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Bouffalant (Revamp) [QC: 0/3]

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Chillarmy, Aug 8, 2012.

  1. Chillarmy

    Chillarmy

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    [​IMG]
    Which of you bright lights decided that Reckless is better than Sap Sipper?

    [Overview]

    • Bouffalant is one of the few Pokemon in Gen V with an amazing concept behind it, brilliant aesthetic design, and a signature move
    • In the current metagame, Bouffalant has a very notable niche: being able to switch into Celebi and Amoonguss for almost free with defenses which surpass Swampert's
    • Bouff's physical movepool is also pretty nice, with moves such as Pursuit, Megahorn and Wild Charge available
    • Sadly, Normal typing is double-edged sword, both offensively and defensively, so it's going to be tough to gauge the utility of Sap Sipper to your team, when other Grass resists can be used
    • Moreover, Bouffalant's Speed is, simply put, bad
    • Keep in mind, though, that Bouffalant is not only noticeably bulky, but can switch into the infamous Spore, Sleep Powder, Leech Seed, and Leaf Storm without any effort, and proceed to devastate the opposing team with a wide array of (boosted) attacks
    • Also, unlike Lati@s and bulky Grass-types Bouffalant isn't weak to Pursuit or U-turn, easing the prediction required to switch it in safely; despite being vulnerable to all forms of entry hazards, Bouffalant, at the very least, has the benefit of not being weak to SR, which is something which Dragonite, Thundurus-T/Tornadus-T, and Zapdos (I guess...?) would die for; finally, Bouff isn't a pushover offensively, which gives it an edge over Nattorei and Amoonguss
    • With all of these things considered, Bouffalant can either be a fantastic addition to your team or deadweight
    [SET]
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: Head Charge
    move 2: Wild Charge
    move 3: Earthquake / Superpower
    move 4: Pursuit / Megahorn / Superpower
    item: Choice Band
    ability: Sap Sipper
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 128 HP / 252 Atk / 124 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • With impressive base 110 Attack, Sap Sipper and most definitely workable defenses, Bouffalant is more than capable of pulling off a Choice Band set with success
    • Head Charge, the crux of this set, is extremely powerful, ripping apart a large portion of the metagame; however, the recoil can be horrendous at times
    • Wild Charge is Bouffalant's next best coverage move, giving the stylish bison an opportunity to do massive damage to both Skarmory and Jellicent
    • Again, though, watch out for the staggering amount of recoil
    • Earthquake nets Bouffalant more consistent coverage on obligatory Steel-types, doing a considerable amount of damage before and after a Sap Sipper boost
    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    • [Pre- and post Sap Sipper Head Charge / coverage move calcs]
    • With an immunity to the seemingly omnipresent Leaf Storm, Spore, Giga Drain and Power Whip, Bouffalant will, more often than not, be useful to balanced rain teams
    • So yeah, Pursuit is the main slash in the fourth slot, as the ability to trap Lati@s and Starmie is invaluable to rain
    • Superpower boasts the best neutral coverage of Bouffalant's available options, OHKOing Nattorei with a SS boost, while slamming other Steel-types (Balloon Tran), as well as Terrakion on the switch; Megahorn is a useful tool for quickly ridding the game of bulky Psychics and has pretty good neutral coverage; Return is Bouffalant's second strongest, but safer STAB option -- only use it if Bouffalant has no need for any of the aforementioned attacks
    • While it doesn't benefit much from Sap Sipper, Celebi is a very good partner for Bouffalant
    • Celebi resists Bouffalant's only weakness, can take on many of the Pokemon which can use Bouffalant locked into Head Charge as setup fodder, act as a lure for most Steel-types with HP Fire (Weatherless / Sand), and, most notably, spread paralysis around for the purpose of making Bouffalant's task of stomping on everything significantly easier
    • Despite not being able to offer much defensive synergy with Bouffalant, Calm Mind Keldeo makes for an excellent offensive partner
    • With most bulky Grass-types being pressured into not using their STAB or out of commission, Keldeo can, much more easily, gain a Calm Mind boost and proceed to massacre the opposing team
    • Thundurus-T is also a great partner, resisting Bouffalant's only weakness and forming a somewhat synergistic immunity core with it
    • Offensive TR Reuniclus works due to Bouffalant's low Speed stat and therefore good utilization of TR; you can drop Bouffalant's as much as possible if it's to be used under TR
    • When using this Bouffalant, it's very important to keep in mind that bulky Grass-types, when in the hands of a competent player, will not go down easily. A healthy Bouffalant is a deterrent for most, if not all Grass-type moves, and Pokemon such as Cloyster, Keldeo, Rotom-W and Terrakion will be able to capitalize on that fact
    • Getting rid of entry hazards is vital to keeping Bouffalant at an acceptable amount of HP, thus making Pokemon such as SubToxic Tentacruel, Magic Bounce Xatu and specially based Shell Smash Cloyster excellent choices as teammates
    • Wish support wouldn't be to shabby, either
    • WishMence. Yup, I'm mentioning WishMence 8)
    • In general, it's imperative to pay close attention to Bouffalant's well being and optimize its coverage moves to compensate for the potential recoil being able to quickly put an end to Bouffalant's life
    [Other Options]

