1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Beetle Power!

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Tangelo, Nov 3, 2012.

  1. Tangelo

    Tangelo

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    143
    [​IMG]
    --------
    Introduction
    --------
    Hey guys, I'm Tangy. I've posted a few teams on Smogon so far and they've successfully drawn some sort of feedback, so I figured I'd do another one. I'm not a fan of writing (or reading, for that matter) long rmts that just yap on and on about pointless stuff, so I'll try to keep this short and sweet.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    This team was built around Heracross HERABOSS because he's the coolest and nobody has used him to much success yet. After Heracross I just threw on a bunch of mons I liked and it ended up working pretty well. The original team had Xatu over Mew , but then Genesect happened (j/s guys, it's the gayest mon in the game). After that I just used the sets that fit my playstyle best: Choice. If you hit hard enough, resistances don't mean a thing. You simplify the game by keeping prediction at a minimum and basically just clicking the move you want and watching the KO's rack up. On this team, almost all of the mons (all but 2) carry a choice item. Other than all choice, I prioritized bulk over speed, and I tried to keep the Volt/Turn to a minimum since I find it annoying as fuck and the moves are too weak IMO. Only one poke I have carries Volt Switch. True bulky offense anyone? And, if anyone cares, I got to 1476 on Beta with this, so it's not too bad.

    That's basically it.

    --------
    Team
    --------
    [​IMG]
    Mew @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Synchronize
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
    - Ice Beam
    - Flamethrower
    - Psychic
    - Trick

    Easily the most versatile and cute poke in OU, Mew can run anything. Mew is usually the lead but it was the last one added. The team was relatively slow (mainly because for the first few weeks of this team's inception I was set on keeping it all bands/specs), so in the end I added this little guy. This set is mainly to surprise fag Genesect (although Sash Gene is still annoying) and KO it turn one. This thing is nice for revenging a ton of things, namely +1 Outraging DNite, Terrakion, DD Gyarados, Landorus, and friends. Another benefit of this guy is it being complete Tyranitar bait. Though this seems like a bad thing,Tyranitar coming in means a free kill for Hera. Trick is nice versus Deo-D leads and as a last ditch move.

    The moveset could be adjusted a ton of ways. Volt Switch gets momentum, and unlike U-Turn it actually hits some useful stuff like Gyara, but I don't use it simply because a lot of the time I'd like to stay in. Shadow Ball and Dark Pulse can hit Jellicent, but Trick cripples it anyways. Psyshock over Psychic is doable but I find hitting most things harder better than hitting Terrakion in sand harder (you still 2HKO with Psychic).

    Before Mew I had a Xatu in this slot. It was alright vs Stall and stuff but it didn't really fit the theme of the team: hit hard. Mew doesn't exactly hit hard, but at least it hits.

    [​IMG]
    Heracross @ Choice Band
    Trait: Moxie
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)
    - Close Combat
    - Megahorn
    - Night Slash
    - Stone Edge

    This right here is the scariest thing in Pokemon. Moxie CB Hera gets a kill basically every time it comes in once Gliscor is gone. 2HKOs Ferro and Skarm easily with CC. I mean, this monster has a chance to 2HKO Scizor with Megahorn. The majority of teams aren't prepared for something this powerful. Early game this thing comes in and just dominates the field. Something to note is that the meta is slowing down a lot from what it was. Lati@s and a lot of scarf pokes are in decline (fuck you gene). If you don't have anything that can outspeed Hera, than it's pretty much an instalose. Stall without a Ghost or Gliscor have huge issues with this guy.

    One thing you may be asking is, "Why use this over Terrakion?". One of the key factors of Heracross is that Hera actually has a decent set of resistances to come in on. Ground, fighting, grass, etc. Not to mention it isn't weak to any priority move. Terrakion's speed gives it a slight advantage over offensive teams, but those teams almost always have priority or a scarf mon, where Terrakion's speed isn't as important. Hera dominates stall and the majority of pokes on balance teams.

