Custom Power

Rock types get a lot out of this meta, as they no longer need to rely on the inaccurate Stone Edge for STAB.

Tyranitar @ Choice Band
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 180 HP / 252 Atk / 76 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Return [Rock]
- Crunch
- Pursuit
- Superpower

Same set as standard, but now you won't miss!

Terrakion @ Life Orb
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Quick Attack / Return [Rock]
- Close Combat
- Swords Dance
- Stone Edge / Rock Polish / Substitute

Use Quick Attack if you want the priority; Return if you don't like Stone Edge's shaky accuracy.

Diancie @ Diancite
Ability: Clear Body (Magic Bounce)
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Psychic [Rock / Fire]
- Moonblast
- Earth Power
- Calm Mind

You could either go with a Rock type Psychic if you want a strong STAB or a Fire type Psychic if you want to hit the likes of Ferrothorn and Scizor.

Wonder if Mega Camerupt is any better now. It can run an Ice / Grass / Electric type Heat Wave (which hits about as hard as Focus Blast thanks to Sheer Force).
 

Natan

...
is a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
Diancie @ Diancite
Ability: Clear Body (Magic Bounce)
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Psychic [Rock / Fire]
- Moonblast
- Earth Power
- Calm Mind
You could also run a mixed set with Naive, 4 EVs in Atk instead SpD and u'll be able to run a Fire type Psychic and have a Rock STAB, plus it may boost your defense.
 

Lcass4919

The Xatu Warrior
To clear up confusion, I think this needs to be clarified Eevee General, which one gets priority with Gale Wings? Fire type Acrobatics/Brave Bird or Flying type Return?

Anyway, congratulations for June LCotM.
there is no confusion, just like how hidden power takes its PRIMARY type into account when "modifiers are in play" then changes type, all moves affected by "custom power" which is based off hidden powers mechanic, would be affected in the exact same mannor. acrobatics would gain priority because as a Hidden power clone, it takes into account its ORIGINAL typing when looking at ability modifiers.

people are just really trying to prevent this, but this is actually proven just because of how hidden power works. there is no "theorymon" there is no "no proof" its literally right there. normalize and gale wings do NOT affect hidden power, because normalize changes its "primary type" to normal, then hidden powers effect alters it to its new type. likewise, hp flying does NOT get gale priority for a similar reason. hidden power is treated as a NORMAL attack until the type change occurs after abilities take effect. meaning gale wings and normalize both dont affect it.

basically, best way to test this, is change hidden powers primary type to flying and have ivs for fire type, and see how it reacts to gale wings. can you get someone to do that eevee? because i think there might be chance its wrong. as gamefreak has done crazier shit before.
 

EV

Banned deucer.
To clear up confusion, I think this needs to be clarified Eevee General, which one gets priority with Gale Wings? Fire type Acrobatics/Brave Bird or Flying type Return?

Anyway, congratulations for June LCotM.
there is no confusion, just like how hidden power takes its PRIMARY type into account when "modifiers are in play" then changes type, all moves affected by "custom power" which is based off hidden powers mechanic, would be affected in the exact same mannor. acrobatics would gain priority because as a Hidden power clone, it takes into account its ORIGINAL typing when looking at ability modifiers.

people are just really trying to prevent this, but this is actually proven just because of how hidden power works. there is no "theorymon" there is no "no proof" its literally right there. normalize and gale wings do NOT affect hidden power, because normalize changes its "primary type" to normal, then hidden powers effect alters it to its new type. likewise, hp flying does NOT get gale priority for a similar reason. hidden power is treated as a NORMAL attack until the type change occurs after abilities take effect. meaning gale wings and normalize both dont affect it.

basically, best way to test this, is change hidden powers primary type to flying and have ivs for fire type, and see how it reacts to gale wings. can you get someone to do that eevee? because i think there might be chance its wrong. as gamefreak has done crazier shit before.
I'll see if Marty can answer this one.
 

Fissure

Cotton Candy Thighs
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
I have seen a lot of scizor discussion already so I thought I would add to it. All Scizor-Mega needs is an attack of 385 and Grass type Double hit is a guaranteed ohko on quagsire. May no unaware wall ruin your BP sweep.
60+ Atk Technician Mega Scizor Double Hit (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Quagsire: 400-472 (101.5 - 119.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO. Also, this set 2hkos unaware clefable. 60+ Atk Technician Mega Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 252 HP / 172 Def Clefable: 222-264 (56.3 - 67%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery.

