[COMPLETED] Goodra

Discussion in 'XY Previews' started by Gary2346, Nov 2, 2013.

  1. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    [​IMG]
    Screw Druddigon.

    [Pros]

    <ul>
    <li>Goodra has great attacking stats, with Special Attack on par with Latias and base 100 Attack to make strong physical moves usable.</li>
    <li>It has loads of switch-in opportunities thanks to its huge Special Defense.</li>
    <li>Its movepool stretches to the horizon, including incredible coverage moves such as Fire Blast, Thunderbolt, and Sludge Bomb.</li>
    <li>Goodra has three great abilities to choose from: Gooey, Hydration, and Sap Sipper.</li>
    </ul>

    [Cons]

    <ul>
    <li>Goodra possesses below average Defense and Speed.</li>
    <li>The nerf to Drizzle keeps it from using Hydration reliably.</li>
    <li>It can be worn down relatively easily due to its lacks of reliable recovery.</li>
    </ul>

    [Set Recommendations]

    <p>name: Special Attacker<br />
    move 1: Draco Meteor<br />
    move 2: Fire Blast / Flamethrower<br />
    move 3: Thunderbolt / Sludge Bomb<br />
    move 4: Focus Blast / Dragon Tail<br />
    ability: Gooey / Sap Sipper<br />
    item: Choice Specs / Assault Vest<br />
    evs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA<br />
    nature: Modest / Quiet</p>

    <p>Goodra's fantastic bulk and high Special Attack allow for it to act as a hard-hitting tank. Thanks to its powerful STAB and great coverage, it is easily able to soften up the opponent so a teammate can come in and potentially clean up. When running Assault Vest, Goodra can act as an incredibly bulky pivot that can deal solid damage to the opponent in the process. Draco Meteor is an incredibly powerful STAB move that deals huge damage to anything that doesn't resist it, and can rip common offensive Pokemon such as Talonflame to shreds. Fire Blast provides this set with much-needed coverage against the likes of Ferrothorn and Excadrill, which can both switch into a Draco Meteor with relative ease and threaten to set up in Goodra's face. Flamethrower is a more accurate but significantly less powerful option over Fire Blast. Thunderbolt gives Goodra a much-needed coverage move against Togekiss and Azumarill, common Fairy-types that will oftentimes try to switch into a Draco Meteor. It's also useful for vaporizing bulky Water-types such as Gyarados, Vaporeon, and Tentacruel. Sludge Bomb hits the less prominent Fairy-types, such as Sylveon and Florges. Focus Blast rounds off this set's coverage by 2HKOing specially defensive Tyranitar, which can easily shrug off a Draco Meteor and threaten to 2HKO Goodra with Crunch. If choosing to run Assault Vest, Dragon Tail is a superior option for its ability to phaze out common switch-ins such as Tyranitar and Blissey, dealing solid damage to them in the process, especially with entry hazards up on the field. It can also prevent sweepers like Volcarona from setting up all over it.</p>

    <p>The EVs are designed to give Goodra maximum power and bulk to become as much of a tank as possible. Because Assault Vest plays differently than Choice Specs, make sure to adjust Goodra's nature and moveset accordingly. Assault Vest Goodra should run a Quiet nature to boost the power of Dragon Tail, while Choice Specs should always run a Modest nature. The Assault Vest set also has the option of running a Sassy nature to give Goodra an even higher boost to its Special Defense, but without a boosting nature, its Special Attack is a bit underwhelming. Sap Sipper can be used if your team desperately hates Grass-types or lacks something to absorb Spore or Sleep Powder. Gengar is a great partner because it can eliminate Fairy-types that are immune to Goodra's STAB, allowing for Goodra to freely spam Draco Meteor. Aegislash can set up on most of the common Fairy-types in the tier, such as Azumarill, Florges, and Sylveon, as well as special walls like Blissey and Chansey. Lucario demolishes special walls like Tyranitar and Blissey that wall Goodra. A Rapid Spin user is nice because Goodra hates entry hazards; Tentacruel and Excadrill are both fantastic options because both of them can switch into a wide variety of Fairy-type moves and spin. The Assault Vest set appreciates entry hazards support because it has great synergy with Dragon Tail, while also making Goodra more threatening all-around. Skarmory, Forretress, Klefki, and Roserade are all good users of Spikes that have great defensive synergy with Goodra.</p>

