Black & White Battle Subway Records (now with gen. 4 records!)

Super Double Subway Streak: 143

I've gone n got myself a new high record and my personal best :)

This is using the team i was asking questions about few days back and i've been playing none stop with it last few days. At first i didnt think it would work due to some low streaks but in the end my luck came through and i got used to the team and ploughed on.

So onto the team:

Leads:

politoad@ Focus sash
Timid
252SPA/252SP
Hydro pump
Surf
Ice Beam
Toxic

what a great little lead, chosen due to only really lead for a rain team lol. its way bulkier than i would have thought and have to admit i like him now haa! The move set is simple, HP for amazing stab, surf to double hit and activate absolb bulb, ice beam for dragons and toxic is just for when i cant take something down quickly so the passive damage helps, also good for stat abusers specially CM or any other SPD boosting moves.

Lead 2:
Manectric @ Choice Scarf
Timid
252SPA/252SP
Thunder
Volt Switch
Flamethrower
Signal Beam

A great abuser of drizzle 100% acc stabed thunders coming off a base 105 special attack?? yes please! Again its simple, i went for the scarf cause wanted something quick from the start and he out speeds all the standard subway pokes. He is amazing due to he can take the electric attacks aimed at toad and toad can OHKO most ground types stopping manectric. The moves again are basic, the only moves i use are Thunder and VS when needed, flamethrower has a few uses but doesnt hit hard enough and SB was only used once i think but that was to take out a exeggutor before it could get TR in. I'm going to try this team again soon and this is main moveset i'm looking at improving, was thinking about HP Ice or Fight, or maybe switcheroo any ideas?

The Back up:

Ludicolo @ Absorb Bulb
Timid
252SPA/252SP
Hydro Pump
Giga Drain
Fake out
Focus Blast (should i replace with ice beam?)

This poke is just amazing, loved him since the Mayors one on the GC lol, and glad i finally got around to using one :). Once again its standard so wont go into detail. I chose GD due to liked fact it regained health and since none my team are bulky or have any means of recovery its the only way :), also best way to handle lanturn. Fake out is important due to lets me take out a threat and let toad use surf to activate my bulb, ludi also switches in when manectric VS out and takes the earthquakes and toads surfs. Once got the +1 its amazing!

and in truth most the battles only involved these 3, the amount teams the front two swept was unreal, Its so fun getting free stat boosts in doubles and wiping the floor with them lol. so my fourth poke is the cleaner-up-a lol, and it is obviously....

Scizor @ Metal Coat
Jolly
Bullet Punch
Swords Dance
Bug Bite
Super Power

Again its standard, i really didnt wana use scizor cause hes on most my teams and bored using him but he does the job so cant really complain. When i go again i'm going to replace swords dance due to was never used so guna look into a new move there, likely be AA or Night slash, possibly roost due to fact coulda used that match i lost lol.

So how the team lost...going from memory due to it was early this morning it happend (need to learn to be calm and patiant when lost and save vid ha)

toad and man vs frozel and Vileplume

Frozel Waterfalls man CH and man faints
Toad Ice beams Vile for less than i thought but decent amount
Vileplume absorbs light

i switch in ludicolo

Frozel Protects and i GD him
Toad Toxic vile (miss click :@)
Toad KO'd by Solar beam

I switch Scizor in

Frozel Protects and i once agian GD him
Vile uses some posion attack and KOs Ludicolo
Scizor Swords dances

Scizor BP Frozel
Frozel Waterfalls leaves me with around low red HP
Vile finishes me off with stored power

was fustrating! tiny bit haxy and a bad match by me :(, Why i shouldnt overplay the game and get tired lol. It was such a winnable match aswell. If i got my thunder off i would have won and if he didnt get lucky with the double protect i would have likely won. My miss click also cost me :( o well it was a fun run which brought me my personal best this year and really like the team so looking for improvements and defo guna try it again soon ( duno when tho due to arkham city and football manager out this month whoop whoop)

Cheers for reading people :)
 
Super Double Subway Streak: 143
Lead 2:
Manectric @ Choice Scarf
Timid
252SPA/252SP
Thunder
Volt Switch
Flamethrower
Signal Beam

A great abuser of drizzle 100% acc stabed thunders coming off a base 105 special attack?? yes please! Again its simple, i went for the scarf cause wanted something quick from the start and he out speeds all the standard subway pokes. He is amazing due to he can take the electric attacks aimed at toad and toad can OHKO most ground types stopping manectric. The moves again are basic, the only moves i use are Thunder and VS when needed, flamethrower has a few uses but doesnt hit hard enough and SB was only used once i think but that was to take out a exeggutor before it could get TR in. I'm going to try this team again soon and this is main moveset i'm looking at improving, was thinking about HP Ice or Fight, or maybe switcheroo any ideas?
Something I'd recommend, having used Manectric in competitive battling before, is to give Overheat a try - 140 BP is going to hit a LOT harder than Flamethrower. Sure the Sp Att drop sucks, but if you're using it as a one-off moves it's great. Try it!

