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BH7 Suspect #1: Crystal-Free Z-Moves

Discussion in 'OM Archive' started by E4 Flint, Dec 28, 2016.

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  1. MiyoKa

    MiyoKa

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    [​IMG]

    vote: Ban
    VoltDarkrai likes this.
  2. E4 Flint

    E4 Flint -inactive in BH due corrupt leader-
    is a Pre-Contributor

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2013
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    Some important notes:
    1)
    This is not a possibility as can be seen here when I first suggested this very idea:
    2)
    Congratulations on those who met reqs. Make sure to note that providing an image to your rank is good but you also need to provide proof that it's your alt. Make sure to edit it in by the deadline.
    Some good examples:
    1 2 3
    I would greatly prefer if you use image hosters instead of links that I have to go and then download images of your rank from.
    MiyoKa and VoltDarkrai like this.
  3. shadowblade270

    shadowblade270

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2015
    Messages:
    3
  4. Rumors

    Rumors

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2013
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    852
    Show Hide
    [​IMG]


    Click the image for a bigger version. If you have trouble seeing it, lemme know, I have a full-sized image on my computer but image hosting sites keep downsizing it. If this isn't proof enough, prod me on the site and I'll arrange for a time to get on that alt and whisper you if you want. That or I'll figure out how to make a video of me swapping from Rumors to CFZ Science and back again.

    ...and no, I didn't get reqs with six Arcanines. I wish I did, but... my W/L would probably be closer to 50/50.

    Anyway, I learned a few things during this req requirements.

    1) I'm still pretty bad at playing frail hyper-offense. Deo-A spam just isn't my style. I need my bulky mons.

    2) The meta is so fragile and offensively slanted that Guardian of Alola isn't as potent as I expected. But oh boy, when the right situation/opposing team rears its head, it really friggin' works way too well.

    3) CFZ spam is not as bad as it sounds. You hear cries and think it one shots literally everything. Then you get in game and find you're two-shotting bulky mons instead if they're not weak to it. Or if they're really bulky, screwing them over with the right coverage move or CFZ. Although... it's still utterly ridiculous to CFZ + resisted move 2HKO a wall. I ran my Quick Feet Mega-Ray set, replacing Earth Power with Alola. Nuked an AV-Regen Solgaleo because of it. Probably woulda did the same to complete-Garde, but I had Ice Beam anyway, so meh.

    4) Deo-A spam can counter your counters. I lost mostly because of misplays (because I don't make the greatest choices for frail HO teams), but also choosing the wrong lead, one time I forgot Water Shuriken was priority, and twice because the opponent was full-on anti-Deo-A spam, so had more counters than I had Deo-As. Teams with counters would often take me down 3-4 mons before I took it out and swept their team.

    5) Playing Deo-A spam is boring. I couldn't be bothered to play more than 8ish games a day.

    6) Also reminded me of why I hate laddering. Low ladder is no fun, mid and high ladder don't have enough good players and instead is filled with meta abusers (like myself this time), and worrying about ELO and crap leads to going for boring, unfun strategies in pursuit of winning at all costs rather than trying to have a good match.
  5. HeadsILoseTailsYouWin

    HeadsILoseTailsYouWin

    Joined:
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    If we have to ban specific CFZs, then Guardian of Alola is by far the biggest offender. I still think that we should keep near everything else.
  6. SuperSkylake

    SuperSkylake

    Joined:
    May 6, 2016
    Messages:
    90
    If there's anything this suspect has taught me how to do better, it's gaining an instinct for when your opponent's Deoxys-A is running Genesis Supernova. Because being able to switch in a Dark type and have it fail is just too satisfying and having every non-immune wall take more than 50% is sad.
    Silver_Lucario42 and MaceMaster like this.
  7. ShedMiddleFinga

    ShedMiddleFinga

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2016
    Messages:
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    vote.png
    The 1 f***ing time i lost was to deoxys spam. Kill it dead.
    Vote: Ban
  8. SuperSkylake

    SuperSkylake

    Joined:
    May 6, 2016
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    90
    Got my reqs on my alt, death2cfz
    View attached screen capture. Hopefully it worked.
    Ban CFZ!