    <p>name: Specially Defensive<br />
    move 1: Dragon Pulse<br />
    move 2: Flamethrower / Fire Blast<br />
    move 3: Thunderbolt<br />
    move 4: Toxic / Dragon Tail<br />
    ability: Gooey / Sap Sipper<br />
    item: Leftovers<br />
    evs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD<br />
    nature: Calm / Sassy</p>

    <p>Goodra has a godlike Special Defense stat, so it comes to no surprise that it can run a very successful specially defensive set. With this set, Goodra can check a wide range of special attackers that litter the tier, such as Rotom-W, Gengar, Alakazam, and Volcarona. Dragon Pulse gives Goodra a reliable STAB move to use against pretty much anything that isn't already hit super effectively by one of its coverage moves. Flamethrower allows Goodra to hit Steel-types such as Ferrothorn, Forretress, Aegislash, and Skarmory before they all attempt to set up on it, while Fire Blast is a more powerful, less accurate option. Thunderbolt rounds off this set's coverage by hitting Tentacruel, Gyarados, and Vaporeon, while nailing Azumarill and Togekiss, which are the more common Fairy-types that Goodra will be going up against. The last moveslot is merely personal preference, but both moves have their own advantages. Toxic is great for crippling Rotom-W and Volcarona, two things that Goodra will commonly be walling but can't really deal with them reliably otherwise. It also cripples Tyranitar and specially defensive Hippowdon, which wall Goodra completely. Dragon Tail allows it to phaze common switch-ins like Blissey and Tyranitar, while preventing setup sweepers from setting up on Goodra. Dragon Tail should really only be used when Goodra is paired with entry hazard support, or else Toxic is superior overall.</p>

    <p>The EVs are to give Goodra as much Special Defense and bulk as possible. A Sassy nature is a better alternative to Calm if you choose to run Dragon Tail over Toxic, as it will appreciate the extra Attack power. Goodra's movepool is massive, so there are a lot of other moves that it could potentially run, but most of them are inferior to the ones listed above for various reasons. Sludge Bomb hits the less prevalent Florges and Slyveon, allowing Goodra to hit all of the Fairy-types for super effective damage, but it's not worth giving up the extra coverage that Thunderbolt gives. Focus Blast hits Tyranitar harder than anything else, but Goodra is better off crippling it with Toxic. The choice between abilities is merely personal preference; Sap Sipper being more useful on teams weak to the Grass type or in need of a Spore absorber, while Gooey is the best option overall for its ability to lower the Speed of the opposing Pokemon when hit by a contact move. Physical attackers such as Mega Lucario, Aegislash, and Scizor are great partners because they can deal with most of the special walls in the tier that can sponge Goodra's moves, like Blissey, Tyranitar, and Chansey. Pairing this set with Pokemon that have access to entry hazards is a great idea, as it allows Goodra to take more advantage of Dragon Tail and potentially wrack up a lot more residual damage. Skarmory, Klefki, Forretress, and Roserade have good defensive synergy with Goodra, and they all have access to Spikes. Rapid Spin support is highly recommended because this set lacks any sort of passive or reliable recovery, meaning that entry hazards can wear Goodra down very easily, so pairing it with Forretress, Excadrill, or Tentacruel is a good idea.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Due to Goodra's gigantic movepool, it's always risky trying to switch something in on its plethora of coverage moves. Because of this, special walls like Blissey, Chansey, and Tyranitar are probably the best options, because they don't really fear any of its coverage moves and can easily switch into a Choice Specs-boosted Draco Meteor. Sylveon and Florges's massive Special Defense allow for them to avoid the 2HKO from Sludge Bomb and retaliate back with a STAB Fairy-type move. Powerful physical attackers such as Garchomp, Salamence, Mega Charizard X, Mega Lucario, and Mega Kangaskhan can all OHKO Goodra with their respective STAB move, making them great checks. Entry hazards are great at limiting Goodra's switch-in opportunities, as it is vulnerable to all forms, and it can be worn down easily due to its lack of reliable recovery.</p>
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2013
  2. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    The Assault Vest set probably needs to be looked into more seeing as it could potentially have a LOT of slashes and QC seemed to have different opinions on how the set should be natured, slashed, etc.
  3. ShootingStarmie

