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Cacturne (GP 2/2)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Endorfins, May 15, 2012.

  1. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
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    [Overview]

    <p>The NU tier appears to be the perfect place for Cacturne to plant itself; not only are its Spiking abilities in high demand, but it also possesses excellent offenses and a unique typing. Unlike many other Spikes users, Cacturne isn't setup bait in any sense of the word; it has access to the deadly Sucker Punch which bypasses Cacturne's poor Speed and lets it revenge kill weakened opposition. Cacturne's typing also grants it an immunity to Psychic-type moves, which are common in the NU tier. Its Dream World ability, Water Absorb, adds another immunity to Cacturne's repertoire, letting it comfortably switch into Water-type moves from the dangerous Gorebyss and Ludicolo before threatening them out with Sucker Punch. Unfortunately, Cacturne's non-existent defenses and poor defensive typing leave it exposed to many powerful Pokemon in the tier such as Sawk, Gurdurr, and Emboar. Cacturne's terrible Speed, while partially remedied by Sucker Punch, is a severe let down when it comes to laying down Spikes; many opposing Pokemon will be able to limit Cacturne to only one or two layers at most before outspeeding and KOing through its weak defenses. Using Cacturne efficiently requires excellent prediction , as its poor bulk and reliance on Sucker Punch leave little margin for error. However, in the right hands, Cacturne will be able to leave its opposition surrounded by Spikes and trembling in fear.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive Spiker
    move 1: Spikes
    move 2: Sucker Punch
    move 3: Bullet Seed
    move 4: Encore / Substitute
    item: Leftovers
    ability: Sand Veil
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>While Cacturne lacks bulk when compared to Spikers such as Garbodor and Omanyte, it makes up for its frailty with offensive presence. Instead of taking hits and setting up Spikes, Cacturne can force opponents out with the threat of its powerful attacks and set up Spikes in the process. Sucker Punch is great for Cacturne as it can revenge kill weakened threats such as Gorebyss; if your opponent wishes to evade Sucker Punch, Cacturne can safely set up Spikes. Sucker Punch and Spikes can force a deadly mind game for your opponent, but keep in mind that the same applies to Cacturne. If your opponent chooses to attack Cacturne as it sets up Spikes, chances are that Cacturne will be KOed or severely weakened, with only one layer of Spikes to show for it. Bullet Seed synergies very well with Cacturne's other moves as it breaks through Substitutes set up by Pokemon such as Haunter hoping to evade Sucker Punch. Bullet Seed also has an added benefit of bypassing Sturdy on Golem and Gigalith. Since many stay in to set up Stealth Rock, Cacturne can score some easy KOs. The last slot rounds out Cacturne's prediction filled set. Encore allows Cacturne to shut down Pokemon reliant on setup moves and status; Quiver Dance users such as Butterfree can be encored into a setup move, either forcing them to switch or letting you set up numerous layers of Spikes. Substitute eases prediction and forces the opponent to attack Cacturne in order to remove its Substitute. Using Cacturne requires excellent prediction skills as it is very frail and reliant on Sucker Punch, and while Encore and Subtitute can help to some extent, Cacturne's performance is normally a measure of its trainer's skill.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EV spread is a basic offensive spread that makes the most of Cacturne's offenses and Spiking ability. With 252 Speed EVs and a Jolly nature, Cacturne can outspeed important benchmarks such as Samurott and Timid Gorebyss without having to rely on Sucker Punch. Maximum Speed also lets Cacturne set up Spikes on as many Pokemon as possible before it gets KOed. Maximum Attack investment lets Cacturne make the most of Sucker Punch and Bullet Seed, and the remaining EVs go into HP. Investing any EVs in Cacturne's bulk is almost useless as it has numerous weaknesses and is quite frail, even with investment. Leftovers is the main option to ensure that Cacturne can continuously create Substitutes and set up Spikes without wearing itself down. However, you can opt to run Life Orb on Cacturne if you feel that the extra power is necessary. One of the greatest advantages of using Life Orb is that Cacturne can OHKO -1 Gorebyss, preventing an otherwise deadly sweeper from rampaging through your team. With prediction, Cacturne can net opportunities to mitigate its Life Orb recoil using its other ability. Water Absorb, which allows it to regain 25% of its HP upon switching into a Water-type move. Unfortunately, Water Absorb is illegal with some of Cacturne's greatest assets, Bullet Seed and Encore. If you choose to run Water Absorb, then Seed Bomb can be used over Bullet Seed, and Substitute can take the place of Encore. Swords Dance, Superpower or Drain Punch can be used in the last slot for greater offensive presence. Swords Dance enables Cacturne to potentially go on a late-game sweep, whereas Drain Punch and Superpower allow Cacturne to effectively damage Probopass and Bastiodon while potentially regaining health.</p>

    <p>Taunt users such as Skuntank and Rapid Spinners such as Armaldo are the greatest threats to not only Cacturne, but also its ability to effectively lay down Spikes. Skuntank can easily Taunt Cacturne to prevent any Spikes from being laid down while also resisting both of Cacturne's STAB attacks. Armaldo can also scare Cacturne out and Rapid Spin away Cacturne's hard work. Therefore, Golem is an excellent teammate for Cacturne as it can both set up Stealth Rock and destroy Skuntank and Armaldo with its STAB attacks. It also has Sucker Punch which can help revenge kill Pokemon not defeated by Cacturne's Sucker Punch. Golem also attracts Water-type attacks for Cacturne to switch into.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Sucker Punch
    move 3: Bullet Seed
    move 4: Drain Punch / Encore / Substitute
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Sand Veil
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Much like the dangerous Swords Dance Absol, Swords Dance Cacturne aims to sweep the opponent with a boosted Attack stat and devastating Sucker Punch. Although Cacturne may not seem to have the Speed to sweep through most teams, it can use the extremely powerful Sucker Punch to strike first and annihilate the opposition. However, Cacturne can differentiate itself from the Disaster Pokemon with a secondary STAB move and access to unique support moves. Bullet Seed is Cacturne's secondary STAB of choice and gels well with Sucker Punch, as it shares excellent neutral coverage with it while being able to break through Substitutes set up by Pokemon hoping to avoid Sucker Punch, and bypasses Golem's Sturdy. The last slot can either help Cacturne to set up or give it greater coverage. Drain Punch gives Cacturne perfect neutral coverage in the NU tier, hitting Pokemon such as Skuntank who would otherwise resist Cacturne's STAB attacks. It also lets Cacturne easily get past Bastiodon and Probopass while also restoring health and negating Life Orb recoil. Encore lets Cacturne lock opponents into ineffective moves such as a setup move or entry hazards. Cacturne can then either set up Swords Dance or let a teammate switch in safely. Substitute protects Cacturne from status and acts as a one time buffer from revenge killers.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>252 Attack EVs and an Adamant nature enable Cacturne to hit extremely hard, even without any boosts. Maximum Speed investment minimizes Cacturne's reliance on Sucker Punch, while also opening up more opportunities to use Encore or Substitute against slower, more defensive Pokemon. A Jolly nature can be used to outspeed opponents such as Gorebyss; however, most of the time, Sucker Punch will be more than enough to OHKO fast, frail opponents. A Life Orb grants Cacturne even more power, and the loss of bulk is negligible as Cacturne is already very frail. However, Leftovers is also a valid item choice, especially if Cacturne chooses to run Substitute in the last slot. Just keep in mind that the power loss is noticeable. Seed Bomb can replace Bullet Seed as the Grass-type STAB move of choice if you find that you need the reliability of Seed Bomb. However, it cannot OHKO Golem through Sturdy, and Bullet Seed hits just as hard on average. Sand Veil is once again the standard ability, as Bullet Seed and Encore are both illegal with Water Absorb. However, Cacturne's Dream World ability can be very useful, giving Cacturne an easy setup on Water-type moves such as the ubiquitous Scald and Gorebyss's Surf. If you choose to use Water Absorb, then replace Bullet Seed with Seed Bomb. As Encore is illegal with Water Absorb, Substitute is the most useful move to use; however, another option is Spikes. With Spikes, Cacturne can bluff a Spikes set early on in the game while also weakening opponents for its late game sweep.</p>