    • Scarf, Sub + moves
    • SD
    • Payback, Revenge, Retaliate, Stone Edge
    • TR support and / or LO
    [Checks and Counters]

    • Most Steel- and Ghost-types, but they need to watch out for coverage moves
    • Slowbro (fatass), Lando-T (Intimidate), Gliscor (Roost until the recoil puts Bouff in a tough position)
    • Anything faster carrying a powerful move, which is a lot
    Show Hide
    [SET]
    name: Choice Scarf
    move 1: Head Charge
    move 2: Megahorn
    move 3: Wild Charge / Stone Edge / Superpower
    move 4: Earthquake / Superpower
    item: Choice Scarf
    ability: Sap Sipper
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 8 HP / 252 Atk / 248 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • One of Bouffalant's biggest downfalls is its abysmal Speed stat; through the use of a Choice Scarf, said problem can be mostly alleviated
    • While the idea of running a Choice Scarf on Bouffalant may seem odd and impractical, our favorite stylish bison can make very good use of the speed boost, which enables it to act as a revenge killer for a wide array of Pokemon
    • Boasting 341 Speed while holding a Choice Scarf, Bouffalant can outpace and subsequently OHKO Thundurus-T, Celebi, Mienshao, Hydreigon, Lucario, MixMence, Low Sweep Breloom and many others with the appropriate attack
    • Head Charge is still the main attack, giving Bouffalant pretty good neutral coverage while maintaining excellent damage output
    • Megahorn reliably OHKOes all variants of Celebi (physically defensive takes a teeny bit of effort to net the OHKO 100% of the time (87.5% chance to OHKO w/ Stealth Rock)) and gives Bouffalant great coverage on Psychic-types in general
    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    • Wild Charge hits Jellicent, Gyarados and Skarmory; Stone Edge nails Thundurus-T, MixMence and MixNite; Superpower 2HKOes Ferrothorn, OHKOes Lucario, and gives Bouffalant coverage on Air Balloon Heatran
    • Earthquake, as before gives Bouffalant more consistent coverage on imposing Steel-types; however, it's most certainly possible to forgo Earthquake and use Superpower instead to success (just be very well aware of the stat drops and their effect on Bouffalant's staying power)
    • Pursuit is far too weak to be used on this set, but it's at least useful for trapping Celebi which are aware of Bouffalant's item
    • 8 HP EVs places Bouffalant at 333 HP -- odd numbers reduce residual damage yadayada
    • Feel free to play around with both Choice sets as they play very similarly, the only difference being: in lieu of punching large holes in the opposing team, one set focuses on KOing specific targets
    • As such, the same rules which applied to the previous set are applied here as well
    • Pretty much the same partners can be used (Thundurus-T, Wish, Keldeo, Celebi, etc)
    • Don't be afraid of packing a cleric in the case that Bouffalant takes a stray Thunder Wave
  2. jc104

    jc104 Humblest person ever
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    Bouffalant got Superpower from one of the BW2 move tutors, I believe. It should probably feature in some way, since it hits Ferrothorn much harder than anything else. This is important given that Ferrothorn uses Grass moves, allowing afrobull to power up with Sap Sipper.

