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Discussion CAP 5th Generation Revamp: Revenankh

Discussion in 'Policy Center' started by Deck Knight, Dec 31, 2011.

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  1. Deck Knight

    Deck Knight DK! DK! Donkey Kong is here!
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    This thread will discuss the revamping of Revenankh.

    The following is all canonical data for Revenankh:

    Revenankh Data (open)

    Revenankh:

    [​IMG]

    Height: 6' 0"
    Weight: 96.8 lbs / 44 kg
    Evolution: Revenankh
    Type: Ghost/Fighting
    Ghost: Ghost STAB; brief intangibility that nullifies Normal and Fighting-type attacks. Can move through walls for a brief period of time but must remain in motion. Superior senses in low light and inside dark buildings. Have no vision reduction in hazes.
    Fighting: Fighting STAB; ignore weight restrictions of throwing/grappling moves. Superior reaction time in close quarters.

    Abilities:
    Shed Skin: (Innate) This Pokemon regularly sheds its skin and any impurities contained in its body. If afflicted with a status condition, this Pokemon has a 33% chance of removing all status conditions at the end of a round.
    Air Lock: (Innate) This Pokemon releases immense barometric pressure, clearing the weather in the arena and preventing the effect of weather moves and abilities from taking place.
    Mummy (DW): (Innate) This Pokemon's skin has a lasting curse on it. When strucky by an opponents contact move, the curse transfers, changing the opponent's ability(ies) to Mummy for the next six (6) actions.

    Stats: 90 / 105 / 90 / 65 / 110 / 65

    HP: 100
    Atk: Rank 4
    Def: Rank 3
    SpA: Rank 3
    SpD: Rank 4
    Spe: 65
    Size Class: 3
    Weight Class: 3
    Base Rank Total: 20

    4th Gen Level-Up Moves:
    0 Wrap
    0 Bide
    5 Sand Tomb
    9 Wring Out
    13 Rock Tomb
    18 Arm Thrust
    23 Mean Look
    26 Glare
    29 Shadow Punch
    33 Revenge
    38 Power Whip
    44 Hammer Arm
    52 Punishment
    62 Moonlight

    Egg Moves:
    Curse
    Destiny Bond
    Force Palm
    Mach Punch
    Memento
    Nasty Plot
    Shadow Sneak

    4th Gen Tutor Moves:
    Ancientpower
    Helping Hand
    Ice Punch
    Knock Off
    Ominous Wind
    Pain Split
    Spite
    Sucker Punch
    Superpower
    Trick
    Vacuum Wave

    4th Gen TMs:
    TM01 Focus Punch
    TM06 Toxic
    TM08 Bulk Up
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM12 Taunt
    TM15 Hyper Beam
    TM17 Protect
    TM20 Safeguard
    TM21 Frustration
    TM26 Earthquake
    TM27 Return
    TM30 Shadow Ball
    TM31 Brick Break
    TM32 Double Team
    TM37 Sandstorm
    TM39 Rock Tomb
    TM41 Torment
    TM42 Facade
    TM43 Secret Power
    TM44 Rest
    TM45 Attract
    TM52 Focus Blast
    TM56 Fling
    TM58 Endure
    TM60 Drain Punch
    TM63 Embargo
    TM68 Giga Impact
    TM77 Psych Up
    TM78 Captivate
    TM80 Rock Slide
    TM82 Sleep Talk
    TM83 Natural Gift
    TM85 Dream Eater
    TM87 Swagger
    TM90 Substitute
    HM04 Strength
    HM06 Rock Smash


    1. 5th Generation Moves

    Here is the list of 5th Generation Moves
    .

    5th Gen Moves currently on Revenankh:
    Hex (Egg)
    Wide Guard (Egg)


    TM Moves: What TMS should Revenankh learn in addition to any currently existing ones.

    Note: Round is the only new universal TM.

    5th Gen (and other) added TMs currently on Revenankh:
    Telekinisis
    Smack Down
    Psychic (Added TM)
    Low Sweep
    Round
    Echoed Voice
    Retaliate
    Bulldoze
    Work Up

    2. Hidden Ability:

    Revenank's current Hidden Ability is Mummy. At one point it had Mold Breaker but Mummy just seemed to fit. However I'm open to different suggestions for a Hidden Ability. It does take up a lot of Cofagrigus' air and Rev is pretty strong without it.

    3. Older Generation Moves

    Are there any older moves that were missed that might be viable on Revenankh? In general I view Revenankh as a guardian type of Pokemon so it should have a few throwing and grappling moves like Vital Throw and Submission.

