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[COMPLETED] Lucario

Discussion in 'XY Previews' started by Subject 18, Oct 23, 2013.

  1. Subject 18

    Subject 18 S H M A C K E D
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    QC Checks: Alexwolf, Snunch, PKGaming
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    [​IMG]

    [Pros]
    <ul>
    <li>Amazing coverage and great movepool, makes it very difficult to (fully) counter.</li>
    <li>It breaks down opposing walls very efficiently.</li>
    <li>It is a great late-game sweeper thanks to Extreme Speed.</li>
    </ul>

    [Cons]

    <ul>
    <li>Being rather slow for a sweeper doesn't do it any favors</li>
    <li>Setting up can be an issue for it due to its bad bulk.</li>
    <li>It suffers from four-moveslot syndrome.</li>
    </ul>

    [Set Recommendations]


    <p>name: Mega Swords Dance<br />
    move 1: Swords Dance<br />
    move 2: Close Combat<br />
    move 3: Earthquake<br />
    move 4: Bullet Punch / Extreme Speed<br />
    ability: Justified<br />
    item: Lucarionite<br />
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe<br />
    nature: Jolly</p>

    <p>Mega Lucario's newly acquired ability gets its time to shine by turning Close Combat into a 240 Base Power move backed by a huge base 145 Attack stat. At +2 the number of Pokemon that are able to withstand the brute force of this attack are few. Adaptability gives you the option of dropping Extreme Speed for Bullet Punch, which now is just as strong as Extreme Speed. With Ice Punch being a tutor move and illegal for the time being, Gliscor is an issue as a +2 Close Combat does about about 40%. Earthquake will allow you to beat with Aegislash without fearing King's Shield while also OHKOing Toxicroak, Mega Gengar and Tentacruel. A combination of Close Combat and Earthquake will get you past Slowbro. Crunch is an option over will hit Ghost-types like Aegislash and Mega Gengar on the switch, which otherwise outspeed and OHKO if you don't have a Swords Dance under your belt. Since Talonflame is an issue for any Lucario set Bullet Punch can be dropped for Extreme Speed and take it out with just a little bit of prior damage.</p>
    <p>A Jolly nature is prefered over Adamant, as Mega Lucario can outspeed everything from base 100 to base 110 Speed, such as Garchomp and Gengar. The EVs are very straightforward to maximize Speed and Attack.</p>

    <p>Entry Hazard support is a must for Mega Lucario to be able to turn 2HKOs into OHKOs. Teammates that can take out Aegislash, such as Garchomp, work really well. Gliscor's presence is problematic and Pokemon such as Greninja and Rotom-W are good options for this role. Greninja can set up Spikes and has access to U-turn to find opportunities for Mega Lucario to set up. Rotom-W makes for a great partner as it keeps Talonflame and Gyarados at bay for Mega Lucario to freely sweep. </p>



    <p>name: Mega Nasty Plot<br />
    move 1: Nasty Plot<br />
    move 2: Dark Pulse<br />
    move 3: Aura Sphere / Vacuum Wave<br />
    move 4: Flash Cannon<br />
    ability: Steadfast<br />
    item: Lucarionite<br />
    evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe<br />
    nature: Timid</p>

    <p>As mentioned, Mega Lucario has a wide array of both physical and special moves in its arsenal. This set will lure in its normal checks and smash those checks into oblivion. This set no longer falls prey to the 50/50 game against Aegislash and is able to OHKO with a +2 Dark Pulse after Stealth Rock. Flash Cannon allows Lucario to beat Fairies such as Sylveon. If you choose Aura Sphere you fall prey to Excadrill, which outspeeds in sand and OHKOes with Earthquake. Vacuum Wave, though weaker, will beat Excadrill and give it priority against Choice Scarf users that can stop Mega Lucario from sweeping.</p>

    <p>Spikes and Stealth Rock are greatly appreciated to turn many 2HKOs into OHKOs. Skarmory does a great job of doing so as it is able to switch in on predicted Earthquakes from Excadrill and set up more entry hazards in the process. Pokemon that have U-turn or Volt Switch can provide more chances for Skarmory to set up.</p>


    <p>name: Mega Mixed Agility<br />
    move 1: Agility<br />
    move 2: Close Combat<br />
    move 3: Hidden Power Ice<br />
    move 4: Flash Cannon / Dark Pulse<br />
    ability: Justified<br />
    item: Lucarionite<br />
    Evs: 112 Atk / 224 SpA / 172 Spe<br />
    nature: Naughty Nature</p>