    <p>Tangela walls Cacturne cold, and can stop it setting up further with either Sleep Powder or Hidden Power Ice. Charizard and Emboar are good teammates because they can both comfortably take on Tangela with STAB Fire-type attacks. Misdreavus is immune to the Fighting-type attacks that Cacturne hates, while the cactus can switch into Dark and Ghost-type assaults directed at Misdreavus. Golem is another useful teammate as it can easily set up Stealth Rock to hamper Flying and Fire-types that commonly switch into Cacturne. Golem also lures in Grass- and Water-type attacks for Cacturne to set up on.</p>


    [Other Options]

    <p>Although most Cacturne sets choose to attack from the physical side, Cacturne has an oft overlooked Special Attack stat, which can be further boosted by Nasty Plot. Unfortuantely, this means that Cacturne loses out on Sucker Punch, which is one of its biggest selling points. As a result, specially-based Cacturne are far easier to revenge kill as they rarely run Sucker Punch. Cacturne can also run a Choice set, being able to utilize Choice Band, Choice Specs, and even Choice Scarf. With Switcheroo, Cacturne can cripple walls and switch around items. Unfortunately, Switcheroo is illegal with Bullet Seed, and a Choice-locked Cacturne loses its ability to effectively Spikes-stack. Cacturne can also run a decent SubPunch set which hits extremely hard off its base 115 Attack stat; however, Cacturne can rarely set up a Substitute safely, and it would be better off using the spare turn to either set up Spikes or boost its stats. Grasswhistle round out Cacturne's rather shallow movepool. Keep in mind that Grasswhistle is extremely inaccurate and is likely to miss almost half the time.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Cacturne's reliance on Sucker Punch means that certain Pokemon can take advantage of it. Quiver Dancing Bug-types or Substitute users, such as Butterfree or Haunter, can both set up on Cacturne as it tries, in vain, to strike with Sucker Punch. Both resist Cacturne's Grass-type STAB move, which enables them to set up with ease. The only hope Cacturne has is if it can Encore their setup move or have perfect prediction with Sucker Punch. Fighting-types also spell doom for Cacturne, as they resist its Sucker Punch; faster Fighting-types such as Sawk and Emboar can strike Cacturne down with STAB Fighting- or Fire-type moves, while Gurdurr can easily set up multiple Bulk Ups on Cacturne. Being a scarecrow, it is quite ironic that Cacturne fears birds such as Braviary and Murkrow. Braviary can devastate Cacturne with Brave Bird, although a boosted Sucker Punch KOes it after Stealth Rock. Murkrow is even more dangerous, as it resists both of Cacturne's STAB moves, can prevent Spikes with Taunt, and finish off Cacturne with Brave Bird. Due to Cacturne's excellent Attack stat and access to Swords Dance, it can be hard to wall Cacturne; however, the premier physical wall of NU, Tangela, can easily put a stop to Cacturne's sweeping attempts. It can even take a +6 Sucker Punch and cut down Cacturne with Hidden Power Ice or put it to sleep with Sleep Powder. Tangela does have to be wary of the rare specially based sets since they target Tangela's vulnerable Special Defense stat. Armaldo also counters Cacturne, taking a +2 Bullet Seed and retaliating with a powerful X-Scissor. Armaldo can also use Rapid Spin to blow away Cacturne's Spikes. Although Cacturne is rarely able to sweep a team, the Spikes it lays down can be far harder to get rid of, so Rapid Spin users are always helpful when facing Cacturne.</p>
  2. gec

    gec i've been crawling through the falling
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    Can't really say much, but maybe add a mention of Bullet Seed for lead Golem? Being able to stop it completely seems pretty good, especially since Cacturne makes a great lead.
  3. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
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    Great Idea, I've added it in!
    Also breaks through Substitutes hoping to setup on Sucker Punch
  4. steviestar

    steviestar

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    Charizard should be mentioned in checks and counters, substitute + life orb variants cockblock cacturne entirely.
  5. Django

    Django
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    You should mention Substitute and / or Sap Sipper Sawsbuck in Checks & Counters. Its a great option for offensive teams and completely stops any Cacturne without Drain Punch, setting up Substitute and Swords Dance for free.

    Emboar is a great partner, both for offensive and defensive synergy. It can break through Tangela and other physical walls that give Cacturne problems, while Cacturne can set up on Alomomola, the biggest stop to Emboar.

    Jolly should be the primary nature on the Spikes set. You mention that it beats standard Samurott, but this is not the case with Adamant. Standard SD Samurott (the one on-site) runs 144 EVs hitting a Speed stat of 212, and in practice I find it speed creeps on this quite a bit. Adamant Cacturne only hits 209, while Jolly will hit 229, which gets the jump on almost every SD Samurott, but will still lose to special or mixed variants which run max Speed. Jolly also allows you to use Substitute on standard stallbreaker Misdreavus, which is unlikely to run that many Speed EVs. Not to mention it at worst Speed ties with Exeggutor, and will beat most variants of Emboar, being able to Sub and scout the move. Those faster Spikes are invaluable in my opinion, as well as being able to effectively counter SD Samurott. Not to mention Jolly will outspeed Timid Gorebyss which is absolutely huge.

    Water Absorb is still pretty damn useful, mainly for the ability to stop SD Samurott cold, and provide an extra immunity to prevent Rain teams (which are getting more and more popular) from simply spamming STAB moves. Encore is a great move though, but the choice between the two should depend on what the users particular team needs to check.
  6. Zebraiken

    Zebraiken is it true what they say, that words are weapons?
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    Bullet Seed needs a ton more emphasis, imo. Being able to flat-out mash Golem and break Subs is awesome. I was looking at Bullet Seed damage vs some of the more common users - if you manage to get a 4-hit Bullet Seed on something like Haunter (which has switched into Cacturne before!), it's OHKOed something like 90% of the time after SR which is fantastic. You easily OHKO Golem unless you get unlucky and only get 2 hits in, but then Sucker Punch finishes it off anyway.

