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Crobat (Placeholder)

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by sax king, Feb 3, 2011.

  1. sax king

    sax king

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    [​IMG]

    [Overview]
    • Crobat makes an exceptional lead with it's base 130 speed and reasonable defences at 85/80/80, as well as its access to taunt
    • Base Attack of 90 and shallow movepool (including its only attack boosting move as Curse) remove most chances of a physical sweep
    • Base Special Attack of 70 isn't all that great, but its much less barren Special movepool and access to Nasty Plot make Special sweeping viable
    • Makes a very decent Stallbreaker with its multi-sided attacking abilities and access to taunt, toxic, and other such moves.
    [SET]
    name: Stallbreaker
    move 1: Brave Bird
    move 2: U-turn
    move 3: Taunt
    move 4: Roost / Super Fang
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Jolly
    ability: Inner Focus
    EVs: 104 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def / 144 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]
    • 252 ATK EVs allow Brave Bird to OHKO Lead Machamps, who can only hope to Bullet Punch in return. I fact, it was the best Machamp-Counter in Gen IV
    • 144 SPE EVs allow him to outspeed base 115s and lower (without Scarf)
    • 104 HP EVs hits a leftovers number, so the remaining are placed in Defence
    • U-Turn allows Crobat to switch out of unfavourable matchups, and break sashes such as Aerodactyls.
    • Taunt allows Crobat to prevent most SR/Spikes users from laying it down
    • Roost is the primary option in the last slot, which allows Crobat to survive throughout a game and continue to BB enemies
    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    • Super Fang is an option over Roost if the user is having trouble with stronger walls, as no one wants to lose half their health in one hit, especially those that depend on it
    • Max Speed is an option, but the only notable Poke that is out sped is ScarfTar, who is done so by a mere 12 more SPE EVs. Though max speed ties with Aerodactyl, Crobat will be U-turning out on the SR anyways, making it useless
    [Teammates and Counters]
    • A bulky SR/Spikes user is very beneficial to a team using Crobat, as he cannot do so himself. Metagross resists Crobat's Psychic, Rock and Ice weaknesses and can set up SR, while Ferrothorn resists Psychic, Rock and Electric and can set up both. Swampert is resistant to Rock and immune to Electric and can set up SR and phaze
    • Rapid Spin support is necessary if the team wishes for Crobat to stay alive outside of the Lead position, as he loses 25% every switch from SR
    • ScarfJirachi makes a great lead partner, setting up SR, tricking away the CS, or flinchhaxing.
    • Crobat has multiple bad matchups, as it usually lets Aerodactyl set up SR, and many offensive leads take it down with ease
    [SET]
    name: Nasty Plot
    move 1: Nasty Plot
    move 2: Heat Wave
    move 3: Sludge Bomb / Air Slash
    move 4: Hidden Power Fighting
    item: Life Orb / Leftovers
    nature: Modest
    ability: Inner Focus
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]
    • Nasty Plot boosts his average SPA stat to an exceptional 576 (749 factoring in LO). This combined with 358 SPE and 4x resist to the most common priority in the game makes him an exceptional sweeper
    • Finds many opportunities to switch in, such as Choiced Mach Punches, Ground moves, Grass moves, and Bug moves, all of which are either 4x resisted or Crobat is immune to.
    • Slip Through is incompatible with Heat wave, the most important move on the set, and therefore should not be used
    • Heat Wave hits Steel types that usually end Crobat, making it the most important move on the set. It also hits Ice types SE
    • Sludge Bomb and Air Slash are your two options for necessary STAB, but it is unadvised to run both.
    • Hidden Power Fighting can fix many of Crobat's coverage issues and can help hit pokes that would normally wall Crobat
    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    • Shadow Ball is an option to hit the Psychic types
    • Other Hidden Power types can be used, but generally they won't offer the same coverage. The only one considerable is Hidden Power Ground, which can offer the most coverage after Fighting.
    • Roost can restore health, but it takes away from Crobat's coverage
    • This is Crobat's only offensive set not walled by steels
    • Cannot be countered/revenged by Breloom or Roobushin
    [Teammates and Counters]
    • Rapid Spin support is essential due to Crobat being a Flying-type
    • With LO recoil, Crobat will not appreciate residual damage, so non-leftovers Nasty Bats appreciate a way to get rid of hazards and weather
    • As a late-game sweeper, entry hazards are vital to his success, particularily Stealth Rock. Therefore, a lead such as Heatran is a great partner for Crobat, as Crobat 4x resists Heatran's 2x weakness, and is immune to his 4x weakness.
    [SET]
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: Brave Bird
    move 2: U-Turn
    move 3: Pursuit
    move 4: Cross Poison
    item: Choice Band
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Slip Through / Inner Focus
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]
    • Choice Band boosts Crobat's average Attack up to a decent 460, which is perfectly usable
    • Its strong Brave Birds will rack up a good bit of recoil, but they are great for killing Fighting-types and Grass types.
    • Great scout hitting boosted U-turns on any switch-in
    • Makes a decent pursuit user after CB boost
    • Its limited movepool gives it very little coverage, making it quite easy to be walled by Steels
    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    • Hypnosis can effectively knock out a single opponent, but will force Crobat to switch next turn due to Sleep Clause
    • Steel Wing can deal with Rock types, but it offers very little coverage
    • Jolly can be used over Adamant, but Crobat appreciates the power boost
    [Teammates and Counters]
    • Repeated U-turns, recoil damage, weather, and recoil all add up quickly, so Rapid Spin support and Wish support are helpful
    • Due to the fact that Steels completely wall him, Magnezone makes a terrific partner to Crobat, as he traps Steels and resists all of his weaknesses. In return, Crobat can block Earthquakes coming his way
    • As a revenger, his teammates consist of whoever has counters that he can revenge.
    [Team Options]
    • Metagross and a lot of other Steel types resist most of Crobat's weaknesses and vice versa.
    • Crobat has a lot of coverage issues, making pokemon like Magnzone useful
    • Crobat can effectively kill fighting-types, so other pokemon like Excadrill or Tyranitar are free to sweep
    • Crobat switches in and out very often, so Rapid Spin support is usefull. Forretress works well for this purpose
    • Crobat needs some extra power behind its hits, so entry hazards are always welcome.
    [ADDITIONAL COMMNETS]
    • Crobat has access to Hypnosis and great speed, but the shaky accuracy makes this more or less a waste of a moveslot
    • Crobat has decent bulk and nice resistances, allowing it to wall to a certain extent. It has access to high speed healing and useful auxilary moves like Super Fang and Whilwind.
    • Crobat's limited movepool gives it very few options, but it always has access to moves like Steel Wing.
    [Checks and Counters]
    • Steel types in general can wall Crobat fairly well, but some have to watch out for the Nasty Plot set's Heat Wave
    • Residual damage can really take a toll on Crobat, making pokemon like Hippowdon and Ferrothorn great counters
    • Bulky pokemon can take a few hits from Crobat and strike back hard
    • If Crobat is paralyzed, it is useless
    • Many of the fighting types Crobat can counter often carry moves like Stone Edge, which will deal a ton of damage on Crobat
  2. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    Messages:
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    Hey there.

