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Compass [Peaked #9]

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Vertex, Jul 6, 2013.

  1. Vertex

    Vertex formerly ballislife
    is a Pre-Contributor

    May 2, 2013

    Yea, I'm pretty sure people hate this new format for Smogon, it's ridiculously horrendous. Well, this is my first RMT, and retirement team, since this is the last time I'll be able to use the Sheer Force Landorus-T + Choice Band Tyranitar + Choice Scarf Keldeo core, so I decided to share it since it's the common archetype of Sand Offense today. Compass, a Sand offense team, was built around a two deadly threats that overpowered our metagame, Landorus-I and Keldeo. The latter is being suspected after Landorus-I just to tell you. Considering I rarely ladder, I got a peak of #9 and is a huge accomplishment considering I rarely ladder and won all mini-tournaments using this team. This team or similiar variants have been popping around the ladder lately, so I just wanted to share this before someon posts this before me. The titles are from Trinitrotoleunes RMT, Girl in the Fire, and the format is similar to that of Harsha's RMT, idk how to type it, lol, so kudos to them!​
    As stated before, I wanted to build a team round KeldTarLando core which is dominate in this metagame. the The first to were really powerful wall breakers that could secure a Keldeo sweep or a Landorus-I sweep itself. Afterwards, I changed Rock Polish to U-turn on Landorus-i to dispose of Celebi considering by Tyranitar is Banded, So Celebi will Baton Pass out first. Afterwards, the the team was great, but I needed something to take care of those ridiculous physical threats like Choice Band Haxorus, so I added Physically Defensive Jirachi, which is rare in this metagame, but can pass Wishes to its recipients making it harder for the opponent. I needed Stealth Rock so enter Garchomp, but it sucked, so I went for Sash Lead Terrakion, to start the early-game advantage. The last spot went Celebi who could pass Nasty Plots to Keldeo and Landorus, while being a nuisance and solid check to rain teams. Afterwards, I tweaked around with some of the sets, for maximum coverage to the metagame. Later, due to weaknesses to E-Belt Keldeo and Scizor, I added Scizor and Rotom-W, the kings of VolTTurn. Now presenting Compass!​
    Scizor @ Leftovers | Technician | Adamant
    248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD | Max IVs
    Swords Dance | Roost | Bullet Punch | U-turn

    Scizor, ridiculously common, and powerful. It's not hard to see why. Technician, STAB prioirity, Pursuit, U-turn, Roost, Swords Dance, Acrobatic, and more! Well, I went with the Choice Band set, but Swords Dance was generally superior. With the help of HSA and this #niggasolid suggestion, this team has brought a new life. It provides me a steel-type like the previous Jirachi, priority, synergy, U-turn to crush Celebi, so Landorus-I can run Stealth Rock, and a powerful physical attacker which this team despertely needs. I have to say, Scizor has been great.

    Usually I'd try out max speed, but since it's the only steel-type, I need more bulk to stay over the curve. U-turn is obviously for early-game since I can bluff the Band (leftovers doesn't work if you switch right away), and hits hard with the Swords Danace when I come across something that walls me like Jellicent.

    Swords Dance is an awesome move, since it secures late-game sweeps and lets it muscle past Scizor's counters like Landorus-T. Finally, Roost is there for reliable recovery and can allow me to sweep many times or cause huge damage. Most Ghost-types like to stay in knowing they are Pursuit trapped, so this lets me get the Swords Dance boost in this situation. Scizor is great, and a super solid competitor which keeps the momentum going(s).

    Rotom-W @ Chesto Berry | Levitate | Calm
    248 HP / 28 SpA / 232 SpD | 0 Atk / 30 Spe
    Volt Switch | Rest | Will-O-Wisp | Hydro Pump

    Once Terrakion, now Rotom-W. Jirachi gave me this idea to help with my Expert Belt Keldeo and Landorus-I weaknesses which was a great improvement to this team. This is the most standard 'mon in the rain infested metagame. and makes a VoltTurn core with Scizor which is nice. Chesto Berry in combination with Rest gives me a one time destruction recovery and Rotom-W can absorb status as well when Celebi is gone (which rarely happens), bar Sleep. It also helps me with Starmie which I can't OHKO with Hidden Power Electric from Keldeo.

    0 Atk with Calm Nature helps reduces confusion and foul play damage, which is arguably the best at doing beccause it's my only check to to Tornadus-I. While 30 Spe EVs is strange, it lets me get the Volt Switch advantage against opposing Rotom-W at no extra cost.