    Also agreeing with all of the above; when you do mention the abilities, make sure to say that if you aren't going to be using Drain Punch / Encore (which are the only two illegal moves iirc) then Cacturne should be using Water Absorb, which is a far superior ability since we don't have sand at all lol.
  7. Steamroll

    Steamroll Tasty
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    Drain Punch and Encore are the only two usable moves that are illegal with Water Absorb, beyond that Cacturne works wonderfully either way.
  8. DTC

    DTC ˢᵉʳᶦᵒᵘˢ
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    This is the Swords Dance set that I had the most success with:

    [SET]
    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Sucker Punch
    move 3: Bullet Seed
    move 4: Drain Punch / Encore / Substitute
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Sand Veil
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    The first set should be changed to this:

    [SET]
    name: Offensive Spiker
    move 1: Spikes
    move 2: Sucker Punch
    move 3: Bullet Seed
    move 4: Encore / Substitute / Swords Dance
    item: Leftovers / Life Orb
    ability: Sand Veil
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    Water Absorb is pretty useless on Cacturne. It helps it accomplish the following things: 1) Avoid the Aqua Jet from Floatziel and Samurott to Sucker Punch 2) Switch into water attacks when weakened then immediately switch out 3) Choice Water-types (Floatziel???) 4) Alomomola

    While all of that is nice, being able to run moves such as Bullet Seed, Drain Punch, and Encore is more useful, especially considering the fact that Cacturne is easily beaten by every Water-type other than Alomomola. Mention Water Absorb in AC.

    Drain Punch is a useful tool for healing, especially on SD sets. Not only does it heal Cacturne when its weakened by Life Orb/whatever hits it takes and survives, but it lets it get past threats such as Probopass, Sawsbuck, and Emboar better.

    Bullet Seed is better than Seed Bomb because on average, it'll do more damage than Seed Bomb. Not only that, but it also gets past Substitute and breaks through Sturdy. One of Cacturne's biggest faults is Pokemon being able to Substitute to avoid Cacturne's Sucker Punch - Bullet Seed breaks through that.

    Mention in the Overview that Cacturne is largely prediction based, but is worth it if you predict right. Mention in checks and counters that that is one of the best way of dealing with Cacturne: predicting right because its very easy to beat if you out-predict it, and there is many, many chances to do that unlike other Pokemon. Mention some Pokemon that force Cacturne into predicting, such as Substitute Charizard and Sawsbuck.

    Mention in checks and counters Emboar specifically. Emboar takes around 52% at most from +2 LO Drain Punch. It's the best offensive counter to Cacturne.

    Also, Bullet Seed is illegal with Water Absorb.

    Edit: Oh right, there is a 1/8 chance of hitting 4 or 5 times with Bullet Seed. Still.
  9. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
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    @djangoo
    Samurott still destroys Cacturne with Megahorn
    @DTC
    Seed Bomb still outdamages bullet Seed on average.

    Otherwise I've put in most of your changes but I personally prefer Encore in the last slot.
  10. DTC

    DTC ˢᵉʳᶦᵒᵘˢ
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    Ah right, my mistake. Anyways, this looks good.

    Mention that its immunities can be very helpful for some teams. I remember Cacturne being very useful on my immunity spam team.

    QC Approve 1/3
  11. Zebraiken

    Zebraiken is it true what they say, that words are weapons?
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    QC APPROVED (2/3)
  12. Django

    Django
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    Cool you went with Jolly.

    QC APPROVE 3/3

    [​IMG]
  13. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
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    Thanks Guys
    Nice work on getting QC Django!
    This will be written up soon
  14. breh

    breh ● ︿ ●
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    I'd like to see a deslashing of Seed Bomb and a move to AC. Bullet Seed comes close to or totally outdamages (in this case, effective 3 hits vs. noncrit Seed Bomb and effective 6 hits vs. crit Seed Bomb) Seed Bomb a little under 70% of the time (it'll have at least 75 effective BP a little over 70% of the time). On the flipside, it allows you to flat out OHKO Golem, which is extremely pertinent (however, I'm kind of wondering when people will begin to stop using Golem to lead or stop being so damn ballsy with it...).
  15. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
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    Bullet Seed can hit harder, however Seed Bomb is stronger than Bullet Seed on average and sometimes, reliability is better especially if Cacturne is looking to sweep.
  16. breh

    breh ● ︿ ●
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    no, it's actually about as strong as bullet seed on average, factoring critical hits.

    (the average damage compared between the two is 84.1885 BP vs. 85 BP)

    Since I can't find the thread from which this came outside of cached copies, I'll post its contents here:

    Show Hide


    Frankly, I find that the increased BP of Bullet Seed is more useful than Seed Bomb's constant power, especially in a metagame where Golem exists. The chance that you get BP higher than 80 is 18% with Bullet Seed and 6.25% with Seed Bomb. That's a pretty big drop.
  17. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
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    Ok I made the change, although this kinda stuff should be going in the NU analysis discussion thread since its already passed QC.
  18. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
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  19. Zystral

    Zystral めんどくさい、な~
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    there were a lot of basic errors here. try rereading the grammar standards thread and where you went wrong should be immediately visible.

    1/2 approved, in any case
  20. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
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    Thanks!
    Ready for GP check number 2
  21. Amarillo

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    I'll give it a try (placeholder, will edit it in)

    Show Hide

    These Go These Stay Comments

    [Overview]

