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Basic Things to Know in Little Cup

Discussion in 'Little Cup' started by v, Sep 26, 2009.

  1. v

    v TRY AND KNOCK ME DOWN...IF U DARE...U FUCKIN SCRUB...FUFUFU
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    Hi. I know we have an onsite article and everything, but people seem to manage to miss some rather key things. These are just little mistakes I see in a lot of battles on the CaP Server, so I thought I'd post a thread on the matter.

    1) When using Life Orb, check if your Pokemon's HP will reduce to 19
    All too often, I will see "Elekid lost 10% of its HP!" at the end of the turn. Life Orb takes 10% of your HP, this is a known fact. However, it is also a known fact that the Pokemon games round down in the event of any decimal. This also holds true for Life Orb recoil. 10% of 19 is 1.9, which rounds down to 1 HP damage per use of Life Orb. You don't have to, of course, as there is a popular belief that Pokemon with 21 HP shouldn't reduce it but it's something you should know nonetheless

    2) Do not use Gyro Ball on Bronzor unless it is holding a Macho Brace
    Bronzor is one of the top Pokemon in Little Cup with its great typing and defenses. It is also very slow. However, unlike in OU, its speed is not low enough to make Gyro Ball stronger than Psychic or Flash Cannon under most circumstances.

    3) Elekid, Voltorb and Diglett all have 20 speed

    I cannot stress this enough. Too many times have I seen Gligar go against Elekid, expecting to tie it and, once outsped and KOed, the Gligar-user saying "aww...i lost a speed tie :(". If you know one thing about the Little Cup Speed tiers, remember that these three are the fastest in the tier, bar none.

    4) Chansey, Marill, Pikachu, Phione, and Rotom are NOT LC-LEGAL
    Seriously, what's the deal with this? Pikachu has a prevo and can't even be hatched from an egg. Rotom and Phione don't even evolve. Marill and Chansey both have prevos. Please, please please do not use them in unrated LC.

    5) 19 and 14 are the "Magic Speed Numbers"
    Many, many Pokemon in the tier hit 19 speed. If you are using a Pokemon that can hit 19 speed as its maximum speed, do so. 14 is the "magic number" for Scarfers. They will hit 21 Speed, which outspeeds all non-scarfed Pokemon but underspeeds faster Scarfers, such as Mankey, Houndour and Gastly.

    6) Wynaut is not Uber
    It doesn't matter how banned it is in UU and NU and OU, this is Little Cup. Wynaut is currently legal for use in standard Little Cup play, so don't harass people for using it.

    7) The Item "DeepSeaTooth" is banned
    This has been less of a problem lately, but I feel it needs to be reiterated. You cannot use the item DeepSeaTooth on Clamperl. Period. How would you like it if your opponent use Soul Dew Latias in OU? You wouldn't, obviously. So, you know, don't do it. No clause exists to rectify this, so we're going on the honor system here.

    8) Gastly does not have 19+ Speed
    People have always seemed to think Gastly is very fast. These people are wrong. If a Gastly sweeps you with Sludge Bomb, that is because it's an excellent Scarfer, not because it's OMG WTF FAST. It isn't.

    9) Abra is extremely mediocre
    People look at Abra and think, "OMG huge SpA and Speed!!" While this is perfectly true, Abra also has paper defenses and a terrible movepool. It only reaches 19 Speed, meaning it ties with a large number of Pokemon. You never, ever want to be on the losing end of this tie with Abra, who has the defenses of a rice paper bag in the rain. Additionally, Priority is extremely prominent in LC and nearly any move will kill Abra. Abra cannot survive a Pursuit. Ever.

    10) Stall is not good
    Sorry, but it's true. There have been very, very few truly successful Stall teams in all of Little Cup's history. With HeartGold and SoulSilver adding in stuff like ExtremeSpeed Dratini and Head Smash Aron, Stall has never been harder to pull off. If you want to become disillusioned with LC really fast, go right ahead and Stall, but if you actually want to get into the meta you're better off leaving Stall alone until you can actually play the metagame.

    11) Even if you plan on playing with LC Clause checked, set your Pokemon to level 5 in team-builder
    There is nothing more irritating than fighting a level 100 Bronzor and losing because you thought it was level 5. Please, do not be that guy. It is also helpful when determining how many or how few EVs to include, so it really is beneficial not only to your opponents, but to you! It also isn't any fun sweeping a team of level 1 Pokemon. Level 5 -- not level 1, not level 100, not level 50 -- Level 5.

    12) Don't put 252 EVs into one stat (unless you're maxing a stat ending in "3").
    There are like 3-4 used Pokemon maximum who have a stat ending in 3, otherwise you are wasting EVs. As a general rule in the team builder, make sure you lower your EVs until you lose a point to find out what EVs you need to get a certain point in a certain stat. Or, you know, read the EV guide.

    13) Dragon Rage and Sonic Boom are banned.

    The highest HP possible in LC is 36, making Dragon Rage a OHKO on literally everything and Sonic Boom a 2HKO. As a result, it is banned. If you are found using it in a ladder match, you will be kicked or even banned if it is a repeated offense.

    14) When using Hidden Power, adding 4 EVs to the lowered stat fixes it
    Yeah. Just ran into this one. Because of the lower stat values, the extra 4 EVs fixes up the lowered stat.

    15) Genderless Pokemon from the Fourth Generation cannot have Level-Up moves
    Third Gen Pokemon benefit from the Pomeg glitch. Bronzor, however, cannot have Hypnosis and the like. Additionally, any Fourth Generation abilities are not compatible with level-up moves on Genderless Pokemon, such as Porygon and Download.

