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DPP UU Blazefire Saber

Discussion in 'RMT Archive' started by Snunch, Sep 7, 2011.

  1. Snunch

    Snunch
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnuswon the 8th Official Smogon Tournament

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    Hello my name is Snunch and this is my team. I based it on one of if not the most underrated pokemon in UU: Moltres. It has lingered around the top 10 for a while, but I don't really have the motivation to make a push to get #1. This team hasn't lost in recent memory though (except bluewind just haxed the shit out of me UGH so thats not true anymore).

    The team's called Blazefire Saber because pkgaming kept yelling at me to use it. I don't know what it means but I don't want to know because I'll probably regret using it as a team name.

    Read the team building process, I explain a lot about my team in it.

    READ THIS Team Building: (open)
    "Moltres was such a boss in 4th gen UU, what metagame shift has completely eliminated it from the metagame?" I wondered to myself. Suicune is surprisingly rare also, so the only new enemy I could see is an improved Chansey. Thankfully, Moltres gets U-Turn, so I devised a team formula to exploit Chansey and leave it helpless.

    [​IMG] + Hazards + Ghost + Spinner + Secondary Chansey check + Bulky water check

    The ghost was easiest for me to decide on. Mismagius and Golurk both work as potential U-Turn targets, but Mismagius doesn't abuse hazards nearly as well as Golurk does.

    [​IMG] + Hazards + [​IMG] + Spinner + Secondary Chansey check + Bulky water check

    Now I needed something I could switch into Chansey, even if it didn't come in via U-turn. Essentially it needed to take status well and handle Chansey. Heracross was the obvious choice.

    [​IMG] + Hazards + [​IMG] + Spinner + [​IMG] + Bulky water check

    Moltres is dead if I can't keep rocks off the field. When I made this team, there were only two spinners actually used in UU: Hitmontop and Donphan. The Froslass boom had not happened yet, but after abusing a hail team, I knew it would happen soon. I chose Blastoise as my spinner to keep ahead of the metagame and pre-emptively laugh at Froslass.

    [​IMG] + Hazards + [​IMG] + [​IMG] + [​IMG] + Bulky water check

    I had two choices of what I could do with the last two slots. I could fill them in with Roserade and a stealth rock user, which would create a pretty balanced team, or I could put both spikes and stealth rock on the same pokemon and use the bulky water check as a sweeper. This would make my team much more offensive, and I decided that offensive suited Moltres' natural playstyle more than balance. Deoxys-D was the obvious choice for a hazard user, getting both hazards up against nearly every team.

    [​IMG] + [​IMG] + [​IMG] + [​IMG] + [​IMG] + Bulky water check

    I knew that my bulky water check didn't need to take any scalds switching in. Assuming they came in on Moltres' fire blast or Golurk's substitute, they would have to heal off residual damage on the switch instead of attacking. Once I realized that, I knew Raikou would be the perfect fit for my team.

    [​IMG] + [​IMG] + [​IMG] + [​IMG] + [​IMG] + [​IMG]



    At a Glance:
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    [​IMG]
    Deoxys-D @ Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Spikes
    - Taunt
    - Night Shade

    Hazard machine, that's really all there is to this Deoxys-D. I usually send it out in the beginning of the match, close if not on turn 1. Max speed lets it taunt a bunch of useful stuff like other Deoxys-D and most taunt Mew. Deoxys-D's amazing natural bulk means I get to set up hazards in the face of pokemon who think they can force me out, like pursuit Houndoom. I really don't have the words to communicate how vital hazards are to this team. With two layers, Moltres laughs at Chansey and Milotic, Zapdos is unable to wall Golurk and Heracross, and Raikou gets a bunch of key KOs with +1 HP Ice. Without hazards, a lot of the time it feels like I'm treading water. I'm not using Recover because I rarely if ever actually need it. I don't rely on Deoxys-D to check or counter anything at all, so letting it die in exchange for multiple layers is always a good deal. I obviously try to keep it alive if I feel like their spinner is threatening, but most of the time I can play around spinners so no big loss if Deoxys-D goes down. Night Shade does consistent damage and hurts stuff like sub Mismagius and Froslass, which is more important than hitting Chansey and Snorlax. The best way I can describe this set is the suicide lead for the BW era.