    <p>The NU tier appears to be the perfect place for Cacturne to plant itself; not only are its Spiking abilities in high demand, but it also possesses excellent offenses and a unique typing. Unlike many other Spikes users, Cacturne isn't a setup bait in any sense of the word: it has access to the deadly Sucker Punch which bypasses Cacturne's poor Speed and lets it revenge kill weakened opposition. Cacturne's typing also grants it an immunity to Psychic-type moves which are common in the NU tier. Its Dream World ability, Water Absorb, adds another immunity to Cacturne's repertoire, letting it comfortably switch into Water-type moves from the dangerous Gorebyss and Ludicolo before threatening them out with Sucker Punch. Unfortunately, Cacturne's non-existant non-existent defenses and poor defensive typing leave it exposed to many powerful Pokemon in the tier such as Sawk, Gurdurr, and Magmortar. Its terrible Speed, while partially remedied by Sucker Punch, is a severe let down when it comes to laying down Spikes. Many opposing Pokemon will be able to limit Cacturne to only one or two layers at most before outspeeding and KOing through its weak defenses. Using Cacturne efficiently requires excellent prediction. While its poor bulk and reliance of on Sucker Punch leave little margin for error, in the right hands, Cacturne will be able to leave its opposition surrounded by Spikes and trembling in fear.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive Spiker
    move 1: Spikes
    move 2: Sucker Punch
    move 3: Bullet Seed
    move 4: Encore / Substitute
    item: Leftovers
    ability: Sand Veil
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>While Cacturne lacks bulk when compared to Spikers such as Garbodor and Omanyte, it can more than make makes up for that with offensive presence. Instead of taking hits and setting up Spikes, Cacturne can force opponents out with the threat of its powerful attacks and set (add space)up Spikes in the process. Sucker Punch is great for Cacturne as it can revenge kill weakened threats such as Gorebyss,; (add semicolon) if your opponent wishes to evade Sucker Punch, Cacturne can safely set (add space)up Spikes. Sucker Punch and Spikes can force a deadly mind game for your opponent, but keep in mind that the same applies to Cacturne. If your opponent chooses to attack Cacturne as it sets up Spikes, chances are that Cacturne will be KOed or severely weakened, with only one layer of Spikes to show for it. Bullet Seed synergies very well with Cacturne's other moves as it breaks through Substitutes set (add space)up by Pokemon such as Haunter hoping to evade Sucker Punch. Bullet Seed also has an added benefit in that it bypasses the of bypassing Sturdy of Pokemon such as on Golem and Gigalith. Since many stay in to set (add space)up Stealth Rock, Cacturne can score some easy KOs. The last slot rounds out Cacturne's prediction-filled set: Encore can shut down Pokemon reliant on setup moves and status. Quiver Dance users such as Butterfree can be encored into a setup move, either forcing them to switch or letting you set up numerous layers of Spikes. Substitute eases prediction and forces the opponent to attack Cacturne in order to remove its Substitute. Using Cacturne requires excellent prediction skills as it is very frail and reliant on Sucker Punch, and while Encore and Subtitute can help to some extent, Cacturne's performance is normally a measure of its trainers skill.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EV spread is a basic offensive spread that makes the most of Cacturne's offenses and Spiking ability. With 252 Speed EVs and a Jolly nature, Cacturne can outspeed important benchmarks such as Samurott and Timid Gorebyss without having to rely on Sucker Punch. Maximum Speed also lets Cacturne set up Spikes on as many Pokemon as possible, adding an extra layer before it gets KOed. Maximum Attack investment lets Cacturne make the most of Sucker Punch and Bullet Seed, and the remaining EVs go into HP. Investing any EVs in Cacturne's bulk is almost useless as it has numerous weaknesses and even with investment it is quite frail. Leftovers is the main option to ensure that Cacturne can continuously create Substitutes and set (add space)up Spikes without wearing itself down. However, you can opt to run a Life Orb on Cacturne if you feel the extra power is necessary. One of the greatest advantages of using a Life Orb is that Cacturne can OHKO -1 Gorebyss, preventing an otherwise deadly sweeper from rampaging through your team. Cacturne can still mitigate its Life Orb recoil if you can predict well with Cacturne's arguably superior ability Water Absorb which lets it restore 25% of its HP just by switching into a Water-type move. Unfortunately, (add comma) it is illegal with some of Cacturne's greatest assets: Bullet Seed and Encore. If you choose to run Water Absorb, then Seed Bomb can be used over Bullet Seed, and Subtitute can take the place of Encore. If you want to run Cacturne in a more offensive manner, then Swords Dance or Drain Punch can be used in the last slot for greater offensive presence. Swords Dance enables Cacturne to potentially go on a late-game sweep, whereas Drain Punch allows Cacturne to effectively damage Probopass and Bastiodon while also regaining health. Keep in mind, however, that Drain Punch is also illegal with Water Absorb.</p>

    <p>Taunt users such as Skuntank and Rapid Spinners such as Armaldo are the greatest threats to not only Cacturne, but also its ability to effectively lay down Spikes. Skuntank can easily Taunt Cacturne to prevent any Spikes from being laid down while also resisting both of Cacturne's STAB attacks. Armaldo can also scare Cacturne out and Rapid Spin away Cacturne's hard work. Therefore, Golem is an excellent teammate for Cacturne as it can both set up Stealth Rock and destroy Skuntank and Armaldo with its STAB attacks. It also has Sucker Punch which can help revenge kill Pokemon not defeated by Cacturne's Sucker Punch. Golem also attracts Water-type attacks for Cacturne to switch into.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Sucker Punch
    move 3: Bullet Seed
    move 4: Drain Punch / Encore / Substitute
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Sand Veil
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Much like the dangerous Swords Dance Absol, Swords Dance Cacturne aims to sweep the opponent with a boosted Attack stat courtesy of Swords Dance Sucker Punch with little resistance. (add period) (I think it's self evident that Swords Dance Cacturne boosts its attack "courtesy of swords dance") Although Cacturne may not seem to have the Speed to sweep through most teams, it can use the extremely powerful Sucker Punch to strike first and annihilate the opposition. This tactic is already well known courtesy of Absol's popularity. (Unnecessary)However, Cacturne can differentiate itself from the Disaster Pokemon with a secondary STAB move and access to unique support moves. Bullet Seed is Cacturne's secondary STAB of choice and gels well with Sucker Punch, having excellent neutral coverage with Sucker Punch while being able to break through Substitutes set up by Pokemon hoping to avoid Sucker Punch, as well as break the Sturdy of Pokemon such as Golem. The last slot can either help Cacturne to set up, or give it greater coverage. Drain Punch gives Cacturne perfect neutral coverage in the NU tier, hitting Pokemon such as Skuntank who would otherwise resist Cacturne's STAB attacks. It also lets Cacturne easily get pass Bastiodon and Probopass while also restoring health and negate Life Orb recoil. Encore lets Cacturne lock opponents into ineffective moves such as a setup move or entry hazards. It can then either set up Swords Dance or let a teammate switch in safely. Subtitute is an all-round great move for any sweeper as it (We're not interested in how substitute is a great move all-round; we're interested in why Substitute is a move for Cacturne.protects Cacturne from status and acts as a one time buffer from revenge killers.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>252 Attack EVs and an Adamant nature mean that Cacturne hits extremely hard even without any boosts. Maximum Speed investment also minimizes Cacturne's reliance on Sucker Punch, while also opening up a greater chance to use Encore or Substitute against slower, more defensive Pokemon. A Jolly nature can be used to outspeed opponents such as Gorebyss, but most of the time, Sucker Punch will be more than enough to OHKO fast, frail opponents. A Life Orb grants Cacturne even more power and the loss of bulk is negligible as Cacturne is already very frail. However, Leftovers is also a valid item choice, especially if Cacturne chooses to run Substitute in the last slot. (add period); but keep in mind, however, (Saying However twice in a single sentence is rarely a good idea) Just keep in mind that the power loss is noticeable. Seed Bomb can replace Bullet Seed as the Grass-type STAB move of choice if you find that you need the reliability of Seed Bomb. However, it cannot OHKO Golem through Sturdy, and Bullet Seed hits just as hard on average. Sand Veil is once again the standard ability, as Bullet Seed, Drain Punch, and Encore are all illegal with Water Absorb. However, Cacturne's Dream World ability can be very useful, giving Cacturne an easy set(delete space)up on Water-type moves such as the ubiquitous Scald and Gorebyss's Surf. If you choose to use Water Absorb, then replace Bullet Seed with Seed Bomb. As Drain Punch and Encore are both illegal with Water Absorb, Substitute is the most useful move to use; however, another option if Spikes. With Spikes, Cacturne can bluff a Spikes set early on in the game while also weakening opponents for its late game sweep.</p>

