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Creative (and good) Movesets Mk II (READ THE OP FIRST)

Discussion in 'BW OU' started by sax king, Jan 17, 2011.

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  1. The Dark Hero

    The Dark Hero

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    [​IMG]

    Tornadus-T @ Life Orb/Expert Belt
    Ability: Regenerator
    EVS: 252 SAtk / 252 Speed
    Modest/Timid/ or any defense boosting, attack lowering nature.
    -Hurricane
    -Heat Wave
    -Icy Wind
    -Air Slash/U-Turn

    The first thing you'll notice. Icy Wind. It's there to hit Chomp and Nite SE, but it also cripples switch ins (Like Rotom-W) with a speed drop. Also, the rather fun part. If it's sunny due to my Ninetales, and they switch in Toed. BAM! Speed drop, and, since Torandus-T will outspeed it for sure, Hurricane its ass! As for Air Slash, for more accuracy, and Conkelderp and Breloom will die anyways. That, and I'm not a huge fan of U-Turn.
  2. the flying afro

    the flying afro

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    To be honest i cant see the use of icy wind aside from hitting dragon types. Focus blast has better coverage and hits harder as well as hitting tyranitar which would wall this set. You say that you use this on a sun team , why then would you use hurricane which has its accuracy lowered. Swap hurricane for air slash and keep u-turn to switch out for recovery.
  3. The Dark Hero

    The Dark Hero

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    It also slows down any switch-ins.

    You give good advice, although I don't trust Focus Blast's accuracy... In case of Tyranitar, I'll switch to something else using U-Turn.

    As for Hurricane, it was just in case I lose the weather war, but I guess I can drop it.
  4. FrostFire

    FrostFire
    is a Tiering Contributor

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    Just with respect to Icy Wind - if you really want the ice-type coverage, then Hidden Power [Ice] is probably better, and I've used it on occasion. It's stronger then Icy Wind (55 BP< 70 BP), and Tornadus-T is outspeeding so much anyway that sacrificing a fair bit of power for a speed drop doesn't seem like it's worth it.

    Overall, HP [Ice] is pretty good; it allows you to hit, not just Dragons, but also Thundurus-T, as well as Landorus-T, Gliscor and others without having to rely on Hurricane. It's not a bad coverage option actually, even though most people don't run it (usually Taunt or Rain Dance takes up this slot on most Torn-T's I see when laddering).
  5. Ada

    Ada
    is a Tiering Contributor

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    Meet combat Blissey; an offensive take on the game's premier special wall:


    [​IMG]

    Blissey @ Life Orb
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 160 Def / 252 SpA / 96 Spe
    Brave Nature
    - Softboiled
    - Thunderbolt
    - Ice Beam
    - Flamethrower

    The idea is simple, come in on one of the many special sweepers you wall and start firing off powerful Life Orb attacks. Rinse and repeat for an easy win.

    The given EVs maximize Special Attack and provide enough Speed to outspeed common Scizor, while the rest are placed in Defense in order to help survive powerful Close Combats. A Brave nature is necessary because this set is not for the faint of heart.


    Pros:

    Simple and easy to use

    Makes an excellent lure

    The most expensive LO attacks in the game


    Cons:

    Hax D:
  6. Onicon

    Onicon

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    Probably I am supposed to take this Blissey-thing as a joke and probably I am right should I consider that you have a Brave nature (+Atk, -Spe). Whatever you intend to do with this one it still needs work.

    First of all, it sucks in any other role but support and there are plenty of more flexible lures out there. So if I intend to use Blissey as a lure that is going to be the secondary task.

    Your speed is alright and gives you some leeway in the case some CB-Scizor creep up a few points. Here are a few important reference points for her SAtk (neutral):
    0 EVs Fire Blast OHKOs CB-Scizor after SR
    0 EVs Ice Beam OHKOs Salamence after SR
    56 EVs Ice Beam OHKOs Offensive-Landorus after SR
    88 EVs Ice Beam OHKOs Offensive-Dragonite after SR
    96 EVs Ice Beam OHKOs Standart-Gliscor after SR
    120 EVs Thunderbolt OHKOs Offensive Gyarados after SR
    132 EVs Flamethrower OHKOs CB-Scizor after SR