    <p>Agility Mega Lucario is great for late-game cleaning against already weakened teams. With an Agility boost under its belt to outspeed every Choice Scarf Pokemon, from there Mega Lucario can use the appropriate move to finish out the match. Flash Canon allows to hit Fairies much harder than Bullet Punch does. Dark Pulse can be used to net a 2HKO on Aegislash as it comes in to try and check Lucario, beats Psychic-types, 2HKOes Mega Gengar after Stealth Rock and has a good chance to 2HKO Forretress after Stealth Rock.</p>

    <p>The EV spread allows Mega Lucario to outspeed Jolly Excadrill sand to avoid being taken out by Earthquake. Max Attack is there to be able to 2HKO Hippowdown after Stealth Rock and one layer of Spikes with Close Combat. The rest of the EVs are dumped into Special Attack with a Rash nature to give Dark Pulse or Flash Canon more power for hitting Aegislash, Mega Gengar, and several Fairies. A Naughty nature is used here, as with it Mega Lucario can withstand a Choice Band Aqua Jet from Azumarill.</p>

    <p>name: Swords Dance<br />
    move 1: Swords Dance<br />
    move 2: Close Combat<br />
    move 3: Crunch / Earthquake<br />
    move 4: Bullet Punch / Extreme Speed<br />
    ability: Justified<br />
    item: Life Orb<br />
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe<br />
    nature: Adamant<br />

    <p>This is easily Lucario's flagship set last generation and it continues to be its staple set. With this set Lucario excels at sweeping teams following a Swords Dance. Extreme Speed gives it a strong priority move to take out anything faster and don't resist it. Close Combat is the main STAB that crushes Steel-types, and anything else slower. The last slot largely depends on what your team is weak to. Crunch deals with Ghost-types like Aegislash and Gengar on the switch. Bullet Punch provides a strong hit on Fairies.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Aegislash forces a 50/50 game trying to avoid attacking as it uses King's Shield and can OHKO regular Lucario with Sacred Sword. Mega Venusaur is able to take every single one of Lucario's moves at +2, then Earthquake or Sleep Powder and render it unless. RestTalk Gyarados is able to eat up any of Lucario's hits as well and can phaze it with Dragon Tail or 2HKO with Waterfall from full health. Choice Band Azumaril with Max HP can take stomach a +2 Bullet Punch and deal 70.56 - 83.33% back with an Aqua Jet if Mega Lucario is at -1 following a Close Combat. Prankster users that have Will-O-Wisp or Thunder Wave are able to cripple such as Sableye, Klefki, and Mega Banette.</p>

    <p>Choice Scarf users that can take a Bullet Punch and take out Lucario afterwards are problematic for it. Garchomp can take a boosted Bullet Punch or Extreme Speed and kill Lucario off with Fire Blast or Earthquake. Talonflame checks both the physical and special sets at +2 and is able to outspeed and OHKO with a Flare Blitz.</p>
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2013
  2. ginganinja

    ginganinja Dating Haunter
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    An all out attacking set is potentially more viable now on Mega Lucario since its has excellent base speed, as well as nice coverage + attacking stats.

    I want QCs opinion on a Special Attacking / NP set. It didn't get one in cos low speed + Vacuum Wave was inferior to ES, but I want opinions again now since Flash Cannon is an ok STAB move since it his Fairies now etc. I don't really care either way, but I want it discussed at least so we can form a solid opinion on it.

    Please note that Gyarados is potentially the best counter to Lucario as it stands, since Rest Talk sets can knock its attack stat down one stage, and phase it out or deal ok damage with its water stab. Its a p reliable switch so mention it please.
  3. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    Also, add Choice Band Azumarill as a check, one of the few priority users that can deal meaningful damage to Mega Lucario without getting wasted by +2 Bullet Punch (see Breloom, Dragonite, Scizor, and Mamoswine). Max HP Azumarill takes an average of 60% damage from +2 Jolly Adaptability Bullet Punch and deals 47.16 - 55.67% or 70.56 - 83.33% at -1 to Mega Lucario. Of 'course if Mega Lucario is not weakened to the necessary level Azumarill cannot revenge kill as +2 Close Combat OHKOes most of the time after SR.

