolipede
    • Shadow Claw prevents Banette from being Taunt bait while Curse deals with anything not willing to kill Banette
    • Destiny Bond on the other hand should take down some offensive Pokemon with it
    [STR AC]

    • Make all of Banette's already miserable stats even more miserable with 0 IV's, except Attack, to make sure Banette can reach the Sash more easily
    • Brave Nature because minimize Speed for TR use
    • Sash is the key to Banette's success, because Banette can't take any hits so it needs that survival to grab a TR turn
    • Insomnia so that you can be immune to Jynx's Lovely Kiss and set up TR on it
    • Because this is TR, slow and strong mons such as Relicanth, Eelektross, and Golurk are musts, that's why Banette exists
    • Not much else to Banette, really
    [OO]

    • Nothing, really
    • Choice sets, Trick is the only thing differentiating it from Golurk
    • Has some special moves like T-bolt, but use Haunter
    • Sucker Punch
    • Can set up weather, but that's better left off to shit like Regirock and Volbeat
    • Has some other support moves such as WoW, T-Wave, Toxic, Disable, Cotton Guard, CM, Pain Split. Unfortunately, can't put any of these to good use.
    [C&C]
    • Kangaskhan can Fake Out+Double-Edge with Scrappy to make sure it accomplishes nothing
    • Taunt Serperior (or most Taunt Pokemon in general due to TR's -7 priority)
    • Mandibuzz
    • Marowak, Golem, and Piloswine since they have multi-hit moves to break past the Sash
    • Its usually the Trick Room sweepers that pose the real threats, Banette itself does not
    • Almost everything viable in NU can beat it because it's so frail and slow
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2013
  2. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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    its stats arent that bad, tone that down a bit please :)

    mention that Banette should almost always be a lead, very rarely do you want to keep it. Also add a few more strong slowmons to teammates (Marowak imo)
  3. Dat Blast

    Dat Blast DOES THIS LOOK LIKE THE FACE OF MERCY TO YOU!?!?
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    My two cents :)

    I don't think you should mention Dusclops in the Overview, as this is an NU analysis.Besides Dusclops is awful in UU so it doesn't exactly "see the limelight."

    Also, Curse is pretty terrible on something with a Sash, so remove that and put it in AC or something.

    Probably missed a ton of stuff about this, but just pointing these two out for now :P
  4. WhiteDMist

    WhiteDMist PU! We don't stink though!
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    I agree with Dat Blast about not mentioning Dusclops in an NU analysis. Curse is fine as a slash though because the whole point of Banette is to KO itself immediately as soon as it can after setting up Trick Room. Since Curse will take inflict 50% damage to Banette's HP even if it doesn't have that much, it is almost guaranteed to faint and free up as many Trick Room turns as possible. Hopefully the opponent will hit Bannette down to its Sash (or at least below 50%), but most opponents know better than to actually take it out (bringing it down to Sash merely makes it easier to finish off before setting up another Trick Room), so Curse and Taunt go really well together in guaranteeing Banette's demise.

    In the Overview, I must agree with Raseri that you should remove that point about bad stats since they aren't horrible. Just say that it is too slow and frail to make use of its decent offensive stats most of the time.

    In OO, instead of what you have for Choice items, mention that Trick is the only thing differentiating Banette from CB Golurk. Finally, mention that it has quite a few status and support moves (TWave, WoW, Toxic, Disable, Calm Mind, Cotton Guard, Pain Split, etc.), but it can't use them well due to its low Speed and bulk.

    In Checks and Counters, add in the fact that any Taunt Pokemon can instantly stop Banette from setting up Trick Room due to Trick Room's negative priority. Add in Marowak next to Golem and Piloswine, but explain that it is because their multi-hit moves can get around Banette's Focus Sash. Finally, mention that it is Banette's teammates that can take advantage of Trick Room that are the real threats. Banette on its own isn't that impressive.