    [​IMG]
    Dragonite @ Choice Band
    Trait: Multiscale
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)
    - Outrage
    - Fire Punch
    - Waterfall
    - ExtremeSpeed

    The final CBer is a staple mon on a lot of teams, Dragonite. DNite is the glue of this team and functions as the line of defense against stuff like Volcarona, etc. Without this guy I'd get wrecked by a TON of stuff. DNite typing, although weak to SR, is key to playing this team. Don't be afraid use Multiscale on resisted hits. Avoiding using DNite is basically asking to lose something else important. Even with SR on the field, I'd rather have DNite KO'd than have 3 others KO'd because I avoided switching it in. Another important thing DNite does is act as a secondary check to Rain and Sun.

    The main selling point of DNite (for me) is the best priority in the game, ESpeed. I basically check the majority of fast things with DNite's ESpeed. It's especially good late game after Hera has done it's job and basically brought everything into kill range for a swift ESpeed. Infact, after Hera has worked through the steels, Outrage is basically GG for stall teams.

    [​IMG]
    Gastrodon @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Storm Drain
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
    Modest Nature (+SpA, -Atk)
    - Surf
    - Earth Power
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power [Grass]

    The first and only specs user is a very underrated one that has dropped in usage quite a bit since the beginning of 5th gen. Specs Gastrodon absolutely wrecks once it gets the Storm Drain boost. It's mainly here so I can absorb Scalds (worst move in the game). It's always nice to have an Electric immunity as well. Thundurus w/o Grass Knot is checked pretty well. The way I play Gastrodon is rarely switching due to it being hit by all hazards. Gastrodon is also the thing I go to for unboosted hits I don't know if anyone else can live.

    A change I've been considering is switching HP Grass to HP Fire or Recover. Ferrothorn isn't really a problem (infact it's switch in fodder for Hera), but HP Fire is always nice to have if Hera ever dies early. Recover is something that has a bit more of a use. It'd be easy to bluff a defensive set by using Recover after taking a few hits. It's also nice because hazards really stack on Gastro.

    [​IMG]
    Metagross @ Leftovers
    Trait: Clear Body
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Meteor Mash
    - Bullet Punch
    - Pursuit

    The first defensive pivot on the team: Metagross. It's still an AMAZING mon and I don't see what people don't like about it. What drove me to use Metagross was this thread. Putting Metagross behind basically everything is injustice. I guarantee that whoever did that either used Metagross early Gen 5, used it badly, lied, or didn't use it at all. Metagross mainly in this slot for stuff like like Tornadus and Zam. It's really important to keep alive if the opp has a Gengar. It's a great utility mon with good bulk. It's most important job, however, is coming in on Outrages / Dracos from Lati@s, DNite, etc. Unlike similar mons who do this (like other steels), Metagross is actually a threat and can hit for damage. It also sets up SR, so that's pretty nice, but the lack of EQ can be a pain sometimes.

    Probably obvious to most people, it seems like Tyranitar could do this job just as well. However Metagross has a few important things TTar doesn't. Firstly, it doesn't induce sandstorm. For a team full of mons weak to hazards and lacking a spinner, more residual damage from sand would be problematic. Next, already touched on earlier, is that Metagross tanks dragon hits. Unlike TTar, Metagross stops Gengar, and isn't deadly weak to fighting.

    [​IMG]
    Rotom-H @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 248 HP / 168 SpD / 92 Spe
    Calm Nature (+SpD, -Atk)
    - Pain Split
    - Volt Switch
    - Overheat
    - Thunder Wave

    The last member of the team, also one of the 2 defensive pivots, is an amazing mon: SpD Rotom-H. This thing has so many jobs that without it my team couldn't function. Previously, I ran a Specs set that, although moderately powerful, wasn't that great due to the sr weakness and it needing to switch-in on a ton of threats. It also takes a lot of pressure off Metagross tanking hits from the likes of Tornadus(-T) and Gengar (Volt Switch is great vs SubDisable). Another thing is Thunder Wave. A team like this, which focuses on slow powerhouses LOVES paralysis support.

    Using this over something like Heatran requires an explanation. Heatran, although having a nice set of resistances and no sr weakness, doesn't have a lot of tools Rotom has, like Volt Switch and Thunder Wave. Heatran also lacks 3 helpful things resistance wise: The ground immunity (all around helpful; spikes), an electric resist (not useless against rain), and no fighting weakness (fuck you Superpower Tornadus-T!).

    Great mon who needs more love.

