Battle Spot Teambuilding Discussion & Help Thread (read post #453, page 19)

[ProjectTitan313]

the good
252 Atk Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mega Mawile: 576-680 (366.8 - 433.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Lucario: 392-464 (139.5 - 165.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Gengar: 422-500 (161.6 - 191.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

the bad
252 Atk Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 16+ Def Mega Scizor: 118-141 (34.4 - 41.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

although ttar can deal with it
252+ Atk Technician Mega Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 248 HP / 80+ Def Tyranitar: 186-222 (46.1 - 55%) -- 61.3% chance to 2HKO
0 SpA Tyranitar Fire Blast vs. 248 HP / 200 SpD Mega Scizor: 252-300 (73.4 - 87.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO and guaranteed ohk with minimal hp/def investment



yeah heatran is a great answer to aegislash
252 SpA Heatran Magma Storm vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Aegislash-Shield: 176-210 (54.3 - 64.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery




Garchomp > ttar , I agree with you here bc
0- SpA Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 248 HP / 200 SpD Mega Scizor: 196-232 (57.1 - 67.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Aegislash-Shield: 188-224 (58 - 69.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

but I prefer to run ttar since he gives me a check to tflame and scarf lando t does the same job as garchomp


So all in all I my team would look like this
(All out attacker) M

(psyshock, hyper voice, focus blast(?) , ??)
SpDefensive Support

(leftovers, shuka berry ?)
Scarf

(eq, knock off, u-turn, ??)
??

(magma storm/eruption/fire blast whatever that suits my team)


Since steel types are the strongest threat to MGarde Ttar I opt to run 2 checks. But this way water types like azumaril, rotom w, suicine, (m) slowbro and several others become another serious threat. Anyway, Hoopa U might be a good addition to deal with those.


Azumaril, slowbro, rotom w

252 SpA Choice Specs Hoopa Unbound Thunderbolt vs. 240 HP / 16 SpD Assault Vest Azumarill: 282-334 (70.3 - 83.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO for those rare occasions, otherwise always a ohk/revenge kill from lando

252 SpA Choice Specs Hoopa Unbound Dark Pulse vs. +1 252 HP / 176 SpD Mega Slowbro: 314-372 (79.6 - 94.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
incase he doesnt cm when I switch in hoopa u... 136+ SpA Mega Slowbro Scald vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Hoopa Unbound: 106-126 (35.2 - 41.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO ...kill/forcing switch in next round

252 SpA Choice Specs Hoopa Unbound Dark Pulse vs. 252 HP / 40 SpD Rotom-W: 219-258 (72 - 84.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
116+ SpA Rotom-W Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Hoopa Unbound: 121-144 (40.1 - 47.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO



252 SpA Choice Specs Hoopa Unbound Thunderbolt vs. +1 252 HP / 4 SpD Suicune: 214-252 (52.9 - 62.3%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Also it works against crocune, but if luck plays a big roll. If it gets a few lucky sleep talks my game is most likely done. Though running a taunt breaker heatran might solve this problem and help against other stall mons/comps.

This leaves me with one space left. Wish support for Hoopa U and MGard ? Or ditch ttar completely for something else to cover other weaknesses, then let lando support with SR ? Or am I just crazy to think this comp might work ? I am open for every kind of critic, guys.

Hoopa is banned in Battle Spot so I'm afraid it's not going to help you much.

If you're scared of Azumarill, Rotom-W, Slowbro, and Suicune, a bulky Grass or Electric mon would help you out. Roserade, venusaur (could be second Mega too), Amoonguss, Ferrothorn, Breloom (frail but hurts like fuck), Virizion, Ludicolo, Zapdos, Thundurus (Incarnate and Therian, incarnate soams T-Wave / cores with Landog, Therian hits like nobody's business and is imo superior in 90% of cases), tons of options.

 

[Moon Sugar]

Hoopa is banned in Battle Spot so I'm afraid it's not going to help you much.

If you're scared of Azumarill, Rotom-W, Slowbro, and Suicune, a bulky Grass or Electric mon would help you out. Roserade, venusaur (could be second Mega too), Amoonguss, Ferrothorn, Breloom (frail but hurts like fuck), Virizion, Ludicolo, Zapdos, Thundurus (Incarnate and Therian, incarnate soams T-Wave / cores with Landog, Therian hits like nobody's business and is imo superior in 90% of cases), tons of options.

Oh darn. My attempt looked so promising :/

Amoonguss + Thundurus T
This is a really offensive approach and requires more of an active gameplay than I intended to do. Thundurus to deal with dragons + water and Amoonguss to revenge kill anyone that survives a hit (+ late game sweep). Running a defensive TTar is out of place with these guys since they are able to deal with all checks Ttar was supposed to do leaving me with another free slot to fill. Suggestions ?

Ferrothorn + Tflame
Get rids of fairy and water types, also gives kang nightmares who could easily rip this team apart. Ferrothorn with protect is able to deal with lopunny since that bunny can't ohk him in any way. Gard + Ttar steal weakness gets covered quite good but that leaves the team open to fighting moves + eq. Although most mons that carry eq also have a way to seriously hurt Tflame, it does his job and deserves a spot imo if I keep Ttar in my team.


