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CAP 5 Pre-Evo - Part 1 - Typing Discussion

Discussion in 'CAP Pre-Evolution Workshop' started by DetroitLolcat, May 27, 2013.

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  1. DetroitLolcat

    DetroitLolcat Maize And Blue Badge Set :)
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    Hello everyone, and welcome to the CAP 5 Pre-evolution process with your host, MC Lolcat! This series of threads is where we will design the pre-evolution for Malaconda that we decided on in this poll right here! As with all CAP-related endeavors, this will be a discussion-and-poll based process that anyone can join. This project will be run concurrently with the Policy Review period between CAPs, so those wishing to participate in CAP but not in a Policy Review capacity are more than welcome to join in here. This process should take a few weeks, as we have to discuss and vote on typing, stats, art, and name among other topics.

    The first rule (and honestly, one of the only rules) of any CAP Pre-evolution process is that this is a completely flavor-based project. Unlike CAP, a largely competitive project with relatively few flavor steps, CAP Pre-evolutions are entirely "for fun" in that competitive reasoning behind decisions is neither required nor encouraged. In main CAP, there is a standard of competitive reasoning that is expected of those that post; in CAP Pre-evolutions, any and all flavor-based reasoning is completely valid. "It just makes sense" is entirely legitimate reasoning behind an opinion, and remember that this project is an avenue for creative minds to express their opinions about what Malaconda should evolve from. Here are some of the typing discussion threads from previous Pre-evolution projects for reference:

    CAP 4 Pre-evo Typing Discussion
    CAP 2 Pre-evo Typing Discussion

    This thread, as the title would suggest, is where we will decide the typing for Malaconda's pre-evolution! Obviously, Grass/Dark will make the slate because Malaconda is a Grass/Dark Pokemon, so spend most of your time discussing alternatives to Grass/Dark. Although it's certainly not taboo to talk about Grass/Dark as a typing for Malaconda Lite, know that there's no point to making a case for it since it's already on the slate. Remember that the only criteria for legitimacy in your argument is that it has to make sense in the context of Malaconda, so don't suggest Dragon/Fighting because "omg it can spam outrage and close combat to beat steels". If you can make a case for an off-the-wall typing as to why it should evolve into a Grass/Dark snake Pokemon, then please go right ahead! Just remember that this stage is not for dreaming up a competitive wonder typing that will crush the Little Cup metagame. We're designing a "just for fun" Pokemon that will evolve into the competitive behemoth known as Malaconda.

    Speaking of metagames, this Pokemon isn't going on the official server and it's not going to be used in a hypothetical Little Cup ladder, so don't base your reasoning around "Dark/Dragon could really help my LC team in dealing with Misdreavus!" or "If we make it a Ghost type it will counter Sawk in NU!!".

    Remember, this is supposed to be a fun process. It's a great time for newcomers to get their feet wet in CAP, a great place for CAP regulars to keep making Pokemon during the downtime, and overall just a cool project to work on during the Policy Review stage of the CAP process. The primary purpose of this is to have fun, so let your imaginations run wild devising the most intricate and logical arguments for Malaconda's Mini-Me!


    Here is Malaconda's Final Product thread, complete with any information you could possibly need on CAP's newest creation: Malaconda!

    All right, everyone, let's make a Pokemon oozing with so much flavor that it puts Ben and Jerry's to shame!

    [​IMG]
  2. jynx KB

    jynx KB

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    Well, from a purely flavor perspective I don't see how Grass alone couldn't be used. Maybe the Dark typing is part of a forked evolution, and Malaconda could have been better had it gone down another path? Otherwise, The original typing is fine.
  3. Hollymon

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    My view on this is that the prevo is either grass/darkthe original typing or pure grass.Most pre evolutions are cute which would work for pure grass or kind of mischievous which would work for grass/dark and could even be stretched to grass. Any other typing a would just be unnecessary but the only other thing suitable would be grass/poison. But even then it is a big stretch and is not needed for this pokemon.
  4. Base Speed

    Base Speed What a load of BS!
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    If you look at existing dark type pokemon, a lot of their prevolutions aren't dark type. Seedot, Cacnea, Corphish, Pupitar and Skorupi all gain it upon evolution. Of course, there are plenty of examples where this doesn't occur, but I think it would be neat for Malaconda's prevolution to join the former group.