    Discussion Guidelines:

    Movepools are assumed to be stripped down to 4th Gen level. 5th Gen added moves are listed for convenience. If you propose an addition of a move, please provide at least two sentences with reasoning consistent with the flavor or competitive needs of the Pokemon. Do the same with abilities: The key here is reasoning. CAPs are already fairly strong, so if you can make a solid argument for an expansion (be it even something as simple as the Pokemon's theme.)
  2. Son_of_Shadoo

    Son_of_Shadoo

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    I would be in favour of adding ThunderPunch to Rev's movepool from 4th Gen Tutors. It already gets Ice Punch, and while I can see it not getting Fire Punch from a flavour standpoint (he'll end up burning himself to a crisp), practically every Ghost type off the top of my head can use some form of Electric attack. I see no reason for Revenankh to differ.
  3. Alchemator

    Alchemator my god if you don't have an iced tea for me when i
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    We just had a bit of a think on IRC and the general consensus was that Mummy isn't really suitable on Revenankh. While it's incredible flavour-wise it does really remove Cofagrigus' niche. Here are some alternatives that can be discussed:


    • Sand Veil
    • Cursed Body
    • Overcoat
    • Sand Force
    • Steadfast
    • Defiant
    • Unnerve
    • Regenerator
    • Pressure

    Obviously there are some options there which are more powerful than others.
  4. Engineer Pikachu

    Engineer Pikachu Good morning, you bastards!
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    I think that Revenankh is actually fairly balanced; it's not as overpowering as some of the other CAPs, but it's definitely good.

    For move additions, I think that reinforcing the "guardian" concept results in the addition of two moves, Quick Guard and Circle Throw. As Revenankh already possesses Wide Guard in its movepool, Quick Guard doesn't seem too much of a stretch, especially since it does guard things. In the same vein, the "Throw" moves seem to fit naturally on Revenankh, hence Circle Throw; I suppose that Vital Throw could be added as well to support this logic.

    Since Revenankh is a mummy and all, I think that Constrict should be added in with Bind.

    For taking out moves, I honestly don't see Revenankh using Telekinesis. Making a Pokemon float in the air requires some psychic power (as mentioned by move descriptions), and I don't think that Revenankh has the mental power necessary to make a move like this work. Likewise, Psychic is a bit extraneous and stretches the boundaries a bit.
  5. Gerard

    Gerard

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    I'm actually a little pissed with Rev getting not one but two exclusive abilities when people was screaming to the air that Kit couldn't get Ilusion for the same reason, so while Rev's ability couldn't fit more unto him, i'll have to say:

    Change Kit with Rev and Illusion with Mummy and now is Cofagrigus that get's it supposed unique ability removed, so i'll go with something in the lines of

    Looking to the abilities I like Afthermath or Cursed Body (As an abiity that could be like a mummy curse for profaning the body or a dead man by touching it (and destroying it)), Insomnia (He woke up from a long dream, and he's a ghost, he doesn't need to sleep ever again), Levitate (well... he is floting), Sand Force (he gets strenght from being in his enviroment, and would be interesting to see extra power vs moonlight recovery as to what rev would choose) and even Pressure (he looks scary, and many ghost have it, something that will hit everything at least neutraly with his STABs doesn sound something that would put some pressure on anyone)

    PS: I also agree that Psychic and Telekinesis don't sound like moves that Rev should be able to usesince they require the kind of brain power that Rev seems to lack (does he even have a brain?)
  6. Temperantia

    Temperantia

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    I'm agreeing with Cursed Body being the best replacement to Mummy.

    Admittedly, this could be extremely annoying in addition to Rev's already great bulk, but from a flavor standpoint this is top-notch and doesn't infringe on any Pokemon's niche.

    And to the above who don't think Rev should have Psychic: there are much more nonsensical users of the move and it's arguably a staple on Ghost-types.
  7. Deck Knight

    Deck Knight DK! DK! Donkey Kong is here!
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    As far as Telekinesis, ALL Ghosts get that, including Shedinja and Froslass who grow into the type. Psychic isn't as universal, but it's pretty darn close. It wasn't an Egg Move in 4th Gen though so I'm loathe to include it. I might entertain Extrasensory though in lieu of that. (No Ghosts or Fighters get that move, but it is on a collection of esoteric normal types and a few other oddities. Rev could learn it by breeding with Chimecho.)

    Right now Sand Force, Steadfast, and Infiltrator appeal to me. Sand Force because it gives Rev a niche in One Ability battles while not adding to its power in All Abilities. Steadfast because Rev is immune to Fake Out but weak to a fair number of flinch moves in Extrasensory and Air Slash, while it resists Arena-wide Rock Slides, and Infiltrator since it just seems like a guardian can break through opposing defenses.
  8. Tortferngatr

    Tortferngatr

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    As for Psychic: Poliwrath gets it too, along with Lucario. Neither have connection to Psychic-types, and both are fairly "mystic." The only Ghosts to lack Psychic are Rotom and Shedinja. I'd personally argue that Rev should get it.

