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BW NU Cloudy with a chance of Draco spam

Discussion in 'RMT Archive' started by ebeast, Aug 25, 2012.

  1. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    [​IMG]
    Dank banner and title made by Keiran (as if you didn't already know by now)

    Introduction

    This RMT actually has quite a bit of a history behind it that dates back to even before Jynx era. When I first read the original Altaria NU analysis back in December of 2011, I took a quick look at the Other Options section and noticed the following, "A Choice Specs set could be used to punish the metagame which lacks enough Steel-types to resist." After taking note I opened up my PO1 Teambuilder and I was off finding the best moves and best EV spread to go with my new found Pokemon. After a bit of fiddling around I had made my first version of what I would later come to call SpecsTaria. After a bit of testing, I truly fell in love with the Pokemon and got my first taste of STAB spamming Choice users I would soon use in pretty much most of my teams. I quickly told my friend, Keiran, that I would get SpecsTaria past QC and get to rank 1 on the ladder with it. While I did manage to get Choice Specs Altaria past QC, I am a huge procrastinator (Like how I am currently procrastinating some AP Bio homework to write this :3) and never did end up laddering enough to make it that far. Even so I still really wanted to share the great Pokemon that I felt everyone should give a chance to. I was originally going to post an RMT using a weird balanced/stall team alongside Altaria back in February under the same name, but even managed to procrastinate that. After the banning of Jynx, I felt it was time to make a new team and finish what I started. This new team was off to be much more offensive based and to take advantage of Altaria's ability to break down many Pokemon. While the composition of the team changed quite a bit to keep it hip with the metagame, the general strategy stayed the same.

    This is what my current team looks like, and while it certainly has flaws it was very fun to make and use. I hope to express this excitement in my writing and formatting style that have evolved so far over time. This is... Cloudy with a chance of Draco spam​

    "While a situation might seem cloudy, there is always a ray of light looking to find its way out."




    Teambuilding Process (open)
    (For those of you wondering what my original team was, here is your answer:
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    As you can see this was a...weird kind of team, but I guess it worked for me back then. Grumpig was basically my little secret weapon against Magmortar and Jynx (Though Grumpig's presence wasn't enough for me to not make pro-ban posts for Jynx in her discussion thread :>)
    [​IMG]
    I like said, this team started off with SpecsTaria. Already with just one mon ready I had a team concept in mind.
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    I decided that since Altaria could break down walls so well, it would make a great partner for SD Samurott as well as having good synergy with it. However I realized that Altaria couldn't break everything on her own...
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Torterra was capable of beating everything that could beat Altaria, but bringing forth another X4 Ice weak mon was not the best thing for this team. I felt I needed another Ice resist and a good Stealth Rock user.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Probopass was a really good fit thanks to resisting Ice and being a good user of Stealth Rock. Having access to Volt Switch never hurts, and made Probopass into a lasting member of the team. However at this point my team was not enjoying Gorebyss or Rain teams that were becoming popular with the recent drop of Ludicolo, so...
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Yup, I got my own Rain Dish Ludicolo to royally screw over teams with Gorebyss and other rain sweepers. I was weak to Sawk and had only one slot left so...
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    SubNP Missy finished my old team and was actually a very good Pokemon back in it's day. However after quite a bit of playing with this, BW2 had come out and along with it some major threats in Skill Link Cinccino and Toxic Boost Zangoose were released...
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    I am a very big fan of keeping old teams alive so even after the release of these major threats, I just updated my team to hopefully fit into the metagame. Haunter was an excellent replacement for Missy and was an excellent check to Zangoose. My team lacked priority and I wanted a way to deal with Musharna so Encore Cacturne was the way to go as Spikes and priority benefits this team so much. Last but not least I discovered that Emboar could do the job of Torterra, but with better offensive synergy alongside Altaria, so that was just a natural change. After all of that, Cloudy with a chance of Draco spam was finished.