    Now, the moves. Volt Switch allows me to scout and kills Keldeo trying to destroy me and Starmie as well. Hydro Pump is to defeat Gliscor (why I use 28 SpA EVs), and Landorus-T too. In general, it's used for SPAM against rain teams and defeating pokemon that are immune to Volt Switch like Jolteon, for instance. I've ran Thunder Wave over Will-O-Wisp, but I'd rather cripple every physical attcker than just paralysis stuff. plus, Thunder Wave doesnt hit Garchomp, which is important because Keldeo's Icy Wind never OHKOes it. Rotom-W, has been a great improvement to this team, and really, thanks for this suggestion.
    Landorus @ Life Orb | Sheer Force | Timid
    252 SpA / 4 Def / 252 Spe | Max IVs
    Earth Power | Focus Blast | Hidden Power [Ice] | Stealth Rock

    This thing is broken now due to it being able to able to defeat team after Rock Polish set-up or not... U-turn is a great option since it removes Celebi which is important for the TarLandoKeld core. Earth Power is for obvious and pwowerful STAB and Focus Blast and Hidden Power are for coverage. Landorus is the strongest member of the team and is a great wallbreaker and since I won't be able to use it soon and neither will you, use it as it lasts.

    I despise of Timid Landorus-I. First of all, Landorus has enough speed to outpace neutral 100s which is great and can use the extra power to 2HKO certain threats like Blissey with Focus Blast which is a great bragging right for any special sweeper bar Latios. U-turn can scout and cause pretty nice damage that annoy Landorus like Cresselia. After that I can scout to the appropriate check or counter. Howver, due to later tests Timid seemed betters ince Celebi almost always Baton Pass's boosts to Landorus-I making Timid the superior choice. With the addition of Scizor and Rotom-W providing almost infinite coverage to the metagame, the lack of a Stealth Rock user was noticeable, so I put it on Landorus-I. stealth Rock and Landorus-i is a cool move since it never drags in Magic Bounce users and Rapid Spin users being a surprise to the opponents team, like Sun Offense, since most carry Xatu and no spinner. Scizor's access to U-turn also made it unneeded.

    Life Orb with Sheer Force is boss, as you would've not noticed and 0 Atk IVs are not use to reduce Foul Play and Confusion damage since I'm running U-turn. Landorus is the frailest member of the team, but can take some hits like Garchomp's Outrage for example. since Hidden Power [Ice] and U-turn gain Life Orb damage, I like to use them sparingly. Landorus is generally the mid- to late-game 'mon since it can sweep best then. Landorus-I is part of my core and is awesome, and yea. No toss ups.

    Celebi @ Leftovers | Natural Cure | Calm
    248 HP / 196 SpD / 64 Spe | 0 Atk
    Nasty Plot | Giga Drain | Baton Pass | Hidden Power [Fire]
    Imagine, a +2 Landorus or Keldeo sweeping entire teams. Wow, that's impressive. Now what about a +4 or +6? Well, that's an absolute nightmare for the opponent. Baton Pass is often considered a newbie move, but may I ask you, why does it exist? Yea, mind shooken, that's what I thought.

    Celebi provides anexcellent rain check and can is a great wall breaker. Due to Celebi excellent typing and synergy with the rest of the team, passing a +4 or +6 boost is pretty easy or killing stuff with ridiculously power Giga Drains is cool too. I've run Psychic to deal with Breloom, the only check to the team, but Breloom can't take a +2 Giga Drain too well. It's also my Jellicent check which walls Keldeo hard. Recover is used for max amounts of longetivity and passing abilities. Natural Cure is a godly ability for Celebi since it can keep on boosting and use Baton Pass aginst walls since all they can do is status, and find there work go to waste. Recover came to waste afterwards noticing the pretty big Sakrmory and Scizor weakness and with my very own Scizor in bait, Hidden Power [Fire] is was superior considering Giga Drain gave me healing and was powerful at +2 giving me "reliable" recovery especially with Leftovers.

    0 Atk is used to minimize confusion and Foul play damage and is cool since Tornadus is much more prevalent. Since Celebi can't do much to Heatran and Skarmory I will Baton Pass immediately to a cool recipient, but in Skarmory's case I wont' boost unless it lacks Whirlwind. Baton Pass is also nice for scouting and avoiding Pursuit and I will only switch if I face a Scarf Tyranitar, since I know it'll go for the Crunch. 64 Spe is used for outpacing all Scizor bar Choice Scarf. I've tried Calm Mind, but it lacks the immediate death boost that Nasty Plot has. Celebi is the most important memeber of the team since it secures sweeps and provides a solid check to rain teams.

    Tyranitar @ Choice Band | Sand Stream | Adamant
    212 HP / 252 Atk / 44 Spe | Max IVs
    Stone Edge | Crunch | Pursuit | Superpower

    Now now, using Tyranitar on team where no Pokemon benefit from it seem weird, but it provides anti-weather support and destroys Keldeo's and Landorus-I's counters. Since Hippowdon seems better due to it not having to risk Dugtrio shenanigans, Tyranitar never comes in until I can spoil my opponent's plan. Why not use Choice Scarf, it much more common and "obviously" better? Well, Tyranitar's Pursuit jacks all-over Ninetales and Politoed since they'll often switch and eat a OHKO with prior damage, spoiling there weather plans. Choice Band Tyranitar is also a much better wall-breaker than the Choice Scarf set and can actually defeat Jellicent.