    First of all, Blissey should joss Thunderbolt, as BoltBeam performs lousily against those who are not quadruple weak because of Blissey's rather low SAtk. Besides, you shouldn't stay in Gyarados anyway because it has Moxie and is a potential candidate for Choice Scarf who obviously won't set up. Is is especially true for Salamence, according to the monthly stats. It's emphasized further on with Thunderbolt being almost unable to 2HKO defensive Politoed with Thunderbolt (Modest, 252) after SR.
    Secondly, Fire Blast is superior to Flamethrower. As you can see it requires a lot more point in order to have the same damage output as Fire Blast. Because I recommend Blissey as a primary supporter and only as a secondary lure, Fire Blast should do the job.

    Summa summarum:

    Blissey @ Leftovers
    Trait: Nature Cure
    EVs: 96 SAtk / 96 Spe / 316 remaining
    Calm Nature
    - Softboiled
    - Fire Blast
    - Ice Beam
    - Toxic / Stealth Rock / Aromatherapy

    Sorry, that may be an overhaul instead of an improvement but it still gets its job done.
  7. BlankZero

    BlankZero

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    If you're going to run Combat Blissey, why not do it this way?

    [​IMG]
    Blissey @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spe / 4 HP -OR- 252 HP / 252 SAtk / 4Spe
    Calm / Modest Nature
    - Softboiled
    - Flamethrower
    - Ice Beam
    - Charge Beam

    Charge Beam to setup sweep, Leftovers/Softboiled adding to longevity, amazing lure coverage (only fearing Fighting Type, as per usual) and running basic max speed/max special, or max HP/max special. Hits hard as crap, lures everything, stays going like the energizer bunny, etc.

    Basically, take out your opponents Physical heavy hitters and bring out Blissey to StallSweep. I've had a few games with just Pseudo BoltBeam with Serene Grace giving 100% SpA boost every Charge Beam, and 20% Freeze Chance (and Burn chance as well).

    The only thing you might run into is ground types like Landorus coming in on you on a Charge Beam, forcing a switch on your part, unless you predict it. Then, Ice Beam knocks it right out.

    Here's some calcs for you just to prove it isn't deadweight, if as nothing but a lure.
    Code:
    
    252SpAtk Blissey (+SAtk) Flamethrower vs 252HP/0SpDef Scizor (Neutral): 111% - 131% (384 - 452 HP). Guaranteed OHKO.
    
    252SpAtk Blissey (+SAtk) Ice Beam vs 252HP/0SpDef Salamence (Neutral): 97% - 114% (384 - 452 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO. 85% chance to OHKO.
    
    252SpAtk Blissey (+SAtk) Ice Beam vs 252HP/0SpDef Landorus (Neutral): 100% - 118% (384 - 452 HP). Guaranteed OHKO.
    
    252SpAtk +1 Blissey (+SAtk) Flamethrower vs 252HP/252SpDef Ferrothorn (+SpDef): 87% - 103% (308 - 364 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO. 21% chance to OHKO.
    
    252SpAtk Blissey (+SAtk) Fire Blast vs 252HP/252SpDef Ferrothorn (+SpDef): 73% - 87% (260 - 308 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO.
    
    As you can see, even on bulky variants, that +0 Super Effective destroys just about anything with x4 weakness, even Maximum Bulk Ferrothorn can barely take a +1 Flamethrower outside of rain, and takes comparable damage from a +0 Fire Blast.

    Certain pokemon, like maximum bulk Latias, will wall you entirely while you desperately try to rack up +1's while it sets up in your face (you'd have to be at +5 just to have a SHOT at a 1HKO), so definitely isn't bulletproof, but it will surprise you, and it will lure folks in with its pudgy pink exterior.