    Also, the latter two sets look pretty questionable at the moment, but I'll wait to see what you have to say about them before jumping to any conclusions.

    edit: running both Frustration and Head Charge is silly. Head Charge is not really that much more powerful, and doesn't have as much recoil as most other similar moves. If anything you should slash the two moves together in the first slot.
  3. Chillarmy

    Chillarmy

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    Forgot to edit Superpower in > Frustration. Thanks for the reminder.

    Choice Scarf Bouffalant is by no means a bad set. The ability to revenge KO Celebi, Thundurus-T, Lando-I, Lucario, catch Low Sweep Breloom, MoxieMixMence, and many other Pokemon off guard is good enough to warrant a separate set. Honestly, I haven't even had much of problem interchanging between Choice Scarf and Choice Band Bouff; the only reason behind why they aren't a single 'Choice' set is due to the different spreads, nature, and importance of some moves. I'm 100% sure that SDS and AG (unless he never got to trying Bouffalant out...?) can back me up on Choice Scarf's effectiveness.

    (Speaking of which, I'm taking names for Choice Scarf as Afro + fashion is too good an opportunity to give up)

    Substitute + 3 attacks was originally supposed to be a set which shows off Bouffalant's potential bulkiness. After a while of testing such a set however, I quickly discarded it for: 1. The overall lack of power, 2. Being unable to capitalize on forced switches, Sap Sipper boosts, etc as well as the the first two sets (powerful and fast attacks, respectively) and 3. Being outclassed by other Pokemon, particularly Snorlax. I then tried to morph the bulky set into something more offensive, did a few test battles, and came to replacing the idea of a 'bulky' set with Substitute + 3 Attacks. Similarly to Heracross, Substitute makes predictions so much easier to make while using Bouffalant. Defensive Celebi, Jellicent Nattorei, nor Amoonguss cannot touch Bouffalant when it's behind a Substitute, therefore simplifying the following turn to the point where the player using Bouffalant will be able to make more accurate assumptions about the opposing player's next move. Spamming Pursuit, Megahorn, Superpower or Head Charge can place Bouffalant in a pretty bad position; Substitute fixes this problem, allowing Bouffalant to better punish a misplayed Grass-type.

    Bouffalant really needs the extra 18 base power, from my experiences with it at least. I was actually going to move Frustration down to AC and mention its use in the final slot. With Wild Charge and Earthquake available, there's really no harm in running two Normal STAB moves, especially considering that it gives the player using Bouffalant a chance to cause quite a bit of damage to the opposing team while simultaneously lengthening Bouffalant's life span.
  4. Danger Mouse

    Danger Mouse

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    I think Head Charge should be slashed with Return/Frustration on all the sets. The loss in power is noticeable, but given that Bouffalant is fairly bulky, it's a shame to sacrifice its lifespan for extra damage.
    Also, considering Bouffalant's horrendous speed, it might be worth mentioning that he can function on trick room teams, since he has decent synergy with Reuniclus.
  5. Chillarmy

    Chillarmy

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    I wouldn't mind slashing Frustration with Head Smash the latter two sets, actually, but I'm going to remain adamant about slashing it onto CB. CB Bouffalant actually misses out on quite a few notable KOs due to the power drop, making pressuring more defensive teams much more difficult. Honestly, I'd rather limit the amount of prediction required to use Bouffalant; otherwise, there's almost no reason to use it over the other two sets. Moreover, the recoil isn't that bad when the risk of locking Bouffalant into one of its coverage moves is considered, not to mention that Wish support from something along the lines of Vaporeon is most certainly viable. Granted, occasionally predicting Jellicent, physically defensive Skarmory, Jirachi, or Gengar switching in and choosing the corresponding attack is greatly beneficial to Bouffalant; but ultimately you'll find yourself spamming Head Charge and really appreciating extra bit of power it has.
    Will do.
  6. Chillarmy