    Attached Files:

  9. Scarfnaut

    Scarfnaut

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2014
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    IDK if you're aware or not but the image you took is god-awful and I'm sure not a single person can decipher it. Use puush or Lightshot to take a picture of your rank + ur username instead, it'll be a lot more clear and it's easy to use.
    sin(pi) likes this.
  10. SuperSkylake

    SuperSkylake

    Joined:
    May 6, 2016
    Messages:
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    Thanks for letting me know, i'm blind so I had no way of knowing. I wish there was na alternative way.
  11. ElMustacho

    ElMustacho

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2016
    Messages:
    16
    Proof (open)

    [​IMG]

    Got the COIL. Waiting the 12th.
    I'm In Math Class Bro likes this.
  12. Akashi

    Akashi (cwl)

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2014
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    355
    Ransei, fsk, Eevee General and 2 others like this.
  13. I'm In Math Class Bro

    I'm In Math Class Bro

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2015
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    http://imgur.com/SEOblON
    Sorry if this image doesn't work. Idk why I can't upload on mobile.

    My Thoughts on Z-Moves (open)

    I've observed through this experience that I need a therapist some CFZs are extremely powerful, like Genesis Supernova in conjunction with 10,000,000 Volt Thunderbolt to nuke most tanks in the meta. Other ones, however, like Darkest Lariat and Pulverizing Pancake, have hindering factors that prevent them from being very useful. In a sense, I believe some CFZs should be banned because they are obviously exploitable, but I wonder if some of them are not overpowered.

    Basically, Genesis + 10 million + Coverage + Boosting/Even more coverage can be impossible to stop and make the game come down to whoever has the faster CFZ user. Who wants to use Volt Absorb Yveltal, which is weak to Ice Beam anyway? Maybe you could use Thick Fat Krookodile.

    But who would use Harvest Tyranitar, or Harvest Yveltal, or Gyarados, or Regigigas, or Lopunny (users of Malicious Moonsault and Pulverizing Pancake)? What would they even function as, anyway? They're all either too slow or lack the same Attacking stats to threaten nearly as many things.

    This is one of my first few forum posts, so please don't tear me up if I'm doing something wrong. Also sorry for textwall, idk why so much is on my mind.


    Wow, how did you get reqs with Deoxys-Speed?
    aki0s likes this.
  14. Piccolo Daimao

    Piccolo Daimao
    is a Pre-Contributor

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    [​IMG]
    shoutout to uc and mamp for the teams, i used both of them at least 5 times on this alt
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2017
    Brawl MK, baconbagon, wishes and 12 others like this.
  15. Eevee General

    Eevee General King of the Universe
    is a Battle Server Administratoris a Forum Moderatoris a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
    Moderator

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    That is so fake look at that five it's all like 1511.

    Nice try.
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2017
  16. Piccolo Daimao

    Piccolo Daimao
    is a Pre-Contributor

    Joined:
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    Hey sorry my computer's fonts are messed up
    Anyways luckily for you, I played a couple more games and my elo fell out of the 1500s so now there's no more suspicious 5
    [​IMG]
    Happy now???????????????

    edit: Here are a couple more alts for good measure:
    [​IMG]
    (bad screenshot but the account is fore encorcer)
    [​IMG]
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2017 at 5:01 AM
  17. Awecyne

    Awecyne

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    Well, just got the reqs, I'd like to vote on this one :D
    Don't pay attention to the name, it's an alt I made this afternoon (and managed to forget the CFZ)

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    TheAzumaKiller and VoltDarkrai like this.
  18. VoltDarkrai

    VoltDarkrai

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    You're fine, congratulations on reqs.
    Awecyne and draegn like this.
  19. Mark_K

    Mark_K

    Joined:
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    [​IMG]

    Will definitely vote DONT BAN
    I don't think they are anywhere close to overpowered, and if they are as strong as people think, there is counterplay.
    Alongside that it comes with some downsides, wastes a move slot and wastes an item if you want to use it twice. Imposter Chanseys and Blisseys can usually tank them and also use them.
  20. Zukrad

    Zukrad

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2015
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    [​IMG]