    <p>Tangela walls Cacturne cold, and can stop it setting up further with either Sleep Powder or Hidden Power Ice. Charizard and Magmortar are good teammates because they can both comfortably take on Tangela with STAB Fire-type attacks. Misdreavus is immune to the Fighting-type attacks that Cacturne hates, while the cactus can switch into Dark- and Ghost-type assaults directed at Misdreavus. Golem is another useful teammate as it can easily set up Stealth Rock to hamper Flying-, and Fire-types that commonly switch into Cacturne. Golem also lures in Grass- and Water-type attacks for Cacturne to set (add space)up on.</p>


    [Other Options]

    <p>Although most Cacturne sets choose to attack from the physical side, Cacturne has an oft overlooked Special Attack stat and which can be further boosted by Nasty Plot. Unfortunately, this means that Cacturne loses out on Sucker Punch, which is one its biggest attractions. As a result, specially-based Cacturne are far easier to revenge kill as they rarely run Sucker Punch. Cacturne can also run a Choice set, being able to utilize Choice Band, Choice Specs, and even Choice Scarf. With Switcheroo in its movepool, Cacturne can cripple walls and switch around items. Unfortunately, Switcheroo is illegal with Bullet Seed and Drain Punch, and a Choice locked Cacturne loses its ability to effectively Spikes-stack. Cacturne can also run a decent SubPunch set which hits extremely hard off its base 115 Attack stat; however, Cacturne can rarely set (add space)up a Substitute safely, and it would be better off using the spare turn to either set up Spikes or boost its stats. Brick Break and Grasswhistle round out Cacturne's rather shallow movepool, the former is compatible with Drain Punch and can shatter dual screens while the latter can be used to put something to sleep. Keep in mind that Grasswhistle is extremely inaccurate and is likely to miss almost half the time.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Cacturne's reliance on Sucker Punch means that certain Pokemon can take advantage of it. Quiver Dancing Bug-types and or Substitute users, (add comma) such as Butterfree or Haunter, (add comma) can both set (add space)up on Cacturne as it tries vainly to strike with Sucker Punch. (Haunter isn't a Quiver Dancing Bug-type) Both resist Cacturne's Grass-type STAB move so it they can setup set up with ease. The only hope Cacturne has is if it can Encore their setup move or have perfect prediction with Sucker Punch. Fighting-types also spell doom for Cacturne as they resist its Sucker Punch; faster Fighting-types such as Sawk and Emboar can strike Cacturne down with STAB Fighting or Fire-type moves, while Gurdurr can easily set up multiple Bulk Ups on Cacturne. Being a scarecrow, it is quite ironic that Cacturne fears birds such as Braviary and Murkrow. Braviary can devastate Cacturne with Brave Bird although a boosted Sucker Punch KOs it after Stealth Rock. Murkrow is even more dangerous as it resists both of Cacturne's STAB moves, can prevent Spikes with Taunt, and finish off Cacturne with Brave Bird. Due to Cacturne's excellent Attack stat and access to Swords Dance, it can be hard to wall Cacturne; however, the premier physical wall in Tangela can easily put a stop to Cacturne's sweeping attempts. It can even take a +6 Sucker Punch and cut down Cacturne with Hidden Power Ice or put it to sleep with Sleep Powder. Tangela does have to be wary of the rare specially based sets as they target Tangela's vulnerable Special Defense stat. Armaldo also counters Cacturne, taking a +2 Bullet Seed and retaliating with a powerful X-Scissor. Armaldo also can use Rapid Spin to blow away Cacturne's Spikes. Although Cacturne is rarely able to sweep a team, the Spikes it lays down can be far harder to get rid of.</p>


    eh i'm slow

    ps: ok lol I fixed stuff
  22. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2011
    Messages:
    546
    Thanks Amarillo

    I think I had them the wrong way round :p
  23. Woodchuck

    Woodchuck i am woodchuck
    is a Battle Server Administratoris a Smogon IRC AOPis a Forum Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    Messages:
    2,184
    amcheck
    Show Hide

    [Overview]

    <p>The NU tier appears to be the perfect place for Cacturne to plant itself; not only are its Spiking abilities in high demand, but it also possesses excellent offenses and a unique typing. Unlike many other Spikes users, Cacturne isn't setup bait in any sense of the word,; it has access to the deadly Sucker Punch which bypasses Cacturne's poor Speed and lets it revenge kill weakened opposition. Cacturne's typing also grants it an immunity to the copious numbers of Psychic-type moves which are common in the NU tier. Its Dream World ability, Water Absorb, adds another immunity to Cacturne's repertoire, letting it comfortably switch into Water-type moves from the dangerous Gorebyss and Ludicolo before threatening them out with Sucker Punch. Unfortunately, Cacturne's non-existent defenses and poor defensive typing leave it exposed to many powerful Pokemon in the tier such as Sawk, Gurdurr, and Magmortar. ItCacturne's terrible Speed, while partially remedied by Sucker Punch, is a severe let down when it comes to laying down Spikes. M; many opposing Pokemon will be able to limit Cacturne to only one or two layers at most before outspeeding and KOing through its weak defenses. Using Cacturne efficiently requires excellent prediction. While, as its poor bulk and reliance on Sucker Punch leave little margin for error;. However, in the right hands, Cacturne will be able to leave its opposition surrounded by Spikes and trembling in fear.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive Spiker
    move 1: Spikes
    move 2: Sucker Punch
    move 3: Bullet Seed
    move 4: Encore / Substitute
    item: Leftovers
    ability: Sand Veil
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>While Cacturne lacks bulk when compared to Spikers such as Garbodor and Omanyte, it makes up for thatits frailty with offensive presence. Instead of taking hits and setting up Spikes, Cacturne can force opponents out with the threat of its powerful attacks and set up Spikes in the process. Sucker Punch is great for Cacturne as it can revenge kill weakened threats such as Gorebyss; if your opponent wishes to evade Sucker Punch, Cacturne can safely set up Spikes. Sucker Punch and Spikes can force a deadly mind game for your opponent, but keep in mind that the same applies to Cacturne. If your opponent chooses to attack Cacturne as it sets up Spikes, chances are that Cacturne will be KOed or severely weakened, with only one layer of Spikes to show for it. Bullet Seed synergies very well with Cacturne's other moves as it breaks through Substitutes set up by Pokemon such as Haunter hoping to evade Sucker Punch. Bullet Seed also has an added benefit of bypassing Sturdy on Golem and Gigalith. Since many stay in to set up Stealth Rock, Cacturne can score some easy KOs. The last slot rounds out Cacturne's prediction filled set,. Encore canallows Cacturne to shut down Pokemon reliant on setup moves and status.; Quiver Dance users such as Butterfree can be encored into a setup move, either forcing them to switch or letting you set up numerous layers of Spikes. Substitute eases prediction and forces the opponent to attack Cacturne in order to remove its Substitute. Using Cacturne requires excellent prediction skills as it is very frail and reliant on Sucker Punch, and while Encore and Subtitute can help to some extent, Cacturne's performance is normally a measure of its trainer's skill.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EV spread is a basic offensive spread that makes the most of Cacturne's offenses and Spiking ability. With 252 Speed EVs and a Jolly nature, Cacturne can outspeed important benchmarks such as Samurott and Timid Gorebyss without having to rely on Sucker Punch. Maximum Speed also lets Cacturne set up Spikes on as many Pokemon as possible, adding an extra layer before it gets KOed. Maximum Attack investment lets Cacturne make the most of Sucker Punch and Bullet Seed, and the remaining EVs go into HP. Investing any EVs in Cacturne's bulk is almost useless as it has numerous weaknesses and is quite frail even with investment it is quite frail. Leftovers is the main option to ensure that Cacturne can continuously create Substitutes and set up Spikes without wearing itself down. However, you can opt to run a((I'm not sure if you are supposed to use "a" here, could a GP member check on this?)) Life Orb on Cacturne if you feel that the extra power is necessary. One of the greatest advantages of using a((same thing here)) Life Orb is that Cacturne can OHKO -1 Gorebyss, preventing an otherwise deadly sweeper from rampaging through your team. Cacturne can still mitigate its Life Orb recoil if you can predict well with Cacturne's arguably superioWith prediction, Cacturne can net opportunities to mitigate its Life Orb recoil using its other ability Water Absorb which lets, allowing it resto regain 25% of its HP just byupon switching into a Water-type move. Unfortunately, itWater Absorb is illegal with some of Cacturne's greatest assets, Bullet Seed and Encore. If you choose to run Water Absorb, then Seed Bomb can be used over Bullet Seed, and Substitute can take the place of Encore. ((maybe new paragraph here?)) Swords Dance or Drain Punch can be used in the last slot for greater offensive presence. Swords Dance enables Cacturne to potentially go on a late-game sweep, whereas Drain Punch allows Cacturne to effectively damage Probopass and Bastiodon while also regaining health. Keep in mind, however, that Drain Punch is also illegal with Water Absorb.</p>