    As for the current move list:

    Telekinesis: Type-move requirements. Hands down this is kept. Definite keep.
    Smack Down: Eh, maybe. Plenty of Fighting-types get it by TM. Keep.
    Psychic (Added TM): Sure. It isn't exactly taboo on Fighting-types, and 90% of Ghost types (lol Shedinja/Rotom) get it. Keep it.
    Low Sweep: Lol, no. Rev has no legs to trip its foes with. Don't keep it.
    Round: Eh, it's fairly common. All TM-learners get Round, so Ankh should, too. Definite keep.
    Echoed Voice: Eh, why not. Keep it.
    Retaliate: Fairly common on Fighting-types and makes flavor sense. Definite keep.
    Bulldoze: Move-move requirement with EQ. Definite keep.
    Work Up: A lot of Fighters get it via TM. Keep.
    Hex and Wide Guard are both worth keeping IMO.
  9. Dummy007

    Dummy007

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    I agree with Engineer on his entire post; I also agree with SoS's suggestion of ThunderPunch. As an ability, I support Cursed Body, since, as Gerard pointed out, it works well as a Mummy's curse. Additionally, five other Pokemon get it, so it's not really stealing much from any other Pokemon.

    As far as moves go, I also support adding Grudge, Poison Jab, and Nightmare. Rev already gets Memento, and Grudge and Memento are pretty similar in concept. Grudge also fits thematically with Cursed Body as an ability. Many human-esque Fighting-types get Poison Jab, and I think Rev is human enough for it to work. It doesn't really give him too much extra coverage, either. Nightmare is a generic Ghost move, and, again, it works with Cursed Body in spiting his adversaries. Rev doesn't get any sleeping moves anyway, so it's gimmicky in doubles at best.

    EDIT: Wow, I'm slow.
  10. Texas Cloverleaf

    Texas Cloverleaf meh
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    Low Sweep is not specifically tethered to the legs, as dropping down and sweeping out someones legs with ones arms is a reasonably common move in martial arts.
  11. Deck Knight

    Deck Knight DK! DK! Donkey Kong is here!
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    Gothitelle learns Low Sweep (don't ask me how) and has no legs to speak of.
  12. Son_of_Shadoo

    Son_of_Shadoo

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    ... I'm going to guess she uses telekinesis, but that's off topic.

    Supporting Cursed Body as the DW ability, if only to make Rev even more annoying :)
  13. Tortferngatr

    Tortferngatr

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    Gothitelle likely has legs if its prevolutions are anything to go by. They're hidden under her gothtower dress.

    but yeah, I'm convinced. While I'm still not sure it's the best option, I'm not adamantly opposed anymore.
  14. Elevator Music

    Elevator Music
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    I think it's really pathetic to compare Illusion to Mummy, seriously Zoroark is pretty impressively rare by ingame standards (especially compared to Cofagrigus) and Illusion is a much more powerful ability than Mummy. And nobody even uses Cofagrigus, I doubt they would just because of Mummy anyways. But c'mon, it already has it, it fits Revenankh incredibly well, please just don't mess with that lol. Not to mention Revenankh already has Air Lock........

    "am I biased??"
  15. Alchemator

    Alchemator my god if you don't have an iced tea for me when i
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    Yes, but then again so am I for wanting Mummy removed. In its stead, I would support Sand Force mainly.

    I also can't see Low Sweep working on Revenankh, though my imagination is most likely tapping into my BatCAP experiences mainly.

    I would support Psychic being replaced by Extrasensory.
  16. Deck Knight

    Deck Knight DK! DK! Donkey Kong is here!
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    An update:

    Revenankh Data (open)

    Revenankh:

    [​IMG]

    Height: 6' 0"
    Weight: 96.8 lbs / 44 kg
    Evolution: Revenankh
    Type: Ghost/Fighting
    Ghost: Ghost STAB; brief intangibility that nullifies Normal and Fighting-type attacks. Can move through walls for a brief period of time but must remain in motion. Superior senses in low light and inside dark buildings. Have no vision reduction in hazes.
    Fighting: Fighting STAB; ignore weight restrictions of throwing/grappling moves. Superior reaction time in close quarters.

    Abilities:
    Shed Skin: (Innate) This Pokemon regularly sheds its skin and any impurities contained in its body. If afflicted with a status condition, this Pokemon has a 33% chance of removing all status conditions at the end of a round.
    Air Lock: (Innate) This Pokemon releases immense barometric pressure, clearing the weather in the arena and preventing the effect of weather moves and abilities from taking place.
    Infiltrator (DW): (Innate) Through a combination of speed and cunning, this Pokemon easily circumvents the effects of Light Screen, Mist, Reflect, and Safeguard with all of its attacks.

