1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

#breezi

Discussion in 'CAP Pre-Evolution Workshop' started by Birkal, Mar 30, 2013.

  1. Birkal

    Birkal We have the technology.
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Server Administratoris an Artistis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
    CAP Head Mod

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2010
    Messages:
    3,724
    Hello! We're going to be starting up yet another pre-evolution, and I'd like to take this one in a bit of a different direction. Syclar, Embirch, and Flarelm are all successful, but I can't help but think that the process for creating them takes an unnecessarily long amount of time to make. Since they're not being implemented on the server, I feel like we have a bit more flexibility in making these.

    What I'd like to do is make our next pre-evolution, Breezi, live on IRC. You can read all of the information on Breezi here. The reason I think IRC would be a good medium of creation for Breezi is that the Pokemon is pretty much complete. Cartoons! laid out some pretty specific details, so it shouldn't take too long to finalize this stuff. On IRC, we'll finalize Breezi's typing, abilities, stats, movepool, and Pokedex entries. This will all be done through voting that will take place in real time. I'll lead the process, and I'd love to answer any questions that you may have.

    All of this will occur on Saturday, April 13th. It will likely start around noon (CST), and I predict that it will take around three hours. In a few days, we'll have threads go up for sprites and art submissions, so we'll have time to vote officially on those aspects on the date. You can chat with us by joining #breezi on SynIRC. If you don't use mIRC or some other client, click here to join us through Mibbit. Until then, you're more than welcome to use #breezi to prepare your stat spreads and movepools. This thread is to be used for general discussion of Breezi and questions that you may have about this process. I know this is wildly different from anything we've ever done officially, but I'm quite confident that we'll be able to do this in an efficient and effective way. If it doesn't work out, then we'll go back to using forum threads for future pre-evolutions. Thanks for reading, and I can't wait to create Breezi with you all in two weeks!
  2. Quanyails

    Quanyails
    is an Artistis a Community Contributor

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2011
    Messages:
    606
    I will hopefully be there. :) My sprites are ready whenever that thread arrives, and I will be glad to participate in the creation of the other components.
  3. DHR-107

    DHR-107 Robot from the Future
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcher
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2008
    Messages:
    1,358
    This will be interesting...

    I have no problems with this being done on IRC, maybe dump other info we have here in relation to Fidget (like his official movepool etc). Give people enough of a heads up about what we are working with.
  4. Eagle4

    Eagle4

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2012
    Messages:
    1,588
    Sounds like fun! I'll definitely attempt to participate in most of the non-art related categories which need finalising. A question though: is Breezi's art finalised or will there be an art thread such as Scylar and Embirch/Flarelm for a more refined art piece?
  5. DHR-107

    DHR-107 Robot from the Future
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcher
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2008
    Messages:
    1,358
    Okay, so I was looking back through Fidget's threads so I could start building my movepool...

    And we are once again in with a conundrum in which move-pools are correct...

    http://www.smogon.com/cap/pokemon/moves/fidgit and http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44196 are very different. I guess this is again because there was some fiddling during the previous Revision project that have been left in? I assume we work off the one that is on site, not the original? Especially considering the ones on-site also have the Tutor moves attached and I am positive Fidget existed pre platinum...

    EDIT: I have been informed by Deck Knight that the onsite one is the correct one. IE, the first one I linked to in this post :)
  6. SgtWoodsy

    SgtWoodsy

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,222
    But it's always been Poison/Flying and evolves by holding an Iron Ball. No need to finalize that!
  7. DHR-107

    DHR-107 Robot from the Future
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcher
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2008
    Messages:
    1,358
    I'd just like to point out an error with Fidget's moveset... It seems he has somehow managed to acquire Metronome via a tutor that doesn't exist.

    It does exist in Gen 3, but I was pretty sure the Revisions or Reversions or whatever they were called were still only based on the Gen 4 Plat tutors and no others. Being a Gen 4 mon it shouldn't have a Gen 3 tutor move at all.
  8. Birkal

    Birkal We have the technology.
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Server Administratoris an Artistis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
    CAP Head Mod

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2010
    Messages:
    3,724
    Posting to say that we'll be starting in about 30 minutes! Come join us in #breezi.