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    The general basis of the set looks fine, and while there may be a few changes, it's not going to drastically affect how good this set looks. Since no other QC member has put their input about what slashes are best, I'm going to stick with Gary2346's slashes as I trust his judgement. Well done Gary

    QC (1/3) APPROVED
  4. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    Thanks SS!
  5. alexwolf

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    [​IMG]

    QC Approved 2/3
  6. ginganinja

    ginganinja Goodbye
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    why is Thunderbolt still the preferred option over Sludge Wave. Doesn't Sludge Wave also hit Togekiss + Azu + Other Faries which are the more common pokemon I see around? I believe I said this in the other thread, so I want to repost this since iirc Sludge Wave / Bomb seems better.
  7. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    Most of QC was suggesting to slash T-Bolt first to hit the more common Fairies (Azumarill and Togekiss) while also smacking bulky Water-types like Tentacruel, Politoed, Vaporeon, and the occasional Charizard Y. Mostly because it has better coverage all around, and Sludge Wave doesn't hit Florges that hard anyway because of its humongous Special Defense. It hits physically defensive Sylveon decently hard though. I personally don't think Sludge Wave is the better slash because although it has the advantage of smacking Sylveon harder, it loses out on coverage against other mons. I'd like a bit more QC input on this though, as for the most part it seemed that a majority of QC was fond of the extra coverage over hitting a few more Fairies, which is why I slashed T-Bolt first.

    And thanks alexwolf I'll get this written up.
  8. Treecko

    Treecko ᶦᶠ ᵃᶰʸ ᵒᶠ ʸᵒᵘ ᶠᵃᵍˢ ᶜʰᵃᶰᵍᵉ ᵐʸ ᵃᵛᵃᵗᵃʳ ᵃᵍᵃᶦᶰ ᴵ ʷᶦᶫᶫ ᵈᵉˢᵗʳᵒʸ ʸᵒᵘ
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    Speaking of Sludge Wave, Sludge Bomb is better imo unless Sludge Wave's extra 5 BP gets it particular KOs. You lose out on 5 BP in exchange for an extra 20% chance of poisoning the foe.
    Gary2346 and alexwolf like this.
  9. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    Oh wow didn't even know it learned Sludge Bomb. Definitely deserves a spot over Sludge Wave then. I will add it in.
  10. False Sense

    False Sense

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    Um... I think it might be worth mentioning that while Sludge Bomb does come with a 30% chance to poison, it's only regular poison. Sometimes that might not be as desirable as Burn, Paralysis, or Toxic Poisoning. Just something to consider, at the very least.
  11. Treecko

    Treecko ᶦᶠ ᵃᶰʸ ᵒᶠ ʸᵒᵘ ᶠᵃᵍˢ ᶜʰᵃᶰᵍᵉ ᵐʸ ᵃᵛᵃᵗᵃʳ ᵃᵍᵃᶦᶰ ᴵ ʷᶦᶫᶫ ᵈᵉˢᵗʳᵒʸ ʸᵒᵘ
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    Yeah, I'd still AC mention Sludge Wave because poisoning something you want to burn later can suck. Still, Sludge Bomb is definitely much more consistent imo, and even regular poison is still nice to have a lot of the time.

    err, not AC, but where ever you'd mention that in these previews.
  12. Unowninator

    Unowninator

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    Why are there 4 IVs in Attack in the 1st set? All its moves are Special.
  13. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    I'm in the process of editing things, so there are a few things that are mixed up ATM. A simple Copy/Paste mistake
  14. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    Sorry for the double posting, but this is finally written up.
  15. Adam Lambert

    Adam Lambert

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    Why is Infestation not mentioned at all, if I may ask?
  16. Unowninator

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    Why shou
    Why should it be? I don't mean to be rude, but I always considered trapping move like those to be useless.
  17. Adam Lambert

    Adam Lambert

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    Well, with Infestation, Toxic, Rest (or Protect) and a filler move, Goodra can potentially stall out a number of threats, while also trapping, and Toxic stalling to make it easier to dispose of them. It definitely has niche. Also, most trapping moves have inaccuracy and immunity issues, unlike Infestation which lacks both. (Meaning it is very accurate, and faces no immunities.)

