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BW2 In-Game Tier List Discussion [Updated 7/24]

Discussion in 'Orange Islands' started by Stellar, Jul 2, 2012.

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  1. Progeusz

    Progeusz

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    Stop using words you don't understand. Ampharos has much higher stats except for Speed. Attack is meaningless (still, almost the same). Mareep isn't ohkod by neutral hits unlike Elekid. Early Thunderwave helps a lot.
    Mareep family is perfectly capable of using Electro Ball. It's not like every single mon has 80 base speed or more. Also, faster mons are usually frail, so 150 bp is redundant.
  2. Ondore

    Ondore

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    You need Waterfall to get the Razor Fang, don't you?

    (TBH, I caught the wild Gliscor and totally forogot Gligar itself was there.)
  3. Chou Toshio

    Chou Toshio @Fighting Necktie
    is an Artist Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

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    ^Oh whoops. Well let's say the rate is for the gliscor than :P
  4. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

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    lolno Mareep has instant twave, that's one advantage it has over the great lord magnemite. Electro Ball is perfectly usable on Ampharos, and the more important part is functioning as a STAB attack until discharge/thunderbolt.
  5. Son_of_Shadoo

    Son_of_Shadoo

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    I see what you did there.

    I posed this question a few pages ago, but it was ignored: how do Gothita and Solosis fare in the sequels?
  6. breh

    breh ⁰ ゝ⁰
    is a Smogon IRC AOPis a Tiering Contributor

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    I'm still not feeling high. Ampharos has less bulk than Electabuzz; this is an indisputable fact. Electabuzz gets Thunder Wave at 19 as an Elekid; you catch it at level 12 anyway so it's more or less equivalent. Electabuzz gets its STAB moves faster and remains fast throughout the game - as you said, it's not always forced to use Thunder Wave before Electro Ball.

    I concede that Ampharos has higher Special Attack (which is relevant once it learns Discharge) and can hold Lucky Egg, but in every other aspect, it seems inferior, unless you consider Power Gem to be a huge advantage.

    Mid is where it should go, I feel. I'll test it in my next run, I guess.

    Gothita I'd assume fares rather badly; I'd guess Solosis fares better but still not well. Both are slow and Gothitelle lacks oomph. Reuniclus, however, does have that nice SpA working for it and even gets STAB moves to abuse it very early on. I remember playing BW1 right around the time of release and thinking, "What is this attack that these rank prevos are using that keeps killing my Pokemon?" Hell, solosis even starts with 105 base SpA, which is pretty cool. (oh, and it gets Shadow Ball later... pity you can't get Calm Mind, though).
  7. Hemp Man

    Hemp Man

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    Does anyone know how good (...or bad) Leafeon is on this game?
  8. R_N

    R_N
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    Well, being post-game doesn't do it any favors
  9. Hemp Man

    Hemp Man

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    It is? I thought you could get him before?

    Well, this is awkward on my behalf...
  10. R_N

    R_N
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    unless something new was discovered you can only evolved into Leafeon at Pinwheel Forest and Glaceon at Twist Mountain

    Which... post-game
  11. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

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    solosis/gothita are pretty bad imo, they weren't exactly that stellar in bw1 and i don't see how they've improved in bw2. both should be low: goth can't hit hard and reuni is too slow.
  12. Antihaxxer

    Antihaxxer

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    Gothita has nice coverage with
    Psychic / Shadow Ball / Thunderbolt / Energy Ball (or Grass Knot couldn't remember), but she's too defensive (High Def Spe & Medium Speed and Average Sp Att)
  13. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

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    coverage is not everything (see magnemite). what's most important is high offenses + speed (see BW1 Archen) as well as availability. Gothita just doesn't work imo.
  14. Antihaxxer

    Antihaxxer

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    Yes Yes, it's not a top material but I do think that Gothita > Solosis :)
  15. Progeusz