    If you guys have anymore advice for new LCers that you feel like they're missing, please post it here. If you disagree with any of the above listed things, please let me know so that I can change it accordingly.

    Current 15 contributed by Vader, Heysup, j. franky and Goldenknight
  2. Seven Deadly Sins

    Seven Deadly Sins ~hallelujah~
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    This is ONLY true for Pokemon with 20 HP. If you have 21 HP, like Houndour, it takes 2 attacks to break even, and 3 attacks to actually start losing out. This is significant, because many things OHKO 19 HP Houndour or severely wound it, whereas less can OHKO 21 HP Houndour.

    So seriously, stop lowering HP to 19. Seriously.
  3. Heysup

    Heysup Monsters are dangerous and kings are dying like flies.
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    I don't 100% agree with this, but I do understand where SDS is coming from.

    I think it should be emphasized to be lowered in a case-by-case basis (maybe even someone can come up with a guide), and maybe even just personal preference. I personally think all Pokemon who use 4 attacks and LO should get 19 HP. However, Pokemon like Dratini who have the means of getting 21 HP without sacrificing any other stat points (its 28 EVs for an HP point), or other pokemon in this situation should leave their HP at 21, because they won't have LO recoil until they set up.

    This means Dratini, or Houndour, or whatever, will be able to take a hit with 21 hp, in order to get a DD or NP. This means you won't get OHKOed immediately if your opponent does 19-20 damage, you still have one turn of attacking rather than zero turns (and you should OHKO everything after one set up move anyway). This really helps when trying to decide if you should attack or stat-up.

    tl;dr

    I agree that it shouldn't be 'automatically reduce your HP to 19'. It should be, 'automatically do it if you have a stat of 40 Base HP or lower, otherwise consider leaving it'. Or something.
  4. Banryu

    Banryu

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    It might also be worth mentioning that Mix sets are much more okay in LC than they are in Standard play, where you usually avoid that as much as possible. The difference in offensive stats is usually significantly less, making Mixing sets and natues more viable; plus, in a metagame where nearly everything dies in three hits or less, the extra point in Defense you lose switching from Timid or Jolly to Hasty isn't much missed.

    ....I dunno, maybe it's worth mentioning... >,>
  5. Heysup

    Heysup Monsters are dangerous and kings are dying like flies.
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    That's not true at all. Standard play has a fuckton of mixed attackers that are quite amazing. In OU there is stuff like MixMence and MixApe everywhere, while in UU there is a shitload like MixBlaziken, Magmortar, Nidoking, etc....
  6. Banryu

    Banryu

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    I suppose that's true, but it IS even more common in this metagame, right? Generally you accomodate for both types of attack more freqently in LC more than any other metagame...

    I guess it isn't worth mentioning.
  7. Seven Deadly Sins

    Seven Deadly Sins ~hallelujah~
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    Actually, generally the only reason that mixed is "more" viable in LC is that it's easier to split EVs. Base stats are vastly more important than investment, and Pokemon such as Houndour don't have to invest much to be effective mixed. With stuff like Mence, it takes specialized investment, whereas Pokemon like Murkrow could run it easily using a mixed set, losing barely any power. The best examples are stuff like Elekid, Kabuto, Houndour, and even some silly thinks like Cranidos or Cubone with Ice Beam.
  8. Heysup

    Heysup Monsters are dangerous and kings are dying like flies.
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    The point is they aren't more common then in standard play. There are only really a few solid Mixed Attackers
  9. Beef 2.0

    Beef 2.0

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    I have two small things that I think should deserve a mention but I won't complain if you don't.

    Larvitar is not a Dark Type and does not get get Sucker Punch
    I have fought way to many people who think Larvitar is a Dark Type with sucker punch and it has affected their approach towards him

    Berry stealing moves, Bug Bite and Pluck are good in LC unlike or moreso than in other metagames
    Oran Berry is not as common as it once was in LC but still is pretty common, just about everyteam has 1-2 oran berry users. Pokemon such as Munchlax, Omaynte, Clamperl and Gligar will often have Oran Berry therefor it is there for you to steal.
  10. diinbong

    diinbong *it's in you to give*
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    imo these should be divided into "Technical" and "Competitive" things you should know about CaP.
  11. ultimifier

    ultimifier

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    this is only a small nitpick but in the "stall doesn't work" section you mention missy and NP. should be edited out now for obvious reasons.
  12. Bologo

    Bologo Have fun with birds and bees.
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    While I haven't had a problem with this, it may be a good idea to add Phione to this list, since people may view it as a pre-evo of Manaphy, when in fact, it doesn't evolve back into it.
  13. Phantasm Blast

    Phantasm Blast

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    4) Chansey, Marill, Pikachu, Phione, and Rotom are NOT LC-LEGAL
    Seriously, what's the deal with this? Pikachu has a prevo and can't even be hatched from an egg. Rotom and Phione don't even evolve. Marill and Chansey both have prevos. Please, please please do not use them in unrated LC.


    if this is the case is skarm legal?
  14. Sledge

    Sledge

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    Skarm violates the first rule and therefore is not allowed in Little Cup.
  15. Idkwhatsrc

    Idkwhatsrc

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    Thanks alot for those tips.
  16. Brammi

    Brammi

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    I see so many people who think it is ok to run 1 scarfer and maybe one priority move because the sets look good together. In a tier like Little Cup where +2 makes basically anything faster than everything it just gets sad sometimes.
  17. Deinosaur

    Deinosaur GO GOOMY

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    This is pretty helpful, so many people have no idea what is going on in LC, and need to look at this.
  18. 13laze13oy

    13laze13oy

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    I think you should add Oran Berry>Leftovers or that Leftovers is next to useless(since most of the time you only get 1 hp). Otherwise a terrific guide.

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