    Chillarmy

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    Holy shit, this is still a thing. OK, two things: Sub + three attacks is pathetic and Scarf is mediocre, so I removed both (I'll keep Scarf in the OP in case SDS / someone is super-adamant about keeping it in). I also finished the skeleton, so go crazy, QC.
  7. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn
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    very confused as to what this does and why I should even consider using it, if you could give me a brief dissertation on how afrobull is noticeably different from its competition in staraptor and slaking I'd appreciate it!
  8. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    I guess he can switch into Celebi and Amoongus easy, and maybe be threatening if he gets an Atk boost, but with Breloom and Ferrrothorn being the most common Grass types in OU, i don't see Afrobull deserving an analyses at all...
  9. Chillarmy

    Chillarmy

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    Foremost, I’d like to note that having an immunity to any type is very useful; in Sap Sipper’s case, the ability to switch directly into Spore, Bullet Seed, Giga Drain, Leaf Storm, and Stun Spore (alright, I’ll concede in this not being used nearly as much as the other moves, but it’s there, at least) is a rare, but certainly valuable trait to have in this metagame. Pressuring defensive and offensive Grass-types to relying their secondary STAB or coverage moves is something which Pokemon such as Rotom-W and Keldeo would really benefit from. During the time which I’d tested Bouffalant out myself, I’d picked up on what my opponents would usually prioritize in attempting to stop Keldeo (SubCM) from setting up. Bouffalant, once its ability was implied or revealed to be Sap Sipper became one of those priorities, and consequently gave me a slight edge in making my moves. Amoonguss would be a lot more cautious of spamming Giga Drain or Spore; Celebi didn’t seem to be as comfortable staying in play for extended periods of time; and Nattorei became more focused on setting up entry hazards, rather than just outright attacking. All of these Pokemon would give Keldeo quite a few opportunities to blast through their team, just due to Bouffalant’s existence. I mean, wouldn’t the risk of giving a Pokemon with triple 95 defenses, base 110 Attack, and a base 120 STAB move with acceptable recoil not only a free opportunity to switch in, but a +1 Attack boost as well trigger fear somewhere in your heart? +1 Bouffalant can 3HKO physically defensive Forretress with Head Charge without SR -- isn’t a feat like that enough to cause someone to play more carefully and thus risk the opposition taking advantage of their apparent fear? Skarmory be a huge roadblock for Bouffalant, but neutering, weakening, or just outright KOing it with another Pokemon (Forry, Thund-T, Goth, Terrakion, etc) is definitely a possibility and doesn’t cause the player using Bouffalant to go far out of their way to support it.

    My test team was: Bouffalant / Keldeo / Tentacruel / Politoed / Latias / Nattorei. My first action while in team preview was scouting the opposing team for a Keldeo check, subsequently analyzing the best possible check(s) and finally determining how much of an impact Bouffalant would have on my opponent’s team. Due to the state of the metagame at the time which this team was at its best, Amoonguss + Tornadus-/Thundurus-T was usually my opponent’s best shot against Keldeo; if a Grass-type is actually present, then Bouffalant is usually played more conservatively and kept in good shape to deter the use of Grass-type of moves against Keldeo. Otherwise, I’d usually find myself keeping Bouffalant handy as a pretty good source of power. Seriously, Head Charge is very strong and with that in mind, 25% recoil isn’t half bad. The huge power boost assisted my team greatly, giving me momentum when need be. Granted, Tornadus-T, Genesect, as well as many others can perform this role just as well, if not better, but with greater bulk, general indifference toward paralysis, not-Flying typing, and a nice physical movepool (Pursuit!), Bouffalant has more than enough going for it to be at least considered over the aforementioned Pokemon.