    --------
    Threats
    --------
    Problem pokes can usually be played around, but they are RP Genesect lategame (Rotom-H covers this pretty well though, not to mention the majority don't even run Bug Buzz for some stupid reason) and sometimes DD Gyara variants give me trouble. Baton Pass in general is a pain in the ass, and well played Deo-D, well not really a threat, set up a ton of hazards. Specs Hydreigon is annoying because it can't be pursuited and EBelt / Lefties Icy Wind Keldeo hurts pretty bad.

    Hooray for the good sprites!
  2. Superpowerdude

    Superpowerdude A sunflower holds its head up high!
    is an official Team Rateris a Smogon Media Contributor
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2012
    Messages:
    1,366
    Hey man interesting looking team you have here!

    I really like the idea of a choice team however i did notice a few problems with your team. First of all as you mentioned Rock Polish Genesect and DD Gyarados give your team quite a few problems. After a Rock Polish Gensect outspeeds your whole team and can hit 4 of your members super effectively with Ice Beam, Bug Buzz and Flamethrower. Although it cant beat Rotom-H, Rotom-H will probally be switching a lot due to Volt Switch and Overheat recoil and with your team carrying no Rapid Spin user Rotom-H will often be to weakend to check Genesect. Gyarados can set up on Gastrodon, Dragonite locked into Fire Punch or Waterfall, Metagross, Mew locked into Ice Beam and Flamethrower, Heracross locked into Megahorn or Close Combat and Rotom-H locked into Overheat. Your team also lacks the move Stealth Rock which is absolutely vital for any serious competitive team. Especially seeing as Quiver Dance Volcarona outpseeds your team at +1 while speed tying with Mew. If Dragonite is weakend which is quite likely due to your team having no Rapid Spinner offensive Volcarona can destroy your team with Giga Dran/Fire Blast/Bug Buzz.

    To help your team with Genesect, Volcarona and give you a good supplier of Stealth Rock i suggest Heatran>Rotom-H with a Shed Shell attatched Heatran is still an excellent check to sun teams and provides the team with the invaluable Stealth Rock. Heatran can also stop Genesect and non Hidden Power [Ground] varaints of Volcarona due to Heatran resisting their Bug and Fire-type moves while being able to threaten with his own Fire-type moves. I really don't see why you would neglect this suggestion just because this Heatran set isn't choiced but if you must have a Choice Specs pokemon then you can still use Choice Specs Heatran. However if you are a competitive player then Stealth Rock Heatran is a much better fit.

    Now to help you against Gyarados i suggest Thunderbolt>Flamethrower on Mew. With Dragonite carrying Fire Punch, Heracross's Close Combat and Heatran/Rotom-H you have most Steel-types covered quite well. Thunderbolt lets you hit Gyarados for 4x super effective damage and also gives Mew the famous "boltbeam" coverage. I also think you can afford to run Choice Scarf>Choice Band on Heracross to turn it into an effective late game cleaner. You already have two powerful wall breakers in Dragonite and Metagross so you can weaken physical walls enough that Heracross can plow through them with a Choice Scarf. With a Choice Scarf Heracross can also obtain Moxie boosts easier turning it into a more dangerous sweeper. You said the metagame isn't as fast as it used to be but base 85 speed with no way to boost it just doesn't cut it in OU anymore.

    Good luck with the team i hope i helped!

    Sets
    Show Hide
    Show Hide

    [​IMG]
    Heatran @ Shed Shell | Flash Fire
    Timid | 4 Hp / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Stealth Rock | Fire Blast | Earthpower | Hidden Power [Ice]

    Tl;dr
    Show Hide
    Show Hide


    Heatran--->Rotom-H

    Mew
    .Thunderbolt--->Flamethrower

    Heracross
    .Choice Scarf--->Choice Band



    ~Superpowerdude
  3. Tangelo

    Tangelo

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    143
    @SPD

    Thanks for the rate!

    Whenever I see a Gene that isn't leading, I'll guess it's RP and conserve Rotom. Gastro can also take a hit if necessary and hit with Surf. It's also important to note that Gene can only set up on priority or IB's, Mew's Psychic, or random Hp Grass (the latter 2 are rarely used). For Gyarados, I think you exaggerating the things it sets up on. Metagross' Meteor Mash will still nail it. Hera puts it in kill range for ESpeed. Gastrodon locked into anything but EP still hits it hard. Even after it's set up I can ESpeed and switch around. I've never had problems with Volc, and that moveset is checked by DNite as well as Rotom. Although, I'm cosidering HP Rock on Rotom-H now.