The set I used was this:

Manectric @ Choice Scarf
Modest, Lightningrod
252 SpA, 252 Spe, 4 HP (Max speed is probs unnecessary, but whatever)
Thunder
Overheat
HP Ice
Switcheroo

I use this competitively, so this happens to fit in its own niche in my team. Enjoy!
 
Thats an interesting idea, i think i looked into it at first planning stage but didnt like the stat drop (back then he wasnt scarfed so was a problem lol) i was going to drop the fire move all together but wil look back into it, cheers for the reminder lol. switcheroo is interesting me but think it would ruin my style of play tad to much, yet would be good vs blissy and co. Hmmm think i might try HP ice and overheat, doesnt make much difference tho due to thunder used 99.9% the time lol. Depends how much damage it does in the rain to grass/steel/ice types i guess.
 
Finally got to 49 wins
. I just randomly threw together this team again, and it's worked well so far. I'll go more in detail after the streak is over, which hopefully wont be for a long time.

EDIT:
Just lost on Battle 58 to a Veteran with Jolteon, Slaking, and Weavile to a slight, but defensible (IMO) misplay. My Darmanitan OHKO'd the Jolteon, and then took a chunk out of Slaking, before dying to a Gunk Shot. I sent in my Cloyster and Shell Smashed while Slaking loafed. I probably should have attacked next, but since I was facing a Veteran, I wanted to make sure that I had the power to KO an Legendary Pokemon if one came up. I Shell Smashed two more times, with Cloyster taking a Gunk Shot in between. I killed the Slaking the next turn and had a Cloyster with 1 HP and +6 in Atk and Speed and a Latios with full health left. The Veteran sends out a Weavile, and I know it's basically over. It kills my Cloyster with Fake Out and I send out my Latios. It literally taunts me by using Taunt, while I use Dragon Pulse to put it in the red. I get killed next turn my Ice Punch.

I most likely would have won if I attacked the Slaking after Shell Smashing once, but I guess you live and you learn. Of course the Subway had to send out a perfect counter to my two remaining Pokemon though. Still happy for my first fairly long streak. Going to definitely use this team again, as the battles go very fast.

There really isn't much strategy involved with my team. If I think I can kill the Pokemon with Darmanitan, I will. If I can't, I switch out to Latios. I only switch in Cloyster if it's a clean switch in so I can keep my Focus Sash intact. I think I might switch out Surf for Grass Knot or Energy Ball. Anybody have tips/comments/etc.?

Darmanitan @Choice Scarf
Adamant
EVs - 6 HP/252 Atk/252 Speed
Flare Blitz
Superpower
Rock Slide
U-turn

Latios @Life Orb
Timid
EVs - 6 HP/252 SpAtk/252 Speed
Psyshock
Dragon Pulse
Surf
Thunderbolt

Cloyster @Focus Sash
Adamant
EVs - 6 HP/252 Atk/252 Speed
Icicle Spear
Rock Blast
Razor Shell
Shell Smash
 
Guess thats to me lol, yeah your right cant believe i forgot protect lol, so when i try again will try protect :) due to scizors coverage moves dont offer much, might add leftovers to him then but would prob miss the slight power boost. Cheers guys :)
 

atsync

Where the "intelligence" of TRAINERS is put to the test!
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Isn't having a fire move on a rain team kinda silly anyway? I don't do damage calcs for my teams (lazy), but it might be worth doing some for overheat and flamethrower to see whether it does enough damage to important opponents to justify using it. If it is underwhelming, hp ice seems like the next best choice (not many other options anyway unless you want to use physical moves for some reason). Actually, you could also try using protect so you can use surf without having to switch out (you have absorb bulb ludicolo though so it might not be necessary unless there is some opponent out that you don't want to switch ludicolo into for some reason).

Also, are you using Lightningrod? You said that Manectric 'takes the electric attacks aimed at Politoed" so I assume you are. If not, you should be!