    Stats: 90 / 105 / 90 / 65 / 110 / 65

    HP: 100
    Atk: Rank 4
    Def: Rank 3
    SpA: Rank 3
    SpD: Rank 4
    Spe: 65
    Size Class: 3
    Weight Class: 3
    Base Rank Total: 20

    4th Gen Level-Up Moves:
    0 Wrap
    0 Bide
    5 Sand Tomb
    9 Wring Out
    13 Rock Tomb
    18 Arm Thrust
    23 Mean Look
    26 Glare
    29 Shadow Punch
    33 Revenge
    38 Power Whip
    44 Hammer Arm
    52 Punishment
    62 Moonlight

    5th Gen Level-Up Moves:
    0 Wrap
    0 Bide
    5 Sand Tomb
    8 Wring Out
    12 Rock Tomb
    15 Arm Thrust
    19 Mean Look
    22 Glare
    25 Shadow Punch
    28 Vital Throw
    33 Revenge
    38 Power Whip
    44 Hammer Arm
    52 Punishment
    55 Grudge
    62 Moonlight

    Egg Moves:
    Counter
    Curse
    Destiny Bond
    Force Palm
    Hex
    Mach Punch
    Memento
    Nasty Plot
    Shadow Sneak
    Submission
    Wide Guard

    4th Gen Tutor Moves:
    Ancientpower
    Helping Hand
    Ice Punch
    Knock Off
    Mud-Slap
    Ominous Wind
    Pain Split
    Spite
    Sucker Punch
    Superpower
    Trick
    Vacuum Wave

    4th Gen TMs:
    TM01 Focus Punch
    TM06 Toxic
    TM08 Bulk Up
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM12 Taunt
    TM15 Hyper Beam
    TM17 Protect
    TM20 Safeguard
    TM21 Frustration
    TM26 Earthquake
    TM27 Return
    TM30 Shadow Ball
    TM31 Brick Break
    TM32 Double Team
    TM37 Sandstorm
    TM39 Rock Tomb
    TM41 Torment
    TM42 Facade
    TM43 Secret Power
    TM44 Rest
    TM45 Attract
    TM52 Focus Blast
    TM56 Fling
    TM58 Endure
    TM60 Drain Punch
    TM63 Embargo
    TM68 Giga Impact
    TM77 Psych Up
    TM78 Captivate
    TM80 Rock Slide
    TM82 Sleep Talk
    TM83 Natural Gift
    TM85 Dream Eater
    TM87 Swagger
    TM90 Substitute
    HM04 Strength
    HM06 Rock Smash

    5th Gen TMs:
    TM06 Toxic
    TM08 Bulk Up
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM12 Taunt
    TM15 Hyper Beam
    TM17 Protect
    TM19 Telekinesis
    TM20 Safeguard
    TM21 Frustration
    TM23 Smack Down
    TM26 Earthquake
    TM27 Return
    TM29 Psychic
    TM30 Shadow Ball
    TM31 Brick Break
    TM32 Double Team
    TM37 Sandstorm
    TM39 Rock Tomb
    TM41 Torment
    TM42 Facade
    TM44 Rest
    TM45 Attract
    TM47 Low Sweep
    TM48 Round
    TM49 Echoed Voice
    TM52 Focus Blast
    TM56 Fling
    TM63 Embargo
    TM66 Payback
    TM67 Retaliate
    TM68 Giga Impact
    TM77 Psych Up
    TM78 Bulldoze
    TM80 Rock Slide
    TM83 Work Up
    TM84 Poison Jab
    TM85 Dream Eater
    TM87 Swagger
    TM90 Substitute
    TM94 Rock Smash
    HM04 Strength


    So on this draft, Revenankh has everything it already had plus Vital Throw and Grudge (Level-Up) as well as Submission (Egg) and Poison Jab (TM). Mud-Slap has also been added back as it is a canonical 4th Gen Tutor. Mummy has been replaced by Infiltrator.

    I thought about Circle Throw and ThunderPunch. I rejected the latter since Revenankh can't phaze now and I think adding that utility to it would be a bit too much. ThunderPunch I'll wait until Grey is released (or whatever the third game will be) and see what kind of tutors those have, and update all CAP Pokemon from there.

    In general I like how it looks and I think the new moves work. As far as Infiltrator, it's also the Hidden Ability of Spiritomb, another tomb-based Ghost Pokemon. Infiltrator allows it to get through Screens and even Glare through Safeguard, so it has a fair bit of utility. I think this will end up being the final.

    Hidden Ability:
    Revenankh's Hidden Ability is now Infiltrator.

    Added/Moved Attacks:
    Superpower is now a Previous Gen Tutor Only.
    Drain Punch is now Past Gen TM Only.
    Mud-Slap is now available as a 4th Gen Tutor Move.
    Vital Throw and Grudge are now available as Level-Up Moves.
    Submission is now available as an Egg Move.
    Poison Jab is now available as a TM Move.
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