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Celebi (Analysis) QC 3/3

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by yee, Sep 20, 2012.

  1. yee

    is a Battle Server Moderator Alumnusis a Past WCoP Champion

    Jan 3, 2010
    Since the analysis was chosen to be reassigned I've elected to write it. Im c/ping Ojama's skelly for now and I'll have it written up by next Thursday.


    Great Base Stats all around
    Quite good typing especially the Grass Typing
    Awesome Ability
    Fantastic Movepool
    Can be used as a Defensive Pokemon (specially or physically) and an Offensive Pokemon
    Blocks some new threats like Keldeo, Thundurus-T, Sheer Force Landorus
    Good support options
    Access to Nasty Plot
    U-Turn weak
    Pursuit weak
    Has a small place in Volturn
    Tornadus-T weak

    name: Defensive
    move 1: Giga Drain
    move 2: Recover
    move 3: U-Turn
    move 4: Perish Song / Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Ice
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Calm
    evs: 252 HP / 244 SpD / 20 Spe

    Good check to many new offensive threats such as Keldeo, Thundurus-T and Sheer Force Landorus.
    Giga Drain is a STAB that gives you recovery and makes you not Taunt bait
    Perish Song gives Celebi a small niche to stop set up sweepers such as Reuniclus, Latias and SubDDNite
    Recover gives you life
    U-turn allows Celebi to build momentum while still being a defensive Pokemon
    HP Fire screws over Ferrothorn and Scizor
    Watchout though, HP Fire can't OHKO Scizor, you'll need a few damage on it before (Stealth Rock + U-Turn should be enough)
    Spread stops a 2HKO from Thundurus-T's LO Modest HP Ice
    20 Spe for Magnezone
    Rest in HP and SpD because you need as much SpD as possible to handle Latios and Thundurus-T
    Lefties is your only item choice
    A Physically Defensive Set is also possible with a Bold Nature.

    Run more or max defense if your hate physics walls, the spread is pretty flexable
    Natural Cure helps a lot here
    Only use Stealth Rock if your team has no other user
    you can use Thunder Wave or even Psychic for the last slot
    Heal Bell
    Ferrothorn and Scizor screw you over without HP Fire so use something like Heatran, Skarmory or even Forretress.
    Works well with Entry Hazards since it has U-Turn
    Tentacruel is an interesting partner in Rain : it spins and sets up Toxic Spikes
    A Sassy Nature could be used there if you would like to hit a bit harder with U-Turn (against another Celebi for example). Evs in Speed would go in SpD / Def.
    Scarf Tyranitar is an amazing partner with U-Turn because Celebi attracts Lati@s, Gengar and traps them
    Gliscor is a good teammate since it handles Terrakion, Scizor and Stall Heatran very well
    Gastrodon and Heatran work well with Celebi because both can check quite well Tornadus-T and Genesect
    Skarmory counters Scizor and checks Terrakion + it can Spikes which is great against U-Turn users such as Genesect and Scizor

    name: Nasty Plot
    move 1: Nasty Plot
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Earth Power / Hidden Power Fire
    move 4: Psychic / Recover / Hidden Power Ice
    nature: Timid
    item : Leftovers / Life Orb
    evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    Arguably the best pure offensive set Celebi can run
    NP boosts your SpA, allowing the sweep
    Giga Drain is a solid STAB and restores your health
    HP Fire because fuck you Steels
    Earth Power because fuck you Heatran
    Psychic because fuck you genies and Dragonite
    Recover because fuck you things that won't let Celebi restore health with Giga Drain
    Spread changed to be much more offensive, now you're not outsped by everything
    Spread can be changed to be more defensive (use Recover / HP Fire in this case with a Modest Nature).
    Hidden Power Ice to hit Dragonite, Hydreigon, Landorus, Tornadus-T etc

    Bulkier spread of 220 HP / 180 SpA / 96 Spe but a lot is faster
    no matter what you're always not gonna have coverage on something so there are good other moves
    Baton Pass
    Scarf Terrakion is still a good teammate here to get rid of genies and fast stuff and special walls (Blissey & Chansey) he also takes the Dark-type attacks Celebi hates
    Tentacruel has good synergy and can spin away hazards (only in Rain)
    Heatran for the Scizor weakness, Magnezone can fit here as well
    Scarf Tyranitar for Lati@s and Gengar
    Jirachi works well with Wish and it can also handle Tornadus-T, Genesect, Lati@s and Gengar
    Leaf Storm can be used over Giga Drain for more power

    name: Offensive
    move 1: Leaf Storm
    move 2: Hidden Power Fire
    move 3: Earth Power / Psychic
    move 4: U-turn / Recover / Thunder Wave
    item: Life Orb
    nature: Timid / Modest
    evs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe

    Leaf Storm is an awesomely powerful STAB move to be used like DM would be on a Dragon
    HP Fire is to take out Steels not named Heatran
    Earth Power is for Steels named Heatran
    Psychic is a reliable STAB move without the -2 SpA effect
    U-turn is a good scouting move
    Thunder Wave gives Celebi some support options
    Recover is awesome and heals off the LO recoil
    Life Orb is great for Celebi (who doesn't have the greatest SpA)
    I kept the EV spread because I honestly couldn't think of a better one