    EDIT: Testing Infestation on Assault Vest Goodra, and it ensures the mon stays in, until you switch, or it times out by itself. It at least, however, ensures that the mon stays in for you to force a switch, and maybe use that gained momentum to set up. Not really sure if it qualifies for a second slash, but I would still like for it to at least be in "other options," if we still have those. I talked someone into trying out the "Infestation, Toxic Rest" set earlier, I'll report back how these findings go. (Note: With Assault Vest Goodra using Infestation, you can use Modest and an extra Spe EV to outspeed other [Assault Vest] Goodra.)
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2013
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  18. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
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    Sorry for being late to the part, but me and Fuzznip agreed that there should be a SpD set with Leftovers, as Assault Vest Goodra is best suited for offensive teams rather than defensive ones. Here is the set we want you to add:

    <p>name: Specially Defensive<br />
    move 1: Dragon Pulse<br />
    move 2: Flamethrower / Fire Blast<br />
    move 3: Thunderbolt<br />
    move 4: Toxic / Dragon Tail<br />
    ability: Gooey / Sap Sipper<br />
    item: Leftovers<br />
    evs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD<br />
    nature: Calm / Sassy</p>

    Toxic is for Pokemon you wall but can't do much against, such as Rotom-W and QD Volcarona, while it also deals with Pokemon that wall you and like to switch into Goodra, such as Tyranitar and SpD Hippowdon. Dragon Tail is still an option if you want phazing cause you have hazards or whatever.

    Also, we decided that Assault Vest and Specs play really similar and for this reason should be merged to this:

    <p>name: Special Attacker<br />
    move 1: Draco Meteor<br />
    move 2: Fire Blast / Flamethrower<br />
    move 3: Thunderbolt / Sludge Bomb<br />
    move 4: Focus Blast / Dragon Tail<br />
    ability: Gooey / Sap Sipper<br />
    item: Choice Specs / Assault Vest<br />
    evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA<br />
    nature: Modest / Quiet</p>

    Dragon Pulse and a +SpD nature go to AC. Make sure to explain how Specs should always go with Focus Blast and Dragon Tail with Assault Vest, same with the natures. Sorry that we decided this after you have written the entire thing up, but it's been a clusterfuck in c&c with a new metagame, new Pokemon, and new sets everywhere, and with more playtesting sometimes come different conclusions.
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  19. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    Okay I implemented all of these changes. Thanks alexwolf.
  20. SOMALIA

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    QC APPROVED 3/3
  21. Gary2346

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    Thanks man! This is ready for GP.
  22. Unowninator

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    IMO, I think Sludge Wave would be better than Sludge Bomb because it isn't blocked by Bulletproof Chesnaught.
  23. alexwolf

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    Couple of things:

    Don't forget the ability to prevent set up sweepers from using Goodra as set up bait and the ability to deal with certain special attackers that Goodra couldn't without it, such as Volcarona (and maybe more, bu i can't think of anything else atm).

    You should better talk about the item choice on the second paragraph, no point in mentioning it in the first sentence of the set comments. The set is a special hard hitting tank and you don't need to talk about its items to describe this. Just tell that with SpA investment it hits hard while having excellent special bulk to switch into special threats.
  24. Gary2346

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    Implemented.