Side Note: If you are scared of Heatran, regular scizor with max attack adamant and life orb has a 50.0% chance to OHKO 252 HP Heatran (This is if you have hp grass IVs). It is a ohko with stealth rocks up. Magmortar post is next.
 
I have seen a lot of scizor discussion already so I thought I would add to it. All Scizor-Mega needs is an attack of 385 and Grass type Double hit is a guaranteed ohko on quagsire. May no unaware wall ruin your BP sweep.
60+ Atk Technician Mega Scizor Double Hit (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Quagsire: 400-472 (101.5 - 119.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO. Also, this set 2hkos unaware clefable. 60+ Atk Technician Mega Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 252 HP / 172 Def Clefable: 222-264 (56.3 - 67%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery.

Side Note: If you are scared of Heatran, regular scizor with max attack adamant and life orb has a 50.0% chance to OHKO 252 HP Heatran (This is if you have hp grass IVs). It is a ohko with stealth rocks up. Magmortar post is next.
Eh. Given that Double Hit is only 105 BP after Technician, and that Scizor's switch-ins like to run things like Rocky Helmet or Rough Skin or Iron Barbs, I'd really just recommend using Return instead.

Though really, with Grass!Return, Scizor doesn't have to worry about Unaware ruining its sweep so much as it has to worry about Skarmory, which is gonna be on a lot of the same teams as Quagsire. Though another teammate can handle Skarmory for it.
 
Some interesting threats/concepts (yes some are pretty bad or outclassed) there's a long list so it's in hide tags:

Return [Ice] - Finally this gets a physical ice type move.
Knock Off [Water] - STAB Knock off is nice
Ice Beam [Ground/Fire] - Fire hits steels. Ground can be used to hit heatran however you lose to ferrothorn.
Mach Punch [Grass] - Maybe, maybe. It's another form of STAB priority so allows you to revenge kill faster grounds/rocks such as Mega Diancie, however majority of faster rock/ground types take neutral from it.
Psychic [Rock/Fire] - Former allows you to substitute diamond storm and dump more EVs into special attack where as the latter helps against steels.
Quick Attack [Dragon/Fire] Either works, is pretty scary with STAB priority tough claws.
Flamethrower [Ground] Finally allows Zard-Y to lure in Heatran and run fire blast at the same time.
Extreme Speed [Flying] Technically aerilate imo :^] really spammable.
Fake Out [Fighting/Psychic] Fake out is weak without STAB but now a STAB fake out will hurt
Hydro Pump [Electric/Flying/Ice] Is able to remove it's checks/counters such as Mega Venu/Lati etc by firing a really power hydro pump electric, flying or ice.
Return [Grass] This is able to remove bulky ground and water types what it usually tends to struggle against.
Fake Out/Return [Ice] See dragonite. Ice type fake out/return is really powerful.
Sludge Wave [Ghost] Not much, just an upgrade for shadow ball, more power.
Knock Off/U-Turn [Flying] Both are pretty spammable as it is, but with STAB it makes it better.
Fake Out [Fighting] Just if you want to hit things SE which normal type fake out doesn't.
Tri Attack [Fire] - Can already trap steels now it can use a 80BP fire type move to do more damage. 30% chance to either burn, freeze or para is also nice.
Discharge [Ice] - An upgrade from HP Ice. Higher BP and has a 30% chance to paralyze. Or sludge wave for thundy.
Giga Drain [Fire/Rock/Ground] - With a Giga Drain either Fire, Rock or ground, serperior can remove majority of its Checks/Counters.
Earthquake [Fighting] Not anything outstanding but a non attack lowering superpower so more spammable.
Return [Fire/Ground/Ice] Fire hits steels. Ground hits rocks and steels. Ice hits Grounds. All checks and counters.
- Energy Ball [Ice] Upgrade from HP Ice. More BP and a chance to lower special defense.
- Quick Attack [Ground] Nothing outstanding, allows you to get priority which is actually SE on things.
Extreme Speed [Flying/Ice/Ground] Since no Custom Power Fairy either of these make good choices for ESpeed Ground gives STAB where as the former two give decent coverage.
- Explosion [Psychic] Imagine this STAB Explosion. Great suicide lead.
- Spike Cannon [Water] Makes use of skill link now gets a water STAB move to spam with skill link.
- Return [Flying] Finally, a powerful flying STAB. Not to mention it's boosted by tough claws, really scary in the end.
- Extreme Speed [Fire] Flareiate? Yeah STAB priority once again which has a nice BP.
- Extreme Speed [Fire] See above.
- Zen Headbutt [Rock] - Literally nothing. Just the slightest upgrade from Rock Slide.
- Tri Attack [Dark/Steel] - Really interesting imo. STAB with a 30% to freeze burn or paraylze, i'd like to see what this can do. Steel can be used to hit fairies.
Extreme Speed [Ice] - Another ESpeeder Ice allows it to hit flying types which usually tend to switch in on Luke.
Return [Any Type] - Coverage is really nice tbh.
Boomburst [Flying] - Extremely Powerful + Spammable. 140 BP with STAB. ban imo
Return [Ice] - It struggles against Grounds now it can trap them and deal and possibly even OHKO them with a Return Ice.
Fake Out [Fighting] - Maybe. STAB Fake Out now give it a fighting gem. Unburden eventually kicks in.
Discharge [Ice] - See above. An HP Ice Upgrade with a chance to paralyze.
Tri Attack [Fire] - See Magnezone.
Boomburst [Flying] - Outclassed by Noivern.
Extrasensory [Grass] - Some coverage. Hits Waters and Rocks which Typhlosion hates.
Flamethrower [Grass] - HP Grass upgrade. More BP.
Bullet Punch [Fighting] - Pretty gimmicky, but a belly drum set with STAB priority can be threatining if it sets up.
Return [Ground/Grass] - I like running return [Grass] to hit grounds/waters which klinklang tends to struggle against. However, Klinklang struggles more against Fire/Electrics so therefore Return [Ground] is Nice.
Flamethrower [Grass] - See above. HP Grass Upgrade. More BP.
Superpower [Psychic] - STAB makes this amazing now it's able to deal more damage to fightings/poisons.
Discharge [Ice] - See Above. An HP Ice Upgrade with also a 30% chance to paralyze.
Boomburst [Flying] - Outclassed by Noivern.
Sucker Punch [Rock] - A somewhat nice bird counter. However still struggles against Gale Wings+ESpeed and comes down to mind games I suppose.