Side question : What do ppl think about 12 hp/252+ spa/252 spdef spread on MGard ? It lets her survive attacks from 252 MGeng and 252+ aegislash

252 SpA Mega Gengar Sludge Bomb vs. 12 HP / 244 SpD Mega Gardevoir: 122-146 (84.1 - 100.6%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Gardevoir Psyshock vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Gengar: 198-234 (146.6 - 173.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ SpA Aegislash-Blade Flash Cannon vs. 12 HP / 244 SpD Mega Gardevoir: 110-132 (75.8 - 91%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Gardevoir Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Aegislash-Shield: 78-92 (46.7 - 55%) -- 59% chance to 2HKO
optional : running protect to bait out aegislash normal form and OHK next round/force switch

 

[cant say]

Amoonguss to revenge kill anyone that survives a hit (+ late game sweep).

Amoongus is this Pokemon

It doesn't revenge kill and it doesn't sweep...

 

[Anirav]

Oh darn. My attempt looked so promising :/
Amoonguss + Thundurus T
This is a really offensive approach and requires more of an active gameplay than I intended to do. Thundurus to deal with dragons + water and Amoonguss to revenge kill anyone that survives a hit (+ late game sweep). Running a defensive TTar is out of place with these guys since they are able to deal with all checks Ttar was supposed to do leaving me with another free slot to fill. Suggestions ?

Ferrothorn + Tflame
Get rids of fairy and water types, also gives kang nightmares who could easily rip this team apart. Ferrothorn with protect is able to deal with lopunny since that bunny can't ohk him in any way. Gard + Ttar steal weakness gets covered quite good but that leaves the team open to fighting moves + eq. Although most mons that carry eq also have a way to seriously hurt Tflame, it does his job and deserves a spot imo if I keep Ttar in my team.


Side question : What do ppl think about 12 hp/252+ spa/252 spdef spread on MGard ? It lets her survive attacks from 252 MGeng and 252+ aegislash

252 SpA Mega Gengar Sludge Bomb vs. 12 HP / 244 SpD Mega Gardevoir: 122-146 (84.1 - 100.6%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Gardevoir Psyshock vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Gengar: 198-234 (146.6 - 173.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ SpA Aegislash-Blade Flash Cannon vs. 12 HP / 244 SpD Mega Gardevoir: 110-132 (75.8 - 91%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Mega Gardevoir Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Aegislash-Shield: 78-92 (46.7 - 55%) -- 59% chance to 2HKO
optional : running protect to bait out aegislash normal form and OHK next round/force switch

Hello Moon Sugar. It's nice to see a new user interested in battle spot but you seem to be a bit inexperienced. That's why I recommend you lurk a bit before you start posting. Also try to visit the battle spot room on PS! http://play.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespot. A lot of us hang out over there and can have practice battles with you. We can also help teambuild with you and can give you advice. Hope to see you there!

 

[Moon Sugar]

Hello Moon Sugar. It's nice to see a new user interested in battle spot but you seem to be a bit inexperienced. That's why I recommend you lurk a bit before you start posting. Also try to visit the battle spot room on PS! http://play.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespot. A lot of us hang out over there and can have practice battles with you. We can also help teambuild with you and can give you advice. Hope to see you there!

Ah well .. I'll definitely check that out. Thanks for the honesty and advice :)

 

[Zeke_Squad]

I am having trouble making a scizor set. Please critique mine and give me any recomendations.
Scizor@Deep Sea Scale
Ability:Technician
252Attack/248Hp/8SpDef
Moves:
Bullet punch
X-Scissor
Swords Dance
Night Slash

 

[Omastar68]

I am having trouble making a scizor set. Please critique mine and give me any recomendations.
Scizor@Deep Sea Scale
Ability:Technician
252Attack/248Hp/8SpDef
Moves:
Bullet punch
X-Scissor
Swords Dance
Night Slash

Why does it have a Deep Sea Scale lol? That's useless. EVs divisible by 8 at level 50. Night Slash is weak, but too strong for Technician. You really ought to change it. Roost, Superpower, etc.

Also, U-Turn>X-Scissor

 

[a0161613]

I am having trouble making a scizor set. Please critique mine and give me any recomendations.
Scizor@Deep Sea Scale
Ability:Technician
Nature: Adamant???
252Attack/248Hp/8SpDef
Moves:
Bullet punch
X-Scissor
Swords Dance
Night Slash

I've highlighted the bits I noticed that were weird. Item choice is just plain wrong, you didnt include a nature - I assumed Adamant. X Scissor and Night Slash you could probably replace. Bug Bite is probably better. Superpower or Pursuit may be better than Night Slash.

it may be difficult to help without knowing the rest of your team.

 

[Zeke_Squad]

I've highlighted the bits I noticed that were weird. Item choice is just plain wrong, you didnt include a nature - I assumed Adamant. X Scissor and Night Slash you could probably replace. Bug Bite is probably better. Superpower or Pursuit may be better than Night Slash.

it may be difficult to help without knowing the rest of your team.