    The biggest issue I have with Heatran is that is lacks the ground immunity. Mamo would do some serious damage. Volt Switch is also nice.

    TBolt > FT is a no because I've caught soo many Genesects turn 1. TBolt > Trick / Psychic will be tested though.

    I've never felt Scarf Hera would be better because Hera does what it's supposed to very well.
  4. EnterRAYZORS

    EnterRAYZORS

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2012
    Messages:
    97
    How do you deal with a sub disable gengar? or torment heatran? because although rare, they are a core and they mean you instantly lose if im not mistaken?
  5. Tangelo

    Tangelo

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    143
    @EnterRAYZORS

    Well I haven't seen the latter but Gengar is dealt with some smart switching and Metagross. Heatran would have me switching in Rotom to Volt Switch the Sub as they Torment or Sub again. If they Tormented, I'll go to Hera, and if they Subbed, I'll go back to Rotom.

    Thanks!
  6. Jimbon

    Jimbon FAKE TRAIN
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2012
    Messages:
    513
    hi tangelo!

    very innovative team you have here, just like some of your other teams you've submitted here, which are always a pleasure to read. it's always nice to see someone having success with something a little different, so good job on that. anyway, onto your team, it seems like with 6 choiced 'mons you will be switching a lot, and you can't always rely on the power from a choice item to break through certain walls. you also have no way of preventing stealth rock, or additional hazards for that matter. forretress / ferrothorn / skarmory can switch in on all of your physical attackers, or even your special attackers locked into the wrong move are used as bait to setup hazards. also mentioning your weakness to rp genesect, rotom-h really isn't that reliable against genesect given that you lose 25% upon switching in, and genesect can break through if it has switched in prior. i think you should change your rotom-h set to a specially defensive set, as it really does patch up a lot of your problems, namely a more reliable answer to rp genesect as well as giving you some extra insurance against sun alongside cb dragonite. i think the spread is 248 hp / 252 sdef / 8 spe or something like that, but you may wanna try willowisp / thunder wave / pain split somewhere on there too to hit common switchins to rotom such as ttar / lati@s while also having some form of recovery. it might slow down your momentum running a more defensive set but i think the ability to check rp gene + dd gyara more reliably is a more worthy tradeoff.

    i also agree with superpowerdude's suggestion of choice scarf heracross over your current choice band set. while choice band is nice for hitting stuff hard, i'm not sure how much sweeping you're doing with 85 base speed and you can't really take advantage of moxie. but yeah, that's all just preference, i think you're really lacking a solid revenge killer somewhere as opposing scarfers can essentially revenge anything on your team while you gotta rely on taking a hit / killing with priority which isn't always reliable. even something like choice scarf jirachi would work well, probably over metagross. namely because you can still switch into lati@s / tornadus-t / alakazam just like metagross could but you can also revenge them while not being locked into bullet punch, while also beating scarf genesect easing your reliance on rotom-h to do so.

    really cool team, luvdisc'd and good luck!
  7. Red3mpti0n

    Red3mpti0n

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2012
    Messages:
    55
    Plain and simple, a full Choice team is easily baited, exploited and predicted around. By no means do you have ANY utility on the team other than Tricking Mew's scarf away. All you can do is mindlessly spam attacks, allowing the most basic stall cores to clean 6-0 you. Normal teams should not exceed two or three Choice item users.

    Your team can most certainly perform well, as you have some decent offensive and defensive synergy, but not nearly as well with six Choice items.
  8. Tangelo

    Tangelo

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    143
    @jimbon

    Thanks for the rate!

    I tried out SpD Rotom-H and I fell in love. It really suits the team and doesn't lose very much momentum. Before it wasn't really doing much damage even with Specs, and now it supports extremely well and takes some stress off Metagross. Thanks for this suggestion!

    Instead of switching to a dedicated revenger I decided to try out Lefties Metagross with SR / MM / Bullet Punch / Pursuit and it's been working alright. Needs a bit more testing but probably gonna switch. Scarf Rachi never worked well for me whenever I used it.