    Team Strategy

    The basic concept of this team is to utilize SpecsTaria and CBoar to break down walls (and each other's counters too) and open up the field to an SD Samurott sweep. Probopass is the bulky pivot of my team, that takes advantage in its, in my opinion, good typing to easily set up Stealth Rock and provide offensive momentum with Volt Switch. I have heard a lot of people saying that Probopass's only real niche is purely due to Volt Switch and that it sucks otherwise. In my opinion, while it is true that Volt Switch is a pretty big factor in its usage, it is also an extremely good asset to have. While an unstabbed 70 BP move is certainly not going to be overpowering anything, Probopass's typing and bulk forces a lot of switches that it can easily take the switch advantage without much of a hassle. This is HUGE for offensive teams, because in a metagame where hazards are as easy to set up as they are and as hard to get rid off as they are, being able to force Pokemon out thanks to gaining the switch advantage and getting free hits on things in absolutely invaluable. Cacturne provides Spikes, priority in STAB Sucker Punch, Encore support, and great Grass-type Pokemon to complete my Fire/Water/Grass core. Last but not least, Haunter has amazing immunities and is my main answer to Zangoose. SubDisable Haunter is seriously an amazing Pokemon in this metagame, and a great fit on my team.​


    At a Glance
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]


    Team's Resistances and Weaknesses (open)
    [​IMG]


    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    "Azure Rain" The Altaria ---Special Wallbreaker & Bulky Pivot
    [​IMG] / [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    @ Choice Specs [​IMG] [​IMG]
    ~EVs: 72 HP / 252 SpA / 184 Spe
    ~IVs: 30 SpAtk / 30 SpD (HP Ground)
    ~Nature: Timid (+Spe -Atk) ~Ability: Natural Cure
    Final Stats (open)
    [​IMG] 309 HP / 216 Def / 238 (357) SpA / 245 SpD / 266 Spe [​IMG]

    - Draco Meteor / Dragon Pulse / Hidden Power [Ground] / Rest

    Altaria is the Pokemon that I have based most of my NU teams on, and never disappoints me. Despite it's very low base 70 SpA, with Choice Specs equipped Altaria can actually muster the same power as a Latios. To me this was simply amazing when I first found out about it. The power of a Latios's Draco Meteor in a tier where only 2 Steel-type are really commonly used is nothing short of excellent, especially when backed up with Altaria's other moves. While Altaria does have access to Fire Blast, Hidden Power Ground is more important to 2HKO Probopass while spamming Draco or Dragon Pulse was usually a better option against everything else. The reason for also having a secondary Dragon-type STAB is that Dragon Pulse works wonders against more offensive teams where Draco is overkill and the Special Attack drops are not wanted to prevent being set up on by dangerous Pokemon. Against other teams Draco Meteor is my way to go for breaking down so many Pokemon including the notoriously bulky Musharna. Altaria has excellent offensive synergy with Emboar and absolutely loves the Spikes support from Cacturne as with just Stealth Rock and 1 layer of Spikes it can deal massive damage to anything that comes in, even doing enough to force special walls to attempt to heal and basically give me a free switch into Emboar to keep my offensive momentum. Natural Cure is an amazing ability and I tried to make the most out of it by giving it Rest and a few HP EVs. Altaria has very good 75/90/105 defenses and Natural Cure Rest can keep itself healthy throughout most of the match to keep spamming STAB. Altaria's great Dragon/Flying typing allow it to handle Swords Dance Samurott and OHKO back with Draco Meteor. My absolutely favorite thing about SpecsTaria is that if the opponent thinks that it could be a DD set, basically anything that they would have for a DD set gets destroyed by a Specs Draco. Altaria is even capable of countering some of DD's counters such as Weezing and Tangela, obliterating them with its Dragon-type STAB. With the fatherly advice from Zeb, my Altaria has gone from being a Modest little Dragon to a shy Timid destroyer. This allows Altaria to outspeed positive natured base 70's such as Samurott and Ludicolo, who were very big threats to my team.Even though Altaria might be a bit slow and has a X4 weakness, it's an excellent Pokemon regardless. Please ignore the following quote: "<TLCNU> Stoutland Ice Fang literally 2HKOes Altaria."​