    EDIT: In response to DHR's post above, the link between the onsite movepool and X-Act's original submission is here. This is one revision we apparently kept permanently, so let's base our movepool for Breezi off of what's on site. I'm posting this here for future reference.
  9. Birkal

    Birkal We have the technology.
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Server Administratoris an Artistis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
    CAP Head Mod

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2010
    Messages:
    3,724
    We're taking a two hour long break, but we've made great progress! Through voting and submissions, we've finalized the following information about Breezi:

    Name: Breezi
    Typing: Poison / Flying
    Abilities: Unburden / Own Tempo
    Stats: 50 / 46 / 69 / 60 / 50 / 75

    When we return in roughly two hours from now, we'll be finalizing Breezi's movepool and Pokedex entries. If you're an artist who would like to help out, check out our Art & Sprites Submission thread. So if you've got the time, join us again on #breezi (link in the OP of this thread) in two hours to submit your movepool and Pokedex entries! PM me if you have any questions.
  10. Birkal

    Birkal We have the technology.
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Server Administratoris an Artistis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
    CAP Head Mod

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2010
    Messages:
    3,724
    As we discussed on IRC, I'm going to put the movepools here on the forum. That keeps us from having to get them all cluttered in pastebins. Here they are!

    jas61292 (open)
    Level Up
    Evolve: lv. 33

    0 Gust
    0 Tailwind
    0 Helping Hand
    5 Encore
    9 Safeguard
    14 Knock Off
    19 Copycat
    25 Whirlwind
    30 Body Slam
    34 Sludge Bomb
    39 Toxic Spikes
    44 Rest
    50 Heal Block
    55 Aerial Ace
    59 Lucky Chant

    To start, I removed the moves that didn't seem fitting, in this case Comet Punch (no arms), Rapid Spin (lacks Fidgit's drill), Gravity (its all about floating), and Earth Power (doesn't have anything to do with the ground). Next, with the exception of the level 0 move Comet Punch, I filled in these moves with some TM moves. Safeguard over Rapid Spin and Rest over Gravity to replace useful utility moves with other useful utility moves, and Aerial Ace over Earth Power to represent its place as a sky pokemon rather than an earthbound one. Finally, I adjusted the levels that it learns later moves at. I looked at the pattern that Fidgit had, and while it kind didn't really follow anything that set later on, I saw the first few differences were 5 4 5 5 6, so I took this as a pattern and repeated it throughout the rest of the level up pool.

    For evolution method I chose lv. 33 because, frankly, it is unremarkable but realistic. I went through every single 2 stage family fully introduced in generation 4, and out of the 20 of them, 18 evolved via normal level up, with the only 2 exceptions being a pair of happieness evolutions. Additionally, among those 18 that evolve via normal level up, only Burmy evolves at a level which it also learns a move, and Burmy is already a unique case since it has a split evolution. In every single other case, the level had nothing significant about it other than the evolution. Since most of the Pokemon evolved somewhere in the late twenties to thirties, I decided to put it at 33. Not too late since Breezi is fairly weak, but not too early since Fidgit is a very high BST Pokemon.


    TM/HM

    TM06 Toxic
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM16 Light Screen
    TM17 Protect
    TM18 Rain Dance
    TM20 Safeguard
    TM21 Frustration
    TM27 Return
    TM30 Shadow Ball
    TM32 Double Team
    TM33 Reflect
    TM36 Sludge Bomb
    TM37 Sandstorm
    TM40 Aerial Ace
    TM42 Facade
    TM43 Secret Power
    TM44 Rest
    TM45 Attract
    TM48 Skill Swap
    TM49 Snatch
    TM56 Fling
    TM58 Endure
    TM77 Psych Up
    TM78 Captivate
    TM82 Sleep Talk
    TM83 Natural Gift
    TM84 Poison Jab
    TM87 Swagger
    TM89 U-turn
    TM90 Substitute
    TM92 Trick Room

    For TMs, its all about taking out what doesn't fit. I decided that Breezi's layed back look made mean dark type moves feel out of place. While the more playful ones, like Knock Off in the level up pool, were fine, Taunting, Tormenting, and Thievery all seemed not to fit. Next I removed the fully evolved exclusive moves, Hyper Beam and Giga Impact. I also felt that as a flying type, the rock and ground moves really didn't fit in, so I axed EQ, Rock Tomb, Stone Edge, Stealth Rock, and Rock Slide.


    Tutor

    Block
    Body Slam
    Double-Edge
    Gastro Acid
    Helping Hand
    Icy Wind
    Knock Off
    Mimic
    Mud-Slap
    Ominous Wind
    Snore
    Swift
    Tailwind
    Twister

    Tutor moves stayed mostly the same, but I removed Earth Power and Gravity for the same reasons they were taken out of the level up pool. I took out Metronome too since Metronome is not actually a 4th gen Tutor move. I have no idea how Fidgit is supposed to get it as a Tutor move, but whatever magic it used is certainly not available to little Breezi.