    [​IMG]
    Moltres @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Fire Blast
    - Air Slash
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - U-turn

    Here it is, the boss itself. Moltres wrecks UU, plain and simple. Fire Blast will kill you if you don't resist it and your name isn't Chansey, and Air Slash will kill you if you think your Milotic or Blastoise can counter Moltres after hazards. The best part is that Moltres commonly comes in on grass and bug types, which means I can use either Fire Blast or Air Slash with no risk at all! If your name is Chansey (or Snorlax I guess), I can simply click U-Turn and send out Golurk or Heracross to force you out. With two layers up, Chansey will be at 50% next time it switches in. Two fire blasts will always kill a 50% Chansey, which means that Chansey can't even counter this more than once. If you think I'm making it sound too easy to destroy teams with Moltres, you're wrong. It is that easy. Good bulk, impressive resistances, and nice speed let Moltres come in a lot and deal damage to everything. The only caveat is Stealth Rock. I never switch Moltres into rocks unless I'm particularly absent-minded. Thankfully, since Rotom is rare in UU, Blastoise can spin vs every ghost in the tier. No rocks == no way to stop Moltres.

    [​IMG]
    Golurk @ Leftovers
    Trait: Iron Fist
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Substitute
    - Focus Punch
    - Shadow Punch
    - Earthquake

    Every team that uses Golurk gets cool points. Its a ghost robot that can fly. How awesome is that? Oh, and it also is faster than Chansey and with the iron fist boost can pose a threat to stall and offense with Focus Punch and perfect neutral coverage, but you already know that. I U-turn from Moltres into Golurk, forcing Chansey to take a bunch of hazard damage and hitting something with a focus punch (most of the time I'll just focus punch the switch so that Chansey can't heal and switch out). Other than that, Golurk serves as a nice switch into rock attacks and is technically my spinblocker. When I say "technically", it's because I just outright kill most spinners before they get a chance. Donphan and Hitmontop really can't threaten much if anything on my team. Donphan checks Raikou, but will never actually rapid spin if Raikou is at +1. Blastoise is dealt with pretty well by Moltres, who lures it in and 2HKOs with Air Slash. When I do switch in Golurk to block spin, I almost always just let it die if the spinner poses a threat to Golurk. You read about it with Deoxys-D, and the same is true here: keeping hazards up is worth it.

    [​IMG]
    Heracross (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Guts
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Close Combat
    - Megahorn
    - Stone Edge
    - Pursuit

    Scarfcross is a UU terror. Not good enough to be broken, but good enough that if I gameplan right, and my wallbreakers do what they do, I can sweep late-game with a STAB attack consistently. I personally make sure every one of my teams has a Heracross counter, but this is definitely not true for all of the ladder. Many people carry a bug resist that is neutral to fighting, or a fighting resist that is weak to bug. Heracross preys on these teams. It is very easy to, for example, come in on a resttalk snorlax and megahorn the incoming Mew. When choosing a scarfer, I usually have to decide between Flygon and Heracross. Here, I chose Heracross because threatening Chansey is too important for this team. Jolly to outspeed other Hera's, lots of Rotom-A, and most +1 Kingdra.

    [​IMG]
    Blastoise (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Scald
    - Roar
    - Rapid Spin
    - Ice Beam

    Blastoise is such a good pokemon right now. With more physical bulk than Milotic, Blastoise shrugs off many physical attackers with ease. Every common ghost in UU is defeated one-on-one by simply scalding it, which is why I don't run Foresight. Blastoise laughs in the face of Froslass, forcing it out and spinning away its spikes, regardless of snow cloak (until Froslass starts using tbolt…). Blastoise shrugs off scarfed V-Creates from Victini like it's nothing, meaning I have a hard counter to the most common scarfer faster than Heracross. Blastoise also makes a very good switch into most Rock types, so sandstorm teams have a hard time relying on the boosted special defense of rock types to defend themselves from Moltres. It's guaranteed spin compared to the pressure my team puts on opposing spinners means I'm winning the hazard war every time.