    Tyranitar has used Fire Punch to kill ferrothorn without fears, but defeating Heatran is essential for this team. Ice Punch and Qua Tail have been used for Dragon-type, Gliscor, and Hippowdon, but i missed out on Superpowers better coverage and power. Finally, Foul Play has been interesting when I used the Choice Scarf set and surprised many people, but it was inferior to Crunch since defating Jellicent is one of the main draws of the Choice Band set.

    Looking at the EV spread, 44 Spe is outpace utility counter Jellicent (male) and outpace opposing Support Tyranitars which is cool. Superpower hits Ferrothorn and pokemon that mainly resist its STAB like Conkeldurr, but forces me to switch after. Adamant Nature is the only nature I consider using since its useful for OHKOing most weather starters with Pursuit. Tyranitar is ridiculously important for this teams success and is nice for stacking up residual damage and countering weather when time gets rough.

    Keldeo-R @ Choice Scarf | Justified | Timid
    252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe | 0 Atk
    Surf | Secret Sword | Icy Wind | Hidden Power [Electric]

    The second most broken pokemon after Landorus-I and the MVP of the team. Where the Compass points is where the move goes is what you can say for Keldeo. It fill all the gaps this team faces like set-up sweepers, revenge killer, etc.

    With Tyranitar remove its checks like Tentacruel for example, Keldeo can wreck havoc. It usually comes in a, the opponent's team is weakened or b, baton pass doom.

    I use Icy Wind and Hidden Power [Electric] since Cloyster and Gyarados are annoying to face and Icy Wind generally has more utility and gains the same OHKOes has Hidden Power, skip Garchomp, and can slow down pokemon that commonly switch into Keldeo like Starmie. From there I switch to Tyranitar or Celebi to use it for killing bait or set-up bait. Keldeo is very important to this team and isn't build around pokemon like some stupid Carracosta sweep and is obviously close to broken for these reasons.

    When the going gets tough, get the navigation, Baton Pass the boost, aim for north, Compass.
    Thanks guys for reading this RMT. It's been great to see Smogon back up and please put it back to the original format, and I'd like to thank some people on Smogon. The first is Trinitrotoleune who chills in False Sense's group and helps us learn about the metagame and is a major inspiration building this team. PC-Reviver and Rohail17 were also cool people who helped me with this team. PC-Reviver is on PS just to say and Rohail17 helped me a little in the lobby in PS to fix issues like Cloyster poopfaces and also Gary2346 who is awesome and yea, Halcyon of Light. This team was a huge success and finally, thanks every one, and its nice to post this standard archetype. Jirachi and HSA (RIP joshe) are noticed for there great suggestions. If you liked it, leave a like (bye, bye Luvdisks...)! Rate, Hate, Steal, whatever, but thanks guys, really.​
    The Tyranitar and -Sparkbeat- like this.
  2. Vertex

    Vertex formerly ballislife
    is a Pre-Contributor

    May 2, 2013

    Halcyon. likes this.
  3. Trinitrotoluene

    Trinitrotoluene Περαιτέρω φαίνεται για πάντα
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Jul 13, 2010
    I am a strongth person, eh? Anywho, this is an excellent team, and one that is definitely representative of the standard metagame. I don't want to replace any of the members (with the probable exception of Jirachi), so most of this rate will be nitpicks regarding moves and EV spreads. First off, I'd like to see you use an EV spread of 136 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 116 Spe on your Tyranitar. This lets you outrun the normal Politoed (from my experience, they usually run 36 Speed EVs, hitting 185 Speed) and mons that attempt to speed creep those Politoed by one point. You do lose a bit of bulk, but the extra speed definitely is appreciated. Anyways, regarding your Landorus, I'd recommend using an EV spread of 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe. You don't need any EVs in Special Defense, which is already hurt by the use of the Rash nature, and the slight boost to Attack is always helpful.

    Also, my name isn't boldfaced in your shout-outs section mate.
  4. Jirachee

    Jirachee scootin
    is a Tournament Directoris an official Team Rateris a Super Moderatoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnus
    RMT Leader

    Sep 24, 2010
    Your team gets absolutely destroyed by Expert Belt Keldeo and U-Turn Landorus. This is because your only check to them is Celebi which is 2HKO'ed by their Bug moves. Everything else on your team can't afford to switch into them, especially if Keldeo is used on a Rain team, as it will do ~75% to Jirachi with Hydro Pump since it uses a physically defensive spread. +Speed Landorus outspeeds your own Landorus so both of your Ground resists can't switch at all into it, making it 100% sure for an opponent's U-turn Landorus to get a kill whenever it switches in, which is in all honesty not very hard considering all the U-turn and Volt Switch spam in OU at the moment. To make it worse, if the opponent brings Expert Belt Keldeo and Rock Polish Landorus, you will lose very easily. Something I'd see fit your team very well is Rotom-W. It's a very nice back-up check to a plethora of threats including Keldeo and Landorus. It doesn't like Secret Sword and Focus Blast but that's pretty much the only move it dislikes from them and you can play around that since you have Celebi. Rotom-W also makes it much easier for your team to deal with opposing Rain since your only way to switch into rain sweepers really is Celebi, and putting that much pressure on one Pokemon can be bad. Honestly I'd place it over Terrakion. Your team isn't all that offensive so a Focus Sash lead isn't that useful.