- Scald [Grass] - Helps a ton against bulky waters and can also cripple them with a burn


 
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Natan

...
is a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
Some interesting threats/concepts (yes some are pretty bad or outclassed) there's a long list so it's in hide tags:
- Tri Attack [Dark/Steel] - Really interesting imo. STAB with a 30% to freeze burn or paraylze, i'd like to see what this can do. Steel can be used to hit fairies.
Tri Attack is as strong as both Flash Cannon and Dark Pulse, and Dark Pulse have the same chance of flinchin' as the Tri Attack chance, 20% (not 30% btw), and is more useful get a Flinch than a Paralyse or Burn (not a Freeze, but there are 6,66% of chance to each one, then flinch is more often than Freeze). Earth Power can be used as well if isn't needed Ground coverage in the set, Surf can be used instead, but I think a better option is run a Fire Blast too. Earth Power in a Scarf Set (running a Timid Nature) is good enough to have 100% of chance to 2HKO Mega Gardevoir Standard without Stealth Rocks. But the coolest is the opponent may think your Earth Power is a Ground-type, as it is viable, then it can be used to punish things like a incoming Mega Altaria. Dark type can be used as well to be a more reliable STAB and deal many damage, otherwise, Poison type is better than Steel imo, as you may see, Azumarill is more common than Klefki, and Hydreigon Scarf is able to 2HKO Azumarill with Poison type Earth Power and is OHKO with Specs after Stealth Rocks, then Hydreigon running Earth Power / Fire Blast is really useful to punish Fairy type.
- Zen Headbutt [Rock] - Literally nothing. Just the slightest upgrade from Rock Slide.
Zen Headbutt to Grass-type is best, to have a useful and good coverage against Water-types and hit fat Ground types aka Hippowdon.
 
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I think I'm doing something wrong. I'm trying to use a Flying Espeed on my Dnite but I just can't, I use the HP to change the IVs, but when I switch the HP to another attack the IVs change to all 31.
 