    Progeusz

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    I said something. Stop.
    Elekid isn't born with Eviolite.
    You get Eviolite after ~10 levels of babying mon 1-2hkod by any stab. I don't like running back and forth to Poke Center and that's exactly why I boxed him after few tries of leveling up. Thundershock/Low Kick/Swift won't ohko anything.
    You can give Flaffy/Ampharos Lefties. Or Expert Belt. Or Lucky Egg. Flaffy can use Eviolite for a few levels too.
    Physical bulk of Eviolite Electabuzz is marginally higher than Ampharos'. Special ~20% higher. Leftovers easily make up for it.
    Ampharos survives longer and hits harder (or shorter but hits much harder). Electabuzz has more speed and learns moves a little bit faster but it could be somewhat redeemed by Lucky Egg. I'd say their performance is pretty similar.
  16. Pika25

    Pika25

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    To remind you, Eviolite is somewhere in Castelia City, just like the prequels.

    Starters: Oshawott high. Tepig high. Snivy mid-high. Each has its advantages and disadvantages versus different gyms (for example, the 8th gym is a water gym where Snivy's line has an advantage, Tepig's a disadvantage, Oshawott's breaks even) and they fare pretty much evenly elsewhere, including Elite Four, except possibly Iris; while Snivy lacks the offenses the other two have, it does have good boosting moves like Coil.

    Lucario: High. It is technically possible to get Lucario before you get that Basic Badge from Cheren. Catch Riolu at the ranch, and just walk along for several steps, and make sure it's daytime before it gains that crucial level. The reward is excellent typing and offenses, good speed, and a move pool to match, especially against pretty much the entire game.
  17. Jackie

    Jackie

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    I'd like to vote Lucario for Mid. He is commonly touted as being a special attacker yet aura sphere (the only primary STAB special attack learned by level-up (note breeding for vacuum wave is post game)) is not available until 51, making a choice for nature difficult. Being stuck with force palm until you either gain and spend BP for brick break or hit 55 is also a little disappointing.
  18. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

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    >ppl touting special attacking lucario
    >are you trolling

    Force Palm/Bone Rush is generally fine enough to work throughout the game, the only concern I have is that he's relatively frail. But he hits like a truck and if you really need a special attack you can just give him Dark Pulse once you get to PWT >.>
  19. Manveru123

    Manveru123

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    His SpA is slightly higher than his Atk, and he can use Calm Mind. Like I said a few pages back, my Lucario with Calm Mind, Dark Pulse, Aura Sphere and Dragon Pulse kicked ass. Not to mention he gets Aura Sphere 4 levels before Close Combat, and by that time he already has Calm Mind and Dark Pulse. So yeah, no hatin' on special attacking lucario kk.
  20. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

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    he's spending 95% of the game using physical attacks and the only special attack he has access to for that 95% is dark pulse. CM and Aura Sphere comes really late, to the point where i just stick with physical luke (my lucario is rash lol)

    also SD comes earlier than CM
  21. Manveru123

    Manveru123

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    Except I don't see a single reason to use him over Heracross if you want a physical fighting type.
  22. Mario With Lasers

    Mario With Lasers Self-proclaimed DEAD king
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    I don't even know where TM04 is in this game lol. I wouldn't even touch special Lucario, to be honest. Until level 37, it has access to Return, Force Palm, Counter, Quick Attack, Rock Tomb, Payback, Ice Punch, Bone Rush and Swords Dance. He might be frail and have a subpar STAB, but its coverage is nice and at least it has something on the physical spectrum.

    If I were to use a special Lucario, I'd try Zoroark instead lol
  23. IOS

    IOS

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    You don't get a "vote" if you haven't played the game.
  24. IncantareFox

    IncantareFox

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    TM04 is buyable at Striaton, along with TM08.
  25. Count Serperior

    Count Serperior

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    Dunno why you guys are argueing over special/physical Lucario tbh.

    There's nothing to discuss:
    He can easily go goth ways, mine (obviously) started out as a physical attacker, then as he learnt more moves he turned special.

    Now I have Aura Sphere/Dragon Pulse/Shadow Ball/Close Combat.

    Just do what you want, both are viable endgame, you're just forced to use physical in the beginning.
    It's up to you really.
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