    [​IMG]
    Raikou @ Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 128 HP / 76 Def / 52 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Calm Mind
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    Another 4th gen star that was left in the dust. Raikou has a hard time switching in to most of the pokemon it's supposed to set up on, especially with the advent of Scald, but my strategy of forcing bulky waters to recover instead of attack means that Raikou gets free switches more often than not. While I wish it were a little stronger sometimes, Raikou is still a literal beast. I chose Sub CM because I knew I didn't want to run Rash in case I had to switch into a scald, and substitute is simply a better move than Shadow Ball or whatever else I would use. There are a bunch of random ground types in UU that can take a +1 HP Ice pretty well, but they for the most part take spikes damage, letting me get the best of them with enough switches. Substitute helps me avoid status, and because it is relatively uncommon, it always works once. This gives me the extra edge needed to take down a Deoxys-D or something similar. With the EVs, Flygon will never break Raikou's sub with U-turn.


    My name is Snunch and that was my team. If you haven't, read the team building process. I explain a lot about how the pokes work together there.

    Importable (open)
    Moltres @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Fire Blast
    - Air Slash
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - U-turn

    Raikou @ Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 128 HP / 76 Def / 52 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Calm Mind
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    Heracross (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Guts
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Close Combat
    - Megahorn
    - Stone Edge
    - Pursuit

    Blastoise (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Scald
    - Roar
    - Rapid Spin
    - Ice Beam

    Golurk @ Leftovers
    Trait: Iron Fist
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Substitute
    - Focus Punch
    - Shadow Punch
    - Earthquake

    Deoxys-D @ Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Spikes
    - Taunt
    - Night Shade
  2. Bluewind

    Bluewind My appearance, ability, and awesomeness strike fea
    is a Contributor Alumnus

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    Hello negres,

    Ever since we played I've always had the feeling having Specs on Moltres makes it much easier to be cirvumvented. I wonder if you really need all that power with Spikes support backing you up, and think you should try Life Orb Instead (with Roost over U-turn, naturally). That would make you less prone to setups (a Raikou with some timing coming in on Moltres once it's locked in anything but Fire Blast can do a number to this team). Not much more than this to be honest, I just really find Specs Moltres a rather meh sweeper. Good luck (BAN ME PLEASE), nice team.
  3. badabing

    badabing hevy hangs da hood,,

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    800
    Idk U-turn seems to be a crucial part of the strategy so if you do switch to LO and forgo a move for Roost (I think the set is fine as is tbh), I 'd probably ditch HP Grass instead and just U-turn out of the stuff you lose coverage on, racking up spikes.

    You should try Ice Beam on Golurk. It makes a p. sexy lure for Gligar, paving the way for Hera to sweep. Prolly over EQ...

    ty for posting a cool UU team it brightened my day. stars
  4. Snunch

    Snunch
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnuswon the 8th Official Smogon Tournament

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    LO vs Specs Moltres: I'll test LO. From experience using it on another team, it's still a boss. I have noticed a decrease in Chansey usage (probably in response to hail), so u-turn might not be as important.

    I'll get back to you on ice beam when I actually see a Gligar.
  5. Snunch

    Snunch
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnuswon the 8th Official Smogon Tournament

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  6. Shiki1335

    Shiki1335

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2011
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    Have u tried a physically offensive Blastoise?

    Blastoise (M) @ Red Card/leftovers (red card is on my team because its soo much fun to run.) Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Brick Break (I personally hate registeel or dual screens.)

    - Aqua Jet (torrent range plus prio.)

    - Rapid Spin (duh.)

    - Rock Slide (kill for offensive zapdos)
  7. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Winner

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    Thats a good team name, i didn't know you that creative.

    Corny jokes aside, I really, really enjoy this team. It uses the best Deoxys-D set known to man (dual hazards + taunt + night shade) + Golurk, meaning hazards stay down. The best part of the team is when Moltres shows up. Pretty nothing in UU barring Snorlax likes dealing with Specs Moltres. I don't see why you should use jolly. (to tie with opposing hera's, but comon you have several good hera checks being slower is a good thing in certain situations because you hit harder if the opposing hera uses CC) My only REAL recommendation is running 48 speed evs on golurk to outrun min speed Empoleon.

    If you want to build an offense team that powers through most team types (stall, hail etc) this is definitely one of the better UU teams.