    Since Banette has little else to note, make these changes and
    qc approved [1/3]
  5. tennisace

    tennisace
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    qc 2/3, next time post that you made the changes
  6. ScraftyIsTheBest

    ScraftyIsTheBest Screw Water Druddigon
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    K thanks for the QC check tennis, I'll get this written up ASAP.
  7. ScraftyIsTheBest

    ScraftyIsTheBest Screw Water Druddigon
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    This is written
  8. ScraftyIsTheBest

    ScraftyIsTheBest Screw Water Druddigon
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    Sorry for posting again, but I'd like to see some checks on this one.
  9. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
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    Add in a mention of Skuntank in Checks and Counters. It can Taunt it to keep it from doing anything and then Pursuit it to break its Sash.

    Otherwise, this is good to go to GP!

    [​IMG]
    QC Approved 3/3
  10. ScraftyIsTheBest

    ScraftyIsTheBest Screw Water Druddigon
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    Thanks Treecko for the final QC check, this is ready for GP now.
  11. tehy

    tehy

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    Hey, just reading through the OO and I feel you don't give much of an explanation for why to not use Shadow Sneak or Choice Specs. But I'm also pretty sure those both suck, so maybe one is in order?

    Also, Calm Mind, Cotton Guard, and Pain Split aren't really supportive options, and even Disable is pretty selfish
  12. Celever

    Celever

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    Amcheck.
    I know this is lazy, but the changes are here http://piratepad.net/w0wHzAGsPq highlighted in green are the additions, crossed out are the removals. (Before the forums changed to version 1.2 the crossing out would transfer over so I would only have to re-highlight things, now that I know it doesn't work like that I will be sure to do it differently next time, sorry about any inconvenience, coming up is the C/P version though)

    C/P Version

    [Overview]

    <p>Banette is a very unfortunate case. While its offensive stats are very solid, it suffers from the fact that it is simply too frail and slow to make any use of said stats the majority of the time. Its movepool isn't helping its case either; Banette is fairly dry on offensive options, further limiting any offensive potential it may have had. Banette does have one small niche, however, as a suicidal Trick Room lead. It can set up Trick Room for its team while taking itself down in the process; don't expect too much out of Banette otherwise.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Suicide Trick Room
    move 1: Trick Room
    move 2: Taunt
    move 3: Shadow Claw / Curse
    move 4: Destiny Bond
    item: Focus Sash
    ability: Insomnia
    nature: Brave
    evs: 252 Atk
    ivs: 0 HP / 0 Def / 0 SpD / 0 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This is Banette's best and only way to effectively contribute to its team. This set should always take the lead position, as it should very rarely stay around for very long. Its main role is to support slower team members with Trick Room whilst usually taking down an opponent in the process. Its middling Defenses and Speed are also key to this set's success. Taunt is an effective tool to stop setup opportunities of the opponent, especially from the likes of Scolipede and Carracosta. Shadow Claw provides a reasonably strong STAB attack for Banette to use, and prevents it from being complete Taunt bait. Curse, on the other hand, is useful against any Pokemon that refuses to outright defeat Banette after it has done its job; aside from the effect of wearing down an opponent for sweepers to better thrive, it will quickly guarantee Banette's demise. Finally, Destiny Bond is useful for Banette to take down an opponent after it has done its job.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EV spread, IVs, and nature minimize Banette's already middling defenses and Speed to allow it to reach its Focus Sash more easily whilst outspeeding plenty of opponents under Trick Room. A Focus Sash is necessary in order for Banette to set up Trick Room successfully, as Banette is a frail Pokemon in general. Insomnia is the prefered ability as it allows Banette to be indifferent towards Jynx's Lovely Kiss and hence set up Trick Room on it. Since Banette is using Trick Room, it is necessary to pair it up with slow and powerful Pokemon such as Marowak, Relicanth, Eelektross, and Golurk. Other Trick Room users such as Exeggutor and Musharna are also advisable to put less pressure on Banette for its role.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>As previously stated, Banette has quite a miserable movepool, which means there isn't much for it to put to good use. It has some useful priority attacks in Sucker Punch and Shadow Sneak, however its lack of STAB on the former makes it a mediocre user of it. Choice Band and Choice Specs are certainly possibilities, but it is outclassed by Golurk and Sawk as a band user, with Trick being its one and only niche over them. It can also support its team with Sunny Day or Rain Dance, and has Thunder to take advantage of the latter, but this role is better left to other Pokemon such as Regirock and Ludicolo. Banette also has some support options such as Will-O-Wisp, Thunder Wave, Disable, Toxic, Pain Split, Calm Mind, and Cotton Guard. Unfortunately, Banette's bulk is so miserable that it cannot put any of these moves to good use.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Kangaskhan can utilize Scrappy along with a combination of Fake Out and Double-Edge to ensure Banette accomplishes nothing. Taunt users such as Mandibuzz, Samurott, and Serperior are also useful to stop Banette from doing its job, especially if it lacks Shadow Claw in favor of Curse. Skuntank can also do this, and can also use Pursuit to break the Focus Sash. Marowak, Golem, and Piloswine can use multi-hitting moves to break Banette's Focus Sash and potentially eliminate it from the match. It is noteworthy that it is usually the slow powerhouses under Trick Room that pose the legitimate threat; Banette itself is not extraordinarily threatening.</p>
  13. V0x