    Therefore, I propose our prevo's type to be Pure Grass.
  5. CJorex

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    I'm going to go with Grass/Dark; not only does it tie it in with Malaconda, it would be the only unevolved Pokemon with that typing
    On a side note, if you look at other Grass/Dark types like Cacturne and Shiftry you will see that their pre-evos are pure grass-types, so that's food for thought.
  6. Eagle4

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    Hey how about Grass/Light

    Grass:
    As CJorex pointed out, Grass certainly does have precedence, and gives leeway for an innocent prevo who then evolves into the spiteful, deceitful Malaconda, from a flavor perspective. I wouldn't mind this typing if we chose it, but I much prefer...

    Grass/Dark: I certainly like the uniqueness involved in having a Grass/Dark prevo. Furthermore, I think it fits the flavor aspect a little more; it is too huge a jump to have an innocent snake evolve into Malaconda.

    Farfetch'd alternatives:

    Grass/Poison: A common typing throughout pokemon, whilst generic, could work. Malaconda is a snake after all, and most snakes have Poison typing. Our prevo could be "poisoned" by spite and greed to become Malaconda.
    Grass/Normal: Represents the innocence our prevo could have. There's also precedence of having a normal type snake, in Dunsparce.
    Dark: Whilst the transition from Dark to Grass/Dark may look a little weird, but there is sort-of-precedence in Altaria, Dark would mean that the prevo loses its thorns and leaves, and becomes a much simpler satan baby. This would be my third choice, although losing the grass typing is still near-unheard of.
  7. DeathCapsule

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    Well, I have two. But first, I would like to say that maybe we SHOULDN'T be trying to add a type from every Pre-Evo. A lot of the Pre-Evo CAPS have different typing or only "half" of the dual type given to an official product. Now, onto the good stuff!

    Grass/Poison: This is one I'm fine with. It would fit a pre-evolution of Malaconda. The only problem I see is that, most pokemon have extremely similar movesets to their evolutions. Most pokemon also have STAB moves. If I remember correctly, Malaconda doesn't have any Poison moves via level up. That's just me being crazy, though.

    Grass/Dark: I'd prefer this one. Not all pre-evolutions have to be cutesy, just look at Ekans! It would be pretty cool to use this typing, and prehaps we could do something cool with the tail. Maybe a black apple blossom? Also, like CJorex said, it would be the only pokemon able to evolve into another pokemon with that typing.
  8. Deck Knight

    Deck Knight A Knight for the Aegis
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    Grass / Poison is ridiculous for one glaring reason:

    Malaconda has two poison moves: Poison Powder and Toxic. "Most snakes are poisonous" is terrible flavor reasoning, it's like you guys didn't even look at the movepool before throwing suggestions out.

    In any case I'm in for Grass/Dark. I think we can depart from the Seedot / Cacnea model for this - our CAP might as well be unique and defy the trend.
  9. DeathCapsule

    DeathCapsule

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    I said that, just to be clear. I think it's good aesthetics-wise, but movepool... not so much. Maybe if a move was replaced by like... Crunch for instance, for Poison Fang in the pre-evo's moveset, it would work out.
  10. Unoriginal Name

    Unoriginal Name

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    Crunch being replaced? Um...

    Anyway, I'm leaning towards Grass/Dark myself, or even pure Dark. Because people have elaborated on Grass/Dark enough already, I'll only discuss Dark. Dark would make sense as a sort of "overgrow" effect as the Pokemon evolves; similarly to how Slowpoke evolves into Slowbro (by a Shellder biting its tail) according to the anime, Malaconda's Dark-type prevo could evolve once grass and thorns grow over its body, causing it to evolve into Malaconda, gaining a Grass typing. Not too Farfetch'd, in my opinion.
  11. Nyktos

    Nyktos Custom Loser Title
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    I think it should be pointed out that in the Final Product and on Showdown, Malaconda is actually Dark/Grass rather than Grass/Dark. Pretty relevant since the first typing rarely changes upon evolution. This guy should really be a Dark-type, then.

    Since we don't have art yet it's impossible to tell which typing actually makes the most flavour since, but since I suspect a lot of the artists are going to want to mess with the apple theme, I do think that staying Grass-type is probably good and so Dark/Grass should be the typing.
  12. srk1214

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    Showdown is the final implemented version. It was implemented as Dark/Grass. The only viable option I see therefore is to stay Dark/Grass. I just don't see little Malaconda working as Dark or Dark/anythingelse.
  13. DeathCapsule

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    In this case of the pre-evo being Dark/Poison, instead of having Crunch the pre-evo would have Poison Fang. But, that's just an example.
  14. Wrong. A prevo can't have any moves that the evo doesn't get, since that would be using a flavour step to change the competitive project. Since Malaconda doesn't get Poison Fang, its prevo can't either.

