Beartic

[Unholy_Crab1]

What's the deal with comparing him to Mamoswine and Weavile?

Mamoswine is slower (in rain), weak to water, and lacks any stat-boosting attacks.

Weavile is slower (in rain), less bulky, but slightly higher attack (which won't really make a difference after a boost or two).

I'm not saying those two are bad, but for God's sake, don't go saying Tsunbeaa is outclassed by him when there's still stunts that only he can pull off. Like some others have said, this guy's gonna probably work well on RD teams, taking care of grass-types, boosting his stats, and just being an all-around awesome bear.

 

[alphatron]

What grass types will Tsunbear be taking care of that give RD teams trouble though? Torterra? Tsunbear fears gyro ball from Nattorei and can't OHKO him.

 

[Unholy_Crab1]

What grass types will Tsunbear be taking care of that give RD teams trouble though? Torterra? Tsunbear fears gyro ball from Nattorei and can't OHKO him.

Actually, provided you SD on the switch, you have a chance to deal some major damage to Nattorei with Superpower. Just about the only way it wouldn't be a OHKO is if Nattorei is Relaxed, with max HP/Defense EVs. And even then, they'll barely be alive.

Also keep in mind that that Nattorei wouldn't have any attack EVs, so his Gyro Ball would still be pretty weak (provided he had it).

 

[alphatron]

Pretty weak? Assuming no attack investment, Nattorei's gyro ball is a gaurenteed OHKO on Tsunbear without the need for Iron Barbs or rocks. Tsunbear takes around 116% minumum. MINIMUM! I haven't done the calcs for relaxed Nattorei on the opposing end of a superpower, but you're probably right about that. +2 superpower should do Nattorei in.

Edit: Nevermind. Even a +2 Kabutops has no chance to OHKO 252/252 Nattorei. It takes 81.3-96% from the superpower. So Tsunbear definitely won't be able to do it either. I won't strike this against Tsunbear simply due to the fact that most rain pokes lose to nattorei anyway and he isn't much different in that regard.

 

[tehy]

Actually weavile is faster if you want him to be even in rain and stronger, with swords dance too. Plus, he isn't reliant on rain and can have stab dark type attacks and pursuit trap.

 

[Unholy_Crab1]

Actually weavile is faster if you want him to be even in rain and stronger, with swords dance too. Plus, he isn't reliant on rain and can have stab dark type attacks and pursuit trap.

If you wanna say that Swift-Swimmer's speed is useless as they're reliant on rain, then Kingdra wouldn't be OU.

And honestly, Weavile gets. . . What, Ice, Dark, and Low Kick. Tsunbeaa (in rain) has higher stats in everything (save for slightly lower attack), and doesn't have Vile's abysmal defense/move pool. And this is before the Gen 5 Move Tutor, mind you.

I'm not saying Weavile is terrible, I'm just saying that he doesn't completely eclipse Tsunbeaa.

Pretty weak? Assuming no attack investment, Nattorei's gyro ball is a gaurenteed OHKO on Tsunbear without the need for Iron Barbs or rocks. Tsunbear takes around 116% minumum. MINIMUM! I haven't done the calcs for relaxed Nattorei on the opposing end of a superpower, but you're probably right about that. +2 superpower should do Nattorei in.

Edit: Nevermind. Even a +2 Kabutops has no chance to OHKO 252/252 Nattorei. It takes 81.3-96% from the superpower. So Tsunbear definitely won't be able to do it either. I won't strike this against Tsunbear simply due to the fact that most rain pokes lose to nattorei anyway and he isn't much different in that regard.

Alright, I stand corrected on Gyro Ball (I didn't do a calc for it). But even so, with no instant-recovery available, it's hard to imagine that Nattorei is gonna survive too long after that. And that's assuming Nattorei's in TOP PERCENTAGE.

 

[SlimMan]

If you wanna say that Swift-Swimmer's speed is useless as they're reliant on rain, then Kingdra wouldn't be OU.

And honestly, Weavile gets. . . What, Ice, Dark, and Low Kick. Tsunbeaa (in rain) has higher stats in everything (save for slightly lower attack), and doesn't have Vile's abysmal defense/move pool. And this is before the Gen 5 Move Tutor, mind you.

I'm not saying Weavile is terrible, I'm just saying that he doesn't completely eclipse Tsunbeaa.



Alright, I stand corrected on Gyro Ball (I didn't do a calc for it). But even so, with no instant-recovery available, it's hard to imagine that Nattorei is gonna survive too long after that. And that's assuming Nattorei's in TOP PERCENTAGE.

Agree with the first paragraph.

For your statement about Nattorei...
What if it switches in on an Icicle Drop?

 

[Unholy_Crab1]

Agree with the first paragraph.

For your statement about Nattorei...
What if it switches in on an Icicle Drop?

