D/P Mixed Mamoswine

Edit: I changed the wording thanks to ToF and I added in Stone Edge as an attack. I need help on that last slot! Also Great Sage sorry about over-riding your post. Can you please tell my what I have to fix again. I will do it this time to save you time. Very sorry about that.

This wasn't mentioned in the analysis so I am going to try and do a section on it.

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/mamoswine

[SET]
name: Mixed Mamo
move 1: Earthquake
move 2: Ice Shard
move 3: Blizzard
move 4: Stone Edge
item: Life Orb
ability: Snow Cloak
nature: Naughty
evs: 248 Atk / 24 SpA / 236 Spe

[Set Comments]
<p>Mixed Mamoswine is often forgotten because of Mamoswine's incredibly high Attack. However, Mamoswine does have 70 base Special Attack, which allows it to defeat physical walls who could stop the standard physical sets cold.</p>

<p>Mamoswine's two most important attacks are Earthquake and Ice Shard. Blizzard is slotted in the third slot to hit Skarmory hard. The remaining attack is variable, and should be based on what your team needs. Earthquake and Ice Shard allow you to hit everything in the game for neutral damage, except for Bronzong. Skarmory takes minimal damage from Ice Shard, a measly 25% on average. At that you are looking at a 5HKO, providing Skarmory is holding Leftovers. However, running 24 Special Attack and a Life Orb allows Mamoswine's Blizzard to easily 2HKO Skarmory. Mamoswine also OHKOs Donphan and Tangrowth with Blizzard. The given Speed EVs easily outspeed Skarmory as well. It will also outspeed a Modest Heatran and Jolly Tyranitar. Your last attack is Stone Edge that will wreck Gyarados, something that can potentially stop you, with it's high defenses, immunity to Earthquake, and Intimidate. With the current Speed EVS, Earthquake will Outspeed and OHKO both Heatran and Lucario.</p>

<p>Life Orb is the item you will need to effectively neutralize certain counters, so forget about Leftovers. With Life Orb you can 2HKO Skarmory 96% with Blizzard, as long as both hit, while keeping strong power on the physical end.</p>

<p>You can run this in a Hail Team, with the added plus of Blizzard having near perfect accuracy. However, without the Hail, Blizzard is as reliable as Focus Blast. Mixed Mamoswine is also a great way to destroy SkarmBliss.</p>

Other Options
<p>On the Mixed Mamoswine set, Hidden Power Fire can be a great way to kill Forretress and land a 3HKO on Bronzong. However losing Stone Edge can hurt you and gives up on valuable coverage.</p>

Thanks for reading it, please just give me feedback so I can try to fix it if anything is worng, as well as mistakes I made.
 
This is quite a useful set, especially on a Hail team. Just wanted to point out that Nevermeltice isn't such a bad item here actually, no recoil for one, and it has the added bonus of making your opponent believe Mamo has CB.
 
Thanks for the positive feedback. I will put NeverMeltIce as an option next to life orb and change my item paragraph to mention it.
 
[SET]
name: Mixed Mamo
move 1: Earthquake
move 2: Ice Shard
move 3: Blizzard
move 4: Hidden Power [Fire] / Stealth Rock / Substitute
item: Life Orb / Nevermeltice
ability: Snow Cloak
nature: Naughty
evs: 252 Atk / 136 SpA / 120 Spe

[Set Comments]
<p>Mixed Mamoswine is often forgotten because of Mamoswine's incredibly high attack. However, Mamoswine does have 70 Base Special Attack, which allows it to defeat physical walls who could stop the standard physical sets cold.</p>

<p>Mamoswine's two most important attacks are Earthquake and Ice Shard. Blizzard is slotted in the third slot to hit Skarmory hard. The remaining attack is variable, and should be based on what your team needs. Earthquake and Ice Shard allow you to hit everything in the game for neutral damage, except for Bronzong. Skarmory takes minimal damage from Ice Shard, a measly 25% on average. At that you are looking at a 5HKO, providing Skarmory is holding Leftovers. However, running 136 Special Attack and a Life Orb allows Mamoswine's Blizzard to easily 2HKO Skarmory. The given Speed EV's easily outspeed Skarmory as well. The last slot is interchangable, with each attack having its uses. Hidden Power Fire can be a potential 3HKO on Bronzong and a 1HKO on Forretress, 2 common switches into Mamoswine. If you feel you cover both Bronzong and Forretress well enough, then Stealth Rock can also work as it allows you to set up rocks as you scout their counter. With the amount of switches Mamoswine forces, the chances of setting up Stealth Rock are high.</p>