Politoed and Manectric seems like a cool lead duo for a rain team. Good job.

@hockeyguy605: Good to see you had some success. I know how awesome lead scarf Darmanitan is. I do think that Cloyster is a strange choice for a backup though. As you said yourself, you can't really switch it in on direct attacks as they break the sash. This means that if you need to switch out Darmanitan and you predict an attack, Latios is your only choice, which may not be a good thing if it can't beat the opponent.
 
Isn't having a fire move on a rain team kinda silly anyway? I don't do damage calcs for my teams (lazy), but it might be worth doing some for overheat and flamethrower to see whether it does enough damage to important opponents to justify using it. If it is underwhelming, hp ice seems like the next best choice (not many other options anyway unless you want to use physical moves for some reason). Actually, you could also try using protect so you can use surf without having to switch out (you have absorb bulb ludicolo though so it might not be necessary unless there is some opponent out that you don't want to switch ludicolo into for some reason).

Also, are you using Lightningrod? You said that Manectric 'takes the electric attacks aimed at Politoed" so I assume you are. If not, you should be!

Politoed and Manectric seems like a cool lead duo for a rain team. Good job.

@hockeyguy605: Good to see you had some success. I know how awesome lead scarf Darmanitan is. I do think that Cloyster is a strange choice for a backup though. As you said yourself, you can't really switch it in on direct attacks as they break the sash. This means that if you need to switch out Darmanitan and you predict an attack, Latios is your only choice, which may not be a good thing if it can't beat the opponent.
I guess you're right about Cloyster, but like I said, I just threw the team together randomly.

Do you have any ideas for the last team member? I kinda want something that can boost its stats to take on Bulky Pokemon of need be.
 

atsync

Where the "intelligence" of TRAINERS is put to the test!
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It may be less silly than you think. Fire attacks come in handy against Ferrothorn (who is still 2x weak to Fire under the Rain), and for Hail teams, both of which can be problematic to a Rain team.
Well I guess it is useful for those cases, especially since Manectric doesn't have many options to pick from. I wouldn't call it absolutely essential for Manectric to carry a fire move since the team at least has Scizor to deal with those threats (and even with Flamethrower, Hail teams are probably going to have the opportunity to do nasty things to you anyway), but having said that I suppose it wouldn't hurt to have Flamethrower as insurance (hax sux) and Flamethrower could probably deal with Hail teams that lead with Abomasnow nicely.

EDIT:

I guess you're right about Cloyster, but like I said, I just threw the team together randomly.

Do you have any ideas for the last team member? I kinda want something that can boost its stats to take on Bulky Pokemon of need be.
My team used Rotom-W instead of Cloyster. It worked ok, but I was very weak to dragons even with Latios (it can't switch in to dragon moves). If you want a booster that can take on other bulky booster, you could try Suicune if you can get one. navy823 used that and got to 105 wins (it's on the list).
 
My team used Rotom-W instead of Cloyster. It worked ok, but I was very weak to dragons even with Latios (it can't switch in to dragon moves). If you want a booster that can take on other bulky booster, you could try Suicune if you can get one. navy823 used that and got to 105 wins (it's on the list).
What about Scizor? It's bulky and resists Dragon type moves.
 

atsync

Where the "intelligence" of TRAINERS is put to the test!
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What about Scizor? It's bulky and resists Dragon type moves.
Just try it out and see how it works out. Sorry I can't be anymore helpful than that, but the best way to see if things work is to actually try them. If it doesn't work, then you can determine what it is about your team that isn't working and make adjustments.
 
Isn't having a fire move on a rain team kinda silly anyway? I don't do damage calcs for my teams (lazy), but it might be worth doing some for overheat and flamethrower to see whether it does enough damage to important opponents to justify using it. If it is underwhelming, hp ice seems like the next best choice (not many other options anyway unless you want to use physical moves for some reason). Actually, you could also try using protect so you can use surf without having to switch out (you have absorb bulb ludicolo though so it might not be necessary unless there is some opponent out that you don't want to switch ludicolo into for some reason).

Also, are you using Lightningrod? You said that Manectric 'takes the electric attacks aimed at Politoed" so I assume you are. If not, you should be!