    Idk about a special set, but i am inclined to say no for now. There isn't anything that an all out attacking physical set cannot get past and a special set can, so unless i am missing something i don't see any point in running special sets. Maybe just give a mention of Vacuum Wave on all out attacking sets to deal with Excadrill, opposing Lucario, Cloyster, Greninja, and other faster Pokemon that are weak to Fighting moves and not to Steel.

    Oh, and we definitely need an all out attacking set for Mega Lucario. Either slash a coverage move with Swords Dance or make another set.
  4. Super Mario Bro

    Super Mario Bro All we ever look for

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    I think the main draw to a Nasty Plot set is that it is much harder to wall with certain defensive cores; a combination Jellicent/Aegislash and Landorus-T/Gliscor ruin the Swords Dance set depending on the coverage move it uses.

    Lucario-Mega (F) @ Lucarionite
    Ability: Adaptability
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid / Modest Nature
    - Nasty Plot
    - Aura Sphere
    - Flash Cannon
    - Shadow Ball

    This set ruins practically every defensive core, unlike the Swords Dance set. While the lack of priority hurts its prospects against more offensive teams, the need for priority at all is diminished, since Mega Luke outpaces the crucial 100-111 speed tier anyway. It's at least worthy of an OO mention, imo.
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2013
  5. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    Yeah after talking with some QC members, NP seems worthy of a main set. Dark Pulse > Shadow Ball because of the flinch chance though and it's not like Toxicroak or Heracross are not outsped and OHKOed by +2 Flash Cannon.
    SOMALIA likes this.
  6. srk1214

    srk1214 Goddess of Light
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    Jellicent and Landorus-T are unavailable. There are basically only two defensive options, Gliscor and Aegislash.
  7. Subject 18

    Subject 18 S H M A C K E D
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    Updated with Nasty Plot. I'm testing an all out attacker set and Agility right now. Will update when I'm done.
  8. Subject 18

    Subject 18 S H M A C K E D
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    I tested an All Out Attacker set earlier and I personally didn't like it was too weak and was unable to secure many 2HKOs or OHKOs on things that it would normally lure in. If someone wants to give me an EV spread for it, I would be open to testing it again.

    The Agility set has been added. I found that a slightly mixed set worked more for me. The EV spread and Nature could use some tweaking as well. Otherwise it should be QC ready.
  9. Togepi

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    I don't know if I'm allowed to post here but I think Poison Jab is going to be a possibility on one of Lucario's sets
  10. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    Any reason why Hidden Power Ice is slashed with Flash Cannon on Nasty Plot Mega Lucario?
  11. Subject 18

    Subject 18 S H M A C K E D
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    Mainly for Gliscor and some dragons. Though I didn't really find the need for it but it was worth mentioning. I can remove that if you want.

    Poison Jab would only be for Fairy Pokemon but Flash Canon and Bullet Punch can cover those just as well. Since Flash Canon is the same base power and receives the Adaptability boost and will hit Fairies much hard. Though on the Physical Bullet Punch hits just as hard and gives you priority.
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2013
  12. kd24

    kd24 yo daddy musta been a drug dealer? why, cuz you're dope
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    ignoring the grammar issues, did you misplace bullet punch and extreme speed? extreme speed seems to be the better option anyway still without adaptability, but this paragraph makes it seem like bullet punch was supposed to be slashed in the first place, not extreme speed
  13. Subject 18

    Subject 18 S H M A C K E D
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    Yeah, I misplaced, my bad. I'll fix it now.
  14. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    Gliscor and dragons are OHKOed at +2 by Flash Cannon so i don't see any reason for HP Ice. Also, i don't see any use for Extremespeed on SD Mega Lucario. If you want Extremespeed use regular Lucario.
  15. Subject 18

    Subject 18 S H M A C K E D
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  16. Kavatika

    Kavatika is wary

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    Stealth Rock is a gen 5 tutor move, thus it is illegal with Garchomp this generation, unless of course it gets it as an egg move, in which case, just ignore me.
  17. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    • I think you should make the pros like this:

    [Pros]
    <ul>
    <li>Amazing coverage and great movepool, which make it very difficult to (fully) counter it</li>
    <li>Breaks down opposing walls very efficiently</li>
    <li>Great late-game sweeper thanks to Extremspeed</li>
    </ul>

    I just combined the sentences that were saying the same stuff...