    @Red3mpti0n

    It's basically prediction versus prediction. It just makes it that mistakes cost a lot more for me and my opponent. Regardless, I'll probably cut back a bit from a full choice team and make this a tad more competitive (although it's alright atm).
    -------
    Changes
    -------
    SpD Rotom-H > Specs
    Maybe Lefties Metagross > CB
    -------
    Keep the rates coming guys, and thanks so far!
  9. Electrolyte

    Electrolyte On a short LoA
    is an official Team Rateris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributoris a Battle Server Moderator
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,025
    Hi, you requested my help, so here's my thoughts-

    being a pretty fully choiced team, you've got some weakness to hazards and opposing set up. You really can't do much in the face of bulky set up sweepers like DDGyara or SubCM Jirachi, who resist your coverage moves and can hit half your team super effectively. Lead Deoxys-D also seems painful to deal with; there really isn't much you can do except switch to HeraBOSS and hope that Megahorn hits, as Metagross's Pursuit doesn't do much and can be stalled with Recover and then set up upon. That leaves you with an astonishing weakness to offensive Deo-D, which can OHKO Hera with Psycho Boost, and then just sit there absorbing hits until all 3 layers and SR are set. For this reason, I suggest you run Trick instead of Psychic. Trick lets you get past pesky stall pokemon on your way to sweeping, as well as discouraging any opponents from trying to set up on you. Trick also opens up your Mew in times of need; if you don't need your scarf anymore you can trick it to whoever and just clean with your genesect-like coverage. It also gives your team the momentum it needs to get back on it's feet after taking a huge blow.

    Since Gyarados and water types loom as a threat in general, I suggest you switch Gastrodon's HP Grass for HP Electric. That forms a nice little boltbeam combo for you to use, as well as a way to hit Gyarados hard without risking Rotom-W. Electric also hits many water types just as hard as HP Grass, while also hitting Skarmory hard, which seems annoying due to it's ability to again stack hazards. HP Fire is not needed as Ferrothorn is dealt with easily by the rest of your team.

    Cool team, interesting pokemon! I hope I helped!
  10. Tangelo

    Tangelo

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    143
    Show Hide
    Battle between cap. morgan and Tangy started!

    Tier: Wifi OU
    Mode: Singles
    Variation: +18, -14
    Rule: Rated
    Rule: Sleep Clause
    Rule: Species Clause
    Rule: Wifi Battle

    Your team: Mew / Heracross / Gastrodon / Dragonite / Rotom-H / Metagross
    Opponent's team: Hippowdon / Jirachi / Heatran / Slowbro / Celebi / Tentacruel

    cap. morgan sent out Heatran!
    Tangy sent out Gastrodon!

    Start of turn 1
    cap. morgan called Heatran back!
    cap. morgan sent out Celebi!

    Gastrodon used Ice Beam!
    It's super effective!
    The foe's Celebi lost 53% of its health!

    The foe's Celebi restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

    Start of turn 2
    Tangy called Gastrodon back!
    Tangy sent out Heracross!

    The foe's Celebi used Recover!
    The foe's Celebi regained health!

    Start of turn 3
    cap. morgan called Celebi back!
    cap. morgan sent out Hippowdon!

    the foe's Hippowdon's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm!
    Heracross used Megahorn!
    The foe's Hippowdon lost 52% of its health!

    The sandstorm rages!
    Heracross is buffeted by the sandstorm!
    The foe's Hippowdon restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

    Start of turn 4
    Heracross used Megahorn!
    The foe's Hippowdon lost 53% of its health!
    The foe's Hippowdon fainted!
    Heracross's Attack rose!

    The sandstorm rages!
    Heracross is buffeted by the sandstorm!
    cap. morgan sent out Heatran!

    Start of turn 5
    Tangy called Heracross back!
    Tangy sent out Rotom-H!

    The foe's Heatran used Lava Plume!
    It's not very effective...
    Rotom-H lost 39 HP! (12% of its health)

    The sandstorm rages!
    Rotom-H is buffeted by the sandstorm!
    Rotom-H restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

    Start of turn 6
    cap. morgan called Heatran back!
    cap. morgan sent out Tentacruel!

    Rotom-H used Volt Switch!
    It's super effective!
    The foe's Tentacruel lost 39% of its health!
    Tangy called Rotom-H back!
    Tangy sent out Gastrodon!

    The sandstorm rages!
    The foe's Tentacruel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
    The foe's Tentacruel restored a little HP using its Black Sludge!