    Since you lose SR, you should use it on Jirachi instead, over Protect. Losing Protect kinda sucks I guess but it's still better than no Stealth Rock. Also, I'd recommend switch Jirachi's and Celebi's spreads around. You mention that Jirachi is physically defensive to deal with Dragons, however you can easily beat physical Dragons by revenging them with Scarf Keldeo, and the weaker ones are still walled by Jirachi. On the other hand, your team will appreciate the ability to tank Draco Meteors even though you have a Tyranitar, since if there's some hazards on the field, Tyranitar has a very hard time switching into Latios directly and you don't wanna lose your pursuiter. As for Celebi, while it does like the extra bulk to take on Rain teams, if you do go for Rotom-W, the pressure on it will be alleviated by a lot. I think that in that situation, a Physically Defensive spread would be superior since Celebi is your main defense against Fighting types like Terrakion and Breloom who are mostly physical Pokemon.

    Trinitrotoluene's Tyranitar spread suggestion isn't bad but it will make your team much weaker to Latios if you don't use a Specially Defensive spread on Jirachi. Also, I'd really recommend moving 4 HP EVs to Special Defense if you use his spread to make sure your HP # isn't even!!! that way you can switch in with Stealth Rock on the field one more time, which is a very little (but nice!) bonus that comes at pretty much no cost.

    oh yea and you should use a Specially Defensive Rotom-W, since while the offensive spreads are nice (and I usually prefer them), they take ridiculous damage from Landorus' Focus Blast lol.
  5. HSA

    HSA I am the God of the new world.

    May 24, 2009
    Celebi is kind of garb in the meta with Lando using U-turn and Keldeo using HP Bug, and you're team doesn't even have rain to make scarf Keldeo go SUPER SAIYAN ON THESE NIGGAS. That's why I'm sugesting a Choice Banded Scizor to wreck up some niggas with super priority, U-turn for some Voltturn shit, and the Pursuit for wrecking up Latis, Gengar (who your team gets wrecked by if subwisp), and even Rotom if you play well. Try it out, I'm pretty sure you're team will be #niggasolid if you use it.
    Sayonara, Hot N Cold and Jirachee like this.
  6. Vertex

    Vertex formerly ballislife
    is a Pre-Contributor

    May 2, 2013
    Thanks for the rate! I tried out Specially Defensive Rotom-W and it was awesome. I got to say, it was a major improvement over my Terrakion and was an absolute bitch to Keldeo and Landorus-I. Physically Defensive Celebi was awesome too and same with Specially Defensive Jirachi with Stealth Rock. Also, all my 'mons HP is odd, lol. Thanks for the godly rate. Ima update the OP soon.

    Yea, i gotta say that celebi aint garbage in this meta, and yo scizor was chill i guess but i got ttar and keld so the nigga pwr went to nigga u turn and rotom-w from jirachi made this nigga solid so chill bro for yo rate, cuz it still was pretty nigga solid

    Thanks for the rate! I tried out your spread but I had harder times switching into those Draco Meteors from like Choice Specs and Life Orb Latios causing Tyranitar to be a complete sack later on. Most Politoed like to switch out since they want to win the weather wars and dont want to Hydro Pump, but it was good for Skarmory, so I am kind of hesitant of changing it. I'll switch the Lando-I spread, and I run 248 Spe since hits 300 spe which is nice. Thanks for the rate! I'll update the OP soon with Jirachi spreads and rotom-w, and tnts lando spread. Thanks bros
  7. Goddess Briyella

    Goddess Briyella Banned deucer.

    Mar 25, 2013
    Hi, Vertex!

    This is a pretty awesome team here. I have in mind a few suggestions that I think can improve this team's performance.

    Firstly, I'd like to point out a weakness to Scizor. Scizor's STABs, backed by Technician (and possibly Choice Band), can directly threaten half of your team, as priority Bullet Punch really puts the hurt on Terrakion and hits Tyranitar for a 2HKO, and U-turn is a clean OHKO on Celebi. Landorus also doesn't take Bullet Punch very well. Keldeo resists Scizor's STABs but being locked into the wrong move with Scarf can mean trouble, as it will take heavy damage from Superpower. For these reasons, I suggest replacing Celebi's Recover with HP Fire to serve as a lure for Scizor, so that the team can be free of the threat. The reason I feel it's acceptable for HP Fire to replace Recover is that Giga Drain, backed by STAB and possibly a Nasty Plot boost, serves as its own recovery move in addition to dealing damage, so by replacing Recover with HP Fire, you maintain your ability to heal off damage with STAB Giga Drain as well as quickly dealing with something that can be an issue for the team.