    <p>Taunt users such as Skuntank and Rapid Spinners such as Armaldo are the greatest threats to not only Cacturne, but also its ability to effectively lay down Spikes. Skuntank can easily Taunt Cacturne to prevent any Spikes from being laid down while also resisting both of Cacturne's STAB attacks. Armaldo can also scare Cacturne out and Rapid Spin away Cacturne's hard work. Therefore, Golem is an excellent teammate for Cacturne as it can both set up Stealth Rock and destroy Skuntank and Armaldo with its STAB attacks. It also has Sucker Punch which can help revenge kill Pokemon not defeated by Cacturne's Sucker Punch. Golem also attracts Water-type attacks for Cacturne to switch into.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Sucker Punch
    move 3: Bullet Seed
    move 4: Drain Punch / Encore / Substitute
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Sand Veil
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Much like the dangerous Swords Dance Absol, Swords Dance Cacturne aims to sweep the opponent with a boosted Attack stat and devastating Sucker Punch. Although Cacturne may not seem to have the Speed to sweep through most teams, it can use the extremely powerful Sucker Punch to strike first and annihilate the opposition. However, Cacturne can differentiate itself from the Disaster Pokemon with a secondary STAB move and access to unique support moves. Bullet Seed is Cacturne's secondary STAB of choice and gels well with Sucker Punch, havingas it shares excellent neutral coverage with Sucker Punch while being able to, breaks through Substitutes set up by Pokemon hoping to avoid Sucker Punch, as well as breaknd bypasses the Sturdy ability of Pokemon such as Golem. The last slot can either help Cacturne to set up, or give it greater coverage. Drain Punch gives Cacturne perfect neutral coverage in the NU tier, hitting Pokemon such as Skuntank who would otherwise resist Cacturne's STAB attacks. It also lets Cacturne easily get passt Bastiodon and Probopass while also restoring health and negateing Life Orb recoil. Encore lets Cacturne lock opponents into ineffective moves such as a setup move or entry hazards. ItCacturne can then either set up Swords Dance or let a teammate switch in safely. Substitute protects Cacturne from status and acts as a one time buffer from revenge killers.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>252 Attack EVs and an Adamant nature mean that Cacturne hits extremely hard even without any boosts. Maximum Speed investment also minimizes Cacturne's reliance on Sucker Punch, while also opening up a greater chancemore opportunities to use Encore or Substitute against slower, more defensive Pokemon. A Jolly nature can be used to outspeed opponents such as Gorebyss, but; however, most of the time, Sucker Punch will be more than enough to OHKO fast, frail opponents. A Life Orb grants Cacturne even more power, and the loss of bulk is negligible as Cacturne is already very frail. However, Leftovers is also a valid item choice, especially if Cacturne chooses to run Substitute in the last slot. Just keep in mind that the power loss is noticeable. Seed Bomb can replace Bullet Seed as the Grass-type STAB move of choice if you find that you need the reliability of Seed Bomb. However, it cannot OHKO Golem through Sturdy, and Bullet Seed hits just as hard on average. Sand Veil is once again the standard ability, as Bullet Seed, Drain Punch, and Encore are all illegal with Water Absorb. However, Cacturne's Dream World ability can be very useful, giving Cacturne an easy setup on Water-type moves such as the ubiquitous Scald and Gorebyss's Surf. If you choose to use Water Absorb, then replace Bullet Seed with Seed Bomb. As Drain Punch and Encore are both illegal with Water Absorb, Substitute is the most useful move to use; however, another option ifs Spikes. With Spikes, Cacturne can bluff a Spikes set early on in the game while also weakening opponents for its late game sweep.</p>

    <p>Tangela walls Cacturne cold, and can stop it setting up further with either Sleep Powder or Hidden Power Ice. Charizard and Magmortar are good teammates because they can both comfortably take on Tangela with STAB Fire-type attacks. Misdreavus is immune to the Fighting-type attacks that Cacturne hates, while the cactus can switch into Dark, and Ghost-type assaults directed at Misdreavus. Golem is another useful teammate as it can easily set up Stealth Rock to hamper Flying, and Fire-types that commonly switch into Cacturne. Golem also lures in Grass- and Water-type attacks for Cacturne to set up on.</p>


    [Other Options]