    As for the cons here is how i would do it:

    [Cons]

    <ul>
    <li>Rather slow for an offensive Pokemon</li>
    <li>Has a hard time setting up due to bad bulk</li> (No need to go so specific about Dark moves on the overview)
    <li>Suffers from four move slot syndrome</li>
    </ul>

    • Remove any Jellicent mentions from your preview as its currently unavailable. If you want to justify Crunch's use mention Aegislash and Mega Gengar (on the switch obviously).
    • Remove the pros and cons section from the MEvo.
    • Add as checks to Mega SD Lucario Choice Band Azumarill (which does a ton with Aqua Jet after 1 Def drop and can take a +2 Bullet Punch even after 3 SR switch-ins) and Aegishield
    Will edit more stuff...
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2013
  18. Jukain

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    Is there any actual purpose to running normal Lucario? I'd use Mega in virtually all scenarios...
  19. kd24

    kd24 yo daddy musta been a drug dealer? why, cuz you're dope
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    "running a different mega"
  20. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    In case you want to use another MEvo, regular Lucario is perfectly usable.

    Remove mentions of regular Gengar when talking about Crunch's usefulness on Mega Lucario, as it outsped anyway. The real use is against Mega Gengar on the switch, which can trap and KO you without a SD boost otherwise.

    Good job


    [​IMG]

    QC Approved 1/3
  21. Snunch

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    Replace the <br /> tag at the end of the agility set with </p>. Other than that this looks good.

    QC APPROVED 2/3
  22. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    QC APPROVED (3/3)
  23. GatoDelFuego

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    Subject 18

    REMOVE CHANGE COMMENTS

    Show Hide
    [Pros]
    <ul>
    <li>Amazing coverage and great movepool, which make it very difficult to (fully) counter. it</li>
    <li>Breaks down opposing walls very efficiently.</li>
    <li>Great late-game sweeper thanks to Extreme Speed.</li>
    </ul>
    space
    [Cons]

    <ul>
    <li>Rather slow for a sweeper.</li>
    <li>Setting up can be an issue due to its bad bulk.</li>
    <li>Suffers from four moveslot syndrome.</li>
    </ul>

    [Set Recommendations]

    <p>Lucario @ Life Orb<br />
    Ability: Justified<br />
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 Atk / 252 Spe<br />
    Adamant nature<br />
    - Close Combat<br />
    - Crunch / Ice Punch <br />
    - Bullet Punch / Extreme Speed<br />
    - Swords Dance </p>

    <p>This is easily Lucario's flagship set last generation and it continues to be its staple set. With this set Lucario excells at sweeping teams following a Swords Dance. Extreme Speed gives it a strong priority move to take out anything that was faster and don't resist it. Close Combat is the main STAB that crushes Steel-types, and anything else slower that is slower and doesn't resist. The last slot largely depends on what your team is weak to. Crunch deals with Ghost-types like Aegislash and Gengar on the switch, and Ice Punch is for Gliscor. and Bullet Punch provides a strong hit on for beating Fairies.</p>
    space
    Mega Evolution Recommendations

    [​IMG]

    [Set Recommendations]

    Physical Swords Dance

    <p>Lucario @ Lucarionite<br />
    Ability: Adaptability<br />
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 Atk / 252 Spe<br />
    Jolly Nature<br />
    - Close Combat<br />
    - Crunch / Ice Punch<br />
    - Bullet Punch<br />
    - Swords Dance </p>

    <p>Mega Lucario's newly acquired ability gets its time to shine by turning Close Combat into a 240 Base Power move backed by a huge base 145 base Attack stat. At +2 the number of Pokemon that are able to within the brute force of this attack are few. Adaptability gives you the option of dropping Extreme Speed for Bullet Punch, who which now is just as strong as Extreme Speed. The option of Crunch or Ice Punch depends on what your team doesn't have covered. Crunch will hit Ghost-types like Aegislash and Mega Gengar on the switch, (AC) who which otherwise outspeed and OHKO if you don't have an Swords Dance under your belt.</p>

    <p>A Jolly nature is prefered over Adamant, (AC) as Mega Lucario you can outspeed everything from base 100 to base 110 Speed, such as Garchomp and Gengar. The EVs are very straightforward to maximize Speed and Attack.</p>

    <p>Entry Hazards support is a must for Mega Lucario to be able to turn 2HKOs into OHKOs. Teammates that can take out Aegislash, (AC) such as like Garchomp, (AC) work really well. Greninja can set up Spikes and has access to U-turn to find opportunities for Mega Lucario to set up. Rotom-Wash makes for a great partner as it keeps Talonflame and Gyarados at bay for Mega Lucario to freely sweep.</p>