    "MC HAMmer" The Emboar ---Physical Wallbreaker & Premier Fire-type
    [​IMG] / [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    @ Choice Band [​IMG] [​IMG]
    ~EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    ~Nature: Jolly (+Spe, -SpA) ~Ability: Blaze
    Final Stats (open)
    [​IMG] 361 HP / 345 (517) Atk / 166 Def / 168 SpD / 251 Spe [​IMG]

    - Flare Blitz / Superpower / Wild Charge / Fire Punch

    Wait stop, it's hammer time! Emboar is one of my favorite Choice Band users to use in NU, due to its amazing STAB coverage and extreme spam factor of Flare Blitz. Flare Blitz destroys almost anything that tries to come in, and things that could tank a Flare Blitzz doesn't enjoy a STAB Superpower. To handle Emboar you basically have to either sacrifice a Pokemon or predict perfectly what move it is going to use to even have a chance. Pokemon like Samurott, Weezing, Gorebyss, and even Altaria are getting 2HKOed by Flare Blitz after Stealth Rock. Superpower hits everything else and does massive damage to Regirock and other potential bulky Fire-type resists that exist. Wild Charge is mainly filler as Superpower is OHKOing Gorebyss and Samurott, Alomomola can just switch out and recover with Regenerator, and after SR Charizard is being OHKOed by Flare Blitz. Main reason it is there is if I really need to OHKO a Water-type without the stat drops or don't have Stealth Rock up for Charizard. I'm not a very big fan of Head Smash or Stone Edge on Emboar as a Flare Blitz will 2HKO SpecsTaria and with SR 2HKO even the defensive variants. Due to this my last slot on Emboar is actually Fire Punch, which allows me to abuse Blaze without killing myself with the recoil. A Blaze boosted Fire Punch is about as strong a Flare Blitz and will do the job of cleaning up when I need to keep Emboar for any situation. Jolly Emboar is really damn good, it outspeeds Adamant Absol, Standard SpecsTaria, Specs Gothitelle, and Modest Ludicolo without losing any key 2 or OHKOes. This is crucial as losing a potential speed tie against Gothitelle or being outsped by such a huge threat that Ludicolo is would be awful for my team.


    "IT'S ROTT TIME" The Samurott ---Set-up Sweeper & Premier Water-type
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    @ Lum Berry [​IMG] [​IMG]
    ~EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    ~Nature: Jolly (+Spe -SpA) ~Ability: Torrent
    Final Stats (open)
    [​IMG] 321 HP / 299 Atk / 207 Def / 176 SpD / 262 Spe [​IMG]

    - Swords Dance / Waterfall / Megahorn / Aqua Jet

    It's Rott Time! Even though this team was based on Altaria, Samurott has always been dedicated sweeper of the team. Samurott just does a fantastic job of cleaning up once Altaria and Emboar have done their job. Broken down walls switching into a hell of hazards just cannot stand up to the power of +2 Samurott, which is easy to set up with Samurott's good bulk and Lum Berry. Since Samurott only needs to wipe out remaining scraps it would rather get a free one-time ability to set up against Status and abuse Torrent easier than succumb to the power of a Life Orb. For this same reason Jolly nature was chosen, as at +2 Samurott doesn't miss out on any KOes while it truly doesn't need the extra power. Jolly Samurott also has the added benefit of out-prioritizing Adamant Absol's Sucker Punch with Aqua Jet, which is always nice and comes in handy. Early game I can use Samurott's priority when needed or deal good damage with its Waterfall accompanied with Stealth Rock and Spikes. Samurott is one of the best Pokemon in NU, and is incredibly dangerous not just because both physical and special sets are of absolute excellence, but that not knowing which set Samurott has plays a huge role in the fear factor that it provides. When an opponent scouts Samurott they will usually make middle weight switches that allow Samurott to accumulate extra damage from a Waterfall and hazards on a member of their team before the opponent brings out the appropriate counter. Even though without a boosting item or Attack boosting nature Samurott is anything but weak at +2 and can easily sweep when it has the chance. The fact that Samurott could sweep a team with just a few hazards down just like that is proof of its dominance of the NU metagame.​


