1. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.
  2. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!

Conkeldurr (Analysis)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by kingofmars, Feb 28, 2011.

  1. kingofmars

    kingofmars
    is a Past SPL Winneris a VGC2 Winner

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2010
    Messages:
    773
    [​IMG]
    QC checks 2/2: Huy, Alaka
    Grammar Checks 2/2: Chou Toshio, Calm Pokemaster

    [Overview]

    <p>Conkeldurr is a great Pokemon for teams that need a bulky, powerful attacker. It has a base 140 Attack stat, which is boosted even more by Guts. Conkeldurr also has 105 / 95 / 65 defenses, making it rather physically bulky. Conkeldurr can work both in and out of Trick Room, making it a good choice for teams that don't want to be totally dependent on Trick Room. Blessed with a strong priority attack in Mach Punch, Conkeldurr becomes a reliable candidate for any VGC 2011 team. </p>

    [SET]
    name: Guts
    move 1: Mach Punch
    move 2: Drain Punch / Hammer Arm
    move 3: Rock Slide / Payback / Earthquake
    move 4: Detect / Wide Guard
    item: Flame Orb
    nature: Adamant / Brave
    ability: Guts
    evs: 252 HP/ 252 Atk / 4 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This set is designed to function either in or out of Trick Room. Conkeldurr already has a huge base 140 Attack stat. However, with a Guts boost, Conkeldurr a massively powerful physical attacker capable of OHKOing a large number of Pokemon. Protect allows Conkeldurr to shelter itself from threats while its status orb activates and gives it the Guts boost. Wide Guard can be used in place of Protect, providing valuable protection for teammates weak against common spread attacks. Unfortunately, the specificity of its protection does limit its usefulness, particularly for Conkeldurr itself. Mach Punch gives Conkeldurr priority, and with a Guts boost, can finish off weakened Pokemon or KO extremely frail ones. The choice between Drain Punch and Hammer Arm is a choice between healing and power. There are three options for the last attacking move. Rock Slide gives you the ability to hit both opponents, Payback is very effective against faster Psychic- and Ghost-type enemies that lack a weakness to Rock-type attacks, while Earthquake hits all grounded Pokemon on the field. An Adamant nature lets Conkeldurr outspeed a few threats outside of Trick Room, and is recommended if not running Trick Room, while Brave allows Conkeldurr to be one of the fastest Pokemon in the metagame when using Trick Room.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Conkeldurr should always run maximum Attack in order to deal as much damage as possible. An Attack boosting nature is also required, as there is no other stat that is worth investing completely in. A more specially defensive EV spread can also be used, in order to give Conkeldurr even defensive prowess. 152 HP / 252 Atk / 104 SpD effectively gives Conkeldurr as much bulk as possible while minimizing the burn damage from burn due to the Flame Orb. Superpower can replace Drain Punch or Hammer Arm to provide an obscene amount of power the first time it's used, but since it lowers Conkeldurr's Attack and Defense significantly, its usefulness is very limited. Earthquake can be used if Conkeldurr's partner doesn't care about damage from it (generally, when it is immune to or resists Ground-type attacks), and can hit both of the opponent's Pokemon with a strong attack that has perfect accuracy. An important thing to note is that the combination of Drain Punch, Mach Punch, and Wide Guard is illegal with Conkeldurr, and either Drain Punch or Wide Guard must be replaced with Hammer Arm or Protect, respectively.</p>

    <p>If running Earthquake, Conkeldurr appreciates a partner that is immune to it. Thundurus makes a great partner, as it can also threaten Tornadus, which is a major threat to Conkeldurr. When not using Earthquake, Chandelure makes an excellent partner, killing bulky Psychic-types and physically defensive Pokemon that Conkeldurr has trouble with. Conkeldurr is an excellent choice to use with Trick Room support, being "faster" than most of the metagame under Trick Room. Reuniclus thus makes a great partner, providing Trick Room and breaking through most physically defensive Pokemon. It also defeats bulky Psychic-types if it runs Shadow Ball.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Fling can be used to burn an opponent's Pokemon. However, if the opponent uses Protect on that turn, you will have effectively wasted a move slot. Facade can deal a hefty chunk of damage to a variety of Pokemon; however, relying on Normal / Fighting coverage leaves you helpless against Ghost-types.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Bulky Psychic-types like Reuniclus and Musharna cause trouble for Conkeldurr, easily taking most of its attacks and KOing it in return with STAB Psychic. Amoonguss can also pose a threat to Conkeldurr, as it completely avoids being 2HKOed by the standard sets, though it can be troubled by Earthquake and must be wary of Facade. Tornadus can outspeed Conkeldurr and KO it with STAB Acrobat or Hurricane.</p>
  2. JRank

