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CAP 5 Pre-Evo - Part 7 - Movepool Submissions

Discussion in 'CAP Pre-Evolution Workshop' started by DetroitLolcat, Jul 7, 2013.

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  1. DetroitLolcat

    DetroitLolcat Maize And Blue Badge Set :)
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    Brattler is what we shall call CAP 5 Pre-Evo. That is a good name because CAP 5 Pre-Evo is eleven characters long so it would not be legal. Now, Brattler needs some moves to use or else it would have no moves and would not be a legal Pokemon.

    Unlike movepools with regular CAPs, Brattler's movepool process is much more restrictive. That is because every one of Brattler's moves must be in Malaconda's movepool. I don't care how insignificant the move seems to be, we are not allowed to change the makeup of our competitive CAP Pokemon with this flavor project. Now, that does not mean that Brattler's moves must be identical to Malaconda's. You can and should omit moves in Malaconda's movepool when creating your submission for Brattler. You may omit whichever moves in Malaconda's movepool that you please, but you may not add moves to Brattler's movepool that are not in Malaconda's. In addition, remember that the egg movepool of the pre-evolution should be identical to Malaconda's.

    Furthermore, this is also the stage where we determine just exactly how Brattler evolves into Malaconda. There is no need to get terribly creative with this step; remember that most Pokemon evolve through simple level-up. However, feel free to get creative if you so please. Just remember that although making Brattler evolve only at level 66 at night on Thursday while your (3)DS has a pentagram drawn around it and you're reciting the Our Father backwards while in a black robe may be an interesting method of evolution, it is not necessarily a reasonable method of evolution.

    Although you are heavily restricted by the allowed moves (only moves in Malaconda's movepool may be included in Brattler's), there is still plenty of room for insight and creativity. There are a multitude of moves you can include and exclude based on you own reasoning, so try to have fun with it!

    Here is Malaconda's movepool in its entirety. I can't place it in "hide" tags so be prepared for the incoming wall of text!

    Level Up Moves
    1 - Rapid Spin
    1 - Vine Whip
    1 - Pursuit
    1 - Wrap
    6 - Pursuit
    12 - Wrap
    18 - Grass Knot
    25 - Sucker Punch
    30 - Slam
    36 - Leaf Blade
    42 - Crunch
    48 - Wring Out
    57 - Power Whip
    66 – Punishment

    TM/HM Moves
    TM05 Roar
    TM06 Toxic
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM12 Taunt
    TM15 Hyper Beam
    TM17 Protect
    TM21 Frustration
    TM22 SolarBeam
    TM27 Return
    TM32 Double Team
    TM42 Facade
    TM44 Rest
    TM45 Attract
    TM46 Thief
    TM48 Round
    TM53 Energy Ball
    TM66 Payback
    TM67 Retaliate
    TM68 Giga Impact
    TM82 Dragon Tail
    TM86 Grass Knot
    TM87 Swagger
    TM89 U-turn
    TM90 Substitute
    TM93 Wild Charge
    TM95 Snarl
    HM01 Cut
    HM04 Strength

    Tutor Moves
    Bind
    Dark Pulse
    Foul Play
    Giga Drain
    Heal Bell
    Iron Tail
    Knock Off
    Seed Bomb
    Sleep Talk
    Snore
    Spite
    Synthesis
    Worry Seed

    Egg Groups: Grass/Dragon
    Egg Moves:
    Aromatherapy
    Beat Up
    Glare
    Haze
    Night Slash
    Poison Powder
    Scary Face
    Screech
    Sweet Scent
    Stun Spore


    Remember that Egg Moves must be the exact same for Brattler and Malaconda!

    And here is Our Prevo so Far:

    Name: Brattler
    Art: [​IMG]

    Type: Grass/Dark
    Abilities: Harvest/Infiltrator
    Stats: 80/70/40/20/90/30

    Have fun submitting your movepools guys! If you have any questions about legality, feel free to ask. There are no silly VGM/Total Move limits other than the fact that all of your moves must come from Malaconda's movepool.