    "Shaqtus" The Cacturne ---Offensive Spiker & Premier Grass-type
    [​IMG] / [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    @ Yache Berry [​IMG] [​IMG]
    ~EVs: 72 HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spe
    ~Nature: Adamant (+Atk -SpA) ~Ability: Sand Veil
    Final Stats (open)
    [​IMG] 279 HP / 361 Atk / 156 Def / 157 SpD / 192 Spe [​IMG]

    - Spikes / Encore / Bullet Seed / Sucker Punch

    Nobody touches the Shaqtus... Cacturne is in my opinion the best user of Spikes in NU. Coming in with access to priority in STAB Sucker Punch and Encore, Cacturne makes excellent use of that it has. While not sporting a fancy Poison-typing or good bulk like Garbodor, I personally like to consider Cacturne as the "Shaq of all trades." Cacturne combines support and offense excellently as it can swiftly stop a potential Musharna with Encore or disarm faster threats such as Rotom-S or Gorebyss with Sucker Punch. Bullet Seed is very nice for breaking the Sturdy from both Carracosta and Golem, while more often than not doing more damage than Seed Bomb. Sadly to use Encore you have to give up Water Absorb, but the trade is well worth it in my opinion as Encore support is what allows Cacturne to set up hazards and stop major threats. Cacturne's Sucker Punch is extremely invaluable to thing team as it allows me to put a stop to faster Pokemon such as Rotom-S, Ludicolo, and Cinccino with the help of entry hazards. My EVs are standard outside of my slight speed creep against other Cacturnes or Pokemon attempting to outspeed Golem. The reason for this is that if I switch into another Cacturne's Bullet Seed or Sucker Punch, I want to be able to Encore it into that so I can start Spiking before the opponent. Losing 2 HP is well worth it as preventing Spikes from landing on your side while you set up your own could change the game in the long run. Thanks to WhiteDMist's recommendation, I changed Cacturne's item over to a Yache Berry, once again reclaiming my NUlympics title as the Berry Man, master of all that is berries. Yache allows my team to handle extremely dangerous Pokemon to my team such as Ludicolo and Special Samurott, who can normally give me tons of trouble.​


    "NOSEPATH" The Probopass ---Stealth Rock user & Bulky Pivot
    [​IMG] / [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    @ Leftovers [​IMG] [​IMG]
    ~EVs: 248 HP / 64 Def / 100 SpA / 96 Spe
    ~Nature: Modest (+SpA -Atk) ~Ability: Sturdy
    Final Stats (open)
    [​IMG] 323 HP / 342 Def / 232 SpA / 336 SpD / 140 Spe [​IMG]

    - Stealth Rock / Thunder Wave / Flash Cannon / Volt Switch

    I AM THE NOSEPATH, FEAR ME AND MY PROBOPASS ARMY. This is quite honestly one of the more complicated EV spreads I've ever had on a Pokemon in any tier, not including my LC cuties. Basically I took the standard Probopass and only gave it enough Special Attack to hit a jump point. This allowed me to invest more in bulk, while still getting the same key 2HKOes on Golem and Armaldo. In general this Probopass's attacks do approximately 7% less than a fully invested one, but it's usually not a big deal and I much more appreciate the ability to handle Cinccino and Rotom-S better. 248 HP EVs and 64 Def is just enough to turn a LO Cinccino Bullet Seed damage variations from a 3HKO to a 4HKO, which is quite the big deal as otherwise I need to rely on priority to beat Cinccino. Rotom-S can be a very big problem, but thankfully Probopass can tank it's attacks well enough and its Stealth Rock will wear it down to the point where Cacturne's Sucker Punch will OHKO after 2 Stealth Rock switch ins. The last 96 EVs are placed into Speed to allow Probopass to outspeed what it needs to, mainly standard Golem and Armaldo. I already talked about why I like Probopass as much as I do in my Team Strategy section, so I'll spare the ranting. In short, the reason I am using Probopass as my Stealth Rock user is because of it's good mixed bulk, good typing, and Volt Switch. While other Stealth Rock users such as Regirock are definitely an great, they just can't come into as many special attackers as Probopass and struggle more against Haunter. Zeb recommended me Thunder Wave over Earth Power as it only really hit Probopass and Klang. Since I use a lot of Thunder Wave Ferrothorn in Ubers I felt like using it on Probopass would be just as effective. People enjoy bringing their dangerous Pokemon on Probopass expecting to get a free switch, but with this new set I can decide to either cripple something with paralysis or gain the switch advantage with Volt Switch.​