    Secondly, I'd like to stress the importance of Landorus's speed. Having a base Speed stat of 101 gives it the ability to outspeed all of the base 100 Speed mons, such as Celebi (which is very significant if you'd like to nail it with U-turn before it can even do anything) and also Jirachi, who can be easily crushed by Earth Power before it can begin to provide support for its team or outspeed and beat you with its annoying Serene Grace/Iron Head flinching antics. I noticed that you decided to run a Rash nature on Landorus as to not take power away from U-turn, I'd like to suggest running a Naive nature and running 252 Speed EVs on Landorus so that it outspeeds Celebi, Jirachi, and other non-Scarfed base 100 Speed mons 100% of the time. Being able to outspeed these OU mons will greatly help Landorus's offense as well as its survivability, and it will become an even greater asset to the team.

    I've added an importable below for the changes I've suggested, if you'd like to give them a try. They should snap right into Pokemon Showdown.

    Show Hide

    Celebi @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature
    - Nasty Plot
    - Giga Drain
    - Baton Pass
    - Hidden Power [Fire]

    Landorus (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Sheer Force
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature
    - Earth Power
    - Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - U-turn

    Well, I wish you continued luck with your team! I hope you find some of my suggestions helpful or at least thought-provoking! ^_^
  8. HSA

    HSA I am the God of the new world.

    May 24, 2009
    ? Sorry if I came across a little bro haha just how I talk sometimes. But for real, Scizor would wreck on this team. It gets a lot of good shit that can push the momentum in your favor
    Vertex likes this.
  9. Vertex

    Vertex formerly ballislife
    is a Pre-Contributor

    May 2, 2013
    What I meant is that Scizor is no longer a threat with the new pokemon I added.
    Thanks for the suggestions! they were both helpful and seemed great.

    The OP has been Updated

    More rates are appreciated.
  10. dcae

    dcae naughty list

    Dec 9, 2011
    Hey there! This is an excellent team you have here! As you have received several strong rates already, this will be pretty short. In terms of synergy, your team is completely solid, so thus I won't change the mons you have here. A few minor tweaks first of all. Stealth Rock on Landorus I is really eh. To be honest, you are much better off running U-turn. Instead, I propose switching your Tyranitar set. I suggest testing out an offensive ChopleTar. Personally I've been using it recently, and it has been very useful. Being able to bluff a Choice item is excellent to pick off threats, and this allows you to move Stealth Rock to Tyranitar. The set is exactly the same EVs and nature, but instead of Crunch, the move of choice is Stealth Rock. I would also play around and speed creep 96 EV Taunt Jellicent's if you want, thought tbh those aren't the scariest sets anymore because they start losing a lot of bulk. Thus, move U-turn back to Landorus I.

    Moving on to Celebi, I see you are running the Nasty Plot passing set, with Hidden Power Fire. HP Fire is an great move on Celebi as it lures in the Scizors, however I'd like to recommend you adding on Speed to your Celebi. Running 64 Spe allows you to outpace any Scizor variant barring the Choice Scarf set. This extra speed allows you to speed creep other stuff that might want to outpace the typical 20 or 36 Spe SpD Celebis.

    On your Scizor, I am going to be frank. Running that SD Scizor set isn't the best late-game sweeper mostly due to the fact that running U-turn as your only other move isn't the best option. Also, considering Stealth Rock and the fact that you will probably Volt Switch into Scizor a lot, you won't be able to bluff the Choice item well, thus making U-turn not worth it. I much recommend Bug Bite > U-turn to be able to have another move choice when sweeping late game. Overall, this is an excellent team, and I hope I helped! Good luck!
  11. Leftiez

    is a Tutoris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnus

    Jan 21, 2012
    Hey there.
    It is a very interesting team, I can't rate your team because it seems very correct, but I notice a big weakness! You are very weak against a sun team, even with Tyranitar, if the opponent has Venusaure it can be dangerous, Venusaure can easily set up a Growth and do much damage then even the Sunny Day version can be very dangerous too, I noticed that you have Rotom-W + Keldeo, but I think Keldeo can perfectly do the job of Rotom-W with Hidden Power Electric can easily come on Gyarados because it stands up well against Waterfall, I then suggest you bring Latias over Rotom-W, Latias is a very good pokemon for your team, it can easily come on Venusaure because it resists to Sludge Bomb after a Growth, you can therefore come directly upon him without problem, but pay attention because if Latias is weakened the opponent can easily finish with Venusaure, and then Latias is now your only reliable counter against Thundurus-T, if the opponent has the double dancer you are going to be very disadvantaged because Celebi cant do anything and if Tyranitar is weakened, Thunder after a nasty plot can kill him because its not the specially defensive version , then if it's Nasty plot with Focus Blast version it can be very annoying for your team, now you can come directly to him and Revenge it kill with DracoMeteor and then Latias is now your 2nd check to Rotom-W.