    Then, it eats them.
  8. Onicon

    Onicon

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    The reason I cannot recommend pure combat Blissey is checked by every physical sweeper faster than herself (means: practically every sweeper in OU). Have a look at its speed tier: Maximum speed Blissey only outspeeds two relevant Pokemon, Vaporeon and Skarmory. The first one won't stay anyway and the latter one survives a Charge Beam and is allowed to switch into something faster. Even Timid Blissey only ties with neutral offensive Scizor. And do not forget that Tyranitar is still prevalent and takes a pitiful amount to damage from either move.
    We still think offensive Blissey does not quite cut it. She is fair as a lure, but too slow for a set up sweeper.
  9. BlankZero

    BlankZero

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    Agreed, but I've won more than one game late game sweeping with Bliss. As long as the physicals are out of game (and latias/other Pink Blobs) Blissey has has the bulk, the coverage, and the power to run through opponents.
  10. EtherDrive

    EtherDrive

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    [​IMG]

    Golem @ Custap Berry
    Nature: Adamant
    Ability: Sturdy
    252 Atk/ 252 Spe

    Sucker Punch
    Counter
    Explosion
    Fire Punch

    I'm waiting for this berries release, desperately.

    This set only has a few jobs. Murder entry hazard leads, Take out an unsuspecting physical sweeper, and Go boom

    The purpose of this set is to abuse Golems Underrated-ness.

    Golem is one of those mons with a Global taunt feature, no one really expects it to be so dangerous until it manages to wipe out literally half of your team if you don't see it coming, which is majority of the time since this set is only possible to get in game by transferring Golem from FR/LG.
  11. BlankZero

    BlankZero

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    Can I have a bit more explanation, and maybe some calcs? Also, what is the purpose of the Custap berry?
  12. dwarfstar

    dwarfstar formerly Darth Missingno.
    is a Pre-Contributor

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    EtherDrive, Hidden Power won't do you any good. Fire Punch has higher base power, works off Golem's better Attack stat (base 110 versus base 55), and frees up EVs to go elsewhere. I'd recommend dumping those EVs in Speed and changing the nature to Adamant.

    The Custap Berry, BlankZero, is intended to let Golem go first when he's at 1HP (or anywhere below 25%, really) with Explosion.
  13. EtherDrive

    EtherDrive

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    I forgot about BW2 move tutors. I really did

    But anyway it's designed to be a wild card, an ace up your sleeve for those situations where you need to get rid of something (namely a few somethings) quickly, and have the advantage of being unpredictable and being rewarded for it


    Edit: Ok tobes. How about you release custap on showdown
  14. BlankZero

    BlankZero

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    Interesting. Wouldn't Azelf do the lead explosion better though?
  15. Onicon

    Onicon

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    It is true that Blissey can attempt a sweep once all physical mons are out of play. We still should be careful because this argument renders half of the last calcs useless because Landorus and Salamence actually are faster physical sweeper.
    Of course this applies to a lot more Pokemon and not just Blissey. Basicly every Calm Minder can sweep a team without physical threats. Jirachi for example does not have to fear CB-CC, CB-Crunch and Earthquake. Latias does not have to watch out for Crunch and U-Turn, Volcarona does not have to care about incoming Stone Edge and Waterfall. All these moves threat Blissey's longevity and have to be taken out to ensure your sweep. Good luck!

    I'll leave it that way, expect for the 252 neutral speed you have. We probably can agree that Vaporeon and Skarmory won't hurt Blissey anytime soon and that so much speed is a waste of EVs. The next "desirable" step from 96 (to outpace CB-Scizor) would be 252 Timid. That's only to tie with SD-Scizor. TIE, not outspeed.

    This one gives me some D/P/P vibes. That to say, I'd rather want to OHKO Ferrothorn and Forretess and Skarmory, in which it unfortunately fails. Azelf is the first thing that comes in mind because with Life Orb it doesn't need investment in SAtk to OHKO everyone of them with Fire Blast - which again means it can pump 252 in Atk for a powerful Boom. Still nice one with the Custap Berry, you may want to add Stealth Rock in the case you won't do as much damage against the present mon with Explosion (Steel, Stone, Ghost).

    Edit: Of course I expect me to have SR on the field when I am speaking about OHKOing Sturdy-mons.
  16. EtherDrive

    EtherDrive

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    Both Skarmory and Forretress have Sturdy and 252/252 Defensive Ferrothorn is 2HKO'd out of sun, 43.75% OHKO'd While in sun.
  17. Aquasition

    Aquasition

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    Physical SCOOT Tornadus-T
    [​IMG]

    Tornadus-T w/ Flying Gem
    Nature: Jolly
    Ability: Regenerator
    EVs: 6 HP/252 Atk/ 252 Spe
    Moves:
    -Acrobatics
    -Taunt
    -Superpower
    -U-Turn

    This Tornadus-T does not require Rain to be effective and hits hard too. Genesect and politoed don't like Flying Gem Acrobatics. The main idea with this set is hit-and-run/anti Setting up, whether that be stat-boosting, entry hazards, or stallers like blissey.) Tyranitar hates being hit with superpower, and u-turn keeps momentum. Taunt is to prevent setting up.