I was referring to him switching in on a Swords Dance/Claw Sharpen/Bulk Up, which would then lead to a Super-Power. However, even an unboosted Icicle Drop + Superpower would still do a respectable amount (though I personally would rather switch out at that point).

 

[tehy]

If you wanna say that Swift-Swimmer's speed is useless as they're reliant on rain, then Kingdra wouldn't be OU.

And honestly, Weavile gets. . . What, Ice, Dark, and Low Kick. Tsunbeaa (in rain) has higher stats in everything (save for slightly lower attack), and doesn't have Vile's abysmal defense/move pool. And this is before the Gen 5 Move Tutor, mind you.

I'm not saying Weavile is terrible, I'm just saying that he doesn't completely eclipse Tsunbeaa.

I don't want to say that. But weavile is almost as fast and can still be so if rain is interrupted, and since politoed is killable,and he's not being used in ubers ever so no kyogre, eventually you might have a weather disadvantage. Tsunbeaa is useless in this event, weavile is not. They're still equally useful with rain, however, with weavile being slightly better.
I mean, maybe encore and superpower is all that tsunbeaa has, and it's really just terrible. Not to mention, ice is not a difficult type to find in rain teams.
Kingdra in rain is still not much better than palkia and i'd definitely use palkia, except that it doesn't learn dragon dance. The speed does matter to an extent, but palkia's ability to destroy enemies regardless of weather is a large asset.

 

[Unholy_Crab1]

The biggest advantage Tsunbeaa has over Weavile (IMO) is his bulk. While Weavile HAS to get OHKO's because of his pathetic defenses, Tsunbeaa can actually afford to take a hit or two. While his defenses aren't God-like, sure, they're still reasonable, as opposed to the 70/65/85 Weavile has.

Also, Tsunbeaa's movepool is a tad bit more eclectic, and he has multiple stat-up moves.

 

[He Who Must Not Be Named]

I really like this guy!
What about a Choice Band on a rain team?

 

[Enlong]

Did anyone mention using Claw Sharpen with Icicle Drop (to make it accurate) in the rain (for the speed to get Flinches to happen)?

Alternatively, perhaps take advantage of him having Endure, Flail, and Swift Swim? Give him a Liechi Berry (or a Salac Berry, if you're worried about Rain being disrupted, or Swift Swim not being enough). Night Slash could be used to stop Ghosts from walling his Flails?

 

[thejoker98]

Rain Dancer (Politoed partner)
@Choice Band/Scarf
252 Attack/252 Speed/ 4 hp
-Icicle Drop
-Rock Slide/Stone Edge
-Return/Shadow Claw/Night Slash/Level Ground
-Brick Break

Probly the only viable attacking moves he has.
Icicle Drop is wonderful so it is definetly there.
Rock Slide has good coverage and i prefer it to stone edge as he will probly die if he doesnt 2HKO or OHKO everything, even if its less powerful, better accuracy increases survival, but nevertheless, Stone Edge is viable (and at times better).
The next move is up to you.
Return is a good filler... but really nothing else...
Shadow Claw is good against only ghosts so i dont know why i put that there, night slash is waaay better.
Level Ground lowers the foes speed, that is really good and makes Tsunbeaa very hard to outspeed by non-choice users but dont use it if you use Choice Scarf
Brick Break has good coverage and is the second most important move on this set.
Nageki is a huge threat with mountain storm (120 power with STAB) and Dageki murders you with 180 choice powered Close Combat so switch if they come. In fact, everything with a fighting move is a threat, really! But the biggest threat is cloyster, walls you and can OHKO with Rock Blast, this thing is very hard to use and is very bad to use...

 

[Fluffy Otters]

Pretty weak? Assuming no attack investment, Nattorei's gyro ball is a gaurenteed OHKO on Tsunbear without the need for Iron Barbs or rocks. Tsunbear takes around 116% minumum. MINIMUM! I haven't done the calcs for relaxed Nattorei on the opposing end of a superpower, but you're probably right about that. +2 superpower should do Nattorei in.

Edit: Nevermind. Even a +2 Kabutops has no chance to OHKO 252/252 Nattorei. It takes 81.3-96% from the superpower. So Tsunbear definitely won't be able to do it either. I won't strike this against Tsunbear simply due to the fact that most rain pokes lose to nattorei anyway and he isn't much different in that regard.

A Swords Dance Super Power ohkoes Nattorei, what move were you using? Even on max hp/max def Nattorei +2 Life Orb Super Power does 111.93-131.82% and Super Power is a level up move. Also, I'm not sure how strong a Kabutops Low Kick is but if it's about 80 bp, it'll ohko max hp/min def (doesn't Nattorei need all the special defense it can get if you're using it against rain?) and have a pretty good chance with Stealth Rock/other damage if it has 350~ def. I don't know what power you put in when calculating but +2 Superpowers always ohko.