    JRank
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2010
    Messages:
    1,299
    If you're going to stay consistent throughout the whole thing, that Roobushin needs to be Conkledurr. Also, I think Earthquake should be slashed in with Rock Slide and Payback.
  3. cosmicexplorer

    cosmicexplorer pewpewpew
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    Messages:
    1,555
    4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 SpD should at least be an alternative option, although it's probably the best in my opinion; it takes around 15% less from special attacks than straight up max HP, and while max HP offers similar benefits physically, Conkeldurr really likes that extra special bulk to take stuff like Chandelure's Heat Waves and Rock Slide it into oblivion, while I don't think any significant KOs are avoided with more physical defense.
  4. kingofmars

    kingofmars
    is a Past SPL Winneris a VGC2 Winner

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2010
    Messages:
    773
    @Jrank
    Oops fixed. When I originally wrote this, I used Roobushin instead of Conkeldurr. Once I saw that the English names were probably real, I quickly changed the names of the pokemon, must have missed one. And yeah, EQ is deffinetely important enough to be slashed in.

    @CosmicExplorer
    I added a specially defensive EV spread mention in additional comments. However, the main set still has 252 HP in order to better abuse Conkeldurr's physical bulk.

    Changes have been made. Any more suggestions are extremely aprrectiated.
  5. Mathghamhain

    Mathghamhain

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2009
    Messages:
    20
    You might want to mention that since he's in the Humanshape Egg Group: Mach Punch / Drain Punch / Wide Guard is an illegal combination, as awesome as it would be. If you want Mach Punch and Wide Guard, you would have to go with Hammer Arm or go with MP / DP / Protect. Just my two cents.
  6. Human

    Human

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2010
    Messages:
    1,113
    252 HP means you take more damage from Flame Orb. I think that either 187 or 199 will be better HP stats to have because of that if you bother having max HP or you can lower the HP IVs (to 18/19) to have 174 HP. You will get more physical/special bulk by putting the EVs into either Def or SpD. Also mention that Facade + Rock Slide/Drain Punch/Hammer Arm can 2HKO Amoongus.
  7. kingofmars

    kingofmars
    is a Past SPL Winneris a VGC2 Winner

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2010
    Messages:
    773
    @Mathghamhain, mentioned it in additional comments, towards the end. I'm glad that someone caught that

    @Human mentioned it in additional comments. However, I didn't put it as the main set because you lose out in bulk in whatever defense you don't invest in, and if running Drain Punch, the extra 2 HP lost becomes inconsequential. Though I can see how this becomes a better spread if running Hammer Arm.

    As always, more comments and feedback are appreciated.
  8. muna

    muna

    Joined:
    May 1, 2008
    Messages:
    451
    [Set Comments]
    <p>This Set is designed to function either in or out of Trick Room. Conkeldurr has the second highest attack stat in the game, outclassed only by Haxorus. However, with a guts boost, Conkeldurr becomes the single strongest Pokémon in the game. Protect allows Conkeldurr to be sheltered from threats while it gets its guts boost. Wide Guard can be used in place of Protect, which can be a good option for defending partners who are weak to common multi-target moves, but since it only works with specific moves, it limits its usefulness. Mach Punch gives Conkeldurr priority, and with a guts boost, it can finish off weakened Pokémon or kill extremely frail ones. The choice between Drain Punch and Hammer Arm is a choice between healing and power. While Rock Slide gives you the ability to hit both opponents, Payback can be used in order to deal a larger amount to psychics and ghosts that aren’t rock weak. Adamant lets Conkeldurr a few threats outside of Trick Room, and is recommended if not running Trick Room, while Brave allows Conkeldurr to be one of the fastest Pokémon in the game, under Trick Room of course. </p>

    Apart from that and the already made suggestions, it looks like a great set.
  9. mudkipmaster

    mudkipmaster

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2010
    Messages:
    750
    Hmmm. I do think Drain Punch is inferior to Facade, as you already get STAB from Mach Punch. 140 BP added with the guts boost is nothing to laugh about.
  10. muffinhead

    muffinhead b202 wifi vgc
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2010
    Messages:
    933
    Darin Punch hits Hydreigon and Audino harder than Facade, as well as regaining health lost by Flame Orb / attacks. Facade is possibly OC worthy.
  11. kingofmars

    kingofmars
    is a Past SPL Winneris a VGC2 Winner

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2010
    Messages:
    773
    It already is in OC
  12. Huy