It is adamant, I dont have my DS with me right now so I cant give too much detail on the rest at the moment.
Ampharos
Charizard
Crobat
Garchomp
Sableye
Scizor
Also, what item would you reccomend?

 

[Anirav]

I am having trouble making a scizor set. Please critique mine and give me any recomendations.
Scizor@Deep Sea Scale
Ability:Technician
252Attack/248Hp/8SpDef
Moves:
Bullet punch
X-Scissor
Swords Dance
Night Slash

Deep sea scale raises the special defense of clamperl by x2 so it makes no sense to use it on Scizor. Zeke_Squad, there is a wonderful scizor analysis written here
http://www.smogon.com/dex/xy/pokemon/scizor/battle_spot_singles/ I recommend you read this and decide which set is the best for your team. Also, before using an item, I recommend you look at the description for the item and see what it does. I think you should lurk the forums a bit and learn more about the meta since you are new. I think earlier, I told you to visit the battle spot room on pokemon showdown. I don't know if you have been there yet but definitely visit it if you haven't.

 

[Mkushrom]

Hi! I wish anyone could help me with my team for BSS:

Gengar @ Gengarite
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Perish Song
- Disable
- Protect

Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Ability: Trace
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 12 SpA / 244 SpD
Calm Nature
- Ice Beam
- Discharge
- Foul Play
- Recover

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
Level: 50
EVs: 244 HP / 252 Def / 12 SpD
Bold Nature
- Foul Play
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
- Taunt

Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Thunder Wave
- Slack Off

Greninja @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
Level: 50
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Gunk Shot
- Low Kick
- Ice Beam
- Dark Pulse

Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Stance Change
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Iron Head
- Shadow Sneak
- King's Shield

I really wish I could keep Slowbro and Gengar or Sableye, but I'm open to suggestions.

Thanks in advance!

 

[cant say]

Hi! I wish anyone could help me with my team for BSS:

Gengar @ Gengarite
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Perish Song
- Disable
- Protect

Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Ability: Trace
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 12 SpA / 244 SpD
Calm Nature
- Ice Beam
- Discharge
- Foul Play
- Recover

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
Level: 50
EVs: 244 HP / 252 Def / 12 SpD
Bold Nature
- Foul Play
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
- Taunt

Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Thunder Wave
- Slack Off

Greninja @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
Level: 50
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Gunk Shot
- Low Kick
- Ice Beam
- Dark Pulse

Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Stance Change
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Iron Head
- Shadow Sneak
- King's Shield

I really wish I could keep Slowbro and Gengar or Sableye, but I'm open to suggestions.

Thanks in advance!

You've got a huge Hydreigon weakness here. Running triple Ghosts is the biggest issue, but you also have Slowbro to make it even worse, I'd recommend swapping out one of the Ghosts (Sableye or Aegislash) or maybe even Bro itself for either Azumarill or Sylveon.

I like Sludge Bomb as a mono attacking option on PerishGar instead of Shadow Ball.

Not really sure what Taunt does on Mega Sableye - apart from stop special attackers from setting up? - since all status moves are reflected anyway, and you have Foul Play and Will-O-Wisp to punish physical set up mons. Knock Off could be cool in the last slot instead.

Greninja needs 20 Atk to OHKO standard Azumarill with Gunk Shot, take that from SpA

Aegislash is missing 4 EVs

 

[Tarzan11]

So I saw on Battlespot stats that Gardevoir's top 3 items used were Gardevoirite, Choice Scarf, and Sitrus Berry, so I guess Mega-Gardevoir is 63%, Scarf Gardevoir is 20%, and Substitute Gardevoir is 10%. Can anyone help me go about learning the three builds? I assume all 3 would have Trace as the ability and have either a Modest or Timid nature. The top 10 moves used are Psyshock, HyperVoice, Taunt, Moonblast, Focus Blast, Destiny Bond, Hidden Power, Trick, Substitute, and Psychic, with Will-o-Wisp (13%) and Encore (11%) also having double digit usage and coming after. I would really like to know how to slash the moves.


Gardevoir @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SA / 252 Spe
Timid/Modest Nature
-Psyshock/Psychic
-Hypervoice
-Taunt/Will-O-wisp/Thunder Wave
-Moonblast/Focus Blast/Destiny Bond

Gardevoir @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Trace
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SA / 252 Spe
Timid/Modest Nature
-Psyshock/Psychic
-Hypervoice
-Moonblast/Focus Blast
-Trick

Gardevoir @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Trace
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SA / 252 Spe
Timid/Modest Nature
-Psyshock/Psychic
-Hypervoice
-Substitute
-Moonblast/Focus Blast

These would be my guesses for how they would look. Wasnt sure what to do with Hidden Power or Encore.