    V0x Glycine G
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    I will do a thing over Celever's am check (I used diff to visualize his changes so I can evaluate whether or not to stamp it, and then I will do my own).

    mine will be blue add red remove
    Celever's will be green add red remove because of the diff app.

    Show Hide

    [Overview]

    <p>Banette is a very unfortunate case. While its offensive stats are very solid, it suffers from the fact that it is simply too frail and slow to make any use of its offensive said stats the majority of the time. Its movepool isn't helping doesn't help its case either, since it is fairly dry on offensive options, further limiting any offensive potential it might have had. Banette does have one small niche, however, as a suicideal Trick Room lead. It can set up Trick Room for its team while taking itself down in the process; therefore, don't expect too much out of Banette otherwise.</p>

    I removed the semicolon in the here when talking about Banette's movepool: I don't think it fits. It was a bit too abrupt of a transition, and it made it seem like the following sentence was not related to "doesn't help its case etc." A colon or leaving the way it was would have been better IMO, since both those convey that Banette's dry movepool doesn't help its case.

    [SET]
    name: Suicide Trick Room
    move 1: Trick Room
    move 2: Taunt
    move 3: Shadow Claw / Curse
    move 4: Destiny Bond
    item: Focus Sash
    ability: Insomnia
    nature: Brave
    evs: 252 Atk
    ivs: 0 HP / 0 Def / 0 SpD / 0 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This is Banette's best and only way to effectively contribute to its team. This set should always take the lead position, as it should very rarely stay around for very long. Its main role is to support slower team members with Trick Room, hopefully while most likest usually* taking down an opponent in the process. Its middling Defenses and Speed are also key to this set's success. Taunt is an effective tool to stop the opponent's setup opportunities of the opponent [don't add this]**, especially from the likes of Scolipede and Carracosta. Shadow Claw provides a reasonably strong STAB move attack for Banette to use, and prevents it from being complete Taunt bait. Curse, on the other hand, is useful against any Pokemon that refuses to outright defeat Banette after it has done its job; aside from the effect of wearing down an opponent for your sweepers to sweep bettweer thrive***, it will quickly guarantee Banette's demise. Finally, Destiny Bond is useful for Banette to take down an opponent after it has done its job.</p>

    *I don't think it's necessary to change "while" to "whilst"--both mean the same thing. I wouldn't say using whilst is wrong, but the author used "while" so there is no need to change it. Also, I changed the phrase to "hopefully" because I feel that better conveys the intention of the set. "Usually" makes it sound like it always will work, but a new player may get outplayed. That's mainly a nitpicky point though.

    **" 's" and of the "blank" accomplish the same thing, but in most cases " 's" is preferred because it's less wordy and sounds less pretentious.