    But now I notice that you are weak to Tornadus/Keldeo Ebelt, they can be dangerous because Tornadus can spamm Hurricane + Focus Blast and Keldeo Ebelt can easily lure Çelebi and Latias, I suggest you swap Scizor with Jirachi Specially Defensive , I totally agree with Jirachi(User xd), Jirachi (Pokémon xd) can be a good Check to Keldeo Ebelt because it resists well without the rain and it is a very good counter to Tornadus and then Jirachi doing well the work of Scizor it can kill Latios, Latias, Reuniclus, Alakazam. Then with Jirachi you can put Stealth Rocks and so put Landorus with Uturn "Naive Nature".

    Latias (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 68 HP / 196 SAtk / 244 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Psyshock
    - Surf
    - Draco Meteor
    - Recover

    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP / 216 SDef / 40 Spd
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Wish
    - Iron Head
    - Body Slam
    - Stealth Rock
  12. Halcyon.

    Halcyon. @Choice Specs
    is a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon

    Dec 29, 2012
    Hey Vertex! This is a very nice Keldeo / Landorus / Tyranitar team with a bit of Volt Turn thrown in, which I think was a great change.

    I'm having trouble finding any specific Pokémon to change that wouldn't screw with the synergy, so instead I'll just focus on one particular set. Since you are running Physically Defensive Celebi and have resorted to putting Stealth Rock on your Landorus, I would change Tyranitar to a SDef Chople Berry set. However, I'm going to tweak the EVs a bit so that he can still do what he's meant to on your team, while adding some extra bulk to help survive hits and bluff a choice item. The EVs I would use are 252 HP / 164 Atk / 92 SDef, which allows you to guaranteed OHKO Latios and Offensive Latias after Rocks with either Crunch or Pursuit (assuming they switch), while taking a minuscule amount of damage from their Draco Meteors and even their Surfs are only 3HKOs. It also helps you deal with Alakazam (once its Sash has been broken, and even if it isn't, Zam still has to hit you twice in a row with Focus Blast, which is only a 49% chance), since you take less than half from its Focus Blast. This means you can still check Lati@s even after you've taken out Alakazam! As for the last move, I would recommend Ice Beam, since you already have plenty of ways to deal with Forretress and Ferrothorn, whereas Landorus can be a bit of a problem if Rotom-W has been weakened (or even if it hasn't if it's Modest, since Focus Blast is an easy 2HKO [yeah I know I just said there's a small chance of that move actually hitting twice, but Landorus is still a huge threat to your team, especially Modest sets that get up a Rock Polish]). This Tyranitar set can actually tank an Earth Power and OHKO back with Ice Beam after Stealth Rock. It also lets you use U-turn on Landorus over Stealth rock, which I think you'll find much more useful.

    Hope I was able to help! Good luck with the team! I...well, I can't exactly "luvdisc" this, but I "liked" it. That's the same thing, right?


    Tyranitar @ Chople Berry

    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 164 Atk / 252 HP / 92 SDef
    Sassy Nature
    - Crunch
    - Pursuit
    - Ice Beam
    - Stealth Rock

  13. Shurtugal

    Shurtugal The Enterpriser.

    Jun 25, 2011
    Hey, got the request.

    And I got to say, this team is the highlight of standard, bar a few special tweaks like SR Landorus. The thing I see is that sun looks a bit hard to play around. Ultimately, you can try Pursuit trapping tales, but most get the speed jump and WoW while others run Dugtrio, meaning that you won't be able to spam Tyranitar too much.

    I can't really change much since this team is already so solid, though I can come up with a few suggestions.
    1. You went from Recover to HP Fire on Celebi, but this team has no problems taking care of Scizor and as such you do not need the lure. Celebi can forgo HP Fire for SR of it's own. By doing this, you open up a free slot on Landorus; which basically means you can now add Rock Polish. RP over U-turn because Scizor is setting up on Celebi and has the U-turn specifically for it. Tyranitar also gets a sexy mention for forcing Celebi everywhere to Baton Pass (aka Superpower the Terrakion!!!).
    2. Ok, the next Pokemon I am looking at is Keldeo. You run HP Electric on this variant when it isn't really needed. Take it from a player who uses Keldeo all the time; HP Elec. is really only there to lure and kill Gyarados. However, why on earth does Keldeo need to kill Gyarados when you have Rotom-W? It's the best switch in because it has Volt-Switch and Will-O-Wisp. Ultimately, I believe Hydro Pump in the opponent's rain should be able to break subs too so you can catch them by switching back and fourth between VSwitch and Hydro. The reason why I bring this up is because Icy Wind and Hydro Pump accuracies have probably fucked you over many matches. By removing HP Elec. for HP Ice and Icy Wind for Surf, Keldeo can become a more reliable revenge killer as well as scoring the OHKO on Non-Yache Garchomp.
    On the side mention, you could run Flying Gem Acrobaticsover U-turn on Scizor, but you lose Leftovers recovery and you'd probably need to speed jump 209 to outpace most speed investment Jellicent and min-invested Rotom-W. As for my standing, either work so that's why it's a side mention.
    On another note, Rotom-W can opt for Thunder Wave over WoW, and there is one legit reason for this: it lures in Lati@s and Venusaur. I know you mention that you prefer WoW, but you currently have huge issues with taking out the +2 Venusaur and Wave can be insurance to that, as well as insurance to Scarf Keldeo and it should live +0 Outrage from Mence too. TWave makes it a great back up check, and I'm not sure exactly what you do with WoW. I run SubSDChomp a lot; so relying on WoW might not be the best answer to Chomp. It hits defensive Pokemon more like Ferro and Jellicent, but Celebi sets up on them.
    Ultimately, I like this team. There isn't much to change. I'd take the Thunder Wave switch and test Acrobatics with a few EV adjustments :). Changes you must take are in points 1 and 2. I feel that BP'ing +2 to RP Landorus, since you can now do that, would make this team all the more aggressive. I'll be glad to rate any other team you might have, but this team is really solid and really standard so any more changes to it would likely ruin how it's played / synergy.
    Hope I helped :)
  14. Vertex