 

[ethan06]

Okay, firstly, there are a couple of key differences between Mega Gardevoir and regular Gardevoir: regular Gardevoir uses Moonblast instead of Hyper Voice, as regular Gardevoir lacks Pixilate, meaning that Hyper Voice isn't changed to Fairy-type and remains a weak Normal-type coverage move. However, on all Mega Gardevoir variants, Hyper Voice is simply far stronger than Moonblast so it's the superior choice. I don't have any input on Sitrus Berry, but I know that Substitute is definitely used on some Mega Gardevoir sets. I'd go with Scarf and Mega as the two most viable sets:

Gardevoir @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
Level: 50
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Psyshock / Psychic
- Hyper Voice
- Focus Blast / Taunt / Will-o-Wisp / Substitute
- Focus Blast / Taunt / Will-o-Wisp / Substitute

Timid nature so that Gardevoir can take the fullest advantage of its base 100 speed stat to tie with max Speed Kangaskhan and outpace any slower Khan variants, as well as anything else in the 100 speed bracket i.e. Volcarona, Salamence before mega, Zapdos etc. Garde has a ton of options for the last two slots so pick your poison: the only two mandatory moves are the dual STABs. Psyshock is better than Psychic nine times out of ten btw as it gives Garde a shot at breaking tough special walls like Chansey (with the aid of Taunt and/or teammates with Knock Off).

Gardevoir @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Trace
Level: 50
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Psyshock / Psychic
- Moonblast
- Focus Blast / Hidden Power [Fire] / Thunderbolt
- Trick

Scarf Garde has only one slot free because of the utility granted by Trick, and support options are less viable with move locking in the picture so I've loaded up the free slot with useful offensive coverage instead. Focus Blast hits Steels in general but HP [Fire] can also be useful for hitting Ferrothorn, Scizor (on the switch obviously, Bullet Punch ;_;) and Skarmory harder. Thunderbolt hits Gyarados and a couple of Flying-types but you're better off hitting Steels. Shadow Ball can be used but the only real target is Aegislash and it tanks in Shield Forme (and Sneak is scary anyway). Modest Nature packs a punch and makes up the power drop from no Hyper Voice a little, and the drop in speed isn't that important when Scarf is a thing.

 

[ArchangelPT]

XY Battle Spot Singles

Greninja @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
EVs: 252 SpAtk / 4 SpDef / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Gunk Shot
- Ice Beam
- Extrasensory
- Grass Knot

Talonflame @ Sharp Beak
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- Sword Dance
- Taunt

Venusaur @ Venusaurite
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Hidden Power Fire
- Synthesis

Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Brave Nature
- Shadow Sneak
- Swords Dance
- Iron Head
- King's Shield

Garchomp @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Dragon Claw

Azumarill @ Assault Vest
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpDef / 252 Hp
Adamant Nature
- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
- Superpower
- Waterfall

----

Looking to maybe replace Aegislash? I know he's strong but i don't like using it very much. If i use him as a special attacker then shadow sneak does basically nothing and physically

I was thinking Espeon because i love Magic Bounce so much but i don't know how well it fits with my team. Would be perfect for dealing with prankster bullshitery though.

_______________________________
cant say edit: I cleaned up the formatting, using the standard PS moveset layouts makes it easier for everybody. I also put XY BSS at the top so people know to not account for stuff like Mega Salamence

 

[Tarzan11]

Okay, firstly, there are a couple of key differences between Mega Gardevoir and regular Gardevoir: regular Gardevoir uses Moonblast instead of Hyper Voice, as regular Gardevoir lacks Pixilate, meaning that Hyper Voice isn't changed to Fairy-type and remains a weak Normal-type coverage move. However, on all Mega Gardevoir variants, Hyper Voice is simply far stronger than Moonblast so it's the superior choice. I don't have any input on Sitrus Berry, but I know that Substitute is definitely used on some Mega Gardevoir sets. I'd go with Scarf and Mega as the two most viable sets:

Gardevoir @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
Level: 50
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Psyshock / Psychic
- Hyper Voice
- Focus Blast / Taunt / Will-o-Wisp / Substitute
- Focus Blast / Taunt / Will-o-Wisp / Substitute

Timid nature so that Gardevoir can take the fullest advantage of its base 100 speed stat to tie with max Speed Kangaskhan and outpace any slower Khan variants, as well as anything else in the 100 speed bracket i.e. Volcarona, Salamence before mega, Zapdos etc. Garde has a ton of options for the last two slots so pick your poison: the only two mandatory moves are the dual STABs. Psyshock is better than Psychic nine times out of ten btw as it gives Garde a shot at breaking tough special walls like Chansey (with the aid of Taunt and/or teammates with Knock Off).

Gardevoir @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Trace
Level: 50
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Psyshock / Psychic
- Moonblast
- Focus Blast / Hidden Power [Fire] / Thunderbolt
- Trick

Scarf Garde has only one slot free because of the utility granted by Trick, and support options are less viable with move locking in the picture so I've loaded up the free slot with useful offensive coverage instead. Focus Blast hits Steels in general but HP [Fire] can also be useful for hitting Ferrothorn, Scizor (on the switch obviously, Bullet Punch ;_;) and Skarmory harder. Thunderbolt hits Gyarados and a couple of Flying-types but you're better off hitting Steels. Shadow Ball can be used but the only real target is Aegislash and it tanks in Shield Forme (and Sneak is scary anyway). Modest Nature packs a punch and makes up the power drop from no Hyper Voice a little, and the drop in speed isn't that important when Scarf is a thing.

Thanks a lot! Yeah, I completely forgot to take into account the lack of its Mega-Ability in the other two sets. Also Destiny Bond has 21% usage on Gardevoir. Do you have any input on how to best make use of it? Im assuming this move is only run on the Mega-set.

