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Blaziken (Analysis)

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Calm Pokemaster, Dec 8, 2010.

  1. Calm Pokemaster

    Calm Pokemaster
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    [​IMG]
    Blaziken

    Status: Finished

    QC Approved: [2/2] panamaxis, Eo Ut Mortus.
    GP Approved: [2/2] jc104 (stamped 2 GP checks)
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    [Overview]
    <p>With excellent 120 / 110 mixed offensive stats and a good movepool, Blaziken has always had the potential to wreck opposing teams. However, its poor base 80 Speed relegated it to the UU tier last generation. This generation, however, Blaziken has hit the jackpot, in the form of one of the best abilities in the game-Speed Boost. With a good movepool including Swords Dance and powerful STAB attacks in Hi Jump Kick and Flare Blitz, Blaziken is now rightly regarded as one of the most fearsome sweepers in the metagame.</p>

    <p>Fast Choice Scarf users and priority moves will however be Blaziken's biggest checks. Even after one Speed Boost, Blaziken will sit at a maximum of 426 Speed, outsped by Choice Scarf users with a base Speed of 81 or more. Blaziken is also vulnerable to priority from the likes of Roobushin, since with its poor 80 / 70 / 70 defenses and Life Orb recoil, it is not going to be living for long. Still, underestimate Blaziken at your own peril; if given the chance to set up, it can tear entire teams apart.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Hi Jump Kick / Sky Uppercut
    move 3: Flare Blitz / Blaze Kick
    move 4: Stone Edge
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Speed Boost
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]
    <p>With its Fire / Fighting typing, Blaziken can easily come in on walls like Blissey and Ferrothorn and force a switch, giving it the opportunity to set up Swords Dance. After that, Blaziken can proceed to wreck the opposition's team with its dual STABs and Stone Edge which net Blaziken excellent neutral coverage.</p>

    <p>Blaze Kick can be considered over Flare Blitz since the recoil damage from Flare Blitz and Life Orb will cause Blaziken's early demise. However, Flare Blitz has a good chance of OHKOing Gliscor after a Swords Dance boost assuming Blaziken is running an Adamant nature. Hi Jump Kick is a high-risk, high-return move, since Blaziken will lose half its health if the attack is rendered ineffective. For this reason, Sky Uppercut might be a safer option. Life Orb is the preferred item choice, since it helps Blaziken net some crucial OHKOs on Pokemon such as Gyarados.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    <p>Wide Lens can be used instead of Life Orb for increased accuracy, but this comes at the cost of some crucial OHKOs. 252 EVs are invested in Attack to maximise the power of Blaziken's physical attacks. A Jolly nature helps you outrun Lucario (with a neutral nature and maximum Speed) before a Speed Boost, and afterwards base 130 Pokemon such as Jolteon and Aerodactyl. Rock Slide can also be used instead of Stone Edge for slightly higher accuracy, but you will miss out on the OHKO on Physically Defensive Jellicent after a Swords Dance</p>

    <p>In general, Blaziken finds it difficult to deal with Bulky Waters such as Jellicent, Slowbro and Unaware Quagsire-particularly the latter. As such, it is advisable to have a teammate to deal with these Pokemon and thus make it easier for Blaziken to sweep. A mixed stallbreaker such as Hydreigon is an excellent sweeping partner for Blaziken.</p>

    [SET]
    name: MixKen
    move 1: Fire Blast
    move 2: Hi Jump Kick
    move 3: Hidden Power Ice
    move 4: Protect / Stone Edge
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Speed Boost
    nature: Rash / Naive
    evs: 80 Atk / 200 SpA / 228 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]
    <p>With its excellent mixed offensive stats, Blaziken can be an effective mixed stallbreaker. Fire Blast and Hi Jump Kick are Blaziken's STAB moves and have great neutral coverage between them. Hidden Power Ice hits Garchomp, Salamence and Gliscor hard, OHKOing all of them.</p>