Natan

...
is a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
I think I'm doing something wrong. I'm trying to use a Flying Espeed on my Dnite but I just can't, I use the HP to change the IVs, but when I switch the HP to another attack the IVs change to all 31.
The EVs are auto setted, then you need to switch they by you own instead use HP and choice another move, in the 1st post after the thread there are the EVs needed to run each type, you can see:
  • Flying (Without Perfect Speed) (31/31/31/30/30/30 or 31/0/31/30/30/30)
  • Flying (Perfect Speed) (30/30/30/30/30/31 or 30/0/30/30/30/31)
 
Volcanion @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
- Scald [Ice or Grass]
- Steam Eruption
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power

One of Volcanion's original weak points in OU was that its coverage was very lacking when it came to fighting Pokemon with type advantages, namely Water and Dragon types. To fight water types, Volcanion had Solar Beam which could only be effective under the sun (which weakens Steam Eruption) or only use it once. To fight bulky dragons, you had to use HP Ice, which is really weak. Now, with the ability to make your first move any type, Volcanion can at least take on one type consistently and can now make use of Scald too. Ice Scald may not be the Freeze-Dry coverage Volcanion wants (and plenty of other moves), but its the best we got here. I recommend Ice Scald more than Grass Scald tho since Dragons (and Lando-T) are more of a threat to Volcanion because of Water Absorb and so it can effectively burn things like Dragonite and Kyurem-B. Grass Scald can by used on Rotom-Wash, but I don't think Rotom-W will be common.

Calcs:
252+ SpA Volcanion Scald vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Multiscale Dragonite: 192-228 (59.4 - 70.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Volcanion Scald vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Garchomp: 440-520 (105.5 - 124.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Volcanion Scald vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Noivern: 460-544 (147.9 - 174.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Volcanion Scald vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Altaria: 184-218 (63.2 - 74.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Volcanion Scald vs. 228 HP / 0 SpD Dragalge: 160-190 (48.7 - 57.9%) -- 96.1% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Volcanion Scald vs. 252 HP / 8 SpD Landorus-T: 456-540 (119.3 - 141.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
 

Natan

...
is a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
Volcanion @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
- Scald [Ice or Grass]
- Steam Eruption
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power

One of Volcanion's original weak points in OU was that its coverage was very lacking when it came to fighting Pokemon with type advantages, namely Water and Dragon types. To fight water types, Volcanion had Solar Beam which could only be effective under the sun (which weakens Steam Eruption) or only use it once. To fight bulky dragons, you had to use HP Ice, which is really weak. Now, with the ability to make your first move any type, Volcanion can at least take on one type consistently and can now make use of Scald too. Ice Scald may not be the Freeze-Dry coverage Volcanion wants (and plenty of other moves), but its the best we got here. I recommend Ice Scald more than Grass Scald tho since Dragons (and Lando-T) are more of a threat to Volcanion because of Water Absorb and so it can effectively burn things like Dragonite and Kyurem-B. Grass Scald can by used on Rotom-Wash, but I don't think Rotom-W will be common.
In 1st place : Volcanion's best switch are Water types and Lati@s, and these Water types aren't that common, but u could calc damage against Lati@s. And run Specs Volcanion with at least Speed to outspeed Rotom-Wash and it won't be a threat.
In 2nd place: "Lando-T are a threat" what? Ik Landorus-Therian defeats Volcanion in 1v1, but it isn't even a switch lol.
 
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Sobi

Banned deucer.
hi, i come here with a request



i think that it would be much more easier if the typing of the move was changed, so that it says "Water" under Body Slam instead of "Normal", because it's not a Normal-type move, and it's extremely misleading and confusing for the battler because then they have to go to the teambuilder, check the IVs, and remind themselves what Hidden Power type it is, making it a much more harder task than usual. i don't know if it's going to be hard to implement or whatnot, but i'd really appreciate if this is done because it helps the battler so much. thanks =]
and sorry if there's already been a post stating this; in which case plz delete this
 
hi, i come here with a request



i think that it would be much more easier if the typing of the move was changed, so that it says "Water" under Body Slam instead of "Normal", because it's not a Normal-type move, and it's extremely misleading and confusing for the battler because then they have to go to the teambuilder, check the IVs, and remind themselves what Hidden Power type it is, making it a much more harder task than usual. i don't know if it's going to be hard to implement or whatnot, but i'd really appreciate if this is done because it helps the battler so much. thanks =]
and sorry if there's already been a post stating this; in which case plz delete this
I'm fully agree with this point.
Also, because on ROM you can play on some random version of metagames, this change could allow us to play also to this metagame, but with random teams.
When you didn't know IV's on pokemon, you can't know what a custom type you have on first move.
Imagine Gengar with moveset: Sludge Bomb / Sludge Wave / Shadow Ball / filler.
You can't say first move is Ghost type, because Shadow Ball. Poison also doesn't make sense, because Sludge Wave.
On random version of this gamemode, you can't know what you have on this pokemon, because you are not a creator of set.
With this change, this problem doesn't exist.

Alternatively we could put information about IV's and (what is more important) Hidden Power what this IV's spread give, under information about stats.
 