<p>Life Orb is the item you will need to effectively neutralize certain counters, so forget about Leftovers. With Life Orb you OHKO Forretress with Hidden Power [Fire] and 2HKO Skarmory with Blizzard. Since you are running 2 Ice attacks you can consider Nevermeltice. This has the added advantage of making the opponent believe you are running a Choice Band.</p>

<p>You can run this in a Hail Team, with the added plus of Blizzard having 100% accuracy. However, without the Hail, Blizzard is as reliable as Focus Blast. Mamoswine's ability to switch into a Blissey's Thunder Wave is very helpful, as it will 2HKO back with Earthquake. Mamoswine can effectively deal with both Skarmory and Blissey, as well as Sandstorm and Hail teams in general.</p>

<p>Substitute could also go in the last slot to guarantee safety against their switch in and try to hurt it with a combination of Mamoswine's STAB attacks. Azelf switching in on a predicted Earthquake would be a good time to sub allowing you to 2HKO with Ice Shard</p>

Just fixed up some grammatical problems, added commas, fixed up some unclear wording, etc.

Nice job overall though =)
 
Thanks and your version is much clearer. I knew I worded it wrong but I just didn't know what to change. Thanks again.

I am going to get more replies off this.
 

Aldaron

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Add Stone Edge as a viable option for that 4th slot. Stealth Rock and Substitute are unnecessary mentions on a mixed Mamoswine set, in my opinion.

Gyarados, Zapdos, Moltres and the like are all hit harder by Stone Edge, so I feel like it deserves a mention.

EDIT:

However if running 136 Special Attack and a Life Orb on Mamoswine a Blizzard will easily 2HKO Skarmory. And with the speed you can easily outrun it. Hidden Power Fire can be a Potential 3HKO on Bronzong and a 1HKO on Forretress, 2 common switches to a Mamoswine.
For, Bronzong, I'll use the Smogon set (even though the practical set generally has much more Special Defense), at 252 HP / 96 SpD. 210 Special Attack with Life Orb and HP Fire does 28.4-33.73% to that Bronzong, which means it NEVER 3HKOs that Bronzong with Leftovers.

HP Fire is really only for Forretress then, and uhhh, Stone Edge definitely provides more general utility than HP Fire.
 
I must have messed up my calcs for that. The reason I use Hidden Power Fire is mostly for forretress though, who is OHKOed by it since he threatens most mamoswines with his high def and a strong Gyro Ball.

I will add in Stone Edge though as another option but that would give me 4 attacks in that last slot. I don't think I want to get rid of any of them yet so I need you guys to decide what would be the best.

Edit: Shit Great Sage what did you fix?! I edited it to ToF's version adding in Aldarons advice. I didn't even know you changed it. I am really sorry about that.

Edit 2: Aldaron Ice Shard should do fine for Zapdos, so Stone Edge wouldn't be needed for him.
 

Aldaron

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KinglerDude, Ice Shard hits Zapdos at 120 total BP...while Stone Edge hits it for 200 total BP...

200 / 120 = 1.66 times more powerful.
 
Yeah but Ice Shard has priority while Zapdos outspeeds you when you use stone edge. Hopefully Zapdos is weakened by Stealth Rock or something and Ice Shard will OHKO while you remain unscathed. Then Stone Edge is useless on zapdos even though it provides more power.
 
I think Stone Edge is more of an option for incoming Gyarados rather than Zapdos. Bulky Zapdos can just roost off the damage, halving Stone Edge's power as it hits whilst greatly diminishing PP from pressure. Though, this could create some Earthquake-on-the-roost mindgames.

Stone Edge is your greatest weapon against an incoming Gyarados, as it's high SpDef would shrug off a Blizzard, whilst intimidate and an ground-immunity handles your other moves reasonably well.
 
Don't know if I can be much help, but I posted a mixed mamoswine in the new moveset thread that utilized an expert belt, hidden power electric, and max special attack EVs. It OHKOs gyarados with stealth rock, and 2HKOs skarmory because of the expert belt boost. May be worth a mention. I would also think Ice beam is a more viable option, as blizzards piss poor accuracy means beating skarmory is going to be a challenge. I definately will 2nd Expert Belt / Nevermeltice > Life Orb, for reasons already listed.
 