    "Hide Yo Kids!" The Haunter ---Zangoose check & Emergency Spinblocker
    [​IMG] / [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    @ Leftovers [​IMG] [​IMG]
    ~EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ~Nature: Timid (+Spe -Atk) ~Ability: Levitate
    Final Stats (open)
    [​IMG] 231 HP / 127 Def / 329 SpA / 146 SpD / 317 Spe [​IMG]

    - Substitute / Disable / Shadow Ball / Sludge Bomb

    Haunter was originally just a replacement to my SubNasty Plot Misdreavus due to the release of Toxic Boost Zangoose, but it has become much more than that. When I'm not spamming Specs/CB attacks, I'm usually playing mind games with Haunter's SubDisable strategy. To be honest I rarely actually use Disable, as the threat of just having it will force switches and get a free Substitute to wreak havoc. Late game though, after I have been double subbing multiples times I like to actually use Disable to throw my opponent off when they least expect it. Teams without good Haunter checks or counters get pulverized very quickly with just Stealth Rock and a layer of Spikes up that I can even use Haunter to break down a few walls before setting up my Rott or finishing the job with Altaria and Emboar. Haunter just has excellent immunities and resists and great offensive stats that's it can be hard to believe that it is an NFE. Haunter is one of the frailest Pokemon in the tier, but by using SubDisable it can become the end-all wall to Zangoose, which is a pretty amazing title to claim. When I really need to keep my hazards up and Haunter isn't needed, I will usually attempt to spinblock to either suicide it to get a free switch into a Pokemon or if I'm lucky enough, stop the Rapid Spin and get free damage off on anything. Overall Haunter is in my opinion an amazing Pokemon in this metagame and deserves all the usage it gets.​


    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    IMPORTABLE (open)
    Azure Rain (Altaria) (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Cloud Nine
    EVs: 80 HP / 252 SAtk / 176 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Draco Meteor
    - Roost
    - Hidden Power [Ground]
    - Power Swap

    MC HAMmer (Emboar) (M) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Blaze
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Flare Blitz
    - Superpower
    - Wild Charge
    - Fire Punch

    IT'S ROTT TIME (Samurott) (M) @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Swords Dance
    - Waterfall
    - Megahorn
    - Aqua Jet

    Shaqtus (Cacturne) (M) @ Yache Berry
    Trait: Sand Veil
    EVs: 72 HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Spikes
    - Encore
    - Bullet Seed
    - Sucker Punch

    NOSEPATH (Probopass) (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 248 HP / 64 Def / 100 SAtk / 96 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Thunder Wave
    - Flash Cannon
    - Volt Switch

    Hide Yo Kids! (Haunter) (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Substitute
    - Disable
    - Shadow Ball
    - Sludge Bomb


    [​IMG]
    dcae and TROP like this.
  2. Snowflakes

    Snowflakes Dango Dango Daikazoku
    is a Battle Server Moderator

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    I'm inclined to say good team.

    In reality I really only play NU with you and only you so I can't entirely give a rate but I do know you're fairly weak to rotom-s if you don't get SR up early and if you do it's a peace of cake. Special Samurott with megahorn also seemed to give you some trouble but you have haunter for later on so you should be fine. pleasure battling this team and you as always bud, keep it up and gratz on voice. ^.^
    <3
  3. WhiteDMist

    WhiteDMist PU! We don't stink though!
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnus

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    Hello EBeast! This is an amazing team, I must say. After a minute reminiscing about Jynx and Magmortar (good times, good times), I have to say that Specs Altaria is an amazing Pokemon to base your team around. There are a few things I would like to recommend to bring out even more of this team's potential.