    <p>Although most Cacturne sets choose to attack from the physical side, Cacturne has an oft overlooked Special Attack stat and whichthat can be further boosted by Nasty Plot. Unfortuantely, this means that Cacturne loses out on Sucker Punch, which is one of its biggest attractionselling points. As a result, specially-based Cacturne are far easier to revenge kill as they rarely run Sucker Punch. Cacturne can also run a Choice set, being able to utilize Choice Band, Choice Specs, and even Choice Scarf. With Switcheroo, Cacturne can cripple walls and switch around items. Unfortunately, Switcheroo is illegal with Bullet Seed and Drain Punch, and a Choice-locked Cacturne loses its ability to effectively Spikes-stack. Cacturne can also run a decent SubPunch set which hits extremely hard off its base 115 Attack stat,; however, Cacturne can rarely set up a Substitute safely, and it would be better off using the spare turn to either set up Spikes or boost its stats. Brick Break and Grasswhistle round out Cacturne's rather shallow movepool,; the former is compatible with Drain Punch ((do you mean compatible with Water Absorb?)) and can shatter dual screens while the latter can be used to put something to sleep. Keep in mind that Grasswhistle is extremely inaccurate and is likely to miss almost half the time.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Cacturne's reliance on Sucker Punch means that certain Pokemon can take advantage of it. Quiver Dancing Bug-types or Substitute users, such as Butterfree or Haunter, can both set up on Cacturne as it tries vainly to strike with Sucker Punch. Both resist Cacturne's Grass-type STAB move so it they can, allowing them to set up with ease. The only hope Cacturne has is if it can Encore their setup move or have perfect prediction with Sucker Punch. Fighting-types also spell doom for Cacturne, as they resist its Sucker Punch; faster Fighting-types such as Sawk and Emboar can strike Cacturne down with STAB Fighting- or Fire-type moves, while Gurdurr can easily set up multiple Bulk Ups on Cacturne. Being a scarecrow, it is quite ironic that Cacturne fears birds such as Braviary and Murkrow. Braviary can devastate Cacturne with Brave Bird, although a boosted Sucker Punch KOes it after Stealth Rock. Murkrow is even more dangerous, as it resists both of Cacturne's STAB moves, can prevent Spikes with Taunt, and finishes off Cacturne with Brave Bird. Due to Cacturne's excellent Attack stat and access to Swords Dance, it can be hard to wall Cacturne; however, the premier physical wall inof NU, Tangela, can easily put a stop to Cacturne's sweeping attempts. It can even take a +6 Sucker Punch and cut down Cacturne with Hidden Power Ice or put it to sleep with Sleep Powder. Tangela does have to be wary of the rare specially based sets, as they target Tangela's vulnerable Special Defense stat. Armaldo also counters Cacturne, taking a +2 Bullet Seed and retaliating with a powerful X-Scissor. Armaldo can also can use Rapid Spin to blow away Cacturne's Spikes. A; although Cacturne is rarely able to sweep a team, the Spikes it lays down can be far harder to get rid of, so Rapid Spin users are always helpful when facing Cacturne.</p>

    green = add
    red = remove
    ((green)) = comments
  24. SkullCandy

    SkullCandy She Bangs The Drums
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2010
    Messages:
    558
    Implement Woodchuck's am check first, then this one.

    c/p (open)

    [Overview]

    <p>The NU tier appears to be the perfect place for Cacturne to plant itself; not only are its Spiking abilities in high demand, but it also possesses excellent offenses and a unique typing. Unlike many other Spikes users, Cacturne isn't setup bait in any sense of the word; it has access to the deadly Sucker Punch which bypasses Cacturne's poor Speed and lets it revenge kill weakened opposition. Cacturne's typing also grants it an immunity to Psychic-type moves, which are common in the NU tier. Its Dream World ability, Water Absorb, adds another immunity to Cacturne's repertoire, letting it comfortably switch into Water-type moves from the dangerous Gorebyss and Ludicolo before threatening them out with Sucker Punch. Unfortunately, Cacturne's non-existent defenses and poor defensive typing leave it exposed to many powerful Pokemon in the tier such as Sawk, Gurdurr, and Magmortar. Cacturne's terrible Speed, while partially remedied by Sucker Punch, is a severe let down when it comes to laying down Spikes; many opposing Pokemon will be able to limit Cacturne to only one or two layers at most before outspeeding and KOing through its weak defenses. Using Cacturne efficiently requires excellent prediction , as its poor bulk and reliance on Sucker Punch leave little margin for error. However, in the right hands, Cacturne will be able to leave its opposition surrounded by Spikes and trembling in fear.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive Spiker
    move 1: Spikes
    move 2: Sucker Punch
    move 3: Bullet Seed
    move 4: Encore / Substitute
    item: Leftovers
    ability: Sand Veil
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>While Cacturne lacks bulk when compared to Spikers such as Garbodor and Omanyte, it makes up for its frailty with offensive presence. Instead of taking hits and setting up Spikes, Cacturne can force opponents out with the threat of its powerful attacks and set up Spikes in the process. Sucker Punch is great for Cacturne as it can revenge kill weakened threats such as Gorebyss; if your opponent wishes to evade Sucker Punch, Cacturne can safely set up Spikes. Sucker Punch and Spikes can force a deadly mind game for your opponent, but keep in mind that the same applies to Cacturne. If your opponent chooses to attack Cacturne as it sets up Spikes, chances are that Cacturne will be KOed or severely weakened, with only one layer of Spikes to show for it. Bullet Seed synergies very well with Cacturne's other moves as it breaks through Substitutes set up by Pokemon such as Haunter hoping to evade Sucker Punch. Bullet Seed also has an added benefit of bypassing Sturdy on Golem and Gigalith. Since many stay in to set up Stealth Rock, Cacturne can score some easy KOs. The last slot rounds out Cacturne's prediction filled set. Encore allows Cacturne to shut down Pokemon reliant on setup moves and status; Quiver Dance users such as Butterfree can be encored into a setup move, either forcing them to switch or letting you set up numerous layers of Spikes. Substitute eases prediction and forces the opponent to attack Cacturne in order to remove its Substitute. Using Cacturne requires excellent prediction skills as it is very frail and reliant on Sucker Punch, and while Encore and Subtitute can help to some extent, Cacturne's performance is normally a measure of its trainer's skill.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EV spread is a basic offensive spread that makes the most of Cacturne's offenses and Spiking ability. With 252 Speed EVs and a Jolly nature, Cacturne can outspeed important benchmarks such as Samurott and Timid Gorebyss without having to rely on Sucker Punch. Maximum Speed also lets Cacturne set up Spikes on as many Pokemon as possible before it gets KOed. Maximum Attack investment lets Cacturne make the most of Sucker Punch and Bullet Seed, and the remaining EVs go into HP. Investing any EVs in Cacturne's bulk is almost useless as it has numerous weaknesses and is quite frail, even with investment. Leftovers is the main option to ensure that Cacturne can continuously create Substitutes and set up Spikes without wearing itself down. However, you can opt to run Life Orb on Cacturne if you feel that the extra power is necessary. One of the greatest advantages of using Life Orb is that Cacturne can OHKO -1 Gorebyss, preventing an otherwise deadly sweeper from rampaging through your team. With prediction, Cacturne can net opportunities to mitigate its Life Orb recoil using its other ability. Water Absorb, which allows it to regain 25% of its HP upon switching into a Water-type move. Unfortunately, Water Absorb is illegal with some of Cacturne's greatest assets, Bullet Seed and Encore. If you choose to run Water Absorb, then Seed Bomb can be used over Bullet Seed, and Substitute can take the place of Encore. Swords Dance or Drain Punch can be used in the last slot for greater offensive presence. Swords Dance enables Cacturne to potentially go on a late-game sweep, whereas Drain Punch allows Cacturne to effectively damage Probopass and Bastiodon while also regaining health. Keep in mind, however, that Drain Punch is also illegal with Water Absorb.</p>

