I guess mabey with the nerffs on hurricane, but I think that OU has too many special attackers. It's just not good enough to take all those attacks
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Pokémon Chesnaught (Revamp Occurring)
- Thread starter Psylink
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So just don't use him against special attackers. Not every mon you fight is going to run on special attacks, and he can take the ones he resists. He's a physical tank, so just use him as such. That being said, as much as I like Chesnaught and the potential he has as good physical tank, I can really only see him being UU, and maybe utilized as on some OU teams as a counter to certain threats like Physical Tyranitar or sub/disable Gengar
His ability to check/counter stuff like Excadrill (this one is big), Landorus (Resist BOTH Stone Edge and Earthquake, also BIG and look at his main sets, it resist ALL moves on them), Landorus-I, Tyranitar, Absol/MegaAbsol without Psycho Cut, Keldeo (ironically he walls special attacker if it runs Sacred Sword, while resist his BOTH STABs, as Sacred Sword hit it on his much better defense stat and HP Ghost is pitifuly weak against it), Hippowdon, Gyarados (watch out on Bounce though), Garchomp, Gengar (this ability :D) etc. give him solid enough niche. 90/128 physical bulk with this typing is really damn good (Resists to -Grass, -DARK, -EARTH, -ROCK [resisting EdgeQuake for physical wall is big]) while 90/70 special bulk when invested can work as well. I really don't get people which say Grass/Fighting is bad typing defensively, when it fact it's... good, especially for physical walling and it has some good resist on special side as well (Grass, Water, Dark) so it can switch on weaker special attacks as well.
EDIT: Yeah, forgot about Spiky Shield. Ok, he technically walls Gyarados as well.
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Chesnaught doesn't have to worry about Bounce because of Spiky Shield. In fact, it would actually like to switch in to Bounce (the set-up turn).
I think people see that 4x weakness and immediately assume he's hard to use. Flying attacks are a lot more common now, but most are stab attacks so it's really easy to predict, i can't think of a whole lot of pokemon that use flying for coverage.
My original point was that hurricane was the only real common flying move in OU (or brave bird sometimes) so it might have a chance of being OU
To say Chestnaught is an unworthy Pokemon (for lack of a better word) is incredibly shortsighted. He has quite a few weaknesses, but those are for moves that it isn't supposed to take. He walls physical attacks beautifully, he has a nice attack score to work with and the movepool (lousy 4 slot limit) to fight back. Sure, he's slow. Like many other bulky walls. There are plenty of slow pokes that works out well, especially with the nerfing to certain offenses..
I think his main flaw, and the reason that he won't see much use in the higher tiers, is that there are simply more options out there. He isn't bad, but everything else is better. I think he'll be a decent UU mon, with specific uses in OU, as stated above me. Like, if you wanted to use him in OU, he'll more than pull his own weight.
I think his main flaw, and the reason that he won't see much use in the higher tiers, is that there are simply more options out there. He isn't bad, but everything else is better. I think he'll be a decent UU mon, with specific uses in OU, as stated above me. Like, if you wanted to use him in OU, he'll more than pull his own weight.
Why did you not use Spiky Shield?
In other news do we have any confirmation on what Bulletproof blocks specifically?
There's a bulletproof thread in uncharted territory that has a WIP list.
Were you switching into stray flying moves, or trying to use him as a wall instead of a defensive spiker?
While I don't think he'll be rampaging all over OU, I definitely think it'll be possible to use him, and in his own way, too. He has a multitude of safe switch ins due to bulletproof, and grass type powder immunities to set up spikes, and can hit pretty hard to boot.
As a pure hazard set-up and wall, he's well outclassed by ferrothorn and even Forretress. As a grass / fighting sweeper Breloom has it outclassed. IT's best (and only) shot is to switch in on something it walls, and then proceed to either set up spikes OR predict the switch to hit it hard.
Offensively, it gets Dragon claw, Shadow claw, powerful STAB in wood hammer or Seed bomb, and hammer arm. It can toxic certain switch ins if you choose to run it. While he definitely suffers from 4 move slot syndrome (You want spiky shield, spikes, leech shield, synthesis, and a multitude of attacking moves, hell maybe even Substitute), he can have various options.
To use in OU you'll need to be careful, and take out key threats such as talonflame, hurricane users, skarmory, and you'll need to be wary of special sweepers. I'm not familiar with UU so much, so I'm not certain how common fliers are down there. But he could see use down there as a ferrothorn-lite.
I mean, if people are TRULY worried about flying types, chesnaught learns rock slide...
Chesnaught will be OU simply because he counters Gengar so hard with Bulletproof. And in a bulky offense world, if you want him to just be offensive, give him the Assault Vest. 90/128/88 bulk is nothing to sneeze at, especially when it is immune to so many of the hardest hitting special moves (here: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/bulletproof.3490443/#post-4906173) that it can't resist. If you're afraid of Flying types, then you aren't playing Stealth Rocks smartly enough - no team will have more than 1 Defogger.