    There is not a set deadline at the moment. I will give 48-hour and 24-hour warnings when applicable, and the 48-hour warning is when you may make your post a Final Submission.

    Only posts with Final Submission in them somewhere will be counted.

    http://smogon.com/forums/threads/cap-5-final-product.3482704/ (Malaconda's Final Product thread!)

    Ready? Begin!
  2. DHR-107

    DHR-107 Robot from the Future
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    Wooohooo! Movepools! I kinda forgot about some of this as I was getting stuff together... And I don't quite know how to format it now on the new forums...

    But let's just go with it :)

    Final Submission

    Level Up Moves:
    0 - Vine Whip
    6 - Pursuit
    12 - Wrap
    18 - Grass Knot
    25 - Sucker Punch
    EVOLVE AT LEVEL 27
    31 - Leaf Blade
    37 - Crunch
    43 - Wring Out
    50 - Power Whip
    56 - Punishment

    Fixed some of the level changes (so it now fits with a pattern) and removed Slam from the level up move set. I put forward Lv 27 as our evo level, as it fits in at the lower end of the Pokemon we based the stats on (Houndour, Grimer etc). This is also 5 levels later than Ekans. I think this fits nicely with the general move pool too, as at that point you start getting much stronger moves. (Off topic: This pokemon would be a real nightmare to level up ingame). EDIT: I took out Rapid Spin because I genuinely disliked the idea of it being on Brattler. It also seems more like a Heart Scale move for Malaconda to receive. I also took out the repeats... It bugs me when first forms have those weird repeat moves.

    TM Moves:
    TM06 - Toxic
    TM10 - Hidden Power
    TM11 - Sunny Day
    TM12 - Taunt
    TM17 - Protect
    TM21 - Frustration
    TM22 - SolarBeam
    TM27 - Return
    TM32 - Double Team
    TM42 - Facade
    TM44 - Rest
    TM45 - Attract
    TM46 - Thief
    TM48 - Round
    TM53 - Energy Ball
    TM66 - Payback
    TM67 - Retaliate
    TM86 - Grass Knot
    TM87 - Swagger
    TM89 - U-turn
    TM90 - Substitute

    Okay, so I went and removed the usual suspects (Hyper Beam/Giga Impact) and then also removed both HM's and Wild Charge. At this point I was looking at most of the other stuff and it wasn't too bad to keep. I thought Roar would be adorable, but I decided against it as the art doesn't really work with it I don't think. And then if that went I decided Snarl had to as well. The only other one I decided to drop was Dragon Tail, as I thought our little Brattler would simply be too small to use it. This follows lots of precedence as non Dragon Pokemon first forms do not get this move... (Except for Lickitung and for some bizarre reason Scraggy).

    Tutor Moves
    Bind
    Dark Pulse
    Foul Play
    Giga Drain
    Heal Bell
    Iron Tail
    Knock Off
    Seed Bomb
    Sleep Talk
    Snore
    Spite
    Synthesis
    Worry Seed

    There was only one move here which I was undecided on, Heal Bell. After getting the art, I decided to leave it in as the rattle was just too good to miss out on that lovely flavour. I had a thought about giving it Fake Tears somewhere too, but that is not allowed :(

    And as always, Egg moves cannot be changed as this is a first form.

    Egg Moves
    Aromatherapy
    Beat Up
    Glare
    Haze
    Night Slash
    PoisonPowder
    Scary Face
    Screech
    Sweet Scent
    Stun Spore

    I might make 1 or two changes, but I am pretty happy with what I've got here :)

    EDIT: Haha, ok that formatting broke horribly... Hopefully that looks tidier.
  3. Objection

    Objection

    Joined:
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    5,695
    Final Submission

    Level Up Moves
    1 - Vine Whip
    1 - Wrap
    5 - Pursuit
    11 - Wrap
    16 - Grass Knot
    22 - Sucker Punch
    27 - Slam
    33 - Leaf Blade
    38 - Crunch
    44 - Wring Out
    49 - Taunt
    55 - Power Whip