 

[Psynergy]

**Greninja @ Life Orb**

Ability: Protean

EVs: 252 SpAtk / 4 SpDef / 252 Spe

Naive Nature

- Gunk Shot
- Ice Beam
- Extrasensory
- Grass Knot

**Talonflame @ Sharp Beak**

Ability: Gale Wings

EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

Adamant Nature

- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- Sword Dance
- Taunt

**Venusaur @ Venusaurite**

Ability: Chlorophyll

EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD

Modest Nature

- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Hidden Power Fire
- Synthesis

**Aegislash @ Weakness Policy**

Ability: Stance Change

EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD

Brave Nature

- Shadow Sneak
- Swords Dance
- Iron Head
- King's Shield

**Garchomp @ Choice Scarf**

Ability: Rough Skin

EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

Adamant Nature

- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Dragon Claw

**Azumarill @ Assault Vest**

Ability: Huge Power

EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpDef / 252 Hp

Adamant Nature

- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
- Superpower
- Waterfall

----

Looking to maybe replace Aegislash? I know he's strong but i don't like using it very much. If i use him as a special attacker then shadow sneak does basically nothing and physically

I was thinking Espeon because i love Magic Bounce so much but i don't know how well it fits with my team. Would be perfect for dealing with prankster bullshitery though.

Sorry if this is the wrong place to post this

Your team lacks solid Kangaskhan switch-ins or ways to get rid of it immediately, and removing Aegislash makes this worse. Swords Dance Aegislash often isn't running King's Shield anyway, but Weakness Policy tends to be somewhat excessive with SD so I'd consider Swords Dance with a coverage move (i.e. Sacred Sword) or opting for Leftovers over WP. Alternatively, consider the specially mixed variant:

Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Shadow Sneak / Flash Cannon
- King's Shield
- Sacred Sword / Flash Cannon

Espeon is a pretty mediocre replacement and only really fits on specific team builds that need something like a Dual Screener, not something I'd replace Aegislash with.

Talonflame also looks problematic for this team though, Scarfchomp can revenge it but Swords Dance variants don't really fear much from your team once they set up. I might consider replacing something for a Talonflame check. Ancient Power/Stone Edge Heatran in place of Aegislash or a Rocky Helmet Suicune over a Water-type might work for you, the latter in particular also messes with Kangaskhan though it has to be careful against specially defensive Talonflame. Adding another Water-type compounds a Thundurus weakness though so I'd replace Azumarill or Talonflame with it.

Also if you keep Greninja, you need 20 Attack EVs to OHKO standard Azumarill with Gunk Shot so I'd take that out of SpA. I also don't think you need Extrasensory since you have a Talonflame to hit Fighting-types and Mega Venusaur, so I'd consider Dark Pulse in its place for Cresselia, especially if you decide to replace Aegislash.

 

[ArchangelPT]

Your team lacks solid Kangaskhan switch-ins or ways to get rid of it immediately, and removing Aegislash makes this worse. Swords Dance Aegislash often isn't running King's Shield anyway, but Weakness Policy tends to be somewhat excessive with SD so I'd consider Swords Dance with a coverage move (i.e. Sacred Sword) or opting for Leftovers over WP. Alternatively, consider the specially mixed variant:

Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Shadow Sneak / Flash Cannon
- King's Shield
- Sacred Sword / Flash Cannon

Espeon is a pretty mediocre replacement and only really fits on specific team builds that need something like a Dual Screener, not something I'd replace Aegislash with.

Talonflame also looks problematic for this team though, Scarfchomp can revenge it but Swords Dance variants don't really fear much from your team once they set up. I might consider replacing something for a Talonflame check. Ancient Power/Stone Edge Heatran in place of Aegislash or a Rocky Helmet Suicune over a Water-type might work for you, the latter in particular also messes with Kangaskhan though it has to be careful against specially defensive Talonflame. Adding another Water-type compounds a Thundurus weakness though so I'd replace Azumarill or Talonflame with it.

Also if you keep Greninja, you need 20 Attack EVs to OHKO standard Azumarill with Gunk Shot so I'd take that out of SpA. I also don't think you need Extrasensory since you have a Talonflame to hit Fighting-types and Mega Venusaur, so I'd consider Dark Pulse in its place for Cresselia, especially if you decide to replace Aegislash.

You nailed it with the weaknesses, those are pretty much the exact problems i'm having.

Should i just create a whole new team from scratch? Seems like i can't really be competitive without a M-Khan

 

[Omastar68]

You nailed it with the weaknesses, those are pretty much the exact problems i'm having.

Should i just create a whole new team from scratch? Seems like i can't really be competitive without a M-Khan

EVs are what catch my eye most looking at your team. Max/Max spreads are often ok, but not for everything. Azu for instance has a specific spread for all sets in the start dex, and then Ofc there's the Atk people mentioned for Gren. You don't have an Azu problem really, so I'd run another one of its many great moves, but if you are gonna go for Gunk Shot some Atk is necessary(and if you're going mixed on a non bulky mom, why are you putting the leftover 4 EVs in the lowered defensive stat anyways? Some benchmark?)