    Start of turn 7
    cap. morgan called Tentacruel back!
    cap. morgan sent out Celebi!

    Tangy called Gastrodon back!
    Tangy sent out Heracross!

    The sandstorm rages!
    Heracross is buffeted by the sandstorm!
    The foe's Celebi is buffeted by the sandstorm!
    The foe's Celebi restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

    Start of turn 8
    cap. morgan called Celebi back!
    cap. morgan sent out Heatran!

    Heracross used Close Combat!
    It's super effective!
    A critical hit!
    The foe's Heatran lost 100% of its health!
    The foe's Heatran fainted!
    Heracross's Attack rose!
    Heracross's Defense fell!
    Heracross's Sp. Def. fell!

    The sandstorm rages!
    Heracross is buffeted by the sandstorm!
    cap. morgan sent out Jirachi!

    Start of turn 9
    Heracross used Close Combat!
    The foe's Jirachi lost 100% of its health!
    The foe's Jirachi fainted!
    Heracross's Attack rose!
    Heracross's Defense fell!
    Heracross's Sp. Def. fell!

    The sandstorm rages!
    Heracross is buffeted by the sandstorm!
    cap. morgan forfeited against Tangy!

    The window was disabled due to one of the players closing the battle window.


    A short battle versus stall for Red3mption.
    ------
    @Electrolyte

    Thanks for the rate!

    If I were to run Trick, I'd go back to what I was doing before and use it over TBolt (which I'll probably do; since I switched I haven't used it more than once). Psychic helps versus Tenta, Conk, etc and is just a general move to use when you're not sure what to use. Psychic also hits Gyara for a decent amount of damage (35-42% on standard SubDD, and 37-43% on Offensive DD), enough so that DNite can finish it off with ESpeed. DD / Taunt variants can get tricked the scarf so that's not an issue.

    The problem I have with HP Elec is that if I switch, opposing Gastro become a minor problem. I'll try it, though.
    ------
    Edit
    ------
    Probably gonna switch to a bulkier Metagross from what I've been testing. It's been working pretty well with SR / BP / MM / Pursuit doing its old job and setting up SR. Combination of Pursuit + BP without locking is even better for check-mating Gengar and friends.
  11. Electrolyte

    Electrolyte On a short LoA
    is an official Team Rateris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributoris a Battle Server Moderator
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,025
    Gastrodon isn't really a problem; you can just switch to Mew to take a Toxic and then reflect it back, and if your opponent looks like he'll stay in you can double switch back to your own Gastrodon, take a Scald, boost your SpA, and then 2HKO with Earth Power, while Ice Beam fails to do much back to you.

    As for ditching T-Bolt, that's possible, and something I didn't notice now that Gyara is totally countered by Gastrodon whose HP electric does more than enough for an OHKO.

    EDIT: Keldeo very rarely carries HP Grass, in fact I see no use to it other than to hit Gastro, who is hit hard by Secret Sword anyway. Scarf variants can be beaten by your own Gastro, and Specs can be beaten by Mew. Mew also beats special Lando-T.
  12. Red3mpti0n

    Red3mpti0n

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2012
    Messages:
    55
    I cannot deny you have good prediction abilities, not was I trying to discredit your team. You managed to keep your opponent on the backfoot from turn one and he felt he couldn't risk a prediction of his own. But that could've just as easily been you who had the bad first turn match-up and you'd have a more difficult time regaining/maintaining momentum with your move restrictions, especially against a HO team. It's not like it can't be done, but I just feel that it could be so much more effective with more flexibility.
  13. Tangelo

    Tangelo

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    143
    @Electrolyte

    I hate getting stuck on EP because it's set up for Landorus; HP Grass at least breaks the subs (or hits it hard enough so I can switch to Nite and finish with ESpeed).

    @Red3mpti0n

    In the end it's all opinion and play style. I've ended up cutting a few choice items for some versatility and it's boosted the performance a bit, so yep.
    ------
    Some new issues I've noticed are EBelt / Lefties Keldeo with CM or HP Grass / Surf / Secret Sword / Icy Wind. I just found one on the ladder and it's a pain in the ass to deal with if I've tricked my scarf away.
    ------
    Changes
    ------
    SR Metagross > CB
  14. Tangelo

    Tangelo

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    143

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)