EV

Banned deucer.
**Please Read Carefully**

DO NOT add a Hidden Power to your moveset in order to manipulate the IVs. The teambuilder no longer stores the values once the move is removed from your Pokemon, so the IVs will change back and you'll have the wrong type. Make sure you enter the IVs yourself when you're entering your EVs to get the right typing. See this post for the values.
 
Electivire (M) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Motor Drive
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 SpA
- Double-Edge
- Ice Punch
- Earthquake
- Cross Chop

Come at me Noivern
 
DO NOT add a Hidden Power to your moveset in order to manipulate the IVs. The teambuilder no longer stores the values once the move is removed from your Pokemon, so the IVs will change back and you'll have the wrong type. Make sure you enter the IVs yourself when you're entering your EVs to get the right typing.
This affects Hidden Type too, but that's going to get special-cased in the next client update; when that happens you could build your team using the Hidden Type format and then change it to Custom Power when you've finished. (I don't know when the next client update is going to happen otherwise I wouldn't have mentioned this until it had been updated.)
 

Marty

Always more to find
is a Site Content Manageris a Battle Simulator Administratoris a Programmeris a Member of Senior Staffis a Community Contributoris a Top Researcheris a Top Tiering Contributor
Research Leader
Which one gets priority with Gale Wings? Fire type Acrobatics/Brave Bird or Flying type Return?
there is no confusion, just like how hidden power takes its PRIMARY type into account when "modifiers are in play" then changes type, all moves affected by "custom power" which is based off hidden powers mechanic, would be affected in the exact same mannor. acrobatics would gain priority because as a Hidden power clone, it takes into account its ORIGINAL typing when looking at ability modifiers.

people are just really trying to prevent this, but this is actually proven just because of how hidden power works. there is no "theorymon" there is no "no proof" its literally right there. normalize and gale wings do NOT affect hidden power, because normalize changes its "primary type" to normal, then hidden powers effect alters it to its new type. likewise, hp flying does NOT get gale priority for a similar reason. hidden power is treated as a NORMAL attack until the type change occurs after abilities take effect. meaning gale wings and normalize both dont affect it.

basically, best way to test this, is change hidden powers primary type to flying and have ivs for fire type, and see how it reacts to gale wings. can you get someone to do that eevee? because i think there might be chance its wrong. as gamefreak has done crazier shit before.
I'll see if Marty can answer this one.
Lcass4919 has the right idea; here's the general flow of how type changes work while a move starts being executed:
  • listed move type
  • moves that call other moves use the new move instead
  • Normalize changes the move to Normal
  • moves now change type (Hidden Power/Judgment/Natural Gift/Techno Blast/Weather Ball + any affected move in this metagame)
  • if the move is unchanged and still Normal (i.e. not Natural Gift with Chilan Berry), Aerilate/Pixilate/Refrigerate change it to Flying/Fairy/Ice
  • if the move is Normal, Ion Deluge changes to Electric
  • Electrify changes the move to Electric
  • Protean activates
  • Gems activate if the Gem matches the move type
Basically, since this metagame seems to use a base move that has its type changed using IVs like Hidden Power, it would happen in that same step, which is far too late for both Gale Wings and Normalize to affect it. So to answer the original question, only moves that are naturally Flying type should be affected by Gale Wings here.
 
Just imagine BW's SubDDnite but with a Flying-Earthquake as the main attack. 20 BP stronger than Dragon Claw and bypasses fairies at the cost of being trolled by Tyranitar with Ice Punch. ExtremeSpeed sounds better on paper but it has too low PP to smash teams away like that.
 

EV

Banned deucer.
Here's a team I threw together in 30 seconds yesterday. It's running hazard free whee!

(cheat sheet:
Sludge Wave-Flying
Return-Ice
Return-Steel
Surf-Electric
U-turn-Flying
Discharge-Water)
Thundurus @ Life Orb
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA / 30 SpD
- Sludge Wave
- Thunderbolt
- Nasty Plot
- Thunder Wave

Kyurem-Black @ Choice Band
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 30 Def
- Return
- Dragon Claw
- Fusion Bolt
- Outrage

Metagross @ Metagrossite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 SpD
- Return
- Bullet Punch
- Ice Punch
- Thunder Punch

Keldeo @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 1 Atk / 30 SpA
- Surf
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Substitute

Landorus-Therian @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 30 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA / 30 SpD
- U-turn
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Knock Off

Rotom-Wash @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA
- Discharge
- Volt Switch
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split
 

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