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Bulkymon - Gotta Stall 'em All! (Weatherless BW Stall RMT)

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Ratatat, May 23, 2012.

  1. Ratatat


    Oct 6, 2006
    (Volcarona not included)

    Greeting, Smogonites! Another day, another team. And this just so happens to be my first on this site. Isn't it amazing how many ways there are for cute, creepy, and just plain weird creatures to mangle each other for our enjoyment? It seems like for every one of these marketable monsters there's an equally interesting way to play, and today I'm going to present a stall team that's big on bulk, but also provides enough muscle to power through even the toughest defenses.

    A quick summation of the team choices. Playing through Black version with no other games to trade from, I was naturally limited on what Pokemon I could use. Having obtained a few exclusives from the games I didn't have from GTS, I put together a fairly simple but surprisingly effective squad of defensive 'mons that I thought I'd try in online competitive play. Taking note of normal hazards like weather and common threats, I tried to be prepared for at least some of them while still keeping team synergy in tact. I decided to not go for a weather team just to be different, but still bound each member together through shared use of entry hazards and status moves. Donphan (the only non-5th gen member), though very useful on the whole, was added for tradition's sake, since I've had one on my team since forever. The remaining fighters had to have a few things in common: namely, they had to bulky, had to have some contribution to the forced-switch, stall dynamic, and they could either heal or at least buff themselves to contribute raw power when needed. I think it worked. At least, it seems to do okay, but hopefully someone can tell me if I've done something horribly wrong with it or overlooked something else entirely. That's what RMT is all about!

    Original chart:
    Show Hide

    The body donors to this digital experiment. While I tried to keep the weaknesses as manageable as possible (though two 'mons did end up with one 4x weakness each), I also tried to see how type immunities I could get to offset this. The team ended up with a whopping seven separate full immunities across the whole lot, and a fairly decent list of 50% resists as well (covering everything except Ground and Flying). This of course fits into the whole goal of a stall/heavy bulk team.

    Average Team Stats:
    HP: 94.83
    Atk: 77.33
    Def: 94.33
    Sp.A: 85.67
    Sp.D: 94.33
    Spd: 56.67

    In addition, by balancing the team's stats, I ended up with near equal-parts HP, DEF, and SP.D (not accounting for EVs), which, despite different specialties among team members, still comes up to be above-average on the whole without too much sacrifice in power. I know this doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things, but I did find it interesting. Also of note: the team's low speed means that even though I don't run Trick Room, I could potentially reap the benefits of it should my opponent use it, aside from maybe Volcarona.

    New team changes in red.

    Ferrothorn [​IMG]Shed Shell
    Relaxed Nature (252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SpD)
    Ability: Iron Barbs
    * Power Whip [​IMG]
    * Leech Seed [​IMG]
    * Thunder Wave [​IMG]
    * Spikes

    Ferrothorn's usefulness is multifold: not only is a great spikes user, but it can also spread paralysis to enforce switches with Thunder Wave and wall bulky waters that would otherwise plague other teammates. Leech Seed allows the little metal plantella to stay in the fight longer and also provides healing to its comrades, particularly Mandibuzz who suffers recoil from Brave Bird. Shed Shell means that it can always switch out and pass the love to something else if need be. It's EVs are equally spread across Defense and Special Defense to maximize effectiveness against both kinds of attack. Power Whip is there for it to be a threat against water types like Vaporeon and Starmie, both usually have little recourse against it unless they're packing HP Fire.

    Donphan [​IMG]Leftovers
    Adamant Nature (252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def)
    Ability: Sturdy
    * Earthquake [​IMG]
    * Stealth Rock [​IMG]
    * Stone Edge [​IMG]
    * Rapid Spin

    Standard spinning Donphan, but is otherwise invaluable for getting rid of the entry hazards that would defeat the whole point of a stall team. While it might seem odd to not include the more bulky Impish version on a team like this, Donphan provides much needed muscle in the absence of any kind of buff or healing move, and for possibly taking out Skarmory, who, left unchecked, would end up walling the majority of the team. Stealth Rock is there to contribute to the switching madness enforced by other teammates, and with Sturdy it's a guaranteed way to insure an entry hazard on proper switch, even if Ferrothorn for some reason couldn't do its job. It's also a good deterrent to Dragonite in conjunction with Stone Edge. Ferrothorn also does a great job of taking care of possible Donphan counters while spreading paralysis to offset the elephant's less than desirable speed while it proceeds to 2HKO many common checks. Gets a free switch on electric types looking to attack Mandibuzz or Jellicent.