    But it can just use Fire Blast or Draco Meteor to smash Chesnaught, so it really doesn't matter.
  25. GatoDelFuego

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    Gary2346

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    [Pros]

    <ul>
    <li>Goodra has great attacking stats, with Special Attack on par with Latias and base 100 Attack to make strong physical moves usable.</li>
    <li>It has loads of switch-in opportunities thanks to its huge Special Defense.</li>
    <li>Its movepool stretches to the horizon; including incredible coverage move like Fire Blast, Thunderbolt, and Sludge Bomb.</li>
    <li>Goodra has 3 great abilities to choose from; Gooey, Hydration, and Sap Sipper.</li>
    </ul>

    [Cons]

    <ul>
    <li>Goodra posses below average Defense and Speed.</li>
    <li>The nerf to Drizzle keeps it from using Hydration reliably.</li>
    <li>It can be worn down relatively easy due to its lacks of reliable recovery.</li>
    </ul>

    [Set Recommendations]

    <p>name: Special Attacker<br />
    move 1: Draco Meteor<br />
    move 2: Fire Blast / Flamethrower<br />
    move 3: Thunderbolt / Sludge Bomb<br />
    move 4: Focus Blast / Dragon Tail<br />
    ability: Gooey / Sap Sipper<br />
    item: Choice Specs / Assault Vest<br />
    evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA<br />
    nature: Modest / Quiet</p>

    <p>Goodra's fantastic bulk and high Special Attack allow for it to act as a hard-hitting tank. Thanks to its powerful STAB move and great coverage, it is easily able to soften up the opponent so a teammate can come in and potentially clean up. When running Assault Vest, Goodra can act as an incredibly bulky pivot that can deal solid damage to the opponent in the process. Draco Meteor is an incredibly powerful STAB move that deals huge damage to anything that doesn't resist it, and can rip common offensive Pokemon such as Talonflame to shreds. Fire Blast provides this set with much-needed coverage against the likes of Ferrothorn and Excadrill, who which can both switch into a Draco Meteor with relative ease and threaten to set up in Goodra's face. Flamethrower is a more accurate, (RC) but significantly less powerful option over Fire Blast. Thunderbolt gives Goodra a much-needed coverage move against Togekiss and Azumarill, (comma) common Fairy-types that will oftentimes try to switch into a Draco Meteor. It's also useful for vaporizing bulky Water-types such as Gyarados, Vaporeon, and Tentacruel. Sludge Bomb hits the less prominent Fairy-types, such as Sylveon and Florges. Focus Blast rounds off this set's coverage by 2HKOing specially defensive Tyranitar, who which can easily shrug off a Draco Meteor and threaten to 2HKO Goodra with Crunch. If choosing to run Assault Vest, Dragon Tail is a superior option for its ability to phaze out common switch-ins such as Tyranitar and Blissey, dealing solid damage to them in the process, especially with entry hazards up on the field. It can also prevent sweepers like Volcarona from setting up all over it.</p>

    <p>The EVs are designed to give Goodra maximum power and bulk to become as much of a tank as possible. Because Assault Vest plays differently than Choice Specs, make sure to adjust Goodra's nature and moveset accordingly. Assault Vest Goodra should run a Quiet nature to boost the power of Dragon Tail, while Choice Specs should always run a Modest nature. The Assault Vest set also has the option of running a Sassy nature to give Goodra an even higher boost to its Special Defense, but without a boosting nature, its Special Attack is a bit underwhelming. Sap Sipper can be used if your team desperately hates Grass-types or lacks something to absorb Spore or Sleep Powder. Mega Gengar is a great partner because it can trap Fairy-types that are immune to its Goodra's STAB move, allowing for Goodra to freely spam Draco Meteor. Aegislash can set up on most of the common Fairy-types in the tier, such as Azumarill, Florges, and Sylveon, as well as special walls like Blissey and Chansey. Blaziken demolishes special walls like Tyranitar and Blissey that wall Goodra. It's gone A Rapid Spinner user Either "spinner" or "Rapid Spin", s in spinner shouldn't be capitalized is nice because Goodra hates entry hazards; Tentacruel and Excadrill are both fantastic options because both of them can switch into a wide variety of Fairy-type moves and use Rapid Spin. The Assault Vest set appreciates entry hazards support because it has great synergy with Dragon Tail, while also making Goodra more threatening all-around. Skarmory, Forretress, Klefki, and Roserade are all good users of Spikes that have great defensive synergy with Goodra.</p>

