It's hard not to write a ridiculous tl;dr regarding this...I'll try my best. The reason I am specifying "Current Gen OU" is because I don't believe we can quickly and to everyone's satisfaction come to an agreement for all official tiers across Smogon. That is why this topic will focus solely on the current OU Council's framework for what competitive and uncompetitive are. That way you can all argue within this framework (whether you agree with it or not; if you disagree, that would be a separate topic and you would have to argue elsewhere about that, not deluge a topic with statements that apply to your own definitions and not a standard). Note, this framework doesn't have to be super specific, but it should be thorough. This framework doesn't have to be solely objective; it should strive to keep objectivity at the forefront but it CAN recognize that quantifying this game in a meaningful manner is pretty hard, so subjective judgment calls can be part of the framework. This framework also doesn't have to permanent; it can change as required by the times. Anyway, I believe it is absolutely vital the OU Council and its current 7 members discuss what it means to be competitive and uncompetitive, because these words are thrown out in every debate nowadays and people are approaching it from completely different perspectives. We were able to kind of brush aside the issue before but I feel it has reached its boiling point and now we need something consistent. What we need is to set up a framework so that, even if they disagree with it, they have to argue within that framework. If they feel strongly that the framework is wrong, they have to argue that in here, not in a specific application topic. Anyone is welcome to pitch in on this topic and I'll be closing all the other PR topics until we come to a good framework that is approved by the council. I'll start this as open-ended and narrow down as I see necessary. I'm also aware we have other topics about this, but those died so I'm start new. Don't quote your posts from those threads. Also, for a bit of guidance, note this one very important change: the OU Council, in the 6th generation, unlike the previous generations, changed from banning things in a vacuum to banning for the sake of the metagame. Yes, that is nebulous (and it was meant to be), but what this means is that we should start with things like what we consider to be "competitive" or "healthy" metagames, not about specific things like Pokemon or abilities or items and what not. That will come later. There are many topics to discuss here...probability management, switching and preventing switching, team match up factor and centralization come up as potential starters. So what are "competitive" and "uncompetitive" for the current gen OU? Quick Edit: As a brief point of information, I want to emphasize that the purpose / intention of this thread is less to determine a solid, set in stone line for broken / uncompetitive / whatever and MUCH MORE to set the parameters for the discussion. That's what I mean by framework.