    ***I don't think "thrive" is the right word there. "Thrive" sort of gives off the tone of surviving, rather than being more effective, as a sweeper would be against weakened opponents.

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EV spread, IV's, and nature minimize Banette's already middling defenses and Speed to allow it to reach its Focus Sash more easily and outspeed whilest outspeeding* plenty of opponents under Trick Room. A Focus Sash is necessary in order for Banette to successfully set up Trick Room successfully, as Banette is a frail Pokemon in general. Insomnia is the prefered preferred ability,[comma] as it allows Banette to ignore be indifferent towards Jynx's Lovely Kiss and hence set up Trick Room on it. Becaus Since Banette is runn using** Trick Room, it is necessary to pair it up with slow and powerful Pokemon such as Marowak, Relicanth, Eelektross, and Golurk. Other Trick Room users such as Exeggutor and Musharna are also advisable to put less pressure on Banette for its role.</p>

    *I think "while" gives off more contrary tone (besides the I run while listening to music--not that "while"). What you really mean is "it does this AND accomplishes that" I think. Also, while vs whilst.

    **Keep this as "Because Banette is running". Neither phrasing has any real advantages over the other, so keep it as what the author wrote.

    [Other Options]

    <p>As previously stated, Banette has quite a miserable movepool, which means there isn't much for it to put to good use. It has some useful priority move attacks in Sucker Punch and Shadow Sneak, buthowever* its lack of STAB on the former makes it Banette a mediocre user of it. Choice Band and Choice Specs are certainly possibilities, but it is outclassed by Golurk and Sawk for the formas a band users, with Trick being its Banette's one and only advantage niche over them**. It can also support its team with Rain Dance or Sunny Day, and has Thunder to utilize the formSunny Day or Rain Dance, and has Thunder to take advantage of the latter, but this role is better left off to other Pokemon such as Regirock and Ludicolo. Banette also has some supportibe options such as Will-O-Wisp, Thunder Wave, Disable, Toxic, Pain Split, Calm Mind, and Cotton Guard. Unfortunately, Banette's bulk is so miserable that it cannot put any of these moves to good use.</p>

    *This should stay as "but". "However" can't be used as a conjunction; however, this is the correct way to use it as a transition.

    **"Niche" I don't think is the right word. "Niche" implies a role, but having Trick doesn't make CB Banette's role really any different. Banette is just weaker.


    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Kangaskhan can utilize Scrappy along with a combination of Fake Out and Double-Edge to ensure Banette accomplishes nothing. Taunt users such as Mandibuzz, Samurott, and Serperior are also useful to stop Banette from doing its job, especially if it lacks Shadow Claw in favor of Curse. Skuntank can also do this, butand can also use Pursuit to break the Focus Sash. Marowak, Golem, and Piloswine can use multi-hitting moves to break Banette's Focus Sash and potentially eliminate it from the match. It is noteworthy that it is usually the slow powerhouses under Trick Room that pose the legitimate threat; Banette itself is not extraordinarily threatening.</p>



    [​IMG] 1/2

    Not bad, @Celever, just keep these things in mind and you'll be on your way:
    • Word Choice: Make sure the changes you make don't change the meaning or feel of the phrase.
    • Unnecessary changes: there are stylistic elements that some writers use over other ones; if they are correct, there is no need to change them.
    I like the changes you make to increase the clarity of the writing though, just keep that up and work on the two things I mentioned and you'll do well. ^_^
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2013
    Celever likes this.
  14. ScraftyIsTheBest

    ScraftyIsTheBest Screw Water Druddigon
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    I implemented that check. This should be ready for a second one.
  15. Namso

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    Here we go.

    Additions.
    Deletions.

    Comments.

    Good stuff.

    GP 2/2
  16. ScraftyIsTheBest

    ScraftyIsTheBest Screw Water Druddigon
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    Thanks for the GP check Fuzznip. This is done and should now be ready for upload.
  17. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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    uploading

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