 

[IronGross]

Tsunbeaa isn't Rain-limited; why not try Avalanche on a Band set?

 

[suffocation49]

Just because it's a bear doesn't mean it's a watered down version of Ursaring. Its movepool and abilities (and typing, in case you hadn't noticed) make it TOTALLY different from Ursaring.

The thing I find incredibly cool about this guy is his ability to play both stall, on a hail team with Snow Cloak, and offensive, on a rain team with Swift Swim. His versatility is really just...cool.

Im pretty sure that was a joke... since it has swift swim

 

[NDenizen]

I actually tried a Wide Lens on Tsunbeaa, in the beginning when Rain was new and exciting. You miss out on extra power or speed, but the knowledge you'll be able to spam Icicle Drop and Rock Slide with no real concerns is nice. Icicle Drop spam is fantastic, it's just getting that opportunity to use SD that is Tsunbear's problem (besides inadequate coverage)

 

[M BLADE]

So, guys, i was playing Pokemon Online for a bit, then realized Sleep Talk is nowhere to be seen on it's movepool. I am disappont

Maybe a BU Sleep Talk set can work?

Beartic @ Leftovers
252 HP/252 SpD/6 Spe
Careful Nature
Ability: Snow Cloak/Swift Swim

-Bulk Up
-Icicle Crash
-Rest
-Sleep Talk

Beartic has nice bulk (Machamp-like bulk, which it's nice) after all. It can be Ice typed, but let's think for a moment:

No one uses Special Rock typed attacks. Same to steel with some exceptions. Fire and fighting special attacks are troublesome, but if you have Rain Dance support (banned blablabla, just let me make my point) on your side it makes Fire neutral, it also boosts it's speed if you use Swift Swim as the ability meaning it can be faster than a number of threats and get 2 BUs, or attack before it is attacked. It can even flinch a foe or two.

You can use Snow Cloak and avoid a hit or two with Obama support.
Ice is a good type that no one is immune to it.

About physical attacks: it can't be helped lol, this thing is weak to two very common typings (rock and fighting) and two niche/mainly STAB moves that are semi common (fire and steel).

Thoughts?

 

[breh]

So, guys, i was playing Pokemon Online for a bit, then realized Sleep Talk is nowhere to be seen on it's movepool. I am disappont

Maybe a BU Sleep Talk set can work?

Beartic @ Leftovers
252 HP/252 SpD/6 Spe
Careful Nature
Ability: Snow Cloak/Swift Swim

-Bulk Up
-Icicle Crash
-Rest
-Sleep Talk

Thoughts?

ICE TYPE USING DEFENSIVE MOVES
DOES NOT COMPUTE
DOES NOT COMPUTE

(in all seriousness defensive ice type that is not articuno is an oxymoron... maybe kyurem I guess)

In addition, nattorei leech seed makes this kind of thing difficult for any non-fire or fighting type attacker.

 

[Woodchuck]

Okay, this pokemon just isn't really good at all.
Especially since Swift Swim + Drizzle is now illegal.

 

[PoJ]

Just because Swift Swim + Drizzle is banned, you can still set up RD without Drizzle... but yeah, Tsunbeaa isn't looking very good, Imo.

 

[Lady Shinki]

SubPunch in hail looks good to me, idk what you guys are talkin about.

beartic @ leftovers/brightpowder
248 HP/252 Atk/8 Spe
Adamant / Snow Cloak

Substitute
Focus Punch
Icicle Drop
Taunt/Shadow Ball/Encore

doesn't sound too bad to me, especially since he has about a 1/4 chance of being able to focus punch twice given hail+brightpowder. Being slow as shit makes encore not very useful, but he can sub vs. slow ghosts that might go for will-o-wisp and then encore it?

 

[Cherub Agent]

I honestly think that this is one of the worst new pokemon. Nobody's going to use it, since it's completely outclassed by mamoswine. It also has no use on a RD team. Sure he get swift swim, but with no STAB water moves and hideous typing, not to mention bad stats, he's outclassed by every physical swift swimmer.

 

[eduardosunshine]

Tsunbeaa @Liechi berry
Jolly Nature
Ability: Swift Swim
Evs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe

~ Icicle Drop
~ Stone Edge
~ Substitute
~ Claw Sharpen



Substitute first for general protection, use Claw sharpen to get an atack and accuracy raise and you can pick your move whitout fear of a miss thanks to claw sharpen, and if things get ugly you can grab a boost from liechi(saved this bear's life many times)

what do you think?

 

[Slightly]

^ With Drizzle+SwSw banned he'll be lacking speed unless you RD+Damp Rock, and even then you'll need to switch him in. I suggest running another ability.

The only time this would see infinite rain is against an enemy's Drizzle team. Considering his STAB is resisted by water, not the best idea. Nor common enough to warrant use.