    <p>Protect helps Blaziken to scout the opponent's move, and gain a free Speed boost. It also allows Blaziken to revenge kill Pokemon which normally outspeed it, like Terrakion. However, Stone Edge hits Jellicent, who walls Blaziken's other moves, hard. If Jellicent can be taken care of by Blaziken's teammates, then running Protect would be the better choice. </p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    <p>Since Blaziken is meant to be a mixed stallbreaker, its EVs are split between Attack and Special Attack. 228 Speed EVs are required to outspeed Deoxys-S and Choice SCarf Garchomp after 2 Speed boosts. 200 EVs are put in Special Attack to increase the power of Fire Blast and Hidden Power Ice, while the remaining EVs are put in Attack.</p>

    <p>Blaziken can also run either Hidden Power Electric or Hidden Power Grass instead of Hidden Power Ice to deal with bulky Water-types such as Quagsire, Jellicent and Slowbro. However, keep in mind that Slowbro and Quagsire are uncommon, and that in the absence of Hidden Power Ice, Pokemon like Latios and Garchomp can pose problems for Blaziken.</p>

    <p>A Naive nature can be used to outspeed Jolteon and Aerodactyl after a Speed boost. However, since these Pokemon are uncommon in the current metagame, running a Rash nature for the Special Attack boost would be the better choice.</p>

    <p>In general, Blaziken has problems dealing with bulky waters-especially Jellicent. Jellicent is never OHKOed by any of Blaziken's unboosted attacks, can heal off damage taken with Recover, and can OHKO Blaziken with STAB Surf. A priority Taunt user such as Thundurus can aid Blaziken by shutting down Jellicent.</p>

    [Other Options]
    <p>Protect and Swords Dance / Claw Sharpen can be run on the same set, but then you will have space only for Hi Jump Kick and Flare Blitz. However, this will possibly give it the chance to get boosts in both Attack and Speed, making it much easier for Blaziken to achieve a sweep.</p>

    <p>Fire Punch is a viable alternative over Flare Blitz if you do not like the accuracy of Blaze Kick or the recoil damage of Flare Blitz. In doing so, Blaziken will lose a lot of power in return for slightly higher accuracy. Blaziken also has access to ThunderPunch and Baton Pass which, unfortunately, are illegal with Speed Boost. A mixed set with Cheer Up is also viable, but Blaziken is better off as a mixed stall breaker than a mixed boosting sweeper.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]
    <p>In general, Blaziken has trouble with Bulky Waters. Slowbro, with its huge base Defense can comfortably take any of Blaziken's attacks barring Hidden Power Electric, and in return OHKOes with STAB Surf. Unaware Quagsire can also deal with Blaziken well, negating Blaziken's stat boosts as well as taking all of Blaziken's unboosted attacks with ease. Jellicent deserves a mention-with a 252 HP / 252 Def EV spread it can take all of Blaziken's unboosted attacks barring Shadow Claw, and OHKOes it with Surf. However, Stone Edge after a Swords Dance boost will OHKO Jellicent.</p>

    <p>Choice Band Azumarill is a great check to Blaziken. A STAB, super effective Aqua Jet will bypass all Speed boosts which Blaziken might have obtained, and OHKO it. However, Azumarill will be OHKOed if it switches in on Hi Jump Kick from an Adamant Blaziken. Bulk Up Conkeldurr can take all of Blaziken's unboosted attacks at full health, and then OHKO Blaziken with Drain Punch followed by Mach Punch.</p>
  2. Agonist

    Agonist Even as I tear your fucking throat away.
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    just wondering, why not use blaze kick in place of flare blitz?
  3. Wynought

    Wynought

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    Blaze Kick should be mentioned far before Fire Punch atleast as the extra power is favoured over the accuracy which is easily fixed if you opt for Claw Sharpen