    Leads don't really exist in gen 5, so you need to rename the first set. Consider naming it Stall Breaker Crobat. The EV's are a bit off, you don't really need all of those attack & speed EV's. Crobat is an annoyer/stallbreaker, not a sweeper. Also, Roost is extremely important on Crobat and it should main a option. (U-turn should be slashes alongside Brave Bird as the secondary option)

    Consider running the gen IV EV Spread: 232 HP / 56 Def / 76 SpD / 144 Spe
    It gives Crobat some nice bulk, and its still fast enough to check most of the metagame. (the EV's allow you to outspeed base 115's)

    The Herbal Bat set just looks terrible. Its walled by steel types and it really isn't threatening at all. That set should be removed.
    The Nasty Plot set doesn't need that many slashes.

    name: Nasty Plot
    move 1: Nasty Plot
    move 2: Heat Wave / Roost
    move 3: Sludge Bomb
    move 4: Hidden Power Fighting
    item: Life Orb / Leftovers
    nature: Timid
    ability: Inner Focus
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    The Band set shouldn't be running Quick Attack or Steel Wing.
  3. Bloo

    Bloo
    is a Tutoris a Tournament Directoris a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis an Administratoris a Past WCoP Winnerdefeated the Smogon Frontier
    Head TD

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    PK and I spoke about this on IRC and came up with a few changes.