    Mandibuzz [​IMG]Leftovers
    Careful Nature (252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD)
    Ability: Overcoat
    * Brave Bird [​IMG]
    * Roost [​IMG]
    * Toxic [​IMG]
    * Whirlwind

    Mandibuzz plays to her strength as a special wall, but was specifically chosen due to her typing (Flying is particularly good since even though none of the team is weak to ground, none of them resist it either) and ability to Whirlwind away potential Steel types unaffected by Toxic (Or an enemy Reuniclus who just plain won't be hurt by it), as well as play off the entry hazards laid by Ferrothorn and Donphan. Roost keeps her in the game as long as possible and when used in combination of leftovers and Ferrothorn's Leech seed, completely counters the health loss of Brave Bird. She fears no Earthquake, the go-to physical move for more than a few 'mons, and gets a free switch on anything Psychic, though they typically have little effect on the team in general. Overcoat also makes sure that weather team damage won't be an additional factor in all this. The versatile vulture also appreciates Donphan's spinning, who can also freely switch in on most of her threats.

    Jellicent [​IMG]Leftovers
    Calm Nature (252 HP / 36 Def / 220 SpD)
    Ability: Water Absorb
    * Scald [​IMG]
    * Ice Beam [​IMG]
    * Will-O-Wisp [​IMG]
    * Recover

    The wibbly-wobbly Jellicent is the second special sponge besides Manibuzz and is tailor-made to counter two specific team threats: Water (which it switches in for free), and Dragons, especially Salamence and Dragonite. Not to mention it's an excellent spin-blocker. While it's non-existent special attack EVs means it can't really function as a full-on attacker, the potential for both burn and freeze are nice bonuses when it has to go all out. Will-O-Wisp was chosen instead of the popular Toxic to keep Scald from possibly counteracting the poison proc, and because no Fire type in it's right mind would switch in on it. Speaking of which, it also serves as a counter to any would-be fire-starters threatening Ferrothorn, or Steel and Rock types hassling Mandibuzz. Getting a free switch on Normal (Exploders) and Fighting attacks (particularly those aimed at Ferrothorn) is always a plus.

    Reuniclus [​IMG]Leftovers
    Bold Nature (252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD)
    Ability: Magic Guard
    * Psychic [​IMG]
    * Calm Mind [​IMG]
    * Focus Blast [​IMG]
    * Recover

    Reuniclus' stats, coupled with Calm Mind, are a devastating combination that also provides exceptional bulk. Couple with with Recover, and you've got a crazy powerful wall/sweeper that's immune to weather and just plain won't go down. Focus Blast, aside from the being the only Fighting attack on the team, is there to keep Dark types from walling it to kingdom come, and can make every quick work of Tyranitar, keeping it from harming Mandibuzz or Volcarona in the process. It's also a great counter to common Fighting types, especially Lucario and Mienshao, and has the tools to take out Cloyster, hopefully while wavering a Shell Smash assault. While Reuniclus can function well at any point in the battle, it works best with a healthy slathering of paralysis thanks to Ferrothorn, or when Scizor has been taken care of by Volcarona.

    Calm Nature (248 HP/ 8 Def / 212 SpD /40 Spe)
    Ability: Flash Fire
    * Lava Plume
    * Toxic
    * Protect
    * Roar

    Taking Volcarona's place as a true stalling fire type, Heatran adds an additional poison immunity and new fire-type immunity via its ability. Unlike its semi-legendary cousin, it's not completely cornered by Stealth Rock and can still dish out heavy damage despite a buff move, especially against the likes of Scizor, Ferrothorn, and Skarmory. While not necessarily a late-game clean-up sweeper, Heatran can function well whenever its needed, and it's always nice to have a backup if things go south early on. Protect gives Toxic a chance to do its thing while Roar not only gets rid of unwanted counters but also forces some nice additional damage with either Spikes or Stealth Rock on the field.