    Anyway, I like how this discussion is going so far, and I don't think I have too much to add. I'm hoping for Grass personally, since I think the Seedot/Cacnea model fits quite well here and I'm not bothered by the lack of originality. Keeping Malaconda's type would be cool too though. I don't think I'll give much thought to anything else.
  15. yoshinite

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    I'm personally in support of Grass or Grass/Normal. Before Lucifer was cast out by God, he was an innocent, perfect angel. I could see Malaconda's prevo as an innocent little snake that gets corrupted when it evolves. Move-wise, it's not like Normal is going to add any coverage or extra moves. Also I want more cute prevos. n_n
  16. DeathCapsule

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    What about Larvesta learning Flare Blitz at level 100, whilst Volcarona doesn't?
  17. yoshinite

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    ^He means by CAP Rules I think.
  18. Spork

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    It's gotta be Dark/Grass. Malaconda is just too sly for me to imagine some uncorrupted baby. (A Dark/Grass prevo would be unique, too!)
  19. DHR-107

    DHR-107 Robot from the Future
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    CaP Prevo movepools can only take away, not add or replace.

    You can shift around moves and the like from TMs/Tutors but you cannot add any moves that are not already there.

    But back to the topic at hand, I see no reason as to change from Malaconda's original typing. The only other relevant typing would be Grass, but as others have said Malaconda is implemented as Dark/Grass rather than the reverse. I would rather see it stay the same than any other. Dark really wouldn't work I don't think, not unless someone has a really interesting idea as to how it gains the grass typing upon evolution.

    Unless Jas/whoever is allowed/has the power reverses the order of the typing, anything Grass related (Unless it is Dark/Grass) can't really be considered.
  20. Asbestospoison

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    I'm going to say Grass/Dark (or Dark/Grass, w/e). The way I see it, it could be like that little kid that always gets into trouble, mischievous but not really trying to hurt anyone (yet).
  21. Kyuzeth

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    I am also going to vote for Dark/Grass-type. This type combination breaks the tradition that Cacnea and Seedot follow; not just those, see also Corphish, a pure Water-type that evolves into the Water/Dark-type Crawdaunt.

    Leaving PreCAP5 Dark/Grass makes it follow the same path as Carvanha and Sharpedo, who are both Water/Dark-type.

    Just sharing some thoughts. Discussion's good so far!
  22. DetroitLolcat

    DetroitLolcat Maize And Blue Badge Set :)
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    Just going to chime in here, even though Larvesta gets Flare Blitz by level-up while Volcarona doesn't, Flare Blitz is still in Volcarona's movepool because Larvesta can level up to 100, learn Flare Blitz, and then evolve into Volcarona on the same level.

    There is no situation where a move can be in a pre-evolution's movepool but not in the final evolution's movepool. This might be a bit confusing because main CAP movepools don't have "pre-evolution moves" that Pokemon such as Volcarona have.

    It is not legal to add moves to Malaconda's movepool through the pre-evolution. Malaconda's pre-evolution's movepool will be a subset of Malaconda's movepool, so the idea of "well we can just add Poison Fang/Poison Tail so Grass/Poison is okay!" is not valid.

    That's not to say that Grass/Poison has no chance of making the slate, just know that the only Poison moves Malaconda's pre-evolution can have are Poisonpowder and Toxic regardless of typing. Whether or not that constitutes bad flavor, of course, is up to the voters!
  23. DeathCapsule

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    Ah, alright, I'm in favor of Grass/ Dark anyway, so, it's all good
  24. frenzyplant

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    I'm personally in support of Dark/Grass, to not follow the trend of Cacnea and Seedot, but also pure Grass to follow their trend.
    I also support Grass/Light best idea so far
  25. Yveltal

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    I personally feel that Dark/Grassis the most sensible typing for Miniconda if we're not going to worry too much about theming, since not only is it less common to see Pokemon gain a second type upon evolution, but it should be able to show it's prowess as a type equalizer in a lesser tier.
    Still, Normal/Grass is a really cute idea if you really want to go to town on the Lucifer-ish theme. I have some cute design ideas that would fit Normal/Grass rather well.
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