    <p>name: Specially Defensive<br />
    move 1: Dragon Pulse<br />
    move 2: Flamethrower / Fire Blast<br />
    move 3: Thunderbolt<br />
    move 4: Toxic / Dragon Tail<br />
    ability: Gooey / Sap Sipper<br />
    item: Leftovers<br />
    evs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD<br />
    nature: Calm / Sassy</p>

    <p>Goodra has a godlike Special Defense stat, so it comes to no surprise that it can run a very successful specially defensive set. With this set, Goodra can check a wide range of special attackers that litter the tier, such as Rotom-W, Gengar, Alakazam, and Volcarona. Dragon Pulse gives Goodra a reliable STAB move to use against pretty much anything that isn't already hit super effectively by one of its coverage moves. Flamethrower allows Goodra to hit Steel-types such as Ferrothorn, Forretress, Aegislash, and Skarmory before they all attempt to set up on it, while Fire Blast is a more powerful, less accurate option. Thunderbolt rounds off this set's coverage by hitting Tentacruel, Gyarados, and Vaporeon, while nailing Azumarill and Togekiss, which are the more common Fairy-types that Goodra will be going up against. The last moveslot is merely personal preference, but both moves have their own advantages. Toxic is great for crippling Rotom-W and Volcarona, two things that Goodra will commonly be walling but can't really deal with them reliably otherwise. It also cripples Tyranitar and specially defensive Hippowdon, which wall Goodra completely. Dragon Tail allows it to phaze common switch-ins like Blissey and Tyranitar, while preventing setup sweepers from setting up on Goodra. Dragon Tail should really only be used when Goodra is paired with entry hazard support, or else Toxic is superior overall.</p>

    <p>The EVs are to give Goodra as much Special Defense and bulk as possible. A Sassy nature is a better alternative to Calm if you choose to run Dragon Tail over Toxic, as it will appreciate the extra Attack power. Goodra's movepool is massive, so there are a lot of other moves that it could potentially run, but most of them are inferior to the ones listed above for various reasons. Sludge Bomb hits the less prevalent Florges and Slyveon, allowing Goodra to hit all of the Fairy-types for super effective damage, but it's not worth giving up the extra coverage that Thunderbolt gives. Focus Blast hits Tyranitar harder than anything else, but Goodra is better off crippling it with Toxic. The choice between abilities is merely personal preference; Sap Sipper being more useful on teams weak to the Grass type or in need of a Spore absorber, while Gooey is the best option overall for its ability to lower the Speed of the opposing Pokemon when hit by a contact move. Physical attackers such as Mega Lucario, Aegislash, and Scizor are great partners because they can deal with most of the special walls in the tier that can sponge Goodra's moves, like Blissey, Tyranitar, and Chansey for example. Pairing this set with Pokemon that have access to entry hazards is a great idea, as it allows Goodra to take more advantage of Dragon Tail and potentially wrack up a lot more residual damage. Skarmory, Klefki, Forretress, and Roserade have good defensive synergy with Goodra, and they all have access to Spikes. Rapid Spin support is highly recommended because this set lacks any sort of passive or reliable recovery, meaning that entry hazards can wear Goodra down very easily, so pairing it with Forretress, Excadrill, or Tentacruel is a good idea.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Due to Goodra's gigantic movepool, it's always risky trying to switch something in on its plethora of coverage moves. Because of this, special walls like Blissey, Chansey, and Tyranitar are probably the best options, because they don't really fear any of its coverage moves and can easily switch into a Choice Specs-boosted Draco Meteor. Sylveon and Florges's massive Special Defense allow for them to avoid the 2HKO from Sludge Bomb and retaliate back with a STAB Fairy-type move. Powerful physical attackers such as Garchomp, Salamence, Mega Charizard X, Mega Lucario, and Mega Kangaskhan can all OHKO Goodra with their respective STAB-type move, making them great checks. Entry hazards are great at limiting Goodra's switch-in opportunities, as it is vulnerable to all forms, and it can be worn down easily due to its lack of reliable recovery.</p>

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    Just remember your compound adjectives (all-around, ect) and "setup" vs "set up"
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2013

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