    Previous member:
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    Volcarona [​IMG]Leftovers
    Bold Nature (240 HP / 216 Def / 52 Spe)
    Ability: Flame Body
    * Bug Buzz [​IMG]
    * Quiver Dance [​IMG]
    * Fiery Dance
    * Morning Sun [​IMG]

    The heavy hitter of the team, Volcarona, like Reuniclus, can buff itself to be a offensive and defensive powerhouse with great self-healing in Morning Sun. By far the quickest member, it brings a much-needed air of velocity among all the slow plodding walls, and it's also the only real traditional sweeper on the squad. The few points spent in speed allow it to outpace common threats even before Quiver Dance, and after that, well, it's cleanup time. With Donphan's Rapid Spin keeping it away from pointy rocks, it's able to bring down the fire and look good doing it. It's Bug stabs are very useful in dealing with Psychic and Dark-types that always tend to pop up like Alakazam and Umbreon, and Fiery Dance takes care of the Ice types looking to hurt Donphan and Manibuzz. It also serves as a big counter to Scizor, who's pretty much the natural enemy of Reuniclus.

    Didn't Make the Cut
    I've always been a big fan of Miltank, and although a Curse version with Heal Bell would fit beautifully into this team's dynamic, as well as add in a potential 8th type immunity, she unfortunately wouldn't be forcing switches any time soon unless Body Slam proc'd. Wish Jirachi would have been nice too, but no matter who it replaced I'd still be doubling up on either Steel or Psychic and it would throw the who type balance off kilter. I've also never really been keen on Blissey, but she was also considered. She does one thing incredibly well, and it would have been decent here, but I almost feel like you have to build a team around her to be any good.

    Y'know, this section was hard to write since I'm not sure if these are legit threats or if I just suck. Either way, what gave me problems, in general, were Rain stall teams. This is largely due to me having no Electric attacks. Jellicent can wall off anything water related, and Ferroseed can provide some damage, but I seem to have an issue keeping up the pace. All I can say is, thank goodness Drizzle/Swift Swim isn't even an option.

    Also, Skarmory's Spike setup is spun away by Donphan, but aside from that the only real way to hurt it aside from Donphan itself is with Volcarona, who gets blasted by Brave Bird more often than not since Quiver Dance provides no physical protection. Lack of Taunt can mess me up as well, especially with Dragon Dancers like Salamence, who, although hurt bad by Jellicent or Donphan, greatly out-speeds them often has the tools to smack my team up while they're trying to lay down some statuses or fortify some kind of defense. Best I can hope for there is to Whirlwind it out and make it start from scratch. I'd love a Heal Bell user of some kind too, but I haven't been able to think of a good way to implement one.

    Thoughts and Thanks
    Well, that's that... I think. If I'm missing something or if there's something that needs changing please let me know. This is my first RMT, after all. I've considered giving Jellicent Energy Ball in place of Ice Beam to act as a true water-type counter, maybe swapping one of Donphan's moves for Ice Shard to make up for the lost damage to dragons. Another Toxic somewhere else might be helpful too, but I'd like some input first. I also truly wish Mandibuzz learned Pursuit. Man, that'd be good here. Pre-emptive thanks to anyone reading and contributing to this, and thanks to both Bulbapedia for the images and Marriland for the team type chart!
  2. XcRunner


    Mar 3, 2011
    Hey, I like the originality of the team, but I'm thinking that Heatran may do a much better job than Volcarona does at being a defensive fire type. You could use
    -Lava Plume
    248 hp/252 spD/8 spe
    You already have stealth rock, so going for a set meant specifically for tanking works well. I can't think of other changes really that wouldn't change your whole team around, but I may edit this later if I think of anything else. This was just something that stuck out to me since you already have Reuniclus as a set up special sweeper.
  3. Ratatat


    Oct 6, 2006
    That's a fitting suggestion. I like Volcarona since it's kinda the best of both worlds - bulky, but fast, which doesn't necessarily mesh with the rest of the team, but it's nice to have speed when I absolutely need it (plus the heal move's nice). But now that I look at it, Heatran would give me two 'mons immune to poison, and add another immunity to fire with Flash Fire for another safe switch-in. Plus, it gives me another Toxic to throw around. I'd hate to lose the Bug moves, but I might trying to do too much with that anyway.