    You could also mention a Wide Lens set in the Optional Changes, with; Blaze Kick, Hi Jump Kick and Stone Egde if Swords Dance is too tantalising.
  4. (makeup)

    (makeup) kevin
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    No Baton Pass set at all?
  5. IronGross

    IronGross

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    Why run a +Spe nature? You have your speed boosted every turn anyway.
  6. Stellar

    Stellar
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    To those wondering about the absence of a Baton Pass set: all currently released Dream World Torchic are male. Blaziken cannot legally have Baton Pass and Speed Boost at the same time (Baton Pass is an egg move). Pokemon Online does not currently bar the use of this illegal set, but the analysis will not include an illegal set just because it is usable on the simulator.
  7. Lee

    Lee @ Thick Club
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    Max HP Azumarill is OHKO'd by Jolly Life Orb Hi Jump Kick 28% of the time after SR. It's 80% if Blaziken is Adamant. Not a good counter by any means and certainly not 'the best in existence.'

    Add the mixed set.

    Blaziken @ Life Orb
    Rash
    60 Atk / 252 SpA / 196 Spe

    - Fire Blast
    - Hi Jump Kick
    - Hidden Power Grass / Electric.
    - Stone Edge
  8. Ich777ich

    Ich777ich

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    Just a really small, small thing. When you are talking about Claw Sharpen you should also mention that Fire Blast's Accuracy is increased as well, allowing him to function better as a mixed sweeper.
  9. TorchicBlaziken

    TorchicBlaziken

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    I'd use Wide Lens over Life Orb any day on Lee's mixed set; the calculations Lee did on the Blaziken thread lose much of their amazingness when you realize that Fire Blast, Stone Edge, and Hi Jump Kick will miss a lot without Wide Lens. In the case of the latter, you do not want Blaziken to miss. With Wide Lens, Fire Blast is 95%, Stone Edge is 90%, and Hi Jump Kick is 100%. Stone Edge may be the same with as Hi Jump Kick is without, but it is still so much better than missing all the time. With Wide Lens, you only have to worry about recoil if a Ghost-type switches in.
  10. Forte.EXE

    Forte.EXE

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    Why is there no MixKen on this analysis?

    name: MixKen
    move 1: Fire Blast
    move 2: Hi Jump Kick
    move 3: Hidden Power [Electric] / Hidden Power [Grass]
    move 4: Stone Edge
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Speed Boost
    nature: Rash
    EV's: 64 Atk / 252 SpA / 196 Spe

    Basically, Heysup's MixKen, but with Speed Boost and Hi Jump Kick.

    Edit: Doesn't Swords Dance + Wide Lens out-power Claw Sharpen + Life Orb? On the Swords Dance set, Wide Lens should be mentioned, as should Blaze Kick.
  11. SOMALIA

    SOMALIA The King
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    If this analysis is ready for QC checks I suggest changing the title to
    Blaziken (QC Approved 0/2)

    Also in future it might be better to just write up a skeleton to save you time and effort incase one of the sets you proposed are rejected by the QC team.
  12. Omicron

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    Why not a Balloon set? In conjunction with SD it can wreck teams that rely on EQ to get rid of threatening fire sweepers like Blaziken and Heatran. I've managed to pull off 6-0 sweeps after opponents are forced to pop the balloon with a weaker attack. It gives a great element of surprise and I think you should at least mention it in the OC.

    Edit: I think Burungeru is a great counter to Blaziken with its resistance to both of its STAB's max HP max Def can survive +2 stone edge i think? I'm not quite sure. But regardless it is still a good counter. Or at least a check.
  13. (makeup)

    (makeup) kevin
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    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Wide Lens increases by 10% of the current accuracy, not 10% of 100. So Fire Blast would be 93.5%, Stone Edge would be 88%, and Hi Jump Kick would be 99%. It helps but not as much as the ability to OHKO Swampert and friends.
  14. religiousjedi

    religiousjedi Destiny likes to use #The in everything.
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    Where's the Shadow Claw? I've found sweeping with Blaziken easier with Shadow Claw over either Rock attacks...
  15. Calm Pokemaster

    Calm Pokemaster
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    @religiousjedi-You get better coverage overall with Rock Slide / Stone Edge. However, I am giving it a mention in Optional Changes.