    Evolution method: Level up while holding Leftovers


    If I recall correctly, in (almost) all cases in which a move is a level-up move for a Pokemon at all stages of evolution, the earlier stages learn the move sooner than the later ones. I looked at the progression of the level-up moves in Malaconda's movepool and noticed that, on average, Malaconda gets a new move every 6 levels, so I decided to make Brattler get a new move every 5.5 levels. I noticed, however, that this progression caused some large deviations later on, so I decided to bring those moves closer by adding a couple of moves from Malaconda's TM movepool to Brattler's level-up movepool (I think this is OK since it's not adding a new move or changing any egg move legalities, plus there's precedent for it - Flamethrower Chimchar for example). I remember a complaint in the final product thread for Malaconda about how Malaconda's level-up movepool was entirely attacking moves, so I chose the two non-attacking moves that seemed to fit best flavourwise. Then I noticed that Brattler had 14 level-up moves, which seemed like a bit much, so I took out Rapid Spin, Punishment and one of the two non-attacking moves, cutting it down to 11 level-up moves, one less than Malaconda. And that, I decided, would be that.

    As for the evolution method, I thought that since Brattler doesn't have an apple on its tail but Malaconda does, that the evolution could be connected to an item that looks like an apple, like Leftovers. If this is considered unreasonable, I'll probably change to just level up at a suitable level.

    TM/HM Moves
    TM05 Roar
    TM06 Toxic
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM12 Taunt
    TM17 Protect
    TM21 Frustration
    TM27 Return
    TM32 Double Team
    TM42 Facade
    TM44 Rest
    TM45 Attract
    TM46 Thief
    TM48 Round
    TM53 Energy Ball
    TM66 Payback
    TM67 Retaliate
    TM86 Grass Knot
    TM87 Swagger
    TM89 U-turn
    TM90 Substitute
    TM93 Wild Charge
    TM95 Snarl
    HM01 Cut


    Took out the moves that suggested a lot of strength or power (namely Giga Impact, Hyper Beam, SolarBeam and Strength), and thought "That'll do".

    EDIT: Upon seeing other comments in this thread, I have removed Dragon Tail as well, since it is very rare for unevolved non-Dragon-types to get the move. Roar is staying though because there is precedence for cute first stage Pokemon getting the move (Vulpix, Stunky, Zorua ...).

    Tutor Moves
    Bind
    Dark Pulse
    Foul Play
    Giga Drain
    Heal Bell
    Iron Tail
    Knock Off
    Seed Bomb
    Sleep Talk
    Snore
    Spite
    Synthesis
    Worry Seed


    Same as Malaconda's tutor moves. There's not really anything there that Brattler doesn't look like it could use.

    Egg Groups: Grass/Dragon
    Egg Moves:
    Aromatherapy
    Beat Up
    Glare
    Haze
    Night Slash
    Poison Powder
    Scary Face
    Screech
    Sweet Scent
    Stun Spore


    Do I need to say anything here?
  4. Quanyails

    Quanyails
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    594
    Final Submission

    Evolves at level 40.

    Level Up Moves
    1 - Rapid Spin
    1 - Vine Whip
    6 - Pursuit
    12 - Wrap
    18 - Grass Knot
    25 - Sucker Punch
    30 - Slam
    36 - Leaf Blade
    42 - Crunch
    47 - Wring Out
    52 - Power Whip
    58 – Punishment

    CiteAndPrune has a definite pattern to Malaconda's level-up moves: always offensive and alternating between Normal, Grass, and Dark-type moves. I kept this pattern, though I have removed the evolutionary repeats of Pursuit and Wrap. On the other hand, the difference between level-up moves goes 5-6-6-7-5-6-6-6-9-9. A pattern established by a pre-evolution tends to stay consistent until it evolves; the pattern then changes. For example, Zorua learns a move every four levels. Zoroark follows the evolutionary pattern of every four levels per move until level 30, its normal level for evolution, which at this point the pattern changes to every five levels. For Brattler, the pattern seems to go 5-6-6-7 twice until the two 9s at the end, implying a late-game evolution of at least level 48. However, pokemon that are the first of two stages with a low BST tend to evolve sooner. Glameow has 310 ST and evolves at level 38. Scraggy, while having a higher BST, is also a dark-type two-stager, and it evolves at level 39. Ferroseed, a grass-type, has a BST of 305 yet evolves at level 40. While suboptimal in terms of level-up move difference consistency, level 40 fits right and gives room to continue Brattler's 5-6-6-7 pattern.