    Change 'LeadBat' to either 'Standard' or 'Stallbreaker' and get rid of everything that talks about Crobat functioning as a lead. With team previews, nothing is stopping your opponent from rearranging their team before the start of a match and putting their best defense against Crobat in the lead position. Crobat also functions outside the lead position,so the name 'LeadBat' isn't entirely fitting. 'Stallbreaker' is a better fit. With Crobat's high Speed, Taunt, and Roost, he can prove to be a nuisance for stall, preventing 'mons like Blissey from healing and stopping Skarmory from setting up Spikes.

    I'm completely rejecting the 'HerbalBat' set you've listed in the OP. It's quite gimmicky, I don't see it posing much of a threat at all, and Crobat needs a lot of support from its teammates if it wants accomplish anything with that set. You're walled by Steel-types such as Jirachi and Magnezone. Without Taunt, you lose to the likes of Skarmory. This set can't break through defensive Gliscor that carry Ice Fang; Rotom-W resists Steel Wing and Acrobat and can take you down with Thunderbolt. Remove it.

    There's a lot of unnecessary slashes on the Choice Band set. Make it look like this:

    Choice Band (open)

    [SET]
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: Brave Bird
    move 2: Cross Poison
    move 3: Pursuit
    move 4: U-turn
    item: Choice Band
    nature: Jolly
    ability: Inner Focus
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe


    • Changed the set name to Choice Band: looks better than "BandBat" and is more professional / consistent with other analyses.
    • Move the 4 HP EVs into Special Defense: 4 HP on Crobat is a Stealth Rock number, so that's no good. Moving them into a defensive stat is the next best option.
    • Removed Steel Wing and Quick Attack as slashes: the only thing you're really hitting with Steel Wing are Rock-types, and the most common Rock-type you'll be seeing is Tyranitar. You're better off using U-turn against it and switching to something that can handle it. I removed Quick Attack because 1) Crobat's already amazingly fast and 2) it's weak.
    • Made Cross Poison a move option: gives Crobat an additional STAB move and allows the bird to put a dent in the most common Rotom forme: Rotom-W.
    You're missing these sections at the end of your skeleton:

    1. [Team Options]
    2. [Optional Changes]
    3. [Counters]
    4. [Dream World]
    In the teammates section, you should provide examples of good Rapid Spinners to pair alongside Crobat. Forretress in particular is good, especially since he can lay down Toxic Spikes, which helps Crobat stall out teams with greater ease. On offensive teams, Excadrill is a good partner. They resist each other's weaknesses quite well, and Excadrill can also Rapid Spin. Even Magic Mirror users like Espeon could be paired with Crobat to bounce back entry hazards.

    You should also put more emphasis on what stops Crobat. Tyranitar and Rotom-W are two big ones that I don't see mentioned anywhere.
  4. Marzbar

    Marzbar

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    This really needs work.... can we get some updates? Or a replacement writer?
  5. madgenius2013

    madgenius2013

    Joined:
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    For the Choice Band Set, mention Wish users (notably Jirachi) that help to mend Crobat's HP. I say Jirachi since it resists Crobat's weaknesses, and Crobat can come in on Ground attacks and be healed.
  6. Marzbar

    Marzbar

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    I think STAB Air Slash with a chance of Flinching and coverage against Fighting, Bug and Grass types is a MUCH better option than STAB Sludge Bomb that is only good against Grass types and resisted by Steel and others.
  7. yaya0

    yaya0

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    Aug 9, 2010
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    I've used the Nasty Plot set, but with Dark Pulse over HP Fighting (to hit Psychics.)
  8. RaikouLover

    RaikouLover

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    Aug 31, 2006
    Messages:
    2,430
    This is debated every generation. Sludge Bomb has superior power, and forms good two move coverage with Heat Wave. Heat Wave also beats Bug and Grass types as well. Mentioning Grass really isnt a concern since Crobat is pretty much THE best Grass type counter there as.
  9. Bloo

    Bloo
    is a Tutoris a Tournament Directoris a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis an Administratoris a Past WCoP Winnerdefeated the Smogon Frontier
    Head TD

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    Even though Crobat isn't an important Pokemon in BW OU, I'm locking this thread under inactivity. The OP hasn't been actively taking care of this thread, so I'll be finding someone else to take over this analysis.

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