    @Lee: I fail to understand why Azumarill isn't Blaziken's best counter, since a STAB super effective priority Aqua Jet will OHKO Blaziken 100% of the time, regardless of what Blaziken's Speed is. Blaziken's only priority attacks are Quick Attack and Vaccum Wave, and none of them come close to OHKOing Azumarill. Did you forget about Aqua Jet?

    @chanazn: Burungeru is OHKO'd by +2 Stone Edge 100% of the time. However, it can take Blaziken's other attacks with ease, or even switch into Hi Jump Kick and cause a lot of recoil. I am giving it a mention. Regarding Balloon, Blaziken is easily KOd by even STAB neutral attacks. Giving it a temporary Ground immunity will thus won't be of much use. Also, on any set, Wide Lens or Life Orb is the superior option over Balloon.

    @SOMALIA: Thanks, I forgot to update the thread title when I finished.

    I am working on adding MixKen to the analysis.
  16. Lee

    Lee @ Thick Club
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    No. Did you forget that a counter needs to be able to switch in? If Azumarill switches in on HJK, it's dead. I'm not questioning that it's a great check and maybe even a decent counter but 'best counter in existence' is a little strong for something that is OHKO'd by an attack that every single Blaziken will use. It's a bit like saying 'Gengar is the best Lucario counter in existence' ... It's obviously a lie because if Gengar switches in on the wrong move he's dead.

    Use the MixKen EVs that me and Forte provided. Naive isn't worth it, and the small Atk investment goes a long way. It's a wallbreaker, not a sweeper.
  17. Calm Pokemaster

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    Ok. Sorry for misunderstanding what you said. I will edit the EVs.
  18. SOMALIA

    SOMALIA The King
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    For Mixken I highly suggest that you use Hidden power Ice and not Grass. Swampert and other Pokemon that are 4x weak to Grass are not common so it is not as useful as last gen.
    Maybe Hidden Power Electric / Hidden Power Ice seems good.
  19. TorchicBlaziken

    TorchicBlaziken

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    Blaziken won't OHKO a lot of things if it misses, but I guess without entry hazard support, it's OK. With entry hazard support, Wide Lens is the way to go. With that, Blaziken will OHKO anyway.

    If HJK misses, Blaziken will be OHKO'd. (to clarify: by the opponent Pokémon's attack, because Blaziken was weakened by HJK's recoil)
  20. Omicron

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    No it won't. HJK's recoil caps at 50% of the user's HP now.

    @Calm Pokemaster

    Thunderpunch shouldn't be a threat to Burungeru since it is illegal with Speed Boost. And who's gonna use Blaze Blaziken anymore?
  21. IcyMan28

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    There is a reason the MixKen set posted by Lee runs either HP Grass or Electric - one of those two moves should get a slash with HP Ice at the least. In fact, maybe it should get the primary slash because of how well Blaziken fares against the dragons / grounds anyway:

    There is only one way Dragonite is coming out on top, and that is if there are no rocks on the opposite side of the field, Dragonite has multi-scale, and is at 100% health. Otherwise, Blaziken will be able to defeat it with HJK + Stone Edge if it comes in at health as high as even 92% (and lacks Lefties, of course).

    Salamence is in the same boat. 2 Stone Edges or Rocks + HJK + Stone Edge will finish it.

    ScarfChomp can switch into HJK once for the entire match and is left at 35% max. Any other version will be outsped and 2HKOd.

    Hailed as a full stop to Infernape last gen, Latias is a poor check to Blaze unless it has Scarf. HJK has a 50% chance to 2HKO with rocks, which goes up once Stone Edge is selected. HP Ice accomplishes the same thing, albeit guaranteed.