    Vertex formerly ballislife
    is a Pre-Contributor

    May 2, 2013
    Thanks for the rate bro! We talked on PS! today and I already told you the reason I didn't go with Chople Tar, however, i might switch the EVs around on Tyranitar. Again, thanks for the rate.

    Thanks for the rate, man! I originally had Jirachi before Scizor if you haven't read the Old OP, and I went and tried it recently. Usually Tornadus is fairly easy to play around since all they do is SPAM Hurricane. I usually just switch to Tyranitar to see if its Specs and switch again to see if it's Sharp Beak. If the opponent switches out, the Scizor usually gains th momentum or B, Sharp Beak never Hurricane never OHKOes Scizor after Rocks letting me Swords Danace and revenge kill. The exra damage is remedied by Roost too. Keldeo E-Belt is pretty weak and the trick is to remove rain with Tyranitar, and Rotom-W and Keldeo can deal with it easily. It's been less of a threat with the VoltTurn core on this team. Tornadus and Expert Belt Keldeo are threats on paper, but not in practice. I don't need U-turn on Landorus since I have Scizor. Now, Double Booster Thundurus-T is a threat I agree. I have to play carefully around since Celebi is my only check. more than likely. Thundurus-T will go for the Nasty Plot and is generally run in rain so I let Politoed get rain and Keldeo can revenge kill with Surf. If it run Focus Blast, Landorus can hit it back hard with HP Ice and walls it. If its Hidden Power Ice or Flying, I go with Tyranitar. Venasaur isn't really a threat. I usually just Double switch when its in and revenge kill it with Icy Wind or slow down the Ninetales switch-in. the sunny Day variants are either two weak to sweep my team or if they have Growth, they dont have enough coverage to sweep my team! Latias was great, but I missed out on teh utility Rotom-W provided, and that would just make scizor more of a threat. Solid Rate! I may consider these suggestions, if my team makes some dramatic changes.

    Yes, I'm gonna go with 64 Spe. Thanks! I've tried Offensive ChopleTar but it lacked enough power the Choice Band set provided. If I did go with it, I would run Choice Scarf since they both provide the same utility and Choice Band is needed to kill Jellicent and Pursuit trap weather starters which chople fails to do. I tried Bug Bite, but the momentum that U-turn provided was to important since Scizor was my only steel-type and it's nice to deal damage while switching when facing a counter.

    More rates are appreciated. Thanks guys!
  15. Wire


    Feb 16, 2013
    this team is just awesome brohame, yo, you should runnin CM over plot cuz you can phys def spread a jack teams over and helps survive and give u bp easier, awesome team bro, its boss
  16. Landscape


    Apr 1, 2013
    Cool tema broooooo

    this team is boss and i gotta say, i thick cm is btr for passing than nasty plot since you got extra bulk, also w/ this try a physically def. spread since you got cm, i have to disagree with shurtugal since SR is a cool move on lando, its unpredictable and lando seems amore like a wallbreaker or temp sweeper, you have a big scizor and ferro weakness, so i dont think its right, tnice to BP celebi and love the name cool team man