Politoed and Manectric seems like a cool lead duo for a rain team. Good job.QUOTE]

Cheers yh i'm obviously using lightning rod lol, cant wait to try out zapdos in its place tho :). Problem with protect is manectric is scarfed so would be pointless yet ideal in truth a HP miss against a ground type can ruin manectric lol, and when ever i feel the need to go for a surf i just VS out. 9/10 tho i just went for the thunder n Hydro pump and its normally enough. Flamethrower there isnt pointless per say, i used it a couple times because if i loose the weather war its a decent move to fall back on, specially when you concider only way to remove rain is by sun/hail sand so gota 1/3 chance to have a boosted fire attack lol, and if suns up there a 50/50 chance i'm up against a grass team where fire move would be usefull lol. But like i said it was hardly used i basicly used thunder 95% battles due to fact it hits like a truck and haxy with para and cant miss. (nothing like nailing froslass first and second time mwhaaaaa) So flamethrower is just a decent coverage move, I thought signal beam would be more usefull for nailing grass types which resist electric but it was disapointing really, so will be swapping that for HP Ice hoping it does more damage lol

After some more thinking (no more playing as yet) on scizor do you recon rain dance could be worthwhile in the place of swords dance? He can switch in on aboma and ttar with easy and set it off. and saves me the double switch of getting toad back in. unsure.

cheers guys :)
 

atsync

Where the "intelligence" of TRAINERS is put to the test!
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Fair enough about Flamethrower.

If your looking to replace Signal Beam with Hidden Power, keep in mind that Politoed already has Ice Beam so you could possibly justify using a different type other than HP Ice (not that HP Ice is a bad choice though as it does get good coverage with your other moves and having a fast ice attack could be useful).

As for Rain Dance, I'd say try it out. As you said, you're mostly using Hydro Pump so Protect becomes less useful in that sense. Plus it can't hurt to have a back up weather starter if Politoed dies. I personally prefer Protect though as it has more use overall besides protecting you from Politoed's Surfs (such as blocking attacks that are obviously aimed at Scizor, which can be a godsend).
 
"You think Tyranitar, HaxChomp, and Starmie is great until..." Lol, one of my previous teams. Try bulky Scizor, he laughs (+6 & full HP) at every single Ice type besides Mamo. *look at movesets* Ttar counters Weaviles in Subway but you can lose him early because he's a lead...
Unfortunately Starmie is less useful than she was in IV Gen - there are too many Sashers and Sturdy users. Maybe Lati as they're bulkier?

SD Garchomp is such a bitch :|
I switched out Staraptor to Scizor, thinking he'll use Dragon/Rock move but he SD'd. Bug Bite deals less then half while he... SDs again. ohko with EQ. Scarfchomp revanges, and there comes Togekiss 4... I revanged with Staraptor and... guess who? Yay, Eelektross. Maybe I could avoid it if I checked trainer and movepools but I was playing in the bus.
This team wrecks legendaries but loses to some stupid stuff

hockeyguy605, Scizor is great, bulky set sets up on half of Subway. You just need Fire resist. Fighting, Water and Ground resists might be useful because STAB CCs, Pumps and EQs can 2hko
 
Anyone know any good bulky physical sweepers? They can be slow, since I'm abusing Blaziken's Speed Boost, and crippling pokemon with Whimsicott.

EDIT: Right now I'm using Blaziken to +2~6 Attack, as well as speed until he can BP to Garchomp. Garchomp doesn't survive as many hits as I'd like him to, though.
 

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It's Lunatic Time
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After some more thinking (no more playing as yet) on scizor do you recon rain dance could be worthwhile in the place of swords dance? He can switch in on aboma and ttar with easy and set it off. and saves me the double switch of getting toad back in. unsure.
A switch then Rain Dance, and 2 Switches would take up two turns either way. The only difference would be who is out on the field at the time. Noting how Scizor is pretty effective against Ice Types and Tyranitar, it's probably better to not have Scizor waste a turn to rain dance, and instead switch your other Pokemon back out for Politoed when its convenient. However, it does mean that you can still change the weather back if Politoed goes down.

But, it's not too hard to find the time to swap Politoed out, then back in again. And Protect is helpful in allowing usage of Surf, and lasting out Trick Rooms. So in the end I would stick with Protect.
 
A switch then Rain Dance, and 2 Switches would take up two turns either way. The only difference would be who is out on the field at the time. Noting how Scizor is pretty effective against Ice Types and Tyranitar, it's probably better to not have Scizor waste a turn to rain dance, and instead switch your other Pokemon back out for Politoed when its convenient. However, it does mean that you can still change the weather back if Politoed goes down.

