Cloyster (Offensive Support) (QC 2/3)

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Hack He Must, Jul 7, 2013.

  1. Hack He Must

    Hack He Must
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    Hi, Hack here. Some people requested me to do this set for Cloyster so here we go.

    [SET]
    name: Offensive support
    move 1: Icicle Spear
    move 2: Rapid Spin
    move 3: Shell Smash
    move 4: Spikes/Toxic Spikes
    item: Focus Sash
    ability: Skill Link
    nature: Jolly/Adamant
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe


    [SET COMMENTS]
    -An offensive anti-hazard Pokémon, often a good lead.
    -Niches itself by being able to get past both Giratina-Formes easier than all spinners. Arceus-Ghost can spin block you, but you can Shell Smash on its switch-in, take a Judgment courtesy to the Focus Sash and 2HKO. If you opponent lacks priority after that happens, then you will spin.
    -Focus Sash is the item of choice. Cloyster is VERY frail on the special side, and the item guarantees a layer of Spikes on turn 1 against most things.
    -Plan your strategy, team preview very important.
    -Icicle Spear- STAB, ghostbuster, sash breaker (multi-hit). Higher crit chance since five hits. Just a nice move in general.
    -Rapid Spin self-explainatory.
    -Shell Smash allows Cloyster to bust through all viable spinblockers in the tier. Giratina-O and specially defensive Giratina are OHKOed, Arceus-Ghost 2HKOed and Great Wall Giratina can get OHKOed as well. +2 252 Atk Skill Link Cloyster Icicle Spear (5 hits) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Giratina: 420-510 (83.49 - 101.39%) -- 6.25% chance to OHKO
    -Spikes generally better. Toxic Spikes are good vs Kyogre, Arceus-Formes and could potentially open up for stuff like Palkia (Toxic Spikes great vs Arceus-Grass). Debatable slash.
    -Use on offensive teams that will appreciate hazard removal, spikes, and offensive presence in one support Pokémon.
    -Lead against Deoxys-S, Deoxys-A, Groudon, Custap Berry Forretress (if your team has no way to OHKO it with Reshiram or Kyurem-W that is).
    -Strategy vs Deoxys-S: Icicle spear first. If it taunted- spin. If it sets hazards- Shell Smash and spin/kill stuff. Vs Deoxys-A- Icicle Spear no matter what.
    -Vs Groudon: Icicle spear first. If it attacks, go for some spikes or KO.
    -Don't lead vs Dialga, Darkrai, they beat you easily (Dialga gets rocks on top of that).
    -Adamant nature for moar POWER, but you fail to outspeed choice scarf Terrakion after a Shell Smash, which will make you unable to pull off the spin.


    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    -Lum Berry for Darkrai (and nickname your Cloyster "I carry Lum Berry"). No, seriously debatable. I have never used Lum Berry, so idk.
    -Hidden Power Fire, can 2HKO Forretress. 0 SpA Cloyster Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Forretress: 176-208 (49.71 - 58.75%) -- 67.19% chance to 2HKO
    Does crap to Ferrothorn who can "spinblock" you with Iron Barbs if you get down to Sash…
    -Ice Shard to pick off weakened stuff, Deoxys-S etc. But it's also debatable. Thought I could mention it so we can discuss it.
    -Rock Blast might deserve a slash, but the primary purpose of the set is to support, and missing out on Spikes is bad, trust me.
    -EXPLOSION. No idk, just found it. It might not be worth it but it does some damage to Kyogre, its best counter (but it doesn't stop the primary purpose of Cloyster, spinning). Debate.
    +2 252 Atk Cloyster Explosion vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Kyogre: 478-563 (139.76 - 164.61%) -- guaranteed OHKO.



    - Teammates
    -Ho-oh, Groudon, Arceus-Extremekiller, Kyurem-W, Palkia, Reshiram, Kyogre, Arceus-Ghost, Giratina-O are some teammates I found good. One thing that must be emphasized is that team support is very important, especially the ability to threaten hazard setters, since Cloyster is to too frail to do its job indefinitely.
    Brief explanation about teammates (all this might not be in the analysis, mind you):
    Ho-oh- It appreciates the removal of Stealth Rock, and its ability to threaten to threaten common hazard setters with its Life Orb boosted attacks helps Cloyster. A banded set can take the sleep from lead Darkrai- a lead Cloyster hates.
    Groudon- As Cloyster is prone to being set-up on by Extreme-Killer Arceus on turn 1, Groudon provides a check to the God of Pokémon thus being a good team-mate for this reason. Stealth Rock support as well as the ability to OHKO Dialga who beats Cloyster and sets up Stealth Rock in the process+ sun support (Cloyster is best used on this team) makes Groudon an almost non-negotiable teammate.
    Arceus-Extremekiller- As Cloyster can fall to Deoxys-S using special attacks in two hits- Extremekiller steps up and revenge-kills the alien before it gets the chance to get hazards up. As a sweeper, Arceus appreciates spike support, especially when using Lum Berry to combat Darkrai leads.
    Kyurem-W- threatens hazard users. Can OHKO Forretress through sturdy. Appreciates Stealth Rock removal (all hazard removal actually). Water resistance, vital for sun teams, since it can semi check Kyogre.
    Palkia- Awesome with spikes support, and great at threatening hazard users. Toxic Spikes can help it bust through Arceus-Grass. Apprciates hazard removal more than Latias, another common Kyogre check. Because it can threaten Ferrothorn better than Latias- Palkia can often be advantageous to use on a team with Cloyster.
    Reshiram- Almost the as Kyurem-W, but Reshiram is a bit worse in this metagame :(
    Kyogre- As strange as it sounds, since I have preached for this set to be used on sun- however, Choice Specs Kyogre with spike support is deadly and it also appreciates Cloyster's hazard removal to keep Water Spout at high levels. It can also threaten common hazard setters such as Groudon, Forretress, Deoxys-D, Excadrill, Ferrothorn (Choice Specs 2HKOs) etc.
    Arcues-Ghost- To spinblock mainly. It's an awesome Pokémon anyway. Ofc Cloyster can support by removing Toxic Spikes, though.
    Giratina-O- Also spin block. And priority. Sub shuffler with Spikes can break stall.