  17. Vertex

    Vertex formerly ballislife
    is a Pre-Contributor

    May 2, 2013
    Thanks for the solid rate! I've actually tried the SR on Celebi and Rock Polish Landorus-I thing multiple times, but the reason I don't use it is because Rock Polish was hard setting up where the metagame is so offensive. I also lack significant support to get the Rock Polish. 90% of the time, Celebi always lure in something that can take it well and Celebi and Landorus have ridiculously bad defensive synergy, so it's extremely tough to get the Rock Polish. Celebi is a cool Stealth Rock user, but I think that it's absolute garbage with it like HSA said, and its meant as bulky pivot. Losing Hidden Power [Fire] is pretty big since now I get screwed around by those stupid Scizor which is a surprisingly huge threat to this team without Hidden Power [Fire]. Hidden Power [Fire] also lets me dispose of opposing Celebi, Jirachi, and Skarmory after the Nasty Plot which also fairly important. Stealth Rock is cool on Landorus-I actually, since it's getting pretty common now, since it shuts down other leads. If I do go with those changes, I'll most likely go with Calm Mind or Rock Polish over Stealth Rock. I still have to do more testing. Thanks for pointing that out! Now, about Venasaur. Usually, it's a threat when I play carelessly, but if I save Tyranitar, it's rarely a threat. I usually just double switch. As I said to Leftiez, Venasaur is threat only on paper, but not in practice. I also prefer Thunder Wave on all my Rotom-W sets, since they provide soooo much utility, but Will-O-Wisp is important to prevent me from being steamrolled by Haxorus, Salamence, Dragonite and other hard hitting sweepers like Scizor. Sure it slows down things, but it doesn't make them weaker which is important and I have Keldeo to revenge kill them anyways. I also do damage calc for Venasaur during battle to see if its Modest or Timid. Flying Gem seems cool, I'll try, and same HP Ice and Surf. Again, thanks for the rate!

    I'll consider both of you as one rate xD. I like Calm Mind, but it lacks the immediate death boost of Nasty Plot which is why I'm not using it. Thanks for the rate!

    More rates are appreciated. This team has been a huge success and I'd like to thank every one who helped me.
  18. Honus

    Honus with them
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Mar 23, 2011
    aight copped ur request :toast:

    this team is really solid already and i think there's only a few changes left to make [or its 5:30 am], but basically it's really good. first i'm gonna say run flying gem acroscizor over your current spread, with acrobatics over roost and bug bite over u-turn. i have a really similar team to this and have the acro sd set over what you have and it absolutely wrecks. basically the set remains a check to all the stuff that scizor needs to check like gengars, ice types, etc, but also acts as a lure to keldeo's counters like gyarados, jellicent, and tentacruel, the set might not be as unknown as it used to be, but it's still a great lure set and i think it's a positive to change what you have now to an sd acroscizor for some hot offensive synergy. also invest some speed into it, probably like enough for 170 [so 16], but you can always go up to 185 to beat faster jellicent, if you're willing to give up the bulk. Also, I think CB Tyranitar's EVs could do with some changing, one of the major points of CB Tar is that it wrecks Skarmory and Jellicent, but a lot of them are up in the 182+ range, since there's basically a ton of speed creeping between the 3 [CB Tar, Skarm, Jellicent], a good place to be at with CB Tar is the 185 mark, where it can creep both Skarm and Jellicent, so it would probably be really optimal to change CB Tar to a spread of EVs: 148 HP / 252 Atk / 108 Spd, where he is fast enough to kill what he needs to while retaining a fair bit of his bulk. finaly change i'd make is to switch up scarf keldeo's moveset. garchomp is actually a pretty big problem for this team, and keldeo is the only mon that outspeeds, but Icy Wind doesn't really hit chomp that hard, i'd probably throw HP Ice on Keldeo over HP Electric since Rotom-W and SD Acroscizor both wreck Gyarados and then put HPump as filler in the last slot for whenever you need the power. Additionally [im not officially putting this in the rate but ill throw it in], I use Latios on my variant of this team in Rotoms slot for an extra thing to rk mons and a more dedicated check to Garchomp, maybe test it out if you want.

    Change Summary:

    HP Electric->HP Ice
    Icy Wind->Hydro Pump

    Current Spread->148 HP / 252 Atk / 108 Spd

    Scizor (M) @ Flying Gem
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 188 HP / 252 Atk / 68 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Swords Dance
    - Bullet Punch
    - Bug Bite
    - Acrobatics

    have fun
  19. moonbase


    Sep 24, 2012
    Hey man, Nice team, and congrats on the peak.
    The only minor thing I would suggest is to put a Lum berry on your scizor instead of leftovers, because it helps more in situations such as 1v1 vs Breloom, where you could set up in its face, and absorbing the burn, and u turning out vs jellicent to trap it or wreck the switch in with t tar.

    That's all I have to say.

    PS: I would luvdisc if I could lol.
  20. Vertex

    Vertex formerly ballislife
    is a Pre-Contributor

    May 2, 2013
    Hey Honus, thanks for the rate! Acrobatics Scizor is to lure in and kill Scizor's common checks like Keldeo and Tentacruel, and for all these checks, I have atlease 2 or 3 'mons that can beat them 1 v 1. I guess its helpful versus the rare CM Keldeo, but I'll still give it a shot. Like I said to Shurtugal, Gyarados is actually a threat, since Rotom-W finds its self set-up bait to it DD boosts which is why I like to keep Icy Wind and HP Electric. Icy Wind also helps me in the rare Gengar / Alakazam situation, so I can go for a sack on Two Icy Winds to Pursuit trap them both. Thanks for the rate, I'll try them out!

    Thanks for the rate! I'll try Lum Berry.

    More rates are appreciated.
  21. Tepig


    Jan 29, 2011
    The evs you currently say you have on your celebi only equal to 500 evs total you might wanna fix wherever that extra 8 goes.

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