Colonel M

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Blah blah.

Tried it, and I personally see no reason to use Hidden Power Fire IF only for Forretress, who gets slammed very hard by Earthquake anyways.

Also, let's cut down the moveset:

- Earthquake
- Ice Shard
- Blizzard
- Stone Edge

Stealth Rock is in Other Options anyways, so keep it there. Substitute and Life Orb are just redundant together. Hidden Power Electric doesn't even sound great on paper personally, EVEN IF it OHKOs Gyarados with Stealth Rock in play since Stone Edge still slams hard against Gyarados anyways.

Ph, even with Bite or Hidden Power Fire, Bronzong is stopped cold by a Bronzong.
 
fuck! I've been hiding this set away for ages, very fun and good

the EVs are totally wrong, and HP Fire will never be any good.

Ice Shard / Blizzard / EQ / Stone Edge @ life orb

252 Attack / 232 Speed / 24 Sp. Attack for Hail teams, wich out speeds Modest Heatran (big threat to them) and 2HKOs Skarm always with Hail damage, and without hail damage 96.663% of the time assuming both blizzards hit.

should you want to use this out of hail, speed can be dropped to 244 to beat Jolly T-tar, with spare in Sp. Attack. Will confirm the 2hko on Skarm assuming both Blizzards hit.

same goes for Weezing. OHKOs Gliscor / Donphan / Tangrowth, ~88% to 252 hp Hippowdon.

136 Sp. Attack EVs is just limiting mamoswine too much.
 
o i have found you my darling! just some little notes on mamo's last slot.

1. stone edge is pretty useless on it imo. the only things that it could hit super effectively that the standard ice/ground combo can't are gyarados, moltres and charizard ad mamo shouldn't stay in on any of them regardless.

2. mamo can learn reflect and i think light screen. i've been abusing reflect lately, it's pretty useful if you already have a spiker.

3. you can always try ice fang if you don't have blizzard.

that's it for now. so proud *sob*.
 
If there's no blizzard, this set wouldn't exist

Stone Edge, as mentioned above, is for Gyarados and Zapdos mainly. Both of which you can stay in on, assuming the former hasn't a DD. It also dents shuckle pretty badly <3

imo you couldn't have the set without stone edge, Gyara would just rape you
 
Substitute and Life Orb on the same frail Mamoswine sounds like a one-way trip to suicide. Or maybe that's just me.
 
eh, i've seen HP fire variations without blizzard. it hits harder on skarm and it doesn't have that horrible accuracy.

i might just change my mind on stone edge. it just seems so limited. gyara's the only OU threat that it hits. every team has to have another gyara counter anyways, mamo gets destroyed regardless after a DD. the point of a slot imo isn't so it can take on every poke in the game, that's unrealistic. the point is to maximise on the slot. i think stealth rock/reflect does that much better.

edit: and i agree with mekkah. needs lefties for that one.
 

Blue Kirby

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Hidden Power Fire will never hit Skarmory harder - it's benefits are limited to Bronzong, Scizor and Forretress alone in regards to Steel-types. Since you can take chunks out of the latter two anyway, you're really aiming just to hit Bronzong.

Blizzard: 120 * 1.5 = 180 (STAB)
HP Fire: 70 * 2 = 140 (super effective hit)

In my opinion, Life Orb is fine. It's Substitute that shouldn't be used on this particular set.

EDIT: Yeah, I can't really see the need for supporting moves on such an offensively orientated set either.
 
Shard / EQ / Blizzard / Stone Edge @ Orb should be only options IMO. Stealth Rock and Reflect are supporting options, out of place on something so offensively oriented.
 
I will put Stealth Rock / Reflect / Sub in other option with a note that sub with life orb is not always wise. I will have to last two slots go to hidden power fire and stone edge (SE as the first set) and then mention in you want a good way to beat forretress and other steel types then use hidden power fire.

Ill edit this in later
 
I will put Stealth Rock / Reflect / Sub in other option with a note that sub with life orb is not always wise. I will have to last two slots go to hidden power fire and stone edge (SE as the first set) and then mention in you want a good way to beat forretress and other steel types then use hidden power fire.

Ill edit this in later
The only other Steel Type you should mention in that category are Bronzong, who you shouldn't be staying in against anyways (Gyro Ball) and Scizor. Jirachi and Metagross both take more from Earthquake.
 

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