I've used Venu a lot, and I like max physical bulk and Bold, with 4 EVs in SpD. Your moves, except Leech Seed over HP Fire. Modest isn't bad on Venu tho, and most actually go Modest(43%, Bold is 28%,) so I'm curious what it gets, and if that's worth what it loses.

I like LO for Talon if you're running no bulk, and U-Turn over Taunt seems worth considering.

Also,bre place D-Claw on Chomp. Dual Chop is the same power, slightly less accuracy, but hits twice, so it may take out certain sash mons. If that doesn't work Fire and Fire Blast are also good options.

 

[Psynergy]

You nailed it with the weaknesses, those are pretty much the exact problems i'm having.

Should i just create a whole new team from scratch? Seems like i can't really be competitive without a M-Khan

If you're having trouble, trying a team with Kangaskhan isn't a bad idea since it's so easy to use, and definitely a good starting point to help you understand the format better. That being said I don't think your team is bad, your Pokemon choices and movesets make sense but they just need some tweaking. Venusaur is definitely not the easiest Mega to use and many of them opt for defensive spreads, but for an early team that's honestly pretty good.

 

[ArchangelPT]

If you're having trouble, trying a team with Kangaskhan isn't a bad idea since it's so easy to use, and definitely a good starting point to help you understand the format better. That being said I don't think your team is bad, your Pokemon choices and movesets make sense but they just need some tweaking. Venusaur is definitely not the easiest Mega to use and many of them opt for defensive spreads, but for an early team that's honestly pretty good.

It's not my first team, i've been adapting it towards what i'm weak against. Which ofc means then i'm weak against something else and the cycle starts over again lol

My original team was MChar Y, Gengar, Scizor, Garchomp, Azumaril and Greninja, then i replaced Charizard with Talonflame and made Scizor my mega. MKhan just feels so ridiculously overpowered to me though, people even build him a special attacker and it STILL works because parental bond is retarded.

 

[ethan06]

I had that problem with the team I used in XY. Eventually what it took was to add some off-centre picks and everything clicked into place, and now it's a sample team lol. That said, I've never used a Mega Kangaskhan in Battle Spot in my life because I'm stubborn and I hate it, so it's definitely possible. With that said:

XY Battle Spot Singles

Greninja @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
EVs: 252 SpAtk / 4 SpDef / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Gunk Shot
- Ice Beam
- Extrasensory
- Grass Knot

Talonflame @ Sharp Beak
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- Sword Dance
- Taunt

Venusaur @ Venusaurite
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Hidden Power Fire
- Synthesis

Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Brave Nature
- Shadow Sneak
- Swords Dance
- Iron Head
- King's Shield

Garchomp @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Dragon Claw

Azumarill @ Assault Vest
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpDef / 252 Hp
Adamant Nature
- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
- Superpower
- Waterfall

One quick fix I can give you to make your Khan weakness a little better is to put Will-o-Wisp on Talonflame, possibly over Taunt. Chansey stall wasn't quite as much of a thing in XY due to the lack of Mega Slowbro and Mega Sableye so it doesn't need to be accounted for too much, but if you have access to ORAS tutors (I assume you do, going off of Greninja's Gunk Shot) then I'd recommend adding Knock Off onto Azumarill to soften the defenses of Chansey and Porygon2, over Superpower. Having HP [Fire] on Venusaur and Flare Blitz on Talonflame should be more than enough to take care of Ferrothorn for you, but if you miss your Fighting coverage then consider putting Sacred Sword on Aegislash somewhere. Nitpick but I believe Greninja needs 28 Atk EVs to guarantee the OHKO onto Azumarill.

The main problem I see with your team as it is at the moment is a Talonflame weakness: your only Flying resist is Aegislash, and that takes a chunk from Flare Blitz and has to try and sweep on 20% HP, which is possible but not ideal. Other than that your best best is Garchomp or Azumarill but they take a lot from Banded Brave Bird too. The only possible tech I can really recommend without significantly rejigging your team lineup is to use Focus Sash on Greninja over Life Orb, to guarantee that you survive a Brave Bird and OHKO back with, say, Scald . Your current Greninja set is a little wack as well so maybe consider dropping Grass Knot and Extrasensory for Scald/Hydro Pump and Dark Pulse - this keeps you from being walled by Aegislash and doesn't worsen your matchup against anything (you still nail Venusaur with Talonflame, and Water/Ground types with Venusaur. Azumarill is covered by Gunk Shot and Venusaur too). You may not even need Gunk Shot given Venusaur's place on the team - Low Kick would be a useful addition for hitting Kangaskhan, Ferrothorn and some other targets. I've given you a lot of things ti try, and they might not all work but sort through them and see what works for you. Best of luck with your team!

 

[a0161613]

Moving it here it's a team building topic anyway:

Still no answer to this:(? What three have you been using so far?

Rotom-W is not something I like at all, but it seems to fit here I guess. Only weak to grass, and while that's compounded by Hippo, you have a 2x resist and a bulky 4x resist. Aegislash resists ice and is immune to fighting, naming other things. Excadrill or something else that can make use of sand would be good. Otherwise Hippo's ability is mostly a bad thing, and rarely really helpful. I always like a grass type or something like that to switch in to Spore from Loom.