    Yeah this post is basically an artificial bump but fuck this team deserves it.
  8. Righteousguy

    Righteousguy

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2011
    Messages:
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    IN response to U-turn,
    First off your team looks GG as is, but if you want to switch your U-turn on moltres, it would be a completely different bird and it is your preference. I think it is fine as is. Your team seems solid....
  9. BLINGAS ♥

    BLINGAS ♥

    Joined:
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    You could potentially run Foresight over Ice Beam on Blastoise if you have a trouble with spin blockers. Other than that the team looks well built.
  10. fatty

    fatty
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
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    perfect example of what a lot of uu teams are trying to accomplish atm: overrun the opposing team with entry hazards and try to kill everything in your wake before they can do the same. because this team uses offensive synergy more so than defensive synergy, you're going to have some problems switching into certain things, but these can usually be remedied if you keep the momentum on your side. having battled you on the ladder and seeing how you play this team, you definitely do just that. it's incredibly hard to set up on this team because you're always forced to be on the defensive, and even if you do manage to gain a little momentum, scarf hera is there to take it right back. that pressure also translates to almost never allowing the opponent to spin those hazards away, which makes it all the more difficult to continually soak up hits from specs tres, scarf hera, raikou and golurk.

    overall, great team, but like i said there are some things you're going to have trouble with if you don't play smart, so here's a list of things to watch out for...

    • you lack a good sub cm mismagius switch-in, who can easily set-up on heracross / moltres locked into the wrong move. keep raikou healthy when you come across one because it looks like it's your best answer. after that, you're gonna have to rely on hera's pursuit, but i think you'd rather not sacrifice your safety blanket.

    • chesto rest kingdra could potentially be a problem if you let it set up on moltres. blastoise, your main physical pivot, can't do shit other than roaring it out, while subsequently taking a +1 outrage to the face. also, scarf hera only does 60.9% - 71.9% with cc / megahorn, so you're going to have to weaken it a bit before revenging (which is hard taking chesto rest into account).

    • your best check for opposing cm raikou is your own raikou, which is obviously pretty unreliable. you can revenge with hera, but again, that's putting hera in a pretty bad situation as it has to contend with a possible sub and it doesnt even come close to a ohko with cc / megahorn.

    the mon's in this team work too well together to consider changing, imo, so i guess those are just things you should watch out for. again, awesome team, kudos for making it.
  11. Banedon

    Banedon

    Joined:
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    It might be just personal preference on my part, but I think you're better off with Roserade + a SR user. I say this because I have vivid memories of Deoxys-D being mega setup-bait. I remember this game where one player switched Venomoth into Deoxys-D's SR, putting Deo-D in a tough spot. It could Taunt and risk the speed tie + eating a super-effective Bug Buzz, or it could switch out and risk facing a +1/+1/+1 Venomoth, which is a Pokemon deadly dangerous to a team like yours, especially if it still has Sleep Powder or Baton Pass to use. There're several other dangerous set up sweepers that wreak havoc on your team if they switch in on Deoxys-D, such as Raikou, Mismagius and Azelf.

    With much greater offensive presence (+ sleep) Roserade can do wonders to patching this weakness. In addition, it takes out Toxic Spikes easily and doubles as a bulky water check. That leaves just SR, but with one open slot there're plenty of offensive Pokemon in UU that can put up SR. You could, for instance, switch out Golurk for Missy and then use Rhyperior as your SR + Ground type + secondary Chansey check. Or maybe you could have Mew in that slot, or Azelf, or idk what. They would be different teams with different weaknesses, and I haven't run through the threat list for them.

    Good luck :)

    PS: Do you have trouble with non-Choice Victini? Specifically the kind with Expert Belt or Life Orb and Grass Knot / Fusion Bolt. They outspeed everything except Raikou and Heracross, neither of which can switch in without some fancy footwork (e.g. Blastoise on the VCreate, Heracross on the Grass Knot). I haven't any suggestions what to do about them, though.
  12. gookie

    gookie Adominnustrata
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

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    Another notable threat are sand teams, Stoutland handily 2hko's everything on this team at worst, and seeing as you only have one ghost, which may very well be switching into a crunch; in fact, if blastoise doesn't get lucky with a scald burn then it's pretty much over.
    (LO Howl, is a straight up 6-0 if it gets a boost off, whereas CB is killing something everytime it switches in when golurk is gone).

    However, with yours being an offensive team it is understandable. That being said the changes that would have to be made would make the team more stall-based and I understand that is probably undesirable (something like roar reflect suicune + phys def hitmontop over blastoise / raikou).

    Still a great team though, bringing some much needed love for fourth gen pokemon

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