    Huy INSTANT BALLS
    is a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2005
    Messages:
    1,511
    Set works

    QC Approved: 1/2
  13. Alakapimp

    Alakapimp All washed up
    is a Tournament Director Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2008
    Messages:
    3,113
    Yep looks good, QC approved 2/2
  14. Chou Toshio

    Chou Toshio @Fighting Necktie
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris an Artist Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2007
    Messages:
    8,121
    Change/Add
    Delete
    Show Hide


    [​IMG]


    1/2
  15. TorchicBlaziken

    TorchicBlaziken

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2008
    Messages:
    1,368
    Hey! Would a After You/Trick Room Focus Punch abuse set work?

    name: Focus Punch
    move 1: Mach Punch
    move 2: Drain Punch / Rock Slide
    move 3: Focus Punch
    move 4: Protect / Wide Guard
    item: Flame Orb
    nature: Brave
    ability: Guts
    evs: 252 HP/ 252 Atk/ 4 SpD

    To be used alongside an After You Trick Room Audino, because Audino's After You will make Conkeldurr's Focus Punch hit right after Audino moves, which will be quickly thanks to Trick Room. (And probably a Chandelure on the team to beat Ghosts.) Would that be viable? And Audino has Heal Pulse to heal Conkeldurr so it can use Rock Slide instead of Drain Punch, unless you also have a Gigalith on the team.
  16. KG3UNFORGN

    KG3UNFORGN

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2011
    Messages:
    7
    OR you can add bulk up and then guts too, bring it out, the oppent will swicth into then activate guts then Machpunch is unstoppable, is kinda like a BP SD Scizor.
  17. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,586
    But TB's set is meant for doubles/triples, and Conkeldurr needs Protect/Wide Guard...

    or it's gonna get gang-raped, period.
  18. kingofmars

    kingofmars
    is a Past SPL Winneris a VGC2 Winner

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2010
    Messages:
    773
    I really don't think that's viable for a couple of reasons.
    1. It uses Conkeldurr as a lead, and Acrobat Tornadus is one of the most common leads in the game, so yeah...
    2. It relies on using Audino. Seriously, Audino IS the worst Trick Room set up pokemon. While it doesn't have the dark weakness, it has the horrible fighting weakness, and since Conkeldurr is the most common fighting type, even if you run Chandelure it's still going to hurt you with Rock Slide.
    3. I haven't seen it used well once. If you or someone else can provide logs proving its effectiveness, I might reconsider. (also, the person you're playing against has to be at least decent at VGC, as shown by their battle)
  19. TorchicBlaziken

    TorchicBlaziken

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2008
    Messages:
    1,368
    Would it work well with a Choice Scarf Cinccino instead?

    Conkeldurr's Guts-boosted Focus Punch will always OHKO Tornadus.
  20. Alakapimp

    Alakapimp All washed up
    is a Tournament Director Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2008
    Messages:
    3,113
    You are using two attacks to get off one, albeit strong and fast, attack. It's simply not worth the effort, unless you can provide logs that prove its useful.
  21. cosmicexplorer

    cosmicexplorer pewpewpew
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    Messages:
    1,555
    A Helping Hand Hammer Arm hits as hard as an After You Focus Punch.
  22. Calm Pokemaster

    Calm Pokemaster
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,660
    Deletions
    Additions / Corrections
    Comments

    Show Hide

    [Overview]

    <p>Conkeldurr is a great Pokemon for teams that need a bulky, strong Pokemon powerful attacker. Conkeldurr It has a base 140 Attack stat, which is boosted even more by Guts. Conkeldurr also has 105 / 95 / 65 (spacing) defenses, making it rather physically bulky. (Be consistent in how you refer to Pokemon. Don't alternate between "he" and "it"; stick to either one. Since you have used "it" everywehere else, stick to it) Conkeldurr can work both in and out of Trick Room, making it a good choice for teams that don't want to be totally dependent on Trick Room. Blessed with a strong priority attack in Mach Punch, Conkeldurr becomes a reliable candidate for any VGC 2011 team. </p>