    Egg

    Disable
    Follow Me
    Me First
    Metronome
    Mimic
    Sand Tomb
    Spikes
    Wish

    And, of course, Egg pool is the same. No changing this up.

    Qwilphish (open)
    Evolve @ Lv 16 because that is when it learns Knock Off, although it is not a requirement for it to actually learn it. Knock Off because it is just so sad for Breezi to have other's lose their item, that Breezi just has to do it as well. :(

    Level-Up Moves:
    - Acid
    - Encore
    5: Gust
    8: Mud-slap
    11: Whirlwind
    16: Knock Off
    19: Sludge
    22: Me First
    27: Recycle
    30: U-Turn
    35: Fling
    38: Sludge Bomb


    TM/HM Moves:
    TM06 - Toxic
    TM10 - Hidden Power
    TM11 - Sunny Day
    TM12 - Taunt
    TM16 - Light Screen
    TM17 - Protect
    TM18 - Rain Dance
    TM20 - Safeguard
    TM21 - Frustration
    TM27 - Return
    TM30 - Shadow Ball
    TM32 - Double Team
    TM33 - Reflect
    TM34 - Shock Wave
    TM36 - Sludge Bomb
    TM40 - Aerial Ace
    TM42 - Facade
    TM43 - Secret Power
    TM44 - Rest
    TM45 - Attract
    TM49 - Snatch
    TM53 - Energy Ball
    TM56 - Fling
    TM58 - Endure
    TM63 - Embargo
    TM67 - Recycle
    TM77 - Psych Up
    TM78 - Captivate
    TM82 - Sleep Talk
    TM83 - Natural Gift
    TM87 - Swagger
    TM89 - U-Turn
    TM90 - Substitute

    Egg Moves (Ground):
    Wish
    Spikes
    Toxic Spikes
    Pursuit
    Sucker Punch
    Block
    Wake-up Slap
    Mud Sport
    Helping Hand
    Follow Me
    Metronome
    Assist

    I took away most every ground-based move, such as Earthquake and Stone Edge. I also took away field effects not related to weather as Breezi would rather be in fresh air anyways :3. The Level-Up moves are based upon Drifloon's DPP level up system of 3-3-5. Many moves from the TM list have been added to the Level-Up move is partially because of the low amount of moves leftover from fidget, and partially because of their flavor in accordance to Breezi.

    DHR-107 (open)
    LEVEL UP
    0 Gust
    0 Tailwind
    5 Encore
    9 Tackle
    14 Knock Off -> Evolve Learning Knock Off
    18 CopyCat
    23 Whirlwind
    27 Slam
    31 Sludge Bomb
    36 Toxic Spikes
    40 Tail Wind
    45 Captivate
    49 Fling
    53 Lucky Chant

    I was really undecided on how to make Breezi evolve. I finally decided that i would let it evolve after learning Knock Off, similar to how Bonsly and Mime Jnr evolve. I know everyone is going to hanker for the Iron Ball method, but I don't like it. The only other method that works for me is normal evolution level, but I think Breezi should have something a little quirky considering it's massive change in form. I loved the idea of keeping Sludge bomb as a dirty reference!

    TM MOVES
    TM06 Toxic
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM16 Light Screen
    TM17 Protect
    TM18 Rain Dance
    TM20 Safeguard
    TM21 Frustration
    TM27 Return
    TM30 Shadow Ball
    TM32 Double Team
    TM33 Reflect
    TM36 Sludge Bomb
    TM37 Sandstorm
    TM41 Torment
    TM42 Facade
    TM43 Secret Power
    TM44 Rest
    TM45 Attract
    TM48 Skill Swap
    TM49 Snatch
    TM56 Fling
    TM58 Endure
    TM77 Psych Up
    TM78 Captivate
    TM82 Sleep Talk
    TM83 Natural Gift
    TM84 Poison Jab
    TM87 Swagger
    TM89 U-turn
    TM90 Substitute
    TM92 Trick Room

    Got rid of all the generically "Evolution moves" and removed all the Rock/Ground Type Attacks too. I also removed both of the HM moves as I think Breezi would be way too tiny to use them.

    TUTOR MOVES
    Gastro Acid
    Gravity
    Helping Hand
    Icy Wind
    Knock Off
    Mimic
    Ominous Wind
    Snore
    Swift
    Tailwind
    Twister

    Removed the obviously Fidget'y moves. Left in the more "Windy" style moves as I expect Breezi to fully be able to utilise them to the best of their effectiveness.