    Also, I’d like to give a clear perspective as to which Pokemon give Bouffalant realistic competition. Sawsbuck, Heatran, Genesect, and Thundurus-T are much better examples of Pokemon worth comparing Bouffalant to. The latter two, despite constantly U-turning and Volt Switching fill roles similar to Bouffalant’s; they utilize their defensive and offensive capabilities, as well as their obviously good compatibility with rain teams to find opportunities switch in, gain some momentum, and at some point, revenge kill an imposing threat. Bouffalant, with its already mentioned amazing defenses and Sap Sipper can find a few opportunities to switch in and proceed to whack something with one of its moves. U-turn may be absent, but the results are similar: in either case, the opposing player is placed into a position where they must be more cautious than usual, be it due to a disadvantageous match-up, or being left with a wall that must heal, attack, w/e or risk being KOed on the following turn. Sawsbuck and Heatran are a bit different, but still comparable to Bouffalant due to their respective abilities; they’re both immune to a type which doesn’t have any type-related immunities and benefit offensively from their abilities. Of course, these Pokemon also have access to a few things which separate them from Bouffalant. Sawsbuck comes with the benefit of being able to Baton Pass its Sap Sipper boosts, while Heatran can set up Stealth Rock and tank more hits due to its doubtlessly better defensive capabilities.
  10. Pocket

    Pocket Apo, the astronaut's best friend >:3
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    Thanks for your dedication to this analysis, Chillarmy.

    First, the move choices. I really don't get why Pursuit is the first slash. Bouffalant doesn't exactly seem like the ideal Ghost / Psychic buster imo - at least I wouldn't use Bouffalant for trapping Ghost / Psychics. I'd personally prefer Return on the fourth slot (which you didn't even list), since for Bouffalant it's health is precious.

    Superpower > Earthquake on the 3rd slot - not being able to hit Ferrothorn for super-effective is silly. This is what I personally propose.

    move 1: Head Charge
    move 2: Wild Charge
    move 3: Superpower / Earthquake
    move 4: Return / Pursuit / Megahorn

    Maybe drop Megahorn to AC.

    Bouffalant should have enough Speed to outrun Skarmory so Bouffalant can finish off Skarmory before the metal bird can roost stall. (Okay, you have the Spe EVs, just don't forget to explain your EVs in AC).

    Checks & Counter needs more elaboration. Not all Steel-types can weather Bouffalant's assaults. Skarmory, Forretress, and Ferrothorn are all obvious counters, but Scizor would prefer not absorbing STAB CB Head Charge (50-59% to max HP Scizor). Max HP Jirachi and Heatran take 42-50%, not exactly safe. Lol Genesect.

    Ghost-types don't exactly enjoy switching into Wild Charge, either, it's main coverage move, so definitely elaborate more on this.
  11. ginganinja

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    QC Rejected 1/3

    O.k my thoughts (when we discussed this on irc)

    Your primary purpose is to check grass types (Sap Sipper is really your only niche) but then again, Rain Teams don't need you (they have Tornadus-T which is better), Sun teams don't need grass support, so your automatically only good on weatherless or sandstorm. In addition, heres how you match up vs the grass types.

    Celebi: You win, provided you don't switch in on a Psychic which will fucking hurt.

    Ferrothorn: Its risky switching in on Ferrothorn, since if I see bouff, im not spamming Leech Seed, instead im spamming SR / Spikes just to fuck you over and deny you an attack boost. In addition, you are forced to switch into me anyway (in case I Leech Seed) and its just a thorny situation.

    Roserade: Is going to wreck you with Sludge Bomb

    Venusaur: +2 Sludge Bomb hurts

    Breloom: Yep im going to unleash my Fight Gem Mach Punch onto you (or Low Sweep).

    In addition, Bouff is slow, like really fucking slow. This means that you are good against slower teams, however these sorts of teams prolly have a Skarmory / Jellicent / Hippowdon / whatever which hurts you. If you come accross a faster team, your utterly useless, since at best you kill something (and then die to recoil or get revenged) or you just get death foddered to something. I am sorry but I just don't see it :(
  12. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    QC Rejected 2/3

    We went over Bouffalent on IRC and decided that it wasn't worth it. Bouffalent is a one trick pony, who's "trick" doesn't end up coming into play that often (its a bad check to most grass-types!) furthermore, its an underwhelming Pokemon. 55 base speed without any other redeeming qualities doesn't really cut it in OU, it'll be lucky if it can get a kill in without being utterly steam rolled by faster paced teams. Sorry, but i'm not going to accept this analysis.
  13. Pocket

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    QC Rejected #3
  14. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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