    TM/HM Moves
    TM05 Roar
    TM06 Toxic
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM12 Taunt
    TM17 Protect
    TM21 Frustration
    TM22 SolarBeam
    TM27 Return
    TM32 Double Team
    TM42 Facade
    TM44 Rest
    TM45 Attract
    TM46 Thief
    TM48 Round
    TM53 Energy Ball
    TM66 Payback
    TM67 Retaliate
    TM86 Grass Knot
    TM87 Swagger
    TM89 U-turn
    TM90 Substitute
    TM93 Wild Charge
    TM95 Snarl
    HM01 Cut

    I've removed moves that typically are only gotten by final evolutions (Hyper Beam, Giga Impact, Dragon Tail). Other moves are typically learned by both or all members of an evolutionary line, hence preserving those.

    Tutor Moves
    Bind
    Dark Pulse
    Foul Play
    Giga Drain
    Heal Bell
    Iron Tail
    Knock Off
    Seed Bomb
    Sleep Talk
    Snore
    Spite
    Synthesis
    Worry Seed

    No changes.

    Egg Groups: Grass/Dragon
    Egg Moves:
    Aromatherapy
    Beat Up
    Glare
    Haze
    Night Slash
    Poison Powder
    Scary Face
    Screech
    Sweet Scent
    Stun Spore

    And no changes.
  5. jas61292

    jas61292 used substitute
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    Final Submission

    So, I've done a lot of movepools for prevos before, but this was by far the quickest and easiest. The fact is, Brattler is so much like Malaconda that making more than just the bare minimum changes seems completely unnecessary.

    Level Up

    Evolves level 33

    1 - Vine Whip
    1 - Pursuit
    1 - Wrap
    6 - Pursuit
    12 - Wrap
    18 - Grass Knot
    25 - Sucker Punch
    30 - Slam
    34 - Leaf Blade
    39 - Crunch
    44 - Wring Out
    50 - Power Whip
    55 – Punishment

    Rapid Spin was the only move removed here. I decided that a move like that, in the position it was in the level up pool, seems much more like a Heart Scale move than a starting one. Outside of that though, the only differences are the levels of the later move. I decided to put the evolution at level 33. As I have liked to do in the past, this evolution is simply a generic level one. Nothing significant about the level. Just a level, like the vast majority of Pokemon in the game. I didn't really think any existing alternate method was more fitting and I didn't want to make something up. I see Brattler as a 5th gen counterpart to Ekans, and chose 33 because Ekans evolves at 22. I kept the double number for the level, but pushed it back by 11 to match up with gen 5's generally later evolutions. As for move levels, the pattern for malaconda started with differences of 5-6-6-7, with 4 differences remaining after my chosen evolution level. As usual, the moves before that level share a level with Malaconda, and after that, I took the same pattern and scaled it back one level each so it gets things quicker than its evo.

    TMs/HMs

    TM05 Roar
    TM06 Toxic
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM12 Taunt
    TM17 Protect
    TM21 Frustration
    TM22 SolarBeam
    TM27 Return
    TM32 Double Team
    TM42 Facade
    TM44 Rest
    TM45 Attract
    TM46 Thief
    TM48 Round
    TM53 Energy Ball
    TM66 Payback
    TM67 Retaliate
    TM82 Dragon Tail
    TM86 Grass Knot
    TM87 Swagger
    TM89 U-turn
    TM90 Substitute
    TM93 Wild Charge
    TM95 Snarl
    HM01 Cut
    HM04 Strength

    So I cut out Hyper Beam and Giga Impact due to their near exclusivity to fully evolved (or former fully evolved) Pokemon. And that is it. Dragon Tail got some thought since Ekans doesn't get it, but unevolved guys like Scraggy, Onix, Dratini, Deino and Lickitung do, so I didn't think it was necessary to take it away. Other than that, everything else just made sense. Most moves are nearly necessary for it based on type or status as a normal Pokemon, and those that weren't, like Strength are common on all sorts of things, and usually throughout entire families.