Serperior would compound quite a few weaknesses, and your helmet is taken, so I don't think that'd be a good choice. Ferrothorn only compounds weaknesses with Luc who isn't bulky anyways, and is pretty good. Assuming Hippo is helmet Ferro should be Lefties.

Is your DNite Lum? And can your Luc OHKO Zard Y without a boost? Also, can Hippo take a hit from it? That doesn't really matter if it can't do anything back though. Especially if you add a grass type an answer to Zard Y would be a good idea. Exca only works in Sand tho(with Sand Rush Ofc,) unless you want Scarf Mold Breaker which doesn't capitalize on sand at all. Mayb Scarf Sand Force? CB Talon is strong enough to always OHKO Zard Y without a decent amount of bulk, though LO can't do that, at least not all the time, if Zard is full. Rocks can help here tho.

Does your Luc only have STABs for attacks? If so you have a Thundy problem, especially ones that OHKO Hippo or can Taunt it. Jellicent can then also be a problem. AV Mamo can live even a Flash Cannon from unboosted Luc, and takes unboosted DNite to town while getting a few chances to fish for Fissure on Hippo. Ferro helps with that, it only gets two chances for Fissure which usually isn't too bad.

I hope some of that helps, I kno I couldn't really help you last time.

What? Sand eliminates Sashes, which GREATLY increases your chance to sweep. Residual damage also increases your chance to nuke stuff with ESpeed after a boost. Sure, it adversely effects Dragonite, but that shouldn't matter once you're set up at +1 Attack and Speed.

Why on Earth would Grass or Sand be an issue? Does no one run Saftey Goggles Dnite + Hippowdon or..?
Char-Y / Thundy: Raikou, TTar, Head Smash Tyrantrum, if it has Electric or Rock moves it kills both. Fire types typically pound Char-Y too, like Entei. Thundy just adores anything with Ice Beam too.

Well this is the current team:

Hide

Lucario-Mega @ Lucarionite
Ability: Adaptability
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Flash Cannon
- Nasty Plot
- Vacuum Wave
- Aura Sphere

Hippowdon @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Slack Off
- Yawn
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake

Dragonite @ Lum Berry
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Extreme Speed
- Fire Punch

Mawile @ Mawilite
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Iron Head
- Play Rough
- Sucker Punch

Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Ability: Trace
Level: 50
EVs: 244 HP / 252 Def / 12 SpA
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Ice Beam
- Foul Play
- Recover
- Trick Room

Hydreigon @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Thunder Wave
- Dark Pulse
- Taunt

As you can see I went with a TR Pory/Mawile pairing plus Hydreigon. THe thing is, I've been laddering with the first three primarily. And after a couple of nights I got to 1350, I've never been that high before. I know it's like next to nothing for most of you guys but that's a big deal for me.

I need more experience TR Pory & M Maw and while I like Hydreigon a lot. I picked these three as someething that was more than competent to fill the hole. The potential with this is that the main three aren't especially quick. So TR could be a thing. Maybe I'll explore that.

But as the main question is HipDraLuc, I always asked the question that we always asked about it, doesn't the Sand just break Dragonite's usefulness? Isn't Luc a bit too frail? What does Hippo offer beyond sand?

Hippowdon is vulnerable to Taunt. That's a given and those three moves are almost always clicked before EQ. Not ideal with Sableye and Thundy around admittedly. But it's still the premier option for a lead in the team. Yawn is the obvious first move as it is the inevitable switch forcer. SR is a move I dislike but it's defining and inevitably it allows Drag and Luc to break so effectively. EQ wrecks, the power behind it admirable. I love that it destroys Mega Gengar - not that this team fears that.

Dragonite is awesome. Yes, Sand breaks Multiscale. In an ideal world it doesnt switch in until after it has finished but at worst it generally spends one turn in. By that point something only has to spend one turn in to be beaten up. I had EQ over Fire Punch initially. THe other moves are standard for a reason. DD works because of the sheer amount of switches. Outrage is powah and E-Speed is just nice for the priority.

Luc is mostly a hit but I can't deny it misses sometimes. It's damn strong and it's a status magnet. Pretty funny to get burnt only see Nasty Plot boost me to +2 and then KO'd by something. What I especially like is seeing how strong Vacuum Wave is with a boost. And when it can do this:
+2 252 SpA Adaptability Mega Lucario Vacuum Wave vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Kangaskhan: 192-228 (106.6 - 126.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

This is why I dont fear Kang if it switches in. It's a bit of a different story if I bring something in but that's where Sand helps.

Obviously I'd like the utility of Knock Off or Taunt and I do think the core has its' issues. Zapdos is a potential issue though I've not really seen it. Thundurus is a problem that I have to bundle by. Surprisingly Luc handles Mamo pretty well. 'Ninja has its' strengths but is vulnerable to priority.

This core though it's great.