    With rocks, even Poison Heal Gliscor will have issues taking on Blaziken. Rocks + Fire Blast or Rocks + HJK + Fire Blast will be an assured OHKO and a solid chance to 2HKO, respectively.

    Hippowdon does not ever need to attempt to take on Blaziken, as it is crippled in the process. This version does the same but with Fire Blast rather than HJK.

    Bulky waters/flyers remain Blaziken's best checks, so HP Electric definitely deserves a slash. Not having to use HJK to 2HKO the likes of Vaporeon and Suicune means that the opponent cannot pivot switch to a ghost to inflict recoil, or use Protect on Vappy to rack up further HJK damage. It also deals better with Slowbro, who is hands down the best counter to SDKen. HP Grass is an option but with Swampert's decreased prominence, it should get AC mention at best.

    EDIT: Also, there absolutely needs to be mention of entry hazards (primarily Stealth Rock due to Blaziken's best checks being part flying / ghost) to help Blaziken. Neutral Offensive Nature Blaziken miss out on OHKO / 2HKOs for the added speed, and hazards help to offset this. The calcs in this post alone (2HKO on Latias, 2HKO on Mence, etc) prove that they help out the MixKen set significantly, and the SD set will appreciate being able to OHKO a full-health Max/Max Impish Gliscor using Flare Blitz 75% of the time rather than never.
  22. Calm Pokemaster

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    @chanazn: Thanks, edited the analysis.

    @Icyman28: Suggested changes have been made. Thanks for taking the time to provide these calcs.
  23. Darkmalice

    Darkmalice Like a facepalm, but better
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    In the first set, Rock Slide doesn't deserve a slash. Stone Edge's extra power is better than Rock Slide's better, but still imperfect, accuracy. For example, +2 LO Stone Edge always OHKOs 252 HP / 4 Def Burungeru with SR support, whilst Rock Slide never will (and it's still unlikely to OHKO with SR + 1 layer of Spikes). Most sets don't have Rock Slide slashed with Stone Edge, and the first set has too many slashes. An AC mention will suffice.

    Claw Sharpen doesn't deserve a slash, only an AC mention. LO + Claw Sharpen is inferior to SD + Wide Lens. The latter gives a boost of x2 after a SD, as opposed to 1.95 after a LO Claw Sharpen, but without the recoil. As for accuracy, HJK is 99%, which is effectively 100% for almost all of your matches i.e. it will rarely miss. Same goes for Blaze Kick and Rock Slide. 88% for Stone Edge is acceptable considering that Fire Blast is usually used over Flamethrower when it has 85% accuracy. In short, the lack of recoil is the main reason for the use of Wide Lens, as the accuracy provided by Wide Lens is sufficient, and Claw Sharpen doesn't give much better accuracy. The only reason Claw Sharpen should have an AC mention as opposed to an OO mention is that Claw Sharpen + LO means your attacks deal more damage before you use your boosting move.
  24. Calm Pokemaster

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    Good point Darkmalice. The analysis has been edited accordingly.
  25. TorchicBlaziken

    TorchicBlaziken

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    Blaziken functions best with Stealth Rock support; this lets him use Wide Lens and still get the OHKOs and 2HKOs he normally does, while simultaneously making Blaziken's valuable wallbreaking tools have a better chance of hitting. In particular, if Hi Jump Kick misses, Blaziken will be 2HKO'd; one hit from recoil and another hit from a foe's attack. But with Wide Lens, there is only a 1% chance of that happening, instead of a 10% chance. The lack of this in combination with the lack of Life Orb recoil mean that Blaziken will last longer. The foes that resist Stealth Rock are already weak to Blaziken's attacks, except for Alakazam and Ranculus, who are still hit neutrally against Fire Blast. Spikes helps too.

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