    Tutors

    Bind
    Dark Pulse
    Foul Play
    Giga Drain
    Heal Bell
    Iron Tail
    Knock Off
    Seed Bomb
    Sleep Talk
    Snore
    Spite
    Synthesis
    Worry Seed

    Same here as for Malaconda. The only real oddballs are Heal Bell and maybe Spite, but if Malaconda gets it, there is no reason Brattler can't. They are just so similar.

    Egg Moves

    Aromatherapy
    Beat Up
    Glare
    Haze
    Night Slash
    Poison Powder
    Scary Face
    Screech
    Sweet Scent
    Stun Spore

    And of course, same here too.

    Overall, that is a grand total of 3 moves lost, and none moved around. I feel that Malaconda and Brattler are Pokemon so similar that to switch up the movepool more than this is just change for change's sake without regard to how Pokemon typically are build.
  6. Eagle4

    Eagle4

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2012
    Messages:
    1,570
    Final Submission

    As with others, I found creating the movepool relatively easy to accomplish for the simple fact that Brattler bears many similarities to Malaconda.

    Evolves at Level 40

    Level Up Moves
    1 - Rapid Spin
    1 - Vine Whip
    1 - Pursuit
    1 - Wrap
    6 - Pursuit
    12 - Wrap
    18 - Grass Knot
    25 - Sucker Punch
    30 - Slam
    36 - Leaf Blade
    EVOLVES
    40 - Crunch
    44 - Wring Out
    48 - Power Whip
    54– Punishment

    Most (if not all) Pokemon keep their level-up pattern regarding what level they gain each move, before evolution. After evolution, the distance between each move changes depending on the stage of the Pokemon. That much is obvious. I decided to move down Crunch to level 40 to keep with the theme as well as adding flavour; Brattler, upon evolution, develops much larger fangs in order to crunch down on foes. Then, I decided that the distance between each move in terms of levels would be 4-4-6, to keep it simple and not over-complicate things. It certainly seems right for Brattler, personally. As I stated, Brattler is very similar to Malaconda; I didn't see the need to remove any moves from the list. I kept Rapid Spin because every pre-evolution of a Pokemon which can learn Rapid Spin still has Rapid Spin, the exceptions being Phanpy and Tyrogue. I also don't see why Brattler can't learn Rapid Spin when Malaconda can.

    I chose Brattler to evolve at Level 40 for a few reasons. I like to compare the Brattler line to the Skorupi line, as I did with the stat submissions. This is because they are both dark types, Brattler and Skorupi both have a BST of 330 and Malaconda and Drapion both have a BST of 500. Skorupi evolves into Drapion at Level 40, and so I saw it fitting for Brattler to do so as well. I would like to refer to Quanyails' reasoning for why I believe Level 40 is the best level for Brattler to evolve into Malaconda. To add to Quanyails' examples, Ponyta evolves into Rapidash at Level 40, where Rapidash has the same BST as Malaconda. Grimer evolves into Muk at Level 38 where Muk has the same BST as Malaconda, and Grimer is 5 off Brattler's BST. I could go on; Brattler evolving into Malaconda at Level 40 is incredibly fitting.

    TM/HM Moves
    TM06 Toxic
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM12 Taunt
    TM17 Protect
    TM21 Frustration
    TM22 SolarBeam
    TM27 Return
    TM32 Double Team
    TM42 Facade
    TM44 Rest
    TM45 Attract
    TM46 Thief
    TM48 Round
    TM53 Energy Ball
    TM66 Payback
    TM67 Retaliate
    TM86 Grass Knot
    TM87 Swagger
    TM89 U-turn
    TM90 Substitute
    TM93 Wild Charge
    TM95 Snarl
    HM01 Cut
    HM04 Strength

    I removed Hyper Beam and Giga Impact for obvious reasons, and Dragon Tail since this is much more commonly seen on fully evolved Pokemon than basic Pokemon. I also tried to add a little more flavour by removing Roar but keeping Snarl. I see Snarl as a weaker form of Roar; Brattler is too small to give off a mighty roar, yet can snarl as an attempt. Adorable! Most fully evolved Pokemon who have Snarl also have pre-evolutions which can learn Snarl; I saw no reason to remove it. Other than that, I saw all moves left as fitting for Brattler.