    Lefties lets you live longer
    Giga Drain is a more reliable STAB move
    use Scarf Terrakion with this, trust me
    Deoxys-D for Hazards
    Watch out for Heatran if you don't carry Earth Power
    HP Ice really won't do much to 2x Dragons, so don't overestimate it
    4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe w/ Timid
    Bulkier spread running 36 Spe, 252 SpA, 220 Spe (use Thunder Wave in this case)
    Stealth Rock is an option over U-Turn or Earth Power
    Scarf Tyranitar

    name: Baton Pass
    move 1: Baton Pass
    move 2: Calm Mind / Nasty Plot
    move 3: Giga Drain
    move 4: Substitute / Hidden Power Fire
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Calm
    evs: 252 HP / 224 SpD / 32 Spe

    Calm Mind > Nasty Plot, since it is much easier to pass CM boosts than NP boosts.
    101 HP Sub makes Chansey / Blissey set-up fodder and protects the CM recipient on the turn of Baton Pass
    Substitute also blocks Dragon Tail - Careful Dragonite's Dragon Tail does not break Celebi's Substitute. After 3 CMs, not even Rain Tank's Hurricane would break Celebi's Substitute most of the time.
    Specially Defensive spread makes setting up CMs on special sweepers much easier.
    HP Fire can be used over Substitute to take out Skarmory before it can phaze Celebi's special attack boosts.
    Many Rain Pokemon are set-up fodder for Celebi

    Thunder Wave gives it 25% fp chance of BP success against phazers, and it's a generally good utility move.
    Earth Power to dispatch Heatran, which may phaze Celebi
    84 SpA to OHKO specially defensive Heatran with a +2 Earth Power or a physically defensive Skarmory with a +2 HP Fire
    72 Spe to beat Modest Heatran to the punch.
    Swords Dance & Seed Bomb / Zen Headbutt to pass Atk boosts
    Magic Coat / Espeon to cockblock phazers
    Recover to keep it healthy
    Rain support is nice to ensure Leftovers recovery and halving Fire moves. Obviously Celebi wouldn't use HP Fire in this case.
    Special sweepers that benefits from a few SpA boosts, such as Thundurus-T, Keldeo, Starmie, Latios, Volcarona.
    Wish Passer / Heal Wisher, such as Jirachi to keep Celebi healthy.
    Teammates that can deal with Scizor, PSong Celebi, Volcarona, and Tornadus. Heatran is a good answer to many of them; Scizor can Pursuit-trap Celebi / Tornadus; Jirachi is the best answer to Tornadus; Gyarados checks Scizor & Volcarona.

    name: Choice
    move 1: Leaf Storm
    move 2: Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Fire
    move 3: Earth Power / Psychic
    move 4: U-turn / Trick
    item: Choice Scarf / Choice Specs
    nature: Timid
    evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    Scarf is revenger
    Leaf Storm is the omnipresent awesome STAB
    HP Fire breaks Steels
    HP Ice breaks Dragons and can actually do something to 2x with Specs
    Earth Power breaks Heatran
    Psychic is a strong STAB
    U-turn is great for scouting
    Trick screws with Blissey / Chansey / stall mons
    Timid to tie with +100's
    Offensive spread

    Modest for more power for the Choice Specs
    Fine tune the spread to be bulkier for the Choice Specs
    Use hazards with this
    Giga Drain is a more reliable STAB for the Choice Specs
    Terrakion is good with this
    Spin away hazards because Celebi will be switching in alot, Starmie can do this well

    [Other Options]
    Swords Dance
    Calm Mind
    Dual Screens
    Perish Song
    Healing Wish
    Stealth Rock
    Trick Room

    [Checks and Counters]
    Faster stuff with strong SE STABs (Tornadus-T, etc.) in general
    Kyurem in hail
    Sun teams
    Salamence / Dragonite if you lack HP Ice
    Scarf Heracross
    X-Scissor on anything that gets it
    Skarmory without Hidden Power Fire
  2. doughboy

    doughboy backhand slap ready
    is a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Sep 4, 2011
    I would mention on more defensive teams that U-turn can be replaced by a more appropriate utility option like Heal Bell. I really question U-turn being that useful to Celebi, since so many things can perform the task of getting switch initiative while Celebi can provide some pretty unique support (Paralysis, Healing Wish, Perish Song, and Heal Bell)
  3. alexwolf

    alexwolf lurks in the shadows
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Jul 3, 2009
    I also think that Heal Bell has a lot of merit on SpD Celebi, as many balanced and stall teams appreciate a cleric. Imo you should remove HP Ice as a third slash and put Heal Bell there. Celebi isn't supposed to check dragons anyway, so i see little merit in using HP Ice.

    Also why Specs Celebi? Grass is a hideous offensive typing to be lcoked into, and the other awful coverage moves don't help either (HP Fire is weak as shit, and as many know, ground moves suck to be locked into). And if this wasn't enough, Celebi is huge Pursuit bait and and has a very mediocre SpA stat. While some of this points remain true about the Scarf set too, Celebi has just enough power to revenge kill what it needs to, along with the bulk to switch in numerous times and U-turn, which are useful traits for a scarfer. So Scarf Celebi may be a mediocre scarfer but he can be an ok pick if your teams needs his useful resistances and bulk, while Specs Celebi is just bad and outclassed (why would you give him Specs when the all out attacking Celebi does everything better?).

    Just my 2 cents...
  4. shrang

    shrang AAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!
    is a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Jul 24, 2009
    Yeah, I thought we rejected Specs Celebi already. Scarf Celebi, I can deal with, but Specs is just bad.
  5. Pocket

    Pocket playing 100%
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Dec 22, 2004
    yee is not working on Celebi anymore - anybody want to finish writing this up?
  6. alexwolf

    alexwolf lurks in the shadows
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    Jul 3, 2009
    Someone lock this pls, the new thread is up.

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