    Even tho I'm boting ban... deep in my heart, I want to abuse them just because is so much fun to do so
  21. Filia

    Filia

    Joined:
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    [​IMG]

    Vote not ban

    I don't think those moves are the problem right now. They can be tanked with some predictions and appropriate mons.
    Heisenerg likes this.
  22. Betathunder

    Betathunder [19:02:01] betathunder: free stabmons

    Joined:
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    finally got it, def not worth it. Shoutout to PinkDragonTamer for giving me his unoriginal team that still was able to go 28-2.
    proof (open)
  23. Puff-Sun

    Puff-Sun

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2017
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    Had to actually make a forum account finally.
    Proof (open)

    Ban these monsters so I can get back to enjoying BH pls
    Team if anyone cares (open)

    Chansey @ Eviolite
    Ability: Imposter
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
    Bold Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Final Gambit
    - Defog
    - Stealth Rock
    - Leech Seed

    Chansey @ Eviolite
    Ability: Imposter
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
    Bold Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Sticky Web
    - Defog
    - Final Gambit
    - Lunar Dance

    Kyurem-Black @ Icicle Plate
    Ability: Refrigerate
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
    Lax Nature
    - Extreme Speed
    - Rapid Spin
    - Fake Out
    - Spectral Thief

    Kyogre-Primal @ Leftovers
    Ability: Water Bubble
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Quiver Dance
    - Water Spout
    - Oblivion Wing
    - Light of Ruin

    Solgaleo @ Darkinium Z
    Ability: Magic Bounce
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
    Impish Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Parting Shot
    - Recover
    - Sunsteel Strike

    Zygarde-Complete @ Toxic Orb
    Ability: Poison Heal
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
    Impish Nature
    - Substitute
    - Thousand Arrows
    - Power Trip
    - Acupressure

    What we learned: Chansey is still busted, especially when it can copy a CFZ spammer, tank a hit, and proceed to kill 3 more things before it has to switch.
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2017
  24. PsychicSweeper

    PsychicSweeper

    Joined:
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    Alt Proof.png COIL proof.png COIL proof.png
    (Note: Wrong Alt, but cant help that now)
    I will be voting ban on CFZ because they take minimal skill to use and can warrant a very high reward
    A lot of people want one per team, but its really just an instant wall breaker or sweeper killer with no real skill to use

    I used kind of a strange team except for 3 matches where i used deo-a spam (Sry Everyone)

    Evanescence (Pheromosa) @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Skill Link
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Icicle Spear
    - Pin Missile
    - Arm Thrust
    - Beat Up

    Rachel (Furret) @ Safety Goggles
    Ability: Prankster
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
    Calm Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Spore
    - Defog
    - Stealth Rock
    - Destiny Bond

    Senor Fluffles (Zygarde-Complete) @ Iapapa Berry
    Ability: Unaware
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
    Lax Nature
    - Heart Swap
    - Core Enforcer
    - Thousand Arrows
    - Defog

    ?sychicSwee?er (Mewtwo-Mega-Y) @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Queenly Majesty
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Shell Smash
    - Moongeist Beam
    - Secret Sword
    - Stored Power

    Regi Giygas (Regigigas) @ Toxic Orb
    Ability: Poison Heal
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Shift Gear
    - Facade
    - Spectral Thief
    - Sunsteel Strike

    Splashy Splashy (Groudon-Primal) @ Water Memory
    Ability: Stakeout
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpA
    Naughty Nature
    - Multi-Attack
    - Thousand Arrows
    - Leaf Blade
    - Ice Hammer
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2017 at 12:08 AM
    The Ruins of Alpha likes this.
  25. MamoJustWins

    MamoJustWins

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    FullSizeRender.jpg
    So, the above are my reqs for the suspect test, and on the subject of CFZs, I vote ban. Why? Because playing 5 Deoxys-attack and a Chansey that just use the same moves every single time is A) Literally 0 fun to play with and against, B) Requires no skill to play on the part of the person using that team, and C) Needs to be VERY specifically counterteamed if one wants any chance of winning, and even then, one must play to utter perfection and win several 50/50s to win. Shoutout to MaceMaster and PDT, I used their teams to get the reqs to vote on this!
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2017
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