    Tutor Moves
    Bind
    Dark Pulse
    Foul Play
    Giga Drain
    Heal Bell
    Iron Tail
    Knock Off
    Seed Bomb
    Sleep Talk
    Snore
    Spite
    Synthesis
    Worry Seed

    No changes here.

    Egg Groups: Grass/Dragon
    Egg Moves
    Aromatherapy
    Beat Up
    Glare
    Haze
    Night Slash
    Poison Powder
    Scary Face
    Screech
    Sweet Scent
    Stun Spore

    Once again, no changes.
  7. vyomov

    vyomov

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2013
    Messages:
    841
    This is my first foray so don't be too harsh :)
    FINAL SUBMISSION

    Evolves when leveled up with Lagging Tail
    Level Up Moves:
    1- Rapid Spin
    1- Vine Whip
    1- Pursuit
    6- Wrap
    11- Grass Knot
    16- Snarl
    21 - Facade
    26- Leaf Blade
    36- Wring Out
    46 - Taunt



    I started off with a 5 level pattern until level 26. At level 26, I changed the pattern to a 10-level one because in-game GameFreak encourages evolving pokemon, so by not leaving too many good moves left, I encourage trainers to let go of the "brattler" and say hello to Malaconda. I decided not to give it Crunch because being a small mon, it really doesn't have the capability to crunch good things to pieces. The last move being Taunt is a taunt to trainers who haven't evolved their Brattlers yet LOL.

    TM/HM Moves
    TM05 Roar
    TM06 Toxic
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM12 Taunt
    TM17 Protect
    TM21 Frustration
    TM32 Double Team
    TM42 Facade
    TM45 Attract
    TM46 Thief
    TM48 Round
    TM66 Payback
    TM86 Grass Knot
    TM87 Swagger
    TM89 U-turn
    TM90 Substitute
    TM95 Snarl
    HM01 Cut

    Here, I removed most moves with power because being a small snake, it doesn't have too much power(with the exception of Frustration, as the snake is perfectly capable of becoming frustrated with the lack of friendship from the trainer). I also removed Strength, as it doesn't fit too well with Brattler's image.

    Tutor Moves
    Bind
    Dark Pulse
    Giga Drain
    Heal Bell
    Knock Off
    Seed Bomb
    Sleep Talk
    Snore
    Spite
    Synthesis
    Worry Seed

    I removed Iron Tail and Foul Play because Iron Tail is too strong for the pre-evo and being a small innocent snake(before evolving into the snake of terror), it really isn't capable of Foul Play at all.

    Egg Groups: Grass/Dragon
    Egg Moves:
    Aromatherapy
    Beat Up
    Glare
    Haze
    Night Slash
    Poison Powder
    Scary Face
    Screech
    Sweet Scent
    Stun Spore


    Didn't change any of the egg moves.

    Hope it was good for a first attempt!
  8. DetroitLolcat

    DetroitLolcat Maize And Blue Badge Set :)
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    All right, we're getting some good discussion and some preliminary movepools. I think this is as good a time as any to post a 48 Hour Warning and to allow Final Submissions. I'll post feedback and more later as this is a phone post.

    It has been roughly 24 hours since I last posted. Therefore, consider this your 24 Hour Warning. Be sure to mark your post as a Final Submission if you wish to be included in the poll.
  9. DetroitLolcat

    DetroitLolcat Maize And Blue Badge Set :)
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    Okay, it's time to post the poll! Consider this thread closed!

    First I will eat dinner.

    Then I will post a poll.
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