    <p>Taunt users such as Skuntank and Rapid Spinners such as Armaldo are the greatest threats to not only Cacturne, but also its ability to effectively lay down Spikes. Skuntank can easily Taunt Cacturne to prevent any Spikes from being laid down while also resisting both of Cacturne's STAB attacks. Armaldo can also scare Cacturne out and Rapid Spin away Cacturne's hard work. Therefore, Golem is an excellent teammate for Cacturne as it can both set up Stealth Rock and destroy Skuntank and Armaldo with its STAB attacks. It also has Sucker Punch which can help revenge kill Pokemon not defeated by Cacturne's Sucker Punch. Golem also attracts Water-type attacks for Cacturne to switch into.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Sucker Punch
    move 3: Bullet Seed
    move 4: Drain Punch / Encore / Substitute
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Sand Veil
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Much like the dangerous Swords Dance Absol, Swords Dance Cacturne aims to sweep the opponent with a boosted Attack stat and devastating Sucker Punch. Although Cacturne may not seem to have the Speed to sweep through most teams, it can use the extremely powerful Sucker Punch to strike first and annihilate the opposition. However, Cacturne can differentiate itself from the Disaster Pokemon with a secondary STAB move and access to unique support moves. Bullet Seed is Cacturne's secondary STAB of choice and gels well with Sucker Punch, as it shares excellent neutral coverage with it while being able to break through Substitutes set up by Pokemon hoping to avoid Sucker Punch, and bypasses Golem's Sturdy. The last slot can either help Cacturne to set up or give it greater coverage. Drain Punch gives Cacturne perfect neutral coverage in the NU tier, hitting Pokemon such as Skuntank who would otherwise resist Cacturne's STAB attacks. It also lets Cacturne easily get past Bastiodon and Probopass while also restoring health and negating Life Orb recoil. Encore lets Cacturne lock opponents into ineffective moves such as a setup move or entry hazards. Cacturne can then either set up Swords Dance or let a teammate switch in safely. Substitute protects Cacturne from status and acts as a one time buffer from revenge killers.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>252 Attack EVs and an Adamant nature enable Cacturne to hit extremely hard, even without any boosts. Maximum Speed investment minimizes Cacturne's reliance on Sucker Punch, while also opening up more opportunities to use Encore or Substitute against slower, more defensive Pokemon. A Jolly nature can be used to outspeed opponents such as Gorebyss; however, most of the time, Sucker Punch will be more than enough to OHKO fast, frail opponents. A Life Orb grants Cacturne even more power, and the loss of bulk is negligible as Cacturne is already very frail. However, Leftovers is also a valid item choice, especially if Cacturne chooses to run Substitute in the last slot. Just keep in mind that the power loss is noticeable. Seed Bomb can replace Bullet Seed as the Grass-type STAB move of choice if you find that you need the reliability of Seed Bomb. However, it cannot OHKO Golem through Sturdy, and Bullet Seed hits just as hard on average. Sand Veil is once again the standard ability, as Bullet Seed, Drain Punch, and Encore are all illegal with Water Absorb. However, Cacturne's Dream World ability can be very useful, giving Cacturne an easy setup on Water-type moves such as the ubiquitous Scald and Gorebyss's Surf. If you choose to use Water Absorb, then replace Bullet Seed with Seed Bomb. As Drain Punch and Encore are both illegal with Water Absorb, Substitute is the most useful move to use; however, another option is Spikes. With Spikes, Cacturne can bluff a Spikes set early on in the game while also weakening opponents for its late game sweep.</p>

    <p>Tangela walls Cacturne cold, and can stop it setting up further with either Sleep Powder or Hidden Power Ice. Charizard and Magmortar are good teammates because they can both comfortably take on Tangela with STAB Fire-type attacks. Misdreavus is immune to the Fighting-type attacks that Cacturne hates, while the cactus can switch into Dark and Ghost-type assaults directed at Misdreavus. Golem is another useful teammate as it can easily set up Stealth Rock to hamper Flying and Fire-types that commonly switch into Cacturne. Golem also lures in Grass- and Water-type attacks for Cacturne to set up on.</p>


    [Other Options]

    <p>Although most Cacturne sets choose to attack from the physical side, Cacturne has an oft overlooked Special Attack stat, which can be further boosted by Nasty Plot. Unfortuantely, this means that Cacturne loses out on Sucker Punch, which is one of its biggest selling points. As a result, specially-based Cacturne are far easier to revenge kill as they rarely run Sucker Punch. Cacturne can also run a Choice set, being able to utilize Choice Band, Choice Specs, and even Choice Scarf. With Switcheroo, Cacturne can cripple walls and switch around items. Unfortunately, Switcheroo is illegal with Bullet Seed and Drain Punch, and a Choice-locked Cacturne loses its ability to effectively Spikes-stack. Cacturne can also run a decent SubPunch set which hits extremely hard off its base 115 Attack stat; however, Cacturne can rarely set up a Substitute safely, and it would be better off using the spare turn to either set up Spikes or boost its stats. Brick Break and Grasswhistle round out Cacturne's rather shallow movepool. The former is compatible with Drain Punch ((do you mean compatible with Water Absorb?)) and can shatter dual screens while the latter can be used to put something to sleep. Keep in mind that Grasswhistle is extremely inaccurate and is likely to miss almost half the time.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Cacturne's reliance on Sucker Punch means that certain Pokemon can take advantage of it. Quiver Dancing Bug-types or Substitute users, such as Butterfree or Haunter, can both set up on Cacturne as it tries, in vain, to strike with Sucker Punch. Both resist Cacturne's Grass-type STAB move, which enables them to set up with ease. The only hope Cacturne has is if it can Encore their setup move or have perfect prediction with Sucker Punch. Fighting-types also spell doom for Cacturne, as they resist its Sucker Punch; faster Fighting-types such as Sawk and Emboar can strike Cacturne down with STAB Fighting- or Fire-type moves, while Gurdurr can easily set up multiple Bulk Ups on Cacturne. Being a scarecrow, it is quite ironic that Cacturne fears birds such as Braviary and Murkrow. Braviary can devastate Cacturne with Brave Bird, although a boosted Sucker Punch KOes it after Stealth Rock. Murkrow is even more dangerous, as it resists both of Cacturne's STAB moves, can prevent Spikes with Taunt, and finish off Cacturne with Brave Bird. Due to Cacturne's excellent Attack stat and access to Swords Dance, it can be hard to wall Cacturne; however, the premier physical wall of NU, Tangela, can easily put a stop to Cacturne's sweeping attempts. It can even take a +6 Sucker Punch and cut down Cacturne with Hidden Power Ice or put it to sleep with Sleep Powder. Tangela does have to be wary of the rare specially based sets since they target Tangela's vulnerable Special Defense stat. Armaldo also counters Cacturne, taking a +2 Bullet Seed and retaliating with a powerful X-Scissor. Armaldo can also use Rapid Spin to blow away Cacturne's Spikes. Although Cacturne is rarely able to sweep a team, the Spikes it lays down can be far harder to get rid of, so Rapid Spin users are always helpful when facing Cacturne.</p>


    [​IMG]

    GP approved 2/2
  25. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
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    Okay, with the release of the new BW2 tutors, some illegalities have become legal so I've changed the analysis to fit.
    This is done

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