Unfortunately Gengar will get Sludge Wave back in December, which will be able to OHKO Chesnaught every time, so he will be limited to countering certain variants of Gengar, but it might just make Sub/Disable Gengar less common. But I still see him as a viable counter to Tyranitar, Ferrothorn, Gyarados
While I do like Chesnaught, I don't know how that would justify it going OU. Firstly, Mega-Gengar won't care because he'll be killing things that are shadow tagged trapped (before it goes uber). Also, defensive Chesnaught likely won't be able to touch non-mega Gengar since it is immune to earthquake and hammer arm. Also, wood hammer is resisted and leech seed is blocked by substitute. Not to mention that Chesnaught will likely want to have spiky shield so one of the above moves would have to be dropped.
Lastly, Gengar users might start using Dazzling Gleam or Psychic if they got tired of being walled. Then again, what is Chesnaught going to accomplish after a walled Gengar switches out?
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I fully agree here he is definitely good enough as a bulky offense or something and can work easily in RU. I think Chestnaught and Lapras (who can get FreezeDry from egg move) would work really really well together.
Anyways i didnt go through the pages so dont know if this set has been called but this is what ill be running:
Bulletproof Leftovers
Impish 252hp 252def 4spdef
-Leech Seed
-Spikey Shield
-Wood Hammer
-PowerUp Punch
This makes for a great defensive wall between leechseed and spikeyshield and good predictions. Wood Hammer takes advantage of great attack stat and powerup punch (outside of stab) gives you plus one so you can try to give yourself more umph to your hits
If Chesnaught sees use specifically against Gengar, Chesnaught will run shadow claw. If you know you wall Gengar, you can set up a layer of spikes easily.
My bad. I always assume people will use him as a sub-seeder. Although due to the defog buff, I wonder if people will run spikes on Chesnaught. I guess time will tell. About shadow claw, I just don't know if Chesnaught has the moveslot for it. It does seems like a pretty good option, but the there are a few downsides. 1) Sub+Disable Gengar still walls it and 2) Such overspecialization for Gengar might be problematic for Chesnaught if it faces a team lacking it.
Yeah, I definitely don't think Chesnaught will be using SubSeed in OU at least. Waaaay too many things can easily force him out. Mind you, the seeds would benefit whoever switches in.
His best bet for OU, IMO, is to switch in on something he walls, and set up spikes on the switch out. Spikes / Spiky shield / 2 attacks is what I'm thinking. Ultimately, though, Ferrothorn would do that better.
They have totally different niche. Ferrothorn typing is better for walling special attackers, while Chesnaught looks like a Pokemon which is designed to take physical attackers. As I said before - Grass/Fighting is great for it. Resisting EdgeQuake combo, which many Pokemon use for coverage is brilliant to have and you have some other great resistances (Dark, Water, Grass to name few), make him good at this job. I checked calcs, he 100% walls Excadrill and standard Landorus sets, no matter what they do. Also takes every single hit against Calm Mind Sacred Sword Keldeo and Choice Specs (just watch out on Focus Blast and Icy Wind, everything you take fine without SR up, it's ironic how Sacred Sword hit him on his much better physical bulk). If you want to be 100% sure to check Keldeo and Gengar as well with Chesnaught, I would recommend to change nature from Impish to Careful. You don't need this positive nature on defense, as you still 100% wall Excadrill, Gyarados and Landorus with standard movesets (while you still 100% counter CB Tyranitar with Stone Edge/Crunch/Earthquake/Aqua Tail and just watch out on random Fire Blasts/Ice Beams), while Careful nature allows you to avoid 2HKO from Keldeo Specs Hydro Pump with SR 100% of time, which is good. I'll edit this post later with calcs.
I don't care how many people say this guy is gonna end up NU/RU. I'm using Chesnaught wherever the hay I want. My first Pokémon in X and Y was Chespin, and I've loved him every step of the way.
Sure, Chesnaught is lacking in a bunch of things. But instead of worrying about what he doesn't have, play to his strengths! My Chesnaught is slow, and basically dead meat against Flying, Fire, and Psychic types.........but seriously, you're supposed to switch out when you have a type-disadvantage, not mutter "Welp, guess I'm screwed..."
Spiky Shield, Wood Hammer, Hammer Arm, Gyro Ball.
Not perfect, but no Pokémon is. He is Grass-Fighting, and fills the role of bulky physical tank+attacker. No other Pokémon can do that.
Chesnaught is awesome in his own way. Done.
Sure, Chesnaught is lacking in a bunch of things. But instead of worrying about what he doesn't have, play to his strengths! My Chesnaught is slow, and basically dead meat against Flying, Fire, and Psychic types.........but seriously, you're supposed to switch out when you have a type-disadvantage, not mutter "Welp, guess I'm screwed..."
Spiky Shield, Wood Hammer, Hammer Arm, Gyro Ball.
Not perfect, but no Pokémon is. He is Grass-Fighting, and fills the role of bulky physical tank+attacker. No other Pokémon can do that.
Chesnaught is awesome in his own way. Done.
Only smeargle
Bulletproof makes Chesnaught immune to Focus Blast for Keldeo, only icy wind on Specs Keldeo can cause problems.
No, Chesnaught is ONLY in field egg group (he is NOT in the grass egg group). There is no grass or mineral pokemon that also have field egg group besides Shifrty line and Serperior line. I highly doubt they can learn spikey shield as an egg move. The ONLY way would only be if Cacturne line or Maractus line can learn Spiky Shield via level up
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