 

[Omastar68]

Moving it here it's a team building topic anyway:



Well this is the current team:

Hide

Lucario-Mega @ Lucarionite
Ability: Adaptability
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Flash Cannon
- Nasty Plot
- Vacuum Wave
- Aura Sphere

Hippowdon @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Slack Off
- Yawn
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake

Dragonite @ Lum Berry
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Extreme Speed
- Fire Punch

Mawile @ Mawilite
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Iron Head
- Play Rough
- Sucker Punch

Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Ability: Trace
Level: 50
EVs: 244 HP / 252 Def / 12 SpA
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Ice Beam
- Foul Play
- Recover
- Trick Room

Hydreigon @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Thunder Wave
- Dark Pulse
- Taunt

As you can see I went with a TR Pory/Mawile pairing plus Hydreigon. THe thing is, I've been laddering with the first three primarily. And after a couple of nights I got to 1350, I've never been that high before. I know it's like next to nothing for most of you guys but that's a big deal for me.

I need more experience TR Pory & M Maw and while I like Hydreigon a lot. I picked these three as someething that was more than competent to fill the hole. The potential with this is that the main three aren't especially quick. So TR could be a thing. Maybe I'll explore that.

But as the main question is HipDraLuc, I always asked the question that we always asked about it, doesn't the Sand just break Dragonite's usefulness? Isn't Luc a bit too frail? What does Hippo offer beyond sand?

Hippowdon is vulnerable to Taunt. That's a given and those three moves are almost always clicked before EQ. Not ideal with Sableye and Thundy around admittedly. But it's still the premier option for a lead in the team. Yawn is the obvious first move as it is the inevitable switch forcer. SR is a move I dislike but it's defining and inevitably it allows Drag and Luc to break so effectively. EQ wrecks, the power behind it admirable. I love that it destroys Mega Gengar - not that this team fears that.

Dragonite is awesome. Yes, Sand breaks Multiscale. In an ideal world it doesnt switch in until after it has finished but at worst it generally spends one turn in. By that point something only has to spend one turn in to be beaten up. I had EQ over Fire Punch initially. THe other moves are standard for a reason. DD works because of the sheer amount of switches. Outrage is powah and E-Speed is just nice for the priority.

Luc is mostly a hit but I can't deny it misses sometimes. It's damn strong and it's a status magnet. Pretty funny to get burnt only see Nasty Plot boost me to +2 and then KO'd by something. What I especially like is seeing how strong Vacuum Wave is with a boost. And when it can do this:
+2 252 SpA Adaptability Mega Lucario Vacuum Wave vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Kangaskhan: 192-228 (106.6 - 126.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

This is why I dont fear Kang if it switches in. It's a bit of a different story if I bring something in but that's where Sand helps.

Obviously I'd like the utility of Knock Off or Taunt and I do think the core has its' issues. Zapdos is a potential issue though I've not really seen it. Thundurus is a problem that I have to bundle by. Surprisingly Luc handles Mamo pretty well. 'Ninja has its' strengths but is vulnerable to priority.

This core though it's great.

That's not what I was expecting on Hippo at all, how has specially defensive been working?

Mawi and bP2 seem ok enough, and I have no problems with Hydra. That said why'd you go t-wave? It's viable, just kinda weird IMO. You won't always bring it with the tr pair, but what made you pick such a Hydra. I think you really want a fire attack in either Hydra or Mawi. Probably Hydra, I don't think Taunt has much use on it, especially cuz it ain't a fast one.

The main other thing is EVs. All but P2 are max/Max spreads, and even p2 is practically that too. Look for Spe tiers and stuff. Even with things where it's reasonable to go max/Max those last 4 EVs can make a big difference. An example is Mawi. I'm pretty sure 4 in Def not SpD changes the chances for being OHKOd by certain things quite a bit.

Also, total nitpick, Hippo wants a Spe IV of 25 to be as fast as it can be while still under speeding min Spe Aegi.

 

[a0161613]

That's not what I was expecting on Hippo at all, how has specially defensive been working?

Better than I could have hoped in truth.

Mawi and P2 seem ok enough, and I have no problems with Hydra. That said why'd you go t-wave? It's viable, just kinda weird IMO. You won't always bring it with the tr pair, but what made you pick such a Hydra. I think you really want a fire attack in either Hydra or Mawi. Probably Hydra, I don't think Taunt has much use on it, especially cuz it ain't a fast one.

To be honest I dont have much experience with that side of the team, I just dont bring them that much when the main three work so well. I feel like I need Taunt somewhere on the team. I never build with it on any BS team and that's a weakness.

I was on PS the other day and someone was singing the praises of Twave Hydrei and I just ran with it

The main other thing is EVs. All but P2 are max/Max spreads, and even p2 is practically that too. Look for Spe tiers and stuff. Even with things where it's reasonable to go max/Max those last 4 EVs can make a big difference. An example is Mawi. I'm pretty sure 4 in Def not SpD changes the chances for being OHKOd by certain things quite a bit.

Also, total nitpick, Hippo wants a Spe IV of 25 to be as fast as it can be while still under speeding min Spe Aegi.

They all came from the analyses so I'd need a great (read: better) reason to change it. And when I put this on cart I'm not breeding for anything that isn't a 0 or 31 IV lol

An example of good and effective this team is against three decent threats.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespotsingles-359103952