    Thanks for the idea! I'm going to think about this some more and see if this is a better fit. If you have any more thoughts by all means post them.
  4. jle1076


    Jan 4, 2011
    But its 4x weakness to stealth rock is a sad story..I think Heatran would also fit better
  5. Honus

    Honus with them
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Mar 23, 2011
    Hey man cool team, but I'd swap Volcarona with Heatran. Stall depends on being able to constantly switch and use its Pokemon to check the threats they are designated to. While Volcarona is cool for countering stuff like Scizor with its nice bulk and recovery, as well as the fact that it can pull off a late game sweep, but the 4x SR weakness is just too detrimental for Volcarona to be on any stall teams, really. Any clever opponent can simply set SR and force Volcarona in with something that Volc is designated to beat and either force Volcarona to take 50% + possibly more or spin and let that Pokemon hurt it or set up. Plus, your Spinner, while durable is susceptible to constantly being beaten down by weak attacks and hazards, so Volcarona's weakness to SR can be easily exploited in this way as well, possibly opening a spot up for another Pokemon. Heatran is pretty close to a replacement for Volcarona since it retains its fire typing and is really great against most standard sun teams, as most Pokemon on them hate switching in on Sun-boosted Lava Plumes, and Heatran always comes in on Ninetales, so you can take advantage of this and double switch it in before spamming Lava Plume. Additionally, Heatran gives you another special wall and resist to Draco Meteors from Latios/Hydreigon, not to mention it has a nice FWG core with Jellicent and Ferrothorn and is quite productive with them.

    Heatran (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Flash Fire
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 212 SDef / 40 Spd
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Lava Plume
    - Protect
    - Roar

    I'm also seeing a bit of a weakness to Dragon Dance Scrafty on this team, since it can set up on Donphan or Jellicent thanks to Lum Berry and proceed to outspeed and 2HKO the rest of your team via Drain Punch [takes out Ferrothorn], Ice Punch [takes out Donphan, and Mandibuzz, which could also potentially end up switching into SR] and Crunch which 2HKOs Volcarona, Reuniclus and Jellicent after Scrafty DDs. You could potentially keep your team healthy, but keep in mind that it will take multiple members to take all of Scrafty's attacks once it reaches +1 and also multiple ones to break it down, so this could open up a sweep for another Pokemon since Scrafty can do serious damage to this team. Anyways I think you could maybe try a Skarmory over Ferrothorn. I feel like this team lacks a true Physical wall in that while Reuniclus and Jellicent are both bulky and check Physical threats, they aren't 'catch all's' for most physical threats such as Pokemon like Skarmory, Tangrowth, and Gliscor are and generally counter a few threats, although they do it well. Skarmory also works great with Reuniclus since it does sometimes have trouble with the strong onslaught of fighting types, although Reuniclus sponges them with ease. Reuniclus also lures in Pokemon like Specially Defensive Jirachi and Scizor, both of which are complete Spikesbait for Skarmory [bar Thunder Jirachi]. Skarmory also gives you a solid counter to Haxorus, because while Ferrothorn can take an Outrage, it can't truly hurt it and must watch out for Brick Breaks.

    Skarmory (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spd
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Spikes
    - Brave Bird
    - Whirlwind
    - Roost
  6. Superpowerdude

    Superpowerdude !
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Mar 15, 2012
    If your going for a Toxic Heatran i prefer
    -Lava Plume
    252 spA/252 spe/ 4 Hp

    with Heatrans typing he cause alot of switches so he can easily set up a sub and then Cripple the bulky watesr that switches in. Also behind a sub he can take a close combat from terrakion then when terakions defenses lowen from the side effect he can be Ko`ed by earthpower.
  7. Ratatat


    Oct 6, 2006
    I like that stat spread on Heatran, and I think it's a pretty clear consensus that's the 'mon I need to have. It's use as an anti-sunner is something I didn't consider either, so I'm glad you brought that up since the main perk of not being a weather team leaves me open to all sorts of weather counters. Now, even though I opted for Toxic instead of your suggested SR - since it's not like any steels will be coming in on it anyway and with SR and Spikes users already on the team I figured another status move in addition to Mandibuzz would even things out - I'm still very open to the idea and am going to try it out alongside it.

    Skarmory is another 'mon I considered, and will most likely end up adding later per your suggestion. I'm holding off for now since Ferrothorn is kind of a crux for the team ATM with paralysis and the only available grass move, but I'm kinda interested in the idea of a physically defensive Manibuzz clone. Like you said, Ferrothorn, Heatran, and Jellicent have a nice feng shui thing going, but it might be worth it to consider a replacement somewhere in there. Also, the more counters I have for Scizor, the better! Thanks for the input!

    I'm a big fan of offbeat movesets, and I do like the potential for Terrakion ownage, especially since it would otherwise annihilate 'Tran, but for a team like this I think I'll play it safe and go for a more traditional defensive spread. Revenge against revenge killers is sweet, but I have enough trouble just trying to stay alive!

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