    Special Nasty Plot

    <p>Lucario @ Lucarionite<br />
    Ability: Adaptability<br />
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe<br />
    Timid Nature<br />
    - Aura Sphere / Vacuum Wave<br />
    - Shadow Ball<br />
    - Flash Canon<br />
    - Nasty Plot </p>
    space
    <p>As mentioned, (AC) Mega Lucario has a wide array of both physical and special moves in its arsenal on both Special and Physical spectrum. This set will lure in its normal checks for the physical set and smash those checks into oblivion. This set no longer falls prey to the 50/50 game against Aegislash and is able to OHKO with a +2 Shadow Ball after Stealth Rock. Flash Canon allows you Lucario to beat Fairies such as Sylveon. Hidden Power Ice is for Dragon-types and Gliscors. If you choose Aura Sphere you fall prey to Excadrill, (AC) who outspeeds under in sand and OHKOes with Earthquake. While Vacuum Wave, (AC) though weaker, (AC) will beat Excadrill and give it priority against Choice Scarf users scarfers that can stop Mega Lucario from sweeping.</p>

    <p>Spikes and Stealth Rock are greatly appreciated as you to turn many 2HKOs into OHKOs. (period) Skarmory does a great job of doing so as it is able to switch in on predicted Earthquakes from Excadrill, (RC) and set up more entry hazards in the process. Pokemon that have U-turn or Volt Switch can provide more chances for him Skarmory to set up.</p>

    Mixed Agility

    <p>Lucario (F) @ Lucarionite<br />
    Trait: Justified<br />
    EVs: 84 SpAtk / 252 Atk / 172 Spd<br />
    Rash Nature / <br />
    - Close Combat<br />
    - Ice Punch<br />
    - Flash Canon / Dark Pulse<br />
    - Agility</p>

    <p>Agility Mega Lucario is great for late-game cleaning against already weakened teams. With an Agility boost under its belt to outspeed every Choice Scarfed Pokemon, from there you Mega Lucario can use the appropriate move to finish out the match. Flash Canon allows you Mega Lucario to hit Fairies much harder than Bullet Punch does. Dark Pulse can be used to net a 2HKO on Aegislash as it comes in to try and check Lucario, beats Psychic-types, 2HKOes Mega Gengar after Stealth Rock and has a good chances to 2HKO Forretress after Stealth Rock.</p>
    <p>The EV spread allows you Mega Lucario to outspeed Jolly Excadrill under in sand to avoid being taken out by and Earthquake. Max Attack is there to be able to 2HKO Hippowdown after Stealth Rock and one layer of Spikes with Close Combat. The rest of the EVs are dumped into Special Attack with a Rash nature to give Dark Pulse or Flash Canon more power for hitting Aegislash, Mega Gengar, (AC) and several Fairies. A Rash nature is prefered over Mild, (AC) as with it Mega Lucario you can withstand a Choice Band Aqua Jet from Azumarill.</p>
    space
    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Aegislash forces a 50/50 game trying to avoid attacking as it uses King's Shield and can OHKO with Sacred Sword. Mega Venusaur is able to take every single one of Lucario's moves at +2, then Earthquake or Sleep Powder and render it unless. RestTalk Gyarados is able to eat up any of its Lucario's hits as well and can phaze it with Dragon Tail or 2HKO with Waterfall from full health. Choice Band Azumaril with Max HP can take stomach a +2 Bullet Punch and deal 70.56 - 83.33% back with an Aqua Jet if Lucario is at -1 following a Close Combat Is this mega or not? Be sure to specify. Prankster users that have Will-O-Wisp or Thunder Wave are able to cripple such as Sableye, (AC) Klefki, (AC) and Mega Banette.</p>

    <p>Choice Scarfers users that can take a Bullet Punch and take it out Lucario afterwards are problematic for it. Garchomp can take a boosted Bullet Punch or Extreme Speed and kill it Lucario off with Fire Blast or Earthquake. Talonflame checks both the physical and special sets at +2 and is able to outspeed and OHKO with a Flare Blitz.</p>

    1/1

    Please also ensure that there is only one line between each paragraph
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2013
  24. Punchshroom

    Punchshroom para is worse than sleep
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    Talonflame can easily revenge Lucario with Flying attacks (especially after Close Combat), but must be wary of +2 Extreemespeed.
  25. Subject 18

    Subject 18 S H M A C K E D
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    GP Check is implemented.

    Thank you everyone.

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