    [SET]
    name: Guts
    move 1: Mach Punch
    move 2: Drain Punch / Hammer Arm
    move 3: Rock Slide / Payback / Earthquake (spacing)
    move 4: Protect / Wide Guard
    item: Flame Orb
    nature: Adamant / Brave
    ability: Guts
    evs: 252 HP/ 252 Atk / 4 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This set is designed to function either in or out of Trick Room. Conkeldurr has the second highest attack stat in the game, outclassed only by Haxorus. Conkeldurr already has a huge base 140 Attack stat. However, with a Guts boost, Conkeldurr becomes the single strongest Pokemon in the game a massively powerful physical attacker capable of OHKOing a large number of Pokemon. Protect allows Conkeldurr to shelter itself from threats while it gets its Guts boost its status orb activates and gives it the Guts boost. Wide Guard can be used in place of Protect, providing valuable protection for teammates weak against common multi-target moves spread attacks. Unfortunately, the specificity of its protection does limit its usefulness, particularly for Conkeldurr itself. Mach Punch gives Conkeldurr priority, and with a Guts boost, can finish off weakened Pokemon or KO extremely frail ones. The choice between Drain Punch and Hammer Arm is a choice between healing and power. There are three options for the last attacking move. While Rock Slide gives you the ability to hit both opponents, Payback is very effective against faster Psychic- and Ghost-type enemies that lack a Rock weakness to Rock-type attacks, while Earthquake hits all grounded Pokemon on the field. An Adamant nature lets Conkeldurr outspeed a few threats outside of Trick Room, and is recommended if not running Trick Room, while Brave allows Conkeldurr to be one of the fastest Pokemon in the metagame when using Trick Room.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Conkeldurr should always run maximum Attack in order to deal as much damage as possible. An Attack boosting nature is also required, as there is no other stat that it is worth investing completely in. A more specially defensive EV spread can also be used, in order to give Conkeldurr even defensive prowess. 152 HP / 252 Atk / 104 SpD/Def effectively produces gives Conkeldurr as much bulk as possible while (space) minimizing the effects of burn damage from burn done by due to the Flame Orb. Superpower can replace Drain Punch or Hammer Arm to provide an obscene amount of power the first time it's used, but since it lowers Conkeldurr's Attack and Defense significantly, its usefulness is very limited. Earthquake can be used if Conkeldurr's partner doesn't care about damage from it (generally, when it is immune to or resists Ground-type attacks), and can hit both of the opponent's Pokemon with a strong attack that has perfect accuracy. An important thing to note is that the three move combination of Drain Punch, Mach Punch, and Wide Guard is illegal with Conkeldurr, and either Drain Punch or Wide Guard must be replaced with Hammer Arm or Protect, respectively.</p>

    <p>If running Earthquake, Conkeldurr appreciates a partner that is immune to it. Thundurus makes a great partner, as it can also threaten Tornadus, which is a major threat to Conkeldurr. When not using Earthquake, Chandelure makes an excellent partner, killing bulky Psychic-types and physically defensive Pokemon that Conkeldurr has trouble with. Conkeldurr is an excellent choice to use with Trick Room support, being "faster," than most of the metagame under Trick Room. Under Trick Room, Reuniclus thus makes a great partner, providing Trick Room and breaking through most physically defensive Pokemon. It also defeats bulky Psychic-types if it runs Shadow Ball.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Fling can be used in order to burn an opponent's Pokemon. However, if the opponent uses Protect on that turn, you will have effectively wasted a move slot. Facade can deal a hefty chunk of damage to a variety of Pokemon; however, relying on Normal / Fighting coverage leaves you helpless against Ghost-types.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Bulky Psychic-types like Reuniclus and Musharna cause trouble for Conkeldurr, easily taking most of its attacks and killing it in the process KOing it in return with STAB Psychic. Amoonguss can also pose a threat to Conkeldurr, as it completely avoids being 2HKOed by the standard sets, though it can be troubled by Earthquake and must be wary of Facade. Tornadus can both outspeed Conkeldurr and KO it with an STAB Acrobat or Hurricane.</p>


    [​IMG]

    GP 2 / 2
  23. kingofmars

    kingofmars
    is a Past SPL Winneris a VGC2 Winner

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2010
    Messages:
    773
    Finished, fuck yeah.
  24. lucariojr

    lucariojr quell the storm and ride the thundurus
    is a Contributor to Smogon

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2009
    Messages:
    1,446
    why is protect there; it gets detect
  25. Lucien Lachance

    Lucien Lachance

    Joined:
    May 16, 2010
    Messages:
    669
    Because, they're the exact same move, but protect gets about 10 extra PP which may come in handy.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)