    For Cacturne, Annoyer gave me a set for my own team that I have been enjoying. It switches Leftovers for Yache Berry, and the EVs are basically the same. It allows you to survive Ice Beam from Ludicolo, Samurott, and unboosted Life Orb Modest Gorebyss so you can hit them back hard or even set up Spikes. You'll have to ask him about what else it can do, but it's worked wonders for me. It does help against Hidden Power Ice Raichu, who can actually break down your team pretty easily with its base 100 Speed. With Haunter dealing with Zangoose pretty well and the amount of priority dealing with Rotom-S, I think your noted weakness are covered pretty well.

    As for Regice and Gurdurr, they can also accomplish the same tasks similar to what I just recommended, but they break the heart of this team, Altaria. Plus, you still have a weakness to Scarf Braviary, and those changes won't really prevent that. With prediction skills that I know you have, you can handle it without having to change two whole members of the team (and it would also make you more vulnerable to Gothitelle).

    Change:

    Cacturne: Yache Berry>Leftovers


    Wow, that was literally the only change I could think of right now. Without completely revamping your team, this was the only change that I felt was necessary. Oddly enough, it does help cover your main weaknesses. Now that I made my recommendation, looking at the overall team reveals that you have most threats covered well enough. The main problem overall is the lack of speed on your team (same with my own actually). Priority makes up for this somewhat, but I would assume that you occasionally would miss the instant speed on such an offensive team.

    Still, this was (as always) a beautiful RMT from you. It actually reminds me of why I like RMTs so much! :) This was witty, had personality, and was still very informative (unlike soooooo many others). Kudos also for using Haunter, it needs more love (#25 in July, are you kidding me?) since it basically rips holes through most of the teams that I rate (as well as 1/3 of the metagame alone). Great team, and I hope I helped improve it! Luvdisc for my fellow procrastinator of course! :pimp:
  4. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    Thanks for everything man, I love you <3 and yup your Rotom-S with its random bulk is annoying :S

    Yes, a fellow procrastinator! :) Thanks for the rate and props DMist, I'll definitely give Yache Cacturne a try as it looks like it could really help my team a lot and make it a lot more fun. Not to mention after Event 1 of NUlympics, people have known me as the Berry man, I think it will fit just nicely. Also oh, I remembered Haunter being top 10 (possible in June?) but either way it seriously deserves every usage it gets, it's absolutely amazing. :)
    TROP likes this.
  5. Zebraiken

    Zebraiken seize the day
    is a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Super Moderator Alumnus
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    ayo ebeast,

    this is a really cool team, and you've definitely come a long way since the first time i met you. :] you've already mentioned how you're somewhat donked by special ludi + samu and i definitely agree with yache cacturne. for the same reasons, this team is absolutely throttled by any kind of rain team (and anything paired with ludicolo that can take out cacturne, really). at present, your only real hope is to try to preserve cacturne's yache berry and take stuff out with sucker punch, but everything else falls to the standard water / ice / grass coverage that every rain sweeper brings. there isn't much you can directly do to counteract this without changing the entire team, but one thing that i think might help you out a bit is to change up your altaria set. the immense power that choice specs dm brings is awesome and rest + natural cure is probably one of the coolest aspects of the set, but i think it'll be worth your while to consider cloud nine altaria with enough speed to outrun timid ludicolo in lieu of your current set. it doesn't pack quite the same power that the modest specs set does, but it actually outspeeds almost every weather abuser (floatzel...) in rain thanks to cloud nine. it's up to you whether or not you want to keep running specs or go for life orb + roost which is somewhat weaker, but either way i think it's in the best interests of this team to opt for cloud nine altaria, so you have at least some hope against weather teams.