    EGG MOVES
    Disable
    Follow Me
    Me First
    Metronome
    Mimic
    Sand Tomb
    Spikes
    Wish

    And the egg moves cannot change :)
  11. Birkal

    Birkal We have the technology.
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Server Administratoris an Artistis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
    CAP Head Mod

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2010
    Messages:
    3,724
    And here is our submitted Pokedex entries:

    Bull of Heaven (open)
    Breezi, the Drifting Pokemon

    Diamond: They drift lazily through the sky on windy days. They often fall asleep while gliding.

    Pearl: They seem to enjoy collecting pebbles from the ground. The extra weight can make their gliding erratic.

    Platinum: It is said that no matter what winds it encounters, a wandering BREEZI always finds its way home.

    paintseagull (open)
    Breezi, the Parachute Pokemon

    They appear to float with the breeze. Somehow, they manage to avoid landing even when the wind is calm.

    It is difficult to tell whether a BREEZI is awake or asleep. They often seem to be ignoring the world.

    They can be found all over the world. Only after strong wind storms can large groups be found together.

    Qwilphish (open)
    Breezi: The Drifting Pokemon

    D: Although they appear to be conscious of their movements, BREEZI have no control over where the wind blows them.

    P: Despite their cute appearance, BREEZI are very poisonous. It is said that one BREEZI is responsible for the endangered DELIBIRD population in Sinnoh.

    P: BREEZI are born without their parachutes. During the first 30 minutes of their lives, they scramble to form makeshift ones.

    Eagle4 (open)
    Breezi, the Ballooning Pokemon

    Diamond: The mood of a BREEZI depends on the strength of the wind. When the wind is calm, it rests.

    Pearl:
    Before modern technology, they were used to carry letters and parcels across vast oceans.

    Platinum: BREEZI has the ability to create wind on command. It shoots itself upwards when threatened.

    I tried to get a variety of themes running through these entries. The Diamond entry, in my opinion at least, is quite cute and reflects on Breezi's relaxed nature alongside the wind theme. I tried going for a unique direction with the Pearl entry, using the idea that Breezi were messengers. Platinum is also a cute entry, and relates to the theme of wind again. The length of the dex entries is the normal length for any entry in Pokemon. Also it is the Ballooning species because the idea behind Breezi is that it creates a silky parachute as a baby, and then grows into an adult spider. The process is called ballooning.
  12. Birkal

    Birkal We have the technology.
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Server Administratoris an Artistis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
    CAP Head Mod

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2010
    Messages:
    3,724
    And just like that, we're done! We've completed the IRC component of Breezi. The only thing remaining are sprites and artwork, which is being conducted in this thread. Once we finish up those, I'll post the Breezi final product. Cheers!

    Name: Breezi
    Typing: Poison / Flying
    Abilities: Unburden / Own Tempo
    Stats: 50 / 46 / 69 / 60 / 50 / 75

    Movepool (open)
    Level Up
    Evolve: lv. 33

    0 Gust
    0 Tailwind
    0 Helping Hand
    5 Encore
    9 Safeguard
    14 Knock Off
    19 Copycat
    25 Whirlwind
    30 Body Slam
    34 Sludge Bomb
    39 Toxic Spikes
    44 Rest
    50 Heal Block
    55 Aerial Ace
    59 Lucky Chant

    To start, I removed the moves that didn't seem fitting, in this case Comet Punch (no arms), Rapid Spin (lacks Fidgit's drill), Gravity (its all about floating), and Earth Power (doesn't have anything to do with the ground). Next, with the exception of the level 0 move Comet Punch, I filled in these moves with some TM moves. Safeguard over Rapid Spin and Rest over Gravity to replace useful utility moves with other useful utility moves, and Aerial Ace over Earth Power to represent its place as a sky pokemon rather than an earthbound one. Finally, I adjusted the levels that it learns later moves at. I looked at the pattern that Fidgit had, and while it kind didn't really follow anything that set later on, I saw the first few differences were 5 4 5 5 6, so I took this as a pattern and repeated it throughout the rest of the level up pool.

    For evolution method I chose lv. 33 because, frankly, it is unremarkable but realistic. I went through every single 2 stage family fully introduced in generation 4, and out of the 20 of them, 18 evolved via normal level up, with the only 2 exceptions being a pair of happieness evolutions. Additionally, among those 18 that evolve via normal level up, only Burmy evolves at a level which it also learns a move, and Burmy is already a unique case since it has a split evolution. In every single other case, the level had nothing significant about it other than the evolution. Since most of the Pokemon evolved somewhere in the late twenties to thirties, I decided to put it at 33. Not too late since Breezi is fairly weak, but not too early since Fidgit is a very high BST Pokemon.


