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CAP 12 CAP1 - Part 5c - (Secondary Ability Discussion)

Discussion in 'CAP Process Archive' started by reachzero, Mar 17, 2011.

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  1. guddagudda

    guddagudda

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    You read what you wanted to read and took my points out of context, there is no reason at all for me to reply to this post.

    EDIT: As did Paradox. For example, in your first refutation you assume that I "ignore" the paralysis and sleep/freeze. However, the very fucking next sentence I explain how Regen recovers damage and thoughtful team building (Aromatherapy, for instance, and for the second time) completely solves this without limiting the CAP to one item to be able to use it's second ability. Diversity is key in momentum, and Poison Heal is detrimental to this.
  2. SJCrew

    SJCrew Believer, going on a journey...
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    I don't see any strong or valid arguments in favor of CAP being broken with Poison Heal, but a lot of concern is being expressed at the idea of it adding a excessive degree of bulk and not fulfilling the concept, which I frankly agree with.

    We don't want it to simply be able to switch into everything and be difficult to take down, we want it to support the team by turning losing situations into winning ones. If you're already down a Pokemon or two and have a weakened Poison Heal CAP, you will not have the power to change the tide of battle. With Prankster, you may still have a trick up your sleeve to prevent setup or a sweep. And the best part of it is, it works in any battle and any situation without adding any more to this Pokemon's tanking ability than what we've established.

    Simply put, I think Poison Heal is the wrong decision because it will make this CAP a decisive tank rather than a bulky offensive Pokemon as it was intended. On top of that, it doesn't have the versatility to be able to do things like cripple Blaziken while its health is low, making it easy to revenge by something else on the team, which is an instant momentum shift. We need to think more about fulfilling our objective than making an awesome Pokemon with as few weakpoints as possible.
  3. Pwnemon

    Pwnemon is a more intuitive player
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    Rolling with your example of sleep/freeze and Aromatherapy, that's pretty much the best momentum steal your opponent can make, which ie basically a stamp of failure on the CAP. I mean, Eat Freeze(Waste turn) > Switch to Aromatherapist > Use Aromatherapy is basically saying "Oh sorry opponent here's your momentum back three fold.

    On the other hand my thing about toxic heal is that while it does a good job of blocking status and getting heal, it is highly liable to become a (in many ways inferior) Gliscor2.0
  4. Gerard

    Gerard

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    I actually have a question regarding Magic Bounce, it's obviously a great ability, one that may even get the Cap in Borderline Broken, but i want to say, how about Colossoil's Rebound?, it seems like Magic Bounce before magic bounce, still nerfed enough like not stopping taunt and stuff like that, seems like a nice second choice and it would help momentum just as much as Magic Bounce with a little more restrictions, and if something with good bulk can use it I don't see it so Broken in this Cap
  5. Destiny Warrior

    Destiny Warrior also known as Darkwing_Duck
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    Pokemon Online is not very conducive to implementing custom abiltiies. In case you didn't notice earlier, no custom abilities are implemented in the client.
  6. Attract

    Attract

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    Do you really have to swear?

    And anyway, what's so great about Regenerator? The only situation it could possibly be better than Intimidate is when you are switching into special attacks, which you really shouldn't be doing. Recovering off 33% of your HP is nice, sure, but that doesn't mean it will be able to take the 50%+ neutral physical attacks on the switch in, which Intimidate addresses. It really isn't different enough from Intimidate to give it the second ability. Both provide it longevity, one with more bulk and the other with more hp (in a sense), but Regenerator doesn't actually give it the boost while it's in play.
  7. guddagudda

    guddagudda

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    If you would read the post being argued here, you would see I am not even a proponent of Regenerator. I merely am pointing out how redundant having PH and Intimidate would be. I got quoted to make it seem like I support Regen over PH as if that's all I said.
  8. Aerodactyl Legend

    Aerodactyl Legend

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    I think that's a very good direct argument on why Regenerator wouldn't help this CAP much in the long run. It fits decently well into the concept, but I'd much rather use Intimidate 90% of the time.
  9. NijaSkills

    NijaSkills

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    On the Mold Breaker idea, what use would Mold Breaker actually be? There are no abilities that give a fighting or flying immunity (besides wonder guard, which doesn't concern it), and of the move types that do carry common immunity abilities (ground, fire, electric, water), only electric gives it any real useful coverage, and all the common Volt Absorb/Motor Drive/Lightning Rod are electric-type, so CAP won't want to deal with them anyway.

    As for Snow Warning, while it, like Cloud Nine, helps against Weather Teams, it is very situational. Especially as Hail teams are kind of gimmicky at best, with only Blizzard-spam and Stallrein/regi going for it. I think that a Prankster weather-move (such as Hail) would make it more useful in other situations.
  10. guddagudda

    guddagudda

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    The argument for MB isn't that it allows CAP to hit things that have immunity, but to make your opponent's ability useless (e.g., Sand Throws, Swift Swims, Chlorophyll, Huge Power, etc., etc.).

    Terrible, why would you give a Flying-type priority Hail? Snow Warning makes it immune to the Hail AND doesn't take up a spot, as it activates on the switch in. With two Hail starters, Hail teams may see an increase in usage and become less "gimmicky." But this isn't the main allure of this ability, either. It is designed to stop weather-based momentum and reverse it with a simple switch. This, to me, is a prime example of a great momentum Pokemon in the current metagame.
  11. reachzero

    reachzero the pastor of disaster
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    The secondary ability poll will consist of Prankster, Poison Heal, Regenerator, and Cursed Body.
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