    you could possibly also try out thunder wave over earth power on probopass if ludicolo on its own becomes that much of an issue, since it allows you to revenge it with your entire team if need be. spreading paralysis is also really awesome for a slower team like yours and gives all of your mons a better chance to sweep - paralyzing something fast and threatening like cinccino makes it literally a non-issue for the rest of your team, since they can all then outspeed and ohko. losing earth power isn't too big of a deal imo because it really only hits other probopass / bastiodon, with the rest of your team doesn't really struggle with (excepting haunter).

    as far as your thoughts on replacements - replacing altaria with regice is going to make you incredibly susceptible to sd jolly samurott especially if regice is weakened, since it basically just has to win the speed tie with your own samu and live through cacturne's sucker punch. i don't know too much about how well gurdurr would work in lieu of emboar, but it would make you weaker to gothitelle + something like sawsbuck or zangoose, since it would trap gurdurr and remove your best check (although gurdurr on its own would be a good idea to consider, since you're already rather weak to something like sd sawsbuck, who can just set up on cacturne and wreck your team with return / horn leech / nature power). the power that emboar brings is irreplaceable though, so it's really up to you and how comfortable you feel playing against threats like sawsbuck.

    summary (open)
    cloud nine altaria > natural cure altaria
    [​IMG]altaria @ life orb or choice specs | cloud nine
    timid nature (+spe, -atk) | 80 hp / 252 spa / 176 spe
    draco meteor / dragon pulse / hp ground / roost or filler (perish song, fire blast, rest, etc) roost for lo, filler for specs

    thunder wave > earth power on probopass

    optional

    consider gurdurr > emboar, primarily for sawsbuck​

    really awesome team, though. hope i helped and gl with it in the future!
  6. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
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    Thanks Zeb :) I will think I will try out Twave on Probopass, since I've had an awesome experience with TWave Ferrothorn over in Ubers; people bring in their offensive threats in on it thinking they can get it in for free. When the situation comes up I can either paralyze a big threat or get switch advantage.

    About Altaria I actually did some calcs with Timid LO compared to Modest Specs and found that the set was about dealing approximately 26% damage less in general. 26% also happens to be the mount of damage that Stealth Rock + 1 layer of Spikes do, so while I will miss the raw power I pretty much get up at least Stealth Rock and a layer of Spikes each game to make up for it. I was thinking of using Cloud Nine and your above spread, but still not sure if stay Specs (With Specs I only need SR to make up for the damage) or to go with Draco / Power Swap / Roost / HP Ground and a Life Orb. Specs is still pretty strong, but it does miss out on Rest + Natural Cure. To be frank I rarely used Rest, but I know it has come in handy before. On DracoSwap's case it can give a DGAF button against things like CM Mushy and Gothitelle, but it's only trading SpA and not the SpD boosts alongside it. This set though is about 13% weaker and suffers from LO recoil, but has ability to safely run Roost.


    EDIT: Ok decided to go with Timid LO and Cloud Nine on my Altaria with Draco / Roost / HP Ground / Haze. I prob won't edit that into the OP because it would involve a total rehaul unlike Yache Berry Cacturne and TWave Probo
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  7. WhiteDMist

    WhiteDMist PU! We don't stink though!
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnus

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    Haze would probably be a good option. It stops set up sweepers as well, so there's that benefit. As long as Altaria isn't trying to do too many things at once, it should be a good change.
  8. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    K I've been playtesting quite a bit with all the fixes and I decided to stick to Timid Specs Altaria. It's been killing me whether to use Natural Cure and Rest or Cloud Nine and Fire Blast. I decided that while Cloud Nine helps against RD Ludicolo (I haven't seen actual rain teams since it dropped) Natural Cure Rest helps out against longer played battles. Ludicolo also cannot set up against anything on my team without being dropped to Sucker Punch range or being TWaved by Probopass. 252 SpAtk Choice Specs Altaria Dragon Pulse vs 0 HP/0 SpDef Ludicolo: 48.84% - 57.81% (2-3 hits to KO) is the weakest attack it is taking as I will never Draco when there a threat capable of setting up. Cacturne does 56% minimum so even that is enough to bring it down. I'll update the OP with this accordingly. Thanks to everyone for helping me out in improving this team, I appreciate it a lot! :)
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