    TM/HM

    TM06 Toxic
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM16 Light Screen
    TM17 Protect
    TM18 Rain Dance
    TM20 Safeguard
    TM21 Frustration
    TM27 Return
    TM30 Shadow Ball
    TM32 Double Team
    TM33 Reflect
    TM36 Sludge Bomb
    TM37 Sandstorm
    TM40 Aerial Ace
    TM42 Facade
    TM43 Secret Power
    TM44 Rest
    TM45 Attract
    TM48 Skill Swap
    TM49 Snatch
    TM56 Fling
    TM58 Endure
    TM77 Psych Up
    TM78 Captivate
    TM82 Sleep Talk
    TM83 Natural Gift
    TM84 Poison Jab
    TM87 Swagger
    TM89 U-turn
    TM90 Substitute
    TM92 Trick Room

    For TMs, its all about taking out what doesn't fit. I decided that Breezi's layed back look made mean dark type moves feel out of place. While the more playful ones, like Knock Off in the level up pool, were fine, Taunting, Tormenting, and Thievery all seemed not to fit. Next I removed the fully evolved exclusive moves, Hyper Beam and Giga Impact. I also felt that as a flying type, the rock and ground moves really didn't fit in, so I axed EQ, Rock Tomb, Stone Edge, Stealth Rock, and Rock Slide.


    Tutor

    Block
    Body Slam
    Double-Edge
    Gastro Acid
    Helping Hand
    Icy Wind
    Knock Off
    Mimic
    Mud-Slap
    Ominous Wind
    Snore
    Swift
    Tailwind
    Twister

    Tutor moves stayed mostly the same, but I removed Earth Power and Gravity for the same reasons they were taken out of the level up pool. I took out Metronome too since Metronome is not actually a 4th gen Tutor move. I have no idea how Fidgit is supposed to get it as a Tutor move, but whatever magic it used is certainly not available to little Breezi.


    Egg

    Disable
    Follow Me
    Me First
    Metronome
    Mimic
    Sand Tomb
    Spikes
    Wish

    And, of course, Egg pool is the same. No changing this up.

    Pokedex Entries (open)
    Breezi, the Parachute Pokemon

    They appear to float with the breeze. Somehow, they manage to avoid landing even when the wind is calm.

    It is difficult to tell whether a BREEZI is awake or asleep. They often seem to be ignoring the world.

    They can be found all over the world. Only after strong wind storms can large groups be found together.



    Also, a thread will be going up later tonight to discuss if people enjoyed using IRC for this creation process or not. There are many advantages and disadvantages, so I think it'd be wise to discuss them. Thankee!
  13. DHR-107

    DHR-107 Robot from the Future
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcher
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2008
    Messages:
    1,358
    I think this went okay actually. Considering it was sort of off the bat and then we just sort of did it it wasn't so bad. I was thinking about making a table of good points and bad ones, but mostly it sort of ended out with good points. The only real negatives is it could get a little heated and it felt like whoever shouted the loudest got the votes (I don't think that was the case but that's what it felt like).

    I think that was both the best and the worst... It was great to have instant feedback, but also bad that the chat was working so fast constantly. I think maybe for Abilities/Movepools (Mainly movepools) people should have a chance (Outside of the normal descriptions for the pastebins) to present their cases for the options they are championing to try and sway the voters. The forum is probably slightly better in that regard because you can have a little more development time for feed back and the like.

    I'll probably update this later when i have more time :P
  14. Pwnemon

    Pwnemon judges silently
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Doubles Co-Lead

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2010
    Messages:
    3,584
    a big downside was that if you happened to not have access to irc on saturday you were basically just SOL
  15. Eagle4

    Eagle4

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2012
    Messages:
    1,588
    It was great fun, and I really do think IRC is the way to go. DHR poses a good point though, and I also felt that at times the process was rushed; although that didn't affect the final results all too much. I gladly await the next IRC prevo process.
  16. Agreeing that it was a good way to do this. Since prevos don't need the same kind of caution and debate we put into a CAP, the faster pace was a fun change. I don't think I should comment on whether it moved too quickly, since I submitted neither stats nor a movepool, but it was always clear that Birkal was willing to take as long as we needed to avoid any major problems. Even though this was the first attempt, it was very well-run. I don't remember it ever getting "heated" either, but maybe DHR and I just interpreted things differently.

    It is problematic that some people just missed the whole thing, but it would be a shame to scrap the whole thing because of that.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)