But, it's not too hard to find the time to swap Politoed out, then back in again. And Protect is helpful in allowing usage of Surf, and lasting out Trick Rooms. So in the end I would stick with Protect.
Yeah i see what your saying was just a thought lol, i no how good protect can be all my teams on double record list abused it lol. So think protect it shall be :) cheers
 
Hey Smogon, been lurking for a while and decided to sign up to post a team I've had some moderate success with. Hoping to get a little insight on some things I can improve upon.

Here's the team:

Dragonite @Lum Berry
Adamant
Multiscale
252HP / 44 Atk / 212 Speed
~Dragon Dance
~Roost
~Fire Punch
~Outrage

Standard set but works incredibly well. Multiscale + Lum Berry guarantees a DD without being crippled. He's really a monster in the subway and can usually 3-0 teams.

Heatran @Choice Scarf
Modest
Flash Fire
252SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Speed
~Earth Power
~Flamethrower
~Dragon Pulse
~Hidden Power Ice

Another fairly straightforward set. I opted for scarf over air ballon or life orb as I was running up against the likes of Lucario/Infernape/Blaziken whom I can KO with earth power but were outspeeding me to KO with their fighting move of choice.

Suicune @ Leftovers
Bold
Pressure
252HP / 252Def / 4SpDef
~Scald
~Ice Beam
~Rest
~Calm Mind

Maximum Defense build here. Usually I can get 3-4 Calm Minds in before I rest. Sometimes I will go for the scald burn right away if I feel the opponent is a threat.

Strategy: Pretty simple strategy - I lead with Nite, if the matchup is favorable I stay in and Dance. If I'm statused or the opponent puts a significant dent in me through multiscale I will outrage right away. If I think I can Dance again I do it and roost away any moderate damage. If a bulky water leads I go straight to suicune who will boost to +6 and rest. At +6 not much can stop him. If Suicune can't get away with boosting and the next matchup is poor I go to Heatran when the matchup dictates.

.
Currently up to 108 with this team, will post a pic when the streak ends. Made a few changes:

1) Swapped Hidden Power Ice on Heatran to Overheat. Sometimes I opt for the extra power over Flamethrower. It's worked out well.
2) Swapped Ice Beam with Substitute on Suicune

The biggest changes though have been in my play as I've gotten very comfortable with the team. I've started to switch alot more liberally, early in the match to try to gain the an early 3-2 edge. Heatran provides so many important resists I have no problem going to him early to get a kill rather than use him to revenge.

Blissey and bulky waters give this team some problems, but Suicune is such a monster he can just pressure stall them while subbing, calm minding, and resting off any residual damage. Starmie also poses a threat but a calm mind boost weakens the Thunderbolt damage a ton on Suicune.
 
Was wondering if I could get some help with the team I am using. I got up to 41 streak with this team, and lost due to hax/crit

Metagross @ Shell Bell
Adamant
Clear Body
4HP/252Att/252Spe
- Hone Claws
- Earthquake
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt

I know this Metagross doesn't run the nromal priority BP, but I like running Zen Headbutt as it allows me to hit Ghost and Fighting for SE. If its not a fire type or EQ user first turn I will HC and than proceed to MM until I win or Meta faints

Charizard @ Choice Specs
Modest
Blaze
4Att/252SpA/252Spe
- Flamethrower
- Focus Blast
- Rock Slide
- Air Slash

Charizard is my second offensive choice. The move set is something I'm a little doubtful about, but it gives him good coverage which lets him work as a good revenge killer.

Vaporean @ Leftovers
Careful
Water Absorb
252HP/4Def/252SpD
- Ice Beam
- Scald
- Aqua Ring
- Protect

Since Vapo comes in normally for someone who kills my Metagross, so normally a fire or ground/rock type. I set up with AR, than proceed to kill. If they send in something that can kill Vapo I normally bring in my Charizard.

I know I have a real weakness to electric types with this team.
 

atsync

Where the "intelligence" of TRAINERS is put to the test!
is a Pokemon Researcheris a Contributor to Smogon
Rock Slide on Charizard seems a bit weak. You're basically looking at a 75 base power non-STAB attack coming off 94 attack (assuming you have a perfect attack IV).

Unless you need Rock Slide to cover a specific threat, perhaps you should consider replacing it with Hidden Power, Ancientpower or Dragon Pulse.
 
I agree with atsync. Rock Slide is not as useful as HP Rock, I don't think there is anything that it beats HP Rock in for your Charizard's EV Spread. However, you might have to rebreed to get the proper IVs...