    Also, Golem. no one ever sees that coming. It hates water types though. Especially with the explosion nerf. Physically defensive toed will rip it apart. Wait a second. ANY bulky water type will bring pain to Golem unless the bulky water is a physical attacker, in which case you can deal damage with counter Sun teams sound easier to kill, but fire-types themselves will hurt, due to lacking EQ (Heatran). You may want to replace Fire punch with EQ, seeing as you get STAB and have an anti-Heatran option.

    Also, is Custap berry available in BW2 now? If so, how? I know I should be asking this in the Q&A, but considering this is a part of the Golem set, I am curious.
  18. Ithilanor

    Ithilanor

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    The biggest issue I see with this is that it doesn't give Tornadus-T any real benefit over the usual LO set, aside from a stronger U-turn and the lack of dependence on rain. Moving from special to physical for your STAB doesn't help you with any of the usual Tornadus-T counters/checks like Jirachi or Bronzong, and I don't think any of the other weathers would find this particularly useful.
  19. Aquasition

    Aquasition

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    What about a non-weather Hyper-offensive? As well as stopping set-uppers like DD users? Acrobatics and Superpower are more reliable than focus miss and Hurricane anyways.

    Also, Flying Gem Acrobatics has a high Chance of OHKing Hasty Genesect and seriously injuring Naive Genesect. Meanwhile, Genesect fails to OHK period(not counting Hax), so it turns into a Genesect check. Not the best one, but still a check.

    It becomes a 2HK either way when LO Hurricane Tornadus is used, losing its ability to check scarfsect. w/o Rain and Hax.
  20. Siggu

    Siggu

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    Other than Regenerator and the higher Speed, I see no reason to use this set on Tornadus-T rather than on Tornadus-I
  21. the flying afro

    the flying afro

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    I could see this set been effective and taunt would destroy slower set up sweepers but if you were using it for that reason wouldn't you use standard form tornadus as it has prankster. Standard form toradus also has a higher attack stat but unfortunatley lacks the speed of tornadus-t.
  22. Ithilanor

    Ithilanor

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    Taunt and Superpower are the primary slashes on LO Tornadus-T already...it's not like using them here is new.

    Your math's off. If rocks are up, Genesect OHKO's Tornadus-T with Ice Beam/Thunderbolt even without a boost; obviously, at +1 SpA Genesect murders Tornadus-T. As for the other way around, LO Hurricane deals 93.63 - 110.24% (56.25% chance to OHKO, guaranteed OHKO after SR) to Naive Genesect and 84.09 - 99.29% (75% chance to kill after SR) to Hasty. I'm still not seeing the merits of your set.
  23. Bluwing

    Bluwing

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    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    INFERNAPE @ Sub Salac
    Trait: Blaze
    EVs: 128 Atk | 128 SAtk | 252 Spe
    Nature: Naive (+Spe, -SpD)
    Moveset: Substitute | Work Up | Close Combat | Fire Blast

    This set is quite amazing, working like a mid game sweeper/wallbreaker or plainly just an late game sweeper. With its high speed it will nearly always get an sub up pretty easely, reason why I chosed two STAB moves is because Work Up boosts both Atk and SAtk, the cool thing about this set is that when Infernape is in Salac range it also has gain its Blaze ability, this will make Fire Blast a 270 STAB move and with this in the sun + a Work Up nothing really can switch into it bar Chandelure which completely walls this set. Anyway this set is quite cool and hope you guys like it, and will try it out as i think it can be quite good in this meta.
  24. The Unlucky one

    The Unlucky one

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    SubPetaya empoleon. Have no clue if this is used a lot. I like it though

    Empoleon @ Petaya Berry
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Agility
    - Substitute
    - Hydro Pump
    - Grass Knot
  25. Antihaxxer

    Antihaxxer

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    Grass & Dragon says hi ?
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