    I probably missed some points, but I have been using the set a whole lot so yeah. Debate please.
  2. Furai

    Furai wellfare
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    Change title to Cloyster (Offensive Support) (QC 0/3)

    Mention that Lum Berry can easily hinder the effectiveness of this set. Ice Shard too; all 4 (5 if you count the slash) make this set unique and make it effective. Ice Shard just wrecks the purpose of this set. It could obviously work, but still. Rock Blast does nothing, remove it. Explosion is good, keep it. At +2 you OHKO SpDef Kyogre and have 75% to one-shot PhysDef ones after 1 Spikes.

    Stress how good this is early game, and that it can also be used as a late-game sweeper if manageable.

    QC Approved 1/3
  3. Theorymon

    Theorymon Watch The Space
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    Alright, just some stuff I get from this Skeleton

    -Get rid of the nickname stuff, it has no place in an analysis

    -On the teammates part, make sure you make the "spinning for SR weak mons" its own paragraph! Also, put Spin Blockers in their own small paragraph.

    -I actually totally disagree with Furai. Having used this set on Offensive Sun teams, Rock Blast has saved my ass against Ho-Oh before. HOWEVER, make sure you talk about the consequences of losing Spikes or Rapid Spin!

    Anyways, I'll do a more throughout check when the actual analysis is written up, but so far, QC Approved 2/3
  4. Furai

    Furai wellfare
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    move 1: Shell Smash
    move 2: Icicle Spear
    move 3: Rapid Spin
    move 4: Spikes / Rock Blast / Toxic Spikes

    should be set order. mention that rock blast is only good for teams totally afraid of ho-oh or for teams that already have a spiker.
  5. trickroom

    trickroom
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    Agree with Theorymon, Rock Blast deserves at least a mention in AC. While it's weak, and doesn't seem to OHKO much things, it OHKOes Kyurem formes at +2 and Ho-Oh without a boost, +2 Icicle Spear doesn't OHKO Ho-Oh over half of the time. Rock Blast also hits Kyogre and Genesect for more damage.

    Remove this sentence.
    Lum Berry for Darkrai (and nickname your Cloyster "I carry Lum Berry"). No, seriously debatable

    Fix what Theorymon said, also Giratina-O beats you with Draco Meteor + Shadow Sneak one-on-one. Mention how it destroys Gliscor as well, sun teams don't really like it. Most of the time you die fast, but if Cloyster is alive mid-game, it can take out Gliscor easily. Ice Shard mention only for Shaymin-S leads most of the time, or Air Slash kills you.
  6. Hack He Must

    Hack He Must
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    I was just messing around with some stuff. The whole "I carry Lum Berry" thing was just a joke lol. Ofc it won't have a place in the fully written analysis. Will mention Ice Shard for Shaymin-S (smart point, never thought of it tbh) and Gliscor (I totally forgot about how good it is vs. sun). I take it as no mention of Lum Berry?

    Also, where to change title?
  7. Furai

    Furai wellfare
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    Ice Shard: 78.59 - 95.01%

    it doesn't even outright OHKO skymin, you're better off with sash + icicle spear lol if shaymin leads. mention that it's just a nice tool if you're afraid of scarf shaymin or something n_n
  8. shrang

    shrang OM OM OM
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    Flinch hax means you can't pull that off most of the time, and Scarf Skymin outspeeds you at +2. At least with Ice Shard you have a guaranteed 2HKO.
  9. shrang

    shrang OM OM OM
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    trickroom likes this.
  10. Hack He Must

    Hack He Must
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    Swamped with studies atm, Sweep implied interest in taking over, so he may as I don't have time:(
  11. Sweep

    Sweep
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    Yeah, I'll be happy to get started on this tonight.
    Melee Mewtwo likes this.

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